In Defense of "Toxic" Internet Culture
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- Опубліковано 22 чер 2023
- i liked blessing's stranded video a lot. this video here is me politely disagreeing with 3 points. chow down on this content
• internet culture is f*...
• I MADE ANDREW TATE RUN...
• Video
• Dissecting the Manosphere
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I hate that 12 year old girls are expected to put up with boys calling them lying whores and bitches because “it’s what teen boys do”. This behaviour makes life absolute hell for teenage girls. Correcting a teen boys behaviour is too harsh but letting teen girls suffer is fine?
Absolutely!
kids say and do dumb things.......but when they never face consequences it doesn't stop' yes you should try calmly at first' but if it doesn't than give them tough love.
I think the people trying to excuse the behavior of the young boy have conflated recognition and understanding of a certain behavior with acceptance of said behavior in certain contexts, e.g., being young and lacking the wisdom that experience brings to one's life. It's a very simplistic and binary view of how to respond to such incidents, most likely born from fear of what they would consider to be a disproportionately negative response to the behavior. But it's also the same uncertainty and confusion that conservatives successfully use to push transphobia. "Won't somebody PLEASE think of the children!!!" etc., and unfortunately Blessing's Stranded is reinforcing that status quo with his opinion on the subject.
@@ddjsoyenby absolutely agree with this take
donno why adults wanna convince kids they can't take responsibility for their actions.
in certain situations it's perfectly reasonable for kids to take accountability. they will survive i promise
Don't act as if it's just teenage boys. Girls, women, and especially feminists do that too. You are proving the point of the same person you criticize. You just instrumentalize and exaggerate something to fit your ideas and obsessions.
Edit for dummies: I'm not talking about the word “whore” which by the way, is still mostly used by women lol. I'm talking about calling groups of people names. Women call all men “beasts” or “pigs” after their personal dissatisfactions, and it's far more socially acceptable than the reverse. That somehow does not affect the lives of boys and men, according to you.
I work with young kids (6-8) and claiming that young kids are “just being edgy” is ridiculous. Boys will consistently use misogynistic language to demean and put down their female peers. The worst part for me is the fact that it only takes one kid to completely ruin the rest. Implicitly or not, the realize that they benefit from sexist behavior (like if they all gang up they can prevent the girls from playing with the toys). It’s hard to watch and even harder to stop. I can easily see this mindset developing as they age.
You shouldn't be allowed near kids. You are clearly deranged by your ideology. Do you have any idea how common female-to-female bullying is? How about boys bullying other boys? And what about girls bullying boys?
It was always "You hit like a girl" where it starts
@stardustorchard9316 Actually, it really starts with little boys seeing girls getting way more love and affection, especially when they are hurt or scared. Little boys, on the other hand, are chided and told to man up and are expected to be tough, even though they are also just small, vulnerable children just like the girls. They aren't old enough to contextualize this or rationalize it in any healthy way, and instead, it develops a deeply subconscious confusion and resentment and this is reinforced by their peers and caregivers.
Yeah I'll never forget being told by a therapist that it only bothered me when I dealt with repeated comments at 12 along the lines of 'why are you even at school? You're going to be a prostitute' because I was bullied and also refused to see me being slapped on the ass and touched on my stomach by a fellow 11 year old as sexual harassment because that kid 'can't have had sexual intent' like kids my age weren't proudly announcing they'd been watching pork since they were 9-11 years old. We really need to stop assuming kids are innocent while being raised in a world that consistently inundates them with stuff that decidedly ruins their innocence
Huh? That's such goofiness, it ain't the kid's fault when he's socialized that way, how tf you expect a kid to understand that stuff, their brain is still developing, I was that edgy kid, now I'm woke af, all it took was a couple of female friends. We should just normalize boys being friends with females in school, instead of having "boys vs girl" Quizes and stuff and segregating them from playing with boys, it's you teachers causing this divide, a feminist sociologist once tried to raise their daughter and son in a gender neutral way yet they still adopted the masculine and feminine straits from school itself
Saying “that’s just what 13 year olds do” is not good enough. We should call out children for saying harmful things even if they are children. It’s wrong as much as it is when they’re an adult. So I agree we won’t stop them from saying these things overnight we might be able to stop them from saying it after they’ve already said it.
100% agree. if they say bigoted stuff unopposed, they may begin to associate it as something that is okay to say. people need to be challenged to grow as a human being
It's true that 13 year olds need to be challenged about what they say, but you shouldnt let your day get ruined over it.
Boys aged 13 have been doing it forever. Only today, if they don't get a raise out of their parents, they have thousands of stupid marks on the internet to rile up.
@@sighup7663 nobody's day was ruined over a post on twitter. additionally, if a kid calls me the f slur at school or in public, i have a right to be a little upset. a little at the kid, but mostly at the parents who allow the behavior.
Hopefully it doesn't rain on you, you might feel assaulted by the rain.. God forbid a child calls you a name we might need a wambulance for you along with the police
That post was a warning sign. Is he an incel? No. That was the incorrect word. This kid is being misogynistic. He needs to realize that even though he’s angry, he can’t act like this.
???? Did nobody going to consider the fact that he had the right to be angry at his WOMAN CHEATING??
@@lotanowo yeah you can be angry without making harmful blanket statements like that. like i can be angry that a man mugged me without saying “every man wants to rob me,” i would say “damn that one dude really fucking sucks” and then move on
It's a child. Get them off social media.
@@lotanowohis “woman” didn’t cheat since they’re literal children. a little girl did something a little boy didn’t like
@@lotanowowhy do you wanna call people slurs? Cheating is one thing and being sexist is a whole other.
The Greta Thunberg bit is weird to me. She grew up as a teenage girl with the largest spotlight imaginable, with every reactionary asshole saying the most vile, misogynist shit at her. All of that because she wanted people to do something about climate change, something most people agree with. It’s not surprising that people saw her admittedly weak response to captain misogyny and it got that many likes. It’s karmically satisfying for her to own him, and you can’t argue with results; he posted a VIDEO to tell everyone how he’s “not owned, actually”
people hated on her due to her gender so much lol it’s crazy
i agree but ive said it before and i stand by it, i actually kinda fw greta’s response to andrew tate. like yeah it wasn’t clever or anything, but it felt like the perfect comeback to someone like tate. Tate is someone with a huge audience that treats him like a god, and he wrote this long, weird ass to Greta basically baiting an angry response. in return, she just hit him with a lame comeback that a 13 year old might come up with, simultaneously denying him the impassioned response he was looking for and also rationing him
@@quinnmcgee7323 I didn't see her comeback as "lame" or "13 year old", more sort of "You're not worth the effort" energy.
That part of the video is extra odd to me because the bulk of his argument is that people online have disproportionate responses to minor transgressions - but then he spends part of his video complaining that too many people liked a tweet that he personally didn’t care for - like, is that not also a somewhat trivial thing to give a shit about? Is complaining that Greta Thunberg got too many Internet points in an online argument not also a pretty “terminally online” thing to do?
I don't think she had a weak response. idk what else u could say to what tate posted. like why we callin the response weak?? the call out by tate was weak so in comparison the response hits pretty hard
He may not be an actual incel BECAUSE HES 12, Does not mean his rhetoric is not the same mentality and just as serious. Incels aren’t only dangerous because of mass shootings, their ideas are JUST as damaging due to the IDEA THAT woman’s rights ARE NOTHUMAN RIGHTS
The amount of crap I've seen that incels spew online, one of the grossest things are some thinking that grape should be legal, and there should be government mandated gf's for them. I wish for them to grow as people and simply stop being worms full of hate
Don't be so dramatic, he's a kid, like now you are trying to demand justice from a 12 year old lol? like dude had his heart broken because they are a bunch of cringe 12 year olds having s3x which is actually messed up, like go be a child and get off social media ffs, that goes for boys and girls. every kid is an emotional psycho around that age, hence why they shouldn't have social media access, but no, we demand justice from the cringe 12 year old, like just stop. I am sure he will just go listen to some cringe emo music, maybe go through a radiohead phase, walking round in the rain and write some cringe poetry and everything will be fine.
And how come je never talks about in_els mass spamming hateful comments in queer and neurodivergent spaces?
@@thesevenkingswelove9554 THANK YOU
Also letting things slide by saying he is 12 is crazy to me. Me and my brother weren't allowed to even cuss and still don't and the kicker is our parents never hit us once. If you don't correct kids when they do some crazy stuff like this, it will just be seen as acceptable, which it is not.
i get what he was saying about giving andrew tate airtime, but i think just ignoring someone like him could make it even worse if that makes sense. if little boys came across his content and they saw no one challenging or criticizing him for his ideals, how are they supposed to know its not ok?
Agreed
I think the fact that Andrew Tate is now synonymous with human trafficker and misogynist grifter is a good advancement. Like Noah mentioned, he wasn’t going anywhere. He’s been around for a while with his grift and it blew up because young kids thought it was sO bAsEd. He would have continued to become popular and gone unchecked if people hadn’t called him out and made it embarrassing to like Andrew Tate.
exactly' tate is a monster who brainwashes children who doesn't get stopped by ignoring him.
@@drooooop yessss public shaming can be good when used correctly. especially if ur being informative n polite while doing it.(not too polite but yk what i mean right?)
there's a reason why some things a socially stigmatized. that's literally how we create morals within a society. someone has to comment on something and say hey maybe not? for others to even think about it
I understand what your saying but from what I’ve seen by giving him so much attention it made him seem like he held a certain power. I feel like the more attention we gave him the more ppl flocked to him and to make matters worse some even started agreeing with him.
I don't think these people realise that of you get into the incel rethorics at 12 and nobody addresses it with you or helps you understand how that's not a healthy coping mechanism, this child might internalise this as a valid strategy for his life. I've heard SO MANY MEN in their 30-40 still living by the "all women are (names)" because when they were teenagers, their crush went out with another boy and that defined their entire perspective on relationships for the rest of their lives! Ignoring problems is never the solution. Education and empathy are.
Exactly. Having uncomfortable conversations is part of an educational process.
@@mousebreaker1000 n das y the gov. is tryna make people dumb
Honestly, I'm ready to go full boomer and say people shouldn't date til they're at least 18 because so many awful attitudes towards dating come from trying it in high school when you're dumb, shallow, immature, etc.
@@jeffersonclippership2588 true..... i thought my parents were just being jackasses. well, they were in other ways lol. but the one thing they were right about is not letting me date tbh. the few bfs i snuck behind their backs weren't even worth the effort.
@@jeffersonclippership2588 idk about that. i had online relationships that tended to last for 6 to 7 months. and were we immature? yes and no. we mainly talked on the phone all the time.
but those relationships were very valuable to me(they were in my age range btw) cause I learned how to talk to guys n what it feels like to have a genuine relationship not centered around physical attraction.
here's my hot take: I think highschoolers should only date each other. here's what I think for the age ranges
15-17
18-19
20-25
25-30
30-40
then whatever u wanna after that.
my reasons: ur brain doesn't fully develop until ur 25. it's not reasonable to ask people to not have a relationship until then but I do think it's a lot healthier when it's within the age range.
rn im 23 so im not sure about the 30s or whatever, I'd have to get there first to see my mental state to be fully sure.
but yeah i say that cause my bfs dad was kinda manipulated by a 49 year old women. forgot what his age was at the time but there was more than a 10 to 15 year difference.
I only suggest these age ranges so that there's no dynamic where one person has a shit ton of experience while the other doesn't. i don't like when older people go for younger people cause they donno how to fix themselves so they'll traumatize the younger generations cause their easier to manipulate.
idk im open to have conversations about this. haven't really discussed it with anyone outside of my bf. so I'd like to hear the opinions
I’ve noticed a trend in this kind of argumentation. It seems a bit of a pot, kettle argument to me, i.e.:
- Internet rando 1: “[minority group] are all [slur, insult]!”
- Internet rando 2: “what a bigoted thing to say. You sound like a [insult, possibly an exaggerated or presumptuous one]”
- Very smart UA-camr spots a comfortable looking fence, sheds a compassionate tear for Internet rando 1, and raises an eyebrow disapprovingly at Internet rando 2.
But hey, in this specific case we’re talking about misogyny, so unlike the *real* kinds of bigotry, it’s fine. We must preserve the misogynists’ precious but fragile ego before anything else. We call this the misogyny exemption (clause 5).
That’s why understanding intersectionality is important for everyone to understand: Including men who face marginalization for their race. He’s empathizing with the incel pipeline bc he’s a man but something tells me he didn’t like moistcritikal standing up for Idubbz. Or he would at least be able to see why that would upset POC. Everyone needs to empathize with the fact that oppressed demographics don’t like being oppressed and can be volatile to their oppressor to protect themselves or others.
@@urheehooit's not, but it's very much how the attitude comes off. This guy very much carries himself like he's got it figured out and now he's just preaching to us dumb dumbs, even though he's just thinly veiling his sympathy for bitter dudes and his lack of desire to criticize them.
Misogyny is the last acceptable -ism, and all of the DARVO that comes about when women talk about it is another means of perpetuating it. "well actually feeeeemales are quite privileged, all men are beaten daily and have to eat rocks and slugs from a very young age while little girls are given flowers and candies" fucking delusional.
@@Tuosma
I think he made the video to indirectly criticize these women under the guise of toxic internet culture.
There was a point he made at the end which really rubbed me the wrong way. He compares a girl being sexually harassed and assaulted her whole life to a guy being ignored his whole life as reasons why these people might be judgmental of the opposite sex. And I think that perfectly encapsulates gender discourse on the internet. Men are mad they don’t have girlfriends and women are mad because they are ASSAULTED AND FEEL UNSAFE. And we’re supposed to pretend these are perfectly equal and valid reasons to be upset at the opposite sex. I’m tired of it.
Yes, that moment put me off his video completely. Those aren't true equivalents.
C o n s t a n t l y
i think the point was that you dont know the story of the person behind the screen. i agree that he used a slightly odd example that doesnt entirely work but i think it doesnt completely take away from his point
Men should not act like they know what is like to be a woman. So many erroneous and vile conclusions are made by these know it all individuals that it is just cringey just listening to them talk from a pompous and entitled perspective.
There's a reason why solitary confinement is considered a gross form of torture, but it's a reality a whole lot of men live in every day.
I remember being that age and having days where I hadn't so much as moved my lips. It's absolutely torturous
I really enjoyed this video, when I first watched the original video I did believe the creator was being a bit too passive. While I wish we could all just ignore misogyny and it would go away I think advocating for less reactivity and adding more nuance to topics online is a better approach
yes
@@urheehoodoes he even talk about the women meme or the massive hate men give to women on insta?
@@urheehoo it was more of an enlightened centrist moment
@@urheehoohe's also a black man. Acting as though because he's 'presumably' cishet means his opinions are less important is disingenuous and is a bad argument for why someone may not have the same opinion as you
yeah i haven't watched the whole video but the parts Noah is showing don't seem the most well thought out and as someone else said they kinda reek of enlightened centrist. i'd even argue that acting like mysoginy can just be ignored and every case where misoginy is showed exists in a vacuum does come across as a guy not even trying to see things from a woman's prespective
Something that was interesting about this video was he was right about the individualism vs community talking point so the groundwork is there these concepts aren’t new to him fr he just has to ask more questions about why certain things are being said and where they come from like he used that example of that 12 year old kid tweet and he chalked it up to “that’s how kids act when their 12” but he didn’t ask himself where does that talk come from like bro is 12 talking about how “women are cheating whores” like where did he get that from? What is he perpetuating here? So I think it’s about that and also looking back and understanding who you’re willing to empathize with cause he could probably empathize with someone falling down an incel pipeline, but not understand why a woman wouldn’t express that same empathy yk
Exactly
@@Mountainlion118 I agree!! also I love your videos!!
Hey! I know you! 💖💖🏳️⚧️🏳️⚧️
Idk if i think this is "normal behavior" for a 12 year old. But again, the internet access young kids have nowadays probably contributed to that.
@@givemenameideaspls
Thank you very much❤️
I'm hoping to make it as easy as possible to help people learn about these complex issues.
I just turned 13 a couple weeks ago. There’s ton of kids at my school who say racist, misogynistic and queerphobic “jokes”. I hate how people always defend the kids I say “they’re young, they don’t know better” then how come I do? Being made fun of because I’m gay isn’t something to dismiss. I’m from the Uk and calling someone gay is seen as an insult. My brother is 5 and he called me gay as an insult, I taught him what gay meant and not to use the word in the way he used it.
I hate how people constantly forget that queer kids exist.
Let’s be honest: they don’t “forget,” they actively deny, and in too many cases would like to end, queer kids’ existence.
What...is "gay" an insult in the UK? Is it in a small city?
@@ekaterinastaneva9922 it’s all over the Uk tbh
@@Amberxxbbunni sad to hear, I thought youngsters are over homophobia
I felt and still feel exactly the same way as you. I vividly remember being 13 and knowing I was being excluded, swept under the rug as a queer kid. I hate how little has changed, but not surprised. (I'm 30)
It doesn't matter that he's a 12 year old, when I was that age I was SA'd by kids my age multiple times, I was also groped by other kids constantly, and many girls in my class and school experienced these same things, so this way of thinking can sometimes (not always) lead to something worse than name calling. This kind of behavior among boys was so prevalent that teachers used to ignore it even when they see it happening. One time I was violently groped everywhere on my body, that boy even pulled off some of my clothes and did disgusting stuff to me while I was crying and begging him to stop and it happened IN PUBLIC in the busiest part of my city in front of a lot of kids and adults and no one even tried to stop him, the kids just laughed at me. We were both 13 at that time, and I have to admit that the experience kinda left a scar, actually this is the first time I talked about it.
But him being 13 doesn't make it any less traumatizing.
I'm not saying that the boy mentioned in the video is like that, I just wanted to point out that it's false to think that boys that age are just harmless and can't do horrible things, because unfortunately it's soo common for girls to experience stuff like this, while people around them don't believe them and say "boys will be boys".
I think the best solution is to try to educate him while he's still young, to not ignore signs like this because otherwise in a few years he's going to be an adult with these same opinions, and he could do even more harm than while he's a kid. Besides it's much easier to teach good and appropriate behavior to children than it is to older individuals who are sometimes set in their beliefs and not even the greatest argument is going to change their mind. Trust me, I tried with my parents lol.
Anyways sorry for trauma dumping and all that, I just wanted to share my experiences and hopefully point out a different kind of argument for my position on the topic.
Thank you for your informative videos and I'm looking forward to your next one! Have a nice day and take care 💜
The young woman who relatively-mildly sexually assaulted me in college, who knew I was disabled, seemed to think it was acceptable. The strongest part of that memory is the witnesses in that public place (a couple of other undergrads, a femme GTA, and our femme. Ph.D.) laughing it off. Still mentally reeling, I took the cue to disregard how violated I felt. It took me years to realize that what happened really was SA, and in the meantime I mistakenly responded falsely on a survey about SA, because both the act and the immediate aftermath made me feel like I could not possibly matter.
@@Robstafarianim so sorry that happened🙁
I’m sorry that happened to you and yes young men should be taught not to act this way!
@@ciitrus111HUMANS should be taught about boundaries, centering the conversation on men is only going to push incels further into their negative beliefs. I was also assaulted by a woman, and similar to OP was told I shouldn't care since I was a man, also happened in a public place. Sexual assault is an evil, vile act, and resorting to gender tribalism isn't going to get anyone anywhere. Humans are shit to each other and we should change that.
@@gidorah Well no one said that you justhave a tendency to strawman our arguments and act like men are victims. I remember you said how I want all homeless men to suffer just for saying how you dismiss womens issues
OMG I found this video a few days ago! My thoughts were that he made good points about not caring about toxic people and not feeding into their online power complexes. I also liked that he said we should take time to listen of people of different opinions.
However, I had a big problem with him saying that both sides of an online argument are morally "the same" cause they're both hypocritical, both toxic, both yelling, etc. Essentially, it's the "both sides are rude so they both suck" argument. It's dumb debate bro logic that I've seen people use as a cover to defend normally undefendable arguments.
Example:
If person A is arguing we should commit genocide and person B is arguing against it, person B is obviously in the right. Even if they're arguing illogically, being a hypocrite, trying to cancel Person A on twitter, Person B is still morally in the right. But these guys wills say "hey, person B is Twitter cancelling Person A??? Person B is obviously unhinged and toxic and rude, we should just ignore them." Meanwhile, they gloss over the fact that Person A is arguing for commiting genocide.
Yeah, this reminds me of the original example that the original guy gave to exact his point. He talked about women hating men because of past s*xual trauma, and men who hate women bc their problems aren't ever taken seriously. You can argue that they're both the same, but one has a significantly more of a heavier weight than the other. And I honestly don't find it comparable at all for that reason.
@@AT-vp8qw my brain took psychic damage with that comparision, just goes to show their bias in the discourse
@@AT-vp8qwholy shit bro I literally commented this exact take on the original post. bros acting like being literally r worded is even in the same dimension as someone being unhappy bc they themselves need to grow as a person. Awful analogy 💀
Mmm...nah that's not what it looks like. Here's what it really looks like:
Person A is arguing we should commit genocide, however he's a faceless nobody on the internet and has no power to do what he wants. Person B claims they argue against Person B...but they go about this by rioting on the streets and causing mob violence against innocent people. Essentially, Person B uses Person A as an excuse to justify their horrendous behavior. Where or not Person B is morally righteous doesn't matter because their actions speak louder than words.
There's also the part where every time Person B tries to cancel someone on Twitter, they always turn out to be innocent people whom they wrongfully attacked because they're too pathetically immature to not make baseless assumptions.
So yeah, every time you hear a centrist say that both sides are bad, what they're really trying to say is that the left isn't as innocent as you think it is.
' different opinions' meaning actual awful people who want to harm others and don't want certain ppl to exist. yeah the first video sucks ass
Wow...if people had just 'ignored' Tate...he probably wouldn't have finally been indicted for sex crimes. Tell me you've never had to worry about being a victim of a sex crime without telling me you've never had to worry about being the victim of a sex crime. Sincerely, a victim of multiple sex crimes.
How was Tate indicted because of internet culture? Wasn't he under scrutiny because of law enforcement of the country he was residing in?
im not entirely sure about that, i don't know that his online popularity lead to any investigation. the stuff he said online certainly did - he literally admitted to multiple crimes - but i really dont think the fact that he blew up over the last couple years led to much. he's a criminal who was going to be investigated for the stuff he said online regardless of whether or not people paid much attention to him or not
@@_ikako_ let's be honest. most people who admit or have proof on them of doing horrendous things don't get investigated or even acknowledged. especially sex crimes and that just statistics. the internet's outrage and his own admittance is what lead to this investigation and his arrest. justice has never been that fair unfortunately.
@@_ikako_He was indicted because he kept bragging about how he could get away with his crimes because the Romanian authorities don’t do anything. And they did not like that. They didn’t want to be made fool of by allowing him to continue to commit crimes on their grounds and brag about getting away with it. That’s why he was arrested.
@@drooooop yeah, and none of that has anything to do with how popular he was in the wider internet zeitgeist. He already had a platform, and the stuff he was saying was raising enough eyebrows to warrant an investigation, but he didn't need to blow up so much for that to happen.
It is really sad because as a 14-year-old, who goes to high school and has friends of the same age and younger. I know all too well what kind of really messed up things are said. From racist "jokes", to misogynistic "jokes" and just other things that are really messed up. And while yes, they are "labeled" as "jokes". That doesn't make them any better. And while one needs to take into account that the people who say these, in the end, are still kids. That doesn't make them invincible to criticism and I think it is really important to point such things out. Of course, like I said before when pointing such things out. One still needs to take into account that these are young people who still need to really grow mentally.
Same here! I am 15 years old and the past 3 years were a big mess. I've got used to hearing racist, misogynistic, ableist, anti-semetic and homophobic/transphobic comments from ages 12-15. In many cases I've pointed this out on my classmates in a respectful manner with intention to educate them for their insensitive statements and they always labeled them as "jokes". I try my best to take into consideration the fact that they are kids and so am I, but I would expect a bit more understanding from them, especially when these are subjects we discuss about during certain classes. It makes me overly sad, because even when they realize they are at wrong, they keep on making uncalled for statements. I hope that they will eventually grow to have a more mature mentality
If kids don't receive any feedback that misogyny is bad actually, then we can't expect them to learn that lesson and grow, can we?
like, it literally AFFECTS the little girls that will hear those "jokes". i WAS affected by those and i still AM struggling with internalised misogyny.
Man when I was 14, my entire class was calling the teacher a jew to their face. You're doing alright lad, good head on your shoulders.
@@Sljm8Dreal. Some guys kept calling me a hurtful term in Russian that means "victim" back in school. I wish I never looked up that words translation to English. A lot of young men have no good role model. If they have a father he should step up and start PARENTING. (correctly) To respect people,no matter the gender or.. Anything else that isn't "normal"
Personally I desperately need these “preaching to the choir,” videos to help me re-connect to reason. I deal with an almost constant stream of hateful rhetoric/misinformation bc of where I am in the country. These videos help me have reasonable conversations and give me hope that other people are fighting for justice and an empathetic world.
The whole “just ignore them” thing can be so counterintuitive sometimes.
I just hope that for the twelve year old kid his parents or people around him get him what he needs whatever that might be
I guess all jews had to do was just ignore the nazis amirite??? 😂😂😂
His "circlejerk" point is terrible. I've arrived at most of my current views via argumentation. At some point I was exposed to a new framing of an issue and that new framing persuaded me.
Especially applying it to ppl like FD Signifier. Agree or disagree with him, but he understands the manosphere and really engages with those guys a lot. Like I think he said he literally went on an 8 hour live stream once lol
Me too. I was quite liberal when I was younger. Hasan, Ethan, Noah and others made me more conservative!
Absolutely. So many of my opinions have changed with being challenged by points from various people on this site. Echo chambers can absolutely form on certain websites, and more often the more extreme your beliefs are, but from personal experience, you basically have to put yourself in your own echo chamber to end up in one. My own feed has been cluttered with both right and left wing content for year and many of my opinions have been swayed by both sides into what I feel is a pretty healthy moderate state
@@tripleeyeemoji2685 liberals are conservatives at this point, u didnt change that much! no worries.
@@passiveaggresivesquirrel2052care to explain how? Go and touch grass.
Ignoring stuff doesn't make it go away, it allows it to fester.
For me it works better than thinking about it
For example: I'm insecure because no girl has ever liked me
If I keep thinking about how no girl has ever liked me I get stuck in thought loops, confused, frustrated, scared and eventually just more insecure
But if I don't think about it I don't have those confusing, frustrating, scary thoughts that make me more insecure
@@painunending4610hats good for you that all your problems come from your own head but people that are daily at the risk of getting hate crimed (usually by men, who wouldve guessed) cant just afford to ignore the fact that there are idiots out there grooming a new generation of young boys into violent reactionaries
@@painunending4610yeah but this is specifically talking about ignoring real world problems. not so much a thought in your head.
I'd go further and argue that "preaching to the choir" can be quite helpful even if it doesn't directly change anyone's mind. There's been several issues where I've agreed with someone on an issue, but my prior reasoning to get to that conclusion was a bit faulty or I'd have trouble articulating my thinking. And this person "preaching to the choir" clarified a point, or brought attention to some critical nuance, or maybe framed it in a way that deepened my understanding.
This was exactly what I was thinking, this content gives me the tools to challenge some of these problematic views effectively
So true
I think this idea of a dialectical response is great. The "responding to dumb videos" genre is overplayed, and it might be more intellectually insightful to see well thought out or at least sincere videos be in conversation with each other (academia does it all the time), so we can actually ponder over difficult questions instead of perpetually arguing about stuff we already know is disproven like alpha male discourse or gender not being a social construct. But a part of me thinks the internet right now is not ready for this level of discourse yet, I am confident a portion of your audience will interpret this video (out of habit) as a takedown of a "bad channel" and they're gonna go and harass this guy instead of approaching this as a conversation.
but responding to a dumb video isnt meant to be intellectual or insightful its just meant to be funny and easy to laugh at. weird comparison to make
@@bogeymanbear yes, but isn't it odd that "being funny" the only thing leftist commentubers seem to want to do / the only thing their viewers seem to want to watch? i'm being slightly hyperbolic (there are definitely great folks in the space who don't do *just* comedic reaction stuff) but i agree w/ greyfox that we could definitely use more content like this, making The Online Left more informed and stronger via intercommunity dialectics, and maybe a little less haha-funny all the time.
@@bogeymanbear yeah sure, and we can always have those videos, I'm just saying there are some interesting conversations to be had and not every response video needs to be hostile, sometimes it can be a friendly, insightful back and forth between two leftists with different perspectives instead of just leftists saying "this guy is misogynistic and makes bad arguments" and the right winger responding back with "I wAs TaKeN oUt oF cOnTeXt"
some leftists seem to disagree on online cancel cutlure for example and seeing soneone like Contrapoint or anyone with her stance have a back and forth with Noah about that would be very enriching to watch, creators with good channels disagreeing and constructively making critical essays on each other is an unexplored territory of the response video genre and I want to see that, or maybe that's just me, laughing at dumb right wingers is fun too don't get me wrong
@@greyfox4838 this could be really interesting but i think there is a problem with how these videos are formatted to have a proper dialectic debate, with how clunky it would feel to watch 40 minutes of one person's points then 40 of another and so on. even still i agree it would be an interesting genre to explore!
i think the internet isn't "ready yet", but not used rather. The creation of more dialectical responses, more nuances on the conversations, can be a trend with the intent to slowly break these habits from the mass little by little.
Yeah we tried ignoring the problem, all those swastikas in the bathroom stalls turned out to be legit, we just pretended it was just people being edgy.
Well and the thing about tate is that he’s not just viral, he’s a criminal. I’d say sure just ignore obnoxious ppl who are famous only for being famous if you don’t like them, but you can’t just ignore criminals away.
It's also kinda fun to watch the fucker crash and burn. It's also outlining why this person is bad. You wanna beat the dead horse of a perfect example of toxic masculinity? Yeah, honestly. The discourse around tate is "holy shit, let's watch this pos get what was coming to him."
Didn't his little spat with Greta cause the Romanian police to figure out where he was and arrest him? I mean... Probably not what she was thinking when she engaged with him, but that's at least one instance where ignoring him was not the right choice.
Holy. At least wait for the trial to end. Just cuz you dislike him doesn't mean he's automatically guilty.
And if you ignore people with opposing views you'll just get stuck in an echo chamber (like this channel).
@@jaynaii5181no
@@jaynaii5181Is it really that unbelievable? The man has literally sold courses on how to do things similar to what he's now accused of. He's been loud enough about his "webcam empire" and his reasons for being in Romania
The implication that F.D. Signifier's video on the manosphere was some big failure that was some kind of intense bias fueled misunderstanding just shows his own biases. F.D. Signifier has a deep empathetic understanding of this subject and shows it in his video.
fr, who the fuck could possibly pick up "he doesn't even care to understand the other side, he's just arguing to argue," From FD's video?
I used to be a hard core conservative and it’s coming across videos like this that got my gears turning and questioning the beliefs I was brought up with. It was not an over night process but with each new video and new perspective I slowly developed a view of a world that was completely foreign to me and only told to me through an extremely bias conservative lens. I will forever be grateful to these communities for making me into what I believe to be a better version of myself, and providing me with a sense of comfort since I feel like an outcast in my family now❤
We live and we learn. Never too late to grow as a person if you're determined to
ditto
Same with me! I used to be a very hateful and awful conservative. Now I've come to realize I'm queer and a total leftist lol. Being raised on racism and sexism is hard to break out of.
I used to be a leftist but it's Noah's videos that actually changed my mind and stopped me associating with them
@@painunending4610 Cool, nobody asked
I remember the 90s where we just pretended bad stuff didn't exist and kept moving forward. Turns out stuff wasn't OK and still needed to be resolved and actually hasn't been resolved. As far as giving problematic people a platform by critiquing them. I think it's necessary but it can also be played into. The algorithms love engagement and the best way to gain engagement is to say the most insane stuff. There are currently THREE tweets from Pearl Davis making stupid comments about how women are unnecessary on the subreddit notliketheothergirls just today. But I do think that these people only gain traction from callouts on Twitter or Facebook where you have to engage directly with them and so their reach grows. So video essays countering the culture could be effective since it balances out the SEO of said person.
Also in the specific case of Tate, and Sneako, ignoring them won’t cause them to go away because they built mini mlms that monetarily incentivizes members of their audience to spread their content around.
I watched the original video before watching this one and I’m so glad you made this response because the original video made me so angry. Not because it was bad but because it wasn’t good - Blessings is clearly a very thoughtful young man but I feel like within his video he tried to preform the “both sides” song and dance - even on issues where one side is clearly right.
The video made me angry because he was like 85% right and he was so close to teaching the right conclusion and it just felt like he hadn’t thought all of the ideas he expressed through to their logical conclusion.
I think it was good, period (though I don't agree with everything). Haven't seen Noah's video yet, but the stupid comments seem to prove his points.
Yeah, honestly, that video made me subscribe to his channel, but I certainly felt like some things were amiss. He is definitely onto something, but I felt like there were things he couldn't see past his peripheral. It was almost a bit tone deaf
centrists are the most sad and awful people ever
There’s that smug “I know the right answer attitude”. Go outside and get off this internet echo chamber shit. The video was good. You getting mad is reflection of your head being buried so far up your ideological ass that you let balanced takes upset you
@@cryfly1 yup these communities exist on both sides and have figure heads they think of as “intellectuals” who really just exist to reaffirm their own world view. Sound like a boomer but I swear human relationships were better prior to social media
I will just say if I hadn’t enjoyed the ‘callout culture’ type videos of danny gonzalez and drew gooden, I may never have become leftist 💀💀💀(greatest entryway to leftist yt pipeline)
? Who is Danny Gonzalez? There's only Drew pretending to be Danny as far as I know?
@@Tijggie82also kurtis?? Which one is that
@@skullchimes If my catholic upbringing has taught me anything, it's that Kurtis is to Danny and Drew what the Holy Ghost is to God the Father and Jesus Christ.
danny' drew and kurtis do it well tbh.
same for me but it was vaush who i no longer watch anymore
F.D. Signifier is necessary, especially within the black community.
Abuse apologia is necessary? Oof
@@jackcharlotte25oof lmao
Although I find his videos interesting and insightful as a white person, I also at times find him a bit self-indulgent and making up theories that are somewhat far-fetched.
But I don't live in America, so my views are not always aligned with those cultural aspects.
@@jackcharlotte25 you may notice those are two completely different sentences
@@jackcharlotte25 is this about jenna marbles?
cowardly ass anti-confrontational behavior bro. this reminds me of when i'm having a genuine argument with someone in a public discord server and someone comes in like "guys dont fight :(((" or when i was bullied as a kid and advised to "just ignore the bullies". trying to ignore and avoid people who spread harmful rethoric is not the "bigger person" deplatforming move blessing stranded thinks it is. at best it doesn't work and at worst it lets people get away with it. it's time to stop shaming people for fighting back against assholes
It also suggests that both opinions and positions are perfectly legit. Hate is not a valid opinion, nor should ever be treated as such. As well, the term "silent acceptance" is worth bringing up. "Just ignore the bully" assumes a bit too much good about the bully (whom does also need help, but victim first), rather than understanding the violence done is for the sake of power. Bullying is all about power, and trying to assert it over someone for a multitude of potential reasons, after all. With bullying, most people tend to be either cohorts, silent acceptors, fence sitters, or look away. Rarely do you have defenders.
The reason the existence of defenders or a victim defending themselves can/does feel threatening to the rest to me feels like it is because it calls them out on not doing jack, and makes them look bad. Something many are allergic to. Ergo, it can easily lead to also attacking the defender(s). As humans, we tend to have a bad habit of liking to side with who we feel is stronger, rather than weaker, as that actually takes some spine and putting ones own neck on the line. School bullying is an amazing microcosm to study to understand how most adults work as well. Cause, it begs to ask, where did they learn the lessons of fence sitting and silent acceptance? Perhaps by being around bullying? And so the ball bounces. Most adults are silent acceptors, cohorts, or fence sitters after all, as the existence of all these wide scale problems does prove. As if not, and most were active defenders, then these problems would be already solved. Once a lesson is learned that being thing X provides security in conflict situations, it's viable to stick for quite a number of folk, unless they put the effort in to grow past it.
seriously, ignoring only works if someone is looking for attention, thing is most hateful people aren't looking for that. They have been legitimatly indoctrinated to think that and think they are doing good by spreading their rethoric. Which is EXTREMLY harmful. Ignoring it will only let hate spread further. It's like thinking cancer will just go away on it's own if you just don't think about it. But it will only continue to grow untill the host dies.
people are trying to stop both parties from fighting because if theyd let you continue i can guarantee you would be the one severly injured, not the other party
@@morgannyan2738 are you demented? This is about word debates. And the people on the side that contains most college level education is definitely not losing rhat
Oh, that's why this triggers me. You're right, this is exactly what they would say when talking about bullying.
I think that one of the glaring problems in the internet culture video is the lack of critical thinking from the perspectives of power and privilege. Its an issue that I see so so so often when men talk about people like andrew tate (who don't like the guy) and think that the best way to deal with that brand of misogyny is to ignore him. As a women, a female assigned at birth and in the age range of the women tate would likely target, I do not have the privilege of just "ignoring him" and I do not want the male content creators that I look up to to ignore him either. When you are a man who listens to tate and believes his views are not at the onset harmful, you learn to refuse to listen to women, so my own agency is pushed to the side because this guy on the internet "makes some good points" I need people like hasan and ethan klein and fd signifier and noah samsen to actively criticize this misogyny because it is an effort to make the internet and the real world a safer place for me and for women in general, and for men too, because it is harmful to men's psyches to act this way -- also I think blessing's stranded confuses incel rhetoric for the term incel, does he not know that incels claimed that word for themselves? that that is what they actively call themselves and their community? i mean good for him to be unware of that side of the internet but like, it definitely pales his arguement
10000% agree, especially on the part of male content creators calling out Tate, *especially* male content creators who make political content and talk about social issues. It is objectively a *good* thing for male creators of Noah's size, Hasan and Ethan and FD's size, who also have a large male audience (I know a lot of women also watch these creators but I also know for a fact that a ton of dudes watch Hasan and Ethan in particular), to call out Tate's extremely harmful rhetoric and talk about *why* it's harmful. It's not just "lol he's such a dumbass." Of course those comments are made, but they also emphasize that Tate is *dangerous.* He is a literal sex trafficker and ADMITTED rapist! I find it interesting that the two example the original video brought up, were the Vice documentary about Tate and Hasan's video, both of which discussed a leaked voice note where Tate admitted to raping a woman and "loving" it, and if I'm not mistaken, both videos talk about the method Tate used that other sex traffickers use called the "loverboy method." This quite literally could be life-saving information. Being aware of the exact methods used by someone like Tate to traffic and exploit women online is VERY important so that someone can recognize it if it's being used on them or someone they know. But we should just ignore Tate?? No. No no no no. You can make that argument for someone like Sneako (although you could also argue he's pretty similar to Tate, just without the trafficking allegations). A bigot on the internet shouting bigoted things to his bigoted audience is one thing. But Andrew Tate isn't just a bigot or regular ol' misogynist, HE'S A CRIMINAL. HE'S DANGEROUS. Making the argument to just ignore him and he'll go away is incredibly wild to me, and tbh it really just comes from an incredibly privileged stance.
literally i feel this so hard as a woman people just tell me to “ignore it” yet i can’t help but notice the way men talk to me differently from other men, treat me harsher constantly make sexist comments , talk about murdering women as a joke and other shit and i’m meant to sit there and ignore it. and then these men go on to act out this shit in real life and what should women do then, ignore it as they’re getting harassed, bullied, raped and murdered??!
what is a woman?
@@morgannyan2738An adult human that identifies as a woman
@@kajamatousek247 why cant a human child identify as a woman?
It's one thing to say "hey maybe change your approach, rethink what you're doing, get rid of some of these toxic habits" but what the guy you were responding to seems to be advocating for is not engaging at all and just sitting idly by while only the most harmful ideas prevail on the internet, and *that's* what's really toxic.
when kids say stuff like that it usually means they heard it from somewhere. it’s important to encourage them to question why they said those things and that it’s harmful
i want to put my experience to this video because i think it illustrate a lot the points of noah. as a french person leaving in france, it was seeing men like andrew tate and other masculinists preaching a so-called motivating speech while founding many misogyne points that I started to take an interest in left-handed youtube. as a woman the malaise and the fear that those posts gave to my mental health forced me to find a community that tried to block and deconstruct the speeches of these people. seeing that this community was more than armed against them (im better now first 😅) reassure myself that people were using their platforms to spread a contradictory message. if this young men do not see it they cannot take it into account, and therefore reorient themselves in a moral trajectory and healthier life. thank you noah for this video!
just to clarify but i rights this 7minutes into the video… like the next point illustrate this phenomenon hihi
As a former right leaning teen I can say "call out culture " works .My turn to more progressive politics was a video of Kristina Maione calling out candance owens'(someone i looked up too ) harmful and incorrect rant on breana taylor.The video was really insightful and well researched and really made me contemplate on my current beliefs and realy made me question all the right wing content i was consuming.
I’m just wondering who taught this young boy to call women whores in the first place? There’s a reason he feels comfortable talking about women that way, that’s a learned behavior. 😕
I think it's worth mentioning that part of the motivation of spree shooters is a desire for infamy. I really wish folks making otherwise excellent video essays would stop using their names and showing their faces. Contagion effect is well-documented and minimizing spreading their deeds alongside their faces, outsider of archival/historical purposes, goes a long way toward making people safer. Thanks, Noah.
Andrew Tate's peak popularity was when no one was paying attention or challenging his views so I have no idea how anyone could claim that people calling out his bullshit has helped him. He's facing jail time now lol
I’m confused… address calling people out as bad, by calling them out?
Forgive me, I may be too old and no longer hip
Thank you! The video is so self righteous while completely lacking any self awareness 🤦🏾♀️
@@cryfly1 I see what you’re saying, but I do disagree with your argument. I honestly don’t believe being dumb is a privilege bestowed by age, but a disposition granted by one’s inability to see themselves as part of the collective. Growing up is a process of becoming less egotistical ; going from a position of ‘me’ to ‘we’.
Younger people think they have all the answers, but as they get older, they should be learning what does and doesn’t work- from intelligence, to add education and experience, to hopefully become a person of wisdom.
I find your rhetoric to be somewhat hateful and condescending because to be frank, children are the future, and if you only coddle them until you expect them to act like an adult, then you are not creating functioning adults, you’re making broken kids. It’s more correct to say he lacks self awareness because he’s young, but to think you have the answers isn’t full stupidity- it’s ego.
@@cryfly1 I’m not going to read your comment, I can tell I offended you and frankly, I can’t have a discussion with people who aren’t smart enough to keep their emotions in check…
Kids aren’t dumb- they are what we raise them.
great video! it's refreshing to see a video that's not just "oh haha here's a person spouting dumb talking points". a+ for adding more nuance and incorporating more empathy into these discussions, it's really good to see
There is no such thing as a "real incel". Sexual frustration should never be treated like a personal characteristic.
tell that to housewives with dead bedrooms
There are people who go out of their way to make it, “their personal characteristic” though, some even going so far as to self identify as said word.
@@morgannyan2738 that’s 99% of the time their own choice
I watched this video when it first came out and I was so irritated. While he does make some relatively ok points, he seems to completely lack any self awareness. Like brah, you’re doing the same shit you’re complaining about. It’s so self righteous and completely lacking of any useful solutions while bitching about how people keep making video essays that don’t solve anything. Also the fact that he compares someone like Vaush to Noah demonstrates either a clear lack of understanding and/or good faith engagement with the content.
Haha the Vaush comparison honestly made me laugh, I can't imagine two more opposite types of content 😭
His Vaush Noah comparison also shows that he did next to no research on his topic and based most of it on his personal feelings/what he saw on Twitter. Because if he had, he would see that they've actually had beef, had videos going back and forth w one another and agree on very little. Vaush himself has some pretty borderline misogynistic views himself, and is one of the biggest detractors from what leftist content creators are trying to achieve bc of his pompous debate lord nature, yet he is frequently held up as The Voice of The Left Online(both by opposition to make us all look stupid by association and by newly radicalized liberals turned leftists who dont know better), which irks me to NO end.
@@dangerxbadger2300 I feel like you missed their direct debate where Vaush destroyed Noah. Ofc Noah didnt post that, bc it made him look like a complete joke. Maybe look it up before further talk about this
@BenjoCovers no thanks. And all I said was that they don't agree on things, not that Noah was better than Vaush at debating. In fact, that's the problem I have with Vaush. He focuses on winning debates rather than furthering discourse, because he's an egotistical loser. I won't be looking it up, because I hate his pompous, condescending bullshit. Thanks for playing though.
sigh. the "just ignore it" or "just meme it out" is a very silly approach to pressing issues that REQUIRE radical change. dunking on people won't sway them from certain ideas, it mostly just will make them angry and ignoring those sorts of issues is a slimy point that works only when there is already a certain progressive consensus around the issue. what happens if the overton window leans more to the misogynystic side? being dissmissive of dangerous narratives is part of how they spread and itsg it just irks me when men try to debate or dismiss things like misogyny in the marketplace of ideas while women have to live with those "silly stupid tweets" every day in real life. we are fed up. for us its not just a silly thing that a 13 yo said, but a trend of thinking and socialisation in this world, we hear this shit every day.
nothing fucking changes if someone dunks on a transphobe and our indiffrence and lack of ACTUAL radical action is exactly what led us to the situation we face now. WE drew the shorter stick because its OUR ideas that require significant amount of deprogramming.
Yes all of this! Create silly goofy memes about the flat earthers. But misogynistic worldviews have real consequences. Large numbers of men buy into it, and the women in their lives have to face their bs. School teachers have been raising concerns of how so many young boys influenced by this content are making their classrooms unsafe for the girls. And it also impacts how men treat their daughters, their partners, their female employees, colleagues, etc. I dont know how it can be made clearer that content radicalizing boys and men = BAD
@@th9nj9 YEP! and also, being exposed to shit like misogyny while being a literal child just makes it easier to adopt more sexist misogynystic ideas and harder to deconstruct them later on
Counterargument: you have to meme it out, because that is what young boys do on the internet to people they don't like. Dunking on people and memeing it out is how you change the minds of young boys.
young girls are the only ones who change their minds from talking about "feelings" and "emotions". (there are exceptions, of course)
Why does blessing stranded keep citing how like 200 crazy hyper online twitter users say something crazy then assigns that to every person that has ever used the internet?
I got like a minute into blessing's video and realized it was more "enlightened centrism", glad Noah was able to break it down
“Centrism” as you call it is actually just living in reality and level headed. It ls idiotic to think that there are obvious correct answers for everything. There’s a reason both “sides” of the internet constantly attack centrism as bad thing because it doesn’t buy into the echo chambers and group think that y’all love. There’s a reason people in the real world don’t respect this internet shit.
@@pc3340 see there needs to be nuance but you can't have nunance in issues that activeky harm people and insult them. We can't have nuance in in_els harassing women online, sure they ate miserable going through things but there is no justification for @buse
@@thesevenkingswelove9554 bruh the argument can be made that anything causes harm. The percentage of incels that harm women is low af. Most are just weird dudes who can’t get laid.
@@pc3340 not only is it idiotic it is childish and naïve
i think my main problem with the video as a whole is its cynicism/doomer vibe. i don't find that particularly helpful when discussing issues. i always like to believe in the possibility of hope and change
Well some other people don't. Let them have their space
Thanks Noah. I had seen the original video a few weeks back, and while I mostly appreciated the argument of practicing compassion, it didn't sit well with me how Blessings played down the effect of misogynistic rhetoric. I appreciate how thoughtful & nuanced your response is.
There was a top comment in the original video. “I’m anti hrt for people under 18 and then people labeled me a conservative.”
Like, sorry. Hrt helps tons of people under 18. Being against it makes you look conservative because it’s an anti trans talking point that doesn’t have anything behind it. It’s not “toxic internet culture” to point this out”
Is it really a good idea though in all cases? I know a few people who thought they were trans when they are young but eventually realized they weren’t. Does it not make sense that for many children it’s not a good idea until they are adults because the effects can be irreversible and permanently damaging?
Typical leftist, doesn't even care about the poor teenagers that find out too late they are not trans.
@@leilameow9582 god damn did I say all cases? I’m not a doctor. I’m not the one who should bed making those decisions for people.
@@leilameow9582 hrt doesn't "damage" anyone, kids aren't put on hormones in most cases anyways it's just puberty blockers. Young people should be able to get medical treatment. Otherwise no other form of medical intervention should be allowed on underage people just in case they regret it.
@@leilameow9582 natural hormones in puberty are just as damaging to trans people if we want to talk about it that way...
Touching grass is very important!
There's something that always rubs me the wrong way when someone goes down the cynical "both sides are doing this as circlejerk entertainment for their audiences" route. I mean isn't that doing the same shtick, just for people who see themselves as "independent thinkers" or derive entertainment from that kind of content? Everyone creator does it to an extent. These videos or "think pieces" can exist for a multitude of reasons (entertainment, information, validation, etc), so even if it "fails" to "change minds" (which you show that they can), it can still serve a different purpose. Depsite this, I liked the overall message he was getting at and the way you responded to it - kudos Noah!
As a teen I was SA’d by a fellow student a year above me and heard other boys at my school calling girls sluts, bitches, whores, and even the lesbian slur/d-word. Not all, but enough boys continuously treated us girls like things, insulted us and made lewd comments, and did not listen to nor respect us in the academic setting, especially in the AP science classes… this kind of behavior started in elementary school and continued throughout high school. Later, in college I was again SA’d and harassed and still heard the misogynistic comments and treatment even with boys who I considered friends for a time. Now a few years later I still have a hard time trusting men because, again, while it’s not all men, it’s enough to the point where a part of me fears all men. By not holding young boys accountable for their misogyny, you allow them to become misogynistic men. Saying “well, they’re young. Young people say dumb shit.” And then insinuate or straight up say you shouldn’t shame them for that behavior is insane to me! How are they supposed to learn that that is not okay? Just because they themselves are young, if an adult believes in the same thing and worse, acts on those beliefs, it is much more serious. By shutting it down in youth you are hopefully preventing them from continuing the bad behavior in adulthood.
I think there have technically been "non misogynist incels", I remember the subreddit "incelswithouthate" and before it got flooded with misogynistic posts when all the main incel subs got banned it actually had what looked to be genuine posts about their frustrations with dating, their looks, their lack of social skills etc.
After it got flooded by the other incel subs I do think that those people probably just identify as "lonely virgins" now rather than incels, as the term has become irredeemable.
Exactly what came to mind
I remember that sub. It was good and nice, even if some normies still invaded to make fun of us
It was when r/braincels got banned that the incels there migrated, and then that was banned soon after. Now there aren't many good places to post about that stuff
I remember, when I was in 8th grade I was saying some misognyistic things (thank god i had no SM at the time). I think I mainly got via my friends, hard to remember? Anyway, one of my teachers heard it and she contacted my mother. My mother gave me a good talking to when I got home. I remember her asking why I believed/ was saying these things, I told her something along lines, " well you stay home all day cooking anf cleaning, etc. Plus there are no or very few women ceo's or politicians." I think she thought for a second and then asked essentially what i would think about if men were forced to do things women do and vice versa. I said i wouldnt like that, so she asked essentially then why do you want to do that to women, and i said idk. Note i was very emotionally distraught during this altercation because i loved my mom and i didnt want her to be angry at me, and shes really scary when she is 😬. This confrontation, immediately made reconsider my position and beliefs and change to non-misogynistic one(this is not an exaggeration). I'm not sure if she remembers this but I certainly do and think about once in a while. It was definitely a watershed moment for me. So yes we should challenge 12yo's being bigotted in whatever form. They may have some idea of what they are saying but not fully comprehend the impact it can have on both them and the people around them. If they can be confronted especially by an respected elder a lot views can be changed much earlier on. Unfortunately many people do not have what I had and the adults in their lives may not care or actively indoctrinate these beliefs into there kids. I'm lucky I had such a strong willed mom.
My friend's mom overheard 8 yr old me make fun of a boy for wearing a pink shirt. She asked me what was wrong with that, & I couldn't answer her. I didn't actually know *why* it was worthy of mockery, just that it was Different, & that was Bad. I was too young to understand. & yet it was incredibly formative to be made to account for myself, & I think it helped make me a more critical thinker.
yes the word INCEL has evolved from its original meaning, because thats how language works! my brother is now married but he still maintains the views he held as an agry INCEL growing up, which have shaped his views on women and mens "Traditional role" as an adult. technically he does not fit the traditonal definition of an involuntary celibate, but he definately maintains the ideology of one
I deeply pity his poor wife.
@@ameliasellers6396 it's highly likely the wife doesn't care. people often choose their burdens in life. you make your bed, you lay in it, so on and so forth.
If you have sex you're not an incel
Your brother is a misogynist, that's it. Call him a misogynist
Words have meaning, use them
Otherwise you should be alright with me calling myself a 'slut' even though I've never had sex
I agree that we shouldn’t just call any ol fella having a hard time an incel, but the word serves a purpose to quantify that kind of behavior. It’s supposed to be really offensive to hear yourself refereed that way because you aren’t supposed to be that. As is leftist tradition, I won’t call you whichever gross group when you stop acting like you’re a part of it.
This
Yeah but it could also make them resent the group that calls them these things
So? Their feelings about being told the truth of what they are are *their* responsibility to deal with. If you go around only calling people out who you think are gonna be receptive, you're gonna stay awful quiet in the face of a whole Lotta injustice
Tldr: truth hurts. 🤷♀️
But who are you to determine how they act? Also, the term incel is meaningless AF due to overzealous feminists wearing it out
@@christopherbrown5409awww who hasnt had a shag in their entire life 😢 poor you
I think it's pretty evident that disengagement as a means to counteract radical controversy isn't effective because the commentator did so and he still got that stuff in his feed.
i know nobody will see this but i think this message is important. i am someone who was radicalized on youtube by the likes of jordan peterson, the quartering, prager u and the like. the first time i saw a hassan video i thought he was an idiot.... the 2nd time i still thought that.... then i saw someone else's video and thought they were dumb too. it took several videos. i couldn't tell you how many, but it took several videos undeniably debunking topics the people i was following made until i came to the conclusion that the people i was listening to, were indeed lying and misleading me. all these videos dissecting these toxic creators are incredibly important. i am literally watching as at this moment my own father and sister are now being radicalized by the same jordan peterson who radicalized me 10 years ago. these people are still dangerous
Dope af
people do see this comment and it speaks to who you are as a person to be willing to change and admit your ways of thinking were worthy of changing. you’re a cool dude if you can look inward and decide to criticize the reasons why you think the way you do. peace and love :)
I am really glad someone made a nuanced and thought out response to this video and clarifying things in a way that helps both sides understand eachother
The only problem here is how algorithms works. They only feed you videos with same spectrum as you watched. We ended up boxing ourselves and become closed minded.
I'll like YT add tab features "not recommended for you" Or something like that to challenge your bias.
I find videos like yours (and other breadtube videos) really helpful as someone who is, shall we say, a member of the choir being preached to. Not only because I always have more to learn and more perspectives to consider, but I also struggle with expressing my views to my pretty close-minded family, and hearing my views articulated in a clever and thought-provoking way is really helpful when it comes to discussing such topics in a way that makes sense to them. I really appreciate what you do, and I think reducing it down to 'preaching to the choir' does a great disservice to work like yours and other people in your circle. Keep up the good work!
I feel like there are so many people (myself included) who have the best intentions but can't help but feel defeated in their own spaces and i think responses like these are super important.
I used to be pro-life
Bi-phobic
Fatphobic
Creators like drew, Danny, Ryan, Peethan, gabi, you, etc. Helped me realize that I was a huge dick hole and I'm not that way anymore. So I think you guys can change other people to be better.
happy you changed ❤ have a nice day
Dude LITERALLY all of those people have helped me too oh my god lol
actually curious if you meant homophobic or if you were fine with gay people but bi people was where you drew the line LOL
@@violetbitch9492A surprising amount of conservatives are like that ngl.
@@ameliasellers6396 damn i had no idea, i wonder what the reasoning behind that is cuz what
as someone who's part of the "choir" i really appreaciate these videos because they make me feel like there's some hope left. I feel really scared and powerless when i see hateful and regressive rethorics being so prominent in the mainstream nowadays. Seeing people still being rational and good gives me some peace of mind and keeps me a bit more stable.
I think blessings stranded seems to be pushing something positive
I also want to bring up, especially with the first kid, you should not be in a relationship when you are 12. I also rushed into my first relationship in 8th grade because our patriarchal culture told me that was what my self worth should be based off of. It is incredibly harmful.
leave the patriarchy, and form your own society, problem solved
@@morgannyan2738 Are you broken?
@@dylanschmeichel2008 you say the patriarchy forced you into a relationship , so leave the patriarchy and form your own society.
A buddy of mine teaches 8th grade in Switzerland. He told me that during dissecting a news article about Anrew Tate about 8 boys in his class tunred out to be avid fans of his, trying to defend him etc. This shit won't go away if we ignore it, it won't get better if everything he does and says goes by without criticism. He will thrive without the attention of his critics, he will thrive even more I'd argue. He is an aggressive force, determined to take over as much young minds as possible, and he already has a devoted army behind him. Standing by and doing nothing can't be the solution. You can't ignore a powerful invasive force into stopping.
The problem I have with blessing stranded’s “preaching to the choir” argument is that he himself is also making a video and calling out other creators by screenshoting them, is that HIS video is doing the same thing.
If he has enough reasoning or evidence to justify making a video that is critical of other people, then the creators he’s critical of most likely felt the same.
Exactly, it's actually hypocritical
I don’t believe your videos have failed. Or many of those content creators Blessing brought up, especially FD Signifier - brother how you going to call that man or his videos a failure. Just because he has an audience, one he doesn’t cater to but love to hear his thoughts and challenges the status quo. Thank you (and a lot of those creators) for sharing your thoughts and the work you’ve put in. It takes a lot of bravery and knowledge to put yourself out there and continuing to learn.
Love you, Noah. As a fellow mullet king, I applaud your ability to explain complex ideas and concepts in a digestible way. In the words of post-apocalyptic radio DJ Freedog, keep fighting the good fight.
It's actually Three Dog. Otherwise, good job, mate.
Seriously, it’s annoying how people expect little girls to tolerate shitty behavior from boys, but boys being called out and dealing with the consequences of their actions is somehow going “too far.”
Ikr? It's BS people think it's inappropriate to send 100k anti-fans to hate mob a child for an emotional outburst. Who tf does he think he is? A child? No, he has according g to Noah the same responsibility as an adult and we all need to collectively harass this child until he realizes the error of his ways. This is a bad look, sweaty. Don't hatemob kids, it will bring GOVERNMENT intervention if you talk them into suicide or something like that.
I agree that's far too prevalent nowadays but the original video wasn't really saying to "tolerate" that behavior or anything of the sort. He wasn't saying that it was "too far" to call him an incel, just incorrect. Now I don't really agree with the logic he used to get there. Because he gave the examples of kids also joking about racism or antisemitism, implying that it wouldn't be fair to call those kids racists or antisemites. Which I don't think is good logic, because as Noah said, those kids are using the same rhetoric as people who in any other circumstance we'd call incels/racists/antisemites. BUT the point was never that it's "OK" or "Tolerable" for children to say these harmful things, just that it's common for them to do so. So I agree with what you're saying here but implying that the original video thought that is kind of disingenous to the actual point I feel, even if the point itself wasn't very good.
Love what you're doing here, and I hope that this evolves into a discussion that builds consensus about tactics & strategy for content like this among the creator community
Nah i hate that equating bs. Half of us are defensive, the other half is offensive. And ignoring it is how it got this psychotically out of control in the first place. I worry younger people are missing so much context for all of this.
regarding the first point; OP’s problem is he admits kids spouting misogyny, and even racism is just normal and to be expected when its fully not. it is not a necessary requirement or stage to go through growing up and IS actually a serious indicator of possible future escalated bigotry or even violence. almost all violent extremists are introduced to uncritical bigoted ideas at that age and further pushing them as “normal” will only make MORE violent extremists
The clarity of the discussion in this video is profound. It's refreshing to see you use empathy and criticism to promote their use in the digisphere
Hasan and your content, among many others, have had an incredibly impact on changing certain negative traits I held on to due to the environment I grew up in. Your "toxic call out content" made me a better person. It made me see things from a ... new perspective.
This was a great video. It had the kind nuance that is so needed and helpful.
I definitely agree that there's something good to come from videos that might be "preaching to the choir" I have family and people in my life who often spew conservative rhetoric and frame it in a rather manipulative way at times and it leaves me struggling to respond to their assertions, also because I struggle with confrontation. Watching videos that go over those same talking points and certain manipulative argument tactics used helps me to get my thoughts together and recognize the arguments, why they might be wrong or misleading, and points me to research to support counterpoints.
You’ve grown so much when it comes to retorts and responses, love to see it
he literally ate and left zero crumbs
Damn I’m actually glad you covered this person cause I remember a little while ago I found his video in my recommended and he just gave off super weird centrist vibes. Like- he would make some decent points here and there but ultimately he was most obviously finding himself in the middle, trying to please EVERYONE, including the very incels he was doing his best to argue against. With the internet, you can’t be like this because you can’t please everyone. You just can’t. There will always be someone to disagree with you. And also…Yeah. Andrew Tate was a super terrible example for the “Deplatforming/not-talking-about-it-and-moving-on” argument not only for what was mentioned in your video but also because he’s an actual freaking criminal who, unfortunately, had real life influence on so many people. The internet figured out he was an overall pos and a fraud, but also that he was facing all of those r-word/human trafficking allegations and because of that, many people wanted to spread that message and get people aware of A. That Andrew Tate is a fucking criminal and B. How damaging misogyny can truly be. I’d argue that if it weren’t for the internet taking hold of Tate and spreading much-needed awareness, then his arrest and conviction would never have happened and he would still be committing heinous crimes in secret. Censorship doesn’t help situations like this, especially when we are talking about someone who is a very real and very dangerous criminal.
Also would like to add that his whole point of “the best way to solve problems is to not talk about them” is very toxic, especially when you apply the idea to something like politics. Politics controls our world, and there are many groups of marginalized people who are affected by these systems every single day. Like Noah explained, I won’t be logging off, and it’s good to argue and fight for those people instead of going offline, sitting back, and ignoring it. Sure, these ideologies can start from neutral places on the internet, but it’s the thought process itself that becomes harmful. It’s like the school bullying analogy that we were all taught. The infamous bystander is equally at fault. And the same applies here. It’s obvious that this dude doesn’t realize that people find comfort, joy, and/or safety in content such as Ryan’s. Because guess what? The other side (Matt Walsh’s) is arguing for those same people finding happiness in those videos to be unalived and stripped of their rights. It’s clear-cut. You cannot deny that.
In my opinion, your privilege starts to show as soon as you say stuff like “I don’t get into politics, it doesn’t really affect me,” as well as when you degrade online communities (that were built from the ground-up) to just “preaching to the choir.” It absolutely oozes of ignorance. Real people are affected by real life politics. Real people are finding these videos and feeing seen, heard, and respected.
Again, very very weird, offputting centrist vibes from this person.
Great video Noah🤠☝️
What’s wrong with being a centrist?
@@ijustwannasleep0488The main issue with centerism is that it falls into the trap of equating issues as being equal simply because they are a concern to people. For a brief example, they equate a right wing individual's disdain for word policing, as being just as valid as a left wing individual's disdain for hearing/seeing slurs. The main factor here is that slurs are inherently harmful, offensive, and perpetuate further violence against the minority groups in question, and there should be limits on freedom of speech in the sense that it should not be used to perpetuate further harm. In these sorts of examples, the points of "I am sad because I feel like I can't express my opinions in the way that makes me confident", and "I am sad because I am exposed to harmful and dangerous dehumanising language", are equated as being just as valid.
Using the above example, Centerism gives validity to points equally, where in reality, arguments ARE in fact often weighted, and there is a correct thing to do. Morally a person seeking to avoid a form of persecution via the exposure of slurs is much more valid than someone's ability to feel like their freedom of speech is being infringed upon - a better question is to ask why this theoretical person believes freedom of speech equals a right to use harmful and dangerous language.
Centerism tends to aim to appeal to both sides of the political spectrum in order to avoid discourse, encourage unity and prompt more nuanced discussion. However, this does not take into account how silence on particular issues further perpetuates harm to victims in some instances. It is also indicative of being in an environment of inherent privilege, as a Centerist has the luxury of being able to approach a point with neutrality because the issue in question does not affect them. Look at the UK at the moment. Trans people are facing constant veiled attacks and outright abhorrent treatment by government officials, with the threat of more on the way. Of course, the trans population is extremely small when compared to the cisgendered population, but we fight everyday for our safety because we are scared of what will happen if we stand idly by as our rights are stripped from us and we are continuously attacked and demonised by the same government officials who are meant to act in the interest of the safety of their citizens, of which we are. It is easy for someone not in the community to not be vocal about trans issues, because they are unaffected by the same things that plague trans people - ie: they have the luxury of not being threatened.
So using that example, I'd like to bring it back to how Centerism and Centerist views do often equate conflicting viewpoints as having the same value, when inherently there is not often as much nuance to a discussion. There are inherent rights and wrongs in a situation, and silence or fence-sitting on a discussion often equates to silence or a lack of support to those who are genuinely affected by whatever is being debated. For some people, a debate is a debate. For others, it is a defense of their very way of life and their physical safety.
Silence on a topic can enable violence towards the persecuted, and not taking a stance on certain viewpoints further allows threats to be perpetuated against victims. We must stand together against oppressors to actively deplatform harmful individuals.
@@AgentTroller thank you for the explanation. I was a bit confused on the negative aspects of someone being in the center/Centrist. I guess I mostly viewed it as someone that is neither left or right but in the middle when it comes to certain topics. But it seems (correct me if I’m wrong) from your definition and example a centrist never fully agrees with one side or the other they tend to always fall in the middle on anything no matter how one side or the other argues for or against the topic. I guess you can say there always the person that wants to play devils advocate in a way?
ua-cam.com/video/zhTsZq4Wk-0/v-deo.html
@@ijustwannasleep0488I think a centrist agrees with certain points the left or right makes. The biggest issue that I see whether it's left or right is that if I have a opinion that's remotely left or right they box me right in there. Like for example, I'm talking about student loan forgiveness and how it should happen and this guy just assumes that I'm on the left because I said that and no conservative would say that. I just dislike how black and white everything as of now.
this was a very good representation about what i thought of this video, and it was way more delicately worded than anything that i could come up with. thank you!
i appreciate you reading actual comments word for word. everyone has their own story . many youtubers can try to lump their comments into a majority to fit their personal perspective, like 'everyone who commented feels this way' and i dont really think thats authentic and good
Typically Tate fans before they were introduced to his content, were already subject to his support, merely just finding bias confirmation in his videos and supporting him thereafter.
Because of this I feel like the issue of tate getting too much exposure in oppositional manner, doesn't drastically change the outcome his impact on social media, but deter people from wanting to face the same scrutiny in social dynamics as his fans tend to. (Due to the exposure) Considering its less about him spreading misinformation and more about misogynists platforming him as a leader. So as a means to suppress his reach, I find that putting attention against him is neccessary. Its what helped get him banned from platforms and exposed criminally.
I love this video and I love Blessings video. I think Blessings video for me was (maybe) a perspective of a typical person who isn’t indulged in online discourse. I think some of Blessing’s points miss the mark a little bit but I don’t think that’s purposeful. I think the overall attitude of the video however (the everyone has an opinion on everything and nobody is listening to each other vibe ) is definitely felt though. When people are calling each other divisive words without any argument or explanation, it just further isolates the individual rather than makes the person understand where they went wrong and how they can improve. Telling someone there an “incel” without explanation as to why it’s wrong just creates a hostile/intimidating environment, and nobody’s willing to hear anything anyone is saying if they just feel attacked without any grace.
Some of the comments are great on here too, but some people “predicting” that something bad will come out about
Blessing is abit trifling icl. Thinking he’s some type of villain because he doesn’t have a similar opinion to you about a situation is mad
he's a boring ass centrist who
probably did engage in certain behaviours online and thinks that making a video talking all intelectually won't make people notice his actual views. he compared a girl being sa'd multiple times to a guy being forever alone. for fuck's sake, wake tf up
Thank you for this video Noah. I watched Blessing’s video and came off it feeling almost exactly the same as you.
I agreed with some of the things he said but I disagreed with a lot. One of the things I realised after watching the video is that some people can’t afford to ignore certain things people say or do on the internet.
Minorities can’t afford to be silent when people say things online that turn societies hostile toward them.
Also, FD signifier and Intelexual Media are some of my favourite creators because they show me a unique black perspective on a lot of issues.
Khadija Mbowe, Broey Deschanel, Shanspeare and a host of other great creators exist and they do great work with their videos.
Thank you for this video Noah. Well done!
i never leave a commentary video like yours without recognizing a different idea or way of thinking. even when i would put myself in the “choir” section i still am able to recognize parts of myself that need to be worked on even if i’m in agreement with everything in the video. growth is not linear and deprogramming takes time. it’s important to preach to the choir when the choir is continually changing and growing.
Thanks for this perspective. I agree with you. There seems to be some "common sense" idea that, if you ignore problems, they will go away, and if you speak up about them, they will get worse. But anyone who has been bullied knows that ignoring the problem is what makes it worse. If no one pushes back, people who say and do horrible things feel safe to continue saying and doing horrible things, and the recipients of their attacks feel more unsupported and afraid. I want the opposite situation. People who say and do horrible things should not feel safe to harm others, and the targets of their words and actions should feel safe from these attacks. This will never happen if people avoid conflict and hope it all goes away on its own. So much of what many people describe as "toxic internet culture" is just the conflict that occurs when people push back on harm that hasn't been widely criticized before.
Hi Noah I love your videos, I'm a big fan of Hasan as well and it bothers me when people generalize Hasan fans as following him blindly and stuff like that. I think you said it really well, people feel seen and represented by content creators sharing experiences. I think comparing people like hasan and Ryan to Matt Walsh is super unfair because Matt Walsh fans actually do believe everything he says usually. I don't watch your videos or Ryan's or Hasans because I need to know what I'm supposed to think, I watch because I learn new things from open minded creators who are open to learning, empathizing, asking questions and sharing real life experiences
It always cracks me up when people accuse Hasans subscribers of following him blindly and saying Hasan's streams are just an echo chamber.. like. Have they ever watched an actual stream of his? He's constantly screaming at idiots who are trying to dunk on him in his chat 😂😂😂 I'd say he has more people in there who completely disagree with him than people who are fully aligned with him on everything.
I think it's funny that for some reason he skips the other 'enlightened centrists' (a.k.a. pretty clear right wingers in favour of mass shootings of protests) despite their communities literally acting like cults and cyber stalking/attack/harassing anybody that opposes their leaders. Meanwhile Hasan's getting attacked by half the internet for saying things he never said, if anything he's probably one of the biggest victims of cult attacks in the space despite him often saying shit I disagree with. You can tell a lot by who he goes for and who he doesn't despite this supposedly being about callouts being toxic. Weirdly his flattening of clearly good and clearly bad things and his tacit support of the harassment of women lines up with the standard enlightened centrist ramblings.
I highly disagree that there are any good points in the video outside of a genetic spend time offline and stop callouts or appealing to 'cults' which he clearly isn't following himself, his targets in this video at 1 to 1 with arguably one of the worst cults on the net outside of Kiwifarms who follow a cult leader who admits he lies to hurt is enemies and benefit himself and that his content revolves around drama. Saying the video has any good points is like saying Andrew Tate is insightful or a benefit to young men because he tells them to work out, it totally misses the substance of his discourse which is the most generic centrists right wing view possible that is inherently hypocritical.
Weirdly
Needing to Feel seen by someone on the internet is kind of sad though it just breeds sad parasocial relationships that make people have ideas of who these people are even though they don't really know them
@@realhillkell I think people are able to have healthy relationships with content creators as an entertainment form. I don't really have a lot of friends, but content creators can fill that role of validating opinions while I maintain my understanding that these are people who I only see snippets of, and they deserve to have their boundaries respected. I'm fully aware I don't know these people. It can be especially validating for queer and trans people who are surrounded by unsupportive family members to hear someone express those thoughts proudly to the world. I think it's okay to find joy in seeing others be expressive :)
@@juliasutton8634 I understand especially with your part on queer and trans people it's definitely not easy for them to find acceptance in real life but there is no denying that the internet still exposes them to just as much hate (as they encounter in real life) as it does love and my theory is when the algorithm pushes the thing that you love and things that you hate equally it only serves to make you more defensive and radical which ultimately will serve no purpose but to make you angrier with the other side and stick very closely to one side with no nuance or very little nuance
I showed my normie friend the Hassan Tate debate and it totally changed his view of Tate. He was super receptive to what Hasan had to say. Obviously, that’s anecdotal, but I agree with Noah that people talking about Tate’s garbage views can at time turn people away from that kind of logic.
There's a real fine line between blocking everything you don't like so you don't see it (and ending up in a bubble) and only interacting with what you disagree (and tainting your algorithm to only show you those things to boost engagement). At the end of the day, most platforms aren't made for nuanced discussion. My own solution is to just not engage (aka I limit my bubble to UA-cam and don't use other social medias nearly as often lol)
The funny part about this is when I came to Noah’s channel I was conservative. I wasn’t even trying to expand my views yet, I just thought he was funny. Eventually I realized I should probably explore the other side of things instead of blindly buying into the rhetoric my parents raised me with. I started Noah’s channel saying “I’m a conservative” then I would watch his landlord video and be like “I’m a moderate” and now honestly I say “I’m a leftist” lmao. Every time I’d watch a video I’d be like “wait wtf I completely agree with that” then do outside research. This shit works!
I definitely have to agree with your point about platforming. If it wasn't for people like Hbomberguy doing videos on the alt-right I would have probably fallen a bit deeper into the pipeline
i am SOO glad you decided to talk about this noah i watched this video the other day and had some big issues with it. it gave off a vibe to me of not really understanding misogyny online. which is totally fine and i get it, i wouldnt understand it either if i wasnt a woman but still. also the "both sides" - ing of, for example, hasan piker and andrew tate. like, hasan is not andrew tate and he doesnt use his platform like andrew does. his streams are nuanced and empathetic. that was probably my biggest issue. ONE MORE THING, comparing ryan beard to matt walsh is certifiably insane lol
Same. I started watching the video but completing it was difficult. The 'well both sides do it' argument was so painful to get through
god i love noah salmon
me too
Same I love Noah Simone
I love you Andy
The value in these videos for me is hearing how you articulate your arguments. I would love to see more.
Loved this video! Conversation need to be had, also within groups that agree on the large subjects
It’s so nice to see you again, Noah! Hope you’re well.
14:17
I agree
I saw this Blessing Stranded video a week ago and was disappointed by the perspective that he thinks people should just roll over, at least that is how I view it once you distill the essence of his message. Keep up the good work, and keep on calling these ideas out. This method is just one tool in the tool box, but it is effective for those who are naturally curious and stumble upon the videos. Other tools for other types of people, that's all.
great video! love that it wasn’t just a diss on their original upload. seems well intentioned for sure and this discourse is helpful i think.
i dont like how the original video handwaved away the misogyny as just like 'silly goofy words'
Hey Noah, thank you for all the effort you put into your videos ❤ I was always a leftist but channels and videos like these help me articulate everything I’m feeling, and seeing a man addressing the dangerous misogyny of other men really truly warms my heart. Gives me hope lmaoo. Have an amazing day 🫶