Interesting design, great rig for single handing. Some trade off going to weather but quite fast. Sails are trimmed like headsails vs mainsail. Unstayed masts will unload in puffs aiding in trim. I like the concept. Great builders in So Africa also.
This could be the perfect start for me to get myself to own a my first live aboard boat and go anywhere, by getting the kit and building it, awesome, thanks a lot for sharing.
Great interview with one of the top designers. Would definitely like more with Jeff Schionning, especially his thoughts on multihulls, since he's a major performance multihull designer.
This looks like a water rocket ship. It appears to be very simple, clean and efficient in the layout and design. Thanks for sharing the interview. Best to Randi and Morgan.
That's pretty close to the boat that has been taking shape in my head over the last couple of years, largely influenced by watching Simon Carter on his (last century) Noelex 30. If those were still being built Carter's channel would have sold a hundred by now. But a new version would be considerably stronger and get on the plane easier. Most yacht designs are the end point of adding forces that work against each other. I see no net benefit in a massive rig to drag a massive lump of lead through the sea. Also inspiring is The Sailing Frenchman with his amazing mini transat. The only thing missing from such designs though appears to be comfort. Great for anyone not prone to sea sickness.
This channel takes an interesting direction! Good choice of boat for an interview with the designer. I would much like to see more in depth presentations of ships that are a bit different.
I've been looking for a similar design for three years. Google isn't as smart as everybody thinks. I've spent a couple months worth of hours searching for something like this, and it's been around for years. Great video Jordan.
Love this concept and it would be great to hear from a design legend like shionning on any of he's other designs. If you do speak with him again can ask if he has any plans to scale up the trouble maker in the future?
@@LearningtheLines not because I’m Israeli, because I’m a sailor I’d like to send you this link. Hopefully It’s would be a good match. I love the water as long as I can go fast without an engine. So kitesurfing, foiling of all kind, wind surfing... I sail quite a bit and i. Was always baffled why are there are so few fast planning yachts and why aren’t there more wings and foils in yachting. I hope this is the cannery in the mine. www.onesails.com/international/technology/wing-sails/wing-sails please pass it to the troublemaker team.
A really interesting design. I have a hard time imagining a two metric ton 30 footer as a blue water cruiser. Maybe I'm just old fashioned. I like the keel design. Short, deep keels should not be simply bolted to the bottom of the boat, the way longer, shallower one is. I would call the rig a "kooner". It is really more of a schooner than a ketch, as the two mainsails appear to be of equal size. So, I would expect more schooner like performance upwind, dispite the short, deep keel. I can imagine with maybe one ton of stores and cruising gear aboard, she might bog down noticibly. I would also like to know her stability curve with the keel halfway extended. It would be interesting to see one of these built and actually cruised long distance as a live-aboard boat (a requirement, in my mind, for any boat to be called a blue-water cruiser). Maybe he should call this boat an off-shore capable coastal cruiser, which to me, it actually is.
This is one of your most interesting videos. I used to crew on a monohull racer on LIE, and some old classics, 30 years ago. Discovered cats in 2000, and looked into Wharrams. Self building a cat is a lot of work with the 2 hulls, so this option seems pretty nice. Unstayed mast on a trailerable boat seem like they would be a lot of work? Also, something a little bigger would be nice for cruising, although the added beam might compensate for reduced length. But, another great video. Thank you
I have been enjoying your videos of Sailboat reviews for a while now and enjoyed them all... Like one of your viewers said, I do like this post as well... Not just reviewing some old or existing boats and tech, you are introducing new tech and possibly where the industry may be heading... I will be contacting the builder in Costa mesa this weekend to see when they will have a finished boat we can all test on the water... I will let you know what they say... Thank you again for your post. Really enjoyed it! Keep it Going! You have lots of people on your side and enjoy your down to earth way of presenting the boats and new technology. Happy Holidays. :)
Any chance we can see what the 10.5 looks like ? I've inquired about a custom design. Debating between 10.5m and 12 m. Would be really curious to see what the 10.5 looks like
Cool boat. I heard him mention the “Laser” which of course is a Bruce Kirby design, and his design of the “Norwalk Islands Sharpie” seem quite similar with its unstayed fully battened cat ketch rig between 18-29 ft which are also trailer sailors. I have the original NIS 31 built back in 1990 with a cold molded hull and she’s still sailing in FL. Her design weight was 8,500 pounds. The rig is a traditional fully battened ketch with a honda 15 outboard raised and lowered in the lazarette through a trap door which is closed when sailing to reduce drag. Her draft with centerboard and rudder retracted is only 18 inches. Max draft is 6.5 ft for knifing to weather. The harder the wind blows the less board you need. These types of boats are wonderful to sail with proven offshore capability with an experienced crew. The DIY seems like the best option. Thanks for the insight.
This seems to be neat and great little boat. As I have learned so far, the features of a boat are always a compromise of things. There are things that I especially like in this! Unstated, short masts are very beneficial for this due the lower point of effort and thus reducing the need for counter ballast and keel depth. Really good route there. The cat ketch configuration makes it super easy to tack and handle the sail area. What I don’t like though is the shape of the hull overall. I’m prone to seasickness and I really would like the movement of the boat to be as gentle as possible. Lightweightness with flat bottom doesn’t feel good in that perspective. But overall very interesting concept.
This is so exciting. I have been thinking this very thing. Thinking jeez if I can not get this done then I'll make it possible for my kids set up. A good idea done by someone else 1st.
Love your work and this is exactly what I'm looking for! Do you think you could do a DIY aluminum build kit? Like the Garcia or Allures 45'? Really anything in the explorer category is what Im most interested in. CNC the plates weld and assemble yourself? If you know of any options I would love it if you would create similar video. Thanks again for the great work you do!!
Third may be the most exciting concept in sailing I've ever seen. I would love to listen to more conversion between the two of youl I would be especially interested in hearing his thoughts on all electric sailboats and the viability in this design, and most of all how he would feel about repeating this exact design in a boat about 10 feet longer.... say something roughly about 40' in length. Now THAT would grab my attention AND my money !!!
I'm excited about this design. What are your thoughts about adding systems to a smaller boat? I.E 600 watts of solar and fitting out an electric galley. I'm curious if I can call it home for 2 to 4 months.
Always been a fan of his designs. What wasn’t mentioned was the ease of raising/ lowering the lower and lighter mainsails of smaller sail area than one mainsail alone(singlehanding)AND the ability to ease mainsheet to abnormal angles(no rigging to impede)during squall conditions instead of constant reefing. J
Many of the features you describe have been available in the popular S2 7.9 ( 7.9 meters loa or about 26 feet). With the lifting lead keel, which is essentially a big lead daggerboard, and kick-up rudder the S2 7.9 can draw as little as 13" draft and is silly easy to trailer launch from a conventional trailer as you describe. With the keel all the way down the draft is 5' so it can point with the best. The keel can be partially lifted to any degree off the wind for added performance. at a weight of about 4400 pounds (balsa core hull and deck) she is light and will easily plane. Lots of room below decks with a private head, very basic galley, and large v-berth and 2 large quarter berths. Lots of great condition used examples available now. Tows easily behind your basic 1500 pickup truck. $10k to $13K will get you a nice boat with sails and trailer ready to go. Most have outboards, some have diesel inboards. Mine has a Yanmar 1gm10. I use it to performance cruise the Great Lakes single handed. Furling jib/Genoa. Symmetric spinnaker. 545 hulls have been built by S2, now Tiara.
Awesome, This very well could be what I am looking for. Wow, I really liked the opposing side stabilization keels or what their name is! The future has arrizzed. Why not ? The stern parachute sounds like it would be what really useful for many applications.Thank You for this 🎥 interview. It didn't leave any questions unanswered for me. Great interview ! He really explained this awesome yacht very, very well. Mark the lone sailor.
It sounds awesome for coastal cruising or island hopping. ...from appearnace and description, it sounds like it would not be so great for blue water. Is that true?
First glance at this reminded me of UA-cam " Dashew Offshore". They have been doing the plaining hull to great success in both sail and power. Troublemaker is trying the same idea of faster speed capabilities , plaining hull and outrun the storm. All the best, Hal
I enjoyed the Calculus, Geometry and Physics lecture. I have found most of the information on the internet is like getting a weather forecast. Everyone repeats what they have heard; no one verifies the facts or even knows what the facts are. Allow me to ask you a simple physics question; take two round objects the same length and size, both have the same nose cone similar to a jet aircraft. Object A; starts the gradual curve to the end (tail/stern) point at 50% of the length. Object B; starts the gradual curve to the end (tail/stern) point at 75% of the length. Simple Question: which object is faster given everything else is constant; Object A or Object B. Last question what is making Object A or B slower given everything else is the same (constant)?
Love the design concept and idea of kit building, it's been done with airplanes for ages and I think it should be something more common for boats, and I would feel better knowing it was done right. I would love to get my hand on one, but my main concern though is that this design has been around for a while (2011 was the earliest I see mention on a quick search) Therefore why is there not one build example in over 9 years that I could find? Are people still in the building process? Did Schionning care to share any sale numbers? Have they even tried to build one for marketing purposes or to at least prove of concept?
Can they sell plans? Is that even an option? I've been thinking of building my own boat. I like that stitch and glue method of construction. This boat definitely looks like it could be built that way.
Basically everything needed to go from nothing to a complete hull with rigging. You add the necessary equipment like electronics, autopilot, motor, etc on your own.
I got in touch with Schionning last year about this kit and asked them to put me in touch with someone who built it. They replied that none had been built, I understood Schionning themselves have not built one. Does anyone know if builds are in the works?
Hi I am looking for n superfast design.. My sons and I are planning to sail from Capetown in the Southern ocean around the South pole and back with the intention to set up a record I am interested in the design Simple basic and fast
I love Schionning designs, incredible in so many ways. The terrible truth for the US market is that the state of our horrific bureaucracy and boat building infrastructure in general is that its 'almost' impossible for the average person to undertake a build like this or any Schionning, Grainger, Shuttleworth etc design and expect a 'reasonable' outcome. I firmly believe that many people have the skill to build the vessels at or above ABY-1A Offshore or Lloyd's standards... the problem is 'proving' it. If you build one of these vessels it will likely take you 5 years or more, you'll spend just as much (or more) than what you'd spend on a used Outremer, you won't be able to get reasonable insurance, and will have little resale value. In Australia they have the system of 'Survey' (I'm no expert, so Aussies correct me if I'm wrong), but that system is in place to enforce standards for boats used in commercial enterprise. The US does have a rigorous system of Coast Guard inspection for commercial boats as well, but it does not grant any kind of certificate of origin so there is nothing behind it to say that builder of the boat is 'qualified'. In Australia, even if the vessel is built strictly for personal yacht use, the owner/builder will still go through with the Survey process which basically insures the build quality is documented and they are able to get insurance. The US has no such system and I'm sure the few boat manufacturers left in the US don't want to see anything like come about again (yes, we did have it long ago, it was a 'Master Boat Builder' certificate from the USCG but that program has gone the way of the Do-Do bird). Anyway, I didn't say it was impossible. You COULD start a business, LLC, incorporate yourself and the like... now you've establish a 'business' entity. If you build the boat with everything under the business name you can be issued a MCO (Manufacturer Certificate of Origin) or something to that effect. With that you could possibly get reasonable insurance (however they will see only one vessel built under that builder name, usually not a good omen). This is the way many one-off custom yachts were built since the late 19th century and going on through today, they were called 'Syndicates'. When a racing yacht was envisioned a group of well-heeled individuals formed a Syndicate to build and race the yacht, and it was usually a very expensive endeavor. Keep in mind, lots of people along the way get to make money and jobs are created, while the 'owners' typically don't lift a finger. This was in the golden age long before annoyances like 'insurance' ever existed, but it still continues to this day. The key point here is that if there is enough money involved to keep all the Bureaucrats happy then you can avoid the red flags, the influence of well-heeled owners also helps. But again, it isn't impossible to enjoy the same legal recognition as a Syndicate as long as you know how to work the system and who you need to pay (not bribes, legitimate fees, inspections, etc). If you are lucky you will have a relative or friend with a large property that has a big old barn or something, because space to build is likely your largest sunk cost. If you can get through all of that in around 3 years and spend around $350K you've won, but its more likely you'll end up building for 5 to 7 years and spend around $500K. If you think I'm wrong, prove it. (BTW, having UA-cam viewers fund it or other donations doesn't count, no freebies or sponsorships... everything has a cost).
@Moritz R there is this Forum thread from 2011: www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Sailing/General/Awesome-new-31ft-trailer-sailor Also an Article at mysailing.com
@@moritz7644 It is quite troubling that nobody has built one in 9 years, and the 3d renders in the current brochure for the design are the same as appear in that 9 year old article.
Not sure anybody looking at Schionning’s website is interested in Monohulls. First time I’ve heard about this too, and I’ve been browsing for a half decade too
Yeah much like a McGregor I have a McGregor 26m they didn't show how you raise or lower the mast. My boat is fairly easy to put on and off a trailer. Doesn't sail anywhere near as fast as this newer sailboat but then again I bought it used and only paid about 11,000...huge difference in price I live in Florida and go to the keys from time to time very shallow there...My sailing instructor has a hunter which can take the shallower water much better because it has a pop-up keel and rudders...With the McGregor you have to actually stop to pull the daggerboard up kind of a pain when the winds blowing hard. Plus my McGregor has a 50 horsepower outboard on it so when it's time to go I can take down the sails and still make 10 knots against the wind. Finally I like the new boat would love to see it's speed but not willing to invest 160k for that privilege I think for that money I'll find a bigger boat that's already set up for cruising across the ocean with water purification, black and gray water holding tanks, air conditioning, generator, and a galley..... McGregor has a porta potty it came with a 5 gallon water tank so I added an 80 gallon water bladder in the stringers underneath the cockpit then had a new hatch made that I could put a window air conditioning in which I take out when I go sailing and put it in a plastic tote box also stored in the berth under the cockpit... Yes you guessed it the extra weight really slows the boat down I've been playing with adjusting how much water I put in the ballast tank so the boat does that sit as low in the water.
I like the _concept._ You might need to be a more experienced sailor for this to be a safe blue water cruizer. I'm not convinced it wouldn't easily capsize in waves higher than the boat itself. It might be awesome for weekend coastal sailing in good weather. Jeff even said they were still working out the ballast design... It suggests that where you have wide beach, you wouldn't even need a dinghy The latest lightweight kit boats like this are awesome though! Great interview!
@ Good point! Plus, scraping the boat hull on the bottom sounds like a nightmare if you do it on a regular basis for a boat this size. If you do it just before low tide, your boat is beached, but when the tide comes back, you can maneuver again -- so that could work. It might be an alternative to twin-keeled boats in locations where extreme tides allow them to sit temporarily on the sand/muck during low tide. Huh! Why am I trying to defend a boat with so many pinch points? I guess the only test is to see how it sails and whether the boat can endure whatever its captain tosses at it. If there are any built, it might be worth looking at their journals.
No transom? What happens in a following sea? It’s a pretty design from the drawings. Not sure why you would want two masts when you could put a gaff rig or a Bermuda rig on a single mast and get the same or better sail area. It would still be manageable for a single sailor. Water ballast would certainly make it more trailerable, but it would make for more time setting up and taking it out.
Perfect size for a baby, husband, and wife? I know I am asking for the World, but I wish there was an up to date website that catalogued all these designs that was searchable and had links with forums for those in the build process.
Gonna be a VERY rough boat in weather. Flat bottom plumb bow means a really slappy boat. But for the benefits of a safer type of trailer-able boat for real off shore sailing it looks ok. All boat choices are made after many many compromises between benefit and cost/risk.
MacGregor's are notoriously lightly built with minimal systems. Macgregor turned the molds over to his daughter in 2013. She changed the company name to Tattoo, maybe because MacGregor had such a poor reputation, and moved operations to Stuart, Florida. Company is still in limited operation but website has not been updated in over five years so not sure about their future.
I was going to provide a long post explaining how wrong you are, but it's the internet and so why waste my time? Enjoy your misinformation about the best-selling sailboat with a proven track record. In the meantime I'll enjoy sailing one lol
"15 knots on a planing hull, unheard of on monohulls of this size" he says... Let me introduce you to my 25 year old Macgregor 26X... :P Which is also trailerbale, with kick-up rudders and centerboard. Single mast though.
@@LearningtheLines No, but it does 15 knots for about a gallon an hour :P And the complete boat cost $35 inc trailer when they stopped production of the 26M model. That's not a kit, that's the fully-loaded boat.
@@joeblow1942 Sensible people wouldn't cross an ocean in any boat... Does this "affordable" ($30k for a kit lol) actually exist? Has it crossed any oceans yet?
@@bigglyguy8429 I'm "sensible" and have crossed the Pacific several times. Yes, that kit exists. It's a fairly new design so I'm not sure any have even been launched yet though. Go to Jeff Schionnings website and you'll see some of the most beautiful boats you've ever seen with many thousands of miles under their daggerboards. If Jeff says you can cross oceans with it then I am 100% confident that you can.
I would like Troy’s opinion very much. I wonder if he would take issue with a light weight boat for offshore sailing. I could see Troy appreciating the uncluttered decks. Anyone care to wager?
Very clever combination of design criteria. Loved this video, but is this just a design? No prototype to test the concepts? I want to see a boat... it's just a pretty picture until it's built and tested at sea. The sailaway price of $160-$170k for a 30' boat is in line with the market... the option to order a kit, or structure only, could be a bid advantage.
Interesting concept, But I wouldn't want to be caught on one in a squall. Designer said its advantage is being able to outrun the storm. There's gonna be a time when you can't, you don't want to be realizing the weaknesses of your ultra lightweight boat when a 20ft wave slams into you in the middle of the Atlantic. Reason mostly old and heavy boats are preferred for ocean crossings is they can take a beating when things go bad unexpectedly. Still seems like a great McGregor replacement now that they are out of business in all but name. Shame its too expensive to fit that role for the average person who doesn't have a few years to build it. The ketch design is rather nice though, both being foward of the cockpit seems like a nice reimagineing.
Cross Oceans? I doubt you know what you are talking about. Have you ever been in high seas with a light boat. I have. Knock downs and roll overs are very common.
You didn't hear that there will be water ballast to give the necessary weight? Also lightweight carbon masts means less righting momentum necessary vs aluminum masts with rigging. 32 feet is plenty long enough for a cruiser also, especially when singlehanding.
@@chrismktgpsu The masts are also shorter since there are two of them, which lowers the center of effort and also increases the effect of righting moment.
Too many armchair sailors , i wouldnt take this boat out into the irish sea, or the hebrides, where i sail my contessa 32, nearly 50 years old but designed FOR the sea , not the road . The seas are steep and the chop can jolt a poor boat to bits . There are seas here that can break really strong boats , like the Mull of Kintyre overfalls or the gulf of Corryvreckan. My girl has been round the world several times , comfortably ,because she weighs 7 tonnes and has a lead keel. A moving rudder on a small yacht would get snapped off in the worst of it, the flatt hull would pound and crash and bury the bow for days at a time and unstayed masts ? Give me a break ! So then , a guy whos never sailed an ocean raves about a boat that's still just a drawing . Welcome to the internet .
Can you give some statistical evidence on the claim that Knockdowns & Roll Overs are very common please.?! You either never crossed any ocean or are trying to selling the usual 'Banana Republic of America' Hill Billy Fake News as completely unfounded truth...
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![We Were WRONG About This Boat! [Full In-Depth Tour] Learning the Lines](/img/tr.png)
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I look forward to seeing more videos on this new design and actual build.
Interesting design, great rig for single handing. Some trade off going to weather but quite fast. Sails are trimmed like headsails vs mainsail. Unstayed masts will unload in puffs aiding in trim. I like the concept. Great builders in So Africa also.
This could be the perfect start for me to get myself to own a my first live aboard boat and go anywhere, by getting the kit and building it, awesome, thanks a lot for sharing.
Great interview with one of the top designers. Would definitely like more with Jeff Schionning, especially his thoughts on multihulls, since he's a major performance multihull designer.
Great video, thank you! I could listen to hours of interviews with him. Please do more. Would love to hear him talk about his Cat designs too.
Noted!
This looks like a water rocket ship. It appears to be very simple, clean and efficient in the layout and design. Thanks for sharing the interview. Best to Randi and Morgan.
this is a water rocket ship ua-cam.com/video/hY6taXLY2NE/v-deo.html
looking forward to seeing a sea trial of this design.
I’d like to see more about this boat design and some visuals more than a single sketch. Keep us posted on progress, construction photos etc.
I definitely liked this video. I really would like to hear his thoughts on multihulls.
A larger MacGregor with way more tech.... Big time pros and cons. Good video, thanks for sharing.
That's pretty close to the boat that has been taking shape in my head over the last couple of years, largely influenced by watching Simon Carter on his (last century) Noelex 30. If those were still being built Carter's channel would have sold a hundred by now. But a new version would be considerably stronger and get on the plane easier.
Most yacht designs are the end point of adding forces that work against each other. I see no net benefit in a massive rig to drag a massive lump of lead through the sea. Also inspiring is The Sailing Frenchman with his amazing mini transat. The only thing missing from such designs though appears to be comfort. Great for anyone not prone to sea sickness.
Would love to see 1 built out properly.
Interesting discussion, thanks for sharing! And congratulations on your daughter!!!!
Almost sounds to good to be real. I would like to see one built and the sea tirals
What's so too good to be true? $175K for a 31 footer?
Fascinating boat, definitely saving this one for further exploration.
This channel takes an interesting direction!
Good choice of boat for an interview with the designer. I would much like to see more in depth presentations of ships that are a bit different.
Thank you for the feedback!
Wow!! This is an amazing option. Thank you for sharing!!
I want to see actual pictures of this boat. Has anyone made one yet?
No
I've been looking for a similar design for three years. Google isn't as smart as everybody thinks. I've spent a couple months worth of hours searching for something like this, and it's been around for years. Great video Jordan.
You asked some great questions of your guest. He was like an encyclopedia (in brief ) of the necessities.
thanks for this, it is definitely thought provoking.
another interview would be great, he is an interesting bloke
Love this concept and it would be great to hear from a design legend like shionning on any of he's other designs. If you do speak with him again can ask if he has any plans to scale up the trouble maker in the future?
Indeed, that might make an interesting larger monohull.
I agree it looks great! I’ve been searching for a planing lg monohull. This is not large but its promising.
They can design and build you a bigger one. A few people have already inquired about a 40' I believe.
@@LearningtheLines not because I’m Israeli, because I’m a sailor I’d like to send you this link. Hopefully It’s would be a good match. I love the water as long as I can go fast without an engine. So kitesurfing, foiling of all kind, wind surfing... I sail quite a bit and i. Was always baffled why are there are so few fast planning yachts and why aren’t there more wings and foils in yachting. I hope this is the cannery in the mine. www.onesails.com/international/technology/wing-sails/wing-sails please pass it to the troublemaker team.
Great presentation. We'll done!
A really interesting design. I have a hard time imagining a two metric ton 30 footer as a blue water cruiser. Maybe I'm just old fashioned. I like the keel design. Short, deep keels should not be simply bolted to the bottom of the boat, the way longer, shallower one is.
I would call the rig a "kooner". It is really more of a schooner than a ketch, as the two mainsails appear to be of equal size. So, I would expect more schooner like performance upwind, dispite the short, deep keel.
I can imagine with maybe one ton of stores and cruising gear aboard, she might bog down noticibly.
I would also like to know her stability curve with the keel halfway extended.
It would be interesting to see one of these built and actually cruised long distance as a live-aboard boat (a requirement, in my mind, for any boat to be called a blue-water cruiser).
Maybe he should call this boat an off-shore capable coastal cruiser, which to me, it actually is.
This is one of your most interesting videos. I used to crew on a monohull racer on LIE, and some old classics, 30 years ago. Discovered cats in 2000, and looked into Wharrams. Self building a cat is a lot of work with the 2 hulls, so this option seems pretty nice. Unstayed mast on a trailerable boat seem like they would be a lot of work? Also, something a little bigger would be nice for cruising, although the added beam might compensate for reduced length. But, another great video. Thank you
I have been enjoying your videos of Sailboat reviews for a while now and enjoyed them all... Like one of your viewers said, I do like this post as well... Not just reviewing some old or existing boats and tech, you are introducing new tech and possibly where the industry may be heading... I will be contacting the builder in Costa mesa this weekend to see when they will have a finished boat we can all test on the water... I will let you know what they say... Thank you again for your post. Really enjoyed it! Keep it Going! You have lots of people on your side and enjoy your down to earth way of presenting the boats and new technology. Happy Holidays. :)
What did they say?
What a nice concept boat. Thanks for the video.
Happy first Thanksgiving together. Hope the 3 of you are doing well.
Interesting looking boat design. Thanks for sharing.🤝🤝🤝🤝👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
love the unstayed ketch concept
Jeff is a GREAT guy. Jordan... sent you an email about a 10.5M kit version he drew up for me. Oh yeah... and CONGRATS again!
I'll take a look!
Any finished boat outa there?
Hi Robert Davies...I will be very interesting in the 10.5 version ..are u building it ?
Any chance we can see what the 10.5 looks like ? I've inquired about a custom design. Debating between 10.5m and 12 m. Would be really curious to see what the 10.5 looks like
@@EZAGEEZAR Hopefully... one day. : )
Cool boat. I heard him mention the “Laser” which of course is a Bruce Kirby design, and his design of the “Norwalk Islands Sharpie” seem quite similar with its unstayed fully battened cat ketch rig between 18-29 ft which are also trailer sailors. I have the original NIS 31 built back in 1990 with a cold molded hull and she’s still sailing in FL. Her design weight was 8,500 pounds. The rig is a traditional fully battened ketch with a honda 15 outboard raised and lowered in the lazarette through a trap door which is closed when sailing to reduce drag. Her draft with centerboard and rudder retracted is only 18 inches. Max draft is 6.5 ft for knifing to weather. The harder the wind blows the less board you need. These types of boats are wonderful to sail with proven offshore capability with an experienced crew. The DIY seems like the best option. Thanks for the insight.
This seems to be neat and great little boat.
As I have learned so far, the features of a boat are always a compromise of things.
There are things that I especially like in this!
Unstated, short masts are very beneficial for this due the lower point of effort and thus reducing the need for counter ballast and keel depth. Really good route there.
The cat ketch configuration makes it super easy to tack and handle the sail area.
What I don’t like though is the shape of the hull overall. I’m prone to seasickness and I really would like the movement of the boat to be as gentle as possible. Lightweightness with flat bottom doesn’t feel good in that perspective.
But overall very interesting concept.
This is so exciting. I have been thinking this very thing. Thinking jeez if I can not get this done then I'll make it possible for my kids set up. A good idea done by someone else 1st.
Love your work and this is exactly what I'm looking for! Do you think you could do a DIY aluminum build kit? Like the Garcia or Allures 45'? Really anything in the explorer category is what Im most interested in. CNC the plates weld and assemble yourself? If you know of any options I would love it if you would create similar video. Thanks again for the great work you do!!
Third may be the most exciting concept in sailing I've ever seen. I would love to listen to more conversion between the two of youl I would be especially interested in hearing his thoughts on all electric sailboats and the viability in this design, and most of all how he would feel about repeating this exact design in a boat about 10 feet longer.... say something roughly about 40' in length. Now THAT would grab my attention AND my money !!!
I'd love to hear the designer talk about the Arrow Cat design.
Cool boat!
I'm excited about this design. What are your thoughts about adding systems to a smaller boat? I.E 600 watts of solar and fitting out an electric galley. I'm curious if I can call it home for 2 to 4 months.
100% doable. We did it aboard Freebie with 600 watts of solar and an induction cooktop and fridge. No propane. You need lithium batteries, though.
I truly love the design
Always been a fan of his designs. What wasn’t mentioned was the ease of raising/ lowering the lower and lighter mainsails of smaller sail area than one mainsail alone(singlehanding)AND the ability to ease mainsheet to abnormal angles(no rigging to impede)during squall conditions instead of constant reefing. J
Many of the features you describe have been available in the popular S2 7.9 ( 7.9 meters loa or about 26 feet). With the lifting lead keel, which is essentially a big lead daggerboard, and kick-up rudder the S2 7.9 can draw as little as 13" draft and is silly easy to trailer launch from a conventional trailer as you describe. With the keel all the way down the draft is 5' so it can point with the best. The keel can be partially lifted to any degree off the wind for added performance. at a weight of about 4400 pounds (balsa core hull and deck) she is light and will easily plane. Lots of room below decks with a private head, very basic galley, and large v-berth and 2 large quarter berths. Lots of great condition used examples available now. Tows easily behind your basic 1500 pickup truck. $10k to $13K will get you a nice boat with sails and trailer ready to go. Most have outboards, some have diesel inboards. Mine has a Yanmar 1gm10. I use it to performance cruise the Great Lakes single handed. Furling jib/Genoa. Symmetric spinnaker. 545 hulls have been built by S2, now Tiara.
Awesome, This very well could be what I am looking for. Wow, I really liked the opposing side stabilization keels or what their name is! The future has arrizzed. Why not ? The stern parachute sounds like it would be what really useful for many applications.Thank You for this 🎥 interview. It didn't leave any questions unanswered for me. Great interview ! He really explained this awesome yacht very, very well. Mark the lone sailor.
This is so cool! Thank you for all your videos. We love them!
This is a very interesting boat. Thank you Jordan 😊👍
Neat Design idea!
Sail plan is a borrowed straight from Freedom 44 Cat Ketch, which was a fantastic design. How difficult would it be to put it together, I wonder?
How have I not seen this video before? I have the Study plans for this yacht. Got a couple smaller boats to build first for experience.
That looks like it would be a great design for the Great Loop around the eastern seaboard.
How about purchasing the plans ?
He's a fount of knowledge. Please reach out to him about multi hulls.
Good video. Too bad about the last 10.
Would love to see one experiment with foils.
👍👍👍 yes more.😬
This is a boat I might actually purchase!
It sounds awesome for coastal cruising or island hopping. ...from appearnace and description, it sounds like it would not be so great for blue water. Is that true?
Why? A faster boat will get you through a weather window faster/better than a slower one.
Definitely a neat boat, although looking at the images and description, I'm having trouble seeing where the drop-down motor goes?
In the transom, aft of the queen berth and under the sugar scoop.
First glance at this reminded me of UA-cam " Dashew Offshore". They have been doing the plaining hull to great success in both sail and power. Troublemaker is trying the same idea of faster speed capabilities , plaining hull and outrun the storm. All the best, Hal
I enjoyed the Calculus, Geometry and Physics lecture. I have found most of the information on the internet is like getting a weather forecast. Everyone repeats what they have heard; no one verifies the facts or even knows what the facts are.
Allow me to ask you a simple physics question; take two round objects the same length and size, both have the same nose cone similar to a jet aircraft.
Object A; starts the gradual curve to the end (tail/stern) point at 50% of the length.
Object B; starts the gradual curve to the end (tail/stern) point at 75% of the length.
Simple Question: which object is faster given everything else is constant; Object A or Object B.
Last question what is making Object A or B slower given everything else is the same (constant)?
Love the design concept and idea of kit building, it's been done with airplanes for ages and I think it should be something more common for boats, and I would feel better knowing it was done right.
I would love to get my hand on one, but my main concern though is that this design has been around for a while (2011 was the earliest I see mention on a quick search)
Therefore why is there not one build example in over 9 years that I could find? Are people still in the building process? Did Schionning care to share any sale numbers? Have they even tried to build one for marketing purposes or to at least prove of concept?
I luv it man!
I’d like to hear more about building the carbon masts.
that's pretty cool. thanks for doing this.
Glad you liked it!
So the trailer comes apart and can be stoad on boat then assembled once you arrive at new destination?
Now wouldn't that be something? Lol
Looks like a nice coastal cruiser or lake boat.
Pretty boat!
were do you by them from in australia
email info@corecraftmarine.com
Or info@schionningdesign.com
We have builders in Australia too.
Can they sell plans? Is that even an option? I've been thinking of building my own boat. I like that stitch and glue method of construction. This boat definitely looks like it could be built that way.
Schionning sells plans.
Hi there
I would love to hear more from him
Looks good for Lake Huron.
What is included with the kit?
Basically everything needed to go from nothing to a complete hull with rigging. You add the necessary equipment like electronics, autopilot, motor, etc on your own.
@@LearningtheLines So if you were to use the kit ($30,000.00) and another 40k for you have a complete bluewater ready boat.
@@aarondean01 Depending on how you finish it, that sounds like a decent estimate.
Interesting video!.. cheers!
I got in touch with Schionning last year about this kit and asked them to put me in touch with someone who built it. They replied that none had been built, I understood Schionning themselves have not built one. Does anyone know if builds are in the works?
Intriguing
Hi I am looking for n superfast design..
My sons and I are planning to sail from Capetown in the Southern ocean around the South pole and back with the intention to set up a record
I am interested in the design
Simple basic and fast
When do we get a boat tour of one?
When one is actually built! Lol. I'll be sure to try to sail it as well!
@@LearningtheLines Sounds good, I'll be looking forward to that!
Great info
I love Schionning designs, incredible in so many ways. The terrible truth for the US market is that the state of our horrific bureaucracy and boat building infrastructure in general is that its 'almost' impossible for the average person to undertake a build like this or any Schionning, Grainger, Shuttleworth etc design and expect a 'reasonable' outcome. I firmly believe that many people have the skill to build the vessels at or above ABY-1A Offshore or Lloyd's standards... the problem is 'proving' it. If you build one of these vessels it will likely take you 5 years or more, you'll spend just as much (or more) than what you'd spend on a used Outremer, you won't be able to get reasonable insurance, and will have little resale value. In Australia they have the system of 'Survey' (I'm no expert, so Aussies correct me if I'm wrong), but that system is in place to enforce standards for boats used in commercial enterprise. The US does have a rigorous system of Coast Guard inspection for commercial boats as well, but it does not grant any kind of certificate of origin so there is nothing behind it to say that builder of the boat is 'qualified'. In Australia, even if the vessel is built strictly for personal yacht use, the owner/builder will still go through with the Survey process which basically insures the build quality is documented and they are able to get insurance. The US has no such system and I'm sure the few boat manufacturers left in the US don't want to see anything like come about again (yes, we did have it long ago, it was a 'Master Boat Builder' certificate from the USCG but that program has gone the way of the Do-Do bird). Anyway, I didn't say it was impossible. You COULD start a business, LLC, incorporate yourself and the like... now you've establish a 'business' entity. If you build the boat with everything under the business name you can be issued a MCO (Manufacturer Certificate of Origin) or something to that effect. With that you could possibly get reasonable insurance (however they will see only one vessel built under that builder name, usually not a good omen). This is the way many one-off custom yachts were built since the late 19th century and going on through today, they were called 'Syndicates'. When a racing yacht was envisioned a group of well-heeled individuals formed a Syndicate to build and race the yacht, and it was usually a very expensive endeavor. Keep in mind, lots of people along the way get to make money and jobs are created, while the 'owners' typically don't lift a finger. This was in the golden age long before annoyances like 'insurance' ever existed, but it still continues to this day. The key point here is that if there is enough money involved to keep all the Bureaucrats happy then you can avoid the red flags, the influence of well-heeled owners also helps. But again, it isn't impossible to enjoy the same legal recognition as a Syndicate as long as you know how to work the system and who you need to pay (not bribes, legitimate fees, inspections, etc). If you are lucky you will have a relative or friend with a large property that has a big old barn or something, because space to build is likely your largest sunk cost. If you can get through all of that in around 3 years and spend around $350K you've won, but its more likely you'll end up building for 5 to 7 years and spend around $500K. If you think I'm wrong, prove it. (BTW, having UA-cam viewers fund it or other donations doesn't count, no freebies or sponsorships... everything has a cost).
This Design is from 2011, and a quick search did not show any built one.
@Moritz R there is this Forum thread from 2011:
www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Sailing/General/Awesome-new-31ft-trailer-sailor
Also an Article at mysailing.com
@@moritz7644 It is quite troubling that nobody has built one in 9 years, and the 3d renders in the current brochure for the design are the same as appear in that 9 year old article.
Not sure anybody looking at Schionning’s website is interested in Monohulls. First time I’ve heard about this too, and I’ve been browsing for a half decade too
can you get plans only
Does it have a problem remaining stable?
Can you please compare this to Bolger loose moosr?
can we have a look at a finished yacht
a single-handed sailors dream
Sold...sign me up!
Yeah much like a McGregor I have a McGregor 26m they didn't show how you raise or lower the mast. My boat is fairly easy to put on and off a trailer. Doesn't sail anywhere near as fast as this newer sailboat but then again I bought it used and only paid about 11,000...huge difference in price I live in Florida and go to the keys from time to time very shallow there...My sailing instructor has a hunter which can take the shallower water much better because it has a pop-up keel and rudders...With the McGregor you have to actually stop to pull the daggerboard up kind of a pain when the winds blowing hard. Plus my McGregor has a 50 horsepower outboard on it so when it's time to go I can take down the sails and still make 10 knots against the wind. Finally I like the new boat would love to see it's speed but not willing to invest 160k for that privilege I think for that money I'll find a bigger boat that's already set up for cruising across the ocean with water purification, black and gray water holding tanks, air conditioning, generator, and a galley..... McGregor has a porta potty it came with a 5 gallon water tank so I added an 80 gallon water bladder in the stringers underneath the cockpit then had a new hatch made that I could put a window air conditioning in which I take out when I go sailing and put it in a plastic tote box also stored in the berth under the cockpit... Yes you guessed it the extra weight really slows the boat down I've been playing with adjusting how much water I put in the ballast tank so the boat does that sit as low in the water.
I like the _concept._ You might need to be a more experienced sailor for this to be a safe blue water cruizer. I'm not convinced it wouldn't easily capsize in waves higher than the boat itself. It might be awesome for weekend coastal sailing in good weather. Jeff even said they were still working out the ballast design... It suggests that where you have wide beach, you wouldn't even need a dinghy The latest lightweight kit boats like this are awesome though! Great interview!
Thank you!
? Pulling a boat that weighs a couple of tons off of a beach would be a great idea, if you have a crew of 20.
@ Good point! Plus, scraping the boat hull on the bottom sounds like a nightmare if you do it on a regular basis for a boat this size. If you do it just before low tide, your boat is beached, but when the tide comes back, you can maneuver again -- so that could work. It might be an alternative to twin-keeled boats in locations where extreme tides allow them to sit temporarily on the sand/muck during low tide. Huh! Why am I trying to defend a boat with so many pinch points? I guess the only test is to see how it sails and whether the boat can endure whatever its captain tosses at it. If there are any built, it might be worth looking at their journals.
No transom? What happens in a following sea? It’s a pretty design from the drawings. Not sure why you would want two masts when you could put a gaff rig or a Bermuda rig on a single mast and get the same or better sail area. It would still be manageable for a single sailor. Water ballast would certainly make it more trailerable, but it would make for more time setting up and taking it out.
Perfect size for a baby, husband, and wife? I know I am asking for the World, but I wish there was an up to date website that catalogued all these designs that was searchable and had links with forums for those in the build process.
That would be awesome for sure!
Way Cool!
Nice, I guess you can put any engine in the that you want, seems like a good fit for electric.
Gonna be a VERY rough boat in weather. Flat bottom plumb bow means a really slappy boat. But for the benefits of a safer type of trailer-able boat for real off shore sailing it looks ok. All boat choices are made after many many compromises between benefit and cost/risk.
MacGregor did a lot of these things, to a lesser degree and were a massively successful design, so I see big things for boats like this.
Yep, just posted that, as I have a 26X :)
MacGregor's are notoriously lightly built with minimal systems. Macgregor turned the molds over to his daughter in 2013. She changed the company name to Tattoo, maybe because MacGregor had such a poor reputation, and moved operations to Stuart, Florida. Company is still in limited operation but website has not been updated in over five years so not sure about their future.
I was going to provide a long post explaining how wrong you are, but it's the internet and so why waste my time? Enjoy your misinformation about the best-selling sailboat with a proven track record. In the meantime I'll enjoy sailing one lol
"15 knots on a planing hull, unheard of on monohulls of this size" he says... Let me introduce you to my 25 year old Macgregor 26X... :P Which is also trailerbale, with kick-up rudders and centerboard. Single mast though.
The Magregor 26X does not do 15 knots under sail. I don't even think it can get on plane under sail. Correct me if I'm wrong here.
@@LearningtheLines No, but it does 15 knots for about a gallon an hour :P And the complete boat cost $35 inc trailer when they stopped production of the 26M model. That's not a kit, that's the fully-loaded boat.
You would NOT cross an ocean with a Macgregor 26X.
@@joeblow1942 Sensible people wouldn't cross an ocean in any boat... Does this "affordable" ($30k for a kit lol) actually exist? Has it crossed any oceans yet?
@@bigglyguy8429 I'm "sensible" and have crossed the Pacific several times. Yes, that kit exists. It's a fairly new design so I'm not sure any have even been launched yet though. Go to Jeff Schionnings website and you'll see some of the most beautiful boats you've ever seen with many thousands of miles under their daggerboards. If Jeff says you can cross oceans with it then I am 100% confident that you can.
I would love to see Free Range Sailing trial this boat for a shake down!!! ........ha ....trouble maker!
PS - congrats to your family !!!! Forgot about that for a second there!!
Not saying there is anything wrong with this design, But i think Troy likes to stick with the tried and proven 👍
I would like Troy’s opinion very much. I wonder if he would take issue with a light weight boat for offshore sailing. I could see Troy appreciating the uncluttered decks. Anyone care to wager?
@@lydiaajohnson - how do you tag Free Range - Would love to make a little "trouble" for them ! I think it would be awesome!
How about a tour?
When one gets built, sure!
The link to core craft doesn’t work
Very clever combination of design criteria. Loved this video, but is this just a design? No prototype to test the concepts? I want to see a boat... it's just a pretty picture until it's built and tested at sea. The sailaway price of $160-$170k for a 30' boat is in line with the market... the option to order a kit, or structure only, could be a bid advantage.
Interesting concept, But I wouldn't want to be caught on one in a squall. Designer said its advantage is being able to outrun the storm. There's gonna be a time when you can't, you don't want to be realizing the weaknesses of your ultra lightweight boat when a 20ft wave slams into you in the middle of the Atlantic. Reason mostly old and heavy boats are preferred for ocean crossings is they can take a beating when things go bad unexpectedly.
Still seems like a great McGregor replacement now that they are out of business in all but name. Shame its too expensive to fit that role for the average person who doesn't have a few years to build it.
The ketch design is rather nice though, both being foward of the cockpit seems like a nice reimagineing.
Cross Oceans? I doubt you know what you are talking about. Have you ever been in high seas with a light boat. I have. Knock downs and roll overs are very common.
Not all light boats are the same. It depends very much on the design.
You didn't hear that there will be water ballast to give the necessary weight? Also lightweight carbon masts means less righting momentum necessary vs aluminum masts with rigging. 32 feet is plenty long enough for a cruiser also, especially when singlehanding.
@@chrismktgpsu The masts are also shorter since there are two of them, which lowers the center of effort and also increases the effect of righting moment.
Too many armchair sailors , i wouldnt take this boat out into the irish sea, or the hebrides, where i sail my contessa 32, nearly 50 years old but designed FOR the sea , not the road . The seas are steep and the chop can jolt a poor boat to bits . There are seas here that can break really strong boats , like the Mull of Kintyre overfalls or the gulf of Corryvreckan. My girl has been round the world several times , comfortably ,because she weighs 7 tonnes and has a lead keel. A moving rudder on a small yacht would get snapped off in the worst of it, the flatt hull would pound and crash and bury the bow for days at a time and unstayed masts ? Give me a break !
So then , a guy whos never sailed an ocean raves about a boat that's still just a drawing . Welcome to the internet .
Can you give some statistical evidence on the claim that Knockdowns & Roll Overs are very common please.?! You either never crossed any ocean or are trying to selling the usual 'Banana Republic of America' Hill Billy Fake News as completely unfounded truth...
great boat this the kind of design that has bveenin the back of my mind figured an Aus would put it together clever bastards !