i'd much rather see a standalone batman beyond not connected to anything than a weird flashpoint movie. that being said, can't wait to see keaton back in the cowl!
Wait until the new listeners get to “What We Reading? What We Gonna Read?” and are confused that the segment is often about what you’re watching and listening to. 😂👍
It gets even more confusing when I think they're gonna tell us what they're West Worlding, and then they start telling us what things they've been watching
I love you guys. You always make me laugh so much early in the morning. Thanks for your hard work! I hope you get a Join button some day so that I can support you directly.
Get Will Arnett to play Bruce Wayne in the Flashpoint film. Dimensions were fudged up by the Flash. Arnett is confused to be not made of LEGO throughout the film, but everyone else plays it straight.
Who the f*** watches you guys for serious and informed reviews, I watch you guy because you never fail to make me laugh and cheer me up with your brilliant comic chemistry, ignore all haters and remember that theres plenty of people who get you two little rascals and love it :D cheers guys
Honestly you have to say "What are we WESTWORLD today!" Every time! It feels so weird revisiting old podcasts where you don't say it. Keep it goinggggg!! 🤣🤣
The flashpoint movie should start with Ben coming back as Bruce Wayne in a cameo at the beginning (he doesn't even have to wear the costume, just be regular Bruce), then have Keaton as Thomas Wayne/Batman for the alternate universe, then at the end when flash comes back to his original universe, a cameo at the end with Robat Battenbat.
Getting Keaton back has been something most of us have been wishing for year, BUUUUT i agree with most here, he should be old Bats from Beyond (how they haven't done a Beyond film yet baffles me, a futuristic Batman that's so different from whats come before but still connected)
I'm only in my late 20's and them talking about looking up a song in the pre internet era gave me PTSD. So many times I'd just catch a commercial or the ending credits and get a song stuck in my head and never know how to find it. Even worse were theme songs from tv shows that either stopped airing or were muted during the credits so the channel could air more commercials. Edit: In the off chance anyone really cares I should clarify that obviously the internet was around when I was a kid, but smartphones didn't exist and my dad had a PC that was strictly for work.
Yes dodgsen is actually the main antagonist of both books really. He is basically nonexistent in the movies. I hope they tye up his arch in the new one.
Joel Schumacher was an underrated director and unfortunately has been plagued still by those Batman films. I was a kid when those came out so there is a sense of nostalgia, but they both are honestly better than we give them credit for. Batman Forever/Kilmer specifically is my second favorite Bats, it still takes him seriously for the time while allowing other characters to have fun. Batman & Robin is just funny as hell, especially looking back now with all our super serious Batman stuff, it's a fun and dumb time. Slower than it should be, but fun!
I don't understand the hatemail. I thought it was somewhat understood that "Caravan of Garbage" is just a funny silly name, they explained it a few times. And while there has been some legit garbage at times, I think most people will also love seeing popular movies and shows being analysed as well. It's just good fun! Anyway, thanks for the podcasts and the youtube episodes. I never take it too seriously but it's always a fun time with big laughs.
The Robbie Reyes Ghost Rider run by Felipe Smith is actually really good. I never really cared for previous iterations, but I was too young to really be into the grimdark nature of the nineties runs. When I was into trying it again they were doing pretty meh Marvel Knights miniseries.
Relating to the cow comment, I do judge films on whether there are any tires flying through the air after a vehicle explosion. For this reason, Jurassic Park 2 is one of the greatest films ever made (there are 2 tires).
Schumacher directed (wrote?) the lost boys. I love that he made a fresh take on vampires and slyly made corey haim a gay kid but nobody picked up on it, lol.
Everyone's wearing masks now, ain't they? Go do some crimes - pump your car full of that juicy gas right out in public for all the world to see! Shout "I'm Batman!" and speed off - after paying for your gas and not exceeding the legal speed limit, of course. How exciting.
Are you guys related to the website WeGotThisCovered that blatantly lies or did you just search We Got This Covered not realising that it's terrible site, not just a sentence, and I'm overthinking this?
That H8 mail segment made me dislike all DC movies and their fans on principle alone. I also find it hilarious that they consider Zach Snyder's movies super high brow intellectual films.
It's Snyder fans, not DC fans. Believe me... there's a huge difference. Holy sh*t, they're insufferable. I like Man of Steel. I'm a defender of that film. But his fans actually think BvS is a masterpiece of cinema and Snyder is a "masterful" storyteller. And anyone who doesn't like it just doesn't understand it. Basically, you're an idiot. They're already sh*tting on the Dark Knight trilogy. Also hating on Shazam just because it's actually a fun & lighthearted film and not dark & brooding like Snyder films. Because apparently, every character has to be Dark & depressing. Like I don't even hate Snyder. I like some of his films. But his fanboys actually make me hide the fact that I'm a DC fan sometimes. Like a lot of people hate on us because they judge us by the Snyder fanboys actions and comments
Could they be possibly doing a 'dr strange multiverse of madness' style flashpoint movie. Where there are rumours of Toby McGuire in Dr strange. So you could have Flash jumping multiverses and in one you have Jeffery Dean Morgans batman
6:58 you won't like it. It is to this day the only move that I just straight-up walked out of the theatre because anything was better than watching that movie.
I thought Batman vs Superman was so bad I swore off the new DC movies. However, recasting Michael Keaton is such wonderful pandering targeted specifically to me that I will watch any new movie that he is in, regardless of how bad it might be.
"Well he made exactly the movies that he wanted to make". That's very incorrect. I hop that people in the comments section and our lovely hosts take the time to read the following. PART 1 Joel Schumacher has gotten a bad rap because of "Batman Forever" and "Batman & Robin". And I think it's unfair. I'd just like to set the record straight, for anyone willing to listen and keep an open mind. Forever got made, by a studio, for the ONE reason any studio opts to make a film, especially a sequel, building a franchise... money. The studio executives and parents and older fans in general felt that "Batman Returns" was far too dark. It was. After the success of "Batman", WB gave Tim Burton free reign to do whatever he wanted with the sequel. The result was a freakish, dark, twisted, absurd movie that failed to do ANYWHERE NEAR as well as the film before it. Still, turning a profit, the studio felt it knew what it had to do to make a more successful sequel. For the record: Batman - Budget - $48 million Box office - $411,348,924 Batman Returns - Budget - $80 million Box office - $266,822,354 So, Tim Burton was made to step down as director, and Joel Schumacher was brought on as director. When hired, Joel initially expressed interest in a dark, serious (but not as dark or twisted as "Returns) prequel that would lighten the films back to what had been established with "Batman", and focus on the duality of Bruce Wayne, basing the story on "Batman: Year One". Pre-Production begins. Daniel Day-Lewis, Ralph Fiennes, William Baldwin, Johnny Depp & Ethan Hawke were all considered to replace Michael Keaton. Val Kilmer was selected by Schumacher because of his dark, emotionally complex, yet charming portrayal of Doc Holiday in "Tombstone". Tommy Lee Jones was selected, again by Schumacher because of his performance in "The Client", which they had just finished making the year prior. These decisions reflect the serious nature Schumacher originally intended for the film. His original pitch for the movie was a prequel. Based on Year One. Primarily focused on Bruce's memories of his father. The studio initially agreed and then insisted on a regular sequel. They compromised and decided on a dark sequel with considerable flashbacks. Basically a combination sequel/prequel. Joel's initial cut was 2 hours 40 minutes. The studio producers and executives felt that this was still to dark and complex to bring in the broad box office appeal they wanted. They decided to make the film broader, and more kid-friendly, particularly family and young adult oriented, to bring in a larger box office draw. They rejected many of the ideas Schumacher had for the film. Extensive re-writes were done. Many scenes, featuring a more psychotic, twisted version of Two-Face, and his BLOODY escape from Arkham Asylum. The scene where Riddler is “shown how to punch” a security guard included the guard being beaten to death. Again, reflecting the dark nature of the film Schumacher wanted, but was not allowed to present. Now, the studio had severely limited the input from their own films director and even its writers. Scenes were filmed, but removed by the studio. Scripts were refused, extensively rewritten, and entire sub-plots were removed from the film. Joel Schumacher was contractually obligated to make a movie, as this is what he was hired to do. Saying no to a movie offer at the outset is always an option. But he didn’t say no, because he was essentially offered a movie that he was later not allowed to make. Schumacher is a director. His JOB is making films. For example, if one’s job is to paint houses, and you refuse an offer to paint someone’s house, that’s not necessarily wise, but not very detrimental to your career. If you accept an offer, and then quit, halfway through finishing the job, word will get around, your reputation will be hurt, and your career is in jeopardy. Hollywood is like this, but worse. It’s full of egos, and power-hungry manipulators. Black-listing IS real, and bad things can happen quickly to ANYONE if they’re not careful who they deal with and how they deal with them. So, in essence, Joel Schumacher’s hands were tied and he was left with basically no alternative but to finish the movie he had been assigned and hope for the best. And it did turn out for the best, as far as the studio is concerned. Batman Forever - Budget - $100 million Box office - $336,529,844 NOW, compare those numbers to the previous films. The studio got exactly what they wanted. What did this “teach” them? Make the sequel even more kid-friendly, even lighter than the previous installment, and give the director even less control, and… make more money! And this is EXACTLY what they tried to do. “Batman & Robin” was designed from the onset to be as lighthearted and financially opportunistic as possible. NOW, at this point, when Joel was asked to return for the sequel, could he have said no? Probably. Would his career have been hurt? Not necessarily. But we don’t know for sure. Warner Bros. and their producers and executives could have reacted negatively to his refusal. But we’ll never know for sure. I see “Batman & Robin” as a mixed blessing. It’s a bad film to be sure. But it was such a failure, commercially and artistically, that it killed the beast. It STOPPED the series in its tracks for ALMOST A DECADE. I see this film as more of Joel Schumacher’s revenge against WB. They wanted light-hearted, so he went as light-hearted as he could. Intentionally aiming at the 1950s/1960s Dick Sprang era of Batman and the 1960s campy Adam West era of Batman. He purposefully and repeatedly reminded the cast and crew of the studios wishes by saying that it wasn’t meant to be serious anymore and was meant to be cartoonish in nature. So, I say all of this to say: Is Joel Schumacher free of blame? Not entirely. He did what he did. But why is it that he is the ONLY person to ever be blamed? WHY? Because people are un-educated about what happened. People don’t know, and likely don’t want to know. They’re happy knowing nothing. And I don’t think that it’s fair that stupidity continues to make Joel Schumacher WB’s scapegoat. He has gone on record, taking the high road, saying that if a film is good, or if you like a film, you should acknowledge and praise everyone involved in that film. But, if you don’t like a film, blame the director, because in the end, he’s in charge. Now, that’s USUALLY true. There are LOTS of examples where that’s not the case. But it takes a big man and a good man and a real director to shoulder the responsibility for a films failure and to take that much hatred. And let’s face it - there’s a LOT of blind, uneducated hatred placed on that man for that film. And for that reason alone, his willingness to accept the blame and hatred, I DON’T blame or hate him. I don’t even hate the film that got made. It’s served many purposes. 1) It destroyed a series that needed to stop. 2) It’s a love letter to a different era of Batman (you might not like the era, but that really doesn’t matter). 3) It allowed for later, different interpretations of Batman to come along. Now you might love them, hate them, or have mixed feelings like I do. BUT, it is with great certainty that I state without Joel Schumacher making “Batman & Robin”, the later Batman films would never have even been considered by the studio. CONTINUED IN REPLIES .....
As stated before, when Schumacher was initially hired, he expressed interest in doing a dark prequel, focused on the duality of Bruce Wayne, based largely in part on “Batman: Year One”. I believe “Batman & Robin” was conceived and executed in such a way to show WB that their plan for the franchise would not be a success. So, with the hopes of finally getting the film he wanted to make, Schumacher torpedoed the film. I believe that notions of Joel Schumacher not truly understanding the character are simply unfounded. This is evidenced by the fact that he considers neither of his entries in the series a “real Batman film” and has stated that “'I owe the Batman culture a real Batman movie” and that he would only return for another film if he was allowed to make the dark dramatic prequel he had hoped for, stating “The only way I would do another Bat-film is if we went back to the basics. It would be nice to take the bigger-is-better concept out of it, and just go pure”. 1) With "Batman Forever" he could not just walk away. Not without repercussions. 2) With "Batman & Robin", I think it's very clear based on his previous films, his intentions for "Batman Forever", the fact that it was originally 2hrs and 40min and got butchered by the studio, and his intentions for after B&R, that he didn't want to leave, so that he could finally make the movie that he wanted. It's like any industry, but worse. You take the shitty job so that you can afford to take the good job later. Often-times actors, directors, and ANY person involved with film will willingly work on a bad project, to secure their chances of working on a better one next time. Perfect examples: John Wayne does "The Barbarian and the Geisha" to increase his total net worth, so that he can direct, produce, and star in his pet project "The Alamo". Michael Caine only agreed to be in "Jaws 4" to pay for his new house. If I were to blame ANY PEOPLE for the bad aspects of “Batman Forever” and the overall final product of “Batman & Robin”, I blame the majority of the producers involved for controlling, shaping, funding, and insuring their production. Producers like Mitchell E. Dauterive, William M. Elvin, Peter Macgregor-Scott, Benjamin Melniker, and Michael E. Uslan. I even blame misguided producers like Jon Peters and Peter Gruber who have shown that they have no interest in respecting writers or directors or making quality films (both having worked on Batman Returns which ushered in the change in tone) (Just research them for yourselves). And the marketing executives involved with these projects, who will more than likely never be revealed in any proper detail and therefore avoid the blame they so rightly deserve. SOURCES BELOW...
SOURCES "Batman 3". Entertainment Weekly. issue #190 Oct 01, 1993. www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,308195,00.html Batman Online - Interview with Batman Forever's Janet Scott Batchler Originally posted on November 27, 2009 on the former Batman site Brother-Eye.net www.batman-online.com/features/2011/9/3/interview-with-batman-forever-screenwriter-janet-scott-batchler Shadows of the Bat: The Cinematic Saga of the Dark Knight-Reinventing a Hero. Warner Bros.. 2005. Nathan, Ian (August 1995). "Hold me, thrill me, kiss me, Kilmer". Empire. pp. 108-117. "Johnny Depp Was Almost Batman In Batman Forever". ComicBookMovie. December 10, 2009. www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/CookiepussProduction/news/?a=12646 Jett (December 16, 2009). "William Baldwin Talks Batman And "JUSTICE LEAGUE: CRISIS ON TWO EARTHS"". Batman-on-Film. www.batman-on-film.com/dccomics-on-film_JL-CRISIS-ON-TWO-EARTHS_William-Baldwin-talks-Batman_12-16-09.html Details October 2011 Issue. Q&A: Ethan Hawke. Interview by Jonah Weiner. www.details.com/celebrities-entertainment/movies-and-tv/201110/ethan-hawke-actor-woman-in-the-fifth "Batman Forever - What Could Be: A Guide to the Batman Forever Cutting Room Floor". Batman-On-Film.com. www.batman-on-film.com/opinion_scissorpuppy_forever.html Jeff Jensen (1998-12-04). "Winging It". Entertainment Weekly. October 19, 2008.
@@orinanime That was a very good series of posts you did there and I absolutely agree with it I have always blamed Warner Brothers for the destruction of the original Bat man movie series , as they actually do call the shots They did the same with the Never Ending Story 3 . Compare that to the first two movies For the record though , I absolutely love Bat man Returns and so do many others . I like the dark tone and the costume is one of the best in my opinion
I've emailed in an email for letters twice now and am concerned as to why you still haven't read it out yet, maybe I've gotten the wrong email idk, to let you know I've titled my email letters btw incase you've somehow missed it.
link.hollywoodreporter.com/view/518d565b191b2a646dbe685cccj4v.gah/416289b3 Michael Keaton is in talks to return as Batman. (And by Batman, we also mean Bruce Wayne. Despite pesky rumors from certain corners, there is no Thomas Wayne in the script, sources tell us. Also: Keaton would appear in costume.)
Bale ain’t no murderer and Pattinson best not be. If Pattinson doesn’t have the rule I’m just gonna not watch his movies cuz it’s not a batman movie without the rule to me cuz that’s what I find appealing about batman.
Is no one gonna talk About the newspaper saying Burton batman captured joker even tho he's dead was he brought back to life is IT his son or Copycat a brainwashed Robin
@@ProxyGaming. what does that have to do with his job? Only people who never get into a fight can be actors? Thats like me asking the guy at subway if hes ever been in a fight because if hes not a "good person" then Idk if im cool with him making my sandwich. And since when does getting into a fight make you a bad person? Its not like he maimed someone. Was he provoked? Did you see if anything happened before the fight? If you dont like him because of things he does outside his job then just dont watch any movies that hes in. Not mess with his career. Problem solved.
@Anthony Hernandez While there is no context, prior to the video, There are multiple actions he could of done as a reaction. Fights are fights, but when a man chokes / hurts a women that crosses line. And I'd be uncomfortable be that a subway employee, or a hollwood actor. But you are right, -- Put my money where my mouth is. I won't go see an ezra miller movie.
Timeline of news on comicbook.com 1. Jeffery dean Morgan to be in the flash. And hour later 2. Michael Keaton cast to be in the flash. 3. He wont have a suit. 4. He will infact have a suit. The day later 5. He's cast but if it doesn't work out it's going to be Christian bale..... It's all piss dont believe it
I think someone should warn Mason that Marcella ends in a really fucking stupid way... ...unless there was an extra season I've missed that fixes everything somehow and I'm an idiot
I can hear that we are approaching Caravan of Garbage being about all these darn kids making too much noise these days, and how it was different back in my day :) Thankfully, its the apocalypse so it wont last long.
I don’t like the way the listener said it by calling you guys soy boys cause that helps no one but I somewhat agree with what he said about endgame. I’m not against women at all I just think narratively it didn’t make sense and was out of place. At that point in the film we’ve reached what we have been building towards: the final battle and we have all the characters flying around fighting and then all of a sudden a political statement is inserted awkwardly breaking the flow of the conflict. That’s just my opinion tho I don’t think you guys are soy boys and I love the podcast
the h8 mail stuff .... look I'm a die hard DC fanboy, I'm biased to all hell, but you gotta be able to take this shit in stride, not everyone needs to love every thing DC puts out. I'm always extremely forgiving of those movies but some of them are still pretty ass and folks are allowed to call em out for being ass.
I would like to know how you guys feel about characters we used to know nothing much about that we know more and more about through prequels and retcons and shit. I'm thinking wolverine, joker, obi wan and yoda. I can't think of a lady or a character not played by a white person so maybe give this question a miss. I've enjoyed listening to this show while inventing cocktails and getting too drunk in the middle of the night but, fuck this being unemployed during a pandemic shit, it sucks dead dogs balls. Just realised none of this is phrased as a question. What a dickhead I am.
At this point if WB dont put Bruce Timm in charge as their Kevin Feige, we will never see a decent and definitive version of any of these characters in our lifetime. Execs are completely moronic and out of touch.
Favourite part of the podcast: Every time James tries to move the topic along, but Mason's not done yet, so he drags them back to the previous topic.
i'd much rather see a standalone batman beyond not connected to anything than a weird flashpoint movie. that being said, can't wait to see keaton back in the cowl!
I thought the same thing. I think they will. We can handle it
I feel the same way. Let’s just have good Batman films whether or not they’re an ongoing series
Wait until the new listeners get to “What We Reading? What We Gonna Read?” and are confused that the segment is often about what you’re watching and listening to. 😂👍
Westworld?
I was confused with that the first time I listened to the podcast 😂😂
It gets even more confusing when I think they're gonna tell us what they're West Worlding, and then they start telling us what things they've been watching
I would 100% watch “Son of Twister”
But only if it’s entirely from the Twister’s POV this time.
Constant spinning and loud winds.
More like Mr. Tuesday Movies.
HEYO
IKR why do they do everything two days late!
LOL...GOT' EM
In fairness they upload the podcast Sunday my time on Spotify
I love you guys. You always make me laugh so much early in the morning. Thanks for your hard work! I hope you get a Join button some day so that I can support you directly.
Get Will Arnett to play Bruce Wayne in the Flashpoint film. Dimensions were fudged up by the Flash. Arnett is confused to be not made of LEGO throughout the film, but everyone else plays it straight.
Sure why not at this point lmao
Amazing
Still shocked that they didn't get Bale back
Who the f*** watches you guys for serious and informed reviews, I watch you guy because you never fail to make me laugh and cheer me up with your brilliant comic chemistry, ignore all haters and remember that theres plenty of people who get you two little rascals and love it :D cheers guys
Michael Keaton Bat as Backman
Honestly you have to say "What are we WESTWORLD today!" Every time! It feels so weird revisiting old podcasts where you don't say it. Keep it goinggggg!! 🤣🤣
Add video guys! Show is amazing! I appreciate the effort every week!
The flashpoint movie should start with Ben coming back as Bruce Wayne in a cameo at the beginning (he doesn't even have to wear the costume, just be regular Bruce), then have Keaton as Thomas Wayne/Batman for the alternate universe, then at the end when flash comes back to his original universe, a cameo at the end with Robat Battenbat.
Getting Keaton back has been something most of us have been wishing for year, BUUUUT i agree with most here, he should be old Bats from Beyond (how they haven't done a Beyond film yet baffles me, a futuristic Batman that's so different from whats come before but still connected)
Might be my favourite episode so far
Yesss haha I love the h8mail but the h8 has an 8 in it segments😂😂 f***ing hilariousss and James whispersssss westworld 😂😂 deaddddd 🤣🤣🤣
I'm only in my late 20's and them talking about looking up a song in the pre internet era gave me PTSD. So many times I'd just catch a commercial or the ending credits and get a song stuck in my head and never know how to find it. Even worse were theme songs from tv shows that either stopped airing or were muted during the credits so the channel could air more commercials.
Edit: In the off chance anyone really cares I should clarify that obviously the internet was around when I was a kid, but smartphones didn't exist and my dad had a PC that was strictly for work.
2:20
James: they called me Mr. Sunday...
You misspelled Joel Schumacher's last name. Also rip Joel, I will definitely miss him, he's responsible for my second favourite Riddler
Oh shit he died? That's so sad.
So glad to finally hear a middle of the road unemotional review of tlou2. I might have to play it sometime
Love that Titanfall 2 shoutout.
You know it's a good week when there's h8 mail for 20 minutes in the description @_@
To anyone who reads this, I hope you have a great day! :-)
you too!
You too homie!
Right back atcha
I think you mean gr8 day
@@apexa903 not cool bro :(
Ghost Rider Trail of Tears was surprisingly good
The west world bit is definitelyyy happening I can feel it 😂 I love it
I always wanted a Batman Beyond. Lets get a Terry McGinnis.
I liked Ghost Rider 2099 a lot when it was first published, but like much of 90's comics I don't think it aged all that well.
Yes dodgsen is actually the main antagonist of both books really. He is basically nonexistent in the movies. I hope they tye up his arch in the new one.
Joel Schumacher was an underrated director and unfortunately has been plagued still by those Batman films. I was a kid when those came out so there is a sense of nostalgia, but they both are honestly better than we give them credit for. Batman Forever/Kilmer specifically is my second favorite Bats, it still takes him seriously for the time while allowing other characters to have fun. Batman & Robin is just funny as hell, especially looking back now with all our super serious Batman stuff, it's a fun and dumb time. Slower than it should be, but fun!
Carey Elwwwzzzzz was in Twister?
Ashley Johnson is the name of the person who voices allie. She also does Critical Role
I don't understand the hatemail. I thought it was somewhat understood that "Caravan of Garbage" is just a funny silly name, they explained it a few times. And while there has been some legit garbage at times, I think most people will also love seeing popular movies and shows being analysed as well. It's just good fun!
Anyway, thanks for the podcasts and the youtube episodes. I never take it too seriously but it's always a fun time with big laughs.
More like Mr. Tuesday Movies, am I right?
Gottem!
THE GLORIOUS RETURN OF H8 MAIL!!!
You can’t comment on UA-cam videos until you unlock all your emotions
The Robbie Reyes Ghost Rider run by Felipe Smith is actually really good. I never really cared for previous iterations, but I was too young to really be into the grimdark nature of the nineties runs. When I was into trying it again they were doing pretty meh Marvel Knights miniseries.
Can someone explain the origin of James' brother that Mason doesn't like? Why doesn't he like him?
Listening to all the hatemail made my day. It also terrified me because it reminded me of the tragically high number of imbeciles in the world.
Relating to the cow comment, I do judge films on whether there are any tires flying through the air after a vehicle explosion. For this reason, Jurassic Park 2 is one of the greatest films ever made (there are 2 tires).
Schumacher directed (wrote?) the lost boys. I love that he made a fresh take on vampires and slyly made corey haim a gay kid but nobody picked up on it, lol.
Well thanks fellas. Now I want Keatons Batman and Nic Cage as Superman from the movie that wasn’t. 😂
In the state of New Jersey you still can't pump your own gas legally, hence the regal position of gas station attendant still exists
Everyone's wearing masks now, ain't they? Go do some crimes - pump your car full of that juicy gas right out in public for all the world to see! Shout "I'm Batman!" and speed off - after paying for your gas and not exceeding the legal speed limit, of course. How exciting.
im also on the low-carb ! kudos !
I'd love to see a Flashpoint where Robat Battinbat's Batman meets Jeffery Dean Morgan's Batman.
Are you guys related to the website WeGotThisCovered that blatantly lies or did you just search We Got This Covered not realising that it's terrible site, not just a sentence, and I'm overthinking this?
you spelled Schumacher wrong (or right, who's to say, really)
That H8 mail segment made me dislike all DC movies and their fans on principle alone. I also find it hilarious that they consider Zach Snyder's movies super high brow intellectual films.
It's Snyder fans, not DC fans. Believe me... there's a huge difference. Holy sh*t, they're insufferable. I like Man of Steel. I'm a defender of that film. But his fans actually think BvS is a masterpiece of cinema and Snyder is a "masterful" storyteller. And anyone who doesn't like it just doesn't understand it. Basically, you're an idiot.
They're already sh*tting on the Dark Knight trilogy. Also hating on Shazam just because it's actually a fun & lighthearted film and not dark & brooding like Snyder films. Because apparently, every character has to be Dark & depressing.
Like I don't even hate Snyder. I like some of his films. But his fanboys actually make me hide the fact that I'm a DC fan sometimes. Like a lot of people hate on us because they judge us by the Snyder fanboys actions and comments
Avengers Game footage: gameplay looks like ultimate alliance smashfest. That doesn't seem to fit with the context we were envisioning.
Read Superman American Alien by Maxi Landis. It's the bases for Man of Tomorrow
Looks like I'm back on that Keaton diet. Hayo! It's pc gone mad.
James and Nick, why do you have a section of the show devoted to lettuce, including a sing-a-long intro?
Could they be possibly doing a 'dr strange multiverse of madness' style flashpoint movie. Where there are rumours of Toby McGuire in Dr strange.
So you could have Flash jumping multiverses and in one you have Jeffery Dean Morgans batman
6:58 you won't like it. It is to this day the only move that I just straight-up walked out of the theatre because anything was better than watching that movie.
That’s funny, Mr. Tuesday Movies sounds like a cheap rip off of Mr. Sunday Movies.
why does mason hate your brother??
Wouldn't you?
i think i have heard it so much i agree with mason...i don't like his brother either
I thought Batman vs Superman was so bad I swore off the new DC movies. However, recasting Michael Keaton is such wonderful pandering targeted specifically to me that I will watch any new movie that he is in, regardless of how bad it might be.
Tnetennba!
"Well he made exactly the movies that he wanted to make".
That's very incorrect.
I hop that people in the comments section and our lovely hosts take the time to read the following.
PART 1
Joel Schumacher has gotten a bad rap because of "Batman Forever" and "Batman & Robin". And I think it's unfair.
I'd just like to set the record straight, for anyone willing to listen and keep an open mind.
Forever got made, by a studio, for the ONE reason any studio opts to make a film, especially a sequel, building a franchise... money.
The studio executives and parents and older fans in general felt that "Batman Returns" was far too dark. It was. After the success of "Batman", WB gave Tim Burton free reign to do whatever he wanted with the sequel. The result was a freakish, dark, twisted, absurd movie that failed to do ANYWHERE NEAR as well as the film before it. Still, turning a profit, the studio felt it knew what it had to do to make a more successful sequel.
For the record:
Batman -
Budget - $48 million
Box office - $411,348,924
Batman Returns -
Budget - $80 million
Box office - $266,822,354
So, Tim Burton was made to step down as director, and Joel Schumacher was brought on as director.
When hired, Joel initially expressed interest in a dark, serious (but not as dark or twisted as "Returns) prequel that would lighten the films back to what had been established with "Batman", and focus on the duality of Bruce Wayne, basing the story on "Batman: Year One".
Pre-Production begins.
Daniel Day-Lewis, Ralph Fiennes, William Baldwin, Johnny Depp & Ethan Hawke were all considered to replace Michael Keaton.
Val Kilmer was selected by Schumacher because of his dark, emotionally complex, yet charming portrayal of Doc Holiday in "Tombstone". Tommy Lee Jones was selected, again by Schumacher because of his performance in "The Client", which they had just finished making the year prior. These decisions reflect the serious nature Schumacher originally intended for the film.
His original pitch for the movie was a prequel. Based on Year One. Primarily focused on Bruce's memories of his father.
The studio initially agreed and then insisted on a regular sequel.
They compromised and decided on a dark sequel with considerable flashbacks. Basically a combination sequel/prequel.
Joel's initial cut was 2 hours 40 minutes.
The studio producers and executives felt that this was still to dark and complex to bring in the broad box office appeal they wanted. They decided to make the film broader, and more kid-friendly, particularly family and young adult oriented, to bring in a larger box office draw.
They rejected many of the ideas Schumacher had for the film. Extensive re-writes were done. Many scenes, featuring a more psychotic, twisted version of Two-Face, and his BLOODY escape from Arkham Asylum. The scene where Riddler is “shown how to punch” a security guard included the guard being beaten to death. Again, reflecting the dark nature of the film Schumacher wanted, but was not allowed to present.
Now, the studio had severely limited the input from their own films director and even its writers. Scenes were filmed, but removed by the studio. Scripts were refused, extensively rewritten, and entire sub-plots were removed from the film.
Joel Schumacher was contractually obligated to make a movie, as this is what he was hired to do. Saying no to a movie offer at the outset is always an option. But he didn’t say no, because he was essentially offered a movie that he was later not allowed to make.
Schumacher is a director. His JOB is making films. For example, if one’s job is to paint houses, and you refuse an offer to paint someone’s house, that’s not necessarily wise, but not very detrimental to your career. If you accept an offer, and then quit, halfway through finishing the job, word will get around, your reputation will be hurt, and your career is in jeopardy. Hollywood is like this, but worse. It’s full of egos, and power-hungry manipulators. Black-listing IS real, and bad things can happen quickly to ANYONE if they’re not careful who they deal with and how they deal with them.
So, in essence, Joel Schumacher’s hands were tied and he was left with basically no alternative but to finish the movie he had been assigned and hope for the best.
And it did turn out for the best, as far as the studio is concerned.
Batman Forever -
Budget - $100 million
Box office - $336,529,844
NOW, compare those numbers to the previous films. The studio got exactly what they wanted.
What did this “teach” them? Make the sequel even more kid-friendly, even lighter than the previous installment, and give the director even less control, and… make more money! And this is EXACTLY what they tried to do.
“Batman & Robin” was designed from the onset to be as lighthearted and financially opportunistic as possible. NOW, at this point, when Joel was asked to return for the sequel, could he have said no? Probably. Would his career have been hurt? Not necessarily. But we don’t know for sure. Warner Bros. and their producers and executives could have reacted negatively to his refusal. But we’ll never know for sure.
I see “Batman & Robin” as a mixed blessing. It’s a bad film to be sure. But it was such a failure, commercially and artistically, that it killed the beast. It STOPPED the series in its tracks for ALMOST A DECADE.
I see this film as more of Joel Schumacher’s revenge against WB. They wanted light-hearted, so he went as light-hearted as he could. Intentionally aiming at the 1950s/1960s Dick Sprang era of Batman and the 1960s campy Adam West era of Batman. He purposefully and repeatedly reminded the cast and crew of the studios wishes by saying that it wasn’t meant to be serious anymore and was meant to be cartoonish in nature.
So, I say all of this to say: Is Joel Schumacher free of blame? Not entirely. He did what he did. But why is it that he is the ONLY person to ever be blamed? WHY? Because people are un-educated about what happened. People don’t know, and likely don’t want to know. They’re happy knowing nothing. And I don’t think that it’s fair that stupidity continues to make Joel Schumacher WB’s scapegoat.
He has gone on record, taking the high road, saying that if a film is good, or if you like a film, you should acknowledge and praise everyone involved in that film. But, if you don’t like a film, blame the director, because in the end, he’s in charge. Now, that’s USUALLY true. There are LOTS of examples where that’s not the case. But it takes a big man and a good man and a real director to shoulder the responsibility for a films failure and to take that much hatred. And let’s face it - there’s a LOT of blind, uneducated hatred placed on that man for that film.
And for that reason alone, his willingness to accept the blame and hatred, I DON’T blame or hate him. I don’t even hate the film that got made. It’s served many purposes. 1) It destroyed a series that needed to stop. 2) It’s a love letter to a different era of Batman (you might not like the era, but that really doesn’t matter). 3) It allowed for later, different interpretations of Batman to come along. Now you might love them, hate them, or have mixed feelings like I do. BUT, it is with great certainty that I state without Joel Schumacher making “Batman & Robin”, the later Batman films would never have even been considered by the studio.
CONTINUED IN REPLIES
.....
As stated before, when Schumacher was initially hired, he expressed interest in doing a dark prequel, focused on the duality of Bruce Wayne, based largely in part on “Batman: Year One”. I believe “Batman & Robin” was conceived and executed in such a way to show WB that their plan for the franchise would not be a success. So, with the hopes of finally getting the film he wanted to make, Schumacher torpedoed the film.
I believe that notions of Joel Schumacher not truly understanding the character are simply unfounded. This is evidenced by the fact that he considers neither of his entries in the series a “real Batman film” and has stated that “'I owe the Batman culture a real Batman movie” and that he would only return for another film if he was allowed to make the dark dramatic prequel he had hoped for, stating “The only way I would do another Bat-film is if we went back to the basics. It would be nice to take the bigger-is-better concept out of it, and just go pure”.
1) With "Batman Forever" he could not just walk away. Not without repercussions.
2) With "Batman & Robin", I think it's very clear based on his previous films, his intentions for "Batman Forever", the fact that it was originally 2hrs and 40min and got butchered by the studio, and his intentions for after B&R, that he didn't want to leave, so that he could finally make the movie that he wanted.
It's like any industry, but worse. You take the shitty job so that you can afford to take the good job later. Often-times actors, directors, and ANY person involved with film will willingly work on a bad project, to secure their chances of working on a better one next time.
Perfect examples:
John Wayne does "The Barbarian and the Geisha" to increase his total net worth, so that he can direct, produce, and star in his pet project "The Alamo".
Michael Caine only agreed to be in "Jaws 4" to pay for his new house.
If I were to blame ANY PEOPLE for the bad aspects of “Batman Forever” and the overall final product of “Batman & Robin”, I blame the majority of the producers involved for controlling, shaping, funding, and insuring their production. Producers like Mitchell E. Dauterive, William M. Elvin, Peter Macgregor-Scott, Benjamin Melniker, and Michael E. Uslan. I even blame misguided producers like Jon Peters and Peter Gruber who have shown that they have no interest in respecting writers or directors or making quality films (both having worked on Batman Returns which ushered in the change in tone) (Just research them for yourselves). And the marketing executives involved with these projects, who will more than likely never be revealed in any proper detail and therefore avoid the blame they so rightly deserve.
SOURCES BELOW...
SOURCES
"Batman 3". Entertainment Weekly. issue #190 Oct 01, 1993.
www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,308195,00.html
Batman Online - Interview with Batman Forever's Janet Scott Batchler
Originally posted on November 27, 2009 on the former Batman site Brother-Eye.net
www.batman-online.com/features/2011/9/3/interview-with-batman-forever-screenwriter-janet-scott-batchler
Shadows of the Bat: The Cinematic Saga of the Dark Knight-Reinventing a Hero. Warner Bros.. 2005.
Nathan, Ian (August 1995). "Hold me, thrill me, kiss me, Kilmer". Empire. pp. 108-117.
"Johnny Depp Was Almost Batman In Batman Forever". ComicBookMovie. December 10, 2009.
www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/CookiepussProduction/news/?a=12646
Jett (December 16, 2009). "William Baldwin Talks Batman And "JUSTICE LEAGUE: CRISIS ON TWO EARTHS"". Batman-on-Film.
www.batman-on-film.com/dccomics-on-film_JL-CRISIS-ON-TWO-EARTHS_William-Baldwin-talks-Batman_12-16-09.html
Details October 2011 Issue. Q&A: Ethan Hawke. Interview by Jonah Weiner.
www.details.com/celebrities-entertainment/movies-and-tv/201110/ethan-hawke-actor-woman-in-the-fifth
"Batman Forever - What Could Be: A Guide to the Batman Forever Cutting Room Floor". Batman-On-Film.com.
www.batman-on-film.com/opinion_scissorpuppy_forever.html
Jeff Jensen (1998-12-04). "Winging It". Entertainment Weekly. October 19, 2008.
@@orinanime That was a very good series of posts you did there and I absolutely agree with it
I have always blamed Warner Brothers for the destruction of the original Bat man movie series , as they actually do call the shots
They did the same with the Never Ending Story 3 . Compare that to the first two movies
For the record though , I absolutely love Bat man Returns and so do many others . I like the dark tone and the costume is one of the best in my opinion
Twister reboot? I live in the mid-west so I have lived many Twister reboots
what if there was a green lantern game that was basically just Scribblenauts
James's pronunciation of 'Tenet' is just a series of consistent fuck-ups and I don't know how to feel about it.
@Weekly Planet please read this for the next H8 mail segment 🤣
Movie theaters are not coming back
I've emailed in an email for letters twice now and am concerned as to why you still haven't read it out yet, maybe I've gotten the wrong email idk, to let you know I've titled my email letters btw incase you've somehow missed it.
Omg my streams are crossing!? Mason follows outside xbox/xtra 😮😮😮
I'd be pleasently surprised if we see Keaton in a batsuit. He'll have a glorified cameo at best.
What if he's in Pfeiffer's catsuit, though? Less pleasant, methinks.
link.hollywoodreporter.com/view/518d565b191b2a646dbe685cccj4v.gah/416289b3
Michael Keaton is in talks to return as Batman. (And by Batman, we also mean Bruce Wayne. Despite pesky rumors from certain corners, there is no Thomas Wayne in the script, sources tell us. Also: Keaton would appear in costume.)
Has the film Thornado come out yet? Its a tornado of Thors!
I've never experienced the word data repeated that much, in such a small space of time, pronounced like that. I feel like I just had a system reboot
I can't wait for next year's blockbuster disaster film : MegaloCano Storm
I still want a Flashpoint movie
You fucking HAVE to get Nic Cage as old superman in burton universe...
Bale ain’t no murderer and Pattinson best not be.
If Pattinson doesn’t have the rule I’m just gonna not watch his movies cuz it’s not a batman movie without the rule to me cuz that’s what I find appealing about batman.
Is no one gonna talk About the newspaper saying Burton batman captured joker even tho he's dead was he brought back to life is IT his son or Copycat a brainwashed Robin
Didn't ezra miller attack some girl recently? Idk if I'm cool with him being the flash. It was like caught, recored and everything...
What does that have to do with him being the flash?
@@anthonyhernandez4266 Beacause he's not a good person?
@@ProxyGaming. what does that have to do with his job? Only people who never get into a fight can be actors? Thats like me asking the guy at subway if hes ever been in a fight because if hes not a "good person" then Idk if im cool with him making my sandwich. And since when does getting into a fight make you a bad person? Its not like he maimed someone. Was he provoked? Did you see if anything happened before the fight? If you dont like him because of things he does outside his job then just dont watch any movies that hes in. Not mess with his career. Problem solved.
@Anthony Hernandez While there is no context, prior to the video, There are multiple actions he could of done as a reaction. Fights are fights, but when a man chokes / hurts a women that crosses line. And I'd be uncomfortable be that a subway employee, or a hollwood actor. But you are right, -- Put my money where my mouth is. I won't go see an ezra miller movie.
I love H8 mail!!!!!!!!
Yes nic cage as superman
Timeline of news on comicbook.com
1. Jeffery dean Morgan to be in the flash.
And hour later
2. Michael Keaton cast to be in the flash.
3. He wont have a suit.
4. He will infact have a suit.
The day later
5. He's cast but if it doesn't work out it's going to be Christian bale.....
It's all piss dont believe it
The Hollywood Reporter is legit. Everything else is rumor.
I hope Erika is just a regular girl who enjoys listening to this podcast on her way to regular work each day.
I think someone should warn Mason that Marcella ends in a really fucking stupid way...
...unless there was an extra season I've missed that fixes everything somehow and I'm an idiot
I can hear that we are approaching Caravan of Garbage being about all these darn kids making too much noise these days, and how it was different back in my day :) Thankfully, its the apocalypse so it wont last long.
I don’t like the way the listener said it by calling you guys soy boys cause that helps no one but I somewhat agree with what he said about endgame. I’m not against women at all I just think narratively it didn’t make sense and was out of place. At that point in the film we’ve reached what we have been building towards: the final battle and we have all the characters flying around fighting and then all of a sudden a political statement is inserted awkwardly breaking the flow of the conflict. That’s just my opinion tho I don’t think you guys are soy boys and I love the podcast
Do justice league dark apokolips war
Oh Noooooo will I have to wait longer for Dune????? Damn you Shai tan
I would've thought that James, as a father, would know the difference between killing adults with guns trying to kill you and killing an unborn baby.
Twenty thousand leagues under the sheets.
☼ i like being confused. #Westworld #Interjection
I love the idea that Keaton's Batman is responsible for all the other multiverse Batmans - like a trial and error process he's doing.
G'day, I'm Batman.
👍👍
Calling Zack Snyder movies cerebral is like calling Sesame Street violent and gory.
Will Marlon Wayans be his Robin?
Twister 2: Rise of the Cownado
Revenge of the Crownado
-You're the Crow now.
-Yessssss.
Keaton NEEDS to be shown in a suit, please not just as an elder tutor
the h8 mail stuff .... look I'm a die hard DC fanboy, I'm biased to all hell, but you gotta be able to take this shit in stride, not everyone needs to love every thing DC puts out. I'm always extremely forgiving of those movies but some of them are still pretty ass and folks are allowed to call em out for being ass.
neat
James just spoiled The Last of Us 2 big time....
Wait what time so I can skip . If it's a genuine one obviously
is there a timecode for it? i'm in the last 3rd of it and i don't want it wrecked so close to the end!
I would like to know how you guys feel about characters we used to know nothing much about that we know more and more about through prequels and retcons and shit. I'm thinking wolverine, joker, obi wan and yoda. I can't think of a lady or a character not played by a white person so maybe give this question a miss. I've enjoyed listening to this show while inventing cocktails and getting too drunk in the middle of the night but, fuck this being unemployed during a pandemic shit, it sucks dead dogs balls. Just realised none of this is phrased as a question. What a dickhead I am.
You guys should do a caravan of garbage for Batman returns now that Keaton is coming back
It hasn't been confirmed yet that he is coming back though
Jonathan Spencer they’re gonna write him a blank check. Of course he will come back
Cosmic Ghost rider
SOYBOY oh my god I'm absolutely going to use that.
It's been around for a while: ua-cam.com/video/C8dfiDeJeDU/v-deo.html
At this point if WB dont put Bruce Timm in charge as their Kevin Feige, we will never see a decent and definitive version of any of these characters in our lifetime. Execs are completely moronic and out of touch.
#Doompatrol 🐎
Check it out!!!