Can we trust the Bible translations?

[@paulmcwhorter]

Very well said, and can be a very divisive issue. By leaning towards the authority of the Textus Receptus, it is very easy to inflame those around us, and be slapped with a label of 'King James Only', like we are some sort of backward cult members. I love the grand literary style of the KJV and much of that grand style is preserved in the NKJV. I am grieved to my core by the cavalier attitude in many of the modern so called translations. Particularly, I am grieved when I see pastors teach or preach from the 'Message', which seems to be a version turning God into some sort of cool dude who would hang out with you in the coffee shop. I am a missionary serving in East Africa, and not Lutheran, but am greatly blessed by your teachings, and never miss any of your videos. I am greatly blessed by each one of them. Thanks!

[@markhorton3994]

The Message translation was written as a challenge to find the oddest word choice without totally destroying the meaning. I find the idea of anyone using it as their main translation for reading tragic However it occasionally sheds light on a passage I have difficulty understanding. When studying a verse or passage (the "verse of the day" usually) I use 33 translations in two languages. From the "Biblia del Oso " and Geneva Bible to the NLT. They ALL say the same thing.
Even worse is the Passion "translation" . It is, apparantly, deliberately wrong.

[@joblogs6330]

Well said. Christianity I believe has been infiltrated by the Jesuits who are still out to destroy Christianity. read my comment at the top, but be warned, after thinking the nkjv was just an easier read of the KJV, I looked who published it, edited it, scrutineered it and the nkjv is a jesuit way of doing satans work by changing small things to mean completely the opposite at times. It is not a good book. The publishers also publish the satanic bible, the lgtbqrs virus bible etc and of course changes are also attributed to copyright (or so they say). When I say KJV, I am frowned upon because they tell me of so many errors. Ok, show me some......? oh if you read the front of the RSV bible in the church pew it tells you. hmmmmm,,,,,,,, nope, it doesn't, it says the KJV is full of errors but not what the errors are. The small changes over a long period of time mean that when people come into the church from the world and even those in the church, when reading new bible copies (because they are not new translations), they can say 'have a look, the bible does not say that' then the church crumbles.

[@markhorton3994]

@@mpkropf5062 I have not found any serious theological differences in The Message from the other over 60 translations I compare to aid studying the " verse of the day". I now include a French and a German translation but NOT The Passion or New World translations because I have seen their deliberate heresy. I admit that one verse out of context at a time may not reveal deficiencies. One reason I include the Message is that lacking verses it shows context better. Another is that occasionally less common meanings of words are revealed. Most claims of mistranslation are based on the origional word not having an exact equivalent in English. The Message sometimes reveals other nuances, which then require further study in context.
However the Message uses "Your in charge " for "Thine is ...the power". That is theologically and semantically correct but offends me.
The Message is absolutely not suitable for daily Bible reading or even comparing a few translations.
John 1:1-2 in The Message
The Word was first, the Word present to God, God present to the Word, the Word was God, in readiness for God from day one.
The wording is odd but the meaning is the same Jesus is God.

[@laurenclark5734]

Fascinating. I know as LCMS we are supposed to read ESV but I’ve been using NASB for over 40 years. Long before I became Lutheran. I use it as my every day go-to.

[@pipsheppard6747]

Lauren, I bought my first NASB in 1975, I think, and though I have used others for comparison work these past 47 years, the NSAB is still my go to translation.

[@danbratten3103]

Lauren, keep using your NASB. My LCMS pastor when I was growing up, read from the KJV even though the Synod officially used the NIV.
I personally read from the KJV but I gave a coworker of mine an AAT Bible because he struggled reading the more popular ones. The most important thing about choosing a translation is this: read whichever one you will actually read. 👍🏻
Blessings in Christ 🙏🏻

[@sharondoan1447]

Having used the NIV for decades, I made an effort to use the ESV when the LCMS adopted it a few years ago.I compare the two translations frequently and still find the most satisfying and understandable read comes from my NIV. Sometimes I find myself posing the question, “ Why did they change that?” after comparing a passage in the two translations. The antiquated English of the KJV is beautiful but not relatable, to me. Others find it deeply satisfying. When King James I authorized this translation of the Bible, it was monumental. From what is recorded , King James is regarded as having “ placed the Bible into the hands of ordinary citizens to a degree never before imagined”. Pretty impressive, I must say. You might want to read a bit more about the reign of this glorified fellow. Turns out he was just a human.

[@laurenclark5734]

@@sharondoan1447 i’m not sure why you’re replying to me in this manner as I did not make any comment either way regarding the king James version of the Bible. I refer to the new American standard

[@CareyBest]

@@sharondoan1447 LCMS switched to ESV because the NIV changed their translation and would no longer offer the version we grew up with. Read a modern NIV and you'll notice they've made most of the verses that referred to "men" gender-neutral.

[@ajplathwisconsin]

For years I have grown to like and admire the New American Standard Bible for its wording. But, especially since I bought a Kindle download of the Lutheran Study Bible, I have grown comfortable with the ESV.

[@HighWideandHandsome]

I, too, am a Textus Receptus enjoyer.

[@sdlorah6450]

After many years in the modern versions, I memorized some verses in the KJV. Over time, I inevitably compared verses in the modern versions to the KJV. The differences that I noticed prompted me to study the issue of Bible versions which before I had not even known was 'a thing.' I had assumed that all versions carried the same meaning, but just used different words to communicate that meaning; I found that there were important words and phrases that were not in the modern versions as compared to the KJV. Sometimes, whole verses are missing.
Dr. Jack Moorman asserts in his book Missing in Modern Bibles that the equivalent of 1 and 2 Peter is missing in the Critical Text that underlies modern versions vs. the text that underlies the KJV and other Reformation-Era Bibles.
In the end, I became a KJVer. It is easier to memorize and retain and gives a full, consistent witness.

[@oddlycreatetiff8920]

I love the comparison of your often-used Bible and seldom-used Bible! What a fascinating idea!

[@alphonseblackwood2930]

Pastor Wolfmueller! God Bless you and the family! Have a good day!

[@lc-mschristian5717]

Thank you. God's peace be with you.

[@andrewl3939]

Good overview. And this is why I like looking at multiple translations when studying, understanding the fundamental differences and the biases or decisions involved in each.

[@sharondoan1447]

I do the same. To compare translations of study Bibles for a better or clearer understanding of the scriptures makes for prudent, competent study. I like the study Bibles because the footnote references lead to even more clarification. I am no linguist, but looking up Greek and Hebrew words to reflect on how the words have been used in the scriptural translation is extremely helpful. I truly would be happy if I could retain even half of what I study for longer than the study session lasts.

[@nathanielnelson324]

Thanks pastor. I needed that reassurance. 👍😎

[@oftin_wong]

You'll need it forever

[@judithtaylor6713]

There you go. All laid out and explained to perfection. Thank you.

[@danbratten3103]

Pastor your comment about your NKJV being worn out, is the exact reason why the TR based Bibles are the ones I lean towards. Because "oldest is the best" is false. The vast majority of the Greek manuscripts are supposedly newer is because they are copies of the ones that were used and worn out.
Blessings to you in Christ.🙏🏻

[@cdunphy457]

loved this I am a true you tube theologian in that my finding the LORD or more correctly I think he found me was from watching videos like this doing there best to explain things that the new christian hasn't ben n learned enough to be sure of them selves with questions like this and its funny but I feel like the Holy Spirit leads me to what I need know and your videos have been at the top of them I love it when you use cards to explain differences and you tell good stories so thank you

[@Ben_G_Biegler]

The more I look into this the more suspicious I become of the critical text.

[@internetsurfer777]

Great video! THanks.

[@hildavoigts3416]

I LOVE my Lutheran Study Bible😍

[@mpkropf5062]

Where did you get it?

[@hildavoigts3416]

@@mpkropf5062 our Synod, here in South Africa sells them, but you can order online, from: Concordia Publishing House, too

[@EXMUTRKS]

I love the like and as comparisons you make, Pastor. I miss St Paul... hope you're doing well in Austin Texas and everyone else.
Signed B Schielke

[@janejude]

The copy of the Fragment of John..over here at the university of Manchester in England!

[@BibleLovingLutheran]

I'm becoming Lutheran. I wish we could go back to the KJV. it's poetic and the Our Father sounds like the one we recite at St Paul's

[@benmizrahi2889]

There is no dogma in Lutheranism on using a certain translation or the other. I know ESV is the preferable version of the LCMS as a synod but you could use whatever translation you find the best suitable for your needs.

[@tedward98]

Saying there are more variants than words, makes it sound like every word is suspect, and we cannot recreate the text. That is nonsense:
The quick brown foxx jumped over the lazy dogs.
The swift brown fox jumped over the lazy dog.
The quick brown fox leaped over the lazy dogs.
The quick red fox jumped over the lazy hounds.
The fast redd fox jumped above the lazy dogs.
A quick brown fox jumped over the sleeping dogs.
The quick fox jumped over the lazy dogs.
The quick brown fox jamped over the lazy dogs.
The fox jumped over the lazy dogs.
The quick brown and red fox jumped over the lazy dogs.
The quick brown fox jumped across the lazy dogs.
The quick brwn fx jumped over the lazy dogs.
9 -11 words 12 variants. Yet the original can be easily discerned.

[@sing4gd1]

I stick with the AKJV 1611 and Received Text translations because I believe God has kept His Word in those Scriptures.

[@federicus1517]

Just today I bought the Nestle-Aland NTG. Very much hoping that in college there won’t be attacks on the word of God. God help me in my upcoming theology studies.

[@hal8517]

(Nerdy Question alert): What is the Lutheran view of the terms Verbal and Plenary inspiration (of the Bible)? And thanks for your videos.

[@bk24708]

I want to try to get used to the kjv for the same reasons and I know the poetry is really good in it.

[@checkplz6626]

Where are the copies of the original manuscripts kept now?

[@Samy-sx6kn]

Text criticism has nothing to do with critical or liberal theology.

[@Outrider74]

I appreciate the TR, having spent my youth in a KJV-only Baptist church (although I firmly reject KJV-onlyism). That being said, I don’t see why people freak out about the Critical Text. When the CT is properly understood, it gives us a more complete understanding of what was originally written.
All that being said, the one problem I have with the TR is that Erasmus took some liberties in his translation of the book of Revelation, as apparently the TR version of Revelation had some issues at the end.

[@richv3742]

I use NKJV and the NIV. Those are my go tos

[@WgB5]

Dude, I would not want you as a diving instructor. How did you pull this video off without getting a ticket?

[@samuelmelkamu2984]

Pastor thanks for this it was help full I wanted to as a question does marry has other children's what does luterans say ? Thank you In advance

[@SwissOnZ]

Haven’t finished the video. Really depends on the edition for the KJV. My edition that I am currently studying a lot of the information is derived from the numbers. (as in pages -book of numbers) the numbers themselves as mentioned before are a language. Genesis starting on page five. 5 angels. Also John 8 which is not in the written text but again 1058. Descendant of KJ most familiar with that type of English. Oddly linguistically you do have to be a bit Swiss. English is also a derivative of German French; Latin. With the numbers the later versions make sense but are truly written in a different English to which I personally find foreign. Again I haven’t finished the video but I’ve also been attempting to read Luther’s version in German as well as plan to order a Nestle-Aland; Alan D again being another translation of my name. Edition Oxford Ruby Reference Allan Bibles. Halfway through the video.

[@brandonschaden9236]

Hello! If the Council of Carthage gave us the current New Testament - why dont Protestants use the Old Testament declared at the council of Carthage?

[@edithhewson7208]

The idea of best translation of the Bible is same as the best denomination of believers of Christ Jesus.

[@mpkropf5062]

I was told Lutherans are not a denomination

[@earlygenesistherevealedcos1982]

Unfortunately, no we cannot. Not completely. But fortunately, we have access to more powerful online study tools than any previous generation. We can go right to the Greek and Hebrew via an interlinear translation and see what makes sense when there is a contrast in translations.

[@simontemplar3359]

well said, Rev. Wolfmeuller! Bart ehrman seems to be the guy who maybe doesn't quite lie but isn't totally honest either. sadly so few people seem to actually read the Bible before parroting, reacting, and regurgitating ehrman et al.
how would you say is best for dealing with these folks? thanks as always!

[@bodilkragh3847]

❤️ I'm sure that God kept his word, and it's KJV 1611.
No other translations accept Jesus as the creator, as far as I know.
Love from Denmark 😍

[@darylrahfeldt2162]

The Byzantine Text (TR) has the characteristic of being smoothed out and filled out compared to the Alexandrian, Western, etc.

[@jonathanclay6718]

I don't know if manuscripts surviving means they were used less. Before the printing press and the modern abundance of bibles and proliferation of translations, most people probably didn't have the luxury of choosing to use one copy over another.

[@danbratten3103]

Pastor, didn't you once say on Issues etc. that you didn't believe the long ending of Mark was original? I can't remember how long ago it was because I just listen to on-demand while driving?
Could you clarify this? Because you sound like TR preferred in this video, but you sounded like a CT preferred in the radio interview?

[@daveblosser4658]

Hi Pastor,
Would you recommend the New King James Version over the NIV Version or other Versions?
Dave 😊

[@jamesanderson9287]

The KJV is considered the best, just have to get around the old Englished, however, like any translation, is subject to error. I have heard an about 18th or 19th Century German translation may be better than that. Errors also lead to misunderstanding of doctrine, etc., so we still have to be careful with the interpretation without the complete, correct version of things.

[@nilsniemeier5345]

I'm curious--when you mentioned the Mark fragment, are you referring to the supposed mummy cartonnage fragment? Because if I remember rightly, that was potentially of dodgy provenance and might have been faked by the now disgraced Dirk Obbink (also, when Obbink was exposed as a manuscript thief and forger, discussion of that fragment more or less dried up overnight).

[@SwissOnZ]

Excited about the NKJV but again I think the KJV is truly finished the rest is supplemental and an academic study.

[@monalisa6264]

Can I ask your opinion? God just woke me up last year and guided me to certain things. One thing was scriptures. When I first started reading I got attacked by evil entities. I was told there are lies mixed with truths within the pages. I was guided to a lot of stories but when I read them especially Revelation it’s like I’m reading my life. How can things in the Bible written a long time ago be happening in my life today?

[@christiancurcio2576]

Did you say you were in Houston? I live in Houston and I’m looking for a church to attend. I believe there is a resurgence of acceptance within confessional Christianity such as the reformed and Lutheran towards the TR. All the reformation confessions quote verses in support of their doctrine from the text used in the king James. One of the main proof texts Lutherans use in regards to baptismal regeneration is in the last chapter of marks gospel. The very last section were the critical text causes doubt! I don’t know why the LCMS has the ESV as their main translation. In the LCMS liturgy they have the longer ending to the Lord’s prayer. But the ESV Bible that they use does not have that section in it. Very inconsistent.

[@verasweet3563]

There are several confessional LCMS churches in Houston of all different sizes. All Lutheran pastors have been trained in Greek and Hebrew, many read Latin and speak additional languages. What type of worship are you interested in and which part of Houston are you willing to drive to? What size of congregation?

[@christiancurcio2576]

@@verasweet3563 I’m looking for a very traditional and super conservative church. No birth control. No divorce/remarriage. Head coverings. Uses the received text (kjv/nkjv) type Church. One where the Pastor actually preaches from the Bible and not a 10-15 minute sermonette type talk. One where the Pastor actually deals with sin within the Church by withholding communion ect. I would drive anywhere in Houston or one of the suburbs for a church like that.

[@mpkropf5062]

@@christiancurcio2576that sounds like a Mennonite Church what you are looking for. They do not have the liturgy. In the liturgy it’s only supposed to be a 10-20 min message and is referred to as a homily. I love the short homily’s it keeps your attention better! Nothing can replace the liturgy!

[@olegig5166]

Let me say I appreciate your congenital and seemingly open minded approach to the version issue. I went through the same thing years ago. Let me tell you what helped me.
First I put aside comparing versions because that would simply make myself the judge and give place for personal preference to creep in.
I tried to figure out exactly what is the very basic question. In all versions we find the indication that God did inspire the original writings. So ok.
The Bible was indeed inspired by God! But what of today?
Inspiration without preservation is a waste. If I build a house and do not preserve it as time goes by, I am a fool.
God is no fool! Therefore we do have the inspired word preserved today!
Since God has preserved His word, we have the right to demand a perfect Bible. Would God make just one mistake? I say NO!
Now we have a parameter with which to measure. We need a parameter outside our own judgement and preference.
A mistake would need be within the individual version itself rather than between versions bearing in mind if God did indeed write, there would be no mistake. On this basis only one mistake, not in printing error, but in truth is all that is needed to show the absence of God's hand.
All modern versions contradict themselves at Heb 3:16 vs Num 14:30.
It's not that they contradict other versions or what I think or feel, but they contradict themselves!
How many mistakes would one allow to God? I say none.

[@BibleLovingLutheran]

For who were those who heard and yet rebelled? Was it not all those who left Egypt led by Moses?
Hebrews 3:16 ESV
not one shall come into the land where I swore that I would make you dwell, except Caleb the son of Jephunneh and Joshua the son of Nun.
Numbers 14:30 ESV
what?

[@olegig5166]

@@BibleLovingLutheran Heb says "all" Num say Caleb and Joshua followed Moses out of Egypt yet according to the book of Jousha they both entered the land. Therefore the "all" of Hebrews is incorrect.

[@BibleLovingLutheran]

@@olegig5166 what? Same
For who, having heard, rebelled? Indeed, was it not all who came out of Egypt, led by Moses?
Hebrews 3:16 NKJV
Which are you saying we're right then?

[@olegig5166]

@@BibleLovingLutheran Hebrews said all who followed Moses out of Egypt rebelled and did not enter. We know that is incorrect because we see Joshua and Caleb in the promised land in the book of Joshua and we also know they followed Moses out of Egypt.
All new versions are incorrect at Heb 3:16.
Why you might ask....Most probably because they were translated from incorrect manuscripts.

[@BibleLovingLutheran]

@@olegig5166 so which is correct

[@altlutheranerimbergischenl8769]

KJV 1611, NKJV, Luther 1912

[@TheFlush1980]

The Bible is the claim, not the evidence.

[@judyglasnapp766]

The many variants that still come out as you say still leading me to the true theology brings confusion and questions. One example is that Jesus is the door. While another variant is that Jesus is a door. I don’t like that. I will keep my mind stayed on the received text that still has a first century fragment that has made the nestles Aland new Greek New testament change bace to the received text.

[@willy9204]

The critical flaw in their logic is that God could come shining in the sky with angels singing his praise and they still wouldn't believe because they don't want to, in other words don't waste your time arguing with atheists

[@wataboutya9310]

With all the many accounts of witnessed miracles in the bible and the knowledge that even those who witnessed them started doubting soon after and sinning again. Truly supports your observations. The question becomes, are they blinded from truth by God just like Pharoah was out of necessity.

[@defenestratefalsehoods]

Im going to say no. The word for young woman was translated into virgin and with that jesus had a virgin birth.

[@augustinian2018]

Respectfully, some of the information in the video was either false, inappropriately slanted, or lacking serious evidential support. This is a crucially important topic-skeptics like Bart Ehrman have misled a lot of people by slanting the evidence against Christianity in their popular works. But we really need to rise above that and be careful with our words. Just as a Lutheran pastor wouldn’t want a layman leading a Bible study and teaching that we must accept Jesus as our personal Lord and savior in order to be saved, conservative textual critics wouldn’t want Lutheran pastors suggesting, without serious substantiating evidence, things like that Sinaiticus and Vaticanus are unreliable (I’ll grant that variants are just as likely to creep in by scribal omission as by scribal addition, and that many Byzantine readings are likely genuine, but so does my NA27; the work of textual critics isn’t infallible, but in the grand scheme of things, churches today have bibles closer to the original/initial text than most churches did throughout the history of the church). Just as teaching doctrine without substantiating that what one is teaching is correct is an error, stating an opinion on a horrifically complex topic like New Testament textual criticism without serious evidence to back it up is also an error. It undermines your credibility on topics that you are better prepared to speak about. Apologies if this is harsh, but a critically important aspect of apologetics is fairly representing the facts. When we distort or underpresent the data to favor our case, we open ourselves to having our credibility undermined. There’s an essay collection on these matters edited by evangelical textual critics Elijah Hixson and Peter Gurry titled Myths and Mistakes in New Testament Textual Criticism published by IVP Academic that may be of interest here.

[@BibleLovingLutheran]

what?

[@pipsheppard6747]

Gee, Pastor, I've done the research and came to a different conclusion. Maybe, just maybe, you conflated textual criticism with higher criticism? Two different fields, even if the second may have flowed from the first. However, the the earliest critics of God's Word didn't need the critical philosophy of more modern times. Satan sure didn't need it: "Did God really say?" That question has been around since shortly after the creation, and it's uptick in modern times was before textual criticism became a thing (think Leibniz, Lessing, Fichte, Jacobi, and Schleiermacher). I use translations based on the critical text and do not have the doubts. Give me a NASB or and ESV any day, no matter what the footnotes say. BTW: I'm reading your "Has American Christianity Failed?" and it is BLAZING!

[@HighWideandHandsome]

Deutsche Bibelgesellschaft can't even be bothered to mention God in the preface to NA28. I don't think he conflated anything.

[@pipsheppard6747]

@@HighWideandHandsome Thanks for your reply! I cannot imagine that this (not mentioning God in the preface) would automatically discount the work that has been done by textual critics. Maybe they do have an agnostic view of spiritual matters, but this would not disqualify the research that has been accomplished.

[@stanyukica382]

Both Old Testament and New Testament books we're canonized by The Catholic Church in the Late 3 hundreds And ratified by the Pope of RomeI n 405AD.
Did Luther swingly or Calvin Get the authority to determine their own Canon and where where did they get it Because it wasn't given by Christ Because Luther wasn't even a Bishop.

[@stanyukica382]

The Old Testament consists of 46 books. The Old Testament scholar At Oxford Can verify that the Catholic Church determines the candidate of creature for the Old Testament that consisted Of 76 books.

[@stanyukica382]

JND Kelly A ox for University scholar of Old Testament and Christian history Wrote a book called early Christian doctrines. In this book he writes that Old Testament consisted of 46 books With 27 books of the New Testament compiling a total of 73 books of the Canon

[@brandonschaden9236]

As a Catholic. This is one of the things that led me back to the Catholic Church

[@mpkropf5062]

Luther was a Bishop, I read during his biography

[@BibleLovingLutheran]

did you by chance read the Lutheran Witness? 😂

[@edithhewson7208]

1881 Bible Hoax UA-cam

[@darylrahfeldt2162]

It's called the "Received Text" because the person who first printed the Greek text in the middle ages printed in the intro that he is printing the text he "received." It has no deeper meaning than that.

[@markhorton3994]

"the person" was Erasmus. He used the seven manuscripts available to him and his memory of others he had seen. He has been quoted as wanting to use Sineaticus but not being able to get to Rome.
Erasmus was long after the middle ages.

[@oftin_wong]

Of course it's not truth
If it was then the life of Hercules would also be a great truth
He was the son of God also