Car prices, in my opinion, are still excessively high. Reductions from previously inflated prices, like £200k for a used GT3, don’t necessarily equate to good deals. It merely indicates a shift from their once exorbitant prices. Even now, they’re more expensive than they were before the pandemic. A genuinely good deal would be something like a 2017 Audi R8, priced at its pre-pandemic rate, plus the normal depreciation rate over the past 3-4 years, and an extra discount for the current high interest rates. Regarding new cars, it’s crucial to note that significant discounts were the norm in the past, barring the last few years. The return to such discounting isn’t extraordinary, particularly as these discounts aren’t much higher than pre-pandemic levels. What’s often missed is the excessive increase in new car prices over recent years, which appears to be more about exploiting consumer spending power than anything else. As a result, many cars are still priced much higher than their 2020 list prices or those of their predecessors, even after accounting for discounts. I’m certainly pleased to see car prices beginning to fall, but I’d hesitate to call them bargains. The economic reality is that most people aren’t financially better off than pre-pandemic, especially considering the current recession, inflation, and high interest rates. For car prices to be truly attractive or indicative of a market crash, they’d need to drop well below pre-pandemic levels. Furthermore, I suggest potential buyers wait a bit longer before making a purchase. A decrease in demand will inevitably lead to lower prices. It’s the basic principle of supply and demand that dictates pricing, not the actual value of the car. High-end models like Porsches, despite their premium price tags, are not overly costly to produce and are assembled relatively quickly. The market prices are still inflated, reflecting what consumers once were willing to pay monthly rather than the actual „worth“. With patience and strategic purchasing decisions, we might see more reasonable and affordable prices in the car market soon that might be real dealzz
When I collected my GTS 4.0 in feb 2022, my salesman in Stuttgart said that I could sell it right now for way more than I paid. ( I got a 6% discount back in 2020 ) After driving it through swiss and Italy it was so much fun that I didn't care about the figures. The depreciation fact flew out of the roof, if there is any. You can't beat smiles per miles 👍
As long as you have no problem with buying it I agree. If someone is forced to sell and going take a huge hit they can't dream of that could be different.
It would be really interesting to compare used car prices with the pre-Covid prices. And surely the correct benchmark for prices would be to use pre-Covid prices less 4 years of normal depreciation. That might be an indicator of how much the current prices still need to fall to be realistic.
Both houses & cars have become too expensive for most Americans these days, most especially for single people and/or single-income households. Even a lot of 2 income households can't afford them.
The industry has driven prices too high for most families. The solution is for prices to align with family budgets, even if it means a market correction. The wisest thing that should be on everyone mind currently should be to invest in different streams of income that doesn't depend on the govt.
What if you don't know how to trade any of these? I mean, see your point some people have the money and are willing to invest, the question is where to.
I agree, that's the more reason I prefer my day to day invt decisions being guided by a invt-coach, seeing that their entire skillset is built around going long and short at the same time both employing risk for its asymmetrical upside and laying off risk as a hedge against the inevitable downward turns, coupled with the exclusive information/analysis they have, it's near impossible to not out-perform, been using a invt-coach for over 7months+ and I've netted over 480k
Many people tend to lean towards spending money on things that don't generate income, like liabilities, rather than investing in assets that can bring in profits. It's important to understand the long-term benefits of investing in assets and making wise financial decisions.
I bought a demo (new) Focus ST in august 2023. Got a 21.5% discount on the car. Got it for about £29000. The car I traded in was Focus ST-line X estate 182ps almost fully loaded bought may 2022 new. It was originally priced just sniff under £30000 (todays currency), after discount I payed about £27500 for it. At the trade I had driven it 17200km. I got a fantastic price for it, £25950. The dealer put it for sale at about £28200.. Nothing happened for al most two months. Then in november they started to cut the price. First to £27000, then after just a week to the amount they payed me. Two more weeks and they made a huge cut to £22900. I was shocked.. What the hell where they doing! This wasn’t the end. Late december they cut the price yet again to £20600. Incredible! Now a week ago they removed the car. I was certain it had been sold. But the car has not changed owner. The market is just bonkers! I got my deal just at right time.
@@bordersw1239 come again? That’s not a sale is it. It’s still in the trade at that point. 99% is a massive claim and wrong, that’s just a fact. Many are bought that way but NOT 99%. 99% of people reading this are in the bottom 99% of intelligence and the top 99% of brexit supporters. That’s a BS statement just like claiming 99% of all cars are on finance. Just not true
My 911 turbo S cost 127k in 2019. Was 18 months old. In covid, it was worth 120k. Needed to sell last November 2023. Got 77k for it. Absolutely gutted. Will never purchase an expensive car again. Had sports cars since I was 18 years old. Finally, I learnt my lesson at 45 years of age
Been there, it's all down to how the economy is going, I had a Ferrari F355 F1 Spider with 14k on the clock that I owned for nine years but a baby came a long and had to sell, the economy was bad and I took 42k for it, same car now 120k.😢
Why are you "gutted" @Baz1000r ? You bought an object that everyone knows depreciates. How much it depreciates by, is dependent on the marketplace. Today's Porsche marketplace is not the same as it was. No investment is market-proof. I don't think you've learned any 'lesson' at all.
@markwood7045 How can you possibly comment on if I have learnt a lesson. Or what I thought my expectations were. What a ridiculous thing to say. You have no idea what I have or haven't learnt
To be fair though, it’s always been the case that you get around a 20-30% depreciation hit as soon as you drive a new car off the forecourt. I do feel that there’s certainly been a resetting of the car market however, from the crazy prices we saw a year or two ago.
Bought my Jag FPace V6 S in 2017 for 60k and still they're going for 28k on Autotrader. Not too bad over 7 yrs. Only got 20k miles on it. Will be keeping it for some time yet.
Good video Pete👍 remember the prices you looked at for the Boxster mostly retail, realistically your car will be late £40’s as a trade in they need a good margin to warrant car etc. Even if you get £48k, £14k depreciation in 2 years is good at this level. See how many 911 Turbo S are at main dealers and for how long! They have much further to come down to shift them. So many more S than non S turbos for sale, over supply.
Used buyers are the real judge of what a car is really worth - which can go either way. When manufacturers overprice a car, the used market isn’t pretty. Don’t forget Pete the online for sale prices you’re seeing are retail prices, so the actual loss to the car owner selling is much higher, as they will only be getting the trade value from the dealer - save for the instances where the dealer bought the car a long time ago, and is now making a loss. In a falling market their margins will be even larger to hedge against falling prices. For your estimated value of your car you mention, you probably need to knock off another chunk if you were to sell to a dealer.
Only in the car trade "In a falling market their margins will be even larger to hedge against falling prices" How about you traders cut your margins making the cars more affordable and sell more cars...
The prices were artificially high owing to the factors you mentioned and really are only returning to where they should be. Interest rates are causing savers to hang onto their capital and borrowers to not bother….both are impacting the car market massively
I have just cancelled my targa order after waiting two years for a build slot and got my deposit back so will probably wait and see and buy a second hand nearly new one the wait is not worth it and perhaps some dealers can get new build slots quicker than others
I think that is smart, I think that some deductions from list are around the corner even on things like the 911 (in deposit contributions etc) Which will cause nearly new to drop fast, so you will likely save a fair bit compared to buying one at list as you were going to
Auto trader , I love it , I’m like a kid in a sweet shop on there , can’t afford a lot of them but it’s great fun looking. Keeps me occupied for hours.
Good video. Supports what I have seen myself. However, in the case of GT3s, I would like to point out that while used prices have indeed come down A LOT, all of those cars you showed still have asking prices above their original MSRPs, even taking options into account.
Yes, the prices are still falling though. Be interesting to see what prices are in another few months. If you look at the price changes for each car on Autotrader it’s quite scary for the dealers holding stock, even on Porsche GT and RS cars at main dealers.
Its an amazing plug-in and interesting to see the price changes, thank you 🤟 - I was looking at V8 F Types 2022 and one dealer has been wildly changing prices - starting at 82k Aug 2023, then down to 69k back up to 90k down to 69k and now up at 72k...🤯
Hi Petrol ped, thank you. I've been looking for a channel that would review nearly new cars. I had a mini clubman cost me silly money as you no. when I had to change due to an accident at work I made a massive loss to me around 10.000 nearly new 6000 miles don't get me wrong my Kia Stonic is pretty much fully loaded better than mini but it was a big loss in a bad time for me but I had to change no choice. So it's nice to see you willing to do more affordable cars your channel keeps me going.
Good to see that used prices are steadily coming down from the convid inflation prices. Plus as said above, cars bought on the tick. Interest rates will hit hard.
Great content as always Pete. The cars haven't lost the money you mention, but the asking prices have reduced by those amounts. Some of those asking prices were always unrealistic. It's also interesting to see how long some of the cars have been on the market. If you can get £50K+ on your car still and only paid £62K(?), I think you've done extremely well. The fact that in the meantime you've loved owning it is very important too. Now is a good time to trade if you're going up the price spectrum, but you'll lock in a higher APR if you finance the car. I've got a Panamera hybrid, but looking at how cheap the Taycan has become has got me thinking of buying one again as they're fantastic cars for the prices they're now selling for.
As I work for a German car main dealer I have seen this first hand with the price drop and also certain models being sold for over list. Be interesting to know what the prices are for a hot hatch or a sensible daily rather than a dream world super car.
I still think that there is further to drop, as nobody has confidence in the market at the moment and things are only worth what people think they are worth. The prices were so over inflated by the waiting lists and the lockdown cash people had burning a hole in their banks. As a lot had worked from home and had nothing to spend money on, coupled with historically low interest rates a bubble began to grow. Now rates have gone up along with cost of basic utilities, coupled with the fact that nobody has any money lying around there is a long way to fall. Certain models such as the Porsche GT products have been produced in much greater numbers than previously so there are loads of cars about to ensure supply while demand falls.
Probably your best video ever. Incredible. I've been looking at an I Pace, OMG circa £38k for a year old HSE with new cost circa £80+. Keep them coming.
When new cars were almost impossible to get people turned to used and sadly greed pushed all the prices of used cars through the roof and now the bubble has burst.
I got a straight swap on my top of the range CRV a year after I bought it! Mine was a special order colour which a customer of the dealers really wanted but didn’t want to wait 8 months for! I got a brand new model with 5 years free servicing thrown in as a sweetener! Bonus!👍😄
Tbf this price correction is happening across the complete board & not just Porsches …. Tbh it was coming & about time too . Paying for overs was ludicrous especially on a deprecating asset
Really interesting vid.Thanks.Used prices are dropping fast.As a matter of interest I priced my car on We buy any car and in the last year the difference in what they are offering me is over £5000.Crazy difference.
The astonishing thing to me is that the asking price for some of the cars you are looking at seem to have been higher than new list price for a 3 year old car, and even with the price drop, it still looks higher than it should be. The used car market post covid was just ludicrous, looks like it is finally starting to correct again, which should also impact new prices if there is more competition. I think the change in the market is nothing more than correcting what was just gouging consumers through covid.
It really depends on where you live. You can’t find a used 2020-2024 Cayman S or GTS within 25 miles of NYC. Here all 911 and Cayman Boxster hold their value like crazy right now with no drop in sight.
I’m in the happy camp tbf I’ve been after a 997 gts and they’re starting to come into a decent price bracket now that the market is starting to stabilise!
Thank you for this as so relevant to me. I am in an almost identical situation to you - 718 Cayman 2019 plate - have loved it for for just over 2 years - would love a 911 next. Plan to keep it for another 6 months and reassess. Love your channel.
New cars have just got ridiculously expensive but it all seems to have got to the point of how much per month someone can afford on pcp rather than the total cost. I get it, but for someone like me, I like to own my cars so call me old fashioned. Hopefully the prices will stabilise.
A few months ago, my jaw nearly hit the floor when I was walking past a main dealer and seeing £25k for a Fiesta, not a special one, it actually had rear drum brakes.
When a C63 with a 2litre engine is more than a £100k you know the world has gone mad. Buy a car and keep it for 10 years min is my motto. PS , shmee's Senna has reduced by £65k and still no takers. It is tainted history wise though.
Who wants a Senna anyway? It’s a pointless car outside a track, and how often do you get to go to the track if you have a job, family and life to attend to?
@@Nord_Mann they're not for using - they're (mainly) a tax free investment. That's why you'll see many Ferraris and such like with crazy low mils on them. - Same with yachts - no inheritance tax
An interesting video, I am also doing my research using the AT extension and in general seen a 10 - 20% rebalancing. Interesting to note the point about your observation about EV owners trading IN and opting for petrol or diesel this does seems to be a trend, with the ramping down of EVs, it would seem the BIK, and salary sacrifice schemes being the only Prop holding up a declining sector. I was the waiting for you to feature the Mercedes’ EQC, readily available at 26k, the only car I can think of with similar depreciation was the Citroen XM
These cars are just kept mainly in a garage it seems, have they been run in properly or have just done small mileages of starting and stopping, never good for any engine
Market forces and all that you mentioned undoubtedly have had an effect here, but I believe these premium brands have always had it good. They’ve very nicely created a demand, and people will pay whatever price is asked within reason. I think most of the brands you mention here had over inflated prices in the first place. The bigger they are the harder they fall after all!! I think what would be interesting is to see the actual profit margins (probably impossible) that would either prove or disprove my theory 👍🏻
Brilliant video Peter and many thanks for adding the link to view the fluctuations! Will make AutoTrader even more addictive! Keep up the great work, love all of your content. Drive safe!
The interesting thing if you could find it out, is how much the dealer has it on their books for? Are the dealers losing money, or were they just over priced in the first place? And are they now back to the correct price. Great video.
A friend of mine is a car transport driver he travels all over the UK. He has told me at Bruntingthorpe there are so many Porsche Taycans lieing in a field youd struggle to count them all.
Interesting video. The problem is that interest rates have significantly increased. So buying these expensive sports cars on finance is a lot more expensive So you have a situation where there are lots of sellers in the market and a shortage of buyers. End result is all second hand cars are falling Also a lot of buyers a couple of years could buy one of these sports cars and thiought they could keep for a year then sell it on with no financial loss. This is no longer the case 😢
Porsche kept increasing new car prices over and above the rate of inflation throughout the covid years, in a grab for cash style. In the 2 years I waited for my first GTS the buy price went up 3 times, and it wasn’t small change increases. The only reason people didn’t cancel was the cars were selling over list. Well that’s now changed, resulting in people cancelling orders and shifting away. Used car prices again are massively over inflated, so when you see reduced by £10k, it was merely £10k overpriced or more, don’t be pulled into this, AT price grabber has a lot to answer for 😂 Porsche make great cars for sure, but the company and dealerships deep routed questionable ethics are now biting them in the ass. Never underestimate the customer, or the British public, or do so at your peril. Range Rover anyone? ❤
If the Range Rover doesn't suit how about a new BMW M8 being offered at a discount of £43.5k off list price at a dealership in Swansea (£122k asking against £165.5k list)? Looks like a bargain until you see used versions barely a year old being advertised at £65k
@@robertbishopp4614 100%. We live in a time of massive greed, even more than before. Over inflated prices are in abundance, what we’re seeing is a reset and crash of a market to some degree. Plus most people are broke, even the spend on the credit card crew are slowing down as finance is now being refused, but they still want and have to keep up with the instagram lifestyle. Pretty sad really. I remember a time 70/80’s when if you ever saw a BMW or Jag on a drive way it was because they were genuinely working in a high position. Check out the council estates in bradfordistan, you’ll see more lambos and Porsche’s than in Dubai! Bonkers. £120k+ cars on the drive and living in a council house. Image/appearance has become more important than basic human ethics and simple living essentials, debt seems to be more a badge of honour, to be written off when insolvency is claimed. Weird world we live in for sure.
I waited 13 months for delivery on a 2023 718 Cayman S. It was worth the wait, and am absolutely unconcerned about resale value because I plan to keep it and enjoy it for a long time. GT cars will almost certainly retain resale better, but they are much harder to get (still on allocation with dealer markups) and for me are less practical as a daily driver.
The reduction of values is eye watering but remember the dealers are still making a profit at these lower prices (smaller than they had hoped of course) so bear in mind that the real value of these vehicles is even lower😳😳
I never understood why mass produced new Porsches would even appreciate. GT models yes, but they have made staggering numbers of the modern Porsche, compared to the hand built air cooled 964 and 993. Sure those are grossly overpriced but at least there's some kind of logic in that. It's ironic that they call 996 a "failure" although it sold way more than 964 and 993 combined. Hardly a failure. Production numbers. G 1974-1986: 196,000 964: 63,762 993: 68.029 996: 175,164 997: 212,964 991: 233,540
Fascinating, No question new cars were getting too expensive and the financing costs that apply today have hit the affordability and depreciation calculations very hard. Good news for used car buyers. How low will some of these lovely cars drop? My opinion is that they will go lower before hitting their real values.
I traded my BMW 230xi to a Model 3 two years ago and I don't really regret it. Best daily driver I've ever owned especially since I drive 40,000km/year but there are times during summer weekends when I wish I was in a sportscar. Was considering a Miata as a 2nd car but by heart's been desiring for a Porsche.; even just the most basic 718. Apparently, there's this stigma that most BMW owners tend to desire a Porsche. At this rate, I might be able to eventually attain one 🙏
EV Man's channel has recently shown that the market is just going back to some kind of normality after a period of unsustainable second-hand values. Additionally, when Onto went bust, they offloaded a mountain of nearly-new EVs, which has resulted in over-supply. As a driver of a small electric car, I am glad to see this as it opens up ownership to a much wider audience.
Local BMW dealer had to eventually knock £9k off a 2019 M5 to sell it at £40k, two months after listing it. I looked at it but 13.9% killed it immediately. Bottom line, something is only worth what the market is prepared to pay for it. That’s the reason why BMW in particular have always struggled with anything over £100k new.
Very interesting Pedro.. Will have to wait and see how the market changes as we move into the year. General Election, global economy, interest rate changes, cost of living crisis etc etc etc.... Thanks for this one, really enjoyed it.
Interesting and thoughtful (and thought-provoking) piece PP, thanks. The magic letters that have "allowed" (aka encouraged) prices to rocket, I give you: PCP. Nobody looks at or cares what the retail price is any more. The only thing that matters is, "Can I afford the monthly payment?" (or rental, as it should really be termed.). Something over 92% of new cars are acquired on a PCP. If PCPs didn't exist and people had to actually pay the full asking price (whether financed or cash), then the market as it stands price-wise would be plunging even further. The other thing is those prices you quote are mostly dealer retail prices. For a more accurate estimate of real depreciation on your Boxster, pop in to your local Porsche dealer and ask him what he'd actually give for you for it, both in P/X and as an outright purchase! One last little thing Pete. Please, please, don't adopt that irritating telly habit of switching from head-on view of you talking to camera to one of your side-view. If I'm speaking to someone face to face, I'm not interested in their ears!😁
Very worrying, I shudder to think how much value I’ve lost on my 10 year old MX5, cost me £8k only a year ago I guess it’s value now would have me in tears! On the plus side I’m not looking at selling so probably best not to worry too much.
We bought a Mini Cooper sport ex demo from one mini dealer , 14 months later sold it to a different mini dealer for 3k more than we paid for it against a brand new cooper sport factory order with very high spec , and it cost us only a few pounds more on a new pcp , only went in for a service ,
Its interesting to me personally as im looking at F-Type's atm, post 2018 facelift V6 low mieage examples are already dropping into the high to mid 30k, il hold on a while longer 😮
Car prices have been crazy the last few years. I had an m2 comp for 12 months at the beginning of covid. I ended up selling it, I added 10k miles, kept it 12 months, then sold it on at a profit of 12k. Mad. I had to sell it at that price. I've been driving my wife's hyundai i30n for the last couple of years, waiting for prices to go back to normal again. It's finally starting now, and I am finally looking to buy myself something nice again.
@@PetrolPed Having owned a brand new 981 for 5 years and driven the 718 it would be very interesting (and funny) to hear a single reason for the 718 - except using it as a track tool. 🤗
And that is why you need to worry about loosing money on your car trades. Every one knows that 981s hold their value much better than the 718, bare the GT4.
'You can't go far wrong in my view buying a Tesla model Y for thirty five grand'. None of us has a crystal ball but I'd happily put a fiver on it that by the middle of the year you would look back and reflect that you were optimistic. Just my view. We'll see. But, do enjoy your videos, knowledge and opinions hugely. Thanks for another great episode.
Not sure why you’re so excited over price changes, some will be demo cars with rising mileage, and the rest were just over inflated to start. I mean a 3 year old Boxter only losing 6-10k, sounds very good tbh, I think a £62k car should be £45-50 tops.
When you look at what your car is worth you have to reduce the Auto Trader garage retail price by 10-15% if PX or 5-10% if you are selling privately. The gap to that next car is always much higher because of this.
Interesting market. I popped into a VW dealer before Christmas as they had a two year old Up GTi, £2k over original list on the forecourt. I was hassled by a salesman trying to sell me a pre registered ID3 for almost half price! Some bargains out there. EVs are pretty toxic. I'd buy a late ICE you could keep and maintain. Jags, Merc SLs. Avoid anything with a big battery.
This morning on my Facebook feed I had two adverts appeared for 28 pre-reg less than 20 miles on the odo, 73 plate EQC AMG Line all on offer at less than £44000 and over 100 Ford Mustang Mach E GT’ at £43000 similar miles, 73 plate pre-regs. The EQC’s were all for sale at Scottish branches of Mercedes main dealers owned by Arnold Clark Group. Ford the elf were advertising the Mach E GT’s
@@timoliver8940 How much below list is that? I'm not in the market, but I tried an EQC when they first came out and I was and thought it was a very nice car. At the time, I think they cost around £60K.
For so long people lived off close to 0% intrest rates be that mortgage car purchase etc. Now that highter intrest rates had time to keep affecting more and more people each month some re adjustments have been forced. Great time have cash . Better saving rate. More purchase power.
I couldn’t care less what my 81 Boxster S is worth. I bought to drive it and keep it. It’s my daily driver and when it’s paid off next year I will be getting a 981 GT4. Here in the States the new and used markets are cratering and will continue as the economic recession continues to slide.
It is all very bewildering and clearly supply and demand operating as defined by Adam Smith back in 1776 !!! I am immune with a 987 Boxster 2005 that has been worth £7k for the last 9 years 😂😂😂 and it is a great everyday driver with that gorgeous 6 lurking away behind you. 😊😊
Great news if your not px but like most cases when buying a car and trading one in is the price to change cost. And that is what you have to negotiate with your car dealer. Great video Ped. but had to laugh because in the start of the video you talked about affordable cars and £50k is a lot of money to pay, which it is and then migrated onto cars costing well in excess of £140k. Love it
Hold tight. With this Houthi issue in the Red Sea ships having to take the long route. This will increase costs and delay deliveries. Could possibly increase prices.
Looking at the price of the M2 and the last versions that came out they’re still more money to drop out of them. If you ask me. I would definitely have to a 992 GT3 for me. What a car.👍
To be fair I'd imagine that very few brand new cars are sold outright these days and at least half are company cars. My company car would have cost 52K outright but it costs me virtually nothing in BIK as it's an EV. I'd have never have been able to afford to buy one outright myself. So keep the reviews of new cars coming!
My wife bought her first car right after the first lockdown in July 2020 when cars were still depreciating like rocks and the covid effect had not kicked in. BMW 1 series 118i SE for £14,599 from Available Car (with service pack included). 20 months old and 20k miles. We sold it to Motorway in August 2023 for £14k. £599 loss in 3 years is just madness. The same age, mileage and spec 1 series is now around £10k more. This is all one big correction that has been way overdue. She now has a GR86 which was an absolute steal at £30k compared to so many other new cars these days.
Hi peter Great information as always 👏 My neighbour is a car trader for last 35 plus years And he’s told me if you buy a used car now for say 100k, The price will drop by 15/20% by Dec 2024 He made a cash offer on Porsche for sale in nov 2023 at a Porsche dealership Asking price was 110k, He offered 100k Offer rejected He got a call yday from the salesman and they offered it to him for 100k
Hello mate, I think the whole market has gone loopy. Prices have never returned to normality really since the ‘Covid’ reasoning. Some items have climbed and stayed, some have climbed and subsided a little. Strange times.
I think it's worth noting that many of the examples quoted still haven't sold after 5 months on the market. That means the asking price reductions haven't been large enough, so the market is dictating they are actually worth less still. I'm not a car enthusiast any more, but I find these videos interesting from time to time. 3 growing kids forced me to re-evaluate my priorities. In my view, nice car ownership has to be the most expensive hobby out there. As most cars fulfill their purpose, spending tens of thousands more for something you simply prefer is the reserve of only the very wealthy or the foolhardy these days. Covid bucked the market for a short period, helping some to convince themselves cars had become an asset, but sadly for most of us, great cars will never make financial sense.
Interesting I have been doing the same. As yours my car has deprecated and I need to wait a little time. GT3 GT4s and Spyders look appealing. Thanks I learnt about the price plug and that’s very useful. You can filter Cat S etc at the bottom of Autotrader.
Really enjoy your content. If I can offer a suggestion. If there's any way you can get data on what these vehicles are actually changing hands for over time, then you've got a much stronger and precise case for depreciation. Asking price just doesn't mean terribly much. Keep up the great work!
The app is great, I've been using it for awhile now. However, crafty dealers are already getting round the app simply by removing cars, then re-advertising them. I have seen this several times, so buyers need to be aware. Either way, prices are plunging, and some by considerably more than the app shows, especially some showing bizarre minor rises, these were often hugely cheaper just a few months ago. Porsche as a brand are the hard hit imo, possibly because of the fantasy prices of the last 12 months.
I would never buy an electric car, i would rather lease if I have to go for electric. The bigger issue is with insurance for them with some companies refusing to insure the Model Y, I heard a spokesperson from an insurance company on the radio talking about a 'very reasonable' £200 per month, what! per month? Are you nuts, no thanks.
These are the cars that haven’t sold. I have been offered a GTS 2021 with 9k and decent spec by a Porsche specialist for £48k who can’t get rid of his stock. I have countered with £43k and have landed on £45K PLUS next 2 services with no labour cost. I think there is more to go!
Would be interested to do similar with older classics, ie 911 3.2 or Merc 190 or Jag X350 … looking at auctions prices seem to be holding up as people dump complexity for older analogue …?
Car prices, in my opinion, are still excessively high. Reductions from previously inflated prices, like £200k for a used GT3, don’t necessarily equate to good deals. It merely indicates a shift from their once exorbitant prices. Even now, they’re more expensive than they were before the pandemic. A genuinely good deal would be something like a 2017 Audi R8, priced at its pre-pandemic rate, plus the normal depreciation rate over the past 3-4 years, and an extra discount for the current high interest rates.
Regarding new cars, it’s crucial to note that significant discounts were the norm in the past, barring the last few years. The return to such discounting isn’t extraordinary, particularly as these discounts aren’t much higher than pre-pandemic levels. What’s often missed is the excessive increase in new car prices over recent years, which appears to be more about exploiting consumer spending power than anything else. As a result, many cars are still priced much higher than their 2020 list prices or those of their predecessors, even after accounting for discounts.
I’m certainly pleased to see car prices beginning to fall, but I’d hesitate to call them bargains. The economic reality is that most people aren’t financially better off than pre-pandemic, especially considering the current recession, inflation, and high interest rates. For car prices to be truly attractive or indicative of a market crash, they’d need to drop well below pre-pandemic levels.
Furthermore, I suggest potential buyers wait a bit longer before making a purchase. A decrease in demand will inevitably lead to lower prices. It’s the basic principle of supply and demand that dictates pricing, not the actual value of the car. High-end models like Porsches, despite their premium price tags, are not overly costly to produce and are assembled relatively quickly. The market prices are still inflated, reflecting what consumers once were willing to pay monthly rather than the actual „worth“. With patience and strategic purchasing decisions, we might see more reasonable and affordable prices in the car market soon that might be real dealzz
Very good analysis?
When I collected my GTS 4.0 in feb 2022, my salesman in Stuttgart said that I could
sell it right now for way more than I paid. ( I got a 6% discount back in 2020 )
After driving it through swiss and Italy it was so much fun that I didn't care about the figures.
The depreciation fact flew out of the roof, if there is any.
You can't beat smiles per miles 👍
Same with me. Waiting for the good weather to take it out on the road again. The 4.0 GTS is the one.
As long as you have no problem with buying it I agree. If someone is forced to sell and going take a huge hit they can't dream of that could be different.
It would be really interesting to compare used car prices with the pre-Covid prices. And surely the correct benchmark for prices would be to use pre-Covid prices less 4 years of normal depreciation. That might be an indicator of how much the current prices still need to fall to be realistic.
Both houses & cars have become too expensive for most Americans these days, most especially for single people and/or single-income households. Even a lot of 2 income households can't afford them.
The industry has driven prices too high for most families. The solution is for prices to align with family budgets, even if it means a market correction. The wisest thing that should be on everyone mind currently should be to invest in different streams of income that doesn't depend on the govt.
What if you don't know how to trade any of these? I mean, see your point some people have the money and are willing to invest, the question is where to.
I agree, that's the more reason I prefer my day to day invt decisions being guided by a invt-coach, seeing that their entire skillset is built around going long and short at the same time both employing risk for its asymmetrical upside and laying off risk as a hedge against the inevitable downward turns, coupled with the exclusive information/analysis they have, it's near impossible to not out-perform, been using a invt-coach for over 7months+ and I've netted over 480k
Many people tend to lean towards spending money on things that don't generate income, like liabilities, rather than investing in assets that can bring in profits. It's important to understand the long-term benefits of investing in assets and making wise financial decisions.
I bought a demo (new) Focus ST in august 2023. Got a 21.5% discount on the car. Got it for about £29000. The car I traded in was Focus ST-line X estate 182ps almost fully loaded bought may 2022 new. It was originally priced just sniff under £30000 (todays currency), after discount I payed about £27500 for it. At the trade I had driven it 17200km. I got a fantastic price for it, £25950. The dealer put it for sale at about £28200.. Nothing happened for al most two months. Then in november they started to cut the price. First to £27000, then after just a week to the amount they payed me. Two more weeks and they made a huge cut to £22900. I was shocked.. What the hell where they doing! This wasn’t the end. Late december they cut the price yet again to £20600. Incredible! Now a week ago they removed the car. I was certain it had been sold. But the car has not changed owner. The market is just bonkers! I got my deal just at right time.
It’s good to see a correction in the market. Flippers took the mick for so long it’s about time they took the hit 👍🏼
💯 WELL SAID 👍
It's basically prices recorecting...The whole PCP model was built on ultra low interest rates, the bubble has burst.
Since 99% of cars are bought on borrowed money, as soon as interest rates go up the price must come down.
Nice stat, it’s wrong but nice effort
How do you think the dealers buy the cars from the manufacturer?
@@bordersw1239 come again?
That’s not a sale is it. It’s still in the trade at that point. 99% is a massive claim and wrong, that’s just a fact.
Many are bought that way but NOT 99%.
99% of people reading this are in the bottom 99% of intelligence and the top 99% of brexit supporters. That’s a BS statement just like claiming 99% of all cars are on finance. Just not true
@@Becausefamilycar Yes they went from 0 to 5,25%. Massive drop 😅
@@StakedWealth369 no they didn’t. Go have a look.
They went up big time many months ago now the rates are dropping a lot
My 911 turbo S cost 127k in 2019. Was 18 months old. In covid, it was worth 120k. Needed to sell last November 2023. Got 77k for it. Absolutely gutted. Will never purchase an expensive car again. Had sports cars since I was 18 years old. Finally, I learnt my lesson at 45 years of age
Ouch 😣
Totally agree,generally the more the spend the more the loose.
Been there, it's all down to how the economy is going, I had a Ferrari F355 F1 Spider with 14k on the clock that I owned for nine years but a baby came a long and had to sell, the economy was bad and I took 42k for it, same car now 120k.😢
Why are you "gutted" @Baz1000r ? You bought an object that everyone knows depreciates. How much it depreciates by, is dependent on the marketplace. Today's Porsche marketplace is not the same as it was. No investment is market-proof. I don't think you've learned any 'lesson' at all.
@markwood7045
How can you possibly comment on if I have learnt a lesson. Or what I thought my expectations were. What a ridiculous thing to say.
You have no idea what I have or haven't learnt
To be fair though, it’s always been the case that you get around a 20-30% depreciation hit as soon as you drive a new car off the forecourt. I do feel that there’s certainly been a resetting of the car market however, from the crazy prices we saw a year or two ago.
Bought my Jag FPace V6 S in 2017 for 60k and still they're going for 28k on Autotrader. Not too bad over 7 yrs. Only got 20k miles on it. Will be keeping it for some time yet.
Ouch@@ReadMyComments
Good video Pete👍 remember the prices you looked at for the Boxster mostly retail, realistically your car will be late £40’s as a trade in they need a good margin to warrant car etc. Even if you get £48k, £14k depreciation in 2 years is good at this level. See how many 911 Turbo S are at main dealers and for how long! They have much further to come down to shift them. So many more S than non S turbos for sale, over supply.
Used buyers are the real judge of what a car is really worth - which can go either way. When manufacturers overprice a car, the used market isn’t pretty. Don’t forget Pete the online for sale prices you’re seeing are retail prices, so the actual loss to the car owner selling is much higher, as they will only be getting the trade value from the dealer - save for the instances where the dealer bought the car a long time ago, and is now making a loss. In a falling market their margins will be even larger to hedge against falling prices. For your estimated value of your car you mention, you probably need to knock off another chunk if you were to sell to a dealer.
Only in the car trade "In a falling market their margins will be even larger to hedge against falling prices" How about you traders cut your margins making the cars more affordable and sell more cars...
@@135Ops I’m not a trader lol.
The prices were artificially high owing to the factors you mentioned and really are only returning to where they should be.
Interest rates are causing savers to hang onto their capital and borrowers to not bother….both are impacting the car market massively
I have just cancelled my targa order after waiting two years for a build slot and got my deposit back so will probably wait and see and buy a second hand nearly new one the wait is not worth it and perhaps some dealers can get new build slots quicker than others
I think that is smart, I think that some deductions from list are around the corner even on things like the 911 (in deposit contributions etc)
Which will cause nearly new to drop fast, so you will likely save a fair bit compared to buying one at list as you were going to
Auto trader , I love it , I’m like a kid in a sweet shop on there , can’t afford a lot of them but it’s great fun looking. Keeps me occupied for hours.
Right on
Good video. Supports what I have seen myself. However, in the case of GT3s, I would like to point out that while used prices have indeed come down A LOT, all of those cars you showed still have asking prices above their original MSRPs, even taking options into account.
Great point!
Yes, the prices are still falling though. Be interesting to see what prices are in another few months. If you look at the price changes for each car on Autotrader it’s quite scary for the dealers holding stock, even on Porsche GT and RS cars at main dealers.
Someone just showed us this video... that £90k drop on the Ferrari is a bloody good find! But there are even bigger drops to be found ;-)
Great vid.
Won’t fancy being in Tom Hartleys shoes at the mo
Its an amazing plug-in and interesting to see the price changes, thank you 🤟 - I was looking at V8 F Types 2022 and one dealer has been wildly changing prices - starting at 82k Aug 2023, then down to 69k back up to 90k down to 69k and now up at 72k...🤯
Hold out brother, it will tank much further. Wait for them to stabilize.
@@TheChaz96agreed. Cars will devalue money won’t so hang on.
I think another issue affecting the prices is the very big margin car dealers are making between the p/ex price and sale price
Hi Petrol ped, thank you. I've been looking for a channel that would review nearly new cars. I had a mini clubman cost me silly money as you no. when I had to change due to an accident at work I made a massive loss to me around 10.000 nearly new 6000 miles don't get me wrong my Kia Stonic is pretty much fully loaded better than mini but it was a big loss in a bad time for me but I had to change no choice. So it's nice to see you willing to do more affordable cars your channel keeps me going.
Dealers must be panicking, their stock is depreciating at an alarming rate.
Good to see that used prices are steadily coming down from the convid inflation prices.
Plus as said above, cars bought on the tick. Interest rates will hit hard.
Great content as always Pete. The cars haven't lost the money you mention, but the asking prices have reduced by those amounts. Some of those asking prices were always unrealistic. It's also interesting to see how long some of the cars have been on the market. If you can get £50K+ on your car still and only paid £62K(?), I think you've done extremely well. The fact that in the meantime you've loved owning it is very important too. Now is a good time to trade if you're going up the price spectrum, but you'll lock in a higher APR if you finance the car. I've got a Panamera hybrid, but looking at how cheap the Taycan has become has got me thinking of buying one again as they're fantastic cars for the prices they're now selling for.
As I work for a German car main dealer I have seen this first hand with the price drop and also certain models being sold for over list. Be interesting to know what the prices are for a hot hatch or a sensible daily rather than a dream world super car.
I still think that there is further to drop, as nobody has confidence in the market at the moment and things are only worth what people think they are worth.
The prices were so over inflated by the waiting lists and the lockdown cash people had burning a hole in their banks. As a lot had worked from home and had nothing to spend money on, coupled with historically low interest rates a bubble began to grow.
Now rates have gone up along with cost of basic utilities, coupled with the fact that nobody has any money lying around there is a long way to fall.
Certain models such as the Porsche GT products have been produced in much greater numbers than previously so there are loads of cars about to ensure supply while demand falls.
Probably your best video ever. Incredible. I've been looking at an I Pace, OMG circa £38k for a year old HSE with new cost circa £80+.
Keep them coming.
Glad you liked it!
So new Audi RS3's seem to be depreciating slower than BMW M2's which suprises me.
Audi rs models 99% of the time are much better than m model's
When new cars were almost impossible to get people turned to used and sadly greed pushed all the prices of used cars through the roof and now the bubble has burst.
I got a straight swap on my top of the range CRV a year after I bought it!
Mine was a special order colour which a customer of the dealers really wanted but didn’t want to wait 8 months for! I got a brand new model with 5 years free servicing thrown in as a sweetener! Bonus!👍😄
Thanks for AT Price tracker extension advise.
Any time!
Tbf this price correction is happening across the complete board & not just Porsches …. Tbh it was coming & about time too . Paying for overs was ludicrous especially on a deprecating asset
Really interesting vid.Thanks.Used prices are dropping fast.As a matter of interest I priced my car on We buy any car and in the last year the difference in what they are offering me is over £5000.Crazy difference.
The astonishing thing to me is that the asking price for some of the cars you are looking at seem to have been higher than new list price for a 3 year old car, and even with the price drop, it still looks higher than it should be. The used car market post covid was just ludicrous, looks like it is finally starting to correct again, which should also impact new prices if there is more competition. I think the change in the market is nothing more than correcting what was just gouging consumers through covid.
Every possession is drooping in value
It really depends on where you live. You can’t find a used 2020-2024 Cayman S or GTS within 25 miles of NYC. Here all 911 and Cayman Boxster hold their value like crazy right now with no drop in sight.
I’m in the happy camp tbf
I’ve been after a 997 gts and they’re starting to come into a decent price bracket now that the market is starting to stabilise!
Thank you for this as so relevant to me. I am in an almost identical situation to you - 718 Cayman 2019 plate - have loved it for for just over 2 years - would love a 911 next. Plan to keep it for another 6 months and reassess. Love your channel.
Thanks Darren 👍
When you do Autotrader searches at the bottom you can choose to exclude CAT S/C/D/N cars from the results so you won’t see them
Thanks for the tip 👍
New cars have just got ridiculously expensive but it all seems to have got to the point of how much per month someone can afford on pcp rather than the total cost. I get it, but for someone like me, I like to own my cars so call me old fashioned. Hopefully the prices will stabilise.
Perpetual debt seems to be the norm
A few months ago, my jaw nearly hit the floor when I was walking past a main dealer and seeing £25k for a Fiesta, not a special one, it actually had rear drum brakes.
😂😂😂
When a C63 with a 2litre engine is more than a £100k you know the world has gone mad. Buy a car and keep it for 10 years min is my motto. PS , shmee's Senna has reduced by £65k and still no takers. It is tainted history wise though.
😬
The fact Shmee has owned it seriously decreases it's value.
Who wants a Senna anyway? It’s a pointless car outside a track, and how often do you get to go to the track if you have a job, family and life to attend to?
@@Nord_Mann they're not for using - they're (mainly) a tax free investment. That's why you'll see many Ferraris and such like with crazy low mils on them. - Same with yachts - no inheritance tax
@@GazMoby can't agree more..
An interesting video, I am also doing my research using the AT extension and in general seen a 10 - 20% rebalancing. Interesting to note the point about your observation about EV owners trading IN and opting for petrol or diesel this does seems to be a trend, with the ramping down of EVs, it would seem the BIK, and salary sacrifice schemes being the only Prop holding up a declining sector. I was the waiting for you to feature the Mercedes’ EQC, readily available at 26k, the only car I can think of with similar depreciation was the Citroen XM
These cars are just kept mainly in a garage it seems, have they been run in properly or have just done small mileages of starting and stopping, never good for any engine
Market forces and all that you mentioned undoubtedly have had an effect here, but I believe these premium brands have always had it good.
They’ve very nicely created a demand, and people will pay whatever price is asked within reason. I think most of the brands you mention here had over inflated prices in the first place. The bigger they are the harder they fall after all!!
I think what would be interesting is to see the actual profit margins (probably impossible) that would either prove or disprove my theory 👍🏻
Brilliant video Peter and many thanks for adding the link to view the fluctuations! Will make AutoTrader even more addictive! Keep up the great work, love all of your content. Drive safe!
The interesting thing if you could find it out, is how much the dealer has it on their books for? Are the dealers losing money, or were they just over priced in the first place? And are they now back to the correct price. Great video.
A friend of mine is a car transport driver he travels all over the UK.
He has told me at Bruntingthorpe there are so many Porsche Taycans lieing in a field youd struggle to count them all.
Polished turds..hard to sell. Tesla are eating their lunch
Interesting video. The problem is that interest rates have significantly increased. So buying these expensive sports cars on finance is a lot more expensive
So you have a situation where there are lots of sellers in the market and a shortage of buyers. End result is all second hand cars are falling Also a lot of buyers a couple of years could buy one of these sports cars and thiought they could keep for a year then sell it on with no financial loss. This is no longer the case 😢
would be a good move to feature more affordable cars Pete and I'm sure your subscription numbers will increase
Porsche kept increasing new car prices over and above the rate of inflation throughout the covid years, in a grab for cash style. In the 2 years I waited for my first GTS the buy price went up 3 times, and it wasn’t small change increases. The only reason people didn’t cancel was the cars were selling over list. Well that’s now changed, resulting in people cancelling orders and shifting away. Used car prices again are massively over inflated, so when you see reduced by £10k, it was merely £10k overpriced or more, don’t be pulled into this, AT price grabber has a lot to answer for 😂 Porsche make great cars for sure, but the company and dealerships deep routed questionable ethics are now biting them in the ass. Never underestimate the customer, or the British public, or do so at your peril. Range Rover anyone? ❤
If the Range Rover doesn't suit how about a new BMW M8 being offered at a discount of £43.5k off list price at a dealership in Swansea (£122k asking against £165.5k list)? Looks like a bargain until you see used versions barely a year old being advertised at £65k
@@robertbishopp4614 100%. We live in a time of massive greed, even more than before. Over inflated prices are in abundance, what we’re seeing is a reset and crash of a market to some degree. Plus most people are broke, even the spend on the credit card crew are slowing down as finance is now being refused, but they still want and have to keep up with the instagram lifestyle. Pretty sad really. I remember a time 70/80’s when if you ever saw a BMW or Jag on a drive way it was because they were genuinely working in a high position. Check out the council estates in bradfordistan, you’ll see more lambos and Porsche’s than in Dubai! Bonkers. £120k+ cars on the drive and living in a council house. Image/appearance has become more important than basic human ethics and simple living essentials, debt seems to be more a badge of honour, to be written off when insolvency is claimed. Weird world we live in for sure.
I waited 13 months for delivery on a 2023 718 Cayman S. It was worth the wait, and am absolutely unconcerned about resale value because I plan to keep it and enjoy it for a long time.
GT cars will almost certainly retain resale better, but they are much harder to get (still on allocation with dealer markups) and for me are less practical as a daily driver.
The reduction of values is eye watering but remember the dealers are still making a profit at these lower prices (smaller than they had hoped of course) so bear in mind that the real value of these vehicles is even lower😳😳
I never understood why mass produced new Porsches would even appreciate. GT models yes, but they have made staggering numbers of the modern Porsche, compared to the hand built air cooled 964 and 993. Sure those are grossly overpriced but at least there's some kind of logic in that.
It's ironic that they call 996 a "failure" although it sold way more than 964 and 993 combined. Hardly a failure.
Production numbers.
G 1974-1986:
196,000
964:
63,762
993:
68.029
996:
175,164
997:
212,964
991:
233,540
Fascinating,
No question new cars were getting too expensive and the financing costs that apply today have hit the affordability and depreciation calculations very hard. Good news for used car buyers.
How low will some of these lovely cars drop?
My opinion is that they will go lower before hitting their real values.
I traded my BMW 230xi to a Model 3 two years ago and I don't really regret it. Best daily driver I've ever owned especially since I drive 40,000km/year but there are times during summer weekends when I wish I was in a sportscar. Was considering a Miata as a 2nd car but by heart's been desiring for a Porsche.; even just the most basic 718. Apparently, there's this stigma that most BMW owners tend to desire a Porsche. At this rate, I might be able to eventually attain one 🙏
great channel and insights bmw i8 dropping too maybe because the batteries are due to be changed
EV Man's channel has recently shown that the market is just going back to some kind of normality after a period of unsustainable second-hand values. Additionally, when Onto went bust, they offloaded a mountain of nearly-new EVs, which has resulted in over-supply.
As a driver of a small electric car, I am glad to see this as it opens up ownership to a much wider audience.
Local BMW dealer had to eventually knock £9k off a 2019 M5 to sell it at £40k, two months after listing it. I looked at it but 13.9% killed it immediately.
Bottom line, something is only worth what the market is prepared to pay for it. That’s the reason why BMW in particular have always struggled with anything over £100k new.
Very interesting Pedro.. Will have to wait and see how the market changes as we move into the year. General Election, global economy, interest rate changes, cost of living crisis etc etc etc.... Thanks for this one, really enjoyed it.
We shall see 🤔
Interesting and thoughtful (and thought-provoking) piece PP, thanks.
The magic letters that have "allowed" (aka encouraged) prices to rocket, I give you:
PCP.
Nobody looks at or cares what the retail price is any more. The only thing that matters is, "Can I afford the monthly payment?" (or rental, as it should really be termed.). Something over 92% of new cars are acquired on a PCP. If PCPs didn't exist and people had to actually pay the full asking price (whether financed or cash), then the market as it stands price-wise would be plunging even further.
The other thing is those prices you quote are mostly dealer retail prices. For a more accurate estimate of real depreciation on your Boxster, pop in to your local Porsche dealer and ask him what he'd actually give for you for it, both in P/X and as an outright purchase!
One last little thing Pete. Please, please, don't adopt that irritating telly habit of switching from head-on view of you talking to camera to one of your side-view. If I'm speaking to someone face to face, I'm not interested in their ears!😁
Christ they have dropped,bottoms dropping out off the market. Very well put together video Pete. Keep them coming in 2024
👍
Very worrying, I shudder to think how much value I’ve lost on my 10 year old MX5, cost me £8k only a year ago I guess it’s value now would have me in tears! On the plus side I’m not looking at selling so probably best not to worry too much.
We bought a Mini Cooper sport ex demo from one mini dealer , 14 months later sold it to a different mini dealer for 3k more than we paid for it against a brand new cooper sport factory order with very high spec , and it cost us only a few pounds more on a new pcp , only went in for a service ,
For most makes and models, motor cars are depreciating assets, and not investments. Even the likes of Ferraris cost a lot in maintenance.
Its interesting to me personally as im looking at F-Type's atm, post 2018 facelift V6 low mieage examples are already dropping into the high to mid 30k, il hold on a while longer 😮
Same! They are quite the bargain
Sold my GT3 and GT4 with a profit, bought my latest Porsche new with a 15 percent discount. I win again.
Car prices have been crazy the last few years. I had an m2 comp for 12 months at the beginning of covid. I ended up selling it, I added 10k miles, kept it 12 months, then sold it on at a profit of 12k. Mad. I had to sell it at that price. I've been driving my wife's hyundai i30n for the last couple of years, waiting for prices to go back to normal again. It's finally starting now, and I am finally looking to buy myself something nice again.
Oh wow!
Great news,I would rather see normal cars,either new or a few years old than all the high end and electric cars you have been reviewing recently.
If you're going for the Spyder - drive the 718 and the 981 back to back. I'm pretty sure you'll choose the older car... 😉
No I wouldn’t 😜
@@PetrolPed Having owned a brand new 981 for 5 years and driven the 718 it would be very interesting (and funny) to hear a single reason for the 718 - except using it as a track tool. 🤗
And that is why you need to worry about loosing money on your car trades. Every one knows that 981s hold their value much better than the 718, bare the GT4.
'You can't go far wrong in my view buying a Tesla model Y for thirty five grand'.
None of us has a crystal ball but I'd happily put a fiver on it that by the middle of the year you would look back and reflect that you were optimistic.
Just my view. We'll see. But, do enjoy your videos, knowledge and opinions hugely.
Thanks for another great episode.
My pleasure 👍
Not sure why you’re so excited over price changes, some will be demo cars with rising mileage, and the rest were just over inflated to start. I mean a 3 year old Boxter only losing 6-10k, sounds very good tbh, I think a £62k car should be £45-50 tops.
This is really going to hit those that change their cars mid term.
This crash was called two years ago, many short investors called it ages ago.
When you look at what your car is worth you have to reduce the Auto Trader garage retail price by 10-15% if PX or 5-10% if you are selling privately. The gap to that next car is always much higher because of this.
It’s the intrest rate that has killed the 50k plus cars.😮
Interesting market. I popped into a VW dealer before Christmas as they had a two year old Up GTi, £2k over original list on the forecourt. I was hassled by a salesman trying to sell me a pre registered ID3 for almost half price!
Some bargains out there. EVs are pretty toxic. I'd buy a late ICE you could keep and maintain. Jags, Merc SLs. Avoid anything with a big battery.
The Porsche Taycan has dropped massively, it would be interesting to see what other electric cars have dropped so much
This morning on my Facebook feed I had two adverts appeared for 28 pre-reg less than 20 miles on the odo, 73 plate EQC AMG Line all on offer at less than £44000 and over 100 Ford Mustang Mach E GT’ at £43000 similar miles, 73 plate pre-regs. The EQC’s were all for sale at Scottish branches of Mercedes main dealers owned by Arnold Clark Group. Ford the elf were advertising the Mach E GT’s
@@timoliver8940 How much below list is that? I'm not in the market, but I tried an EQC when they first came out and I was and thought it was a very nice car. At the time, I think they cost around £60K.
For so long people lived off close to 0% intrest rates be that mortgage car purchase etc. Now that highter intrest rates had time to keep affecting more and more people each month some re adjustments have been forced. Great time have cash . Better saving rate. More purchase power.
I couldn’t care less what my 81 Boxster S is worth. I bought to drive it and keep it. It’s my daily driver and when it’s paid off next year I will be getting a 981 GT4. Here in the States the new and used markets are cratering and will continue as the economic recession continues to slide.
Spyder all day long! LOVE mine. Shout if you want a drive!
It is all very bewildering and clearly supply and demand operating as defined by Adam Smith back in 1776 !!! I am immune with a 987 Boxster 2005 that has been worth £7k for the last 9 years 😂😂😂 and it is a great everyday driver with that gorgeous 6 lurking away behind you. 😊😊
Lmao I'm also immune with my 986 Boxster but unfortunately heavily diseased with my 992 GTS.
I really enjoyed this video, thank you. Also I didn't realise this price tracker existed - very handy!
Great news if your not px but like most cases when buying a car and trading one in is the price to change cost. And that is what you have to negotiate with your car dealer.
Great video Ped. but had to laugh because in the start of the video you talked about affordable cars and £50k is a lot of money to pay, which it is and then migrated onto cars costing well in excess of £140k. Love it
Just dreaming 😂
sounds like the times are suggesting hanging onto that 718 Boxster GTS for a while longer.
The grey M2 at Targa Florio belonged to one of my Petrolhead Tours mates.....he chopped it in against a 992 2S cab...
Hold tight. With this Houthi issue in the Red Sea ships having to take the long route. This will increase costs and delay deliveries. Could possibly increase prices.
Lots of price drops across the board and the important thing here is, they still haven’t sold. There is further to go here, I feel.
Agreed 💯
Looking at the price of the M2 and the last versions that came out they’re still more money to drop out of them. If you ask me. I would definitely have to a 992 GT3 for me. What a car.👍
To be fair I'd imagine that very few brand new cars are sold outright these days and at least half are company cars. My company car would have cost 52K outright but it costs me virtually nothing in BIK as it's an EV. I'd have never have been able to afford to buy one outright myself. So keep the reviews of new cars coming!
Great point!
My wife bought her first car right after the first lockdown in July 2020 when cars were still depreciating like rocks and the covid effect had not kicked in. BMW 1 series 118i SE for £14,599 from Available Car (with service pack included). 20 months old and 20k miles. We sold it to Motorway in August 2023 for £14k. £599 loss in 3 years is just madness. The same age, mileage and spec 1 series is now around £10k more. This is all one big correction that has been way overdue. She now has a GR86 which was an absolute steal at £30k compared to so many other new cars these days.
Hi peter
Great information as always 👏
My neighbour is a car trader for last 35 plus years
And he’s told me if you buy a used car now for say 100k,
The price will drop by 15/20% by Dec 2024
He made a cash offer on Porsche for sale in nov 2023 at a Porsche dealership
Asking price was 110k,
He offered 100k
Offer rejected
He got a call yday from the salesman and they offered it to him for 100k
It's a normal price correction after the COVID mark up and inflation. Cars are still generally extremely expensive for their real value.
Hello mate, I think the whole market has gone loopy. Prices have never returned to normality really since the ‘Covid’ reasoning. Some items have climbed and stayed, some have climbed and subsided a little. Strange times.
I think it's worth noting that many of the examples quoted still haven't sold after 5 months on the market. That means the asking price reductions haven't been large enough, so the market is dictating they are actually worth less still. I'm not a car enthusiast any more, but I find these videos interesting from time to time. 3 growing kids forced me to re-evaluate my priorities. In my view, nice car ownership has to be the most expensive hobby out there. As most cars fulfill their purpose, spending tens of thousands more for something you simply prefer is the reserve of only the very wealthy or the foolhardy these days. Covid bucked the market for a short period, helping some to convince themselves cars had become an asset, but sadly for most of us, great cars will never make financial sense.
Interesting I have been doing the same. As yours my car has deprecated and I need to wait a little time.
GT3 GT4s and Spyders look appealing.
Thanks I learnt about the price plug and that’s very useful.
You can filter Cat S etc at the bottom of Autotrader.
You knew they were overpriced. Why are so many people totally unaware of the effect of geopolitics on car prices.
Really enjoy your content. If I can offer a suggestion. If there's any way you can get data on what these vehicles are actually changing hands for over time, then you've got a much stronger and precise case for depreciation. Asking price just doesn't mean terribly much. Keep up the great work!
The app is great, I've been using it for awhile now. However, crafty dealers are already getting round the app simply by removing cars, then re-advertising them. I have seen this several times, so buyers need to be aware. Either way, prices are plunging, and some by considerably more than the app shows, especially some showing bizarre minor rises, these were often hugely cheaper just a few months ago. Porsche as a brand are the hard hit imo, possibly because of the fantasy prices of the last 12 months.
I paid £44k for my 981 Cayman S 2 years ago. Models with similar spec and mileage are now selling at £24k!
😢😢😢😢😢😢😢
I would never buy an electric car, i would rather lease if I have to go for electric. The bigger issue is with insurance for them with some companies refusing to insure the Model Y, I heard a spokesperson from an insurance company on the radio talking about a 'very reasonable' £200 per month, what! per month? Are you nuts, no thanks.
These are the cars that haven’t sold. I have been offered a GTS 2021 with 9k and decent spec by a Porsche specialist for £48k who can’t get rid of his stock. I have countered with £43k and have landed on £45K PLUS next 2 services with no labour cost.
I think there is more to go!
Would be interested to do similar with older classics, ie 911 3.2 or Merc 190 or Jag X350 … looking at auctions prices seem to be holding up as people dump complexity for older analogue …?