Pressure on the blade face and getting purchase to roll is so subtle. It’s there, no denying. It’s a process that intermediate boaters appreciate. Thank you for an awesome video!
I've been stuck in my head after an easy failed roll in July. I really needed to hear "Take it easy on yourself". Great advice. I had an instructor who taught me to practice not rolling up until your third sweep...to not engage the hip snap on the first two but just "open the book" enough to get a breath. Some people don't get it, but it helps me remember that I need to calm down...get a breath, know I have more time than I think, and have the mental clarity to remember the basics. Excellent video as always.
@@CleanLineKayaking - I think the point of the exercise is best summed up by you from 12:00 to 12:15 and 15:18 to 15:29 in "Teaching the Roll". I'm laughing at myself because when I first started, people would tell me I was trying to roll before I had even flipped over, lol.
Comforting to hear that someone had a similar experience. Missed a roll and second attempt and wet exited in a bit of a panic. Did a great remedial session but I've developed a fear of getting back on the river. Also stuck in my head.
@@Farenheit451NY - my advice would be to join a local or out-of-state club and attend a whitewater school on a river that matches and pushes you beyond your current skill level. While there is always a risk, you'll be in a somewhat "controlled" environment. Don't worry about swimming. Go for it!
Great tips! I’ll add a few more: 1. In the pool or where ever practicing, instead tossing someone around, do bracing drills. Stand behind them and try to flip them randomly to one side or the other. After a few random braces, flip them too hard to brace so they have to roll up unexpectedly. This accomplishes 2 things - it teaches someone how to have a reflexive and rock solid brace, and it teaches them how to roll when flipping unexpectedly. To randomize L/R, have them always do a half or full roll so they are rolling on both sides. This is how I taught my daughter to have a solid brace and bomb proof roll on both sides. 2. The usual cause of roll failure is head lift or leading with the head. It’s nearly impossible to roll with a fully committed head lift because you are pulling on the wrong knee to lift your head. When you see someone rolling up barely and doing that. Do not congratulate them on their sloppy roll. I see that way to often, the “any roll is good” BS. Nip that in the bud and save them many future swims. To end that once and for all, encourage to always look at the rolling blade regardless if they can see it. If the head is turned towards the rolling blade, they won’t lead with it. 3. Once you learn to roll, don’t practice in the setup position, ever. You never flip on the river set up. Practice setting up with every roll. 4. Acclimate to the water so you don’t freak out when you flip on cold days. Do practice rolls at the beginning of the run and a few spots down the run regardless of conditions. You will have a much better chance of nailing a roll if you do that.
This is good advice. The frustration for me was trying these things, and still failing at times and not knowing why. Although the bracing drill is something I could try that perhaps I haven’t. Thanks
Thanks Boyd for the good advice. I’m competent grade 3 but my roll was always 50/50 in it, and affected my confidence in that regard. I’ve not kayaked over a year, but itching to get back to it now, and work on my roll in the rapids
The weird thing for me is I am better at moving water rolling than in still water, I’m trying to bomb proof my C to C roll then move on to back deck roll and then hand rolling. I learned exactly what you said, wait in the setup position a little longer before rolling and it made the difference.
@@colestjohn3348 I’ve gone back and forth on brands but use surf ears for surfing and docs pro plugs for paddling. The reason is helmet fit. Both are vented with a leash. I don’t actually attach either to anything for kayaking because they tend to get tangled with my helmet straps if one falls out.
the backdeck roll is really best for that… video dropping, hopefully later today, with video included of me grinding down shallow rocks upside, on purpose, just to demonstrate it. Otherwise, just rolling as quickly and efficiently as you can is best. If it’s real shallow, your body will drag, you’ll end up on the upstream side of your boat, and you can roll on the upstream side from there. All of this stresses the need to learn to roll on both sides and to learn how to backdeck roll eventually. 🤙🏻
Should we be taking a breath between roll attempts in the event we have a couple failed rolls? It's not that easy to take a breath, but with a tight PFD, upside down underwater and under stress, I'm only able to make a few attempts before needing air.
good question... a complex one too. Generally, I say no because if you take a breath, it's a forfeit attempt. If you're up high enough to get a breath, then you've lifted your head... meaning you've tensed up, used too much arm, etc. That said, in rare circumstances, I've been known to do a "false roll" where I don't actually plan to roll at all, just grabbing a breath for a reset and a quick glance to orient myself before drifting into something that would flip me again anyway...much better than swimming because you're out of breath. The problem is, most of the time, if you just relax and focus on one good attempt, you'd be upright and not having to worry about whether or not you should take a breath. Make sense? The average person can hold their breath 30s without training and 2-3 min with breath-hold training... so most of the time, you're better off training yourself to relax. The moment you feel that tense, twitchy feeling that you need to breath and can't hold your breath any longer, you are only 1/3 of the way through your breath hold. If you tell yourself to relax, you can triple it in that moment.
Pressure on the blade face and getting purchase to roll is so subtle.
It’s there, no denying. It’s a process that intermediate boaters appreciate. Thank you for an awesome video!
I've been stuck in my head after an easy failed roll in July. I really needed to hear "Take it easy on yourself". Great advice. I had an instructor who taught me to practice not rolling up until your third sweep...to not engage the hip snap on the first two but just "open the book" enough to get a breath. Some people don't get it, but it helps me remember that I need to calm down...get a breath, know I have more time than I think, and have the mental clarity to remember the basics. Excellent video as always.
Gotta keep kayaking fun. Too many people/instructors put on too much pressure. Thanks for watching! 🤙🏻
@@CleanLineKayaking - I think the point of the exercise is best summed up by you from 12:00 to 12:15 and 15:18 to 15:29 in "Teaching the Roll". I'm laughing at myself because when I first started, people would tell me I was trying to roll before I had even flipped over, lol.
@@shawhi1 I've got photos of me getting air set up to roll because I'm flipping anyway so why not!?
Comforting to hear that someone had a similar experience. Missed a roll and second attempt and wet exited in a bit of a panic. Did a great remedial session but I've developed a fear of getting back on the river. Also stuck in my head.
@@Farenheit451NY - my advice would be to join a local or out-of-state club and attend a whitewater school on a river that matches and pushes you beyond your current skill level. While there is always a risk, you'll be in a somewhat "controlled" environment. Don't worry about swimming. Go for it!
So many good nuggets in here. As an intermediate paddler this is really good!!!
Great tips! I’ll add a few more:
1. In the pool or where ever practicing, instead tossing someone around, do bracing drills. Stand behind them and try to flip them randomly to one side or the other. After a few random braces, flip them too hard to brace so they have to roll up unexpectedly. This accomplishes 2 things - it teaches someone how to have a reflexive and rock solid brace, and it teaches them how to roll when flipping unexpectedly. To randomize L/R, have them always do a half or full roll so they are rolling on both sides. This is how I taught my daughter to have a solid brace and bomb proof roll on both sides.
2. The usual cause of roll failure is head lift or leading with the head. It’s nearly impossible to roll with a fully committed head lift because you are pulling on the wrong knee to lift your head. When you see someone rolling up barely and doing that. Do not congratulate them on their sloppy roll. I see that way to often, the “any roll is good” BS. Nip that in the bud and save them many future swims. To end that once and for all, encourage to always look at the rolling blade regardless if they can see it. If the head is turned towards the rolling blade, they won’t lead with it.
3. Once you learn to roll, don’t practice in the setup position, ever. You never flip on the river set up. Practice setting up with every roll.
4. Acclimate to the water so you don’t freak out when you flip on cold days. Do practice rolls at the beginning of the run and a few spots down the run regardless of conditions. You will have a much better chance of nailing a roll if you do that.
This is good advice. The frustration for me was trying these things, and still failing at times and not knowing why. Although the bracing drill is something I could try that perhaps I haven’t. Thanks
Thanks Boyd for the good advice. I’m competent grade 3 but my roll was always 50/50 in it, and affected my confidence in that regard. I’ve not kayaked over a year, but itching to get back to it now, and work on my roll in the rapids
The other thing I learned about keeping the head down in my class, was that it prevented me from “over rolling” and flipping back over to other side.
The weird thing for me is I am better at moving water rolling than in still water, I’m trying to bomb proof my C to C roll then move on to back deck roll and then hand rolling. I learned exactly what you said, wait in the setup position a little longer before rolling and it made the difference.
hand rolling and back deck videos about to drop… finally. 🤙🏻
There's at least 2 of us then. People look at you like you're mad when you confess to being happier rolling in WW than a pool!
I have a bombproof roll until it is not! :)
Great information! Learning a lot thanks so much keep it up!
stoked! Thanks for watching! 🤙🏻
This is exactly where I got stuck in progress. I am looking for a training partner
yes! 🤙🏻
Boyd, Nice one! If I may ask, how do you secure your earplugs? To your helmet? And which are these?
@@colestjohn3348 I’ve gone back and forth on brands but use surf ears for surfing and docs pro plugs for paddling. The reason is helmet fit. Both are vented with a leash. I don’t actually attach either to anything for kayaking because they tend to get tangled with my helmet straps if one falls out.
Any advice for shallow water, when you're getting bounced off rocks or don't have the depth to get forward to a setup position? Thanks
the backdeck roll is really best for that… video dropping, hopefully later today, with video included of me grinding down shallow rocks upside, on purpose, just to demonstrate it.
Otherwise, just rolling as quickly and efficiently as you can is best. If it’s real shallow, your body will drag, you’ll end up on the upstream side of your boat, and you can roll on the upstream side from there.
All of this stresses the need to learn to roll on both sides and to learn how to backdeck roll eventually. 🤙🏻
Should we be taking a breath between roll attempts in the event we have a couple failed rolls? It's not that easy to take a breath, but with a tight PFD, upside down underwater and under stress, I'm only able to make a few attempts before needing air.
good question... a complex one too. Generally, I say no because if you take a breath, it's a forfeit attempt. If you're up high enough to get a breath, then you've lifted your head... meaning you've tensed up, used too much arm, etc.
That said, in rare circumstances, I've been known to do a "false roll" where I don't actually plan to roll at all, just grabbing a breath for a reset and a quick glance to orient myself before drifting into something that would flip me again anyway...much better than swimming because you're out of breath.
The problem is, most of the time, if you just relax and focus on one good attempt, you'd be upright and not having to worry about whether or not you should take a breath. Make sense? The average person can hold their breath 30s without training and 2-3 min with breath-hold training... so most of the time, you're better off training yourself to relax.
The moment you feel that tense, twitchy feeling that you need to breath and can't hold your breath any longer, you are only 1/3 of the way through your breath hold. If you tell yourself to relax, you can triple it in that moment.
I think you might need a safe word for when the partner keeps flips you intentionally.
"Aaaaahhhh!!!". No... this won't work. "Ummm!!!" is better.