I´ve just tried this and it works like a charm! Thank you for finding this! A couple things I would like to add which made things even easier for me: 1. You can move your firemage into the castle for range, if the AI is further back. 2. Try to waste enemy ammo by standing behind the rocks to the right of the gate with the mage. They will take almost no damage from the mortars. 3. Since you have them, make use of the archers. After the mortars are out of ammo you can place them close to the wall (but out of range of the turrets) so when the AI starts moving units again you can have some free target practice. 4. Bring in the dragon too with Imrik and the cav. You usually wont need it, but its nice to have some backup. Thank you again and have fun killing rats everyone!
i used to send a 5/10 units inside as bait and use Imrik and the princes to enter through a different gate rush to the victory point and capture. use the dragon and mage to kill blobs in the meanntime. never failed me
@@gregogresky4286 Currently turn 68, 106 settlements, Ulthuan united and the only thing missing for long vicrory is hunting down Skarbrand. Yeah, not that far into a campaign at all :P Lemme restart real quick just to have Nagashizzar on turn 8 instead of 64 ;)
Thanks for the video, that was really nice. When I tried it, the Skaven refused to form a blob, so I just used archers and the mage to burn a hole into their ranks, kill the monsters, until I could rush with Imrik, the dragon princes and the dragon to the main point and defend it until win.
@One Pitch Man great Video, I have to try this out. Thanks for sharing! Edit: Tried it, it works! Very fun. I'm going to try this strat on stream tonight, I'll link this vid, hopefully funnel a few people your way.
Succeeded on the first try, had to change some things up once I was inside the walls with Imrik and the cav as the AI had about 3-4 units still moving around back there. But worked out!
I kiiiiiind of found a way to do this on 3.1, while playing on Normal. The problem is that it requires the Greater Invocation of Vaul, so you have to be at turn 10 in order to effectively carry it out. I'm not sure if that's too late for it to be considered a rush, in addition to the difficulty having been a bit lower on my end. Either way, I would be happy to share if you'd like to hear it. Even if it's just so you can get some ideas for another way to approach it
I dont mind waiting till i get 2 stalk units. Wait for them to be far away or near the walls, have tge 2 stalk units run on the west side and capture both victory point generating points at the same time. By the time enemies reach the points it is already a victory. Granted you need 2 stalk units which is the hard part.
My Zhatan campaign was on a steamroll until I encountered endgame Imrik, who had 30% fire resistance on his army, and phoenix' and dragon princes that were practically invincible to all fire damage. Since all high tier Chorf troops do fire damage, Imrik really is a hard counter to them
Yeah you need to deal with him very early. He becomes a real threat late game. He is actually the first i'm wiping out, not counting your starting enemy.
Force him to land and let your blunderbusses do the work. They have a ridiculously high dps against SEMs and they don't do fire damage. Unless you went for a monster meme army or put in more fire glaives than necessary you should be able to win without much trouble.
@@pureityXXX Oh you're right! I thought blunderbusses did fire damage as well but they don't! Well next army I send his way will have them included. This army had 4 fire glaives so yeah, they were ineffective. I'll also bring some of those bull centaur heroes to gang up on him.
I usually go and kill Drazh and Tretch. Ghorst generally takes a while to start bothering you as well as Kugath. They're busy fighting each other. Tretch specifically can be a big issue as he can quickly snowball if you don't smack him quick.
Is it possible to just put the reinforcements inside the city and run them into the victory point and wait out the countdown? I just did that with the grimgor strat.
NIcely done, getting a dragon doomstack this early will be so fking OP. Although what's the reason you recruited so many archers? I thought that control large army only required 2 armies and the amount of units doesnt matter or is that a WH2 thing?
I heard 21 units in a recent guide for taking the Chaos Dwarf T5 settlement as well and I have actually experienced a few times where untoggling control large armies wasn't available in the very early game when I had fewer than 20 units and a supporting lord for you know what we did in WH2.
It is just zharr naggrund and nagashizzar atm. The black pyramid starts at tier 3 atm but would mabe make sense for ca to change it in the future? These videos may scare them out of that though 😅
@@onepitchman6910 After trying this strat and failing for loads of reasons, THANK YOU I finally did it! Also, I would add that you should save enough money to do a Greater Invocation of Vaul for extra dps :)
@boon Yea same basically. In fairness I don't think it would take too many more turns to capture it so suppose its still a good start position if you focus on taking it
I did this strat but cheated a bit , no archers, instead destroyed the barracks and build the eagle building and recruit a few of those.Easily killed the sigle entities that rushed to recap the point when focusing them down with the dragon, Imrik and eagles, the other infantry can also be held easy with those.
imagine they would make a warhammer game like this BUT you can actually play in first person in battles ... I think I would only play this until my eyes fall out
I have found out about this..in my Drazoath campaign. I didn't want to cheese raiding it, I just wanted to smash the rats. Right far side is where I usually start as well. But I separate my units = less damage taken. It's a bit of a dance to let them burn through all the summons. But man..I was so surprised. AI sallied out during battle map siege..first time ever for me. They formed first blob inside a gate, but next one was created outside walls and since I had control large armies - they all chased me into my lines of waiting hobbos and dwarfs.. Draz ended up with like +2000 kills and 180 000 damage done. Courtesy of lore of Hashut
Cant you just use the Grimgore Turn 2 streategy to have the Reinforcing at the plaza? So imrik starts at the gate bash it down and then Reinforcing army comes behinde in city and taking the plaza.
One tactic I use as high elves is misdirection strat. Place most of your army on one side of the settlement with faster units closer to the other side but not near it. The aim is the get the ai to position it's forces at the other gate so you can run around and use invocation of vaul the break through quickly near the undefended side. Admittedly this worked better in wh2 before settlement towers but it still functions much the same. Invocation of vaul can also destroy wall towers which can create blind spots which is great for archer heavy armies.
Imrik has a unique version of the invocation of vaul rite. It gives extra stat boosts to dragons and dragon princes while also giving 3 extra dragon breaths to all dragons.
Unfortunately this can be a bit luck based here. If they come one at a time, Imrik (and your dragon if healthy enough) can try to kill the ogres. Best not to fight with the princes before you're on defense as the ai will use their unit bomb on the ogres. Don't commit too hard to trying to kill them, if they route leave them alone and keep capping asap.
You will have to start casting burning head from a distance. Going inside with the mage will trigger chasing so unless you want to try luring the blob forward stand outside and cast towards the blob. You should still be able to get a fair amount of damage using up all winds but not as much.
If the goal is to get them all to bug out and blob so that you can kill them with aoe, wouldn’t it be better to leave control large armies ticked? Then their entire force would blob at the same time and you can kill them easier.
The problem with having them all there is about predictability. Yes you can make a bigger blob but the ai acts WAY more erratically. Also it is possible to get army losses with the strat but you need to get very lucky. The control large army button makes it easier to cut down the numbers and reliably win with capture point.
@@onepitchman6910 Skavens would only get some money from cheesing a Nagashizzar battle since they need food to settle cities at high levels. You can already get Skavenblight tier 4 by turn 5 with Ikkit Claw though.
When I recorded the video I did it first try. HOWEVER, I failed many times when testing to find the most consistent strategy. I can do this consistently now but there was a fair bit of practice needed. If you follow the battle strat as closely as possible you can definitely get it down!
Would be a great strat, if it worked more easily. I wasted 3.5 hours attempting it twice and failing both times🤦🏼♂️. Great idea on paper, not so easy in practice.
At least 21 units are needed to get the option to "control large armies" stopping the ai having more than 20 units on the field at a time. The archers are the cheapest unit to spam for that. If you fight all 40 units in the settlement at the same time, the battle is still doable but the ai becomes hillariously janky and unpredictable.
Lol CA game design is so bad, thanks for showcasing it XD no large army / lighting strike is a joke, add the sieges and how bad the defenses are (no oil, no need for equipement, towers with narrow vision) and its an easy win.
UA-cam compresses audio when you upload making it quieter. I found this out shortly after releasing the video... Apologies and it will be something I fix for the next one!
@@CJ-wh7ik i blame the player, but indirectly the game. I don't care if nobody like siege or not or if you like them. The cheese is reel her and i'm sad to see such a incompetent Ai and i'm sad to see such people abusing that. This is as much interesting that watch someone play a game with tcheat on or watch someone beat a child in a game, or maybe not. A child would probably control ai army better in a siege than the ai, so it would be more interesting to watch.
They changed the AI in patch 3.1 If you want to cheese the battle now you have to use all the catapults' and mortars' ammo on your dragon, fly left to right until they're out of ammo. You should be able to move your archers up after that but I doubt you'll have enough ammo and winds of magic to go through all these rats and cause army losses
Single player game, dude. Do what you want. I tend not to cheese... usually... but sometimes in sieges, because they're just no fun and I want them over with.
I´ve just tried this and it works like a charm! Thank you for finding this!
A couple things I would like to add which made things even easier for me:
1. You can move your firemage into the castle for range, if the AI is further back.
2. Try to waste enemy ammo by standing behind the rocks to the right of the gate with the mage. They will take almost no damage from the mortars.
3. Since you have them, make use of the archers. After the mortars are out of ammo you can place them close to the wall (but out of range of the turrets) so when the AI starts moving units again you can have some free target practice.
4. Bring in the dragon too with Imrik and the cav. You usually wont need it, but its nice to have some backup.
Thank you again and have fun killing rats everyone!
Production quality in these videos is awesome, very well done
i used to send a 5/10 units inside as bait and use Imrik and the princes to enter through a different gate rush to the victory point and capture. use the dragon and mage to kill blobs in the meanntime. never failed me
That's a neat strategy! It's a shame I'm already past turn 60 in my Imrik campaign.
restart?
@@johnpaul252003 After 60 turns? Yeah, sure :P
60 turns isnt even that far in a campaign
@@gregogresky4286 Currently turn 68, 106 settlements, Ulthuan united and the only thing missing for long vicrory is hunting down Skarbrand. Yeah, not that far into a campaign at all :P Lemme restart real quick just to have Nagashizzar on turn 8 instead of 64 ;)
@@SereglothIV That's all?
Restart time!
Thank you for this. I had a fun time taking the chaos dwarfs tower, now I will try my hand at this
really fantastic guide, I cant wait to try this after work tomorrow
This is a really great guide. I appreciate you making this video.
Thanks for the video, that was really nice. When I tried it, the Skaven refused to form a blob, so I just used archers and the mage to burn a hole into their ranks, kill the monsters, until I could rush with Imrik, the dragon princes and the dragon to the main point and defend it until win.
@One Pitch Man great Video, I have to try this out. Thanks for sharing!
Edit: Tried it, it works! Very fun. I'm going to try this strat on stream tonight, I'll link this vid, hopefully funnel a few people your way.
Great video dude!! love the format! More of these!!
Succeeded on the first try, had to change some things up once I was inside the walls with Imrik and the cav as the AI had about 3-4 units still moving around back there. But worked out!
I've never played a really solid Imrik campaign and haven't tried him in WH3 yet so this is a cool trick to know
As someone who enjoys a great start in my campaigns i appluad you mate great work new sub
Imrik: "Look at me! I am Nagash now."
30 turns later: giga chad grimgor meet giga chad imrik near the dark fortress 😂😂😂
I kiiiiiind of found a way to do this on 3.1, while playing on Normal. The problem is that it requires the Greater Invocation of Vaul, so you have to be at turn 10 in order to effectively carry it out. I'm not sure if that's too late for it to be considered a rush, in addition to the difficulty having been a bit lower on my end.
Either way, I would be happy to share if you'd like to hear it. Even if it's just so you can get some ideas for another way to approach it
How did you do it ? I would like to hear it eheh
Awsome job man this is amazing!
Great stuff...thanks my man...
I dont mind waiting till i get 2 stalk units. Wait for them to be far away or near the walls, have tge 2 stalk units run on the west side and capture both victory point generating points at the same time. By the time enemies reach the points it is already a victory. Granted you need 2 stalk units which is the hard part.
What are the stalk units?
Cheesey Imrik
My Zhatan campaign was on a steamroll until I encountered endgame Imrik, who had 30% fire resistance on his army, and phoenix' and dragon princes that were practically invincible to all fire damage. Since all high tier Chorf troops do fire damage, Imrik really is a hard counter to them
Yeah you need to deal with him very early. He becomes a real threat late game. He is actually the first i'm wiping out, not counting your starting enemy.
@@AleXxTM123 Zhatan starts north of the great bastion so that's impossible to do early game
Force him to land and let your blunderbusses do the work. They have a ridiculously high dps against SEMs and they don't do fire damage. Unless you went for a monster meme army or put in more fire glaives than necessary you should be able to win without much trouble.
@@pureityXXX Oh you're right! I thought blunderbusses did fire damage as well but they don't! Well next army I send his way will have them included. This army had 4 fire glaives so yeah, they were ineffective. I'll also bring some of those bull centaur heroes to gang up on him.
@@Tuck213 I'm sorry, still getting my Chaos Dawi mixed up :D
This doesn’t work anymore. Now the enemy catapult systematically gets in range of the infantry
awesome video, trying this out now c:
I did this before I saw this video & got army losses when the princes were standing on the final objective. Little later, maybe t10.
Great vid, keep it up
What would you recommend after this? Going West to kill off Queek or putting that off and pushing east to kill Ghorst and nurgle like normal runs?
I usually go and kill Drazh and Tretch. Ghorst generally takes a while to start bothering you as well as Kugath. They're busy fighting each other. Tretch specifically can be a big issue as he can quickly snowball if you don't smack him quick.
Is it possible to just put the reinforcements inside the city and run them into the victory point and wait out the countdown? I just did that with the grimgor strat.
The reinforce inside the city bug is exclusive to chaos dwarf cities. CA just mucked that up when making the new maps.
@@onepitchman6910 Ah gotcha, thanks!
NIcely done, getting a dragon doomstack this early will be so fking OP. Although what's the reason you recruited so many archers? I thought that control large army only required 2 armies and the amount of units doesnt matter or is that a WH2 thing?
I heard 21 units in a recent guide for taking the Chaos Dwarf T5 settlement as well and I have actually experienced a few times where untoggling control large armies wasn't available in the very early game when I had fewer than 20 units and a supporting lord for you know what we did in WH2.
Control large armies requires more than 20 units under player control to be toggled.
Super cool demonstration man! Do you know which other settlements start at level 5?
It is just zharr naggrund and nagashizzar atm.
The black pyramid starts at tier 3 atm but would mabe make sense for ca to change it in the future? These videos may scare them out of that though 😅
@@onepitchman6910 After trying this strat and failing for loads of reasons, THANK YOU I finally did it! Also, I would add that you should save enough money to do a Greater Invocation of Vaul for extra dps :)
Skavenblight? Can't remember if it does it not.
does the making ai blob strat work with all skaven settlement with this layout?
I think so. AI really don't like the layout.
@@onepitchman6910 i will try this next time i find a skaven settlement
It seems to work for a lot of layouts really. I've came across a lot of insane blobs patch 3.0... they really messed the AI up
Mine were all lining up along the edges of the paths for some reason.
It works pretty much with almost all weird layout settlements. CA never bothered to fix the AI
I've done this before however tried today after the latest patch and can't seem to get it to work now? Hoping it's just me 😢
Just spend 4hrs and multiple tries to capture the skaven settlement. In the end, still failed😢
@boon Yea same basically. In fairness I don't think it would take too many more turns to capture it so suppose its still a good start position if you focus on taking it
Are the dragon battles bugged for anyone else?,
I can’t get the AI to bunch up! They camp spread out inside near the gate
That is some epic cheese. Nice shit!!
How do you deal with the large units? Non of them sustained much damage from the fire and they just steamroll the princes and Imrik.
I did this strat but cheated a bit , no archers, instead destroyed the barracks and build the eagle building and recruit a few of those.Easily killed the sigle entities that rushed to recap the point when focusing them down with the dragon, Imrik and eagles, the other infantry can also be held easy with those.
imagine they would make a warhammer game like this BUT you can actually play in first person in battles ... I think I would only play this until my eyes fall out
You mean like mount and blade?
I have found out about this..in my Drazoath campaign. I didn't want to cheese raiding it, I just wanted to smash the rats. Right far side is where I usually start as well. But I separate my units = less damage taken. It's a bit of a dance to let them burn through all the summons. But man..I was so surprised. AI sallied out during battle map siege..first time ever for me. They formed first blob inside a gate, but next one was created outside walls and since I had control large armies - they all chased me into my lines of waiting hobbos and dwarfs.. Draz ended up with like +2000 kills and 180 000 damage done. Courtesy of lore of Hashut
Cant you just use the Grimgore Turn 2 streategy to have the Reinforcing at the plaza? So imrik starts at the gate bash it down and then Reinforcing army comes behinde in city and taking the plaza.
That bug is exclusive to chaos dwarf settlements because CA mucked up the reinforce zones when making those maps.
@@onepitchman6910 I'm pretty sure i have done that with Scarbrand.
I can't seem to get them to blob anymore. Did they fix it in the last update, or am I just doing it wrong?
Unfortunately it has been patched in 3.1, I am trying to get a new consistent strategy working but nothing that hasn't felt luck based so far.
One tactic I use as high elves is misdirection strat. Place most of your army on one side of the settlement with faster units closer to the other side but not near it. The aim is the get the ai to position it's forces at the other gate so you can run around and use invocation of vaul the break through quickly near the undefended side. Admittedly this worked better in wh2 before settlement towers but it still functions much the same. Invocation of vaul can also destroy wall towers which can create blind spots which is great for archer heavy armies.
you can move the reinformcent point? Since when?
It was added when wh3 released. Really nice feature!
How does your dragon have 6 breath attacks?
Imrik has a unique version of the invocation of vaul rite. It gives extra stat boosts to dragons and dragon princes while also giving 3 extra dragon breaths to all dragons.
For some reason the rat ogres keep moving and chasing me down when i get to victory location
Unfortunately this can be a bit luck based here. If they come one at a time, Imrik (and your dragon if healthy enough) can try to kill the ogres. Best not to fight with the princes before you're on defense as the ai will use their unit bomb on the ogres. Don't commit too hard to trying to kill them, if they route leave them alone and keep capping asap.
I had no idea you could move reinforcement points and I’ve been playing since twwh 1!
I found out because I'm curious af and I must touch everything in games.
You can only do it in TWWH 3.
what do i do if blob doesnt move up?
You will have to start casting burning head from a distance. Going inside with the mage will trigger chasing so unless you want to try luring the blob forward stand outside and cast towards the blob.
You should still be able to get a fair amount of damage using up all winds but not as much.
So why have you recruited all these archers, when you don't actually use them in battle?🤔
If the goal is to get them all to bug out and blob so that you can kill them with aoe, wouldn’t it be better to leave control large armies ticked? Then their entire force would blob at the same time and you can kill them easier.
The problem with having them all there is about predictability. Yes you can make a bigger blob but the ai acts WAY more erratically. Also it is possible to get army losses with the strat but you need to get very lucky. The control large army button makes it easier to cut down the numbers and reliably win with capture point.
@@onepitchman6910 fair enough. Good guide!
That's a good strategy! But the only downside is playing as the knife ears. Can Anyone else exploit this early on?
The next closest faction is queek. There is no other factions between him and nagashizzar. I have yet to test a strat though.
@@onepitchman6910 Skavens would only get some money from cheesing a Nagashizzar battle since they need food to settle cities at high levels.
You can already get Skavenblight tier 4 by turn 5 with Ikkit Claw though.
Sad face this no longer works :(
Tyrion chese confederations ?
you video is really quiet buddy
It's NaggaCHEESE-HARD ! 🤣
Did you manage at first try? I tried several times and Imrik can't stand this position long enough
When I recorded the video I did it first try. HOWEVER, I failed many times when testing to find the most consistent strategy. I can do this consistently now but there was a fair bit of practice needed. If you follow the battle strat as closely as possible you can definitely get it down!
@@onepitchman6910 You're right, the second try after I wrote the comment was a success ahah, thank you!
The volume is really low on your video, I literally need to raise the volume to maximum to hear lol
UA-cam has nuked the audio after uploading it it seems, I can't fix it without a reupload 😩
@@onepitchman6910 it's alright dude, you'll figure it out in the future :)
this has been fixed sadly
😢
Looks like you got lucky. That dragon was so low for so long and somehow didn't die
This is insane😅
Very tasty cheese.
These sentinel cheesing strats are silly
Audio is a bit low buddy
Would be a great strat, if it worked more easily. I wasted 3.5 hours attempting it twice and failing both times🤦🏼♂️. Great idea on paper, not so easy in practice.
Skill issue
It takes some practice. Took me 3 attempts to get it right.
Yeah, for some reason, the control large army won't show up for me, so that also might play a factor, having to deal with double the skaven units
Attempt #3 and I made it. Lost my sun dragon in the process tho lol
Great video, but the volume is too low.
No your speakers must just be bad. I had it on like 20% volume on my phone and had no issues
@@callumcochrane7759 Well, you can open any video on youtube and do a quick comparison, the volume is a bit low TBH.
@@callumcochrane7759 That's weird I tried on mobile and it's still low volume as well.
Might be some kinda codec problem?
nice
Imrik is fun 56 wardsave round 15 XD
Can you provide save files for this and turn 2 tier 5 grimgor?
Why did you need all the archers?
At least 21 units are needed to get the option to "control large armies" stopping the ai having more than 20 units on the field at a time. The archers are the cheapest unit to spam for that.
If you fight all 40 units in the settlement at the same time, the battle is still doable but the ai becomes hillariously janky and unpredictable.
voice is a little to low try normalizing your voice or something in the settings
how much did they charge for the chaos dwarfs dlc again? lmao
Too much, I'll wait for the next steam sale. Maybe they'll have fixed the busted Magma cannons and Astrogoth by then
Nice video! They really somehow butchered the siege AI in 3.0 with the mega blobbing thing xD
You're a little bit quiet. At 100% and I would like to turn you up a little bit.
Does not work
Gg
bit cheesy though...
Lol CA game design is so bad, thanks for showcasing it XD
no large army / lighting strike is a joke, add the sieges and how bad the defenses are (no oil, no need for equipement, towers with narrow vision) and its an easy win.
Why the f he so quiet??
UA-cam compresses audio when you upload making it quieter. I found this out shortly after releasing the video... Apologies and it will be something I fix for the next one!
Ai bait LOL
another boring cheese siege battle
Don't blame the player, blame the game. Sieges suck and nobody likes them
@@CJ-wh7ik I like siege battles. If there where only Land battles that would be lame.
@@UrsusPlayZ there will always be outliers in statistics but it doesn't make you right. The general community does not like the new siege system
@@CJ-wh7ik i blame the player, but indirectly the game. I don't care if nobody like siege or not or if you like them. The cheese is reel her and i'm sad to see such a incompetent Ai and i'm sad to see such people abusing that. This is as much interesting that watch someone play a game with tcheat on or watch someone beat a child in a game, or maybe not. A child would probably control ai army better in a siege than the ai, so it would be more interesting to watch.
@@Baras70 Then don't watch and quit bitching. Also, learn to spell.
Catapults keep mauling my army in the blob
They changed the AI in patch 3.1
If you want to cheese the battle now you have to use all the catapults' and mortars' ammo on your dragon, fly left to right until they're out of ammo.
You should be able to move your archers up after that but I doubt you'll have enough ammo and winds of magic to go through all these rats and cause army losses
Yeah just decided to attack around move 14/15 with a bigger army and I finally got it done. But thanks for the help my G ❤️
What is it with half this damn community and doing everything EXCEPT fighting a fkin battle normally?
Single player game, dude. Do what you want.
I tend not to cheese... usually... but sometimes in sieges, because they're just no fun and I want them over with.