Wow thanks for putting in the time and effort and especially for the scientific approach. For me, as long as the Barnes options shot with precision out of my 6.5 creedmoor, honestly I would go with them live happily ever after. this is because I really just want one bullet for everything between a chamois or roe deer up to elk (wapiti). Over the years I have taken a dozen elk with 140 to 147 grain Bergers and Hornady ELD-X with a 6.5 creedmoor, which all shot incredibly precisely out of my rifle, and all the elk died dramatically quickly. The "boiler room" contents were soup. Meanwhile the elk I have shot with factory Barnes 127 gr LRX, also with my 6.5 creedmoor between 100-300 yards (similar ranges to the Berger and Hornady) have also all died ferociously quickly. The "boiler room" contents were also soup. (It's subjective and anecdotal of course, but my perception was even that the Barnes-shot elk died faster. exit wound?) So, I guess, how soupy do you need the soup to be? 3" wound channel? 3.75"? 4.5"? I mean. Geez. Those all sound savage. And in my on-the-ground-experience there isn't any real difference in how an elk dies with a 3" channel vs 4"+ (because i am assuming, based on other research as well as Berger statements (bergerbullets.com/barnes-tests-proves-why-berger-hunting-vlds-are-so-successful/) that the Berger and ELD-X created bigger (though shorter/less penetrative) wound channels). So doesn't it, as usual, really come down to what shoots the most precisely out of the gun? And i might be the odd one out (probably am) but I am actually happy to see slightly smaller wound channels on both Barnes options (vs E-Tip and GMX) because this means maybe I won't lose as much meat on this year's chamois and roe buck and even red deer. Last year I used 143 gr ELD-X on all three species and, of course, not surprisingly, there was a lot of unwanted peripheral damage and meat loss. It's not a ding on the ELD-X, it's obviously not the right tool for the situation. It was what I had on hand. I'm just pointing out that the Barnes strikes me as, in fact, possibly the BEST option IF, like me, you are looking for one bullet and one load that can cover the widest range of game (that you plan to eat) AND you're not interested in taking shots past 400 yards. (Obviously at the longer distances the Berger and ELD bullets serve their intended purpose.) Since the 127 gr LRX out of a 6.5 creedmoor has been, in my experience, merciless and savagely lethal on 600-700 lb elk, yet based on Simple Minded Fella's tests looks to simultaneously have the best chance of not sawing chamois and roe deer in half, I'm excited to make the LRX or TTSX my one sword to rule them all. (Unless of course I couldn't get either bullet to shoot well out of my rifle. But i happen to already know LRX is adequately precise.) Maybe I'm also making a case for context. And what may be a desirable trait in one context might actually not be desirable in another. So it's hard to make blanket statements about which is "best". I would just add a bunch of qualifying statements to it.
@@titomish5914 Well the case I was trying to make above was that I choose based on an order of priority (and this depends on the person) For me, it's: 1) does it shoot with adequate precision out of my rifle, if yes then, 2) is the bullet construction/design optimal for the distances I plan to shoot at (so, beyond 300 yards, i start thinking more frangible construction, such as ELD-X, Berger and relatively speaking the LRX. Within 300 yards then I personally prefer more classical copper bullet construction, typified by (T)TSX, LRX, and of course E-Tip and GMX and maybe the new CX) and 3) what is the smallest grain-weight that is ethical for the largest game I plan to pursue. Some may quibble with this, but in my personal, lived experience over the last ten years and several dozen big game animals taken with the 6.5 creedmoor, a well-placed bullet of the right construction for the distance, even of modest weight is so incredibly lethal and destructive I have zero need to create more destruction. You were probably hoping for a concise answer. For me, with 6.5 creedmoor, on blacktail (mule deer) bucks, I would be 100% confident with stopping power any of the quality copper bullets in the vicinity of 120 grains. And hopefully they will spare a bit more meat than the frangible options. Aim small, miss small! Godspeed!
Outstanding info as usual.!! I do appreciate these test with min and max velocity. This has helped me decide to go ahead and make the 120GMX MY Grendel hunting projectile. Especially since shots will be 300 and in. My Odin barrel likes the 120 class much better than the heavier weights. Thanks again Brother! Keep up the great work!!
Thank you! This is first rate info regarding expansion on monolithics. I've had amazing luck with 168 grain TTSX out of a .308 on hogs, but all of those shots were under 100 yards, so lots of velocity. I'm glad that your work has provided some hard data on what happens with copper at lower velocities, especially since I am now hunting areas that offer longer range shots.
Your welcome. The TTSX is hard to beat. There are other monolithic bullets that may help extend your range a little but overall the TTSX has great knockdown.
Thanks. I started doing these tests to get results to determine what I would prefer to use in the field. I try to keep a very open mind and stay unbiased letting the test speak for themselves.
glad i found this video! surprisingly poor performance from the Barnes offerings. that's a HUGE difference in muzzle velocities for bullets with roughly the same minimum expansion velocities! i've bought 1 box of every factory lead-free 6.5CM round i could find to try and find the most accurate load for my gun. now i'm hoping it's not a Barnes, because i can't have a maximum effective range of ~250. that's just silly. and i'm gonna be very sure to bring my chrono out for accuracy testing day.
Just purchased some .308 E-tips and wondered what the penetration comparison might be. Very nice presentation and data. Thank you. I have two Merkel 308 Win rifles. The KR-1 has a 1:12 twist & groups 165 gr lead and 150 monolith bullets (same length). The K-1 has a 1:10 twist & prefers 180 gr lead and 165-168 monolith (again the same length). I also have a 1:12 twist Kimber Montana 308 which groups best with 130 gr (TTSx is the only monolith tried). Twist, weight, length, and velocity all play an important role in precision of group. Obviously there are other factors including day of the week and color of underwear.
I have recently started using Hammer Bullets in a couple of my rifles and I am really liking how easy they are to get to shoot accurately. They have a couple lighter 0.308 bullets your Kimber may like. 124 grain and 137 grain Hammer Hunters in 0.308
Great comparison, thanks. I think I’ll look at changing to Hornady instead of Barnes too FYI I shot a large Sask mule deer Nov ‘21 at 350yd using the Barnes 78gr TSX out of my 22-250AI going 3,425fps. Performed excellently, though AB says that was still travelling about 2,600fps at impact.
Those velocities are wild...with how different the two Barnes are! I don't load 6.5 but ~300 fps less velocity...? wow! May I ask you what powder it was and charge?
My rifle shoots the 127 grain 2850 and the ttsx at 2980 out of a 22 inch 6.5 creed you are making me want to try the cx bullets. If your numbers are right im going to get 3000 plus out of the cx.
The original barnes x-bullets were a 110 alloy copper. Softer than what they are using now. I know this cause my father helped randy brooks develop that bullet after usimg the original design and getting no expansion on a caribou. Still have buckets of them. Ill use them every day over the new tsx and ttsx
You did it right by moving the blocks down. Some people will use reduced velocities to simulate long range impacts and not move the blocks, not realizing that reduced velocities also reduces bullet rotational speed which will affect expansion. Long range will reduce velocity, but for all practical purposes, rotational speed will remain almost constant owing to the gyroscopic effect of the spinning bullet.
This is interesting I use the Barnes bullets and with the 127 gr and get 2860 fps from a 22 inch barrel? You need to use the powder they recommend not one powder fits all . This is a good bullet for the creedmoor .
It is an excellent bullet overall. After trying different powders and wondering what the heck was going on I took my caliper to them and I had got a bad batch and they were all a few tenthousands under .264 and I was not getting the seal I needed around the bullet. All the other copper bullets I tested measured to the correct diameter. If I ever buy Barnes bullets again (I most likely will) I will check the diameter first thing and contact them if they are undersized.
I may have missed it because I just found your channel, but you have mentioned "reduced [powder] load" in at least a couple if the vids I've seen. Does that simply mean "some powder load less the published 'DO NOT EXCEED' value? Nice videos! I wish you continuing with your continuing videos!
If I’m not mistaken, Barnes sold to Remington...and things took a noise-dive in the view of many. I was a Barnes Vor-Tex loyalist...but then accuracy diminished. I tried everything imaginable to bring it back...but it never happened. I’m no longer a Barnes fan...had to move on to another lover; reloading with CEB
Yes they sold out to Remington and quality control went out with that sale. CEB are one of the most impressive solid bullets I have ever tested. They are pricey for what they are, other then price I have been very impressed with CEB.
So. Back from the range today and got disappointing results with the 120gr GMX. HORRIBLE RESULTS!! First bullet my SAKO dislikes. I’m going to seat it deeper and not crimp it. Currently the 127LRX is my winning mono load. Sub MOA @ ~2700 FPS. 20” factory barrel too.
I have done some testing with Cutting-edge bullets and have the data, at some point I do plan on doing a comparison type video like this one with the monolithic bullets I have tested sence this video.
Well done sir! Would you share which of these if any you’d choose over all the others? Looks like e-tip and GMX are comparable. I’m assuming the gmx is cheaper.
If all of these gave the same type of accuracy I would use the GMX for sure. I have not done any accuracy testing on any of these yet. I will be at some point as I plan on dedicating one of my 6.5 CM's to just copper bullets.
That's a Big drop in Velocity. From about 2850fps for the GMX and E-tip, to 2550fps for the TTSX? That's about 10% slower and probably contributes to the reduced damage.
I think it's because the gas was escaping around the bullet when I put the caliper to the bullets the Barnes Bullets were .2635 and the Nosler and Hornady were a true .264
@@josephvafi after gel testing them in multiple different calibers now I would not use them because Nosler and Hornady are cheaper and work better. Not that they are bad and won't get the job done, its just that there are better options for less money.
Did you use hodgdon h4350 powder charge? Do you recall the charge weight you use for the Barnes 120gr ttsx? I’m reloading the Barnes and would like a starting point. Thanks
Not in this round of testing. I have never had an issue getting any of these to shoot good regardless of caliber I just recently started doing high and low velocity gel testing to appease my curiosity as I could not find the information I was looking for online so I am generating my own.
@@simplemindedfella Thanks for the response. The testing you did and the information you gathered was very informative. I am trying to decide on a bullet to load up for Mule Deer for my .257 Weatherby. So far I am leaning towards the 100 grain E-Tip. I have 100 grain Ballistic Tips loaded up now but at 200 yards or closer they behave like varmint bullets, looking for a tougher bullet and monolithics are hard to beat for that.
@@philipwalker1267 I just picked a powder to get the velocities I was looking for doing gel test. I have not loaded these for accuracy and used for hunting as where I hunt it is not required to use lead free. RL 16 is a powder I really like with my other loads in 6.5 CM and think it would work well with these.
@@simplemindedfella I would say the bullets would have to be compared at the same velocity to make that determination. 300 fps is quite a bit of a contributor to the marginally better results of the gmx. I understand that with the same powder charge you got a lower velocity but that's irrelevant. If the pressure is lower and you can add powder to achieve the same pressure and velocity with the Barnes assuming you have case capacity. The pressure and velocity likely have allot to do with the surface contact. The Barnes bullets have 3 groves and the gmx has 2, that extra surface contact likely increases pressure, restulting in more velocity. Anyway, great video 👍
@@racrx728 I tried that and I am actually going to have to test a different batch of bullets at some point. I got a badd batch and they were slightly undersized and I felt as I could not safely continue testing that batch of bullets. In regards to the slight advantage of the gmx is because it functions at a lower velocity and yet still holds together at the higher velocities given them a broader range of effectiveness. Both are excellent bullets and I would base my choice off of which ones I could get to shoot the most accurate as the advantage of the gmx is slight. In this particular case I would go with the gmx because I got a badd batch of bullets from Barnes.
Love the videos.. looking for info for my daughters grendel.. have loaded 120 nosler b.t. and picked up the 130 gr gamechanger but don't know about those if they go fast enough.. any thoughts
ua-cam.com/video/jhZIgI26WgY/v-deo.html I have shot whitetail with these and they did a great job out of the Grendel. Anything over the 120 gr range is really hard to get moving fast enough to perform out of the Grendel
I took an Antelope this season with Barnes factory LRX 6.5 Creedmoor from a Kimber with a 22" barrel at a laser measured 408 yards. Dropped him in his tracks. I wouldn't hesitate to continue hunting with Barnes ammo.
Russell, how do you define 'long range'? And have you looked at ballistics beyond 500 yards on those two? That's the whole appeal of the higher BC of 6.5. Beyond 5-600yds, 6.5 CM wins. Less than that, 270 wins.
OK, I have to declare shenanigans. For tix factory ammo the 27 grain load is 28 50 ft./s. I chronograph 2835 out of my 24 inch Teaka. Don’t know what you did wrong but you lost 300 feet a second. I think that a redo is in order. I think you were selling barn short. Also, 300 feet a second means all the difference in the world with regard to impact energy and temporary and permanent one cavity. I think you need to redo this or at least throw some projectiles over your chronograph.
I got a bad batch of Barnes bullets that were a few tenthousands under sized and I was getting bleedby. I tried two different rifles couple different manufacturers brass and five different powders with three different primers before figuring it out. So yes at some point I should try to get my hands on some Barnes bullets in. 264 and make sure they are good this time and redo the test. Overall Barnes are excellent performing and highly leathal bullets. Unfortunately it seems like they lost some quality control with their sell out to Remington. I have used Barnes in the past and I will use them in the future. I will go through them and check each bullet individually from here on out as having the issues that I have I feel as tho I need to unfortunately.
Something is wrong regarding the velocities on the Barnes. You don't research why there is incredible velocity difference! Why wouldn't you re-do the Barnes when the data is obviously extremely suspect??? Me thinks the powder charge was NOT the same as the others and that you made a serious mistake.
Yes, I did my do diligence and research and yes there was something wrong, very wrong. I got a batch of Barnes bullets that where slightly under sized and the gasses were escaping around the bullet because they were to small for them to seal properly going down the bore so even with further testing and increasing the powder charge I was getting pressure signs on my brass from the initial contact with the lands before the bullet was fully leaving the case starting to move but then the gasses would escape around the bullets after they left the case because they where not sized properly not giving me the velocity. Yes I need to redo this test, but with a good batch of bullets. I tried to figure out what was going on with 2 different rifles before I almost ran out of bullets (somewhere I have 3 of them left) when I threw the caliper on what I had left and realized oh here's my problem it's not the guns or the powder it is indeed the bullets themselves that have a problem. I discovered all that with further testing after having done this video and maybe I should explain a little bit of that in the description section. Those bullets were not free as well as the gelatin and other parts of the testing process. If you would like to send me a box of these bullets I will gladly cover the other costs of other materials for testing and do more testing with a good batch of bullets. If you are interested in seeing another test on these and are willing to send a good batch of bullets so I can then email me at simplemindedfella@outlook.com and we can discuss it and I can give you an address.
I like this comparison video the best. Right to the nuts and bolts of what I’m looking for. Great job.
Pretty much the best bullet video ever made, only way to make it better is to see what it does in the actual field on big game lol
Nice job mate. Very informative and getting me to rethink about monolithic bullet selection
Wow thanks for putting in the time and effort and especially for the scientific approach.
For me, as long as the Barnes options shot with precision out of my 6.5 creedmoor, honestly I would go with them live happily ever after. this is because I really just want one bullet for everything between a chamois or roe deer up to elk (wapiti). Over the years I have taken a dozen elk with 140 to 147 grain Bergers and Hornady ELD-X with a 6.5 creedmoor, which all shot incredibly precisely out of my rifle, and all the elk died dramatically quickly. The "boiler room" contents were soup.
Meanwhile the elk I have shot with factory Barnes 127 gr LRX, also with my 6.5 creedmoor between 100-300 yards (similar ranges to the Berger and Hornady) have also all died ferociously quickly. The "boiler room" contents were also soup. (It's subjective and anecdotal of course, but my perception was even that the Barnes-shot elk died faster. exit wound?)
So, I guess, how soupy do you need the soup to be? 3" wound channel? 3.75"? 4.5"? I mean. Geez. Those all sound savage. And in my on-the-ground-experience there isn't any real difference in how an elk dies with a 3" channel vs 4"+ (because i am assuming, based on other research as well as Berger statements (bergerbullets.com/barnes-tests-proves-why-berger-hunting-vlds-are-so-successful/) that the Berger and ELD-X created bigger (though shorter/less penetrative) wound channels).
So doesn't it, as usual, really come down to what shoots the most precisely out of the gun?
And i might be the odd one out (probably am) but I am actually happy to see slightly smaller wound channels on both Barnes options (vs E-Tip and GMX) because this means maybe I won't lose as much meat on this year's chamois and roe buck and even red deer. Last year I used 143 gr ELD-X on all three species and, of course, not surprisingly, there was a lot of unwanted peripheral damage and meat loss. It's not a ding on the ELD-X, it's obviously not the right tool for the situation. It was what I had on hand.
I'm just pointing out that the Barnes strikes me as, in fact, possibly the BEST option IF, like me, you are looking for one bullet and one load that can cover the widest range of game (that you plan to eat) AND you're not interested in taking shots past 400 yards. (Obviously at the longer distances the Berger and ELD bullets serve their intended purpose.)
Since the 127 gr LRX out of a 6.5 creedmoor has been, in my experience, merciless and savagely lethal on 600-700 lb elk, yet based on Simple Minded Fella's tests looks to simultaneously have the best chance of not sawing chamois and roe deer in half, I'm excited to make the LRX or TTSX my one sword to rule them all. (Unless of course I couldn't get either bullet to shoot well out of my rifle. But i happen to already know LRX is adequately precise.)
Maybe I'm also making a case for context. And what may be a desirable trait in one context might actually not be desirable in another. So it's hard to make blanket statements about which is "best". I would just add a bunch of qualifying statements to it.
What would you recommend for black tail bucks?? On A 6.5 creed?
@@titomish5914 Well the case I was trying to make above was that I choose based on an order of priority (and this depends on the person)
For me, it's: 1) does it shoot with adequate precision out of my rifle, if yes then, 2) is the bullet construction/design optimal for the distances I plan to shoot at (so, beyond 300 yards, i start thinking more frangible construction, such as ELD-X, Berger and relatively speaking the LRX. Within 300 yards then I personally prefer more classical copper bullet construction, typified by (T)TSX, LRX, and of course E-Tip and GMX and maybe the new CX) and 3) what is the smallest grain-weight that is ethical for the largest game I plan to pursue. Some may quibble with this, but in my personal, lived experience over the last ten years and several dozen big game animals taken with the 6.5 creedmoor, a well-placed bullet of the right construction for the distance, even of modest weight is so incredibly lethal and destructive I have zero need to create more destruction.
You were probably hoping for a concise answer. For me, with 6.5 creedmoor, on blacktail (mule deer) bucks, I would be 100% confident with stopping power any of the quality copper bullets in the vicinity of 120 grains. And hopefully they will spare a bit more meat than the frangible options.
Aim small, miss small! Godspeed!
@@velvetsnout thanks for the info
Outstanding info as usual.!! I do appreciate these test with min and max velocity. This has helped me decide to go ahead and make the 120GMX MY Grendel hunting projectile. Especially since shots will be 300 and in. My Odin barrel likes the 120 class much better than the heavier weights. Thanks again Brother! Keep up the great work!!
Thank you! This is first rate info regarding expansion on monolithics. I've had amazing luck with 168 grain TTSX out of a .308 on hogs, but all of those shots were under 100 yards, so lots of velocity. I'm glad that your work has provided some hard data on what happens with copper at lower velocities, especially since I am now hunting areas that offer longer range shots.
Your welcome.
The TTSX is hard to beat. There are other monolithic bullets that may help extend your range a little but overall the TTSX has great knockdown.
A comparison between all three is exactly what i was looking for. Thank you!
Your welcome
Well done! Nice seemingly unbiased comparison with clear results.
Thanks. I started doing these tests to get results to determine what I would prefer to use in the field. I try to keep a very open mind and stay unbiased letting the test speak for themselves.
glad i found this video!
surprisingly poor performance from the Barnes offerings. that's a HUGE difference in muzzle velocities for bullets with roughly the same minimum expansion velocities! i've bought 1 box of every factory lead-free 6.5CM round i could find to try and find the most accurate load for my gun. now i'm hoping it's not a Barnes, because i can't have a maximum effective range of ~250. that's just silly. and i'm gonna be very sure to bring my chrono out for accuracy testing day.
Thank you very much for testing these specific bullets.
Great job, great video!! Thank you! All the best from Hungary Europe.
Just purchased some .308 E-tips and wondered what the penetration comparison might be. Very nice presentation and data. Thank you. I have two Merkel 308 Win rifles. The KR-1 has a 1:12 twist & groups 165 gr lead and 150 monolith bullets (same length). The K-1 has a 1:10 twist & prefers 180 gr lead and 165-168 monolith (again the same length). I also have a 1:12 twist Kimber Montana 308 which groups best with 130 gr (TTSx is the only monolith tried). Twist, weight, length, and velocity all play an important role in precision of group. Obviously there are other factors including day of the week and color of underwear.
I have recently started using Hammer Bullets in a couple of my rifles and I am really liking how easy they are to get to shoot accurately. They have a couple lighter 0.308 bullets your Kimber may like. 124 grain and 137 grain Hammer Hunters in 0.308
I keep coming back to this video, best big game bullet video probably ever made. Lol.
I'm glad you find the information valuable.
Great work as always, keep it up my friend!
Great comparison, thanks. I think I’ll look at changing to Hornady instead of Barnes too
FYI I shot a large Sask mule deer Nov ‘21 at 350yd using the Barnes 78gr TSX out of my 22-250AI going 3,425fps. Performed excellently, though AB says that was still travelling about 2,600fps at impact.
Your welcome glad you enjoyed
Those velocities are wild...with how different the two Barnes are!
I don't load 6.5 but ~300 fps less velocity...? wow!
May I ask you what powder it was and charge?
My rifle shoots the 127 grain 2850 and the ttsx at 2980 out of a 22 inch 6.5 creed you are making me want to try the cx bullets. If your numbers are right im going to get 3000 plus out of the cx.
@calebdavis3110 go with Badlands Bulldozer 2 or Hammer bullets if you are wanting crazy high muzzle velocities. Great on the business end as well.
The original barnes x-bullets were a 110 alloy copper. Softer than what they are using now. I know this cause my father helped randy brooks develop that bullet after usimg the original design and getting no expansion on a caribou. Still have buckets of them. Ill use them every day over the new tsx and ttsx
You did it right by moving the blocks down. Some people will use reduced velocities to simulate long range impacts and not move the blocks, not realizing that reduced velocities also reduces bullet rotational speed which will affect expansion. Long range will reduce velocity, but for all practical purposes, rotational speed will remain almost constant owing to the gyroscopic effect of the spinning bullet.
You did a great job with this 👍
Nice job! Thanks for the info!
This is interesting I use the Barnes bullets and with the 127 gr and get 2860 fps from a 22 inch barrel? You need to use the powder they recommend not one powder fits all . This is a good bullet for the creedmoor .
It is an excellent bullet overall. After trying different powders and wondering what the heck was going on I took my caliper to them and I had got a bad batch and they were all a few tenthousands under .264 and I was not getting the seal I needed around the bullet. All the other copper bullets I tested measured to the correct diameter.
If I ever buy Barnes bullets again (I most likely will) I will check the diameter first thing and contact them if they are undersized.
Simple Minded Fella Remington!🙄🙄
This is some good info. Curious to know what powder you were using
H4895 as it works best with reduced loads. I do not recommend people do this type of testing as you will get squibs and it can be dangerous.
Well done. Thanks for the detailed info.
I may have missed it because I just found your channel, but you have mentioned "reduced [powder] load" in at least a couple if the vids I've seen. Does that simply mean "some powder load less the published 'DO NOT EXCEED' value?
Nice videos! I wish you continuing with your continuing videos!
If I’m not mistaken, Barnes sold to Remington...and things took a noise-dive in the view of many. I was a Barnes Vor-Tex loyalist...but then accuracy diminished. I tried everything imaginable to bring it back...but it never happened. I’m no longer a Barnes fan...had to move on to another lover; reloading with CEB
Yes they sold out to Remington and quality control went out with that sale. CEB are one of the most impressive solid bullets I have ever tested. They are pricey for what they are, other then price I have been very impressed with CEB.
Yes thanks for the research on this
Your welcome
Curious as to what length of barrel and firearm did you shoot all the ammunition?
22 inch Browning
@@simplemindedfella thank you sir. It helps me put into context how much velocity is being lost compared to a 24” barrel. Which shouldn’t be too much.
So. Back from the range today and got disappointing results with the 120gr GMX. HORRIBLE RESULTS!! First bullet my SAKO dislikes. I’m going to seat it deeper and not crimp it. Currently the 127LRX is my winning mono load. Sub MOA @ ~2700 FPS. 20” factory barrel too.
If your getting good results with Barnes and horrible with Hornady I would just go with LRX and quit wasting time with the GMX.
very helpful, thank you!
Your welcome
...following on my past comment, have you considered making a video where Cutting Edge Bullets are used in your comparisons?
I have done some testing with Cutting-edge bullets and have the data, at some point I do plan on doing a comparison type video like this one with the monolithic bullets I have tested sence this video.
@@simplemindedfella thanks! I was thinking of loading for elk and was torn between copper Raptor or Maximus out of an 30-06
Well done sir! Would you share which of these if any you’d choose over all the others? Looks like e-tip and GMX are comparable. I’m assuming the gmx is cheaper.
If all of these gave the same type of accuracy I would use the GMX for sure. I have not done any accuracy testing on any of these yet. I will be at some point as I plan on dedicating one of my 6.5 CM's to just copper bullets.
Can you add a link to the video of you shooting that you got these results from? If you have the video?
ua-cam.com/video/V6QLLJQK2Cw/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/Fwzs2W3ppyY/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/Mh3Iht7Wn4I/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/bO1yYGWApM0/v-deo.html
That's a Big drop in Velocity. From about 2850fps for the GMX and E-tip, to 2550fps for the TTSX? That's about 10% slower and probably contributes to the reduced damage.
I think it's because the gas was escaping around the bullet when I put the caliper to the bullets the Barnes Bullets were .2635 and the Nosler and Hornady were a true .264
@@simplemindedfella Good video and great post hoc detective work. So would you just give the Barnes a bit of a crimp then?
@@josephvafi after gel testing them in multiple different calibers now I would not use them because Nosler and Hornady are cheaper and work better. Not that they are bad and won't get the job done, its just that there are better options for less money.
Paul Tull morning
Great thank you Sir 👍
Did you use hodgdon h4350 powder charge? Do you recall the charge weight you use for the Barnes 120gr ttsx? I’m reloading the Barnes and would like a starting point. Thanks
No I didn't use H4350. My preferred powder for my Creedmoor is RL16 www.hodgdonreloading.com/ should have some good starting point information.
Did you by any chance do any accuracy testing as well?
Not in this round of testing. I have never had an issue getting any of these to shoot good regardless of caliber I just recently started doing high and low velocity gel testing to appease my curiosity as I could not find the information I was looking for online so I am generating my own.
@@simplemindedfella Thanks for the response. The testing you did and the information you gathered was very informative. I am trying to decide on a bullet to load up for Mule Deer for my .257 Weatherby. So far I am leaning towards the 100 grain E-Tip. I have 100 grain Ballistic Tips loaded up now but at 200 yards or closer they behave like varmint bullets, looking for a tougher bullet and monolithics are hard to beat for that.
Great info 👍
So, the Barnes give safer pressure levels. People should be cautious when svitching from conventional 120 grs bullets to GMX and E-tips.
You like the gmx over the ttsx in 120gr ?
In gel testing I would have to say yes, the gmx definitely out performed the ttsx. I have not yet shot game with them.
What powder h4350 ?
@@philipwalker1267 I just picked a powder to get the velocities I was looking for doing gel test. I have not loaded these for accuracy and used for hunting as where I hunt it is not required to use lead free. RL 16 is a powder I really like with my other loads in 6.5 CM and think it would work well with these.
@@simplemindedfella I would say the bullets would have to be compared at the same velocity to make that determination. 300 fps is quite a bit of a contributor to the marginally better results of the gmx. I understand that with the same powder charge you got a lower velocity but that's irrelevant. If the pressure is lower and you can add powder to achieve the same pressure and velocity with the Barnes assuming you have case capacity. The pressure and velocity likely have allot to do with the surface contact. The Barnes bullets have 3 groves and the gmx has 2, that extra surface contact likely increases pressure, restulting in more velocity. Anyway, great video 👍
@@racrx728 I tried that and I am actually going to have to test a different batch of bullets at some point. I got a badd batch and they were slightly undersized and I felt as I could not safely continue testing that batch of bullets.
In regards to the slight advantage of the gmx is because it functions at a lower velocity and yet still holds together at the higher velocities given them a broader range of effectiveness. Both are excellent bullets and I would base my choice off of which ones I could get to shoot the most accurate as the advantage of the gmx is slight. In this particular case I would go with the gmx because I got a badd batch of bullets from Barnes.
Love the videos.. looking for info for my daughters grendel.. have loaded 120 nosler b.t. and picked up the 130 gr gamechanger but don't know about those if they go fast enough.. any thoughts
ua-cam.com/video/jhZIgI26WgY/v-deo.html
I have shot whitetail with these and they did a great job out of the Grendel.
Anything over the 120 gr range is really hard to get moving fast enough to perform out of the Grendel
6.5-300 weatherby magnum for the long rang
I took an Antelope this season with Barnes factory LRX 6.5 Creedmoor from a Kimber with a 22" barrel at a laser measured 408 yards. Dropped him in his tracks. I wouldn't hesitate to continue hunting with Barnes ammo.
Big shocker... 6.5 Creedmore is not a long range cartridge. Get a 270 if you want performance
Russell, how do you define 'long range'? And have you looked at ballistics beyond 500 yards on those two? That's the whole appeal of the higher BC of 6.5. Beyond 5-600yds, 6.5 CM wins. Less than that, 270 wins.
@@1AAbraham if your shooting game beyond 600 yds.
Be sure to upload the gut shots as well as the kills.
@@1AAbraham 6.8 western is a better high bc cartridge and it has plenty of energy. 6.5 creedmoor is too slow at the muzzle
OK, I have to declare shenanigans. For tix factory ammo the 27 grain load is 28 50 ft./s. I chronograph 2835 out of my 24 inch Teaka. Don’t know what you did wrong but you lost 300 feet a second. I think that a redo is in order. I think you were selling barn short. Also, 300 feet a second means all the difference in the world with regard to impact energy and temporary and permanent one cavity. I think you need to redo this or at least throw some projectiles over your chronograph.
I got a bad batch of Barnes bullets that were a few tenthousands under sized and I was getting bleedby. I tried two different rifles couple different manufacturers brass and five different powders with three different primers before figuring it out.
So yes at some point I should try to get my hands on some Barnes bullets in. 264 and make sure they are good this time and redo the test.
Overall Barnes are excellent performing and highly leathal bullets. Unfortunately it seems like they lost some quality control with their sell out to Remington.
I have used Barnes in the past and I will use them in the future. I will go through them and check each bullet individually from here on out as having the issues that I have I feel as tho I need to unfortunately.
Something is wrong regarding the velocities on the Barnes. You don't research why there is incredible velocity difference! Why wouldn't you re-do the Barnes when the data is obviously extremely suspect??? Me thinks the powder charge was NOT the same as the others and that you made a serious mistake.
Yes, I did my do diligence and research and yes there was something wrong, very wrong. I got a batch of Barnes bullets that where slightly under sized and the gasses were escaping around the bullet because they were to small for them to seal properly going down the bore so even with further testing and increasing the powder charge I was getting pressure signs on my brass from the initial contact with the lands before the bullet was fully leaving the case starting to move but then the gasses would escape around the bullets after they left the case because they where not sized properly not giving me the velocity. Yes I need to redo this test, but with a good batch of bullets. I tried to figure out what was going on with 2 different rifles before I almost ran out of bullets (somewhere I have 3 of them left) when I threw the caliper on what I had left and realized oh here's my problem it's not the guns or the powder it is indeed the bullets themselves that have a problem.
I discovered all that with further testing after having done this video and maybe I should explain a little bit of that in the description section.
Those bullets were not free as well as the gelatin and other parts of the testing process. If you would like to send me a box of these bullets I will gladly cover the other costs of other materials for testing and do more testing with a good batch of bullets.
If you are interested in seeing another test on these and are willing to send a good batch of bullets so I can then email me at simplemindedfella@outlook.com and we can discuss it and I can give you an address.