it really just feels like you have no idea what you're actually talking about... the usual "it doesn't solve absolutely everything in one go, therefore don't bother at all"-argument
A Lot used, a lot spilled, a lot wasted, but still needed. Using the correct alternative will help that considerably. lithium ion is NOT that correct alternative for cars, in my opinion.
I have a Tesla model 3 and my house has a full house solar system with Lithium batteries. The solar system cost me 14,000 dollars and pays for itself in 5.5 years. The Tesla model 3 has of course Lithium batteries. My house energy savings per year with the solar is over 3,000 dollars a year. My EV produces annual savings of over 3,000 dollars a year over my previous gas cars. That's 6,000 dollars a year savings and over 10 years about 60,000 dollars I've saved. All with lithium at the base. My objectives have nothing to do with the climate change or CO2 discussions. Looking after me and my family is priority.
Have you had the system for at least five years yet? Are those savings actual numbers you've experienced or the figures in the documentation? I've heard of people not getting the savings that's claimed and some ending up with hardly any savings for whatever reason. Hopefully, you're an exception. If you have a chance, I'd suggest swapping for sodium ion batteries if they're ever available for your system: faster charging, more lifetime charge/discharge cycles, and safer than lithium ion.
@@jimrageLT1 Hi, I've had my system for just on 3 years. My numbers taken directly from the App which is called Solarman Smart. It's pretty comprehensive with the daily, monthly, and yearly numbers. A nice graphic that shows the direction of energy from panels, grid, batteries, and house. Always showing production and consumption. The graphs daily show an average of about 45+ kw consumed on average daily basis. It's also a bit fun as it shows how many tons of CO2 I've saved or equivalent trees I've planted and and tons of coal saved. Cute. Production pretty much matches that consumption unless it's an ugly day. The inverters are (2) actually. 5kw each with 6kw of solar going in which is within the spec. If selling back to the grid (I don't) the utility providor limits the size of a system on single phase to 5 kw. Hence I have 2 5kw systems with the inverters in a master/slave configuration. The 22 545 watt panels are on a fairly flat carport type roof. Not ideally angled but it works. The height is not so high so they are easily cleaned with a ladder. The inverters are programmed in 6 hour blocks. This allows for the movement of energy in a priority type focus. The 20 kwh of batteries are 10 each with each inverter. I could add more in chain if needed. Generally the batteries are fully charged by just around noon or a little later. We run appliances such as washers and dryers in the afternoon or throw some juice in the EVs. My pool pump runs during the day not at night which would be normal. My house has 2 meters. One standard meter with my house distribution panel. A 2nd meter expressly for charging EVs only is offered by my grid providor and is a Time Of Use meter or TOU. It runs from the power pole directly to my carport and the wall charger and does nothing else. So we swap between EV wall boxes depending which car or how much "excess" sun. The batteries have a lower cut off of 20%. Then the grid kicks in. If this occurs it's seamless and usually in the wee hours of the morning. They are LFP and I didn't investigate any other possible chemistries. After 3 years I don't observe any degradation,,,,, yet. I had an inverter fail and it was fixed under warranty but it took an entire month. (not happy about that) The system was then shut off and a switch box puts me on the grid solely and bypasses the solar system. The panels are Longi, inverters Deye, and the wall format batteries LV Topsun. Overall I'm quite pleased. My buddy has a similar system on 3 phase from the same company. But he massively over sized his system so his return is not very good. The grid providor offers energy buy back but if a system is limited to 5kw there won't be any excess to sell back and the price they pay is silly low. It appears they are playing the game of solar cooperation but don't really want to make it viable for them buying excess power. All my cabling is run underground and 🤞 it is reliable. We've had to reset the system a few times in heavy thunder and lightning storms and I think it's likely the copper ground rod needs to be a bit deeper. But actually that only happened a few times. I think that's about all the details I know. It works nicely for me. Thailand has low cost labor so that expense is not a consideration. Goods from China are low cost as so much is traded between Thailand and China. (same for Chinese EVs) as they are plentiful and low cost due to a tax treaty between the 2 countries. I'm an expat from the west. 😉
@@jimrageLT1Hi, I've had my system for just on 3 years. My numbers taken directly from the App which is called Solarman Smart. It's pretty comprehensive with the daily, monthly, and yearly numbers. A nice graphic that shows the direction of energy from panels, grid, batteries, and house. Always showing production and consumption. The graphs daily show an average of about 45+ kw consumed on average daily. Production pretty much matches that. The inverters are (2) actually. 5kw each with 6kw of solar going in which is within the spec. If selling back to the grid (I don't) the utility providor limits the size of a system on single phase to 5 kw. Hence I have 2 5kw systems with the inverters in a master/slave configuration. The 22 545 watt panels are on a fairly flat carport type roof. Not ideally angled but it works. The height is not so high so they are easily cleaned with a ladder. The inverters are programmed in 6 hour blocks. This allows for the movement of energy in a priority type focus. The 20 kwh of batteries are 10 each with each inverter. I could add more in chain if needed. Generally the batteries are fully charged by just around noon or a little later. We run appliances such as washers and dryers in the afternoon or throw some juice in the EVs. My pool pump runs during the day not at night which would be normal. My house has 2 meters. One standard meter with my house distribution panel. A 2nd meter expressly fir charging EVs only is offered by my grid providor and is a Time Of Use meter or TOU. It runs from the power pole directly to my carport and the wall charger and does nothing else. So we swap between EV wall boxes depending which car or how much "excess" sun. The batteries have a lower cut off of 20%. Then the grid kicks in. If this occurs it's seamless and usually in the wee hours of the morning. They are LFP and I didn't investigate any other possible chemistries. After 3 years I don't observe any degradation,,,,, yet. I had an inverter fail and it was fixed under warranty but it took an entire month. (not happy about that) The system was then shut off and a switch box puts me on the grid solely and bypasses the solar system. The panels are Longi, inverters Deye, and the wall format batteries LV Topsun. Overall I'm quite pleased. My buddy has a similar system on 3 phase from the same company. But he massively over sized his system so his return is not very good. The grid providor offers energy buy back but if a system is limited to 5kw there won't be any excess to sell back and the price they pay is silly low. It appears they are playing the game of solar cooperation but don't really want to make it viable for them buying excess power. All my cabling is run underground and 🤞 it is reliable. We've had to reset the system a few times in heavy thunder and lightning storms and I think it's likely the copper ground rod needs to be a bit deeper. But actually that only happened a few times. I think that's about all the details I know. It works nicely for me. Thailand has low cost labor so that expense is not a consideration. Goods from China are low cost as so much is traded between Thailand and China. (same for Chinese EVs) as they are plentiful and low cost due to a tax treaty between the 2 countries. I'm an expat from the west. 😉
@@jimrageLT1I've written extensive comprehensive replies but they keep getting deleted. 😢 My system 3 years running and data from actual use. I provided lots of detail but this channel or UA-cam apparently didn't appreciate my level of detail. I think the secret is to size the system correctly. And my system is at least 50% cheaper than what is available in most Western markets.
@sunrisejak2709 That's weird, I did see them in one app I use, but I dont see it now. Hadn't had a chance to reply. You had a lot of info there. Your friends solar system sounds like one of those that isn't providing what was advertised. Whole house systems just seem very inconsistent, that way. I'm not sure how reliable those figures for saved CO2 emissions and stuff are. They can make an app say anything to make you feel better, but it sounds your system is doing the right thing, thankfully.
EVs and Lithium are still in the Beta Test phase, and it's proving to be one hell of eye opener. New research is coming on line that may prove much less expensive and far less pollution.
I'd be interested to see what you could find out about an Australian scientific organisation called CSIRO and their ammonium to hydrogen metal membrane that was announced probably 5 years ago and has all but vanished. When it was announced it was a co-venture with Toyota Australia who had to functioning examples in a pair of Corollas. The technology touted ammonia as an abundant production by-product that was the best form of transporting hydrogen that could exist (better even than pure hydrogen due to the molecular structure of ammonia). The ammoniia was supposedly split on the fly by this metal membrane forming pure hydrogen. The only reason I give this any credence is that it came from CSIRO, which from its historical scientific prowess is not one to say they have created something without substantial evidence.
I want less shit to fail in my car and not membranes that need an total overhal ever 2-3 y for the price of an engine rebuild. If you can even handle that stuff safely is on a way other side of the medal
@@jimrageLT1 from memory it was pretty unclear on the details. But the key message was this membrane allows the live conversion from ammonia to hydrogen for use in vehicles. And from by very basic understanding, this is ideal because ammonia is an extremely abundant waste product from various industrial processes. Secondly because it's 3x more efficient method of storing and transporting hydrogen than pure hydrogen. The way the technology fell off the face of the earth (more or less) has me concerned that conflicting interests from the fossil fuel world had development stopped or slowed.
It’s great that you not only mention how many gallons of water are needed but how much weight that is equivalent to that way you have a better idea of pounds of water, yielding X amount of pounds of lithium instead of gallons of water, yielding gallons of lithium. Very well doneand presented. In both ways, the mining as well as the pools of Brian, take up a huge area of land that will be forever changed just like a super fund site is here in the United States.
After doing the math myself, the CO2 related impact on the climate doesn't look bad, more like a drop in the ocean! I heard that we annually release about 37.5 billion tons of CO2 worldwide [2023], so if mining 1 ton of lithium gives us 15 tons of CO2 (so 37B/15 = 2.5B) and we mined 180,000 tons of Lithium in 2023, then it gives us.... 2,500,000,000/180,000 = 13889 years of lithium production. Which is about 38 years of producing lithium to equate *just a SINGLE DAY* of our worldwide CO2 production (or in other words annual production of lithium equates to only ~38 minutes of our annual CO2 production!!), which in my opinion looks decent! 🙂
Yeah, the numbers suggest a comparative drop in the bucket. If we scale that up to the 2035 estimate of our lithium production needs of about 4,500,000 tons that 13889 years suddenly becomes 548...still good (comparatively speaking) but we won't make that number. We're projected to come up short by 24% or 1.1 million tons in production by then. All of this, of course, assumes the 1:15 ton ratio remains constant...which I doubt it will. I expect it'll get worse. The point I was trying to make was that lithium is too costly (and I don't just mean money) and too dangerous for 1000lb batteries. If we limited it to small applications then we get so much more out of that same lithium per ton. Example: From what I've read, a Tesla Model S battery contains 62.9 Kilograms of lithium which translates to about 14 batteries, if my math is right (900Kg=.99 Tons, 900/62.9=14.3). Assuming the figure of 1 gram of lithium per cell phone battery is correct, we would get 900,000 batteries for that same ton of lithium. In the world of the Net Zero fantasy, any emissions are too many emissions. The best we can do, on that front, is maximize the bang for the buck, as they say.
@@jimrageLT1 I heard that some scientists are working or more carbon based batteries, though with no good efforts without making things ultra expensive. However, if technology keeps getting better, then one day in future, after we already destroy the climate completely, maybe we will be able to produce good and clean batteries? ...not much of comforting thought though.. And I agree about things possibly worsening too, the deadly desire to be as greedy as possible and make things as cheap as possible, on the biggest scale one can, will probably make pollution even worse :-(
Yeah, there are some good alternatives in the works and I'll talk about those in a later video. But in the end, there's not going to be one single solution that works for everything.
A LOT, over the years, for sure. In my opinion, we're trading that out for something that's comparatively as bad or worse. I'm not - and never have said - oil is the only way. The long term solution is going to be a mix of technologies to meet our energy needs. Lithium ion has its place, but it doesnt offset as much oil as proponents say it does and its too dangerous to be in big things like cars, again, my opinion.
@@jimrageLT1🇨🇦 There are some very bad people behind Lithium mining in particular. Mining a major force in Canadian industry. There is violence in Africa and South America directly related to our industry. When mines open up in the US, you will see these pros in action. They do not lose. Wake up.
If you pay heed to the rest of the WEF statements, their goal is quite far from EV production for the masses and they sure don't give a rip for real CO2 or even pollution.
Lithium can be recycled so its impact on CO2 is reduced each recycle cycle, honestly I am personally pro mining for things, not really an ecology thing for me. Overall reduction in air and water pollution as a whole is just a reality even though the isolated areas of the mines not so much.
Well said. A lot of battery manufacturers claim to be able to reclaim 95% or more of the mineral material from lithium ion batteries under "optimum conditions". The problem is that process to separate the minerals from the black mass collected in the first part of the recycling process is still a work in progress. Still very expensive and still no industry standard for that process. When we can hit that mark consistently and efficiently, then it becomes almost sustainable...almost.
So the comparison you're doing with the EVs Battery's and other things that uses lithium like your phone and gropro etc. Yeah sure bud did you know this? It only takes 166 smartphones to recycle enough cobalt to build a new EV battery. -Redwood materials That means your phone and my phone is more cobalt rich now i know you are talking about EV battery and Lithium but let me tell you this, only ~17% of the 150 million devices Americans discard each year is recycled. That's each year. Why mine when you can recycle this is not as big of a problem you think, you're reading too much fear mongering articles that goes around and tells you EVs are bad and they aren't possible. Absolutely false, if you would just find the proper amount of lithium to be extracted here in America like with EnergyX you'll understand that the demand is for Lithium is not a problem to be solved, it's already being solved
17% might a generous figure, if you ask me. The claims are that 95% or more of the minerals can be reclaimed in the recycling process "under optimum conditions", which is great for the sustainability part of it. In the shredding part of the recycling process, its comparatively easy to separate the black mass (the minerals) from the rest of the material. But after that, its gets very expensive and chemically intensive to fully reclaim and separate the black mass into the mineral components. There really isn't a cost-effective way to do that (yet) as far as I am aware. The whole recycling process is so expensive (right now), manufacturers find it easier to keep on digging. So few batteries are recycled because A) people find it inconvenient to take their batteries to the right drop off location and B) It's really difficult to make a profit without a contract deal with particular manufacturers to recycle their batteries. But yeah, if everything was being recycled consistently then we'd have something.
@@jimrageLT1 it's not a claim, it's the on Average they recover by recycling batteries, there are three basic approaches to recycling batteries each with it's own drawbacks 1. You can burn them which is wasteful and can result in toxic emissions 2. You can dissolve them in strong chemicals which is expensive and uses the most energy. Or 3. Separate them mechanically which can be labor intensive and dangerous. Until the last few years recyclers are simply ground up the batteries and sent them overseas for someone else to deal with but Redwood materials is borrowing the most useful bits from each of those categories or recycling. The Redwood materials process starts by grounding up the batteries in vacuum and they go to a conveyor belt to the RCI which is essentially an enormous slow cooker baking the materials at several hundred degrees for about an hour and perhaps it's redwoods biggest innovation thus far, traditional recycling uses well over 1,000° c or 1,800 Fahrenheit to separate out precious materials. If you go and the do some digging around you'll find the entire process of recycling Redwood materials do what I told you is just the early stages of their recycling methods learn about it and yes this is more cost effective compared to the 3 traditional ways of recycling pls do more research about this before making assumptions of what you think is happening
Thanks for the info. I'm aware that nailing down the recycling process is still a work in progress, but I'll add this to my list of research for the video I'll be doing on recycling.
Funy thing they try to delay as hard as possible cant sell: Service plans, engine trims and tunings, extended warantys (well out of waranty your car will be trash anyways so no one will buy it)
What, in particular? Late in the video, I did say I'd be talking about other battery technologies in another video. If there's some relevant in overlooking, please let me know. I want to be as informed as I can if I'm talking about this stuff. Thanks.
What do you think about lithium for lithium ion batteries after watching this? Let me know below!
@@jimrageLT1 I think that li on is a start but I feel that better is out there if we all work to make it happen.
it really just feels like you have no idea what you're actually talking about...
the usual "it doesn't solve absolutely everything in one go, therefore don't bother at all"-argument
I think you're full of shit.
Hi, let's talk about oil and how we get , use , dispose of .
A Lot used, a lot spilled, a lot wasted, but still needed. Using the correct alternative will help that considerably. lithium ion is NOT that correct alternative for cars, in my opinion.
2 wrinkles in my brain 🧠….this was a banger 🔥
Thanks. My delivery wasn't my best work, but I hope the point came across as intended.
@@jimrageLT1 1% better on each video is all you need to do! You did great 👍🏻
Excellent video 👍
Thanks!
Thanks Sir.
Most welcome
I have a Tesla model 3 and my house has a full house solar system with Lithium batteries. The solar system cost me 14,000 dollars and pays for itself in 5.5 years. The Tesla model 3 has of course Lithium batteries. My house energy savings per year with the solar is over 3,000 dollars a year. My EV produces annual savings of over 3,000 dollars a year over my previous gas cars. That's 6,000 dollars a year savings and over 10 years about 60,000 dollars I've saved. All with lithium at the base. My objectives have nothing to do with the climate change or CO2 discussions. Looking after me and my family is priority.
Have you had the system for at least five years yet? Are those savings actual numbers you've experienced or the figures in the documentation? I've heard of people not getting the savings that's claimed and some ending up with hardly any savings for whatever reason. Hopefully, you're an exception. If you have a chance, I'd suggest swapping for sodium ion batteries if they're ever available for your system: faster charging, more lifetime charge/discharge cycles, and safer than lithium ion.
@@jimrageLT1 Hi, I've had my system for just on 3 years. My numbers taken directly from the App which is called Solarman Smart. It's pretty comprehensive with the daily, monthly, and yearly numbers. A nice graphic that shows the direction of energy from panels, grid, batteries, and house. Always showing production and consumption. The graphs daily show an average of about 45+ kw consumed on average daily basis. It's also a bit fun as it shows how many tons of CO2 I've saved or equivalent trees I've planted and and tons of coal saved. Cute. Production pretty much matches that consumption unless it's an ugly day. The inverters are (2) actually. 5kw each with 6kw of solar going in which is within the spec. If selling back to the grid (I don't) the utility providor limits the size of a system on single phase to 5 kw. Hence I have 2 5kw systems with the inverters in a master/slave configuration. The 22 545 watt panels are on a fairly flat carport type roof. Not ideally angled but it works. The height is not so high so they are easily cleaned with a ladder. The inverters are programmed in 6 hour blocks. This allows for the movement of energy in a priority type focus. The 20 kwh of batteries are 10 each with each inverter. I could add more in chain if needed. Generally the batteries are fully charged by just around noon or a little later. We run appliances such as washers and dryers in the afternoon or throw some juice in the EVs. My pool pump runs during the day not at night which would be normal. My house has 2 meters. One standard meter with my house distribution panel. A 2nd meter expressly for charging EVs only is offered by my grid providor and is a Time Of Use meter or TOU. It runs from the power pole directly to my carport and the wall charger and does nothing else. So we swap between EV wall boxes depending which car or how much "excess" sun. The batteries have a lower cut off of 20%. Then the grid kicks in. If this occurs it's seamless and usually in the wee hours of the morning. They are LFP and I didn't investigate any other possible chemistries. After 3 years I don't observe any degradation,,,,, yet. I had an inverter fail and it was fixed under warranty but it took an entire month. (not happy about that) The system was then shut off and a switch box puts me on the grid solely and bypasses the solar system. The panels are Longi, inverters Deye, and the wall format batteries LV Topsun. Overall I'm quite pleased. My buddy has a similar system on 3 phase from the same company. But he massively over sized his system so his return is not very good. The grid providor offers energy buy back but if a system is limited to 5kw there won't be any excess to sell back and the price they pay is silly low. It appears they are playing the game of solar cooperation but don't really want to make it viable for them buying excess power. All my cabling is run underground and 🤞 it is reliable. We've had to reset the system a few times in heavy thunder and lightning storms and I think it's likely the copper ground rod needs to be a bit deeper. But actually that only happened a few times. I think that's about all the details I know. It works nicely for me. Thailand has low cost labor so that expense is not a consideration. Goods from China are low cost as so much is traded between Thailand and China. (same for Chinese EVs) as they are plentiful and low cost due to a tax treaty between the 2 countries. I'm an expat from the west. 😉
@@jimrageLT1Hi, I've had my system for just on 3 years. My numbers taken directly from the App which is called Solarman Smart. It's pretty comprehensive with the daily, monthly, and yearly numbers. A nice graphic that shows the direction of energy from panels, grid, batteries, and house. Always showing production and consumption. The graphs daily show an average of about 45+ kw consumed on average daily. Production pretty much matches that. The inverters are (2) actually. 5kw each with 6kw of solar going in which is within the spec. If selling back to the grid (I don't) the utility providor limits the size of a system on single phase to 5 kw. Hence I have 2 5kw systems with the inverters in a master/slave configuration. The 22 545 watt panels are on a fairly flat carport type roof. Not ideally angled but it works. The height is not so high so they are easily cleaned with a ladder. The inverters are programmed in 6 hour blocks. This allows for the movement of energy in a priority type focus. The 20 kwh of batteries are 10 each with each inverter. I could add more in chain if needed. Generally the batteries are fully charged by just around noon or a little later. We run appliances such as washers and dryers in the afternoon or throw some juice in the EVs. My pool pump runs during the day not at night which would be normal. My house has 2 meters. One standard meter with my house distribution panel. A 2nd meter expressly fir charging EVs only is offered by my grid providor and is a Time Of Use meter or TOU. It runs from the power pole directly to my carport and the wall charger and does nothing else. So we swap between EV wall boxes depending which car or how much "excess" sun. The batteries have a lower cut off of 20%. Then the grid kicks in. If this occurs it's seamless and usually in the wee hours of the morning. They are LFP and I didn't investigate any other possible chemistries. After 3 years I don't observe any degradation,,,,, yet. I had an inverter fail and it was fixed under warranty but it took an entire month. (not happy about that) The system was then shut off and a switch box puts me on the grid solely and bypasses the solar system. The panels are Longi, inverters Deye, and the wall format batteries LV Topsun. Overall I'm quite pleased. My buddy has a similar system on 3 phase from the same company. But he massively over sized his system so his return is not very good. The grid providor offers energy buy back but if a system is limited to 5kw there won't be any excess to sell back and the price they pay is silly low. It appears they are playing the game of solar cooperation but don't really want to make it viable for them buying excess power. All my cabling is run underground and 🤞 it is reliable. We've had to reset the system a few times in heavy thunder and lightning storms and I think it's likely the copper ground rod needs to be a bit deeper. But actually that only happened a few times. I think that's about all the details I know. It works nicely for me. Thailand has low cost labor so that expense is not a consideration. Goods from China are low cost as so much is traded between Thailand and China. (same for Chinese EVs) as they are plentiful and low cost due to a tax treaty between the 2 countries. I'm an expat from the west. 😉
@@jimrageLT1I've written extensive comprehensive replies but they keep getting deleted. 😢 My system 3 years running and data from actual use. I provided lots of detail but this channel or UA-cam apparently didn't appreciate my level of detail. I think the secret is to size the system correctly. And my system is at least 50% cheaper than what is available in most Western markets.
@sunrisejak2709 That's weird, I did see them in one app I use, but I dont see it now. Hadn't had a chance to reply. You had a lot of info there. Your friends solar system sounds like one of those that isn't providing what was advertised. Whole house systems just seem very inconsistent, that way. I'm not sure how reliable those figures for saved CO2 emissions and stuff are. They can make an app say anything to make you feel better, but it sounds your system is doing the right thing, thankfully.
EVs and Lithium are still in the Beta Test phase, and it's proving to be one hell of eye opener. New research is coming on line that may prove much less expensive and far less pollution.
Yeah, we can only hope. A few of those options have been around for a long time. They're finally getting a second look.
I'd be interested to see what you could find out about an Australian scientific organisation called CSIRO and their ammonium to hydrogen metal membrane that was announced probably 5 years ago and has all but vanished. When it was announced it was a co-venture with Toyota Australia who had to functioning examples in a pair of Corollas. The technology touted ammonia as an abundant production by-product that was the best form of transporting hydrogen that could exist (better even than pure hydrogen due to the molecular structure of ammonia). The ammoniia was supposedly split on the fly by this metal membrane forming pure hydrogen.
The only reason I give this any credence is that it came from CSIRO, which from its historical scientific prowess is not one to say they have created something without substantial evidence.
Nothing new from them since 2020, that I can find. Looked interesting, though. I'll be reading up that.
I want less shit to fail in my car and not membranes that need an total overhal ever 2-3 y for the price of an engine rebuild. If you can even handle that stuff safely is on a way other side of the medal
#Facts
@@jimrageLT1 from memory it was pretty unclear on the details. But the key message was this membrane allows the live conversion from ammonia to hydrogen for use in vehicles. And from by very basic understanding, this is ideal because ammonia is an extremely abundant waste product from various industrial processes. Secondly because it's 3x more efficient method of storing and transporting hydrogen than pure hydrogen.
The way the technology fell off the face of the earth (more or less) has me concerned that conflicting interests from the fossil fuel world had development stopped or slowed.
@@stefanpredl6849 all questions to be answered i guess. Not to shit on an idea before such details are known is a good start.
It’s great that you not only mention how many gallons of water are needed but how much weight that is equivalent to that way you have a better idea of pounds of water, yielding X amount of pounds of lithium instead of gallons of water, yielding gallons of lithium. Very well doneand presented. In both ways, the mining as well as the pools of Brian, take up a huge area of land that will be forever changed just like a super fund site is here in the United States.
Thanks. I think it helps illustrate the point when the units of measure are the same.
After doing the math myself, the CO2 related impact on the climate doesn't look bad, more like a drop in the ocean!
I heard that we annually release about 37.5 billion tons of CO2 worldwide [2023], so if mining 1 ton of lithium gives us 15 tons of CO2 (so 37B/15 = 2.5B) and we mined 180,000 tons of Lithium in 2023, then it gives us.... 2,500,000,000/180,000 = 13889 years of lithium production. Which is about 38 years of producing lithium to equate *just a SINGLE DAY* of our worldwide CO2 production (or in other words annual production of lithium equates to only ~38 minutes of our annual CO2 production!!), which in my opinion looks decent! 🙂
Yeah, the numbers suggest a comparative drop in the bucket. If we scale that up to the 2035 estimate of our lithium production needs of about 4,500,000 tons that 13889 years suddenly becomes 548...still good (comparatively speaking) but we won't make that number. We're projected to come up short by 24% or 1.1 million tons in production by then. All of this, of course, assumes the 1:15 ton ratio remains constant...which I doubt it will. I expect it'll get worse.
The point I was trying to make was that lithium is too costly (and I don't just mean money) and too dangerous for 1000lb batteries. If we limited it to small applications then we get so much more out of that same lithium per ton. Example: From what I've read, a Tesla Model S battery contains 62.9 Kilograms of lithium which translates to about 14 batteries, if my math is right (900Kg=.99 Tons, 900/62.9=14.3). Assuming the figure of 1 gram of lithium per cell phone battery is correct, we would get 900,000 batteries for that same ton of lithium.
In the world of the Net Zero fantasy, any emissions are too many emissions. The best we can do, on that front, is maximize the bang for the buck, as they say.
@@jimrageLT1 I heard that some scientists are working or more carbon based batteries, though with no good efforts without making things ultra expensive. However, if technology keeps getting better, then one day in future, after we already destroy the climate completely, maybe we will be able to produce good and clean batteries? ...not much of comforting thought though..
And I agree about things possibly worsening too, the deadly desire to be as greedy as possible and make things as cheap as possible, on the biggest scale one can, will probably make pollution even worse :-(
Yeah, there are some good alternatives in the works and I'll talk about those in a later video. But in the end, there's not going to be one single solution that works for everything.
And how many oil related disasters have there been and human lives lost from air pollution?
A LOT, over the years, for sure. In my opinion, we're trading that out for something that's comparatively as bad or worse. I'm not - and never have said - oil is the only way. The long term solution is going to be a mix of technologies to meet our energy needs. Lithium ion has its place, but it doesnt offset as much oil as proponents say it does and its too dangerous to be in big things like cars, again, my opinion.
@@jimrageLT1🇨🇦 There are some very bad people behind Lithium mining in particular. Mining a major force in Canadian industry. There is violence in Africa and South America directly related to our industry. When mines open up in the US, you will see these pros in action. They do not lose.
Wake up.
Just dont look on the statistics for disabled kids. Or kids with learning problems or asthma
Thing is, oil isn't going anywhere... we just add to the pollution feeling good about it... that's all there is
If you pay heed to the rest of the WEF statements, their goal is quite far from EV production for the masses and they sure don't give a rip for real CO2 or even pollution.
Lithium can be recycled so its impact on CO2 is reduced each recycle cycle, honestly I am personally pro mining for things, not really an ecology thing for me. Overall reduction in air and water pollution as a whole is just a reality even though the isolated areas of the mines not so much.
Well said. A lot of battery manufacturers claim to be able to reclaim 95% or more of the mineral material from lithium ion batteries under "optimum conditions". The problem is that process to separate the minerals from the black mass collected in the first part of the recycling process is still a work in progress. Still very expensive and still no industry standard for that process. When we can hit that mark consistently and efficiently, then it becomes almost sustainable...almost.
No problem, new product coming through. 😂
Cant get here fast enough
U2oob: "Tesla on fire in Sarasota Florida" ... [include quotes]
His very first sentence is wrong. Try getting an education.
We'll see what it looks like in 2035.
@@jimrageLT1 Pretty easy to see the trend right now.
Dino cars are toast.
Probably not completely.
So the comparison you're doing with the EVs Battery's and other things that uses lithium like your phone and gropro etc. Yeah sure bud did you know this?
It only takes 166 smartphones to recycle enough cobalt to build a new EV battery. -Redwood materials
That means your phone and my phone is more cobalt rich now i know you are talking about EV battery and Lithium but let me tell you this, only ~17% of the 150 million devices Americans discard each year is recycled. That's each year. Why mine when you can recycle this is not as big of a problem you think, you're reading too much fear mongering articles that goes around and tells you EVs are bad and they aren't possible. Absolutely false, if you would just find the proper amount of lithium to be extracted here in America like with EnergyX you'll understand that the demand is for Lithium is not a problem to be solved, it's already being solved
You are being BS to about recycling, It's not happening like they say it is!
@@ShaneMcGrath. What's BS about it? Tell me mr informed guy
17% might a generous figure, if you ask me.
The claims are that 95% or more of the minerals can be reclaimed in the recycling process "under optimum conditions", which is great for the sustainability part of it. In the shredding part of the recycling process, its comparatively easy to separate the black mass (the minerals) from the rest of the material. But after that, its gets very expensive and chemically intensive to fully reclaim and separate the black mass into the mineral components. There really isn't a cost-effective way to do that (yet) as far as I am aware. The whole recycling process is so expensive (right now), manufacturers find it easier to keep on digging. So few batteries are recycled because A) people find it inconvenient to take their batteries to the right drop off location and B) It's really difficult to make a profit without a contract deal with particular manufacturers to recycle their batteries.
But yeah, if everything was being recycled consistently then we'd have something.
@@jimrageLT1 it's not a claim, it's the on Average they recover by recycling batteries, there are three basic approaches to recycling batteries each with it's own drawbacks 1. You can burn them which is wasteful and can result in toxic emissions 2. You can dissolve them in strong chemicals which is expensive and uses the most energy. Or 3. Separate them mechanically which can be labor intensive and dangerous.
Until the last few years recyclers are simply ground up the batteries and sent them overseas for someone else to deal with but Redwood materials is borrowing the most useful bits from each of those categories or recycling. The Redwood materials process starts by grounding up the batteries in vacuum and they go to a conveyor belt to the RCI which is essentially an enormous slow cooker baking the materials at several hundred degrees for about an hour and perhaps it's redwoods biggest innovation thus far, traditional recycling uses well over 1,000° c or 1,800 Fahrenheit to separate out precious materials.
If you go and the do some digging around you'll find the entire process of recycling Redwood materials do what I told you is just the early stages of their recycling methods learn about it and yes this is more cost effective compared to the 3 traditional ways of recycling pls do more research about this before making assumptions of what you think is happening
Thanks for the info. I'm aware that nailing down the recycling process is still a work in progress, but I'll add this to my list of research for the video I'll be doing on recycling.
I hope people wake up and realize it's just an other scam... billionaire don't make money by being honest...
@@joseph-mariopelerin7028 🤦♂️
Funy thing they try to delay as hard as possible cant sell: Service plans, engine trims and tunings, extended warantys (well out of waranty your car will be trash anyways so no one will buy it)
Your right
Somebody hasn’t investigated current developments in battery chemistry
What, in particular? Late in the video, I did say I'd be talking about other battery technologies in another video. If there's some relevant in overlooking, please let me know. I want to be as informed as I can if I'm talking about this stuff. Thanks.