How to upgrade almost any 10speed wheel to work with 11speed: 7 tips tricks and hacks
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- Опубліковано 1 лип 2024
- Here is a very common problem. You have an older 10 speed wheel and want it to work without your new 11speed bike / gearing. Here we run through the 7 ways you can make the conversion for almost any wheel. Also don't overlook all those 10 speed wheels sold second hand at rock bottom price because people want the 11sp version.
If you have a short attention span and want a quick answer go to 12:44
Links
darkspeedworks.com/blog-11spee...
www.edco-wheels.co.uk/product/...
Wheels Manufacturing Converter wheelsmfg.com/products/rear-dr...
Brilliant, thanks for taking the time to put this together. I love improvisation and low budget solutions. I buy most of my stuff second hand, don't mind being a season or two behind, after all, the rider makes the bike, the bike doesn't make the rider. Keep up the good work.
The Bicycle Engine. The mechanic makes the bike
Man.. I don't even have a bike. But after watching this and because of his zeal and passion, I might go and buy a 10 speed bike tomorrow and do all the work needed to make it takes the 11s cassette.
At first I thought oh God 14:00 minutes long, but you managed to fit about an hours worth of content in that 14, this was extremely on point, thank you.
Love the inset video of the Cycleops G3 hub. As an owner of one that continues to perform year after year on my FC 404 clincher it’s good to know some of us are still out there.
Dude, this is an amazingly useful video. Well done. Thanks so much for all the work you put in to create this.
I've done this on my 10 speed Shimano RS 80 wheel. Machined the freehub, so it works now perfectly with 11 speed cassette.
Also used a 11 campagnolo cassette with Sram 11 speed gears - works great as well.
Thanks for the tip! Took the 13T sprocket out of an 11s 11-32 cassette to run an old RS10 wheel in an 11s drivetrain. Works like a charm, just adjust the L limit screw. Indexing still works unchanged
Great post , explains the whole picture , which of course in cycling is seldom entirely straight forward ! Thanks for the video
Thank you. I had an old set of Mavic wheels that I thought were out of date but I found the spacer, removed it and replaced my daughters very heavy wheels.
Simple advice but hey, it got me going! Thanks for putting this together, really helpful!
Excellent description on the video. Just saved me a tonne of grief! Thanks
This is an excellent video. Very helpful and well presented. I am using option 7, custom 11-speed mono-block 11-34 cassette. Thanks.
So much good information. Thanks for letting us all know.
Such a useful video! Thank you so much for putting it out there for us to use. -Mikes Bike's Work
You're my go-to bike professor!
Haha good to know! New video on tyre volume come v soon.
this is such an informative video. thank you!
I have a campy 10 speed wheel. I'm having trouble getting 10 speed cassettes lately. Love the idea of just getting an 11 speed and not using one. Thanks
6.27...that was very informative..solved my problem....thanks
Great video 👍 very helpful thank you 🙏
Great video, you helped me a lot!
Shimano 11sp MTB cassettes are concave at the back at 1.85 mm just like Campy and Edco therefore fit perfectly on 10sp road hubs.
Whatttttttt. Mind blown!
But won't they still not work since they are dynasys?
wrong. I just put a brand new 11 speed cs-m8000 on a shimano FH-m475 hub from like 2007. in fact its like it was meant to be. everything just worked.
M Y do you mean a cassette such as the Shimano slx m7000 11 mountain bike sprocket would fit on a 10 speed hub of a road bike? I’m just wondering whether to try it as it’s a cheap option and wouldn’t lose much money if it didn’t work out.
@@paulbradley48 Yes. It does. Shimano HG-800 11-34T was fitted onto a 10s freehub and it works. SLX may not be used because the road RDs is up to 34T unless you use the Shimano RX800 clutched road RD. I fitted the RX800 using 34/46 CR with 11-42T cassette.
Brand new Ambrosio Conversion Cassette. FOR ELEVEN SPEED CAMPY DRIVETRAINS ON A SHIMANO HUBBED WHEEL!!!
This cassette allows you to run 11 speed Campy on a SHIMANO 11 speed freehub pattern/wheel!
No more worrying about using a Shimano spec wheelset on your Campagnolo equipped bike! A really fantastic idea from Ambrosio.
Excellent video, thank you 🙏
I have a cyclo cross bike with an 11 speed SRAM PG-1170, 11-36, road cassette paired with a SRAM force rear mech. I've been wanting to fit a pair of wheels on this bike from a 29er mtb with DT Swiss 240 MTB Hubs with a 10/11 speed freehub body fitted. I hadn't appreciate all the complexity with 10/11 speed compatibility between road and MTB and found this blog and the comments really useful.
I didn't want a huge 11 speed MTB cassette with a 50 sprocket (all the Shimano and SRAM 11 speed MTB cassettes all seem to have a 48 or 50 sprocket) as that isn't ideal for cyclocross or gravel and a Shimano or SRAM 11 speed road cassette won't fit the freehub as these cassettes are too wide.
My solution has been to use a Sunrace CSMS8 cassette. These are 11 speed MTB cassettes and for the mtb 10/11 freehub but you can get an 11-36 which is much better for the cyclo-cross/gravel bike.
In terms of spacing of sprockets I have compared the SRAM road cassette and the Sunrace MTB cassette and I can't tell any difference in width, although it's quite hard to measure precisely. Visually, all the sprockets line up. Gears run smoothly, even under load.
Much cheaper than the edco monoblock
Hopefully others will find this useful
Duncan
This is so smart, thank you!
Very thorough!
Hi, great video. I machined my 11 speed utegra cassette and fit it on a 10 speed chapagnolo rim it is working fine. I reduced 900 grams for 4 US dollars
The cassette is less than 300 grams. How did you reduce 900 grams by machining the cassette? Are you hands less weight now???
@@electricsky7194 Old wheelset I imagine
I don’t know if it’s been mentioned here by anyone but you can also purchase the Shimano R800 11-34 cassette 11 speed because now the 34T is milled out and it fits on Shimano 10 speed hub wheels.
it doesn't milled out. 11 speed 11-34 cassette are similar to any shimano 11 MTB casette.
Can you advise? Currently have trek checkpoint 4 with Tiagra 10 speed and want to ultegra it
Think this is possible?
Well done!
thanks!
Great idea.. I haved DT-swiss wheel set 10speed and my cassette is 11 speed Shimano Ultegra how muck mm should I shave to free hub body to fit my 11s ultegra cassette? Thank you so much
Brilliant ideas
I wish more manufacturers offered conversion kits.
What about buying a replacement hub...plenty out there and just swapping out the 10 speed for 11 speed? DT Swiss makes one for under USD 60.00 online...would that work, or am I totally off?
The problem with option #6 is that the rings are rampped to accept the chain so that when you remove one ring you offset the ramps and get shitty shifting on that one ring.
So would I also have to change out the rear derailer, shifters, and front cassette?
So if I can get an 11-speed freewheel for my bike, that's all I need? I currently run a 12-27 DA cassette and there's always been a thin spacer run with it as that's what was on the bike when the 12-25 was on there from new. I though wheel re-dishing was needed?
okay think he answered my question, well maybe..but can someone dumb this down for me..i wanna upgrade my group set and wheel set, my came with a 8 speed shimano claris..found a good deal on 11 speed 105's groupset for under 400 bucks, im a heavier rider so i also buying new wheelset which are says 8, 9, 10 speed compatible, so can i just replace the free hub with an 11 speed free hub without doing all that machining ?
Thank you for the very helpful tip! I guess the machining-down cassettes method will work as good to fit a 11-spd Shimano road cassette onto a modern MTB free hub? The MTB free hub is 1.25mm shorter than 11-spd road hubs.
The "11-speed MTB" hub is really just a 8/9/10-speed freehub body. The new 11-speed 34T "road" cassette is the smallest that will work on the 8/9/10-speed body spacing. MTB can get away with using the 8/9/10-speed body spacing as the largest cog is far enough from the spokes at the outer edge that the rear derailleur won't run into the spokes. The new 11-speed 34T "road" cassette is the smallest that will work on the 8/9/10-speed body spacing.
@@davidobrien8438
I have the opposite issue that all of you are talking about. My old MTB uses 8spd Suntour XC Pro shifters with an 8spd Dura Ace derailleur on a 7spd Suntour 12-28 freewheel. The hub is 130mm spacing for a bike that should be 135mm, so I want to upgrade to a new 135mm hub with 11-28 8spd. The only problem is that Suntour used dual width spacing on their freewheels and cassettes, with standard 4.8mm spacing on the 3 or 4 upper cogs and 5mm on the smaller cogs. Since a standard freehub body is too narrow to handle adding spacers to make the cassette 0.8 mm wider, the only option I can think of is to get an 11spd road hub (Hope Rs4 probably) and replace the 1.8mm spacer for adapting a 8/9/10spd cassette to an 11spd body, with a 1mm spacer, and replace the 3mm spacer with a 3.2mm; along with somehow obtaining 0.2 spacers to add to the spider (where the loose cogs start) and the two end cogs that are made without spacers. That should give me the Suntour Accushift spacing with a Shimano cassette. The only problem is getting the 0.2mm spacers (I did find the 3.2mm spacer can be found on older Sachs cassettes), so I may have to get them machined. It’s a pain, but I love my XC Pro lever shifters/Dura Ace derailleur set up. I just want to modernize the hub and go to a more available cassette instead of the old school, unavailable freewheel.
verygoodinformationjustalittlebitfastexplainedbutunderstandtherewasalottocoverwelldone!!! 😄
thank you!
Set the speed to 0.75 then its ok 😂
This must be sped up.
*fast* fitness tips
🤣 .75 makes it perfect
It was like listening to an auctioneer!
*skips to 12:44 🙄 great video again though!
shimano now has 11-34 11-speed cassettes that will work on 10 speed hub. Just need a long cage derailleur (r8000)
Great video. One question. So in a HED tri spoke it should be easy to make the modification. You have a lot of room fro the chain and the 11s cassette. right?
Jacuist thanks. Yes there is a lot of room from the spokes and the cassette
Will I need to change the shifter if I change 10 speed cassette to a 11 speed cassette. Campagnolo Sustem
I have a Corima S+ wheel but the 11s free hub has split where 3 pawls are housed. Hence I need a replacement. Corima freehubs are very expensive, is it possible to find a cheaper replacement? Ie novatec.
thank you
Super video. Thanks guys. I'm about to change from a 10 speed to an 11 speed Di2 shimano system.
However my wheels are 10 speed shimano (wh7900 c24 and c50). I really want to keep them if possible. Which of the hacks will work ?
Thanks in advance, Martin
Several will work but do you want to ride with the full 11 functionality, if so you might want to buy that Edco cassette or a customized shimano cassette.
Thanks.. !!!! Truly helpfull 😎👍
Hey thanks for the video! I have a question, if I have an 10 speed cassette and it has he spacer can I just remove that spacer and put a different spacer on the other side to adjust chain line problems in big big? My crankset is for an 11 speed bike but I currently have 10 speed system. If the cassette was a few mils further in I think the problem would be solved?
hi loveisforever, yes you can try a different sized spacer but the lock ring must still fit securely on the freehub otherwise the cassette may come loose. Further the amount of extra spacing you will likely achieve is probably about an extra 1mm which is unlikely to solve chainline issues. What chainline issues are you having?
Five stars double thumbs up.
I have planet X 82 carbon Shimano 10 speed,any luck with that one?
Can I build a cassette 11 speed from two 9 speed cassettes? Trying spacers 2,55mm to 1,85mm?
Things get really wild when you are fitting an XD body on a road wheel to get a taste of those 9-42 cassettes
Great! Now how do we change our brake shifters from 10 to 11 speed. If you change the hub don't you need to change the shifter for the indexing ?
I was assuming you had an 11 speed gear system with a 10 speed wheel (see video description)! If you have an entirely 10 speed hub, gearing, shifters I would buy a new bike or stay with 10sp!!
11s cassettes are cheaper than 10s second hand at the moment here in Japan. I have a spacer on my 10s system. I see I can put a 11s cassette on the rear wheel but what issues will my 10s indexing system have?
I believe 11spd is narrower and the shifter will need replacing.
Lots of excellent information, thanks. But now, on to the complaint; why are you pronouncing the G in Campagnolo?
He has accent.
Hint #1: An 11 speed wheel with a 10 speed casette will have 2.8 mm of spacer on it.. specifically
Where can I buy this spacer? I have a 10 speed Ultegra cassette I want to put on my Hed 11 speed
Can 9 speed will also work with 11 speed if milled down in the center?
DT swiss 430 with a shimano hub. Sadly I have a qr axle. For now I am trying to mod what I got. My main reason for wanting to this is the 9-46t availability. I know 12 is out of the question which has a 50t cassette.
I am not sure about this, but it sounds doubtful, maybe someone else can help??
You cannot got smaller than 11T. You will NOT be able to use the SRAM XD cassettes in any way. However, the "9-speed" body is the one you want to mill down. The "10-speed" body is too-short so you cannot. NOTE: what you think of as a "10-speed" freehub body is really a 8/9/10-speed (and you MUST USE A 1mm SPACER for Dura-Ace/Ultegra/105 (but not Tiagra) 10-speed Shimano cassettes).
👏👏👏👏
Thanks for sharing
Very useful :)
Always loving your vdo but I don’t think you can talk any faster... :)
How to get the speech speed from 10 to 6?
what! i can attach 11 speed casette on my tiagra 10 speed??
Ok, question: I`m currently using a 12-25 10-speed cassette Dura Ace 7800 with a compact crank set 36-50 in the front and would like to upgrade it into a 11-28 10- or even 11-speed..
With my Mavic Ksyrium wheel, I have the 2.8 mm of space on the freehub for an additional toothring, but does my rear derailleur (it`s a medium size) fit a 28 ring and a 11-speed cassette?? Shimano made it only for 25, but in 2007 didn`t even exist a 11-speed 28 system?! Need help.
Martin T I've successfully used a 9 speed 11-30 cassette with shimano tiagra short cage rear mech. Shimano say 25 teeth is the max for that mech but simply adjust the b screw to increase the cage/cassette clearance. Shifts fine with 9 speed indexing.
You CANNOT use your existing "10-speed" rear derailleur with an 11-speed cassette. The cable pull was lengthened by Shimano between 10-speed -> 11-speed. (NOTE: your "10-speed" rear derailleur is really a 10/9/8-speed derailleur as the "speed" is determined by your shifters, not the derailleur).
[NOTE2: 10-speed 4700 Tiagra uses the new longer cable pull and isn't compatible with previous 10-speed shifters/derailleurs]
Genius
Can you do fat bikes videos?
A 10 speed free hub body will work with an 11 speed cassette I swapped cassette and derailleur on mine.
I guess your chainline is slightly out and then the lockring thread may give way any time soon....…. cheers!!!
@@electricsky7194
He may be talking about an MTB freehub body or the standard 8/9/10 body rather than the 1mm narrower version made for road 10spd.
cool cool cool
I have an 7900 Dura Ace and 7800 Dura Ace rear hubs. What is the best way to upgrade both to 11 speeds? Thanks to everyone who take the time to answer me.
One more thing: Has somebody tries to install an free hub body of Ultegra 6800 in 7900/7800 Dura Ace hubs? Is that posible or the internal mechanism of the bodys is not compatible?
Ask Shimano if an 11 speed freehub can be installed.
I have a 16-25 cassette on at the moment but I need to give it back as a spare I have a 16-27 11 speed cassette. Could I just swap the cassettes and take the 27 away from the new one?
are both cassettes 11 sp? or you want to put the 16-27 11 speed cassette on in place of a 16-27 10 speed cassette?
I want to put the 16-27 (11 speed) in place of the 16-25). I don't want to mess around with indexing so wanted to just take the 27 away from the 11 speed cassette and make it a 10 spd.
If both cassettes are 11 then thats fine. Assuming the 27 ring/cog is individual you can remove it and make it into a 10. But you need to do two things. You will need another spacer at back of 16-27 and you will need to adjust your (largest cog) limit screw.
The 16-27 is 11 and the 16-25 is 10, I just want to take one cog out of the 16-27 to make it only have 10 cogs
hmm I doubt this will work, at least not smoothly
How about the other way, can I put 9 speed cassette on 10/11 road hubs?
yes, use spacer.
TOTALLY DISAGREE that removing the 11T cog from an 11-speed cassette to fit a 8/9/10-speed body is a bad choice. If 11T is so "mandatory" why does Shimano and SRAM offer so many 12T-* 10-speed cassettes.
The "NEED" for 11T is such a myth for non-competition cyclists. 100 RPM cadence even with 50T-12T gives a speed above what the majority (ie. >50%) need. Tuck instead. Needing to brake + accelerate into/out from switchbacks on the descent also prevent you from being fast enough to spinning out 50T-12T. Giving up mid-range flat-land / rolling hills gearing is often a poor choice.
Cos pussies run 12up casettes 11-23/25 is whats needed
10speed is more than enough unless youre in the TDF.....then just worry about one's EPO source.
I where can I get a mavic freehub for a campy 10 speed casette to install on an aluminum mavic cosmic wheel (1995-1999)
Above send ans to louk@dawsoncollege.qc.ca
Will Campy 10 speed shifters work with an 11 speed cassette? Will the campy 10 speed rear derailleur work with an 11 speed cassette?
Very unlikely to work smoothly. see nice article on this here: cyclingtips.com/2014/10/mixing-groupsets-what-works-together-and-what-doesnt/
This video is clearly inspired by the movie Spinal Tap. The speed is set to 11.
Although I read the description very carefully, I do not understand it.
I have a question I'm hoping you can help with. On my road bike, I have one (Easton) rear wheel, among several Easton rear wheels, that when I shift into the biggest cog, the Dura Ace derailleur cage touches the spokes. I don't want to adjust my limit screw because that will adversely affect the shifting limit in my other wheels when I change wheels. My derailleur is not bent, nor is my hanger. The wheel is properly dished too. All my wheels are Easton with either the R4 or R4s hub. The freehub body are all specific 11-speed.
Why would my rear derailleur touch the spokes on one specific rear wheel? Thanks for your assistance it's appreciated.
I am guessing the RD only touches during the shift phase? During the shift the RD actually travels slightly further than the large cog in order to pull the chain over (unless you block this with the limit screw). With an 11sp system the gap between the end of the cassette and hub flange is only 6.9mm. This leaves little room for the spokes. If I am correct you may have too small a gap on one wheel due to the spoke path on that wheel. IMHO your best bet is a tiny spacer (or additional spacer) eg 0.5mm or 0.25mm behind the cassette. Are you changing wheels & cassettes or swapping one cassette betw wheel changes?
You might have a bent derailer hanger....
Wer in locatin sir?renseth
Is it possible to place an 11s cassette into an 8s hub.?
Yes, you can. First, for shimano, 8s, 9s, and 10s freehubs are identical (in nearly all cases). So to get an 11s drivetrain to work with one of those 8/9/10s rear hubs, just follow one of the options here: darkspeedworks.com/blog-11speed.htm
11 speed 11-34 cassette working perfectly on 8/9/10 freehub body.
I think I know the answer but I will ask anyways. Is mt bike wheel and cassette under same rule?
For Shimano mountain cassettes, there is no difference in freehub body depth between 10 and 11 speed.
And Shimano's 11 speed mountain cassettes fit onto 10spd freehubs because Shimano is awesome.
wouldn't you need to reddish the wheel?
No not needed, but good question.
Fastfitnesstips
in some cases you might
www.boydcycling.com/11-speed-faq/
www.hedcycling.com/11-speed-conversion/
shouldn't be that hard anyway.
Can I convert 7 cassette to 10
Sheldon Brown's says "7-speed hubs only accept 7-speed cassettes --though 8 or 9 sprockets can be installed on a 7-speed hub, using 9- or 10-speed spacing. It is also possible to transplant an 8- 9- 10-speed cassette body onto most 7-speed Freehubs."
Wait, what is the point of taking out a ring of an 11 speed cassette to make it 10 speed? At that point, you might as well use a 10 speed cassette.
Some have had success swapping a 10 speed shimano freehub for a campy freehub if the manufacturer makes that but does not make a shimano 11 speed freehub for the given wheel. Then, as you suggest, you can run a campy 11 speed cassette with a shimano drivetrain with minimal issues.
Also SRAM Red 1190 cassette is not Ti, it's steel except for the granny ring whic is Alu. DA uses Ti in the larger cogs.
"Wait, what is the point of taking out a ring of an 11 speed cassette to make it 10 speed? At that point, you might as well use a 10 speed cassette" The 10sp will not work correctly due to 11sp indexing on the bike especially in the shimano 10sp which is actually smaller than shimano 9! re SRAM 1190 thanks for info, was not aware of that!
This technique is for those that already have 11-speed shifters. Those won't work with normal 10-speed cassette spacing.
It is also a good approach for junior racers who buy new bikes that won't meet the roll-out restrictions regulations. They already have to "block out" the 11T-13T cogs. So loosing one of those cogs and being able to buy NICE HED/Zip/Edge/etc.. wheels on the cheep is advantageous.
Can't you just buy a 11s cassette that's compatible with 10s hub?
only 11-34 is compatible without any adjustment. at the first place your chain and rear derailleur have to be long enough to accommodate the largest cog.
just like 1997 Ritchey OCR system....
Here with an 8 speed...
Taking out a ring from the cassette means you dont have 11 speed , you may aswell buy a 10 speed cassette with a different range .
Great info but you talk super fast like you sped up the sound on your video.
11:00 the solution for 300$
3 minutes to get to it?????
11s road cassete*
what are you talking about
TRIGGER WARNING TO HIPSTER FIXIE RIDERS
It's pronounced CAM-pan-YO-lo. No hard G.
You speak so fast
Are you Scatman John? Slow down mate..
#3.... NO.... You will spend as much $$$ as just buying a proper free hub..
Did you take your medicine before doing the shoot 😂
I borrowed yours, does that count? 😂
Cam paG no lo......hahaha. So you won’t sound like a muppet it’s pronounced something like Campanyolo. You’re welcome, my pleasure :)
Lay off the stims. Don't piss in a cup until it's out of your system.
Damn you need to get straight to the point. Too much run around in the intro. Great video, but waste of time at first.