The LS7 Valve Issue Strikes Again... | RPM S7 E42
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- Опубліковано 3 вер 2019
- On Today's Episode of the RPM Web Series, we tear down a C6 Z06 that was the victim of the notorious valve guide valve issues.
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Internet: There's no Ls7 valve problem
RPM: YOU GON LEARN TODAY!
The Internet is who let me know about the LS7 valve problem..
bliglum Lots of ignorant deniers on the interwebs these days
Toilet motors
Iandiorio1 no. Just shitty valve guides. Best motor GM has ever made. Therefore best engine ever made.
@@Iandiorio1 I wouldn't go that far. After all they're not those garbage Ford Triton motors.
I think it was caused by those grand sport stripes... on a Z06 :-p
They look like shit big time!
The hash stripes were first on the Ron Fellows edition Z06. Not exclusive to GS.
cyberspectre that’s not a Ron fellows edition. Those are white.
recently purchased the h/c/i longtubes package from you guys, 140k on my ls7 and it's still running strong, pulled everything off and it was still in great shape, done taking chances though!
FRAN YOU CAME A LONG TO BUILD THIS UA-cam CHANEL YOUR 1 OF THE BEST IN CAR TUNING
This is easily my favorite show. Hands down might as well put this shit on cable.
No wonder the vid was late, you had to edit in the "kapows" and "kablams"! Good job, sir!
love this shop, love the truth! so glad this shop is doing work on my car, HEY RPM, do you guys work on Vipers too?
It's so satisfying to see Eric bring that C6Z back from the dead. :)
I love your channel keep up the great content!!
Great footage big RPM fan
Unfortunately my 07 c6z just had the same issue with 50k miles on it. Soon to be a 700hp beast!
Curious to know if your vette was stock when you ran into this issue?
Next time show Frank the FedEx man!
I think it’s time for me to make an appointment. I’m always worried about this happening to my 2008 Z06 . Original owner completely stock with 15k on it .
Man looks like it was still climbing in power 🤘
Great job
Glad mine are fixed
Hi, do all LS engines require lash caps and if so on which rocker do you install the lash caps on? All the rockers or just the intake side or exhaust side?
Perfect vid for dinner time
That kind of break in an area of the valve stem where the end of the valve guide would be with the valve closed would suggest side forces being applied to the valve. It would seem to me that the head had not been machined properly, where the valve seat insert was not concentric with the valve stem. Any engine builder worth his salt should have discovered this in doing the final valve lapping where he would have seen a non uniform dye ring on the valve seat. Being at higher temperature and being a weaker hollow sodium-filled valve, I would expect the exhaust valve to fail.
I guess this is one of the reasons you could get such a high performance car for such little money, relative to those hyper expensive European sports cars. This is one of the reasons that I went with a Japanese-made Nissan 370Z a couple of years ago when I was in the market for a new sports car. I had considered getting a new gen III Coyote engine Mustang GT, but changed my mind when I saw the shoddy quality control on those engines and transmissions and all the problems people were having and then being jerked around by Ford corporate. I don't think that either Ford or GM are that much different in their manufacturing philosophy, in the words of Lee Iacocca: "Ship the *hit", in response to a question about a QA production issue on one of their cars.
i work at a Chevy dealership ls7 sodium filled valves drop like candy :-( did so many
One of my favorite parts are the dyno conversations 💥
That a&a kit with head cam package seems like it’s getting more popular. Have you guys considered putting together a stage 4 z06 package with all the incidentals to add the blower to the h/c/i package like a one stop shop? (e.g. radiator, fuel upgrades, meth kit) (obviously clutch would be needed but could be priced separated due to consumer choice) As usual, keep up the great vids.
Lol, I’m watching Fran tune the Camaro and my girlfriend walks by the tv and says “I like him since I saw him with his girlfriend”. Hope she don’t think I’m buying her a race car. 🤦🏼♂️
That Z06 was not only a victim of dropping a valve, it was a victim of bad taste....AKA, grand sport stripes...😩
🤣🤣🤣 that's my car! it was a bad call on my part! I'll be removing them after picking up the car on Friday!
SF 475 how many miles on the car?
Lift N' Shift we say in the video ..
23000 miles
Over 20k with the new clutch and short throw shifter..... I bought a warranty with the car from dealership in Phoenixville p.a they renigged on the warranty and never told me. I thought I was protected until the motor blew and found out they screw me over! I called a few lawyers cant find one that will take the case yet.
That’s what you get with an aluminum block. My old man had a SBC 383 striker that lived in a few different bodies. It dropped a valve once, destroyed the head, piston, bent the rod, tweaked the crank a bit too. Block was fine. Honed the cylinders and it lived on for several more years.
I have a feeling that the majority of valves that are dropping are in cars that are getting hammered on pretty good. Yes I know these are the hi performance GM cars but if you thrash anything eventually something is going to break.
LT4’s have the same junk hollow stem valves that break off. Just did a long block in my 2017 C7Z with 5k miles full bolt on car. $25k later with a lF1a-94 because of a failed exhaust valve. I’m sure there will be more lt4’s having same issues unfortunately.
My LS motor in my 2014 Camaro SS seized up , so I'm just going to swap a used motor because the engine repair shops I've looked into have too many complains and I cannot find a good engine rebuilt shop in the NJ / PA area
LOL at Steve mocking the internet idiots at @4:55!!
What's you guys occupation called ? How is that not the best job ever on Earth ?
How many C6Z’s with dropped valves have come through your shop? Any idea? Seems no one can put a number to the problem. One thing for sure, even if it only 1/10th a percent... it sucks if you’re the 1 out a thousand that it happens too...
I cracked the block in mine too.
Hey if anyone sees this id like to know about adding to my oem fuel system on my 06Z. My eforce with small pulley is not getting enough fuel.
Any chance you can set me up with the right fuel system combo maybe install and tune my brand new LS7?
So when you change the engine block, do you need to update anything with the DMV? (Here in Aus our 'DMV' records engine numbers and VINs, is it the same in the US?)
Not that im aware of
Ls6 cam bolts Happened to me on a stock 25k lemans z06 😢😢
As much as I would love a C6Z06, I can't do it because of this. It will be a C6 grand sport for me.
Have you guys heard of Reworked heads or aftermarket heads failing??
Also he needs a catch can that intake manifold was nasty.
Man I haven’t seen Zeus in a minute!
GM should be taking care of the valve problem not the customers
GM did actually issue a repair protocol for these, but only for a certain period of time. Most if the time it happens when you spin the living shit outa them & let it bounce on the limiter.....
Robert Hachten Happens stock off the limiter all of the time. Guides go out of spec in 10,000 mile intervals on these things
I always been a GM fan but they be fucking up lately the 5.3LM truck engines that have cylinder deactivation are piles of shit just google 5.3 DOD fix and read the horror stories.
The last LS7 in a Vette was 2013. Z/28 was 2015. You’re sol now. Only a couple grand for new heads if you bite the bullet before you have to drop 15+ on a new motor.
Why not take care of BOTH?
Ive really been thinking of getting a z06 but after seeing this multiple times, I think im leaning toward a grandsport
Scared me in to buying a grandsport and eventually put a supercharger on it.
It aint hard to fix this issue tbh. 1 set of heads or get yours reworked and its fixed for good
True but i didnt want to do this when i just bought the car and didnt have a grand or more to do this@@Shadow0fd3ath24
What happened to the guy that worked on the end lift? Haven’t seen him in awhile
im just learning about this problem and unfortunately the hard way. so what now? i was driving 09 z06 everything fine then boom@!! lotta white smoke total chaos on the dash lights wtf. got it to the dealer and they say blown new motor needed? huh take it for second opinion guy says blown new motor. that's like $20k right? so the car sits in driveway looking sad.im in california where can i take it?
Man the video makes me very nervous driving my z06 around , even with the heads "fixed".
There's a chance you might get abducted by UFO before your valve drop it's bullshit they focus on it because people are modifying their cars if it happens to five people out of 5000 they make a big deal out of it because it's a ZO6 I have a 2006 ZO6 I love it I ain't touching it it's good the way it is.
@@richardcerritelli9657 We do hope you're making the right decision. You're bank account is hoping so, too!!
If it’s been fixed you shouldn’t have that problem.
so does the piston push the broken exhaust valve back into the intake manifold, im just wondering how it got back up there, forgive my ignorance on this
And how did it get past the intake valve!?
That's probably the most reliable Ferrari in the world
I'm really surprised being Chevy's pride and joy sports car they didn't recall the heads on them!
How many miles do the get before the valves drop?
Just changing the cam is beginning of problems . Heavy roller lifters , no upgrades to valve control , hiflow ex , all will happen again not if but when !
Did you guys replace the intake manifold on that blue z06? Id feel a little nervous even after cleaning the metal out
We discuss and show that that in the video
RaceProvenMotorsports I guess I missed that
Was it only LS6's that had the cam bolt issue or did LS1'S have that problem as well?
Greygoose c5 both
How much is it correct the heads?
Never in a million years would I ever send my car to a shop dirty. outside, inside, engine bay, hell door jambs and trunk. it's embarrassing. The amount of dirty cars i see at just this shop is disgraceful.
thats cause these guys work their ass off they don't live with their moms. But also the friggin weather and the roads around this are are filthy.
Well I can afford to do that! I'll give you a couple bucks you can come clean it for me!!
i think dirt was the least of his worries
I hope the dry sump tank was cleaned out and new oil lines used.
It’s not our first rodeo.
@@RaceProvenMotorsports Glad to hear this was done, but I didn't recall it mentioned in vid, which could be helpful to those unfortunate LS7 owners that have a similar situation.
18:18
What I´ve heard and been told (and hoping for since I´m a LS7 owner) is that this normally doesn´t happen unless you overrev the engine. So guys race it and get in second in instead of 4th... and then piston and valve slightly touch and after that, the valve can let go anytime.
Well it could also happen from over camming the spring rate too
You’ve been told wrong.
@@RaceProvenMotorsports Ok, so they just drop valves with no pre-indication at all? Is it the retainers? If the valve guides are really that bad.. would´nt it start consuming oil and smoke alot as an indication? I´m guessing it´s a good reason to take it apart and do some tuning meanwhile anyway :D
Mine and many others dropped a valve while cruising down the road
@@RaceProvenMotorsports So why exactly does it happen?
Those 01 and 02 c5 z06 had the valve spring issue didn't know about the LS7.
Its not valve spring problem in the LS7's. It is a combination of valve guides, the types of valves and probably the 1.8 ratio rocker geometry. The guides wear until there is so much side play, the valve snaps off.
Can yall reset the odometer when you put a new engine in or do yall have to leave at what it is?
Facepalm
Yup you can. I roll my odo back everytime I change the windshield wipers too.
It's a Federal crime to reset odometers.
Badass Z06.
Anyone else only see Magnetos helmet in Eric's hair?
I don't know why the valve issue on c6 z's was never a recall.
Damn !!!! The Valve Issue Is Dumb Real !!!!!
Didn’t know a different short block would cause a 30-40hp loss! I know OEM is lighter but jeez!
No one ever said 30-40 whp you’re comparing a mamo ported msd Heads Cam numbers. This has stock intake manifold so 6-8whp max.
Two of my five brand new Corvettes turned out to be Lemons & the last one, my 2013 427, was THEE last Corvette I'll ever purchase! THEY ARE JUNK which is why they sell them so cheap compared to other high performance cars. My first Corvette lemon, a 2007, was an electrical issue but the 427 was an electrical AND engine failure! You couldn't pay me to ever buy another Vette!
It looks like either valve springs or keepers was not up for the rpm range
The valve stem broke
some people started a class action lawsuit against GM for this problem. I dont think it went anywhere thou
GM's lawyers are numerous and VERY powerful. Things don't go well against them unless many people are dying, and this issue isn't killing people, just killing people's bank accounts, but that's OKAY! Because that's capitalism baby!
@@bliglum I agree. To bad, one of the best motors GM created and it has a fatal flaw. Every one of these engines is a ticking time bomb. I may be biased because having first hand experience with this.
@@nuckleheadzgarage8360 I heard that man.. I've been doing well financially, recently, and was looking at the C6 Z06 as the best performance value (as I'm still somewhat frugal).. But DAMN!! They're known for dropping valves and grenading... Son of a BITCH!!
@@bliglum so even with a aftermarket head/cam it still grenades?
@@downtowndaniels9238 Good question.. Sort of looking at one right now with aftermarket heads/cam for sale.
GM should be absolutely ashamed of themselves. Till this day GM says nothings wrong with the LS7.
Why I am still happy with my LS2
Whats the difference between a short block and a long block? I mean, the obvious of course but why do people choose one over the other? I always wondered
Short block is just block and rotating assembly. Long block is complete intake to pan and ready to drop in and go.
I love it my guys rpm keep up the work and love video 💯💯💯💯💯💯👍 me Chevy gang all day for life true
What cam did you use to get 594hp.....
Our RPM B-3 all mods are listed at 19:11
Ugh, this scares me. I just picked up an 06 Z this fall with 17,500 miles and I don’t want this to happen....but I also don’t want to bring the car to just any shop and have the valves and valve guides done.....damn I wish RPM was closer 😭
Just a shipping company away. We do it all day everyday
@@RaceProvenMotorsports - lol ya, not super wanting to spend $2,800 on shipping though....at least not right now. I’d rather be able to stick that into the car itself.
Nick Kruger ok
4 or 5 k for a valve replacement job ? Did I hear that correctly ?
Paul Letchworth there’s cheaper options..
Paul Letchworth it’s the quality of the valves they use. Well the labor is no joke also.
You’re better off with just complete aftermarket ported and milled heads
If your going get hit with a 5k valve job... you might wanna think about dropping a crate in at that point and say fuck it.
I think he meant it as since the new motor is getting heads/cam package it's 4-5k just that package instead of whole new block plus heads/cam package. I think, I could be wrong but that's how I took it as
Hmm my 57 fuelinjection 65 396 425 65. 327 fuelinjection 67 winters 427 corvettes never spit a valve and grandad drove the shit out of them when he raced them and I own them and still push them .. whats deal with the newer engines? Can't cut it ?
Anyone else wonder what Fran is always doing on his phone lol
Craigslist for banshees and other shit
Has the z28 engines suffered the same problems?
Yes
Hollow stem sodium filled valves? Ah. They be perfectly fine.
Every $5 purchase on the RPM website gets you an entry into winning a busted-a$$ valve! Hurry...while supplies last!
Does this happen with the Z28s also??
Yes
Do these guys get paid hourly or by the job ?
While the LS7 valve issue is real... the percentage of LS7's which have experienced the issue is relatively low when compared to the total amount of LS7's currently on the road. With that said... My ZO6 has an appointment with Katech Monday morning. It's at 55K miles so I've pressed my luck far enough I think.
I have a 09 with the same mileage. I do have a warranty for another 1.5 years. Not sure what to do here.
can you guys please throw some prices up there . if someone brings in a c6z and needs the heads fixed , whats the cost? Some ballpark figures.
Can we see some street tuning with you and fran .
No, because people just get hung up on price then vs the work being done. And besides all of our prices are on our website for people who actually want to get work done.
@@RaceProvenMotorsports okay , thank you . Im trying to get my friend to have his heads done before he drops a valve .
Does GM have a bulletin to repair these under warranty?
Pretty sure anyone with a C6 Z06 is well past their warranty.
No. They admitted the issue and had a bulletin describing the testing procedure, but never proactively repaired.
@@TheFi1thyCasual I meant while they still had the warranty.
You never know 😄
why wont fram tune a ls1 car? he used to so why not do them ?
That valve problem is just for the ls7's exclusively?
Yeah. LS3's have a different head design. Valve guides are too loose causing the valves to wiggle and wear to the point the break off into the engine.
Not to mention rod bearing failure
Wow!! Fran actually has a white shirt???!! Lol
So I take It that it's just the ls7 that had this issue? And does that mean the z28 camaro with the ls7 had this same issue?
Yes all LS7s
Hi, Bad Case Of TOO Much Right Foot ! Missed A Shift ? How High RPM Was It Turning ? Hey Watch This ,,,, Rev ! WHAM !!!!!
Yea right? I would like to see a data log on that engine... valve guides break when a valve is bent can you say valve float? Check other valves for stem damage from valve float. Ooo that rev limiter sounds cool... BAM!
Nope I was cruising between 80 85 and I dont beat on my cars! The highest I ever took the rpm on this car was in the 5k range. That's once in a while!
@@369motoman Quite a few stock motors have dropped valves while turning 2,000-2,500 RPM cruising on the freeway. These are facts. There IS a HUGE problem with these. Why do you think this engine is no longer in a production car?
Can I have the zo6 block for my 280z?
The block and sleeve were broken
@@darrylmerriman8831 I know
Texas speed making bank...$$$$$....lol
Damn RIP LS7
Guys, can you give me an idea how much power im leaving on the table using stock catted ls7 manifolds with a h/c z06 that has the b3 cam, cai, msd intake with 102tb and stock exhaust. Thanks
Brutality110 atleast 30hp
Mine picked up 60whp adding Corsa cold air and Kooks 2" catless with stock mufflers. Car had LME heads and custom road race grind cam before cold air and exhaust upgrade made 510 whp and 470wtq. After made 570whp and 515wtq.
Who the hell would do all those mods and leave the stock manifolds and cats on it??? My guess is 60+ with all those other mods already done.
@@ssoffshore5111 when you are on a budget. But knowing heads need to be first but while you have heads off might as well do cam. That was my dilemma so I did heads cam. The next month did headers and cold air. If not for head issue would probably done only cold air and headers.
Thanks. Mainly had stock manifolds due to concerns of engine bay heat but will be putting on tsp 1 7/8 longtubes soon. Motor mounts also seem bad so putting poly mounts also while exhaust is out of the way.
How did the valve end up in the manifold
That's what I'm saying. Crazy. I guess it went out through the intake valve?
Path of least resistance, other cylinders pulling vacuum sucked the exhaust valve into the intake
Once the valves snapped off, there was a direct path back to the intake, all those loose pieces were being hit by the rotating assembly. Launched a bunch of junk in all directions, including up into the intake manifold.
@@gregd6404 So when one drops does the whole catastrophe break the head off the adjacent valve? Seems obvious now
What causes the valve issue? Valve float?
Loose valve guides causes the valve stem to wear and break.
@Toob247 Toob247 well a hollow tube is stronger and more rigid than a solid tube.
Vararam intake on that Z06 was a massive waste of money.
The reason I no longer have my C6Z. Great car ruined by GM's refusal to recall the LS7. I wasn't keeping that mofo and fixing their mistake on my dime.
G.arbage M.otors smh
Every car has a flaw. Who doesn’t do heads and cam on a C6Z anyway...
@@isiahgomez6860 Every car doesn't have a flaw that eventually takes out your engine. GM should've recalled the LS7. There's no way to defend that.
mdmoore23 guys like me really don’t care because we modify LS engines so warranty is out the window. And all performance cars do have a flaw doesn’t matter if it’s a engine or transmission, flaw is a flaw. Name a performance car with 0 flaws
I don’t get ppl who wanna go fast but cry about warranty go get a Hyundai Veloster, they have 100,000 mile warranty lmao
So before I go drop 3-5 grand on a head swap on my 07 z06, is there any ACTUAL way of testing my valve guides? I would enjoy some reassurance that my LS7 isn't affected by this issue, I also would rather not drop a few thousand on something that doesn't NEED to be done(in case my valve guides are healthy).
-Thanks for all the videos, they're always very informative and entertaining, keep up the good work
it is inevitable... it was also mentioned numerous times throughout the video that it can happen at anytime. In other words no test no warning.
If you like the way your car drives stock just do the heads. It's worth the $3000.
Google the GM Wiggle Test. Its not easy to perform. Will cost $400 -500 for a quality mechanic to perform. It can easily be done incorrectly. Honestly, youre better off putting that money towards having your heads rebuilt or replaced.
There not all bad I've got an 2007z06 works like a charm, do a wiggle test ,listen to it ,and just drive it ,personally I don't know one person that has the problem, maybe the ones that drive the shit out of them ,just have your mechanic take the value covers off and check if your paying someone 500hundred dollars to do that u have the wrong mechanic ,if there was a big problem Gm would have a recall,there all nuts
What year? I heard it was certain years
All LS7. 06-15
Poor Z06 :(
I wonder if there’s a way to put that as a claim with insurance.
Nope
Chris Cahill “pothole cracked my oil pan” 😂
Lift N' Shift well, that would work if you have the balls lol
how much horsepower was it pushing ?
It was stock...
@@RaceProvenMotorsports road hard damn
No. They all break
Maybe people will stop believing everything the internet says. Being lucky is just that. Luck. But when that runs out. Well you see what happened to his engine. At least with his TSP engine he'll have plenty of room down the road for forced induction.
how common are those issues
As common as an LS7
It's not that I don't want to do my heads on my 07 Z06 it's that I can't afford it. So do I just park it dreaming that some day I get rich and can afford? So much stress! I love driving my car.
If you cant afford that what will you do if the motor goes?? Maybe trade it in
@@sf4756 I really don't know. It's got 38,000 on it and I just pray every time I drive it.