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It actually amuses me that a man who dwells in 40k nightmare fuel, proprietor of Grimdark Story Hour, gets this sponsorship. I guess when you lie awake pondering horrors beyond imagination, best do it on comfy mattress 😂
"Right, so everything in this millenium is fucked. What even is the date?" "I believe that would be heresy, my lord" "Excuse you?" "The subject of the current imperial date is heresy. The respective ordo chronos is having an entire civil war over it" "The fucking WHAT!!?"
Rob Gorillaman: "... Fuck this "Inquisition"! How and why does it even exist?!!!" Golden Tampon: "I believe that's also heresy, my lord." Rob Gorillaman: ".....................................??" *twitch* Golden Tampon: "The Ordo Originatus and the Ordo Redactus are currently trying to..." Rob Gorillaman: *HAS A STROKE*
@@twisteddazeThere are a lot of video games in very different genres that are in Warhammer 40k universe, and they are entirely different from the tabletop game. The most recent examples are Space Marine 2, a 3rd person action game, and Rogue Trader, an RPG game.
I want to play it but those models are stupid expensive and the local game shop has waaaaaay too many sweaty neckbeard stereotypes. When that last chick left you knew there were too many of them 😂
IIRC there was a loyalist Imperial Knights House that was suddenly attacked by Space Marines accusing them of being traitors. They fled into the Warp, turned to Chaos, then returned to real space looking for revenge. A temporal anomaly meant they reappeared before they had been attacked, and their ‘revenge’ was what triggered the Space Marine’s attack in the first place!
@@T57Custodian Irrelevant. While SOMETHING must have caused the Knights to turn traitor and enter the Warp, it no longer happened. It’s been erased, replaced with a self-sustaining loop that doesn’t need those original events
@@T57Custodian bootstrap paradox relies on the implication that time has a single reference frame in the "present" when that's a complete illusion. The loop is self-sustaining, it needs no beginning, only a point that intersects another timeline
My theory: Malcador after leaving the throne reincarnated in the late 1950's and knowing what the future holds formed an organization called GW where he play tests his future plans to hopefully prevent the future there is now. This ordo is serving to update malcador with the changes in the future based on his playtesting in the present. This is bat shit but find it fun.
@annfranknthatic Luetin did fairly comprehensive one, and MajorKill did a speed run version. There are few other people have done them as well. More perspectives are good though.
Hypothetical: It isn't 2 Order Chronos, but rather 2 wings of it. One wing was returned to the timeline to keep up with records and to correct the negative effects of them being gone in the day to day and removes all confusion of them disappearing, which likely was a problem they confronted. The other corrects issues from a more severe scale, but with precise points in the timeline.
There's multiple factions, but primarily two. The first is the one established to "help" the Imperium, the other, after realizing there is a necessary path existence must follow to avoid temporal paradoxes, holds to a more subtle approach.
@@309freddie It might even be that one side doesn't like the other anymore BECAUSE of said paradoxes. Kind of like their version of the typical Inquisitorial morality scale.
@@mediumsurmoon6283 Now call me paranoid but I have my suspicions that the holy and auspicious Ordo Nlyfans may have been infiltrated and corrupted by agents of she who thirsts
Hey Wes, I just wanted to say thanks so much for making the videos! I used to paint and play 40k with my dad back when I was 10. I haven’t touched the figures or any books in over 10 years. I just randomly stumbled on one of your videos, and I have been bingeing them ever since. Thank you for bringing me back to the fandom!
36:21 The hollow sun bit is interesting as its a necron tomb world inside a stars core and one of its cryptek cronomancer rahkoz is really good at manipulating time and the hollow sun is located in jerichos reach and something or someone is messing with rahkozs time manipulation so that might be related to this.
Given the extra-temporal nature of Ordo Chronos, it's possible the ones who were directing the Legion of Damned were the Ordo in the future. Thus the past Ordo were investigating themselves.
Wait even Guilliman didn't ask where the hell they've been? If that's the case then the only people who probably know that they even still exist are probably chaos factions and maybe Bellisarius Cawl. Which doesn't even say anything about the Necrons. They probably observe everything. In fact I'm pretty sure one of their tomb lords can actually travel through time and I think he's like the arch nemesis of Trazyn the Infinite. But Trazyn is so smart and crafty that he reacts and ruins the other guy's time traveling plans before they can do anything.
Necrons are aware enough to not adjust the timeline to serve their own personal needs. To do so is to invite self-annilation. Moving things in time is like transfering a spiderwab without destroying it.
@@309freddie Yea considering the Necrons are effectively immortal they need to plan a fair bit forward, IMO its also the reason that that they are VERY hesitant to use the Celestial Orrery.
IMO they hadn't disappeared when Guilliman went into stasis and were back before he woke up. Or he just made a new Orda Chronos when he found out nobody was keeping track of time fluctuations.
I already know there have been time travel shenanigans in Warhammer 40K. I remember a Dark age tech ship arriving to the 40th millennium. That was hilarious when the ship AI berated the Tech preists trying to appease her with oils and dances. Ther was also another occasion when a team of Sisters of battle that found a time displaced ship that was both brand new and millions of years old and it had a flesh pit of psykers and a future version of one of the SOB's present on the ship trying to warn of a future calamity by talking through the psykers, but the past SOB burned the flesh pit before the message could be relayed. And then later it was changed to Sister of silence doing the same thing. And then it flipped again. I think the Ordo Chronos is changing things over and over.
I'm pretty sure the SoB psychic fleshball was from the Daemonifuge comic line that details the backstory of Ephreal Stern and how she got hectic anti-Chaos psychic powers. The fleshball sacrificed itself and transferred its collective psychic powers and soul energy to Stern. The one that was made from Silent Sisters was during the Heresy, where the fleshball manipulated events to warn a squad of Silent Sisters sent to investigate it about the future danger of the Horus Heresy. Realizing that the fleshball was talking with the voice of one of her subordinates, the Sister captain executed the subordinate in question and this retconned the fleshball from existing.
@@fadelsukoco3092 No no, it wasnt the Demonifuge, i read this in an actual novel not a comic. And that whole thing with the sisters silence, it was SOB's first and then it was changed to Sisters of silence. The retconn was retconned! XD
@@antcow1239 Then they were still different events that had to have happened in different books, since the example with the Silent Sisters is before the Heresy and the Sororitas didn't exist until the Age of Apostasy.
I loved your Perdition's flame video. I was really exasperated with that inquisitor. She can't accept that the ship and its people were truly overrun, that they'd done everything they could to "do their jobs" as she put it so angrily. Her forces were bested in an honest fight with a ton of angry pox walkers. The last survivors on that ship are not to blame.
It's a good parable on the dangers of becoming too focused on the inquisition immediate goal and not thinking of the impact that goal could have to the established timeline.
One of your best videos ever. I have read several different books of 40k now and I still feel like I have to come to these just to have an educational background to understand what I have read. Until this video I don't ever recall hearing of the order chronos. Yet I was sucked in and couldn't stop listening. Your definitely getting to be one of the better story tellers out there. Thank you for what your doing.
The last time I watched a video where a youtuber pieced together random bits of information from a lore and current pov ended up nailing the next part of the story.
I love all the Inquisition's more esoteric Ordos, they truly do not get enough of the spotlight. Stoked to hear you're gonna cover the Legion of the Damned, can't wait!!
This is easily one of the most intriguing warhammer mysteries I have ever watched ! Great job on putting all of this together and re-telling it in a very engaging way !
That is a good way to ensure that the branding does not break.... "No sire, it turned out its not the 41k now, it was 800 years earlier than we thought!" - It will stay stay 40k forever!" ....
A mystery of hundreds of years - of course the warp can play havoc with time and sometimes ships show up hundreds of years after they were scheduled. OOO - Not an accident? Oh I love your shows as you always bring up the things we often miss or hadn't realized might be important. I remember that story where the the ship was victim because of what the inquisitor brought aboard. The Ship officer and the man imprisoned on the way to face trial. You narrated that story for us last year. It was great!
It’s been a while since I’ve felt genuine oooo and aaaaa about 40K. I’ve been in it so long the grimdark isn’t as captivating as it used to be for me. But stories like these remind me just how deep this universe is and you did a great job bringing it to life! Ave Imperator!
The "Chronostrife" is just clerks not knowing how to interpret confusing, heavily redacted mission reports: Inquisitor 1: Planet Helios IV destroyed by asteroid impact, year 634 m34. Inquisitor 2: Asteroid destroyed, Planet Helios IV destroyed by Ork invasion, year 845 m34. Inquisitor 3: Invasion repulsed, Planet Helios IV destroyed by Exterminatus, year 298 M35. Clerk 1: "What are they doing?" Clerk 2: "Arguing about history, I guess. What a bunch of idiots. Helios IV was never destroyed, I was born there!"
Chronostrife happened because in humanity's ancient past the Unified Realm of Merica never learned to use the 24 hour clock. Over 38,000 years the error introduced by occasionally forgetting to wind their watches means there's now a 2,000 year uncertainty in the actual date.
Thank you Sir! I feel like this presentation goes from the level of sharing lore in a high quality way to finding/creating lore that is beyond a well crafted fan theory. Impressive work.
I love luetin's video essay format for when I want in depth deep dives. I love Wes for small 20 min videos to update my missing lore. That being said if Wes does make hour long video essays I'll listen :)
I think the ordo cronos messing with time makes perfect sense. plus it would be the perfect in canon explanation of all the random retconning games workshop liked to do with the canon and factions
14:27 - I had a thought I sometimes considered when it comes to Tyranids and their effect on humanity if they somehow showed up at an earlier point in time. A story which I thought Warhammer could play around with would be "what if a Gene stealer actually created a cult during the time humanity first appeared on earth?". They could make a story about how every living human in the universe has descended from a single Gene Stealer cult. I know teranids are connected to a hive mind, but from what I'm aware Gene stealers have the ability to cut themselves off from the hivemind to better perform their task. It would be interesting if there was a story about a Gene stealer cutting it's connection to the hive mind, going back in time and slowly cultivating humanity to allow them to grow and expand throughout the galaxy so the overall teranids fleet could eventually come to the galaxy and acquire more bio-mass in the year 40k. Perhaps because the Gene Stealer is sent back in time, after building up humanity a bit it decided to try and reconnect to the hivemind, but as the Gene Stealer is not from this point in time the Hive Mind sees this particular Gene Stealer as a foreign body and doesn't allow it to reconnect with the hivemind. Now because the Gene Stealer is permanently disconnected it no longer is influenced by the hive mind it becomes it's own individual allowing it to make its own decision. Now perhaps instead of using humanity as a food source, it uses humanity for its own needs and prepares them for an invasion from the Tyranids in the future. Then maybe in the year 40k people learn of this information and falsely begin to suspect the god emperor himself is a Gene Stealer. Which could maybe work because if almost every human descended from a single Gene Stealer cult, then it may be possible for a Gene stealer to talk directly into the brain of any living human. As both Gene Stealers and the God emperor have this ability. (It's often mentioned the God emperor's mouth doesn't move when he speaks, instead people hear his voice in their head). Gene Stealers also make humans think they are angels/ divine creatures. In this hypothetical story the humans that think the God emperor is a Gene Stealer could also suspect this is why humanity worships him like a god. IDK I think it would be an interesting story IMO, but it would probably clash with lore. 🤷
What are you talking about? Ordo Chronos is the most well known Ordo within the Inquisition. Everyone knows they have been in charge of investigating time anomalies, and they're the ONE Ordo whose Inquisitors you actually want to see. Have you forgotten they were responsible for correcting the Emperor's Tarot during the Siege of Terra, in order to compensate for when Horus stopped time so the disparate defenders could stay in communication? The above is just an in-universe perspective for the Ordo Chronos. They have never disappeared, but they have also been absent for centuries, but they have been present the entire time to help the Imperium keep the Proper Time. I'd love if there was a book with Orikan wondering why his Orrery is giving incorrect results, and discovering the Ordo Chronos exist. Excellent video as usual.
The fun thing about time traveling organizations is that BOTH of your Ordo Chronoses could be the very same one. They just haven't uncovered the secret of time travel YET, but will have done so in their past/40k's far future. They were ripped out of time at their meeting (probably by the Legion Of The Damned both as punishment and as the Legion saw it as neccessary), dropped into the future, learned how to time travel and then went back and established the more mundane Ordo Chronos the Imperium knows today.
Hear me out! What if present Ordo chronos fights over dates and calendars just in order to make it easier for the time traveling Ordo Chronos to arrive at the right date and year?
I think it's possible that Kronos and the legion of the Damned are actually allies. However, they had to avoid Kronos until the time was right. Potentially even knowing that one or several of their number would be captured but essentially playing a game of cannon mouth right up until the time in which the emperor and the legion felt Kronos was ready to join them
Love all the work and passion. Long time sub. Hope in the future you produce retelling of all the books, spoilers and all. Love how you add personal insight, details, and humor to your stories. Huge undertaking, i know, but you deserve a huge team and support. Here for 3 hour videos. Continue the amazing work, and I can't wait for the next upload.
I think the Ordo Chronos is a plot device that will cover a multitude of retcons when Games Workshop inevitably changes its mind over and over. "Alright, so whenever you find that sort of contradiction in the official lore... a member of the Ordo Chronos did it."
18:00 "The Cronostrife a bitter and ongoing war within Ordo Chronos over the Imperium's dating system" I see the shipping wars are still alive and in the grim dark of the 41st millennium
This reminds me of a 40k fanfiction anthology where one of its chapters is called Time War. I think it literally involved this faction of the Inquisition basically getting involved in an eternal time war that has happened in the past, it is currently happening and is going to happen in the future all at the same time because time travel is a bitch. They're also warring with other factions from other timelines because any fucking around with the timeline will kill their timeline and they don't want their timeline to be killed and the reason they're 40k versus as fucked up as it is is because people have changed the past so many times that it made the future worse until it is the nightmare reality that we know and love today.
I could imagine this being some sort of Madella effect. When they disappeared and covered their tracks it might not be noticed because from that point it's like they never existed, so nobody doesn't remember. And nobody notices them coming back because when they return it's like they always existed, like they were never gone.
I love your long form content, and especially especially when you go full tinfoil hat swimming in the shoals of the emperoin. Your speculation is fun to listen to, as it's obvious you're a huge fan of 40k, but more importantly you're *joyful* about it. Even in the amazing Grim dark Story Hour, your passion is clear through the way you elegantly recreate such somber and bone chilling atmospheres.
it’s funny you made this video now because a few days ago I went back and watched all of your warhammer horror vids and my favorite was the Pharisene paradox story, kinda seems like perfect timing. Anyway I love your videos keep up the great work man 👍
The effort and passion you pour into your videos never ceases to amaze me. I love watching your videos, and they are just the absolute perfect thing to immerse myself into before bed. Thank you for all of your hard work, and I eagerly look forward to your next video
Don't forget Grey Knights to handle Chaos elements, Adeptus Mechanicus to keep the equipment running and Some Ulthwe for guidance. Lots of armies to collect.😊
Oh snap, are we getting a Fire Hawks video next?! You always talk about the most interesting, spooky stuff from the setting and I much prefer that over the battle reports.
This gave me an idea for a Wrath and Glory campaign that largely starts like perdition's flame, but i want the party to be successful, then have them learn to time travel to different events in the imperium to change or ensure the outcome.
It can even justify intentionally losing batttles in order to reduce the enemy to a certain strength before their next battle. Not every loss is a loss, but a win for a different reason.
I think I agree with your final theory so there's that. It also meshes the idea that perhaps writers of Chrono-Strife might be the author not having a lot of knowledge or care about what the Ordo Chronos could actually be.
@WesHammer Your list of lore is missing the Inquisitor: Prophecy/Martyr games, which revolve around a Ship-Sanctuary and do involve a few things of Ordo Chronos - among them, the ship monastary "Martyr".
Seriously Wes. Keep up the awesome damn work man. You are my go to for warhammer 40k lore now a days and your content just keeps getting better and better. I was following you when it was just short skits on tik tok. Here we are now. Badass. 🤘😤🤘
My prediction before watching the video (the part following the sponsorship) : -Ordo Chronos: “Alright, I’m finally back! You wouldn’t believe how much I had to go through to return to the prime time stream! 😮💨” -The rest of the Imperium: “Oh, you were gone, I didn’t even notice. 😯” Tho tbf, with planets getting lost in clerical errors, major wars occurring across nearly all sectors of the empire, half the galaxy getting cut off, and even the calendar itself being in uncertainty, I would forgive the Imperium being a bit too distracted to notice a minor Ordo going off the radar. 😅
I love a lot of the 40k lore, you know endless wars ancient gods, etc. but this is have to be my favorite so far, once time travel gets involved. Idk I love it. I wish I could see a anime focused on just the ordos and just this story of a war behind the war in space and time. It’s great I want to see more of this if it ever comes out 😅
Great content. Thia channel is a lovely distraction and having listened to both of the mentioned horror story breakdown videos this greater context video was really interesting.
28:59 could be a Coincidence as multiple warp wacky situations as unless Big E is sending dead legionaries to help out it could be that both could be separate loyal warriors going through time or that Big E is making ghost Asartes and the Fire hawks help out with them at times or are United as you’d have to explain the ultramarine
I imagine that the Eldar might want to use the door to stop Slanesh’s rise/birth…although I have a feeling that it might just make it worse or lead them to a far worse fate.
Damn, I remember listening to the story of the Perdition’s flame while painting, so I wasn’t looking at the visuals on the screen. In my mind i was seeing something like a Deamon Prince, or Greater Deamon of Khorne, with all the talk of skulls and flames, and i thought it was some sort og infighting between the Chaos gods that the poxwalkers were hunting it down. Also how the Captain was seemingly infected with bloodlust and couldn’t stop fighting even if it cost her her life, and driven insane when fighting alongside it. I had to go back and rewatch that part of the story with all this new information, very cool!
Overall, this theory fit together fairly well and I could absolutely see it being an actual very serious storyline. My biggest issue with it is my lack of faith in GW being able to timeline out something that subtle.
Such a cool topic, excited to see where this goes in the future… or the past? Would love a video about your favorite 40k books or where someone should get started who wants to start reading them!
The inquisitor saying "watch the nebular till i get back" sounds a lot like the famous line from Oates during an Antarctic exploration "I'm just going out for a walk, I may be some time" when really he knew he wouldnt come back.
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the dead cabal is the legion of the damned?
It actually amuses me that a man who dwells in 40k nightmare fuel, proprietor of Grimdark Story Hour, gets this sponsorship. I guess when you lie awake pondering horrors beyond imagination, best do it on comfy mattress 😂
well constructed video, keep it up man
Wow, that's one insincere promo.
@@captainanopheles4307 This guy stole all his content from other people on TikTok; everything he does is insincere.
"Right, so everything in this millenium is fucked. What even is the date?"
"I believe that would be heresy, my lord"
"Excuse you?"
"The subject of the current imperial date is heresy. The respective ordo chronos is having an entire civil war over it"
"The fucking WHAT!!?"
Rob Gorillaman: "... Fuck this "Inquisition"! How and why does it even exist?!!!"
Golden Tampon: "I believe that's also heresy, my lord."
Rob Gorillaman: ".....................................??" *twitch*
Golden Tampon: "The Ordo Originatus and the Ordo Redactus are currently trying to..."
Rob Gorillaman: *HAS A STROKE*
@@rampage75_25 Brwahahahahahahahahaha...he would, right after lighting his 50th lohstick and eating his 100h bow of desk cereal...
@@Vicarious_Heart😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
@@Vicarious_HeartHerecy HERECY EVERYWHERE!
**Exterminatus button awaiting…..**
YOOOOOOOOOOO, i have wanted an Ordo Chronos coverage video for YEARS.
Wes, you are the best.
Honestly I don't play Warhammer, nor do I have any desire to, but the lore is incredible and I LOVE hearing you talk about it
Just play, do it
@@andrewcrane5105 not into games that make me think too much. don't like keeping track of stats
Read the books. They're great :) There's many ways to interact with the hobby.
@@twisteddazeThere are a lot of video games in very different genres that are in Warhammer 40k universe, and they are entirely different from the tabletop game.
The most recent examples are Space Marine 2, a 3rd person action game, and Rogue Trader, an RPG game.
I want to play it but those models are stupid expensive and the local game shop has waaaaaay too many sweaty neckbeard stereotypes. When that last chick left you knew there were too many of them 😂
IIRC there was a loyalist Imperial Knights House that was suddenly attacked by Space Marines accusing them of being traitors. They fled into the Warp, turned to Chaos, then returned to real space looking for revenge. A temporal anomaly meant they reappeared before they had been attacked, and their ‘revenge’ was what triggered the Space Marine’s attack in the first place!
Beautiful idea!
The bootstrap paradox.
Who cause the relataliaton first?
@@T57Custodian Irrelevant. While SOMETHING must have caused the Knights to turn traitor and enter the Warp, it no longer happened. It’s been erased, replaced with a self-sustaining loop that doesn’t need those original events
PIME TARADOX!
@@T57Custodian bootstrap paradox relies on the implication that time has a single reference frame in the "present" when that's a complete illusion. The loop is self-sustaining, it needs no beginning, only a point that intersects another timeline
Wes is going absolutely insane and I'm so here for it, dig deeper Wes. DIG. DEEPER.
No diddy
Nuh huh diddy
Wes for Emporer/ PM / Dead Prez ... whatever you got going on in your reality 😂
My theory: Malcador after leaving the throne reincarnated in the late 1950's and knowing what the future holds formed an organization called GW where he play tests his future plans to hopefully prevent the future there is now. This ordo is serving to update malcador with the changes in the future based on his playtesting in the present. This is bat shit but find it fun.
Now as much as stupid and funny this is. It is also quite fascinating as well for this theory
@@Pixel22-fs3tt glad you enjoy it. My theory is the last book GW ever writes will reveal malcador and/or the Emperor run GW.
This is wild
@maniacalskipper I dig it. That's my official head Canon now. Thanks mate!
and Elon Musk is the Emperors current form
My man id love to see you do a deep dive on the legion of the damned.
i second this
Thirded
dint he make one? or am i thinking of another long form wh40k youtuber
You may be thinking of Luetin09. He did one on them.
@annfranknthatic Luetin did fairly comprehensive one, and MajorKill did a speed run version. There are few other people have done them as well. More perspectives are good though.
Hypothetical: It isn't 2 Order Chronos, but rather 2 wings of it.
One wing was returned to the timeline to keep up with records and to correct the negative effects of them being gone in the day to day and removes all confusion of them disappearing, which likely was a problem they confronted.
The other corrects issues from a more severe scale, but with precise points in the timeline.
man, I could Imagine Kyros Fateweaver, the Lord of Change be their eternal enemies kinda like Blood Angels with Ka'Bandha
There's multiple factions, but primarily two. The first is the one established to "help" the Imperium, the other, after realizing there is a necessary path existence must follow to avoid temporal paradoxes, holds to a more subtle approach.
@@309freddie It might even be that one side doesn't like the other anymore BECAUSE of said paradoxes. Kind of like their version of the typical Inquisitorial morality scale.
@@derkaiserzenI just imagine Kyros losing his mind (even more) seeing ordo chronos pop in and out of his memory/future sight at random
@@ReesesCup7979 I love the thought of that!
Robert Grillerman: "I wonder what's for dinner"
"That is heresy my lord"
"Wh-"
"The Ordo Culinarium has established that..."
" *Dies again* "
I swear to the emperor.... Is there actually an Ordo Culinarium? It'd be hilarious
Ordo Nlyfans
@@mediumsurmoon6283 Now call me paranoid but I have my suspicions that the holy and auspicious Ordo Nlyfans may have been infiltrated and corrupted by agents of she who thirsts
@@thetobi583 But who would be in charge of the taste testers???
@@michaelarreola4201 oh, this could be a topic for WesHammer to get into 😆
"What's the scaariest thing in Warhammer 40k?"
"The Inquisition has timetravel."
"The Inquisition has time travel and they STILL haven't wiped out the Tyranids"
Majority Report?
No one can stop high inquisitor Nelson Mandela
@@YakubTheFather and few understand the effect he has.
The only thing worse would be mkoll with time travel
Hey Wes,
I just wanted to say thanks so much for making the videos! I used to paint and play 40k with my dad back when I was 10. I haven’t touched the figures or any books in over 10 years. I just randomly stumbled on one of your videos, and I have been bingeing them ever since. Thank you for bringing me back to the fandom!
36:21 The hollow sun bit is interesting as its a necron tomb world inside a stars core and one of its cryptek cronomancer rahkoz is really good at manipulating time and the hollow sun is located in jerichos reach and something or someone is messing with rahkozs time manipulation so that might be related to this.
Nice idea for Dyson Sphere function. All the power, needed for time travel, and no need to build a shell.
Given the extra-temporal nature of Ordo Chronos, it's possible the ones who were directing the Legion of Damned were the Ordo in the future. Thus the past Ordo were investigating themselves.
Absolutely!
That would be very much an Inqusition thing to do😅
@@Hurricayne92 My best Dark Heresey RPG campaign turned out to be secret war between a Purtian and a Radical Inquisitiors.
this!
I would love a long form video on the Legion of the Damned. Such an interesting, out of place concept that has been under-explored.
Wait even Guilliman didn't ask where the hell they've been? If that's the case then the only people who probably know that they even still exist are probably chaos factions and maybe Bellisarius Cawl.
Which doesn't even say anything about the Necrons. They probably observe everything. In fact I'm pretty sure one of their tomb lords can actually travel through time and I think he's like the arch nemesis of Trazyn the Infinite. But Trazyn is so smart and crafty that he reacts and ruins the other guy's time traveling plans before they can do anything.
Cawls about to shit in ordo chronos’ cheerios
His name is Orikan The Diviner. He's a very powerful Chronomancer Necron Overlord.
Necrons are aware enough to not adjust the timeline to serve their own personal needs. To do so is to invite self-annilation. Moving things in time is like transfering a spiderwab without destroying it.
@@309freddie Yea considering the Necrons are effectively immortal they need to plan a fair bit forward, IMO its also the reason that that they are VERY hesitant to use the Celestial Orrery.
IMO they hadn't disappeared when Guilliman went into stasis and were back before he woke up. Or he just made a new Orda Chronos when he found out nobody was keeping track of time fluctuations.
One of my most favorite groups.
Anyone who can write themselves out of existence, entirely, gets my attention.
*Staring in commisar*
I first learned about the Ordo Chronos from your video on the Pharisene Paradox. Their stories really bring out that temporal horror to 40k.
I already know there have been time travel shenanigans in Warhammer 40K.
I remember a Dark age tech ship arriving to the 40th millennium. That was hilarious when the ship AI berated the Tech preists trying to appease her with oils and dances.
Ther was also another occasion when a team of Sisters of battle that found a time displaced ship that was both brand new and millions of years old and it had a flesh pit of psykers and a future version of one of the SOB's present on the ship trying to warn of a future calamity by talking through the psykers, but the past SOB burned the flesh pit before the message could be relayed.
And then later it was changed to Sister of silence doing the same thing.
And then it flipped again.
I think the Ordo Chronos is changing things over and over.
I'm pretty sure the SoB psychic fleshball was from the Daemonifuge comic line that details the backstory of Ephreal Stern and how she got hectic anti-Chaos psychic powers. The fleshball sacrificed itself and transferred its collective psychic powers and soul energy to Stern.
The one that was made from Silent Sisters was during the Heresy, where the fleshball manipulated events to warn a squad of Silent Sisters sent to investigate it about the future danger of the Horus Heresy. Realizing that the fleshball was talking with the voice of one of her subordinates, the Sister captain executed the subordinate in question and this retconned the fleshball from existing.
@@fadelsukoco3092 No no, it wasnt the Demonifuge, i read this in an actual novel not a comic.
And that whole thing with the sisters silence, it was SOB's first and then it was changed to Sisters of silence.
The retconn was retconned! XD
@@antcow1239 Then they were still different events that had to have happened in different books, since the example with the Silent Sisters is before the Heresy and the Sororitas didn't exist until the Age of Apostasy.
@@fadelsukoco3092 Maybe, all i was saying is it happened both ways
I loved your Perdition's flame video. I was really exasperated with that inquisitor. She can't accept that the ship and its people were truly overrun, that they'd done everything they could to "do their jobs" as she put it so angrily. Her forces were bested in an honest fight with a ton of angry pox walkers. The last survivors on that ship are not to blame.
It's a good parable on the dangers of becoming too focused on the inquisition immediate goal and not thinking of the impact that goal could have to the established timeline.
I've wanted a video explaining this often overlooked faction for a long time. I'm glad someone finally addressed it.
Ordo Chronos has that hard-coded plausible deniability: "How can we be culpable if it never happened? If we never existed?"
I feel like I need a drink after watching this video. I have no idea how you kept all that information even a little organized.
One of your best videos ever. I have read several different books of 40k now and I still feel like I have to come to these just to have an educational background to understand what I have read. Until this video I don't ever recall hearing of the order chronos. Yet I was sucked in and couldn't stop listening. Your definitely getting to be one of the better story tellers out there. Thank you for what your doing.
"The greatest trick the Ordo Chronos ever pulled was convincing the galaxy they didn't exist."
The last time I watched a video where a youtuber pieced together random bits of information from a lore and current pov ended up nailing the next part of the story.
Oooh who was that?
I love all the Inquisition's more esoteric Ordos, they truly do not get enough of the spotlight. Stoked to hear you're gonna cover the Legion of the Damned, can't wait!!
This is easily one of the most intriguing warhammer mysteries I have ever watched ! Great job on putting all of this together and re-telling it in a very engaging way !
11:22 that is pretty cool. A new Imperial Guard regiment that has a medieval looking armor making it look like handgunners from warhammer fantasy
That is a good way to ensure that the branding does not break.... "No sire, it turned out its not the 41k now, it was 800 years earlier than we thought!" - It will stay stay 40k forever!" ....
forever 21- you must cease & desist. LIKE RIGHT TOTALLY NOW!
Think they are allowed to round down to 40k at least till we reach the next game iteration Warhammer 50k.
A mystery of hundreds of years - of course the warp can play havoc with time and sometimes ships show up hundreds of years after they were scheduled. OOO - Not an accident? Oh I love your shows as you always bring up the things we often miss or hadn't realized might be important. I remember that story where the the ship was victim because of what the inquisitor brought aboard. The Ship officer and the man imprisoned on the way to face trial. You narrated that story for us last year. It was great!
It’s been a while since I’ve felt genuine oooo and aaaaa about 40K. I’ve been in it so long the grimdark isn’t as captivating as it used to be for me. But stories like these remind me just how deep this universe is and you did a great job bringing it to life! Ave Imperator!
I want you to make a part two for when the emperors children "saved" that imperium world from genestealers.
I would also like that!
The Emperor comes back: “it’s actually pronounced Jilla-man”
*Dies again*
The "Chronostrife" is just clerks not knowing how to interpret confusing, heavily redacted mission reports:
Inquisitor 1: Planet Helios IV destroyed by asteroid impact, year 634 m34.
Inquisitor 2: Asteroid destroyed, Planet Helios IV destroyed by Ork invasion, year 845 m34.
Inquisitor 3: Invasion repulsed, Planet Helios IV destroyed by Exterminatus, year 298 M35.
Clerk 1: "What are they doing?"
Clerk 2: "Arguing about history, I guess. What a bunch of idiots. Helios IV was never destroyed, I was born there!"
Chronostrife happened because in humanity's ancient past the Unified Realm of Merica never learned to use the 24 hour clock. Over 38,000 years the error introduced by occasionally forgetting to wind their watches means there's now a 2,000 year uncertainty in the actual date.
@@MattyRlufc I blame that damned chaos ritual of "daylight savings time"
@@handsomeman-child8751 I did wonder why we had to sacrifice the firstborn just to change the clocks 🤔
Thank you Sir! I feel like this presentation goes from the level of sharing lore in a high quality way to finding/creating lore that is beyond a well crafted fan theory. Impressive work.
Most enjoyable loretuber hands down. Positive, fun, and informative.
I love luetin's video essay format for when I want in depth deep dives. I love Wes for small 20 min videos to update my missing lore. That being said if Wes does make hour long video essays I'll listen :)
@@noahhenry6584Luetin for the sleep, Wes for quick lore catchups
My favourite kind of 40k lore, something with a bunch of unresolved mysteries to speculate on!
I think the ordo cronos messing with time makes perfect sense. plus it would be the perfect in canon explanation of all the random retconning games workshop liked to do with the canon and factions
14:27 - I had a thought I sometimes considered when it comes to Tyranids and their effect on humanity if they somehow showed up at an earlier point in time. A story which I thought Warhammer could play around with would be "what if a Gene stealer actually created a cult during the time humanity first appeared on earth?". They could make a story about how every living human in the universe has descended from a single Gene Stealer cult. I know teranids are connected to a hive mind, but from what I'm aware Gene stealers have the ability to cut themselves off from the hivemind to better perform their task. It would be interesting if there was a story about a Gene stealer cutting it's connection to the hive mind, going back in time and slowly cultivating humanity to allow them to grow and expand throughout the galaxy so the overall teranids fleet could eventually come to the galaxy and acquire more bio-mass in the year 40k. Perhaps because the Gene Stealer is sent back in time, after building up humanity a bit it decided to try and reconnect to the hivemind, but as the Gene Stealer is not from this point in time the Hive Mind sees this particular Gene Stealer as a foreign body and doesn't allow it to reconnect with the hivemind. Now because the Gene Stealer is permanently disconnected it no longer is influenced by the hive mind it becomes it's own individual allowing it to make its own decision. Now perhaps instead of using humanity as a food source, it uses humanity for its own needs and prepares them for an invasion from the Tyranids in the future.
Then maybe in the year 40k people learn of this information and falsely begin to suspect the god emperor himself is a Gene Stealer. Which could maybe work because if almost every human descended from a single Gene Stealer cult, then it may be possible for a Gene stealer to talk directly into the brain of any living human. As both Gene Stealers and the God emperor have this ability. (It's often mentioned the God emperor's mouth doesn't move when he speaks, instead people hear his voice in their head). Gene Stealers also make humans think they are angels/ divine creatures. In this hypothetical story the humans that think the God emperor is a Gene Stealer could also suspect this is why humanity worships him like a god. IDK I think it would be an interesting story IMO, but it would probably clash with lore. 🤷
What are you talking about? Ordo Chronos is the most well known Ordo within the Inquisition. Everyone knows they have been in charge of investigating time anomalies, and they're the ONE Ordo whose Inquisitors you actually want to see. Have you forgotten they were responsible for correcting the Emperor's Tarot during the Siege of Terra, in order to compensate for when Horus stopped time so the disparate defenders could stay in communication?
The above is just an in-universe perspective for the Ordo Chronos. They have never disappeared, but they have also been absent for centuries, but they have been present the entire time to help the Imperium keep the Proper Time. I'd love if there was a book with Orikan wondering why his Orrery is giving incorrect results, and discovering the Ordo Chronos exist. Excellent video as usual.
The fun thing about time traveling organizations is that BOTH of your Ordo Chronoses could be the very same one. They just haven't uncovered the secret of time travel YET, but will have done so in their past/40k's far future. They were ripped out of time at their meeting (probably by the Legion Of The Damned both as punishment and as the Legion saw it as neccessary), dropped into the future, learned how to time travel and then went back and established the more mundane Ordo Chronos the Imperium knows today.
Multiple factions of Ordos Chronos in inevitable, given the nature of manipulation of space time.
Hear me out! What if present Ordo chronos fights over dates and calendars just in order to make it easier for the time traveling Ordo Chronos to arrive at the right date and year?
I think it's possible that Kronos and the legion of the Damned are actually allies. However, they had to avoid Kronos until the time was right. Potentially even knowing that one or several of their number would be captured but essentially playing a game of cannon mouth right up until the time in which the emperor and the legion felt Kronos was ready to join them
Love all the work and passion. Long time sub. Hope in the future you produce retelling of all the books, spoilers and all. Love how you add personal insight, details, and humor to your stories. Huge undertaking, i know, but you deserve a huge team and support. Here for 3 hour videos. Continue the amazing work, and I can't wait for the next upload.
I think the Ordo Chronos is a plot device that will cover a multitude of retcons when Games Workshop inevitably changes its mind over and over.
"Alright, so whenever you find that sort of contradiction in the official lore... a member of the Ordo Chronos did it."
Exactly at 32min I started cackling at the foil. Made me think he was going to throw the line, "but that's just a theory, A Warhammer Theory!".
18:00 "The Cronostrife a bitter and ongoing war within Ordo Chronos over the Imperium's dating system" I see the shipping wars are still alive and in the grim dark of the 41st millennium
17:35 Is he using that flaming sword as a reading light, a lhostick lighter, or both?!
Both 😂
This reminds me of a 40k fanfiction anthology where one of its chapters is called Time War. I think it literally involved this faction of the Inquisition basically getting involved in an eternal time war that has happened in the past, it is currently happening and is going to happen in the future all at the same time because time travel is a bitch. They're also warring with other factions from other timelines because any fucking around with the timeline will kill their timeline and they don't want their timeline to be killed and the reason they're 40k versus as fucked up as it is is because people have changed the past so many times that it made the future worse until it is the nightmare reality that we know and love today.
Not only does Ordos Chronos have to fight the war, but clean up evidence of a war, so as to not pollute the time line.
I could imagine this being some sort of Madella effect.
When they disappeared and covered their tracks it might not be noticed because from that point it's like they never existed, so nobody doesn't remember.
And nobody notices them coming back because when they return it's like they always existed, like they were never gone.
Mandella effect being an indicator of time manipulation with minor paradoxical impact.
Love you Wes! Keep up the great work favorite warhammer channel thanks for being with us through all this time :) big hugs and best regards
I love your long form content, and especially especially when you go full tinfoil hat swimming in the shoals of the emperoin. Your speculation is fun to listen to, as it's obvious you're a huge fan of 40k, but more importantly you're *joyful* about it. Even in the amazing Grim dark Story Hour, your passion is clear through the way you elegantly recreate such somber and bone chilling atmospheres.
As a theory crafter myself, I love your way of thinking. This is a very convincing way of putting all the pieces together.
it’s funny you made this video now because a few days ago I went back and watched all of your warhammer horror vids and my favorite was the Pharisene paradox story, kinda seems like perfect timing. Anyway I love your videos keep up the great work man 👍
The effort and passion you pour into your videos never ceases to amaze me.
I love watching your videos, and they are just the absolute perfect thing to immerse myself into before bed.
Thank you for all of your hard work, and I eagerly look forward to your next video
Wes has the best Breakdown in history of Warhammer youtubing
Inquisitor Lord Emmett Brown: "Great Scott!"
All these bots in the comments, UA-cam needs to sort their shit out
There’s gotta be a bot reporting option lol
@@Voxcast07nah that's too smart for their style.
@@Voxcast07there’s the option to report spam. I suppose that could be it
Fr, there needs to be an… inquisition
I sadly doubt UA-cam will do anything till it affects them negatively. As bots are basically just very active users in UA-cam’s eyes
Definitely might need to make an inquisitorial list with some legion of the damned death watch space Marines after this video
Don't forget Grey Knights to handle Chaos elements, Adeptus Mechanicus to keep the equipment running and Some Ulthwe for guidance. Lots of armies to collect.😊
Imagine trying to keep to appointment time in 40K
True , if the warp travel is involved you can both arrive hundreds of years too late or possibly before you made the appointment
Oh snap, are we getting a Fire Hawks video next?!
You always talk about the most interesting, spooky stuff from the setting and I much prefer that over the battle reports.
32:15 I love the slow decent of madness in your voice 😂😂😂😂
This gave me an idea for a Wrath and Glory campaign that largely starts like perdition's flame, but i want the party to be successful, then have them learn to time travel to different events in the imperium to change or ensure the outcome.
It can even justify intentionally losing batttles in order to reduce the enemy to a certain strength before their next battle. Not every loss is a loss, but a win for a different reason.
I think I agree with your final theory so there's that. It also meshes the idea that perhaps writers of Chrono-Strife might be the author not having a lot of knowledge or care about what the Ordo Chronos could actually be.
I literally just finished rewatching the Perditions Flame video and this one came on automatically.
The omnissiah has blessed my algorithms today
This was absolutely awesome!
I really hope their story gets continued by Black Library, and that we get another video from you when it does.
Can't wait for a deep dive on the legion of the damned.
Mister Wes. Your work is needed for the future of Warhammer Lore. Do not fail on Your mission
@WesHammer Your list of lore is missing the Inquisitor: Prophecy/Martyr games, which revolve around a Ship-Sanctuary and do involve a few things of Ordo Chronos - among them, the ship monastary "Martyr".
Seriously Wes. Keep up the awesome damn work man. You are my go to for warhammer 40k lore now a days and your content just keeps getting better and better. I was following you when it was just short skits on tik tok. Here we are now. Badass. 🤘😤🤘
Epic dude, I’m tying my homebrew chapter into them after watching this video!
“Khârn and Argel Tal” for the mattress is hilarious 😂
My prediction before watching the video (the part following the sponsorship) :
-Ordo Chronos: “Alright, I’m finally back! You wouldn’t believe how much I had to go through to return to the prime time stream! 😮💨”
-The rest of the Imperium: “Oh, you were gone, I didn’t even notice. 😯”
Tho tbf, with planets getting lost in clerical errors, major wars occurring across nearly all sectors of the empire, half the galaxy getting cut off, and even the calendar itself being in uncertainty, I would forgive the Imperium being a bit too distracted to notice a minor Ordo going off the radar. 😅
The Ordos Chronos isn't doing their job, if they're on the radar.😊
This is my absolute favourite warhammer video so far I love the Theory keep up the good work man
I can’t wait for a deep dive for the legion of the Damned
Still waiting on your next merch drop! My "bring the noise" noise marine shirt is still one of my fav shirts!
I love a lot of the 40k lore, you know endless wars ancient gods, etc. but this is have to be my favorite so far, once time travel gets involved. Idk I love it. I wish I could see a anime focused on just the ordos and just this story of a war behind the war in space and time. It’s great I want to see more of this if it ever comes out 😅
3:58
Imagine type Khârn and they send you a pile of skulls to sleep on.
Lmao
Great content. Thia channel is a lovely distraction and having listened to both of the mentioned horror story breakdown videos this greater context video was really interesting.
Lets say the quiet part: this is a very effective way to 'explain' the numerous plot holes and expired lore in the 40k lore; which I'm all for.
28:59 could be a Coincidence as multiple warp wacky situations as unless Big E is sending dead legionaries to help out it could be that both could be separate loyal warriors going through time or that Big E is making ghost Asartes and the Fire hawks help out with them at times or are United as you’d have to explain the ultramarine
I loved both Perditions Flame and this is another good video by Weshammer
This is your best, if most unhinged, work yet. I'm on board. Or I will be. Or I was. Maybe both.
Your deep dives are so much better than your short form content
Can't wait for the LoD deep dive! Perfect to listen to while working on my Firehawks!
My favorite video of yours!!
I imagine that the Eldar might want to use the door to stop Slanesh’s rise/birth…although I have a feeling that it might just make it worse or lead them to a far worse fate.
Damn, I remember listening to the story of the Perdition’s flame while painting, so I wasn’t looking at the visuals on the screen. In my mind i was seeing something like a Deamon Prince, or Greater Deamon of Khorne, with all the talk of skulls and flames, and i thought it was some sort og infighting between the Chaos gods that the poxwalkers were hunting it down. Also how the Captain was seemingly infected with bloodlust and couldn’t stop fighting even if it cost her her life, and driven insane when fighting alongside it. I had to go back and rewatch that part of the story with all this new information, very cool!
Overall, this theory fit together fairly well and I could absolutely see it being an actual very serious storyline. My biggest issue with it is my lack of faith in GW being able to timeline out something that subtle.
fantastic work thank you so much, you are doing this community a great service with your videos
42:34 "robooty giggleman"
Such a cool topic, excited to see where this goes in the future… or the past?
Would love a video about your favorite 40k books or where someone should get started who wants to start reading them!
*sees Weshammer posted a new video*
Looks like I ain't getting shit done for a bit
i use your videos as a dark story time about something I enjoy keep up the good work
The inquisitor saying "watch the nebular till i get back" sounds a lot like the famous line from Oates during an Antarctic exploration "I'm just going out for a walk, I may be some time" when really he knew he wouldnt come back.
Absolutely Love the content Wes! You got me into warhammer when I saw you on tiktok a few years back. Been a fan ever since. You the best!
Fascinating! That was a terrific video. Would love to see GW publish more lore on this faction.
It's always fun to see 40K reference other scifi.
Sinclair involved in Time Travel.
Cant wait for the legion of the damned video. Chronos having captured one of them is crazy