As a teacher, yes, I would step in and give her lunch. She’s 6 and no, you shouldn’t feel ok about leaving the teacher feeling uncomfortable about YOUR daughter being hungry. We had a 6 year old hop in the car for school without putting shoes on. The teacher called his mom to ask to bring him shoes. His mom wouldn’t bring him shoes to teach him a lesson to bring shoes next time. That was a punishment for the teacher who didn’t get a break from kids that day because he had to stay inside for recess with her while she ate her lunch. It’s your responsibility as a parent to make sure that your kids, especially 6 year old kids, leave the house with shoes and lunch every day.
That happen to me when I was in second grade. That day my mom didn't fix my lunch or gave me money for lunch. So I ask my friend for money and our teacher step in and told him not give any of his money. When we got to the lunch room, she made my set a table by myself. I started crying and Lunch lady came over. Ask me what's wrong, I told her. Then she told me get in the lunch line and get your lunch. I said I don't have any money. She said that's ok go get your lunch, I go talk to your teacher.
I agree… at that age it is easy to forget things. But Ruby wanted to play the strict responsible mom teaching their kids life lessons. Fast forward she’s an insane monster mom and child abuser who starved that same little girl that forgot her lunch. It is very sad. Specially knowing that Russell the 12 year old that escaped was so malnourished that he stopped growing. But they are safe now but will have to get so much therapy after all of this. It took this to save them.
I didn’t have it as rough as those kids but i know what it’s like to be so anxious at home that basic tasks are hard. I would imagine there’s more going on if a child shows up to school without shoes
So glad to see this here! Was pretty disheartened to see someone like KJ was featured on the news about this story when there are so many creators better equipped to address this situation and I was ready to hear from you guys a little more about this.
Jordan, were you channeling your inner Olivia (H3 Podcast) when you made this slideshow? lol On slide 2, when you said, "Our players are..." that's definitely what it reminded me of. ❤️
@@leeanncornett5246 yes, she’s a hot mess. She’s in the middle of her fifth defamation lawsuit and it’s not going well (if you look at the court documents instead of listen to her spin on it). Also there was a promise from the Derricos to immediately litigate against her. I think she’s trying very hard to stay relevant and bolster her follower base before she’s hit with some kind of media muzzle that will impact her reach.
What does an adult do if they forget their lunch? Do you go hungry? No. You go buy something, get delivery, etc. Yet a 6 year-old child is expected to go hungry. So she's imposing standards on a little kid that adults don't even have to abide by. This is enraging.
I was sent to a teen program owned by and LDS family in Arizona for over a year when I was 16. The church not only suggested it to my parents, they also paid for the entire thing- over $50,000. It was horrific emotional and mental abuse I still struggle with 25 years later. I’d love to see all those programs shut down.
I’m so sorry that happened to you and can’t believe that a church would spend that much money on that. You have that much money and couldn’t spend it on things that are more beneficial to help out the community. What part of AZ was it in? I’m just curious because I’m from there.
Not to down play your experience, but the church are experts on separation and isolation in and emotionally abusive program. It's called: the mission. 20 years since my mission amd I still deal with the anger from that experience every single day.
People who are not Mormon, who are not in the harsh or abusive mode of treating others (children or ANYONE), see what Ruby was even before Jodi. Ruby was a sadist prior to meeting Jodi so it is not as Ruby presented later, when she wept at the sentencing…like she had been in so terribly influenced by Jodi. The phone calls between Kevin and Ruby when she was first in jail tell the story of what is true…they were on the same page, they believed in the harsh treatment of the children, they believed the children had evil in them (when the truth most likely is that Ruby and definitely Jodi are partially possessed. Listen to Kevin speaking about when Jodi moved into their home for awhile and research exorcisms, and Jerry Marzinsky’s work).
@JordanandMcKay, @Mormon Stories Podcast as a former watcher of 8passengers I quickly want to give two examples of the youngest daughter's "egregious" behavior, that was pointed out in two vlogs. 1) The first one must haven taken place shortly after Jodi came into their lives. It was still in the old house, around 2019, so E. was 5 or 6 years old. The family was getting ready to go to the movies when it was decided that Ruby would stay home with E., because E. had to be punished for not being "humble". Now what could a 5/6 year old have done to not be humble? She had asked which movie they were going to see. Yep. A question that 99,9% of people would ask if they were going to the movies. But Ruby explained that the children had to be grateful for whichever movie they were going to see. Now just to make that clear: it was NOT that E. had asked which movie they were going to see, was told which one it was and then threw a tantrum. NOTHING the like. Simply her asking about the movie was considered entitled/ungrateful/not humble and had to be punished. 2) The other incident was in the new house, so must have been a year or two later, with E. now being 6 or 7. The video was titled something like "being sick sucks" or whatever. In it, Ruby told us that E. was having a pretty high fever and was sick in bed. She went on to explain that she had heard E. whimpering throughout the night and at one time get up and go downstairs in the kitchen to get herself some ice. Ruby went on to explain that she did NOT get up to check on E., because she thought her 6 year old daughter whimpering throughout the night was an attempt of manipulation. So this mom didn't check on her little girl who was clearly in distress to punish her for "manipulating" her parents. She was also gleaming when she was recounting this story and didn't seem to feel any kind of remorse about her behavior, even when she found out the next morning that E. was actually sick. These are the types of "behavior" the little kids displayed to be labled as being "in distortion" by Jodi and Ruby. On a side note: E. sometimes got in trouble at school for kinda being the class clown. Which is tragic, because this behavior was actually taught to her by Ruby. E. was constantly filmed since she was a toddler and she was made to act early on. If she did something funny or cute and the camera wasn't on, she was encouraged to reenact it for the camera. She was praised for being silly/funny/spunky/cute in front of the camera all the time, she was told that viewers loved it and was given more attention from her mom when behaving like that, because she delievered content for Ruby's camera. She was absolutely groomed to be hyper and acting to entertain and make people like her. It doesn't come as a surprise then that a 5/6/7 year old applies the same methods to be liked at school. It was the one behavior she knew would get her attention and love.
Thank you for explaining this, I was wondering what would be considered egregious. Also the "they're just manipulating" is often an excuse for denying medical care to kids in the troubled teen industry, for example it played a role in the death of Taylor Goodrich (I think that's her last name). Why are accusations of being manipulative so common in Utah/Mormon culture, when the person in question is just trying to get their needs met?
@@nomadicamthe short answer is yes! For example, i was told by an instan care dr. That if I didn't check in to an emergency room ICU in 2 hours he didn't expect me to live. Instead, I called my mission president (so yes, I was a legal adult and was asking my mormon leadership authority permission to go to an emergency room) he said no, I was faking it. Can you even believe that's how much of my autonomy I had given away. Shocking to me now
Having raised 2 wonderful, smart, compassionate daughters (who both, it turns out, have ADHD), I can't even begin to imagine letting them go hungry for things they forgot to do when they were little. Kids, even if they don't have ADHD, are all little space cadets, because their minds are busy figuring out this thing called Life. What a horrible thing, to punish them for being human.
Ruby strikes me as a straight-up psychopath. She’s cruel to her children just because, and she gets a kick out of it. She smiles and giggles talking about the abuse. It’s horrific.
It struck me that the only time Ruby cried was not when her children were suffering, but when she had to give up "millions" of dollars by shutting down 8 Passengers. Can you say narcissist?
My mom got up two decades from the early 1980s to the early 2000s every single morning at 5 a.m. - to make sure we would have enough food at school at make it punctual to school.
Yeah, very horrific. When I first saw clips of her channel, I thought it was a joke. I thought that there is no way a mother is not only doing these things, but proudly broadcasting it. It really shows how crazy she truly is. She doesn’t believe she is wrong. She thinks abusive behavior is normal. I mean, I don’t want to absolve her of responsibility by implying she doesn’t know right from wrong. She’s a functioning adult who knows right from wrong. But she has somehow convinced herself that what she was doing was okay and normal. A lot of abusers hide the abuse. They try to keep up a facade of normality. She didn’t even attempt to hide it. It shows how dangerous extreme religious beliefs can be. A toxic religious leader can convince people that these things are right. I will never understand how people fall for them. Ruby had to have already had some evil in her to do everything she did. Religion can be a powerful tool for abusers. Jodi’s influence just gave her a perceived “pass” to act on it.
it's crazy how social workers seem to think neat and tidy people can't be abusers... Our home was neat and tidy BECAUSE of abusive screaming and yelling and dragging kids out of dead sleep at 3am to "complete the chore chart" that was sterile hospital environment level nutso. How many non abusive cluttery people are dragged through the ringer because they don't have a dishwasher or live in a small sq ft house that looks more messy than a rich person with 3000sqft house with the exact same number of items "out" of place. As kids initialy it felt affirming that our mom was being reported but you know how many times we bothered to speak up to CPS after they kept LEAVING us in the home after investigating and being enamored by the martha stewart decor-zero times. what's the point. so we can be in extra trouble when you leave? I'm tired of social worker excuses. You don't have a good model to assess abuse. That's the bottom line. You're bias and shooting in the dark. Being overworked isn't the real core of the issue.
Yeah, I've noticed this too. My family was what you would consider middle class. My grandma finally reported my parents for abuse of me and my younger sibling when I was a teenager. (I'd been telling her what was going on for years.) There's definitely a class/socioeconomic element within what gets investigated thoroughly and what does not. I was not allowed contact with my grandma after she reported. That was the "punishment" because my grandma and I were close. Just because the house is clean and looks nice/the kids have nice clothes doesn't mean abuse isn't going on. I would say given my experience that most middle-class abusers know enough about the system and how it works to tow a fine line. My parents were highly educated and it plays a role in whether or not a child will be believed. Another way, I was punished was to be given counseling when I was younger after telling school staff what was going on at home. It looked good on the outside, but my parents wanted to convince me that I was the problem.
But no one gets privileged treatment like the meth addicts. They put several kids a week in the hospital, and the kids are sent back as soon as they get out of the hospital. Several have been killed.☠️☠️☠️☠️
Ruby Franke sounds like she was 3 steps away from us finding her kids missing and deceased ala Lori Vallow. The greatest news is that one of her children was given the strength to escape and get help for themself and their siblings. Getting these children away from this household is the best thing for them. Her husband is also culpable for allowing this to happen!
100% they were actually looking for land in AZ that they said would give them the space and isolation for the kids to enact the full "treatment". I think those kids were definitely going to be killed.
Ruby is a sadist. She might not admit it to herself, but she takes pleasure in her kids pain. There is no other name for her behavior. Who knows what went on when the cameras weren't on...
This is in line with my theory she has an underdeveloped amygdala. One of the few emotions she can empathize with is fear . This may be why her eyes light up when she causes this to her children. She gets feedback from their fear. Psychopath
there was this video where she wanted (for some reason???) to blame Chad for her stomach ache, even Jodi had to tell her that it wasn't the case (well, she told her that she was in distortion, but you get the idea) - but Ruby nonetheless wanted to blame him for it. this woman is not okay.
The clip where she threatened her oldest he wouldn't be able to eat that day if he didn't stop playing with his little brother. The two boys were laughing and playing, and she couldn't stand it! No joy in her household!
Children aren’t little manipulative adults walking around trying to trick parents with some voodoo into giving them love and Pepperidge Farm cookies. Parents that parent from that mindset windup raising manipulative adults that are still just little kids trying desperately to get their needs met getting into all kinds of bad situations. It’s is a survival trait. Too many parents walking around wanting Bare Minimum Awards. Thanks to you all. This has been an incredible show. I love the time you take on giving all the story instead of just little sensationalized tidbits
@@timriehl1500 I agree, but even that word “spoiled” - which I also sometimes use to mean “treated with great love, affection, and attention” - has unnecessary negative connotations. All children deserve love and attention at a minimum.
Never once did I go to school without my lunch or bus money ( to come home ). Never once. Neither did any of my 5 siblings. My mom was in charge of making sure when we left we had all we needed to take. No drama ever !!! Thanks MOM :)
Children learn what love is, what doing for others is, by having their mother and their father love them and do things for them, particularly when they are so young.
I am a 58 year old grandma that started watching the Griffiths families in 2015 when I was living in a different state than my own grandchildren and missed them terribly. I stopped watching Ruby about 2 and a half years ago because her actions with her kids made me very uncomfortable. I never dreamed something this severe would happen. My heart is just breaking for those kids. And their grandparents being so far away. Their father is equally as responsible as Ruby is for those kids conditions, he has no excuse for not knowing.
Of course he knew. He lived in that house and didn’t seem to stop the disciplinary actions Ruby carried out. Terrible parents, I think Kevin needs to be charged , also.😢😢😢
as are the rest of that family who have admitted they KNEW what was going on with those children. Ellie and Jarrod and their pathetic statement. They KNEW and they chose to do NOTHING.
@@lindajohnson. Yes, from everything I've seen so far (and I didn't even know about this family until this week), it looks like...at best...Kevin just checked out mentally, physically and emotionally and just let things happen. (His attitude seems to have been "whatever you say, Ruby".) I gather from statements made here and there, though, that when these recent events happened Kevin and Ruby had been separated for some time and the kids weren't living with Kevin. The duct tape, extreme starvation/emaciation and isolation things were happening at Jodi's house in Ivins, Utah (close to St. George). Things probably escalated after the separation and when Ruby and Jodi had complete custody of the kids. Hard to say whether Kevin knew the full extent of what was going on at Jodi's house. He definitely SHOULD have been more pro-active and concerned about their welfare and SHOULD have known how dangerous it would be to let Ruby just have free reign, since she seems to have demonstrated an almost sadistic glee in meting out harsh discipline in the past. Kevin seems to have been way too detached and unconcerned. But I have no idea what went on in their household for the 90% of the time that the cameras weren't turned on. Ruby was probably in charge of editing everything they uploaded in the past.
Never once did "the gift of pain" cross my mind when I think of my child, regardless of if i thought he needed to learn a lesson. As a parent, as much as I want to protect him from all pain, the thought of contributing to it hurts my heart.
Thank you for covering this story. Ruby wanted to absolutely break her child’s spirit and have complete compliance. How absolutely tragic when a mother stops feeling, understanding and empathising with what her child is going through. What a complicated trauma those children much have when this treatment by their mother is construed as ‘love’
I'm not sure Ruby ever stopped feeling empathy because I'm not sure she ever started. I think Ruby may have some cognitive empathy as in, she's learned what people usually feel in certain situations, but she herself cannot feel it or empathize. I think she has an underdeveloped amygdala and may be a psychopath.
She’s an absolute piece of work with her perfect hair and makeup and outfits, while she passes judgment on a nine yr old kid for not being humble enough or having sufficient gratitude. Heart breaking to see the earlier videos of Russell and Eve and know that they wound up bound and starved by their lunatic mother. She’s too proud and stubborn to show any remorse or back down from her ridiculous nonsense so hopefully the judge will throw the book at her and she’ll sit in prison for YEARS. Happy 10th Birthday to little Eve, I hope she gets to see her older sister at least. In the video where Ruby threatened to cut off her bear’s head, Sherri swooped in to hug her and I suspect that happened a lot.
A side note on Ruby denying to bring Eve a lunch at school: it had been mentioned in previous vlogs that Eve was underweight and her pediatrician was concerned and had instructed Ruby on getting her to take in more calories. I had watched their vlogs, and that point was what horrified me the most. There obviously were huge issues with food!!!
Ruby used that as punishment. If the kids didn’t behaved as she wanted or did what she told those kids starved they didn’t get any food!! That’s why they are malnutrition. It’s so sick and evil! It makes my blood boil.
@@JustJ-Me , yes, I was a subscriber of 8 passengers, so I helped creating the monster. But I don't think most of the portuguese were aware. Plus, here the news are not complete. For example, they don't mention that the police also found E ( I don't want to say her name) in the house. They only talk about the 12 years old boy. This case is also news in England. I saw it on a TV channel
I am German and watched 8 passengers when I was younger. I guess it was interesting for us Europeans to watch how people - and Mormons live in America. I remember thinking: wow such a strict mom. But to some extent I was just thinking: oh okay, that's how things are in America. I stopped watching when Chad was sent to camp. I found that too extreme. I still followed occasionally and it definitely got worse and worse from there. Would be interesting to know when Jodi entered the picture. I wouldn't be surprised if it was 4 years ago. It would line up nicely.
I came across 8 passengers through Ruby 's parents. And then I began watching her sisters as well. And yes, for me too it was a way of understanding how mormans live. I watched her channel until the drama she made about the song 's lyrics in her one of her daughter 's school. And, honestly, I thought it was the mormon way of thinking. I hope I was wrong.....when she joined Jodi, I lost all interest. When did they met? For a long time or just in recent years?
I grew up with Ruby. She lived around the corner from me. We were not in the same ward, since my house was the boundary line for my ward, but we were in the same stake. We went to girls camps, and other stake activities together. We played together as little girls, slept over at each other's homes, went to each other's birthday parties, walked to school together... I am 2 years older than her, and she was 6 when her family moved in. I've been paying attention to the things going on with her for the last several years. And I'm horrified at where this has gone. I was disgusted at some of the things that went on with 8 Passengers, but I never would have thought that things would have gotten this extreme. I'm just sick over it.
There are a lot of things that still aren't clear to me. I wonder how far back the connection between Ruby and Jodi go. I get the impression that Jodi was filling Ruby's head with horrific ideas long before they formally went into business together. Ruby may have been relatively normal before she came under the influence of Jodi. From what I've seen so far, it looks like Kevin's biggest failing was that he was just too passive and let Ruby make all of the parenting decisions. As things got progressively worse, it looks like he just wasn't up to dealing with it in any constructive way. Reading between the lines, the older kids seem to blame Ruby for the abuse and Kevin for enabling/stepping back and letting Ruby run wild. I'm just guessing at this point, based on the limited information available.
@@TEAM__POSEID0N Jodi started influencing the family when Chad was "acting up" (being a normal teenager). She's the one who recommended the wilderness camp so ig you could say she was behind the most unhinged decisions like taking his bed away.
It's interesting that you slept over at each other's homes. I lived in Alpine (as the only non-Mormon) for 24 years and sleeping over was a big no-no -- All the mom's I knew wouldn't let their kids stay over at anyone's home. I often wonder if they knew what was going on in certain homes, like the Brown family who lived in the neighborhood a street over from me. Especially considering she was 6 when they moved -- that is really young for a kid to sleep over at someone's home
You can see that Ruby is clearly enjoying abusing her kids because every time she describes what she’s doing to them she looks so gleeful or is laughing. What a disgusting, cruel woman. I hope she gets the prison time she deserves
Can we all take a moment to think how brave little Russell was to seek help ? He saved all his siblings. ❤ I am praying for all these children. Also just my 2 cents…these family channels need to stop.
And on the audio, if I am remembering right, he literally comments that his treatment was “his fault,” which he must have been told repeatedly. Tragic, and no, even if he was a convicted murderer in prison, what those 2 monsters did would be a crime. He seems like a great kid pushed to the brink.
@@paulac2249Closer to 4 than 3. 😅 Better to watch one great four hour long video than four subpar one hour long videos, yeah? I love Mormon Stories and how in depth and long their episodes are, but I tend to listen in chunks instead of all at once. I also usually speed up the video. Hope you gave this video a watch -- it's really good if you're interested in the topic!
My daughter forgot her lunch when she was about six. I ended up doordashing chick-fil-a so she had nuggets, fruit, and milk. I don’t make millions like Ruby does; it was an expensive meal for her but she had to eat. Just putting it out there that there are ways around it if you can’t get back to the school. What Ruby did is inexcusable.
Ruby's "if your child is on fire, you hurt them to put the fire out" example is INSANE. I have literally had a friend set themselves (accidentally) on fire, and my brother put them out by tackling them with a blanket. IT. DID. NOT. HURT. HER. She was just instantly relieved. Yes, the burns hurt, but literally nobody thought that my brother was doing anything but helping. There was no "Why are you abusing her?" Ruby is bizarre and clearly delusional and unsafe. Jail is the best place for her; there is no way she needs to be running around free to interact with innocent and unsuspecting humans, children or otherwise.
That analogy was so weird. Yes, “beating out the flames” is a thing (usually with wet towels or burlap sacks) but you usually don’t beat out the flames on a person. And I would think any kid on fire would be screaming “Mom, mom! I’m on fire! Put it out! Put it out!”
Halloween day, my boys could dress in costumes for school , a lunch time parade. The boys had a hurried breakfast, and snack at recess, probably a couple of hours later. In the lunch line my son fainted, fell forward, broke out front teeth. The pediatrician ran a pyramid of tests, he told us that it was likely hyperglycemia, low blood sugar. He was not diabetic, and never had another episode. Food is fuel, life, not optional
John, I'm one of the 50% never-mo viewers whose been here for years. It is this Griffiths family that caused me to find your podcast. I've watched the Griffiths family of vloggers from the very beginning when Ellie + Jared (the youngest Griffiths sister) first started their channel to document their infertility journey. The rest of the siblings and parents followed E+J vlogging lead when they made their own channels. I think this is why the 8Passengers channel exploded in popularity so quickly because Ruby's sisters already had large and successful UA-cam channels when Ruby started 8 Passengers. Anyway, it is because of this family that I found Mormon Stories Podcast. I became fascinated with learning more about their religion because previously I only knew of Mormonism = polygamy. And I couldn't understand how these people who seemed to have it all going for them could be Mormon. So I started looking into it and found your podcast and never left. These stories are fascinating to me. Now talking about 8Passengers feels like it's coming full-circle for me today. Under very unfortunate circumstances, of course. Thank you so much for covering this story. I wanted to DM you and ask you to speak about the news, so this is exactly what I was hoping for on your platform here.
It was the same for me! I'm from Uruguay, I knew very little about Mormons... But it was from watching these families that I became interested and ended up in MS
I'm very concerned about the influence members of the Mormon faith had in the failures of local policing and CPS in regard to this case. It seems as though teachers, family members, neighbors and other members of the public were reporting Ruby for about two years and nothing seems to have been done. Having seen plenty of previous cases in which members of the Mormon faith acted corruptly to return children to the people they were trying to escape, that there was potentially a concerted effort to either cover-up or ignore what was happening in this case.
8 passengers was not only free marketing for the mormon church, but the church was given 10% of what ruby was making. Why ruin that for a few kids’ safety? Many people (adults and children) have been/are being abused and ~allegedly~the mormon church has covered it up to save face. I wish more people knew about the insidious nature of this lds church.
IME The Mormon Church puts its image and money above all else. The family’s vlogs brought them a good image so the covered. Now just like blacks holding priesthood, polygamy, and their anti lgbtq crusade = its going to back fire. it’s a dying religion and having grown up in it, I say Good Riddance.
Thanks for bringing Jordan and McKay on, and for such valuable insight into this horrific situation. As always, thought provoking and honest discourse.
Hi, I’m new here. Hidden True crime told me about how awesome you guys are. I came for my interest in the Frankie/Hildebrant case, but you taught me the term “ high demand religion” and that sparked so many connections for me. After surviving a childhood in the Evangelical Christian religion, I hadn’t realized how much it had contributed to my CPTSD. Thank you. I’m excited to keep watching.
The lunch "consequence" is wild to me. As an adult if I forget my lunch I can go buy something or order something or ask my partner to drop it by. It's wild to me that people expect kids to be more responsible than adults. I forget things often and people help me because we are all human. Her poor kids
My parents didn’t bring me lunch I forgot mine and they both worked. Neither could my partner even as an adult. I’m literally fine though. I’m not saying it’s ok but I don’t bring a lunch a lot as an only parent and try to make the food stretch so I skip meals. My kids think I like being “the garbage disposal” (that’s what I call it when I eat after they are full.) they didn’t realize we had very little because I did so happily. Lots of people scrimp for their kids. I however do not think this mom had a job and she had the time and the money. I just prefer my kids to get the best nourishment and I neat what’s left on their plates often. This mom is lazy and selfish and she could have easily given the school a credit card and put money at least on a lunch card for her kid in case kids forgot their lunch.
I’m so glad you collaborated with Jordan and McKay for this story!! I got most of my info about the 8 passengers saga from Jordan and McKay, and the story hit so close to home for me that I followed their a lot of their in-depth coverage.
Omg you just explained something to me. My Mormon aunt was visiting and I made an offhanded joke about never checking my teenage sons browser history, and she FREAKED out. Like she triggered my fight or flight and I ended up cornered by her in my garden shed, and I had to yell at her to get her to shut up and back off. It was scary, and I lost trust in her after that.
Love the discussion about "is this a Mormon story, or a story that just happens to have Mormons in it?" I had an idyllic childhood being raised in Mormonism, but i can absolutely see where the doctrine enables people with certain personality types or proclivities. My parents used to say "Even the Devil can quote scripture." and i appreciate that helped me recognize that not all people who seem religious are good. Excellent, fair discussion.
I really wish I had watched this live, but this is actually my first time on the channel! I have a friend who went to BYU and she said that having a church recommended counselor/therapist violate HIPPA and tell the church and school about certain things is actually a common occurrence and people just don’t know that they can fight it. She said people get kicked out left and right and that’s part of why the church pushes these counselors so much.
She doesn’t seem, she is. She starved her kids, left them alone for weeks at a time, did not send them to school, and let someone else discipline her kids violently as well as all the crazy harsh punishments to her kids which included leaving them without food when misbehaving. She’s disgusting and needs to get many years in prison
I feel for those kids. When I grew up my parents thought it was proper punishment to “send me to bed without supper”. My stomach would hurt with hunger pains and I would just sit up and wait until enough time passed after everyone went to sleep so I could sneak to the kitchen and get some food. (I also started stashing food in my room). I can’t imagine this going on for days. Poor kids - talk about trauma. 😢
My Mom did that to me also. She would give me a slice of bologna and slice of cheese for lunch while everyone else had sandwiches and chip and chocolate cake for dessert. I washed dishes, cleaned house did laundry took care of pets and siblings and if they did anything wrong it was my fault. Large families often have a scapegoat. My youngest sister liked to tattle on me . She married a Mormon. Not surprised.
that's how I wound up with bulimia! I'd eat a whole loaf of bread or something out of hunger pain, I'd gotten fat doing that and then because I was in trouble for gaining weight I'd throw it back up. They sent me to fat camp and I got bullied for being a normal weight lol. My ED morphed into anorexia with bulimic traits. I'd break and eat a whole bunch then toss it up to hide the evidence aka the weight. Even now as a married woman in my own house I can't eat without heavy shame and I ask permission to eat anything I did not purchase, including leftovers I cooked myself. I just can't break the food shame mindset. I still hide dishes, if my husband sees a dish and it's not for something I made for both of us I panic -- not that he cares, it's just so ingrained.
I was discussing this with my family when all this news came out. This never happened to my sister and me, but I do remember seeing parents sending their children to bed without supper in old television shows and movies when I was child. One of my favorite books growing up was _Where the Wild Things Are_ and in this book Max is sent to bed without his supper. Though, in those old movies and TV shows (and in my favorite book) one parent would eventually relent and bring food to their child, it does appear that there was a time that this was something that was common place and not looked at as abuse.
I was brought to your channel by the algorithm. I want to thank you for clear unbiased content about these very worrying and sad events concerning Ruby Fanke and Jodi Hildebrante. Knowing the in depth research and time that went in to your content thank you. As a non Mormon, your content opened my knowledge about not just those involved but the Mormon Church and the purity teaching. It was a great incite. Also I hope people realise that all religions have good and bad. Thank you
Facts and well said. Maybe look at his long list of videos, I’m also not a Mormon but grew up w them in So Nevada and although I don’t agree w everything he says, I have learned so much and respect him very much and am thankful for all his hard work and sacrifice put into this channel and thrilled to finally see some significant growth after putting out so much content for so many years and getting the recognition this content deserves, and another great video John, thx! Godspeed;)
What is baffling about this situation is that they had so many followers subscribed to this garbage and exploitation for YEARS! I couldn't watch this for one episode! Her treatment of her kids is deplorable and people gave her money to watch it i cant believe that it wouldnt be considered verbal and emotional abuse by authoritiesw😮 just withholding food and speaking about it should have had this channel shut down. Why did so many followers condone her parenting practices??? Thank you for bringing awareness to this.
Thank God my parents were normal, relaxed human beings! I never would have survived with a crazy parent like Ruby. The kids who rebelled the most back in my youth were those whose parents watched their every move and set all kinds of harsh rules and limits.
I'm not going to watch this video because child abuse is too triggering for me. That being said, I'm glad this is being covered and wish the best for these kids.
Is it not borderline abuse for a child to be locked in a room with an adult being questioned about touching themselves? It feels abusive to me. You all have opened my eyes to so much. Thank you for great informative content!
They are not locked in with anyone. The Bishop now asks parents if they want to be with the child and many times encourages that. Bishops are volunteers who were asked to do the job of helping an entire congregation. They aren't perfect, but the Bishop's number one goal is to love and help that individual. He wants to see them happy, and that involves stopping addictive behavior.
@@ramsrnja it's a problematic situation on so many levels. Primarily a minor is put in a vulnerable situation where the potential for abuse is extremely high.
Thank you SO MUCH for having Jordan & McKay on! I feel like they are one of the few people that are covering this case with knowing so much backstory on the situation. It’s such a complicated story so it’s easy to get confused. I give grace to those who have gotten things wrong but it’s so easy for things to spiral into things that aren’t even happening.
I brought my therapy dog to see teen young women at the Utah State Hospital in Utah County. One of the girls became very attached and it was arranged that I would bring him to her outpatient therapy. She eventually ended up in that place in Orem and I was supposed to be able to see her…with the permission of her parents who thought my dog and ai were great influences on her. They told me they had arranged it. When I called to go, I was told no. So I asked if I could speak on the phone to her…”no.” I explained that I was on the list and was told that her therapist decided that I couldn’t see her. It was so weird. I was so worried that she’d think I abandoned her.
Here are my “whys”: Why did this Ruby person have all these kids when clearly she didn’t understand anything about children? Why did the husband allow this to happen? Why wasn’t she arrested years ago when it was clear her children were being abused? Why would anyone enjoy watching this type of video exploiting and abusing children? I just don’t get it. I never heard of these people until now but their content appeared to be mundane at best and cruel at worst.
Mormon missionaries came to my house for a year but they could not answer any of my concerns because when a Morm has concerns they are instructed to pray unti they get over it. I told them about info available on the LDS website but they weren't allowed to read it. I would look them in their eyes and see Stepford wives. And I told them what I saw. They finally gave up.
@@knewsome47 very interesting. I have toyed about what to do when those young missionaries come around. They are so young that sometimes I feel guilty about bursting their bubbles like I am the meanie who breaks the news that Santa Claus doesn’t exist. But other times I feel like they are old enough and it is about time someone tells them the truth. Your analogy of stepford wives is very accurate
Kevin is totally complicit in the abuse; he was there when those small children watched their siblings open presents and they got nothing, he was there when his oldest son slept on a beanbag for 7 months. I think it’s unlikely he was involved in the state of the children who were rescued from the home, but he was part of the environment that allowed this kind of food deprivation and physical abuse to continue and escalate. I hope he is not granted custody but I recognize that the level of abuse the children experienced in his absence was much greater, so maybe he will be. But I don’t believe he is a healthy parent who will care for them well if he gets custody.
Have you considered that it was Ruby’s way no other way. He had no say in how she raised the kids. With the fact he worked as a professor and was out of town often especially if a earthquake had happened some where.
@@breams8973as an adult he did have a say. If he believed they were being abused, he could have taken him, filed for divorce and custody, and brought evidence to court to show the kids were being mistreated by her. It's not an easy road but it's required for parents to keep their kids safe even if it will make the abuser mad.
“Virtue signaling” aka demonstrating bigotry in the case of that fast food chain. In my observation of the prevalent culture in Utah there’s is such a push to perfectionism that “fake perfect” seems better than authentic. In relation to troubled teens, one LDS neighbor sent their daughter to a Christian camp for troubled teens in Jamaica where she was forced to wear dresses that resembled FLDS garb. I was horrified. How do you protect your 13 year old child when they’re in another country?
The fast food chain didn't demonstrate bigotry. Saying your religion doesn't believe in something isnt hate....it does say those things in the Bible about homosexuality, but many of us are conflicted on that. I dont think the people who went to chic FIL a were all there for good reasons....I would go to support a chain that stands by their convictions, and to support people being free to have their own beliefs . If others went for hateful reasons thats not on the chain. Also most religions have far harsher and actual hate filled views on lgbtq issues....chic FIL a showed they aren't bigots by donating free food on a Sunday when the pulse night club tragedy happened. I hate ruby turned the chic FIL a thing into more than it was in my opinion.
@@erikaelyse8192I have never gone to that chain since they took that stance and they only changed their tune because it was hurting their business- so many people boycotted them. Businesses need to keep their religion out of business because not all their customers even share their beliefs and they alienate them- which means losing money.
_I have been thinking for many years that Ruby is a closeted sadist after I watched her interactions with her children. She is full of GLEE when punishing them, and the punishments themselves were always way overboard._ 😑
I’m not associated with the LDS church but, I wanted to get my head around this case and found you through Hidden True Crime and Jessi Hildebrandt’s interview. Y’all have done a stellar job in this collaboration. I definitely got clarity about all of the players, as well as, perhaps the nuances of their relationships and beliefs that just aren’t available through most other major outlets. Thank you for delivering so much information in a clear and thoughtful manner. I’m subscribing to both channels to show my support.
My sister worked at one of those camps and has since sent her step daughter to one due to what she determined was unhealthy, sexual behavior. My niece was only 15 when she went there and actually ran away twice. It literally broke my heart that I couldn’t step in because I did not find out until after the fact. I still carry a lot of guilt, especially since my niece has essentially cut off the entire family. I literally cannot believe these institutions even exist.
I hope one day you can reconnect with your niece and let her know how truly sorry you are that you weren't there for her, and that you want to be there for her now. Maybe someday she will be ready for that.
Also, can we acknowledge the children had to save themselves while everyone watched their abuse taking place online consistently?!! I’d never heard of this family until a few days ago. To hear so many people reporting that they have been watching this family in the abuse for years. It’s so disturbing.
Unfortunately reports to child services from strangers on the internet can make the local services pay less attention to the case, not more, so when you're a stranger on the internet there's very little you actually can do to make it stop as an individual
I went through the exact same "sex therapy" group that is being discussed around ~1:42:00. It's called "LifeStar" and there are programs like this all over the state. Truly a horrific experience with the group shaming and punishment. I was in the program from ages 16-18.
Jordan and McKay are just phenomenal. I found them first, then found Mormon Stories, and love you all for your knowledge, your empathy, and compassion.
This had been reported several times. The oldest son reported it 2020, her followers reported her, even created a petition to have the children removed. NOBODY believed the children. IMO, CPS & LE need to be checked out, why did they drop the ball? A lot of this could have been avoided if someone had listened to & believed the children.
How on earth would "Mormon authorities" know what was going on in someone's home. And why should they need to be made aware. This is criminal behavior, something only law enforcement can deal with.
Do you know the Mormon Church are not the police, child protective services or legal authority?? Adults who observed starving children or who wondered why they did not appear at school should have called police or child protection. Church couldn't care less.
their videos are bringing up memories for me. i feel so terrible for all of the children. i cannot imagine the struggles they will have for the rest of their lives. what egregious parenting and therapy. it's a travesty that not everyone will be held accountable - like the bishops/mormon employees who recommended jodi's practice. my heart goes out to all of the victims.
I’m so glad McKay said what I have been wanting to scream from the rooftops: that the focus has been mainly on Ruby (the blonde beauty social media phenom), allowing Jodi to avoid the spotlight and scrutiny that she and her philosophy needs. You all are doing a great job!
I knew about this family here and there because of other channels' coverage of them and was always somewhat interested as someone who was raised in a strict, violent, angry, traditional Christian household. As someone who grew up with very strict, disciplinarian parents who were like Ruby lite, I can understand the feeling the children and family may have felt that they were unheard - on the channel Markie, he has a video from a few months ago where the sisters and Shari seemed to insinuate that there was things happening behind the scenes, if she was isolating them more and more, and taught them to sweep the problems under the rug (I was taught this as a child to not "air out our family's dirty laundry" - which to my parents could be very innocuous things - or I'd be punished for it) the extended family may not have known how bad things may have gotten. I feel so much for those children and hope they are surrounded by support so they can heal
I hope this message gets out to all those poor people that need it. It's outrageous behaviour to punish people for their sexual desire - which is merely a human trait.
Just happened to see this video because of the Hildebrant/Franke news, and as an ex-Mormon was curious to listen in. Can't hear the whole episode for well over 3 hours (!), but I appreciate the honest information Jordan McKay are sharing. I'll have to reopen it over the next few days. Thanks, John!
I know this is the introduction. But the bravery of that young boy…so amazing! My heart breaks for him! If I could hold him and make it better I would. I looked at my son and held him after this story broke. I couldn’t ever imagine doing this! So I just wanted to take 2 seconds and give the credit to this boy who is his own hero and the hero to his sister!!! ❤❤❤
Very courageous young man and as a Social Worker in the Aboriginal/Criminal Justice systems and I can assure you that current CPS systems need urgent reformation and I have been working to change certain laws and wake people up regarding the plight of children in the system particularly in relation to foster care and child placement! Children are Sacred and deserve the very best of love and care that we have to offer! 👵🏽✌🏾🦅☀️🦅🙏🏽
Hi. Would you ever do a video/ podcast about the Mormon scrapbooking industry culture? The scrapbooking industry is dominated by Mormon women with families, who document and publicise their families online in order to sell their crafting products. Heidi Swapp, Maggie Holmes, Becky Higgins, Lizzie Kartchner (there are many more) are the biggest names in scrapbooking and are all Mormon. One ‘famous’ scrapbooker, Heidi Swapp, her 16 year old son died by suicide. He had told her that he wanted to leave the Mormon Church and she wouldn’t allow it. She blogged his funeral and posted all the photos online. She even released scrapbooking products inspired by his suicide (which I thought was so distasteful, the proceeds weren't even going to charity!) I wonder how the kids feel abut their Mom’s putting their lives online in other to sell their products and this perfect family lifestyle?
It was a very informative broadcast. It helped me understand why Kevin may not have custody of the kids. Now, all the children need a safe custodial home, and the supports needed.
Oh course not, Keven will not be given custody of his kids. There's procedures that CPS will put him through. He will have to go through lot of interviews and visit before CPS will hand his kids over to him. That is a if. His kids might decide they want live with one of their aunts. There's also a possibility that Ruby could end up with a none guilty verdict. But it depends on what her kids tell the person that is questioning them that will determined in what verdict she get. A mental verdict could keep her out of prison. But, she will lose all custody of her kids if that happens, she won't be allow to be around children at all. The other two verdict will be best for her..
Why is Ruby considered an parenting expert ? She constantly sharing that her children are “troubled” and need punishment. The only people I would consider as parenting experts would be those with healthy happy adults because they are clearly doing something right.
She was considered parenting expert because she is a " life coach", you know, the trendy thing people do in a few weeks or months to be able to "help" others. In reality they went to a few seminars and learned how to build money from others.
She told me that on several occasions and I was like sweetheart, I have a professional therapist for that. I don't need a neighbor knowing any more of my business than what they THINK they already know.
John you are such a good dude. This situation is horrific. It’s like the Duggers meets the Turpins (that disgusting couple that tied up their kids, abused and starved them). I’m sure I’ll find out but where are the two older kids and can they help the younger siblings?! Jordan and McKay know their stuff, was nice to discover them.
Shari doesn’t live with her Aunt Julie. Julie and her family recently moved to Kansas City. Shari is back at BYU. Interestingly, their Aunt Ellie lives in St. George-so close to where the events took place. Reddit is wondering if the Griffiths grandparents would end their mission early in light of what happened.
This whole thing made me so incredibly angry,shocked and sad. These kids went through so much abuse. Your perspectives needed to be told. Thank you. One of the best podcasts.
In my experience growing up Mormon (though I’m 57), Love is earned. It’s conditional. When I came out lgbtq my parents and didn’t talk for years. My gay friend Craig in SLC committed suicide after his parents shut th door on him at 15 y/o. IME LDS teaches cruelty. I wasn’t a perfect parent and my kids weren’t either but every moment even now I love them No Matter What!
@@michwoodside yes even now- what kind of sinister Alex jones conspiracy did you think I meant?? I love my Children- regardless! Wow, what did ‘even now’ mean? hahahahaha dude you need therapy- full 🛑
@cwb1400 God's love for YOU is UNCONDITIONAL. That doesn't mean He loves sin or that sin is healthy or good for you. Heaven will be full of sinners. God knows this & sent His Son anyway to pay the price for us. That doesn't mean we should not attempt to be better or claim our sins aren't sins though.
My kids in highschool forget their lunch, if I couldn’t make it, I would have food delivered, or borrow a lunch ticket and send $ the next day, what she’s doing is as a parent she isn’t taking responsibility because she forgot to make sure the child had her lunch when they left, because that’s her responsibility as a parent especially to monitor the younger kids she is making the child suffer for her lack of being a good parent is so wrong
It is a relief to hear that the safe incident was actually another call. Until you stop and realize that means that, at the same moment in the same jurisdiction another child was trapped in a safe room. That kids’ parents aren’t internet famous so we won’t know the backstory or the outcome, but it’s a reminder that these high profile stories are unfortunately snapshots of what’s unfortunately happening in who knows what number of not famous households.
She stands in Abuse and says her kids were being damaged by “entitlement”??? She lived off abuse of those kids!!! She was mad viewers were calling her and Jodie out and couldn’t take it. Couldn’t put the kids on film because they probably looked starved and abused at this point. Jodie doesn’t have custody of her own kids!!! He ex raised them!!! Get real!
Thank you for doing this interview. This interview has been very informative. I think a lot of people watched their channel because they developed a parasocial relationship with the family. It's really unhealthy for strangers to know such intimate details about the kids. I hope that all the kids can now recover from the lack of privacy.
Thank you for this thoughtful review of this case. When I was in the 6th grade I had a friend whose mother abused her little sister 4 years old (long story) one day my friend asked me to stop being so nice to her sister; because when I leave “she” her mother gives it to her worse. Very sad. This was the late 70’s. Her mother did finally get hers but it was many years later.
I found Mormon Stories through Jordan and McKay and last summer I watched so much of your content. I haven't been watching much lately, but I have kept up with Jordan and McKay. It's nice to have them bring me back here again.
Ruby is going to run back to Kevin, the church will sacrifice Jodi, and use the whole thing as a PR campaign to the power of the Mormon church to save and support families from the evil of straying.
When I lived in Houston in the 80’s my church encouraged us to attend a meeting where a special speaker was coming. He had left the Mormon faith. He was to speak on the Mormon beliefs. As the speaker was starting the vestibule doors opened and 6 men stood at the back of the church. They men were dressed in white shirts and tied. Immediately the speaker was shuffled off the side door and the meeting was dismissed. Frightening.
I moved out of Utah a few years ago (only non-Mormon in my neighborhood) and I can't tell you how glad I am to be out of that area. It was bizarre at times -- including a group of women who all were hanging out at one family's beach house in CA and decided to all greet their husbands (together) wearing their underwear -- and asking each husband which one was the sexiest....WEIRD. I can tell you all sorts of things about MLM CEOs in my neighborhood and the most fascinating thing .... ALL they cared about was how much money everyone was making
Sounds about right! Bunko groups... wow mind blowing conversations about sex, their husband, money, and personal lives... the woman!! Weirdest cats I have ever met!
@@auggiedoggiesmommy1734-tell them. Be clear in your telling, truthful and unbiased. I’m here to learn, as a member of society, a lot can be gleamed from true stories.
As a teacher, yes, I would step in and give her lunch. She’s 6 and no, you shouldn’t feel ok about leaving the teacher feeling uncomfortable about YOUR daughter being hungry. We had a 6 year old hop in the car for school without putting shoes on. The teacher called his mom to ask to bring him shoes. His mom wouldn’t bring him shoes to teach him a lesson to bring shoes next time. That was a punishment for the teacher who didn’t get a break from kids that day because he had to stay inside for recess with her while she ate her lunch. It’s your responsibility as a parent to make sure that your kids, especially 6 year old kids, leave the house with shoes and lunch every day.
That happen to me when I was in second grade. That day my mom didn't fix my lunch or gave me money for lunch. So I ask my friend for money and our teacher step in and told him not give any of his money. When we got to the lunch room, she made my set a table by myself. I started crying and Lunch lady came over. Ask me what's wrong, I told her. Then she told me get in the lunch line and get your lunch. I said I don't have any money. She said that's ok go get your lunch, I go talk to your teacher.
@@kenmdem @kenmdem That lunch lady is an angel!♥
“the teacher is uncomfortable with her being hungry” if a 6 year old in distress doesn’t make you uncomfortable, i don’t know what to tell you.
I agree… at that age it is easy to forget things. But Ruby wanted to play the strict responsible mom teaching their kids life lessons. Fast forward she’s an insane monster mom and child abuser who starved that same little girl that forgot her lunch. It is very sad. Specially knowing that Russell the 12 year old that escaped was so malnourished that he stopped growing. But they are safe now but will have to get so much therapy after all of this. It took this to save them.
I didn’t have it as rough as those kids but i know what it’s like to be so anxious at home that basic tasks are hard. I would imagine there’s more going on if a child shows up to school without shoes
Thank you John & MSP for having us on again! It’s always an honor! ❤️ -Jordan & McKay
You two are the real deal! Thank you for your professionalism. John is pretty awesome too!
So glad to see this here! Was pretty disheartened to see someone like KJ was featured on the news about this story when there are so many creators better equipped to address this situation and I was ready to hear from you guys a little more about this.
@@Schu0086that ladys a drama queen and her names attracts more clicks & views. Especially since she is a UA-camr as well as the 8p fam
Jordan, were you channeling your inner Olivia (H3 Podcast) when you made this slideshow? lol On slide 2, when you said, "Our players are..." that's definitely what it reminded me of. ❤️
@@leeanncornett5246 yes, she’s a hot mess. She’s in the middle of her fifth defamation lawsuit and it’s not going well (if you look at the court documents instead of listen to her spin on it). Also there was a promise from the Derricos to immediately litigate against her. I think she’s trying very hard to stay relevant and bolster her follower base before she’s hit with some kind of media muzzle that will impact her reach.
What does an adult do if they forget their lunch? Do you go hungry? No. You go buy something, get delivery, etc. Yet a 6 year-old child is expected to go hungry. So she's imposing standards on a little kid that adults don't even have to abide by. This is enraging.
not to mention the child is actually growing!
Good point
Excellent point Linda!! 👍🏼
Sometimes adults have to go without eating too if they don't have money, but a child has zero choice in the matter.
Exactly! It’s not teaching her anything! It’s just punishment for punishments sake.
I was sent to a teen program owned by and LDS family in Arizona for over a year when I was 16. The church not only suggested it to my parents, they also paid for the entire thing- over $50,000. It was horrific emotional and mental abuse I still struggle with 25 years later. I’d love to see all those programs shut down.
_I am so sorry, you were let down in a horrific way._ 😢
I’m so sorry that happened to you and can’t believe that a church would spend that much money on that. You have that much money and couldn’t spend it on things that are more beneficial to help out the community. What part of AZ was it in? I’m just curious because I’m from there.
Not to down play your experience, but the church are experts on separation and isolation in and emotionally abusive program. It's called: the mission. 20 years since my mission amd I still deal with the anger from that experience every single day.
@feistyshlomit6719 The Canadian government has no credibility in the world anymore.
Amen
The scariest part is how much delight Ruby takes in talking about her punishments.
This!!!! Both of them the husband did it too but I always felt that pit feeling watching videos of her
Sadism
Exactly. Sadistic behavior. She's the devil, and so is Jodi.
People who are not Mormon, who are not in the harsh or abusive mode of treating others (children or ANYONE), see what Ruby was even before Jodi. Ruby was a sadist prior to meeting Jodi so it is not as Ruby presented later, when she wept at the sentencing…like she had been in so terribly influenced by Jodi. The phone calls between Kevin and Ruby when she was first in jail tell the story of what is true…they were on the same page, they believed in the harsh treatment of the children, they believed the children had evil in them (when the truth most likely is that Ruby and definitely Jodi are partially possessed. Listen to Kevin speaking about when Jodi moved into their home for awhile and research exorcisms, and Jerry Marzinsky’s work).
@JordanandMcKay, @Mormon Stories Podcast as a former watcher of 8passengers I quickly want to give two examples of the youngest daughter's "egregious" behavior, that was pointed out in two vlogs.
1) The first one must haven taken place shortly after Jodi came into their lives. It was still in the old house, around 2019, so E. was 5 or 6 years old. The family was getting ready to go to the movies when it was decided that Ruby would stay home with E., because E. had to be punished for not being "humble". Now what could a 5/6 year old have done to not be humble? She had asked which movie they were going to see. Yep. A question that 99,9% of people would ask if they were going to the movies. But Ruby explained that the children had to be grateful for whichever movie they were going to see. Now just to make that clear: it was NOT that E. had asked which movie they were going to see, was told which one it was and then threw a tantrum. NOTHING the like. Simply her asking about the movie was considered entitled/ungrateful/not humble and had to be punished.
2) The other incident was in the new house, so must have been a year or two later, with E. now being 6 or 7. The video was titled something like "being sick sucks" or whatever. In it, Ruby told us that E. was having a pretty high fever and was sick in bed. She went on to explain that she had heard E. whimpering throughout the night and at one time get up and go downstairs in the kitchen to get herself some ice. Ruby went on to explain that she did NOT get up to check on E., because she thought her 6 year old daughter whimpering throughout the night was an attempt of manipulation. So this mom didn't check on her little girl who was clearly in distress to punish her for "manipulating" her parents. She was also gleaming when she was recounting this story and didn't seem to feel any kind of remorse about her behavior, even when she found out the next morning that E. was actually sick.
These are the types of "behavior" the little kids displayed to be labled as being "in distortion" by Jodi and Ruby.
On a side note: E. sometimes got in trouble at school for kinda being the class clown. Which is tragic, because this behavior was actually taught to her by Ruby. E. was constantly filmed since she was a toddler and she was made to act early on. If she did something funny or cute and the camera wasn't on, she was encouraged to reenact it for the camera. She was praised for being silly/funny/spunky/cute in front of the camera all the time, she was told that viewers loved it and was given more attention from her mom when behaving like that, because she delievered content for Ruby's camera. She was absolutely groomed to be hyper and acting to entertain and make people like her. It doesn't come as a surprise then that a 5/6/7 year old applies the same methods to be liked at school. It was the one behavior she knew would get her attention and love.
This is so incredibly sad. I have no words.😢
Ruby protests to much about same sec relationships is she hiding in plain sight🤔Cape Town 👍🌍🇿🇦🌈
@@joywilson9718 Ruby and Jodi an item? Maybe, that would not be a surprise.
Thank you for explaining this, I was wondering what would be considered egregious. Also the "they're just manipulating" is often an excuse for denying medical care to kids in the troubled teen industry, for example it played a role in the death of Taylor Goodrich (I think that's her last name). Why are accusations of being manipulative so common in Utah/Mormon culture, when the person in question is just trying to get their needs met?
@@nomadicamthe short answer is yes! For example, i was told by an instan care dr. That if I didn't check in to an emergency room ICU in 2 hours he didn't expect me to live. Instead, I called my mission president (so yes, I was a legal adult and was asking my mormon leadership authority permission to go to an emergency room) he said no, I was faking it. Can you even believe that's how much of my autonomy I had given away. Shocking to me now
"No limit to what they can justify when they have defined abuse as love" -- Jordan. YES! That says it all. Thank you, Jordan
Spot on
those sound like lyrics to a country song id listen to on repeat
Having raised 2 wonderful, smart, compassionate daughters (who both, it turns out, have ADHD), I can't even begin to imagine letting them go hungry for things they forgot to do when they were little.
Kids, even if they don't have ADHD, are all little space cadets, because their minds are busy figuring out this thing called Life. What a horrible thing, to punish them for being human.
THIS
THIS 💯
Exactly! It’s a MISTAKE! I’ll never understand punishment for making a simple mistake. It creates adults afraid to do anything challenging.
Well, I hope she does not expect the system to be lenient with her, she needs to learn a lesson…
Sadly this mother from hell does not seem very human herself.
Ruby strikes me as a straight-up psychopath. She’s cruel to her children just because, and she gets a kick out of it. She smiles and giggles talking about the abuse. It’s horrific.
It struck me that the only time Ruby cried was not when her children were suffering, but when she had to give up "millions" of dollars by shutting down 8 Passengers. Can you say narcissist?
She wants to win
My mom got up two decades from the early 1980s to the early 2000s every single morning at 5 a.m. - to make sure we would have enough food at school at make it punctual to school.
Yeah, very horrific. When I first saw clips of her channel, I thought it was a joke. I thought that there is no way a mother is not only doing these things, but proudly broadcasting it. It really shows how crazy she truly is. She doesn’t believe she is wrong. She thinks abusive behavior is normal. I mean, I don’t want to absolve her of responsibility by implying she doesn’t know right from wrong. She’s a functioning adult who knows right from wrong. But she has somehow convinced herself that what she was doing was okay and normal.
A lot of abusers hide the abuse. They try to keep up a facade of normality. She didn’t even attempt to hide it.
It shows how dangerous extreme religious beliefs can be. A toxic religious leader can convince people that these things are right. I will never understand how people fall for them. Ruby had to have already had some evil in her to do everything she did. Religion can be a powerful tool for abusers. Jodi’s influence just gave her a perceived “pass” to act on it.
Now that we know about Jodi too - this is truly a frightening matchup!
it's crazy how social workers seem to think neat and tidy people can't be abusers... Our home was neat and tidy BECAUSE of abusive screaming and yelling and dragging kids out of dead sleep at 3am to "complete the chore chart" that was sterile hospital environment level nutso. How many non abusive cluttery people are dragged through the ringer because they don't have a dishwasher or live in a small sq ft house that looks more messy than a rich person with 3000sqft house with the exact same number of items "out" of place. As kids initialy it felt affirming that our mom was being reported but you know how many times we bothered to speak up to CPS after they kept LEAVING us in the home after investigating and being enamored by the martha stewart decor-zero times. what's the point. so we can be in extra trouble when you leave? I'm tired of social worker excuses. You don't have a good model to assess abuse. That's the bottom line. You're bias and shooting in the dark. Being overworked isn't the real core of the issue.
Yeah, I've noticed this too. My family was what you would consider middle class. My grandma finally reported my parents for abuse of me and my younger sibling when I was a teenager. (I'd been telling her what was going on for years.) There's definitely a class/socioeconomic element within what gets investigated thoroughly and what does not. I was not allowed contact with my grandma after she reported. That was the "punishment" because my grandma and I were close. Just because the house is clean and looks nice/the kids have nice clothes doesn't mean abuse isn't going on. I would say given my experience that most middle-class abusers know enough about the system and how it works to tow a fine line. My parents were highly educated and it plays a role in whether or not a child will be believed. Another way, I was punished was to be given counseling when I was younger after telling school staff what was going on at home. It looked good on the outside, but my parents wanted to convince me that I was the problem.
But no one gets privileged treatment like the meth addicts. They put several kids a week in the hospital, and the kids are sent back as soon as they get out of the hospital. Several have been killed.☠️☠️☠️☠️
What a sick piece of crap. I can't wait for her to get her wake-up call.
I agree and I am a Social Worker!
Ruby Franke sounds like she was 3 steps away from us finding her kids missing and deceased ala Lori Vallow. The greatest news is that one of her children was given the strength to escape and get help for themself and their siblings. Getting these children away from this household is the best thing for them. Her husband is also culpable for allowing this to happen!
Yes thank God those kids are safe now. I can’t stop thinking that those kids could’ve been dead if that boy didn’t run for his life.
I cannot accept the lack of intervention from the dad. Wifey says you can’t have contact--absolutely NOT.
100% they were actually looking for land in AZ that they said would give them the space and isolation for the kids to enact the full "treatment". I think those kids were definitely going to be killed.
Ruby is a sadist. She might not admit it to herself, but she takes pleasure in her kids pain. There is no other name for her behavior. Who knows what went on when the cameras weren't on...
This is in line with my theory she has an underdeveloped amygdala. One of the few emotions she can empathize with is fear . This may be why her eyes light up when she causes this to her children. She gets feedback from their fear.
Psychopath
there was this video where she wanted (for some reason???) to blame Chad for her stomach ache, even Jodi had to tell her that it wasn't the case (well, she told her that she was in distortion, but you get the idea) - but Ruby nonetheless wanted to blame him for it. this woman is not okay.
The clip where she threatened her oldest he wouldn't be able to eat that day if he didn't stop playing with his little brother. The two boys were laughing and playing, and she couldn't stand it! No joy in her household!
No matter what she should never have custody of her children ever again
You seem to be correct.
John, I greatly appreciate your push to describe the pictures and what is going on to make this site more accessible for those with disabilities.
Children aren’t little manipulative adults walking around trying to trick parents with some voodoo into giving them love and Pepperidge Farm cookies. Parents that parent from that mindset windup raising manipulative adults that are still just little kids trying desperately to get their needs met getting into all kinds of bad situations. It’s is a survival trait. Too many parents walking around wanting Bare Minimum Awards.
Thanks to you all. This has been an incredible show. I love the time you take on giving all the story instead of just little sensationalized tidbits
LOL; that "voodoo" is their cuteness. Her kids are so beautiful; if I were their parent, they'd be spoiled silly.
oh yes. Lots of love and hugs @@timriehl1500
@@timriehl1500 I agree, but even that word “spoiled” - which I also sometimes use to mean “treated with great love, affection, and attention” - has unnecessary negative connotations. All children deserve love and attention at a minimum.
yeah that's 100% a recipe for cluster B personality disorders, BPD in particular.
Never once did I go to school without my lunch or bus money ( to come home ). Never once. Neither did any of my 5 siblings. My mom was in charge of making sure when we left we had all we needed to take. No drama ever !!! Thanks MOM :)
Ruby, expected the little girl to make her lunch. She was just a small child. How ridiculous this woman is.😢😢😢
Children learn what love is, what doing for others is, by having their mother and their father love them and do things for them, particularly when they are so young.
I did. My parents both worked so if I forgot my lunch I was SOL I was fine. Just a little hungry.
❤❤❤❤❤
That’s what a loving mother does. I can’t imagine my babies out there in the world “alone”.
I am a 58 year old grandma that started watching the Griffiths families in 2015 when I was living in a different state than my own grandchildren and missed them terribly. I stopped watching Ruby about 2 and a half years ago because her actions with her kids made me very uncomfortable. I never dreamed something this severe would happen. My heart is just breaking for those kids. And their grandparents being so far away. Their father is equally as responsible as Ruby is for those kids conditions, he has no excuse for not knowing.
Of course he knew. He lived in that house and didn’t seem to stop the disciplinary actions Ruby carried out. Terrible parents, I think Kevin needs to be charged , also.😢😢😢
Wow…I can relate …did the same ( 60 year old grandma )
as are the rest of that family who have admitted they KNEW what was going on with those children.
Ellie and Jarrod and their pathetic statement. They KNEW and they chose to do NOTHING.
@@lindajohnson. He looks like Mr. Clean, but he really isn't. Both parents need to be stripped of parental rights.
@@lindajohnson. Yes, from everything I've seen so far (and I didn't even know about this family until this week), it looks like...at best...Kevin just checked out mentally, physically and emotionally and just let things happen. (His attitude seems to have been "whatever you say, Ruby".) I gather from statements made here and there, though, that when these recent events happened Kevin and Ruby had been separated for some time and the kids weren't living with Kevin. The duct tape, extreme starvation/emaciation and isolation things were happening at Jodi's house in Ivins, Utah (close to St. George). Things probably escalated after the separation and when Ruby and Jodi had complete custody of the kids. Hard to say whether Kevin knew the full extent of what was going on at Jodi's house. He definitely SHOULD have been more pro-active and concerned about their welfare and SHOULD have known how dangerous it would be to let Ruby just have free reign, since she seems to have demonstrated an almost sadistic glee in meting out harsh discipline in the past. Kevin seems to have been way too detached and unconcerned. But I have no idea what went on in their household for the 90% of the time that the cameras weren't turned on. Ruby was probably in charge of editing everything they uploaded in the past.
Never once did "the gift of pain" cross my mind when I think of my child, regardless of if i thought he needed to learn a lesson. As a parent, as much as I want to protect him from all pain, the thought of contributing to it hurts my heart.
Thank you for covering this story. Ruby wanted to absolutely break her child’s spirit and have complete compliance. How absolutely tragic when a mother stops feeling, understanding and empathising with what her child is going through. What a complicated trauma those children much have when this treatment by their mother is construed as ‘love’
Dame thing with the Duggars break the kids spirit when there young ! End up like quiet little robots !
I'm not sure Ruby ever stopped feeling empathy because I'm not sure she ever started.
I think Ruby may have some cognitive empathy as in, she's learned what people usually feel in certain situations, but she herself cannot feel it or empathize. I think she has an underdeveloped amygdala and may be a psychopath.
When she put a blanket and pillow by the toilet for her five-year-old who had gotten sick in the night, and then she went back to bed...
Horrific!
She’s an absolute piece of work with her perfect hair and makeup and outfits, while she passes judgment on a nine yr old kid for not being humble enough or having sufficient gratitude. Heart breaking to see the earlier videos of Russell and Eve and know that they wound up bound and starved by their lunatic mother. She’s too proud and stubborn to show any remorse or back down from her ridiculous nonsense so hopefully the judge will throw the book at her and she’ll sit in prison for YEARS. Happy 10th Birthday to little Eve, I hope she gets to see her older sister at least. In the video where Ruby threatened to cut off her bear’s head, Sherri swooped in to hug her and I suspect that happened a lot.
One has to wonder where her mother expected her to get her example for humility….
A side note on Ruby denying to bring Eve a lunch at school: it had been mentioned in previous vlogs that Eve was underweight and her pediatrician was concerned and had instructed Ruby on getting her to take in more calories. I had watched their vlogs, and that point was what horrified me the most. There obviously were huge issues with food!!!
Ruby used that as punishment. If the kids didn’t behaved as she wanted or did what she told those kids starved they didn’t get any food!! That’s why they are malnutrition. It’s so sick and evil! It makes my blood boil.
This is a huge case. It has already reached the news in my country, Portugal. I really hope Ruby, Jodi, but also Kevin don't get away with this.
@@JustJ-Me , yes, I was a subscriber of 8 passengers, so I helped creating the monster. But I don't think most of the portuguese were aware. Plus, here the news are not complete. For example, they don't mention that the police also found E ( I don't want to say her name) in the house. They only talk about the 12 years old boy. This case is also news in England. I saw it on a TV channel
@@julianarodriguex899 , honestly, what we hear in Europe is probably only the tip of the iceberg
I am German and watched 8 passengers when I was younger. I guess it was interesting for us Europeans to watch how people - and Mormons live in America. I remember thinking: wow such a strict mom. But to some extent I was just thinking: oh okay, that's how things are in America.
I stopped watching when Chad was sent to camp. I found that too extreme.
I still followed occasionally and it definitely got worse and worse from there. Would be interesting to know when Jodi entered the picture. I wouldn't be surprised if it was 4 years ago. It would line up nicely.
I came across 8 passengers through Ruby 's parents. And then I began watching her sisters as well. And yes, for me too it was a way of understanding how mormans live. I watched her channel until the drama she made about the song 's lyrics in her one of her daughter 's school. And, honestly, I thought it was the mormon way of thinking. I hope I was wrong.....when she joined Jodi, I lost all interest. When did they met? For a long time or just in recent years?
Australia as well
I grew up with Ruby. She lived around the corner from me. We were not in the same ward, since my house was the boundary line for my ward, but we were in the same stake. We went to girls camps, and other stake activities together. We played together as little girls, slept over at each other's homes, went to each other's birthday parties, walked to school together... I am 2 years older than her, and she was 6 when her family moved in. I've been paying attention to the things going on with her for the last several years. And I'm horrified at where this has gone. I was disgusted at some of the things that went on with 8 Passengers, but I never would have thought that things would have gotten this extreme. I'm just sick over it.
You are so brave. Thank you for sharing your story with us. ❤ no one would have ever known she would have gone that far. Hope you're doing well now.
There are a lot of things that still aren't clear to me. I wonder how far back the connection between Ruby and Jodi go. I get the impression that Jodi was filling Ruby's head with horrific ideas long before they formally went into business together. Ruby may have been relatively normal before she came under the influence of Jodi. From what I've seen so far, it looks like Kevin's biggest failing was that he was just too passive and let Ruby make all of the parenting decisions. As things got progressively worse, it looks like he just wasn't up to dealing with it in any constructive way. Reading between the lines, the older kids seem to blame Ruby for the abuse and Kevin for enabling/stepping back and letting Ruby run wild. I'm just guessing at this point, based on the limited information available.
@@TEAM__POSEID0N Jodi started influencing the family when Chad was "acting up" (being a normal teenager). She's the one who recommended the wilderness camp so ig you could say she was behind the most unhinged decisions like taking his bed away.
It's interesting that you slept over at each other's homes. I lived in Alpine (as the only non-Mormon) for 24 years and sleeping over was a big no-no -- All the mom's I knew wouldn't let their kids stay over at anyone's home. I often wonder if they knew what was going on in certain homes, like the Brown family who lived in the neighborhood a street over from me. Especially considering she was 6 when they moved -- that is really young for a kid to sleep over at someone's home
@@TEAM__POSEID0N I've seen clips in which Kevin was fine with Ruby's abuse of his children. He is not innocent.
You can see that Ruby is clearly enjoying abusing her kids because every time she describes what she’s doing to them she looks so gleeful or is laughing. What a disgusting, cruel woman. I hope she gets the prison time she deserves
Right.. the look on her face is of evil almost like 'ya I did that, I thought of that punishment'
I get such creepy feels when she smiles like that
almost like the shiny happy people documentary where they were smiling and hugging the kids while spanking them….so insane
Either that or she plays it off as no big deal for the outside world
@@ilovetennis1691 That's totally bizarre! 🥺
Reminds me of Lori Vallow Daybell.
Can we all take a moment to think how brave little Russell was to seek help ? He saved all his siblings. ❤ I am praying for all these children. Also just my 2 cents…these family channels need to stop.
And on the audio, if I am remembering right, he literally comments that his treatment was “his fault,” which he must have been told repeatedly.
Tragic, and no, even if he was a convicted murderer in prison, what those 2 monsters did would be a crime. He seems like a great kid pushed to the brink.
Family channels are exploitation, full stop. Some are even abusive. They should be illegal.
Any idea how Russel is doing?
One of the most sad parts is when the 911 reporting call, he said that the escaped child said, It’s my fault. Rips the heart.
I have been watching tons of footage about this story and this was BY FAR the best , most comprehensive, and fair coverage of it. Thank you.
@@paulac2249 77u
@@paulac2249 uu77777
@@paulac2249Closer to 4 than 3. 😅 Better to watch one great four hour long video than four subpar one hour long videos, yeah?
I love Mormon Stories and how in depth and long their episodes are, but I tend to listen in chunks instead of all at once. I also usually speed up the video.
Hope you gave this video a watch -- it's really good if you're interested in the topic!
I’m an LCSW in Idaho and the harm that is sanctioned and hidden and ignored by this religion is wide spread. What you are doing is important.
I am an ex Mormon and I work in BH as well. I am astounded by the crimes and abuse and murder that is happening in this religion!
What's LCSW?
@@atmoms2 licensed Clinical Social Worker. I’ve been in private practice for years.
@@laurapierce1243 One son in the Francke family was assumed to have moved out, but I think they need to find him to make sure he wasn't murdered.
@@atmoms2 Licensed Clinical Social Worker. Usually very well educated and trained people skilled in the evaluation and care of struggling families.
My daughter forgot her lunch when she was about six. I ended up doordashing chick-fil-a so she had nuggets, fruit, and milk. I don’t make millions like Ruby does; it was an expensive meal for her but she had to eat. Just putting it out there that there are ways around it if you can’t get back to the school. What Ruby did is inexcusable.
True
absolutely!
Ruby's "if your child is on fire, you hurt them to put the fire out" example is INSANE. I have literally had a friend set themselves (accidentally) on fire, and my brother put them out by tackling them with a blanket. IT. DID. NOT. HURT. HER. She was just instantly relieved. Yes, the burns hurt, but literally nobody thought that my brother was doing anything but helping. There was no "Why are you abusing her?"
Ruby is bizarre and clearly delusional and unsafe. Jail is the best place for her; there is no way she needs to be running around free to interact with innocent and unsuspecting humans, children or otherwise.
That analogy was so weird. Yes, “beating out the flames” is a thing (usually with wet towels or burlap sacks) but you usually don’t beat out the flames on a person. And I would think any kid on fire would be screaming “Mom, mom! I’m on fire! Put it out! Put it out!”
Halloween day, my boys could dress in costumes for school , a lunch time parade. The boys had a hurried breakfast, and snack at recess, probably a couple of hours later. In the lunch line my son fainted, fell forward, broke out front teeth. The pediatrician ran a pyramid of tests, he told us that it was likely hyperglycemia, low blood sugar. He was not diabetic, and never had another episode. Food is fuel, life, not optional
Good advice!😊
@@Woodman-Spare-that-tree Adults with hypoglycemia can't skip meals either.
John, I'm one of the 50% never-mo viewers whose been here for years. It is this Griffiths family that caused me to find your podcast. I've watched the Griffiths family of vloggers from the very beginning when Ellie + Jared (the youngest Griffiths sister) first started their channel to document their infertility journey. The rest of the siblings and parents followed E+J vlogging lead when they made their own channels. I think this is why the 8Passengers channel exploded in popularity so quickly because Ruby's sisters already had large and successful UA-cam channels when Ruby started 8 Passengers. Anyway, it is because of this family that I found Mormon Stories Podcast. I became fascinated with learning more about their religion because previously I only knew of Mormonism = polygamy. And I couldn't understand how these people who seemed to have it all going for them could be Mormon. So I started looking into it and found your podcast and never left. These stories are fascinating to me. Now talking about 8Passengers feels like it's coming full-circle for me today. Under very unfortunate circumstances, of course. Thank you so much for covering this story. I wanted to DM you and ask you to speak about the news, so this is exactly what I was hoping for on your platform here.
Yay Amy! So happy to hear this!!
It was the same for me! I'm from Uruguay, I knew very little about Mormons... But it was from watching these families that I became interested and ended up in MS
I'm very concerned about the influence members of the Mormon faith had in the failures of local policing and CPS in regard to this case.
It seems as though teachers, family members, neighbors and other members of the public were reporting Ruby for about two years and nothing seems to have been done. Having seen plenty of previous cases in which members of the Mormon faith acted corruptly to return children to the people they were trying to escape, that there was potentially a concerted effort to either cover-up or ignore what was happening in this case.
All I can think of Ruby was giving a lot of money to the mormon church so…
Welcome to Utah, where the church runs everything.
8 passengers was not only free marketing for the mormon church, but the church was given 10% of what ruby was making. Why ruin that for a few kids’ safety? Many people (adults and children) have been/are being abused and ~allegedly~the mormon church has covered it up to save face. I wish more people knew about the insidious nature of this lds church.
IME The Mormon Church puts its image and money above all else. The family’s vlogs brought them a good image so the covered. Now just like blacks holding priesthood, polygamy, and their anti lgbtq crusade = its going to back fire. it’s a dying religion and having grown up in it, I say Good Riddance.
Seems inevitable when majority of those in office are LDS.
Thanks for bringing Jordan and McKay on, and for such valuable insight into this horrific situation. As always, thought provoking and honest discourse.
Hi, I’m new here. Hidden True crime told me about how awesome you guys are. I came for my interest in the Frankie/Hildebrant case, but you taught me the term “ high demand religion” and that sparked so many connections for me. After surviving a childhood in the Evangelical Christian religion, I hadn’t realized how much it had contributed to my CPTSD. Thank you. I’m excited to keep watching.
The lunch "consequence" is wild to me. As an adult if I forget my lunch I can go buy something or order something or ask my partner to drop it by. It's wild to me that people expect kids to be more responsible than adults. I forget things often and people help me because we are all human. Her poor kids
My parents didn’t bring me lunch I forgot mine and they both worked. Neither could my partner even as an adult. I’m literally fine though. I’m not saying it’s ok but I don’t bring a lunch a lot as an only parent and try to make the food stretch so I skip meals. My kids think I like being “the garbage disposal” (that’s what I call it when I eat after they are full.) they didn’t realize we had very little because I did so happily. Lots of people scrimp for their kids. I however do not think this mom had a job and she had the time and the money. I just prefer my kids to get the best nourishment and I neat what’s left on their plates often. This mom is lazy and selfish and she could have easily given the school a credit card and put money at least on a lunch card for her kid in case kids forgot their lunch.
I’m so glad you collaborated with Jordan and McKay for this story!! I got most of my info about the 8 passengers saga from Jordan and McKay, and the story hit so close to home for me that I followed their a lot of their in-depth coverage.
Omg you just explained something to me. My Mormon aunt was visiting and I made an offhanded joke about never checking my teenage sons browser history, and she FREAKED out. Like she triggered my fight or flight and I ended up cornered by her in my garden shed, and I had to yell at her to get her to shut up and back off. It was scary, and I lost trust in her after that.
Yikes!!!😮
what was she saying?
Sounds like something my evangelical neighbor might do.
Yep the truest believers are the worse. Nice religious people 😅disgusting
What the …?
Love the discussion about "is this a Mormon story, or a story that just happens to have Mormons in it?" I had an idyllic childhood being raised in Mormonism, but i can absolutely see where the doctrine enables people with certain personality types or proclivities. My parents used to say "Even the Devil can quote scripture." and i appreciate that helped me recognize that not all people who seem religious are good. Excellent, fair discussion.
Good point!
True of every ideology.
I really wish I had watched this live, but this is actually my first time on the channel! I have a friend who went to BYU and she said that having a church recommended counselor/therapist violate HIPPA and tell the church and school about certain things is actually a common occurrence and people just don’t know that they can fight it. She said people get kicked out left and right and that’s part of why the church pushes these counselors so much.
I love having y'all in the same cast! Thank you for your dedication and support for truth and ethics.
I am an atheist but my sister is a Mormon. Mormon Stories Podcast has been very helpful.
This mom Ruby, seems like an abusive, neglectful mom at best and a sociopath at worst!! I can’t IMAGINE having my SIX year old daughter go HUNGRY!!! 😢
She doesn’t seem, she is. She starved her kids, left them alone for weeks at a time, did not send them to school, and let someone else discipline her kids violently as well as all the crazy harsh punishments to her kids which included leaving them without food when misbehaving. She’s disgusting and needs to get many years in prison
@yesie8375 who disciplined them? How do you know this is factual?
@@big.fan.of.justice5754 the kids where with Jodi under her supervision when found. What does that say to you ?
@therealz360z7 Most schools give kids a sandwich and milk when they don't have a lunch.
@@big.fan.of.justice5754Jodi allegedly
I was not expecting this to be a collab
I feel for those kids. When I grew up my parents thought it was proper punishment to “send me to bed without supper”. My stomach would hurt with hunger pains and I would just sit up and wait until enough time passed after everyone went to sleep so I could sneak to the kitchen and get some food. (I also started stashing food in my room).
I can’t imagine this going on for days. Poor kids - talk about trauma. 😢
My Mom did that to me also. She would give me a slice of bologna and slice of cheese for lunch while everyone else had sandwiches and chip and chocolate cake for dessert. I washed dishes, cleaned house did laundry took care of pets and siblings and if they did anything wrong it was my fault. Large families often have a scapegoat. My youngest sister liked to tattle on me . She married a Mormon. Not surprised.
Sorry that happened to you both 😢
that's how I wound up with bulimia! I'd eat a whole loaf of bread or something out of hunger pain, I'd gotten fat doing that and then because I was in trouble for gaining weight I'd throw it back up. They sent me to fat camp and I got bullied for being a normal weight lol. My ED morphed into anorexia with bulimic traits. I'd break and eat a whole bunch then toss it up to hide the evidence aka the weight. Even now as a married woman in my own house I can't eat without heavy shame and I ask permission to eat anything I did not purchase, including leftovers I cooked myself. I just can't break the food shame mindset. I still hide dishes, if my husband sees a dish and it's not for something I made for both of us I panic -- not that he cares, it's just so ingrained.
I'm sry that happened to you 😢
I was discussing this with my family when all this news came out. This never happened to my sister and me, but I do remember seeing parents sending their children to bed without supper in old television shows and movies when I was child.
One of my favorite books growing up was _Where the Wild Things Are_ and in this book Max is sent to bed without his supper.
Though, in those old movies and TV shows (and in my favorite book) one parent would eventually relent and bring food to their child, it does appear that there was a time that this was something that was common place and not looked at as abuse.
As an aside, I do love how committed John is to plugging supporting guests who are content creators
My heart goes out for the children.
Thank you for having Jordan and McKay because they are great people.
This was fabulous. Jordan’s PowerPoint was so good and thorough. She should pursue a PhD.. If she isn’t already.
The fact that Jodi’s license was reinstated is disgusting
I was brought to your channel by the algorithm.
I want to thank you for clear unbiased content about these very worrying and sad events concerning Ruby Fanke and Jodi Hildebrante.
Knowing the in depth research and time that went in to your content thank you.
As a non Mormon, your content opened my knowledge about not just those involved but the Mormon Church and the purity teaching.
It was a great incite.
Also I hope people realise that all religions have good and bad.
Thank you
Facts and well said. Maybe look at his long list of videos, I’m also not a Mormon but grew up w them in So Nevada and although I don’t agree w everything he says, I have learned so much and respect him very much and am thankful for all his hard work and sacrifice put into this channel and thrilled to finally see some significant growth after putting out so much content for so many years and getting the recognition this content deserves, and another great video John, thx! Godspeed;)
What is baffling about this situation is that they had so many followers subscribed to this garbage and exploitation for YEARS! I couldn't watch this for one episode! Her treatment of her kids is deplorable and people gave her money to watch it i cant believe that it wouldnt be considered verbal and emotional abuse by authoritiesw😮 just withholding food and speaking about it should have had this channel shut down. Why did so many followers condone her parenting practices??? Thank you for bringing awareness to this.
Exactly my thoughts...its disturbing that so many followed them and thought this was normal!
Because America is a very uncaring society.
I bet Ruby is pro life. I should say pro birth.
Thank God my parents were normal, relaxed human beings! I never would have survived with a crazy parent like Ruby. The kids who rebelled the most back in my youth were those whose parents watched their every move and set all kinds of harsh rules and limits.
I'm not going to watch this video because child abuse is too triggering for me. That being said, I'm glad this is being covered and wish the best for these kids.
It's really important to look after yourself ❤
Is it not borderline abuse for a child to be locked in a room with an adult being questioned about touching themselves? It feels abusive to me. You all have opened my eyes to so much. Thank you for great informative content!
It's full on emotional as well as sexual abuse by a professional to a child.
Hell Yes!
Absolutely. Especially because the male adult has zero training.
They are not locked in with anyone. The Bishop now asks parents if they want to be with the child and many times encourages that. Bishops are volunteers who were asked to do the job of helping an entire congregation. They aren't perfect, but the Bishop's number one goal is to love and help that individual. He wants to see them happy, and that involves stopping addictive behavior.
@@ramsrnja it's a problematic situation on so many levels.
Primarily a minor is put in a vulnerable situation where the potential for abuse is extremely high.
Thank you SO MUCH for having Jordan & McKay on! I feel like they are one of the few people that are covering this case with knowing so much backstory on the situation. It’s such a complicated story so it’s easy to get confused. I give grace to those who have gotten things wrong but it’s so easy for things to spiral into things that aren’t even happening.
I brought my therapy dog to see teen young women at the Utah State Hospital in Utah County. One of the girls became very attached and it was arranged that I would bring him to her outpatient therapy. She eventually ended up in that place in Orem and I was supposed to be able to see her…with the permission of her parents who thought my dog and ai were great influences on her. They told me they had arranged it. When I called to go, I was told no. So I asked if I could speak on the phone to her…”no.” I explained that I was on the list and was told that her therapist decided that I couldn’t see her. It was so weird. I was so worried that she’d think I abandoned her.
Here are my “whys”:
Why did this Ruby person have all these kids when clearly she didn’t understand anything about children?
Why did the husband allow this to happen?
Why wasn’t she arrested years ago when it was clear her children were being abused?
Why would anyone enjoy watching this type of video exploiting and abusing children?
I just don’t get it. I never heard of these people until now but their content appeared to be mundane at best and cruel at worst.
_bEcAsE mOrMoNiSm...._
Mormon missionaries came to my house for a year but they could not answer any of my concerns because when a Morm has concerns they are instructed to pray unti they get over it. I told them about info available on the LDS website but they weren't allowed to read it. I would look them in their eyes and see Stepford wives. And I told them what I saw. They finally gave up.
@@knewsome47 very interesting. I have toyed about what to do when those young missionaries come around. They are so young that sometimes I feel guilty about bursting their bubbles like I am the meanie who breaks the news that Santa Claus doesn’t exist. But other times I feel like they are old enough and it is about time someone tells them the truth. Your analogy of stepford wives is very accurate
Kevin is totally complicit in the abuse; he was there when those small children watched their siblings open presents and they got nothing, he was there when his oldest son slept on a beanbag for 7 months. I think it’s unlikely he was involved in the state of the children who were rescued from the home, but he was part of the environment that allowed this kind of food deprivation and physical abuse to continue and escalate. I hope he is not granted custody but I recognize that the level of abuse the children experienced in his absence was much greater, so maybe he will be. But I don’t believe he is a healthy parent who will care for them well if he gets custody.
Have you considered that it was Ruby’s way no other way. He had no say in how she raised the kids. With the fact he worked as a professor and was out of town often especially if a earthquake had happened some where.
@@breams8973as an adult he did have a say. If he believed they were being abused, he could have taken him, filed for divorce and custody, and brought evidence to court to show the kids were being mistreated by her. It's not an easy road but it's required for parents to keep their kids safe even if it will make the abuser mad.
He’s just as guilty! Just a very weak man controlled by a bully.
“Virtue signaling” aka demonstrating bigotry in the case of that fast food chain. In my observation of the prevalent culture in Utah there’s is such a push to perfectionism that “fake perfect” seems better than authentic. In relation to troubled teens, one LDS neighbor sent their daughter to a Christian camp for troubled teens in Jamaica where she was forced to wear dresses that resembled FLDS garb. I was horrified. How do you protect your 13 year old child when they’re in another country?
The burbs all around Salt Lake City are full of these stepford wives and perfect children hiding behind the control of the church
The fast food chain didn't demonstrate bigotry. Saying your religion doesn't believe in something isnt hate....it does say those things in the Bible about homosexuality, but many of us are conflicted on that. I dont think the people who went to chic FIL a were all there for good reasons....I would go to support a chain that stands by their convictions, and to support people being free to have their own beliefs . If others went for hateful reasons thats not on the chain. Also most religions have far harsher and actual hate filled views on lgbtq issues....chic FIL a showed they aren't bigots by donating free food on a Sunday when the pulse night club tragedy happened. I hate ruby turned the chic FIL a thing into more than it was in my opinion.
@@erikaelyse8192I have never gone to that chain since they took that stance and they only changed their tune because it was hurting their business- so many people boycotted them. Businesses need to keep their religion out of business because not all their customers even share their beliefs and they alienate them- which means losing money.
_I have been thinking for many years that Ruby is a closeted sadist after I watched her interactions with her children. She is full of GLEE when punishing them, and the punishments themselves were always way overboard._ 😑
I totally agree. There is something really unhinged about her.
I’m not associated with the LDS church but, I wanted to get my head around this case and found you through Hidden True Crime and Jessi Hildebrandt’s interview. Y’all have done a stellar job in this collaboration. I definitely got clarity about all of the players, as well as, perhaps the nuances of their relationships and beliefs that just aren’t available through most other major outlets. Thank you for delivering so much information in a clear and thoughtful manner. I’m subscribing to both channels to show my support.
My sister worked at one of those camps and has since sent her step daughter to one due to what she determined was unhealthy, sexual behavior. My niece was only 15 when she went there and actually ran away twice. It literally broke my heart that I couldn’t step in because I did not find out until after the fact. I still carry a lot of guilt, especially since my niece has essentially cut off the entire family. I literally cannot believe these institutions even exist.
I hope one day you can reconnect with your niece and let her know how truly sorry you are that you weren't there for her, and that you want to be there for her now. Maybe someday she will be ready for that.
Also, can we acknowledge the children had to save themselves while everyone watched their abuse taking place online consistently?!! I’d never heard of this family until a few days ago. To hear so many people reporting that they have been watching this family in the abuse for years. It’s so disturbing.
Yes!!!
Unfortunately reports to child services from strangers on the internet can make the local services pay less attention to the case, not more, so when you're a stranger on the internet there's very little you actually can do to make it stop as an individual
@@Heather-vi7gy that’s true too.
Well said!! 😢😠🙏
In this ongoing horror scene, I’m thankful we’re at least being treated a J&M/MSP colab.
I went through the exact same "sex therapy" group that is being discussed around ~1:42:00. It's called "LifeStar" and there are programs like this all over the state. Truly a horrific experience with the group shaming and punishment. I was in the program from ages 16-18.
Jordan and McKay are just phenomenal. I found them first, then found Mormon Stories, and love you all for your knowledge, your empathy, and compassion.
same here!!
Takeaway: this shouldn't have taken a child ESCAPING to get the attention of Mormon authorities!!
This had been reported several times. The oldest son reported it 2020, her followers reported her, even created a petition to have the children removed. NOBODY believed the children. IMO, CPS & LE need to be checked out, why did they drop the ball? A lot of this could have been avoided if someone had listened to & believed the children.
Lori daybel rings alarm bells. 😳 all connected to this church
Absolutely. There is a dark, deep underbelly to this church
How on earth would "Mormon authorities" know what was going on in someone's home. And why should they need to be made aware. This is criminal behavior, something only law enforcement can deal with.
Do you know the Mormon Church are not the police, child protective services or legal authority?? Adults who observed starving children or who wondered why they did not appear at school should have called police or child protection. Church couldn't care less.
Another Lori Vallow was stopped in time. Hallelujah
their videos are bringing up memories for me. i feel so terrible for all of the children. i cannot imagine the struggles they will have for the rest of their lives. what egregious parenting and therapy. it's a travesty that not everyone will be held accountable - like the bishops/mormon employees who recommended jodi's practice. my heart goes out to all of the victims.
The neighbor who alerted the police is the real hero in this sick situation.
I’m so glad McKay said what I have been wanting to scream from the rooftops: that the focus has been mainly on Ruby (the blonde beauty social media phenom), allowing Jodi to avoid the spotlight and scrutiny that she and her philosophy needs. You all are doing a great job!
I knew about this family here and there because of other channels' coverage of them and was always somewhat interested as someone who was raised in a strict, violent, angry, traditional Christian household. As someone who grew up with very strict, disciplinarian parents who were like Ruby lite, I can understand the feeling the children and family may have felt that they were unheard - on the channel Markie, he has a video from a few months ago where the sisters and Shari seemed to insinuate that there was things happening behind the scenes, if she was isolating them more and more, and taught them to sweep the problems under the rug (I was taught this as a child to not "air out our family's dirty laundry" - which to my parents could be very innocuous things - or I'd be punished for it) the extended family may not have known how bad things may have gotten. I feel so much for those children and hope they are surrounded by support so they can heal
I hope this message gets out to all those poor people that need it. It's outrageous behaviour to punish people for their sexual desire - which is merely a human trait.
You mean, like the religion of the poster of this video? He supports this part and parcel.
@@psyborg06 yep. 😀
@@psyborg06What do you mean? Which poster?
@@MM-jf1me The person on your video screen is an LDS member, went on a mission, whole 9 yards. Never denounced.
@PrincessButtercup458 No, Darrel Johnson.
Just happened to see this video because of the Hildebrant/Franke news, and as an ex-Mormon was curious to listen in. Can't hear the whole episode for well over 3 hours (!), but I appreciate the honest information Jordan McKay are sharing. I'll have to reopen it over the next few days. Thanks, John!
I know this is the introduction. But the bravery of that young boy…so amazing! My heart breaks for him! If I could hold him and make it better I would. I looked at my son and held him after this story broke. I couldn’t ever imagine doing this!
So I just wanted to take 2 seconds and give the credit to this boy who is his own hero and the hero to his sister!!! ❤❤❤
Very courageous young man and as a Social Worker in the Aboriginal/Criminal Justice systems and I can assure you that current CPS systems need urgent reformation and I have been working to change certain laws and wake people up regarding the plight of children in the system particularly in relation to foster care and child placement!
Children are Sacred and deserve the very best of love and care that we have to offer!
👵🏽✌🏾🦅☀️🦅🙏🏽
@@kathyborthwick6738LakotaEmoji: glad to see you are speaking out that these things sometimes happen in the foster care system too.
The Adam Paul Steed interview was amazing! 6 hours of jaw dropping interview
Hi. Would you ever do a video/ podcast about the Mormon scrapbooking industry culture? The scrapbooking industry is dominated by Mormon women with families, who document and publicise their families online in order to sell their crafting products.
Heidi Swapp, Maggie Holmes, Becky Higgins, Lizzie Kartchner (there are many more) are the biggest names in scrapbooking and are all Mormon.
One ‘famous’ scrapbooker, Heidi Swapp, her 16 year old son died by suicide. He had told her that he wanted to leave the Mormon Church and she wouldn’t allow it. She blogged his funeral and posted all the photos online. She even released scrapbooking products inspired by his suicide (which I thought was so distasteful, the proceeds weren't even going to charity!)
I wonder how the kids feel abut their Mom’s putting their lives online in other to sell their products and this perfect family lifestyle?
You both did an amazing job on this video! Thank you so much for all your hard work and outstanding content.
It was a very informative broadcast. It helped me understand why Kevin may not have custody of the kids. Now, all the children need a safe custodial home, and the supports needed.
Too bad there aren’t more custodial homes that people want for them. People need to step up.
Oh course not, Keven will not be given custody of his kids. There's procedures that CPS will put him through. He will have to go through lot of interviews and visit before CPS will hand his kids over to him. That is a if. His kids might decide they want live with one of their aunts. There's also a possibility that Ruby could end up with a none guilty verdict. But it depends on what her kids tell the person that is questioning them that will determined in what verdict she get. A mental verdict could keep her out of prison. But, she will lose all custody of her kids if that happens, she won't be allow to be around children at all. The other two verdict will be best for her..
@@kenmdem Those children need protection from both of their parents. Kevin was fine with every thing Ruby did to his children.
Her small children were so “numb” probably from dealing with years and years of abuse that nothing phased them anymore.
It’s always a treat to see you all collaborating, I wish it was under better circumstances!
Jordan and McKay are fantastic! I've been hoping they would be collaborating with you on this.
Why is Ruby considered an parenting expert ? She constantly sharing that her children are “troubled” and need punishment. The only people I would consider as parenting experts would be those with healthy happy adults because they are clearly doing something right.
People are going to believe what they want!
I cannot get over the panic rooms or fort Knox as she called it ! Those had to be built for that very reason . It's really very disturbing
She was considered parenting expert because she is a " life coach", you know, the trendy thing people do in a few weeks or months to be able to "help" others. In reality they went to a few seminars and learned how to build money from others.
She told me that on several occasions and I was like sweetheart, I have a professional therapist for that. I don't need a neighbor knowing any more of my business than what they THINK they already know.
John you are such a good dude. This situation is horrific. It’s like the Duggers meets the Turpins (that disgusting couple that tied up their kids, abused and starved them). I’m sure I’ll find out but where are the two older kids and can they help the younger siblings?! Jordan and McKay know their stuff, was nice to discover them.
The similaritys with the Turpins was my first thought too.
Sherri lives with her aunt Julie and uncle Landon. Not sure where chad is.
Shari doesn’t live with her Aunt Julie. Julie and her family recently moved to Kansas City. Shari is back at BYU. Interestingly, their Aunt Ellie lives in St. George-so close to where the events took place.
Reddit is wondering if the Griffiths grandparents would end their mission early in light of what happened.
This whole thing made me so incredibly angry,shocked and sad.
These kids went through so much abuse.
Your perspectives needed to be told. Thank you. One of the best podcasts.
In my experience growing up Mormon (though I’m 57), Love is earned. It’s conditional. When I came out lgbtq my parents and didn’t talk for years. My gay friend Craig in SLC committed suicide after his parents shut th door on him at 15 y/o. IME LDS teaches cruelty. I wasn’t a perfect parent and my kids weren’t either but every moment even now I love them No Matter What!
Yes! It starts with god. His love is conditional so your parents love is conditional and the cycle of abuse goes on.
“Even now I love them” ? Really?
@@michwoodside yes even now- what kind of sinister Alex jones conspiracy did you think I meant??
I love my Children- regardless! Wow, what did ‘even now’ mean? hahahahaha dude you need therapy- full 🛑
@cwb1400 God's love for YOU is UNCONDITIONAL. That doesn't mean He loves sin or that sin is healthy or good for you. Heaven will be full of sinners. God knows this & sent His Son anyway to pay the price for us. That doesn't mean we should not attempt to be better or claim our sins aren't sins though.
Ruby reminds me of Lori Daybell
I agree. Both are scumbags.
And the cause: Fear mongering end times doctrine the Mormon church followed by lack of control/power of women in an extreme patriarchal construct
She’s a lot like Lori Vallow… ME ME ME … awful people, both of them. It’s ok, she’s going to get what’s coming to her.
My kids in highschool forget their lunch, if I couldn’t make it, I would have food delivered, or borrow a lunch ticket and send $ the next day, what she’s doing is as a parent she isn’t taking responsibility because she forgot to make sure the child had her lunch when they left, because that’s her responsibility as a parent especially to monitor the younger kids she is making the child suffer for her lack of being a good parent is so wrong
My kids' schools have a policy of never refusing lunch. They just put it on the kid's tab and the parents pay online
Silence is the problem but Mormons call it gossip. That's not gossip if you are helping. People over principle!❤
It is a relief to hear that the safe incident was actually another call. Until you stop and realize that means that, at the same moment in the same jurisdiction another child was trapped in a safe room. That kids’ parents aren’t internet famous so we won’t know the backstory or the outcome, but it’s a reminder that these high profile stories are unfortunately snapshots of what’s unfortunately happening in who knows what number of not famous households.
But now we know there was a safe room. 😢
She stands in Abuse and says her kids were being damaged by “entitlement”???
She lived off abuse of those kids!!! She was mad viewers were calling her and Jodie out and couldn’t take it.
Couldn’t put the kids on film because they probably looked starved and abused at this point.
Jodie doesn’t have custody of her own kids!!! He ex raised them!!! Get real!
Thank you for doing this interview. This interview has been very informative.
I think a lot of people watched their channel because they developed a parasocial relationship with the family. It's really unhealthy for strangers to know such intimate details about the kids. I hope that all the kids can now recover from the lack of privacy.
It will take a lifetime
It’s very evident that Ruby enjoys causing pain to her children. It’s bizarre to see.
This is awesome. You guys are amazing. Thank you for bringing this to the forefront. Subscribed! ❤
Thanks for subbing!
Thank you for this thoughtful review of this case. When I was in the 6th grade I had a friend whose mother abused her little sister 4 years old (long story) one day my friend asked me to stop being so nice to her sister; because when I leave “she” her mother gives it to her worse. Very sad. This was the late 70’s. Her mother did finally get hers but it was many years later.
My point above is we do have be careful how these things are approached.
Sounds like a really sad story
I found Mormon Stories through Jordan and McKay and last summer I watched so much of your content. I haven't been watching much lately, but I have kept up with Jordan and McKay. It's nice to have them bring me back here again.
Ruby is going to run back to Kevin, the church will sacrifice Jodi, and use the whole thing as a PR campaign to the power of the Mormon church to save and support families from the evil of straying.
When I lived in Houston in the 80’s my church encouraged us to attend a meeting where a special speaker was coming. He had left the Mormon faith. He was to speak on the Mormon beliefs. As the speaker was starting the vestibule doors opened and 6 men stood at the back of the church. They men were dressed in white shirts and tied.
Immediately the speaker was shuffled off the side door and the meeting was dismissed. Frightening.
ties
Guess they aren’t allowed to speak freely!
WTH? Did you ever see the speaker again? This is scary.
love jordan and mckay, these two are awesome, great discussion, glad both your channels shed light on this crap
Us too!
Collaboration between MS and Jordan & Mckay was very valuable in explaiing this tragic story. Thank you.
I moved out of Utah a few years ago (only non-Mormon in my neighborhood) and I can't tell you how glad I am to be out of that area. It was bizarre at times -- including a group of women who all were hanging out at one family's beach house in CA and decided to all greet their husbands (together) wearing their underwear -- and asking each husband which one was the sexiest....WEIRD. I can tell you all sorts of things about MLM CEOs in my neighborhood and the most fascinating thing .... ALL they cared about was how much money everyone was making
Sounds about right! Bunko groups... wow mind blowing conversations about sex, their husband, money, and personal lives... the woman!! Weirdest cats I have ever met!
Never ever heard or experienced anything like this happening and I've been LDS my whole life.
@@ILthegreatwhere did you live?
@@ILthegreatI have a lot more stories
@@auggiedoggiesmommy1734-tell them. Be clear in your telling, truthful and unbiased. I’m here to learn, as a member of society, a lot can be gleamed from true stories.