$60k for a Tacoma with a 7% APR is absolutely insane. I just don't get why people are still buying new vehicles right now unless it's a 100% necessity.
Not only that used cars are nearly as expensive as new, so common logic would say why would someone buy used when brand new is not that far away. The whole car industry has been nuts since 2021
My buddy runs 2 car dealerships. Mazda and VW. On his lots and across other dealers, vehicles and inventory is starting to stack up. Spring is going to show some great incentives, interest rates are also dropping.
Jon is 100% correct, WE as consumers must NOT support these crooked dealers, put your emotions aside and take a stand. He mentioned Thousand Oaks Toyota, now before I comment, I must say that I am speaking from personal experience with Thousand Oaks Toyota, and it was horrible. Let's just keep at that, they inflate their prices, considering Thousand Oaks is a very affluent area, right next to Westlake Village, Agoura Hills, and Calabasas, so that does not surprise me. I really appreciate Jon for making this video, please share...
And 5K to some of those people is like $5 to us. But still, there are common folk still out there. And I know MSRP is suggested, however in this economy, it says otherwise.
When the truck was revealed, I was dead set on buying one. Seemed like a no brainer to me and I couldn’t be more excited. Then when the MPGs and (more importantly) the prices were revealed, especially with these dealer markups, that excitement just died down pretty quick. No chance id buy one with markups like that. Going to settle on keeping my Rav4 for now until/if things improve.
I’m Fort Lauderdale Florida and got my 2023 Rav 4 in October last year. I want the new land cruiser but I’m afraid it’s going to be way outside of my budget with these dealer markups.
Gotta say... I think Toyota corporate needs to do something about this so their brand isn't tarnished. My local dealership does sell at MSRP, but their service and parts department are incredibly shady. They often sell OEM parts for 20-30% above the stated prices on Toyota's website. It really stinks because the vehicles are amazing, but you have to be very careful what Toyota dealership you choose to do business with.
Even though Toyota dealers are private franchises, they still wear the brand and represent the company. So I agree. Eventually to many bad eggs will ruin the brand for people. I see it in the comments often. Somebody has a horrible experience at multiple dealers and they just up and quit the brand. It sucks for sure. But there are great dealers out there for sure, it just stinks that that standard isn’t across the board. If it was, a company would dominate through word of mouth alone.
The Toyota dealer near where I live in south Florida has a terrible sales department, thankfully the service department is great. Last year, I was shopping for a 4Runner and the dealer said they had a new 2023 TRD Pro being shipped to the dealership. The MSRP was around $60k for the car, which in my opinion is already too high, but decided to negotiate with them. The sales rep comes back to me with a deal sheet for the car with an adjustment fee of... wait for it TWENTY THOUSAND dollars. It was such a gobsmacking figure that we immediately turned around and hauled ass out of there. $80 grand for a 4Runner, smh
AMEN! If people would all collectively just STOP paying over MSRP, we could all get our trucks for a decent price. Please, let’s work together on this one bros
It is simple, they will stop adding mark up on the trucks when people stop buying and the trucks rot on the lot while they have to cover the flooring cost of them. Be patient and grab one at msrp when you are ready.
How about buying it at invoice price not at MSRP. Dealers make money no matter what. People just being careless and be a willing buy at whatever price.
Part of the problem too, John, is that dealers will sell you the truck at MSRP, but will tack on 2-5k in Mandatory add-ons (like “lifetime” warranties or coatings) that cost them nothing. They do this so they can say they sell at MSRP, but it’s the same scheme.
Order the truck and wait a few months instead of buying off the lot. It is worth it as long as you still have something to drive. One time I ordered a truck (new 2007 Silverado diesel) and got the dealer to swap my order in place for one of theirs and it came pretty quick. Basically, it gets let me cut the line. They don't have time to do all the crap to it they try to charge you for when you are on the lot the same day it arrives.
Go to the dealer to order. I've never ordered from Toyota. Only bought used. A dealer will still try to sell you on a bunch of stuff, but they should be asking first, not adding it to the sticker. Some Ford dealers were charging markups on Ford Bronco orders when they first came out but that is pretty rare and I would have gone nuclear if that was tried on us when we took delivery.@@naraku137
I went through this when I went to test drive a 3rd gen Taco 4 months ago and they had a mark up of 10%. I had a two word answer. Then asked why I should pay such a premium for a truck that’s going to be outdated in 4 months? Their answer? “Well, our bills went up just like yours did.” Yea, and I adjusted my spending to account for the increased price.
n 2022, profits reached an estimated $6.5 million per location for dealerships owned by public auto retailers, more than triple of pre-pandemic levels, according to the report from Haig Partners, a buy-sell advisory firm to auto dealers.Mar 17, 2023
If you have a 3rd gen in great condition and have it paid off, they're still worth 35k. But it would be worth waiting a year or two. Keep the value up on your truck, and trading in might be worth.
The Toyota Tacoma ceased being an affordable pickup a while ago. Now the prices are insane. I am looking to buy a pickup but looks like I'll be one well used, put a little money into fixing one up. Still save me tens of thousands over the insanity behind new prices.
The problem is, dealers will lure you in with good prices, then come up with all these caveats for you to get the car at that price. I had a friend who sold cars and told me that's what they do.
Yeah, one of the reasons we have moved away from Toyota & Lexus in our area. I love the reliability of both brands, but my Audi dealer doesn't charge over MSRP. I just can't support a dealer or a brand that wants over MSRP for a vehicle.
When the 3rd gen tundra came out the forums did a good job of organizing spreadsheets of local dealerships. Explained how much if any mark up existed. Thanks to those guys I got my limited 2 weeks after the launch at msrp. Hopefully, the taco boys get smart and band together to figure it out.
Those are actually small mark ups if you ask my local dealer. Two years ago they were adding $11,000 dealer adjustment to Tacoma and $10,000 to Tundra. (Anchorage, Ak)
Bought my 21 Tacoma TRD Sport for MSRP… paid cash… I put less than 5k a year on it, doing just truck stuff and 2nd vehicle miles. In another 17 years I will have only 100k on it. Unlike the new gen I have the bulletproof V6. It will be the last truck I will ever have to buy.
Lancaster Toyota has always been a ripoff. During the car "shortage'" a couple years ago they were marking cars up to $10,000 over MSRP. And people were paying for it. With persistence, I bought a hybrid corolla at $1000 under MSRP at another dealer.
Some old timers like me will remember when Miata's were going for 65k. It was ridiculous, but it ultimately settled down. I know we are all excited about the 4th gen, but we also want to feel good about our decisions at the end of the day
Your point is well made at the end. Toyota wants these Trucks to move and they set the price to move the trucks at a volume they want them to. There are dealers that feel the same way and won't mark up vehicles. Their business model is to move more vehicles and get more happy (return) customers. You don't want to do business with a dealer that is marking up vehicles. They'll find other ways to screw you, too (more than a regular dealer does). The last 3 new vehicles I purchased (of 4 in my life) were ordered. It is such a better process and I would never buy a new vehicle off the lot again unless I couldn't wait for some reason. I was able to compare dealership experiences and everything else before deciding where to take our business. We had a 2021 Bronco order in for a long time when we started hearing about the back-end markups that some dealers were trying. Thankfully our dealer didn't do it. Opinion to take or leave: It might be disingenuous to compare your (and other's ) pre-order purchase at TSRP with a purchase off the lot adding a mark-up. Also, subtly bagging on California then only choosing 3 dealers to prove your view, all from CA, is also a bit much. Why not show this happening at dealers in other states? It will tell a more complete story. Presented it such as you did takes away from your point and, to a lesser extent, your credibility. If it is only happening in California, then that is a big story and should be emphasized and even get the press involved.
I mentioned that in the video there are good dealer out there. in CA, AZ, WA etc. There is a no mark up toyota group if you wana break down dealer by dealer.
5.24 per gallon yesterday in my part of California. FYI, the markups on new toyotas in CA is why I just recently bought my 4runner used. Spent 2 years looking.
PREACH!!! The dealerships will run out of customers with more money than brains eventually. We need to remember them and punish them accordingly. To be fair... there still are some good dealers out there.
MSRP is a rip off considering how much the dealer pays the OEM for the vehicle, the dealers that are selling over MSRP are just ripping you off more. Anyone that tells you that buying at MSPR is OK is probably getting a kick back from that dealer.
There are still brand new 40th Anniversary edition 4Runners sitting on the lot a year later, being listed for less than MSRP. When they came out people were paying $15k over list prices thinking they were going to be collectible. Don’t give into the gougers, only pay what things are worth.
We live in the Wenatchee valley, Washington state. Every dealership here have markup’s on their vehicles. So we travel 3 hours away to buy our vehicles at MSRP
I have 2 dealerships without markups but man it’s been a hassle trying to buy one of these. These are a 21000 truck costing us 40g it’s horrible. I want a 2024 trd premium hybrid.
I currently live in Orange County and I am coming from Los Angeles looking to get into a pick up or SUV, came across your video when I was looking into the Tundra then found out about Tacoma’s came out with a new gen too - and your videos are super HELPFUL. Torn between Tundra, Tacoma and Tahoe BUT the prices are all INSANE.
You just gotta call around and find a dealership that isn’t marking cars up. I live north of Chicago and the dealership closest to me is marking up their RAV4 hybrid by $15k, so I left and called around until I found a dealership in the suburbs that wasn’t marking them up.
I have a 2022 trd offroad, paid cash and in no rush for the next gen, mainly waiting for the next gen 4runner. Ultimately living a 100% debt free life is great. Only reason why dealers are marking up is because they know there are so many suckers out there willing to sacrifice a life of financial success just for the newest truck. Foolish in my opinion.
I didn’t over MSRP for my 23’ TRD OR back in May. I had been looking for months and refused to “order” a truck with options I didn’t want and eventually found one
I ended up with a Honda but my dealer had a market adjustment on theirs also. I shopped 8 other dealers, went back to my dealer and offered them the opportunity to meet my lowest price, which was below MSRP. They took the deal. So, not only will I not pay over MSRP, I won't even pay that much. Oh, and I got 0.9% interest.
Thanks for sharing Jon and revealing that these additional dealer markups over MSRP are still taking place! We've seen 4 Runner prices drop here in Connecticut and the Northeast Among Toyota dealers because interest rates are so high now. Most of the reputable Toyota dealers who've been in business for 50 to 60 years are now offering $2,000 off MSRP on 4 Runners. That said, they can keep them until I can get 10% off MSRP!
Even without these "market adjustments" aka dealership scams and price gouging these prices are still absolutely ridiculous. Not even a handful of years ago the same price that you could get this next generation's base model pre-markup, you could have actually got a nice 4wd Tacoma with a nice trim package. People should refuse to let these dealerships scam them and have them be forced to lower these ludicrous prices. So much for the working mans truck.
We should be going beyond simply refusing to buy at inflated MSRPs...we should be reaching out to state representatives to let them know it's time to end the dealership model.
I hope there are honest dealers out there that will focus on high volume sales rather than playing the markup game. I also hope they snatch most if not all of the sales from these other greedy dealers.
I walked out of a vw dealer after I saw a 10k markup. they said they were flexible on it and I told them” if you’re still marking up vehicles, then I don’t want to do business with you regardless of if you’re flexible”. walked out and never went back. found a better one a little further away
100% agree. The only other thing I wish you would have said is remember which dealerships are doing this now and then when things are back to normal, give your money to any other dealer that has the same price. Voting with your wallet is the only way to make bad dealers understand (or go out of business).
I put down a deposit at my dealership in September for a new '24 Tacoma TRD Off-Road or Sport. I've purchased many trucks from them and they have a no market adjustment policy.
Keep fighting the fight. I really want a new Tacoma trd pro or trailhunter next year. Laughing every time you mentioned CA dealers, because I live in Southern California totally not surprising greedy dealerships.
Ive heard Toyota is trying to get away from dealerships and you would buy online from the factory. I hope this is true as it will get rid of all the crook stealerships. Has anyone else heard of this??
Interest rates aren’t very high from a historical perspective. You’re just used to basement rates stemming from relatively recent catastrophic events. (‘08 financial crisis, pandemic/inflation)
This, insanity will only stop when the consumer decides enough is enough, These dealers will continue to mark these new cars and trucks up as long as the consumer continues to buy them its not just Toyota its all of them, We as consumers should let them sit on the lots until they are mice infested and the tire are rotting off the wheels
Boycott any dealer trying to rip of people! No shortage! Tacomas and tundras setting with big money off everywhere. Nobody buying. Let these set there as well!
Shop around folks. I’ve bought 8 new vehicles since 2012 and bought almost every one of them at invoice (or below in some cases). The only exception was a Bronco which was MSRP which was bought to sell.
This shit has to stop ... We have only ourselves to blame; we keep paying above sticker and/or bullshit markup fees. Some blame can be cast towards Toyota as they have the power to stop "adjustment fees."
Back in 2021-22 I was looking at a 4R TRD ORP with KDSS, dealer marked up another $5K over sticker, I already had a 2020 4R TRD ORP with KDSS, and dealer said they where really hard to find and are getting the inflated price. He asked me if I had a trade I pointed to my 4R and told him I wanted $5K over KBB clean trade in for my 4R and they wouldn't't bite, I laughed and walked away.
In April 2023 I purchased my Tacoma it’s an SR5, 4x4, v6, automatic with blind spot monitoring, rear parking sensor, 5” bed, signals on the mirrors, and dual climate control. Being totally honest $44.680 out the door this included warranty taxes everything. I don’t know if I over paid I don’t think so, but please leave respectful comments and let me know. Anyway I love the truck I installed myself Bilstein 5100 in the front 2” and a 1” supreme suspensions block in the back, Tyger soft roll up bed cover, and running boards and Luckyman seat covers been using this brand on all my vehicles. Now looking for bigger tires any suggestions?
The dealers are driving away customers. In December my wife was shopping for a replace for her Prius. We went to dealer to order a new Prius Prime. 3-6 month wait and they didn’t want to tell us what we would be facing at deliver as far as price. I told them we won’t order until they give us a price. $4200 markup. We drive just down the street and got a Tesla Model 3 performance for $3,750 OFF MSRP and it was in stock. This would have been our 4th Toyota.
For anyone in Alabama, McKinnon Motors in Clanton (Central Alabama) does not mark up their Toyota inventory. They also sell Nissan. Ask for Steve Johnson. Great guy.
This is why i love my local dealership (Principle Toyota in Memphis). I have bought 8 Toyota from them, around 5 Camrys, my old and new Tundras. Never any markup, even their Capstone Tundras are around $6000 below 1794 around $4300 below MSRP. New cars never have a markup. We bought my wife a RAV4 XSE Hybrid about a month ago at MSRP. Just don't take your trade in to them, they will under cut the hell out of your trade, I'm guessing that's how they make their money.
I'm a buyer at msrp.... NEVER thought I would say that, lol. I was leaning heavily toward a trail hunter over the f150 tremor. Probably will just end up with another Ford. I like them just fine, but have been intrigued by the 4 cyl turbo hybrid.
That is total bullshit! I bought my 19’ Tundra 1794 edition top trim level brand new for less than 50K and 0% for 5 years. 50K for an SR5 Tacoma is just highway robbery!
Jon, there are 3 types of pricing at dealerships that I've seen: MSRP, SRP and TSRP. The listings that you were showing had only SRP listed. SRP and TSRP are usually inflated prices that include MSRP plus all of the other junk fees and add-ons that dealers want to pile onto vehicles. Buyers should only be working off of MSRP. Also, now that you've moved to Florida, you're in the Southeast Toyota Distributor region (FL, GA, NC, SC, AL). (I'm in the Gulf States Toyota Distributor region (TX, LA, MS, OK, AR).). We're lucky enough to have the added layer of a distributor between the dealership and Toyota which usually means unwanted add-ons/options loaded onto Toyota vehicles -- creating a 4th pricing of "DSRP". When I purchased my '23 TRD Pro Access Cab V6 in December of '22, there were 6 Distributor options added to my truck. MRSP on the sticker was $36,040. The Distributor options added totaled $2,071 bringing it to a DSRP of $38,111. I bought the truck because the dealership, Toyota of Denton, was discounting the car during the last week of the year to $35,748 which is what I paid for it.
I agree! Shop around! I bought a Kia Niro EV in 2022 when EV’s were scarce, had to purchase mine in Maryland and have it shipped to me in order to not pay over MSRP and get the color and options I wanted. Dealers were marking them up $7.5K (amt of the tax credit). I paid $1200 to ship it to me, saved over $6K
Thank you! Couldn’t agree more. Actually was thinking about getting a ZR2 because it’s looking like the 24 TRD Pro will be $60k+ and I might refund my deposit on that. Chevy dealership had $5k markup. Asked if it was negotiable via phone call. Was told NO. I said have a nice day. At the end of the day truck still would have been less than new pro but F no I’m not gonna increase my monthly payment so the dealership gets a bonus. Their bonus should be me buying the truck and then maybe being a customer for life and getting said truck serviced at their dealership.
Honestly the new Tacoma is not a truck I would want to get anymore. That new 4 cylinder turbo engine is bound to have many problems, especially for towing.
Dealers are smart because they know people will still pay over msrp because they really want the truck, rarely do people back out they just convince themselves that its worth it
Dealer markups/greed will hurt 4th Gen Tacoma sales. Midsize trucks are generally lifestyle trucks, they don't offer near the utility as a full-size SUV or full-size truck which can be had for similar prices. Can you imagine paying over $50K for a 4 cylinder turbocharged truck that really can only seat two adults and like a small child? Especially, with today's interest rates. Being priced so high it will make buyers think twice about how they really want to spend that kind of money and to be honest I think a lot of buyers will end up making a different choice. I bought my 3rd Gen new in 2016 (Double Cab/TRD Off Road) for $33,500. Its crazy what today's prices look like. I encourage people to take care of their vehicles they own today and make better use of your hard earned money with travel and experiences.
Good on you for getting out of Cali. I spent my first 35 years in El Cajon. CA, very close to Chula Vista. I moved to Indianapolis, IN and have no regrets. I just filled up my 16' Tacoma for $2.35 a gallon.
Jon, thanks for bringing some sense to the madness. Toyota baked past markups into the base price of this truck; Dealerships would have sale for $3,000 under MSRP and Toyota would need to provide a $5,000 factory rebate to get me interested. I was in Fort Myers all last week and gas was $2.89.
U made me worried now Jon.. lol it’s amazing how in the beginning everyone was saying this is the most affordable midsize truck - of course dealers won’t let us enjoy that
Why I just purchased a different car 2 months ago. I really wanted a Tacoma TRD 4x4 but knew it would be close to impossible to get one and the ones that are available would be marked up. Paid cash for my 2024 RAV4 so figured id sell it and get a Tacoma in 2 years when the market stabilizes.
Sadly, we have countless losers that have to be the 1st to own the latest and greatest. If they had $100k price tags, these are the idiots that would buy it.
Agreed, glad to hear you tell people to stop the madness paying these high prices. It's the few that either have the money or are careless with their money that ruin it for the rest of us by giving in to these high prices. If everyone would stop and send a hard message, they may keep prices acceptable.
There's probably a dozen or more Toyota dealers within 75 miles of me. Since the mid-90s, I've bought a new Toyota from about 6 of them. We have 3 Toyotas now that are 2020 or newer. I shopped all the dealers I've dealt with before. Unfortunately, for the 2020 Tundra, I bought it for less than MSRP but got it out of the state because of the way it was equipped. The 2022 and 2023 models we only shopped 2 of the dealers because they were the only 2 that weren't selling vehicles for more than MSRP.
Not only would I not pay over msrp, I will refuse to do business in the future for the dealerships doing this. I had to change my home dealer from Dublin ca to Walnut Creek ca
$4.05 per gallon, ampm)arco, today ! By the way, there are still lots of 2023 Tacoma available! I got mine TRD off road 4x4 V6 bare bones for $46000 out the door !
That’s crazy. 40,000 is the price of the highest trim Tacoma from 2020 and is basically the price of a new Full Size Truck now. 40k is crazy to pay for a base model.
Gotta pass the word that it’s against Toyota’s terms and conditions with their dealerships to sell over MSRP. Made some calls about Corwin Toyota in Fargo and now they know to not try to charge me over MSRP.
Idid buy a 23 Sequoia Pro and Tundra Pro this year. They wanted over MSRP but I refused and they did sell for MSRP which still makes a good profit. I will never pay over.
The prices are already high. A basic 2024 TRD Sport 4x4 auto is $42,600 MSRP, plus destination charge of $1500.00, plus dealer fee of $800.00 and taxes here in Florida, puts the price at just over $48,000 WITHOUT options, and you know none come without some options. I was hoping for the TRD Sport I-force Max hybrid 4x4, but it will likely put the price out of my range. I would guess the hybrid version will tack on another $3 - 4 thousand, which will put the trim I want around 52 - 53K - well out of my price range.
Extra dealer markup started in the early 80s when people were waiting in line for a Honda four-door Accord! I used to sell all my Hondas in Flagstaff to the Phoenix people because the dealers down there were gouging. And I made a comfortable living giving them all a good deal. $1200 over invoice! These dealers wanna make 10 grand a car. They don’t get much business I’m not sure, but I bet there’s a lot of cars left over from the last four years brand new that haven’t sold.
I bought a new Jeep Rubicon and I got it for under MSRP earlier this year and there were hardly any on the lot, but I stood firm and got the deal I wanted.I knew what was coming at the beginning of the year🤔 so I was prepared to walk if I didn't get the price I wanted it at.
Would you pay over MSRP??? Please search out other dealers if possible!
Heck no 🙃
Can we buy direct from the dealer yet?😤
Nupe nupe nupe
most people will pay more thats why dealers keep price up
Never. It's better to travel then pay ridiculous "adjustments."
These dealership will stop mark ups when people stop buying vehicles that are marked up.
BINGO
Yeah And let them rot in the parking lot and they’ll learn to lower prices
Great in theory, but theres an ass for every seat. Plenty of jackwagons will still rush right out to have the newest thing
But “People” are stupid lol
@@wamdaddy yep and that's the heart of the matter
$60k for a Tacoma with a 7% APR is absolutely insane. I just don't get why people are still buying new vehicles right now unless it's a 100% necessity.
Because the banks are making a shit ton of money on 72 month auto loans lol
Not only that used cars are nearly as expensive as new, so common logic would say why would someone buy used when brand new is not that far away. The whole car industry has been nuts since 2021
Not anymore. Depreciation is hitting certain models and brands very hard, right at this moment.
Writing off business expenses.
My buddy runs 2 car dealerships. Mazda and VW. On his lots and across other dealers, vehicles and inventory is starting to stack up. Spring is going to show some great incentives, interest rates are also dropping.
Jon is 100% correct, WE as consumers must NOT support these crooked dealers, put your emotions aside and take a stand. He mentioned Thousand Oaks Toyota, now before I comment, I must say that I am speaking from personal experience with Thousand Oaks Toyota, and it was horrible. Let's just keep at that, they inflate their prices, considering Thousand Oaks is a very affluent area, right next to Westlake Village, Agoura Hills, and Calabasas, so that does not surprise me. I really appreciate Jon for making this video, please share...
And 5K to some of those people is like $5 to us. But still, there are common folk still out there. And I know MSRP is suggested, however in this economy, it says otherwise.
Thousand Oaks was the worst experience I ever had in a stealership
@@TRDJon Correct, I just read Toyota was fined 60 million to settle U.S. regulator charges, stop biting the hand that feeds you..
@@mangogainz7046 Lol, I hate to say this but, TOYOTA (The One You Ought To Avoid) has become..
Sorry Toyota. Not interested. You can keep them and lay people off. I truly hope Toyota loses brand loyalty. Much better options out there
When the truck was revealed, I was dead set on buying one. Seemed like a no brainer to me and I couldn’t be more excited. Then when the MPGs and (more importantly) the prices were revealed, especially with these dealer markups, that excitement just died down pretty quick. No chance id buy one with markups like that. Going to settle on keeping my Rav4 for now until/if things improve.
I’m Fort Lauderdale Florida and got my 2023 Rav 4 in October last year. I want the new land cruiser but I’m afraid it’s going to be way outside of my budget with these dealer markups.
Gotta say... I think Toyota corporate needs to do something about this so their brand isn't tarnished. My local dealership does sell at MSRP, but their service and parts department are incredibly shady. They often sell OEM parts for 20-30% above the stated prices on Toyota's website. It really stinks because the vehicles are amazing, but you have to be very careful what Toyota dealership you choose to do business with.
Wait until you hear that fixed ops and not sales makes dealerships the most money
I don’t think this is just a Toyota problem. When I drove a VW, the dealership I went to for service was almost as bad.
Even though Toyota dealers are private franchises, they still wear the brand and represent the company. So I agree. Eventually to many bad eggs will ruin the brand for people. I see it in the comments often. Somebody has a horrible experience at multiple dealers and they just up and quit the brand. It sucks for sure. But there are great dealers out there for sure, it just stinks that that standard isn’t across the board. If it was, a company would dominate through word of mouth alone.
People with more money than sense need to stop paying these prices and screwing it up for the rest of us!
The Toyota dealer near where I live in south Florida has a terrible sales department, thankfully the service department is great. Last year, I was shopping for a 4Runner and the dealer said they had a new 2023 TRD Pro being shipped to the dealership. The MSRP was around $60k for the car, which in my opinion is already too high, but decided to negotiate with them. The sales rep comes back to me with a deal sheet for the car with an adjustment fee of... wait for it TWENTY THOUSAND dollars. It was such a gobsmacking figure that we immediately turned around and hauled ass out of there. $80 grand for a 4Runner, smh
AMEN! If people would all collectively just STOP paying over MSRP, we could all get our trucks for a decent price. Please, let’s work together on this one bros
It is simple, they will stop adding mark up on the trucks when people stop buying and the trucks rot on the lot while they have to cover the flooring cost of them. Be patient and grab one at msrp when you are ready.
How about buying it at invoice price not at MSRP. Dealers make money no matter what. People just being careless and be a willing buy at whatever price.
Part of the problem too, John, is that dealers will sell you the truck at MSRP, but will tack on 2-5k in Mandatory add-ons (like “lifetime” warranties or coatings) that cost them nothing. They do this so they can say they sell at MSRP, but it’s the same scheme.
THIS as well. People need to be aware of
Order the truck and wait a few months instead of buying off the lot. It is worth it as long as you still have something to drive. One time I ordered a truck (new 2007 Silverado diesel) and got the dealer to swap my order in place for one of theirs and it came pretty quick. Basically, it gets let me cut the line. They don't have time to do all the crap to it they try to charge you for when you are on the lot the same day it arrives.
@@gunningopherWhere and how do I order one?
Go to the dealer to order. I've never ordered from Toyota. Only bought used. A dealer will still try to sell you on a bunch of stuff, but they should be asking first, not adding it to the sticker. Some Ford dealers were charging markups on Ford Bronco orders when they first came out but that is pretty rare and I would have gone nuclear if that was tried on us when we took delivery.@@naraku137
They are only mandatory if buyers pay.
I have never paid for that stuff in my life.
It’s not the dealers, it’s the buyers who pay those prices.
Exactly. If we don`t buy, They`ll have to put prices down.
100% buyers fault.
I don’t blame the dealers at all. If buyers are willing to pay over msrp, why wouldn’t the dealers take it.
It's both
Amen. Love the Taco, solid built truck but refused to pay what they were asking. Got the Frontier instead. $15 k cheaper
@@AJourneyOfYourSoul
Preach! Supply chains have been back to normal for some time now. Dealers doing this are just greedy and crooked.
I went through this when I went to test drive a 3rd gen Taco 4 months ago and they had a mark up of 10%. I had a two word answer. Then asked why I should pay such a premium for a truck that’s going to be outdated in 4 months? Their answer? “Well, our bills went up just like yours did.” Yea, and I adjusted my spending to account for the increased price.
That's a lie from the dealer. They have made record profits the lost 3 years!!
How to you know what the dealer P&L is?
n 2022, profits reached an estimated $6.5 million per location for dealerships owned by public auto retailers, more than triple of pre-pandemic levels, according to the report from Haig Partners, a buy-sell advisory firm to auto dealers.Mar 17, 2023
If you have a 3rd gen in great condition and have it paid off, they're still worth 35k. But it would be worth waiting a year or two. Keep the value up on your truck, and trading in might be worth.
It sucks that some dealers are still trying to pull this markup crap!
I get supply and demand. I do, but with rates the way they are, we now are in control again, not the dealer.
We need to not buy anything over msrp
The Toyota Tacoma ceased being an affordable pickup a while ago. Now the prices are insane. I am looking to buy a pickup but looks like I'll be one well used, put a little money into fixing one up. Still save me tens of thousands over the insanity behind new prices.
Be willing to travel across the country and drive back or have it shipped back. The good dealers are out there if you put in the time/effort.
Facts!
The problem is, dealers will lure you in with good prices, then come up with all these caveats for you to get the car at that price. I had a friend who sold cars and told me that's what they do.
Yeah, one of the reasons we have moved away from Toyota & Lexus in our area. I love the reliability of both brands, but my Audi dealer doesn't charge over MSRP. I just can't support a dealer or a brand that wants over MSRP for a vehicle.
When the 3rd gen tundra came out the forums did a good job of organizing spreadsheets of local dealerships. Explained how much if any mark up existed. Thanks to those guys I got my limited 2 weeks after the launch at msrp. Hopefully, the taco boys get smart and band together to figure it out.
haha I think that's the same place I found my 3rd gen plat at some random dealership.
There is a FB page no markup Toyotas. I should have tagged that in this video
And how about the new GX550 Overtrail? This will likely be the same situation.
Those are actually small mark ups if you ask my local dealer. Two years ago they were adding $11,000 dealer adjustment to Tacoma and $10,000 to Tundra. (Anchorage, Ak)
60 grands, no thanks. I'm keeping my 2019 Taco
I'll push a wheelbarrow for 60K.
@@thermionic8530l payed 38000 for my 2018 off-Road. I’ll never pay dealer markup, never!
Bought my 21 Tacoma TRD Sport for MSRP… paid cash… I put less than 5k a year on it, doing just truck stuff and 2nd vehicle miles. In another 17 years I will have only 100k on it. Unlike the new gen I have the bulletproof V6. It will be the last truck I will ever have to buy.
Lancaster Toyota has always been a ripoff. During the car "shortage'" a couple years ago they were marking cars up to $10,000 over MSRP. And people were paying for it. With persistence, I bought a hybrid corolla at $1000 under MSRP at another dealer.
Some old timers like me will remember when Miata's were going for 65k. It was ridiculous, but it ultimately settled down. I know we are all excited about the 4th gen, but we also want to feel good about our decisions at the end of the day
It will settle down for sure. I just hate to see it right away
Dang when were the Miata’s going for 65k I got mine first year 4th gen released at 31k after tax and fees for the club with some add ons.
miatas never sold for that, ot crusier hot $10 over
Your point is well made at the end. Toyota wants these Trucks to move and they set the price to move the trucks at a volume they want them to. There are dealers that feel the same way and won't mark up vehicles. Their business model is to move more vehicles and get more happy (return) customers. You don't want to do business with a dealer that is marking up vehicles. They'll find other ways to screw you, too (more than a regular dealer does).
The last 3 new vehicles I purchased (of 4 in my life) were ordered. It is such a better process and I would never buy a new vehicle off the lot again unless I couldn't wait for some reason. I was able to compare dealership experiences and everything else before deciding where to take our business. We had a 2021 Bronco order in for a long time when we started hearing about the back-end markups that some dealers were trying. Thankfully our dealer didn't do it.
Opinion to take or leave:
It might be disingenuous to compare your (and other's ) pre-order purchase at TSRP with a purchase off the lot adding a mark-up. Also, subtly bagging on California then only choosing 3 dealers to prove your view, all from CA, is also a bit much. Why not show this happening at dealers in other states? It will tell a more complete story. Presented it such as you did takes away from your point and, to a lesser extent, your credibility. If it is only happening in California, then that is a big story and should be emphasized and even get the press involved.
I mentioned that in the video there are good dealer out there. in CA, AZ, WA etc. There is a no mark up toyota group if you wana break down dealer by dealer.
5.24 per gallon yesterday in my part of California.
FYI, the markups on new toyotas in CA is why I just recently bought my 4runner used. Spent 2 years looking.
Congrats on the new to you 4R man!
Those gas prices are outrageous!
$4.19 in SoCal this morning
4Runner isn’t a wise choice either.. I have one n I don’t really like the sluggish power n the amount of gas it eats…
PREACH!!! The dealerships will run out of customers with more money than brains eventually. We need to remember them and punish them accordingly. To be fair... there still are some good dealers out there.
Thanks for the advice,I'm seriously thinking of a new Tacoma and do not plan on paying over MSRP.
In Huntersville NC I saw a trd pro 4runner marked up $15K
You are a truth teller!! Thanks TRD Jon.
MSRP is a rip off considering how much the dealer pays the OEM for the vehicle, the dealers that are selling over MSRP are just ripping you off more. Anyone that tells you that buying at MSPR is OK is probably getting a kick back from that dealer.
There are still brand new 40th Anniversary edition 4Runners sitting on the lot a year later, being listed for less than MSRP. When they came out people were paying $15k over list prices thinking they were going to be collectible. Don’t give into the gougers, only pay what things are worth.
@@alamogiftshop Wait a year and buy one CPO? Or go buy a last gen Taco and save the money for mods. Whatever floats your boat I suppose.
Unfortunately there is plenty of people paying 15k over😮, when i buy my pro at msrp, but people so dumb paying over
Great video and 100% agreed. People just sit here and complain about markups but if the people are stupid enough to keep buying it'll never stop!
We live in the Wenatchee valley, Washington state.
Every dealership here have markup’s on their vehicles.
So we travel 3 hours away to buy our vehicles at MSRP
Well, $2.49 by my apt here in Houston. Yet, wow on those dealer prices. Pretty sure they will want a ridiculous amount for the Pro 🙄
Dealers need to remember they aren’t necessary. Direct sales need to happen
I have 2 dealerships without markups but man it’s been a hassle trying to buy one of these. These are a 21000 truck costing us 40g it’s horrible. I want a 2024 trd premium hybrid.
I currently live in Orange County and I am coming from Los Angeles looking to get into a pick up or SUV, came across your video when I was looking into the Tundra then found out about Tacoma’s came out with a new gen too - and your videos are super HELPFUL. Torn between Tundra, Tacoma and Tahoe BUT the prices are all INSANE.
Welcome aboard!
Do not buy a vehicle with the Chevy 6.2 engine.
I am so glad you did this video!! These dealerships are crooks! Please people!! Don’t pay over sticker!!! These prices are already too high!!!!
You just gotta call around and find a dealership that isn’t marking cars up. I live north of Chicago and the dealership closest to me is marking up their RAV4 hybrid by $15k, so I left and called around until I found a dealership in the suburbs that wasn’t marking them up.
Fully agree 100%. Dealers will keep adding markups if people keep buying them
I paid 3k under msrp for a tundra SR5 TRD off road. Since when did tacomas cost as much at tundras lol. I paid 49,800 plus tax. Consumers are idiots!
I have a 2022 trd offroad, paid cash and in no rush for the next gen, mainly waiting for the next gen 4runner. Ultimately living a 100% debt free life is great. Only reason why dealers are marking up is because they know there are so many suckers out there willing to sacrifice a life of financial success just for the newest truck. Foolish in my opinion.
I didn’t over MSRP for my 23’ TRD OR back in May. I had been looking for months and refused to “order” a truck with options I didn’t want and eventually found one
I ended up with a Honda but my dealer had a market adjustment on theirs also. I shopped 8 other dealers, went back to my dealer and offered them the opportunity to meet my lowest price, which was below MSRP. They took the deal. So, not only will I not pay over MSRP, I won't even pay that much. Oh, and I got 0.9% interest.
Effort and sacrifice pays off long term, but most people are too lazy to do it.
Good job.
Thanks for sharing Jon and revealing that these additional dealer markups over MSRP are still taking place! We've seen 4 Runner prices drop here in Connecticut and the Northeast Among Toyota dealers because interest rates are so high now. Most of the reputable Toyota dealers who've been in business for 50 to 60 years are now offering $2,000 off MSRP on 4 Runners. That said, they can keep them until I can get 10% off MSRP!
Even without these "market adjustments" aka dealership scams and price gouging these prices are still absolutely ridiculous. Not even a handful of years ago the same price that you could get this next generation's base model pre-markup, you could have actually got a nice 4wd Tacoma with a nice trim package. People should refuse to let these dealerships scam them and have them be forced to lower these ludicrous prices. So much for the working mans truck.
We should be going beyond simply refusing to buy at inflated MSRPs...we should be reaching out to state representatives to let them know it's time to end the dealership model.
I hope there are honest dealers out there that will focus on high volume sales rather than playing the markup game. I also hope they snatch most if not all of the sales from these other greedy dealers.
There is man. It actually works better for them because they get allocated more cars. Weird how that works.
I walked out of a vw dealer after I saw a 10k markup. they said they were flexible on it and I told them” if you’re still marking up vehicles, then I don’t want to do business with you regardless of if you’re flexible”. walked out and never went back. found a better one a little further away
‘23 Tacoma will go up in value I bet too since it’s the last v6 engine for Tacoma!
100% agree. The only other thing I wish you would have said is remember which dealerships are doing this now and then when things are back to normal, give your money to any other dealer that has the same price. Voting with your wallet is the only way to make bad dealers understand (or go out of business).
Thank goodness I signed a deal with my dealership here in Canada for MSRP when I put a deposit down.
Heck ya! There you go
I put down a deposit at my dealership in September for a new '24 Tacoma TRD Off-Road or Sport. I've purchased many trucks from them and they have a no market adjustment policy.
@@TRDJon Canada law forbid dealerships from selling over MSRP I wish the United States would institute such a law
Keep fighting the fight. I really want a new Tacoma trd pro or trailhunter next year. Laughing every time you mentioned CA dealers, because I live in Southern California totally not surprising greedy dealerships.
Ive heard Toyota is trying to get away from dealerships and you would buy online from the factory. I hope this is true as it will get rid of all the crook stealerships. Has anyone else heard of this??
this would be so ideal
Interest rates aren’t very high from a historical perspective. You’re just used to basement rates stemming from relatively recent catastrophic events. (‘08 financial crisis, pandemic/inflation)
This, insanity will only stop when the consumer decides enough is enough, These dealers will continue to mark these new cars and trucks up as long as the consumer continues to buy them its not just Toyota its all of them, We as consumers should let them sit on the lots until they are mice infested and the tire are rotting off the wheels
Boycott any dealer trying to rip of people! No shortage! Tacomas and tundras setting with big money off everywhere. Nobody buying. Let these set there as well!
you can’t fix stupid Jon…
Nope....
Shop around folks. I’ve bought 8 new vehicles since 2012 and bought almost every one of them at invoice (or below in some cases). The only exception was a Bronco which was MSRP which was bought to sell.
This shit has to stop ... We have only ourselves to blame; we keep paying above sticker and/or bullshit markup fees. Some blame can be cast towards Toyota as they have the power to stop "adjustment fees."
Dealers are private, but they still weard the Toyota brand
Great job calling out this nonsense. 👍🏻
Back in 2021-22 I was looking at a 4R TRD ORP with KDSS, dealer marked up another $5K over sticker, I already had a 2020 4R TRD ORP with KDSS, and dealer said they where really hard to find and are getting the inflated price. He asked me if I had a trade I pointed to my 4R and told him I wanted $5K over KBB clean trade in for my 4R and they wouldn't't bite, I laughed and walked away.
In April 2023 I purchased my Tacoma it’s an SR5, 4x4, v6, automatic with blind spot monitoring, rear parking sensor, 5” bed, signals on the mirrors, and dual climate control. Being totally honest $44.680 out the door this included warranty taxes everything. I don’t know if I over paid I don’t think so, but please leave respectful comments and let me know. Anyway I love the truck I installed myself Bilstein 5100 in the front 2” and a 1” supreme suspensions block in the back, Tyger soft roll up bed cover, and running boards and Luckyman seat covers been using this brand on all my vehicles. Now looking for bigger tires any suggestions?
Congrats on the new truck!
The dealers are driving away customers. In December my wife was shopping for a replace for her Prius. We went to dealer to order a new Prius Prime. 3-6 month wait and they didn’t want to tell us what we would be facing at deliver as far as price. I told them we won’t order until they give us a price. $4200 markup. We drive just down the street and got a Tesla Model 3 performance for $3,750 OFF MSRP and it was in stock.
This would have been our 4th Toyota.
For anyone in Alabama, McKinnon Motors in Clanton (Central Alabama) does not mark up their Toyota inventory. They also sell Nissan. Ask for Steve Johnson. Great guy.
Yeah a dealer in Madison says he selling a trd sport for 62000 but he said it has premium package. Thats crazy
*madison wisconsin
This is why i love my local dealership (Principle Toyota in Memphis). I have bought 8 Toyota from them, around 5 Camrys, my old and new Tundras. Never any markup, even their Capstone Tundras are around $6000 below 1794 around $4300 below MSRP. New cars never have a markup. We bought my wife a RAV4 XSE Hybrid about a month ago at MSRP. Just don't take your trade in to them, they will under cut the hell out of your trade, I'm guessing that's how they make their money.
I'm a buyer at msrp.... NEVER thought I would say that, lol. I was leaning heavily toward a trail hunter over the f150 tremor. Probably will just end up with another Ford. I like them just fine, but have been intrigued by the 4 cyl turbo hybrid.
That is total bullshit! I bought my 19’ Tundra 1794 edition top trim level brand new for less than 50K and 0% for 5 years. 50K for an SR5 Tacoma is just highway robbery!
Jon, there are 3 types of pricing at dealerships that I've seen: MSRP, SRP and TSRP. The listings that you were showing had only SRP listed. SRP and TSRP are usually inflated prices that include MSRP plus all of the other junk fees and add-ons that dealers want to pile onto vehicles. Buyers should only be working off of MSRP. Also, now that you've moved to Florida, you're in the Southeast Toyota Distributor region (FL, GA, NC, SC, AL). (I'm in the Gulf States Toyota Distributor region (TX, LA, MS, OK, AR).). We're lucky enough to have the added layer of a distributor between the dealership and Toyota which usually means unwanted add-ons/options loaded onto Toyota vehicles -- creating a 4th pricing of "DSRP". When I purchased my '23 TRD Pro Access Cab V6 in December of '22, there were 6 Distributor options added to my truck. MRSP on the sticker was $36,040. The Distributor options added totaled $2,071 bringing it to a DSRP of $38,111. I bought the truck because the dealership, Toyota of Denton, was discounting the car during the last week of the year to $35,748 which is what I paid for it.
I agree! Shop around! I bought a Kia Niro EV in 2022 when EV’s were scarce, had to purchase mine in Maryland and have it shipped to me in order to not pay over MSRP and get the color and options I wanted. Dealers were marking them up $7.5K (amt of the tax credit). I paid $1200 to ship it to me, saved over $6K
Thank you! Couldn’t agree more. Actually was thinking about getting a ZR2 because it’s looking like the 24 TRD Pro will be $60k+ and I might refund my deposit on that.
Chevy dealership had $5k markup. Asked if it was negotiable via phone call. Was told NO. I said have a nice day. At the end of the day truck still would have been less than new pro but F no I’m not gonna increase my monthly payment so the dealership gets a bonus. Their bonus should be me buying the truck and then maybe being a customer for life and getting said truck serviced at their dealership.
Honestly the new Tacoma is not a truck I would want to get anymore. That new 4 cylinder turbo engine is bound to have many problems, especially for towing.
Gas price at Costco here in California was $4.11/gal a couple days ago when I filled up.
Damn, pre Covid nobody paid MSRP and often it was considered normal to pay less, especially with dealer incentives….sad really😢😮😳😳😡😡😡😡
Can't Toyota step-in and stop this nonsense?
Dealers are smart because they know people will still pay over msrp because they really want the truck, rarely do people back out they just convince themselves that its worth it
Dealer markups/greed will hurt 4th Gen Tacoma sales. Midsize trucks are generally lifestyle trucks, they don't offer near the utility as a full-size SUV or full-size truck which can be had for similar prices. Can you imagine paying over $50K for a 4 cylinder turbocharged truck that really can only seat two adults and like a small child? Especially, with today's interest rates. Being priced so high it will make buyers think twice about how they really want to spend that kind of money and to be honest I think a lot of buyers will end up making a different choice. I bought my 3rd Gen new in 2016 (Double Cab/TRD Off Road) for $33,500. Its crazy what today's prices look like. I encourage people to take care of their vehicles they own today and make better use of your hard earned money with travel and experiences.
There are idiots that will buy these trucks and ruin the market for everyone else.
Good on you for getting out of Cali. I spent my first 35 years in El Cajon. CA, very close to Chula Vista. I moved to Indianapolis, IN and have no regrets. I just filled up my 16' Tacoma for $2.35 a gallon.
Oh wow!
Jon, thanks for bringing some sense to the madness. Toyota baked past markups into the base price of this truck; Dealerships would have sale for $3,000 under MSRP and Toyota would need to provide a $5,000 factory rebate to get me interested.
I was in Fort Myers all last week and gas was $2.89.
hey jon keep in minda that we were used to buy at msrp MINUS rebates and an extra dealership rebates and sometimes even a free item added
U made me worried now Jon.. lol it’s amazing how in the beginning everyone was saying this is the most affordable midsize truck - of course dealers won’t let us enjoy that
Why I just purchased a different car 2 months ago. I really wanted a Tacoma TRD 4x4 but knew it would be close to impossible to get one and the ones that are available would be marked up. Paid cash for my 2024 RAV4 so figured id sell it and get a Tacoma in 2 years when the market stabilizes.
Sadly, we have countless losers that have to be the 1st to own the latest and greatest. If they had $100k price tags, these are the idiots that would buy it.
Agreed, glad to hear you tell people to stop the madness paying these high prices. It's the few that either have the money or are careless with their money that ruin it for the rest of us by giving in to these high prices. If everyone would stop and send a hard message, they may keep prices acceptable.
There’s plenty of buyers who will pay the mark up just so they can be one of the first .
There's probably a dozen or more Toyota dealers within 75 miles of me. Since the mid-90s, I've bought a new Toyota from about 6 of them. We have 3 Toyotas now that are 2020 or newer. I shopped all the dealers I've dealt with before. Unfortunately, for the 2020 Tundra, I bought it for less than MSRP but got it out of the state because of the way it was equipped. The 2022 and 2023 models we only shopped 2 of the dealers because they were the only 2 that weren't selling vehicles for more than MSRP.
Here in Wisconsin the gas Price is $2.88 and on other places are $2.65 gallon like minnesota I hope here in Wisconsin don't have the markups 😅😢
Not only would I not pay over msrp, I will refuse to do business in the future for the dealerships doing this. I had to change my home dealer from Dublin ca to Walnut Creek ca
$4.05 per gallon, ampm)arco, today ! By the way, there are still lots of 2023 Tacoma available! I got mine TRD off road 4x4 V6 bare bones for $46000 out the door !
That’s crazy. 40,000 is the price of the highest trim Tacoma from 2020 and is basically the price of a new Full Size Truck now. 40k is crazy to pay for a base model.
Gotta pass the word that it’s against Toyota’s terms and conditions with their dealerships to sell over MSRP. Made some calls about Corwin Toyota in Fargo and now they know to not try to charge me over MSRP.
Idid buy a 23 Sequoia Pro and Tundra Pro this year. They wanted over MSRP but I refused and they did sell for MSRP which still makes a good profit. I will never pay over.
The prices are already high. A basic 2024 TRD Sport 4x4 auto is $42,600 MSRP, plus destination charge of $1500.00, plus dealer fee of $800.00 and taxes here in Florida, puts the price at just over $48,000 WITHOUT options, and you know none come without some options. I was hoping for the TRD Sport I-force Max hybrid 4x4, but it will likely put the price out of my range. I would guess the hybrid version will tack on another $3 - 4 thousand, which will put the trim I want around 52 - 53K - well out of my price range.
Extra dealer markup started in the early 80s when people were waiting in line for a Honda four-door Accord! I used to sell all my Hondas in Flagstaff to the Phoenix people because the dealers down there were gouging. And I made a comfortable living giving them all a good deal. $1200 over invoice! These dealers wanna make 10 grand a car. They don’t get much business I’m not sure, but I bet there’s a lot of cars left over from the last four years brand new that haven’t sold.
Thank you for this. I'm really considering buying one or a complete opposite and going for Toyota crown. I'll have to see where I get better vaule
Checkered Flag in Va Beach, VA is adding markups to Tacomas and Land Cruisers, and they told me they have a wait list for both.
I bought a new Jeep Rubicon and I got it for under MSRP earlier this year and there were hardly any on the lot, but I stood firm and got the deal I wanted.I knew what was coming at the beginning of the year🤔 so I was prepared to walk if I didn't get the price I wanted it at.
I’d love to know how much of that price increase is taxes.
I drive a 2005 Taco I bought new. My next vehicle may be the scout or a Tesla PU.