Excellent engineering explanations Rich!! While I had reached a conclusion that I probably still want a geometry correction bracket even with all adjustable control arms, stumbling onto your video was a comforting confirmation of my decision. Of the countless videos I watched in researching a custom lift, NO one addressed WHY one might want to use a geometry correction bracket even if using adjustable control arms. Almost all implied that it's an either or...really had to read between the lines to contemplate that I might need both. Thank You for this video and confirming that I'm not crazy for thinking I might want/need both.
The geometry correction is something all can benefit from however some arms introduce different bends and arc paths so you just need to be careful and cycle the suspension without the springs to make sure evening clears though out the new geometry and new arms.
Wow ~ I hate you but love you man! Great Vid on the AEV lift and Geo Brackets. I have turned some wrenches in my day, but your videos convinced me to install the AEV RT 2 1/2" Lift. Completed the rear, and installed the Geo brackets today. Will take care of the front springs and shocks tomorrow. Big thanks for your vids, it was a great help as otherwise I would have paid someone to install. Working with just jacks and floor stands but we are getting er done. TY!
HA! I appreciate the kind words. The best part of doing the work of documenting the install is getting people to mod their own vehicles and better understand what it is they are doing. There are plenty of better channels to watch for entertainment but as far as documenting the installation stuff, I try to cover the little stuff and some of the less exciting but totally critical steps in the most concise way I can. I am glad it got you through the first part of the install and hope you enjoy the last part. Let me know how it goes.
@@exhaustinglife ~ Hey Rich, thank you brother. Finished up my Jeep Sahara Unlimited 4XE today. Took it for a test drive and one of the front springs came off. NAH just kidding . . Your vids are just spot on. I also added the Yeti HD front tack bar as well. Everything came out awesome. I will be adding the 35" Nittos and Fuel rims in the next couple weeks, then we will get her an alignment. Awesome stuff, Thanks again!
@@FordTremor Drove the wheels off! LOL enjoy the fruits of your labor. Their is nothing better than your turned your own wrench to get exactly what you wanted.
@@exhaustinglife Agree! Got that baby installed, double checked torqued all bolts and straightened the steering wheel back to center. Love the AEV lift and rides great! Ironically the Nitto Ridge Grapplers 35"s on Fuel Rims arrive today! Xmas in Sept. Thanks again for the support and all your vids to help others out!
Just got these put on my gladiator mojave that's on a 2" lift and 37s, I would say just the improvement in impact response is quite dramatic and definitely worth the price.
I am on similar gear with a 2.5" lift and 37's as well. It is not a modification you struggle to feel. If you have driven your Jeep hard either on the street or dirt you will notice the benefits to stability under braking or acceleration.
@@exhaustinglife ive been driving it for about a day now, wow it brakes almost completely flat now no more nosediving I'm very happy with how my jeep feels now great product.
After realizing the intent for the shields were to protect the factory bushings, there really was no need to keep them as the entire arm was relocated out of the impacted area of the exhaust / catalytic converter heat and in direct airflow outside of the frame rail.
I’ve got a set to sell its brand new in a box I’ve bought it together with the 2 inch AEV spacer lift kit and the instructions there said you don’t need correction brackets.
You don't "need" them to make the spacer lift work... it just drives and performs better with them. Your front axle caster will be out of spec and it will drive but will track poorly compared to stock. The geometry correction brackets return the necessary 6 degrees of caster with the stock control arms.
Hi I am interested in this kit but would like to keep as much ground clearance as possible. Is there a noticeable difference with how low the control arms sit or is it negligible? Thanks
The bracket does sit about 1/4" lower than the Artec belly pan I have but its not in a place where I expect to see that change effect critical ground clearance for the type of rock crawling I do. The arm itself sits a little more than 2.5" lower than the original mounting point which is higher than the bottom of the frame. If you check out the video at 9:48 you can see the bracket in purple and just where it sits.
On the AEV product page, it says it "decreases operating angle of front drive shaft." I don't understand that. Do you understand how changing the angle of the control arms effects the driveshaft? As the position of the axle is the same and rotationaly it would be lower, so more of an angle not less, or am do I have that wrong?
Yes. Let me try to explain. As you know, the front suspension upper and lower control arms are of a different length. In their nominal position (ride height), they sit fairly parallel to the ground. As the suspension is articulated into full droop (or full compression for that matter), the caster starts to change faster as the axle moves further away from nominal (ride height) and closer to each extreme. These increases due to the shorter upper arm does not allow for caster to remain the same. This change in caster increases the driveline angle more quickly relative to the more extreme the control arm angle gets. With the geometry relocation brackets the angle of the control arms sitting near stock (ride height) position AFTER the lift is installed which preserves the caster longer through the droop (or compression) of the axle as the unequal length impact is less now not already having started with the more extreme angles created by lifting the Jeep (pushing the axle away from the chassis) If the upper and lower control arms were of exact equal length, then your initial thoughts on the position of the axle being lower would mean the angle of the driveline would be the same. For this reason, you do not need to make a driveline modification to accommodate a lift upto 3.5" where some stock geometry kits with even adjustable arms do. I hope that makes sense... it super easy to see if I could post a 3D model image showing control arm arcs.
I’m installing these on my jeep and the holes to mount the passenger side bracket don’t line up. If I mount the upper bracket , the lower outside bracket hole is about 1/4” too low for the bolt to pass through? If I do it in reverse thr upper mount bolt won’t go on. Any suggestions?
Couple questions. 1.) is it an AEV geometry relocation bracket? 2.) is it adjustable for different types of lift values? (i.e. 2.0", 2.5-3.5", 4.0") In the video you will see that the AEV units have an adjustment for the upper arm which corrects Caster positioning for the upper arm. Most of the other brands have pre-drilled holes and construction wise are laser cut, welded and some even bolted together. The stamped and welded construction of the AEV is much more precise from unit to unit. Let me know which you have and I might have some insight.
Thank you for the reply. We were able to get it to work. We had to fiddle with it a bit but got both bolts in by putting them both in at the same time instead of one before the other. I was also told by AEV that you can rock the vehicle back-and-forth a bit and that could help get the bolts in place. And yes, it’s one of their stamped geometry correction brackets for the 2.5 to 3 inch RT suspension. Thank you again!
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but is it even possible to get those control arm bolts to 190ft-lbs without an impact like you're doing here? I'm trying to imagine being under my Jeep with a box wrench in one hand and my torque wrench in the other, but it seems like it would be a pain in the ass.
I don't always show the torqueing step. You will need a torque wrench that is capable of the proper setting and in my case a 1ft pipe extension on the Snap-on torque wrench was adequate. 190 ft-lbs is a LOT of force.
This is what I did since I was working alone: First get a long torque wrench, second sit on the floor with your legs going under the Jeep, third lift the torque wrench using a curling motion, and use your legs to help push up the wrench as an assist. It gives you a lot more power.
AEV provides some guidelines at the end of the instruction manual on when you can use the brackets along with an adjustable control arm. They specifically address when adjustable control may be REQUIRED to use the Geometry Brackets. In section B "Installation with Non-AEV Suspensions" 1. You’ll first need to get a measurement from your vehicle to determine whether or not you should be using the drop brackets. Measure from the bottom of the frame to the top of the spring seat. Many suspensions vary from advertised height based on vehicle options, accessories, and manufacturing tolerances. We recommend measuring the height of your vehicle even if you know the advertised lift height. This will help ensure you set caster to the proper spec. NOTE: If your measurement is less than 5 inches we do NOT recommend these brackets. 2. . If your measurement is greater than 7.5 inches adjustable control arms MAY BE REQUIRED to achieve the proper caster angle. 3. You can now proceed to part A to finish the installation of the drop brackets.
@@philliplehn3600 Adjustable arms can be used to alter length if the geometry needs to be changed for more lift or axle housing but be mindful of interference.
I will be doing the geometry correction brackets, they are in the mail. It drives like shit over sharp bumps at speed with a 2.5 inch lift and that was with adjustable lower control arms at 5 degree caster and with standard tyres.
Hi , i have 2020 jeep wrangler ,thinking to install AEV spacer lift but i am not sure , i would need this correction brackets as you mentioned it need s for 2020+ jeeps
Put on 50k miles in under 2 years and was drawn to the ZR2 Silverado with the 6.2L. Found a buyer and got screwed by the dealership and lost my allocation to unreasonable "market adjustments" and had to find a capable alternative.
@@exhaustinglife sorry to hear that. you were my resource for information on the ZR2. Good luck. I hope to see you later with the new model coming out.
Excellent engineering explanations Rich!! While I had reached a conclusion that I probably still want a geometry correction bracket even with all adjustable control arms, stumbling onto your video was a comforting confirmation of my decision. Of the countless videos I watched in researching a custom lift, NO one addressed WHY one might want to use a geometry correction bracket even if using adjustable control arms. Almost all implied that it's an either or...really had to read between the lines to contemplate that I might need both. Thank You for this video and confirming that I'm not crazy for thinking I might want/need both.
The geometry correction is something all can benefit from however some arms introduce different bends and arc paths so you just need to be careful and cycle the suspension without the springs to make sure evening clears though out the new geometry and new arms.
Thank you for this video! It was so helpful when installing the 2.5 on my 4xe!
Wow ~ I hate you but love you man! Great Vid on the AEV lift and Geo Brackets. I have turned some wrenches in my day, but your videos convinced me to install the AEV RT 2 1/2" Lift. Completed the rear, and installed the Geo brackets today. Will take care of the front springs and shocks tomorrow. Big thanks for your vids, it was a great help as otherwise I would have paid someone to install. Working with just jacks and floor stands but we are getting er done. TY!
HA! I appreciate the kind words. The best part of doing the work of documenting the install is getting people to mod their own vehicles and better understand what it is they are doing.
There are plenty of better channels to watch for entertainment but as far as documenting the installation stuff, I try to cover the little stuff and some of the less exciting but totally critical steps in the most concise way I can.
I am glad it got you through the first part of the install and hope you enjoy the last part. Let me know how it goes.
@@exhaustinglife ~ Hey Rich, thank you brother. Finished up my Jeep Sahara Unlimited 4XE today. Took it for a test drive and one of the front springs came off. NAH just kidding . . Your vids are just spot on. I also added the Yeti HD front tack bar as well. Everything came out awesome. I will be adding the 35" Nittos and Fuel rims in the next couple weeks, then we will get her an alignment. Awesome stuff, Thanks again!
@@FordTremor Sounds like you got it all handled. The adjustable track bar is a nice touch. I might be adding a Steer Smart as a finishing touch.
@@FordTremor Drove the wheels off! LOL enjoy the fruits of your labor. Their is nothing better than your turned your own wrench to get exactly what you wanted.
@@exhaustinglife Agree! Got that baby installed, double checked torqued all bolts and straightened the steering wheel back to center. Love the AEV lift and rides great! Ironically the Nitto Ridge Grapplers 35"s on Fuel Rims arrive today! Xmas in Sept. Thanks again for the support and all your vids to help others out!
Just got these put on my gladiator mojave that's on a 2" lift and 37s, I would say just the improvement in impact response is quite dramatic and definitely worth the price.
I am on similar gear with a 2.5" lift and 37's as well. It is not a modification you struggle to feel. If you have driven your Jeep hard either on the street or dirt you will notice the benefits to stability under braking or acceleration.
@@exhaustinglife ive been driving it for about a day now, wow it brakes almost completely flat now no more nosediving I'm very happy with how my jeep feels now great product.
@@Miguelmedina22 It really works. Enjoy it!
Good stuff rich, that photo in the end with the reflection 👌🏻
Bee Canyon with no one around
This video needs more views!
LOL I agree ;)
AEV sent me! 😎
I appreciate your visit and their sending you.
Were you able to get those heat shields back in place after installing the brackets?
After realizing the intent for the shields were to protect the factory bushings, there really was no need to keep them as the entire arm was relocated out of the impacted area of the exhaust / catalytic converter heat and in direct airflow outside of the frame rail.
I’ve got a set to sell its brand new in a box I’ve bought it together with the 2 inch AEV spacer lift kit and the instructions there said you don’t need correction brackets.
You don't "need" them to make the spacer lift work... it just drives and performs better with them. Your front axle caster will be out of spec and it will drive but will track poorly compared to stock. The geometry correction brackets return the necessary 6 degrees of caster with the stock control arms.
Definitely corrects the lack of adjustability to prevent death wobble. It fixed my vibration that I was chasing due to not enough caster.
Hi I am interested in this kit but would like to keep as much ground clearance as possible. Is there a noticeable difference with how low the control arms sit or is it negligible? Thanks
The bracket does sit about 1/4" lower than the Artec belly pan I have but its not in a place where I expect to see that change effect critical ground clearance for the type of rock crawling I do. The arm itself sits a little more than 2.5" lower than the original mounting point which is higher than the bottom of the frame. If you check out the video at 9:48 you can see the bracket in purple and just where it sits.
On the AEV product page, it says it "decreases operating angle of front drive shaft." I don't understand that. Do you understand how changing the angle of the control arms effects the driveshaft? As the position of the axle is the same and rotationaly it would be lower, so more of an angle not less, or am do I have that wrong?
Yes. Let me try to explain.
As you know, the front suspension upper and lower control arms are of a different length. In their nominal position (ride height), they sit fairly parallel to the ground.
As the suspension is articulated into full droop (or full compression for that matter), the caster starts to change faster as the axle moves further away from nominal (ride height) and closer to each extreme. These increases due to the shorter upper arm does not allow for caster to remain the same. This change in caster increases the driveline angle more quickly relative to the more extreme the control arm angle gets.
With the geometry relocation brackets the angle of the control arms sitting near stock (ride height) position AFTER the lift is installed which preserves the caster longer through the droop (or compression) of the axle as the unequal length impact is less now not already having started with the more extreme angles created by lifting the Jeep (pushing the axle away from the chassis)
If the upper and lower control arms were of exact equal length, then your initial thoughts on the position of the axle being lower would mean the angle of the driveline would be the same. For this reason, you do not need to make a driveline modification to accommodate a lift upto 3.5" where some stock geometry kits with even adjustable arms do.
I hope that makes sense... it super easy to see if I could post a 3D model image showing control arm arcs.
Ok thank you for taking the time to explain that! Your install video was excellent btw with some good tips. Appreciate it!@@exhaustinglife
I’m installing these on my jeep and the holes to mount the passenger side bracket don’t line up. If I mount the upper bracket , the lower outside bracket hole is about 1/4” too low for the bolt to pass through? If I do it in reverse thr upper mount bolt won’t go on. Any suggestions?
Couple questions. 1.) is it an AEV geometry relocation bracket? 2.) is it adjustable for different types of lift values? (i.e. 2.0", 2.5-3.5", 4.0")
In the video you will see that the AEV units have an adjustment for the upper arm which corrects Caster positioning for the upper arm. Most of the other brands have pre-drilled holes and construction wise are laser cut, welded and some even bolted together. The stamped and welded construction of the AEV is much more precise from unit to unit.
Let me know which you have and I might have some insight.
Thank you for the reply. We were able to get it to work. We had to fiddle with it a bit but got both bolts in by putting them both in at the same time instead of one before the other. I was also told by AEV that you can rock the vehicle back-and-forth a bit and that could help get the bolts in place. And yes, it’s one of their stamped geometry correction brackets for the 2.5 to 3 inch RT suspension. Thank you again!
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but is it even possible to get those control arm bolts to 190ft-lbs without an impact like you're doing here? I'm trying to imagine being under my Jeep with a box wrench in one hand and my torque wrench in the other, but it seems like it would be a pain in the ass.
I don't always show the torqueing step. You will need a torque wrench that is capable of the proper setting and in my case a 1ft pipe extension on the Snap-on torque wrench was adequate. 190 ft-lbs is a LOT of force.
@@exhaustinglife Thanks! Yea I have a 250ft-lb wrench, it just seems tough to get enough leverage in the first place without some kind of trick.
This is what I did since I was working alone: First get a long torque wrench, second sit on the floor with your legs going under the Jeep, third lift the torque wrench using a curling motion, and use your legs to help push up the wrench as an assist. It gives you a lot more power.
Did you end up removing the heat shields all together ?
At first no, but there is no need to keep them as the upper bolts no longer have rubber bushings next to the exhaust / catalytic converters
I believe the instructions says not to use with adjustable controls arms
AEV provides some guidelines at the end of the instruction manual on when you can use the brackets along with an adjustable control arm. They specifically address when adjustable control may be REQUIRED to use the Geometry Brackets.
In section B "Installation with Non-AEV Suspensions"
1. You’ll first need to get a measurement from your vehicle to determine whether or not you should be using the drop brackets. Measure from the bottom of the frame to the top of the spring seat. Many suspensions vary from advertised height based on vehicle options, accessories, and manufacturing tolerances. We recommend measuring the height of your vehicle even if you know the advertised lift height. This will help ensure you set caster to the proper spec.
NOTE: If your measurement is less than 5 inches we do NOT recommend these brackets.
2. . If your measurement is greater than 7.5 inches adjustable control arms MAY BE REQUIRED to achieve the
proper caster angle.
3. You can now proceed to part A to finish the installation of the drop brackets.
Should be able to use adjustable lower control arms if they can be adjusted to the standard length.
@@philliplehn3600 Adjustable arms can be used to alter length if the geometry needs to be changed for more lift or axle housing but be mindful of interference.
I will be doing the geometry correction brackets, they are in the mail. It drives like shit over sharp bumps at speed with a 2.5 inch lift and that was with adjustable lower control arms at 5 degree caster and with standard tyres.
Hi , i have 2020 jeep wrangler ,thinking to install AEV spacer lift but i am not sure , i would need this correction brackets as you mentioned it need s for 2020+ jeeps
The geometry relocation brackets can be used with a spacer lift. They provide no lift on their own.
Dude, where's the ZR2?
Put on 50k miles in under 2 years and was drawn to the ZR2 Silverado with the 6.2L. Found a buyer and got screwed by the dealership and lost my allocation to unreasonable "market adjustments" and had to find a capable alternative.
@@exhaustinglife sorry to hear that. you were my resource for information on the ZR2. Good luck. I hope to see you later with the new model coming out.