I carry a UK legal pocket knife and I use it pretty much everyday as the tool it is. However, I will never take out with me if I'm off out for a drink or a night out. It's a sad state of affairs where we have to live in this world as a locking blade is safer for the operator
Thanks for this BBB. What about the long extending razor sharp knifes for cutting wallpaper etc. they have the segmented blade that you can break off when it blunts. Are they totally illegal on the street
@BlackBeltBarrister Hi, I disagree. Criminal Justice Act 1988, section 139 (3) This section applies to a folding pocketknife if the cutting edge of its blade exceeds 3 inches. As you can see, it clearly says "cutting edge". Companies such as Heinnie Haynes, import and sell knives in the UK based on this. That is, for example, not including the finger choil in the blade length. BOOKER V DPP to the best of my knowledge refers to a bladed article, that granted may not have been considered sharp, but the law doesn't say "sharp". It did however have a cutting edge, futhermore, it was in no way foldable, making the length of the cutting edge irrelevant. An entirely different cattegory. Please explain if you still think I'm missing something.
I've carried that Spyderco UK PK every day for 20 odd years. Many of us Brits worked with Spyderco to design that knife, so it was as safe as reasonably possible without a lock, and compliant with our legislation. Still, however, there are bobbies that will try and confiscate it; though they are required to return it once they've confirmed with the station that it is, in fact, legal to carry without a 'reasonable' excuse.
@Mr DejavuKing @Mr DejavuKing Yes, it will be up to the officer, whether you have to wait to get it returned, after they've generally conferred with a colleague at the station. Carrying penknives is legal, and has always been. I comply with, and respect the law, and the often thankless job police officers do. I have even been screened by British intelligence. I feel sorry for the MI5 officer who had to go through all the pictures of my cats and the back of my head. Honestly I probably use the tweezers on my Swiss Army Knife more than the little folding penknife blade. But it's useful, and before I ever started, I checked with the legislation, and have kept up to date with it, as is my responsibility. That's what this video is about!
@Mr DejavuKing @Mr DejavuKing I think you're right to be cautious, and it's completely understandable. But I've always stood out (I'm a weird colour) so I expect to be picked out and targeted. It doesn't bother me, and I volunteer the information say, about my folding knife to security and police officers. I've also been attacked by criminals a fair few times for sticking out, twice were life or death situations, where I unfortunately had to become violent. I carried a penknife every time, and I always informed the police (once was outside a police station lol). So since I expect to be questioned/held up, I try and be as helpful as possible. But yes, it would be most positive if every police officer knew every intricacy of every law. They're only human though. Technology could perhaps bridge that gap with AI. And the general public has, as you pointed out, an aversion to knives that they don't have for say, cars, which are many order of magnitude more dangerous and deadly than any folding knife. What did you study, and to what conclusion did it make you come to, to be so cautious? If I may ask?
@mrdejavuking7395 "and that's that." No it isn't. The police are not judge and jury and never have been. And there is also a Desk sergeant before judge and jury. That is why we have such things as wrongful and unlawful arrest, for which compensation is paid. Your hysteria does little for the discussion.
I don't know how myself and fellow boy scouts survived in the 50's. We all carried long bladed sheath knives, and were actively encouraged to do so. No one got stabbed, not even threatened and we all reached adult hood. We were never asked to prove a good reason for having them. Does this mean that modern youngsters are stupid, or does it mean that the gov' likes to have full control over everyone.
It's curious how that works... that people who get properly trained in what a knife is for tend not to use them in an incorrect manner. It's almost like education is a good thing 🤔
@Homie I don't need to read up on it, I know the history well enough. And I know plenty of working class weans that never slashed a soul, despite having easy access to knives. Curiously, quite a lot of them had access to guns as well, and also never misused them either. It's the person that becomes the problem when they're ignorant. You don't solve that problem by allowing them to stay ignorant.
@Homie 'Middle Class', 🤣🤣🤣🤣. The council estate where I lived was about as rough as you can get, all coal miners and steel workers, but in the event of a fight, no one used a knife, just knuckles. Pull a knife and you were considered a coward, it was a rough place with bare knuckle fighting and other illegal activities, but a woman could walk through there at night and never be harassed.
Daniel, the Brooker vs Dpp case was to find if a butter knife fell into the meaning of section 139 Cja 1988. They took the earlier case of revocation ‘is a screwdriver a bladed article’ within the meaning of section 139 and cross compared it. Successive discussions declared that a screwdriver didn’t fall within the meaning of section 139 as this would put too many limitations on everyday items carried by various people. However they did find that a blunt un sharpened butter knife was indeed a bladed item, and I agree completely with everything that you’ve said so far - however my dilemma here is within section 139, it makes direct comment on two parts of the blade as an exemption for a pocket knife to be within the meaning of that exemption. That the ‘cutting edge’ of the ‘blade’ must not exceed 3 inches. So up to this point ive never seen this challenged, if it makes the assumption that there is a cutting edge as part of the blade then the anatomy of that blade is being constructed from that meaning. If it were to say the blade length must not exceed 3 inches, then I’d have no ambiguity.but it talks about the blade and its cutting edge, they are two separate items and I would suggest that from the meaning within section 139 that they must be construed that way.
Bravo sir 👏 A 3 Inch blade and an inch finger choil is perfectly acceptable as the definition of a finger choil is an area designed to hold a knife securely, ergo an extension of the handle.
So what part of the blade would you measure ? The length of the cutting edge will increase with the curvature of the blade. An example would be that a blade measured with a straight ruler from tip to the handle may be 7.5cm but the cutting edge would be 8.3cm depending on the width of the blade. The wider the blade then the longer the cutting edge.
I'm so glad that you posted this! I need a multi tool to go with my travelling art set for opening tubes and sharpening pencils (I prefer to knife sharpen) thank you for letting me know what would be safe and legal to carry.
Read the legislstion in the publicly accessable archive and you will see the real law says something vastly different to what this guys google search told him.. acts are worded very specifically and meticulously for a reason as im sure you can imagine, and what this guy says, and what the actual law says, are wildly different.
Thanks BBB, as a knife collector I had always wondered about this specific issue. The only one I carry on my person is attached to my key chain; it is the Swiss Army Victorinox Mini Champ knife, as it has multiple useful tools, weighs a miniscule 40 grams and the longest blade is only 1⅝ inches.
Before my accident, I studied under many Senseis. And each of them would say, much, the same; Inanimate objects don't kill people, psychopaths with inanimate objects do. - Alá John Wick with a pencil.
Chimpanzes can make pointy sticks, as can prisoners in total lockdown. You cannot legislate away such a simple creation. Treating the causes of people turning to violence is a more effective strategy.
@@Naptosis but the point is, and always should be (IMHO), while you can’t prevent 100% of psychopaths or otherwise so inclined persons, you reduce the occurrence by reducing the likelihood, the severity is always the same (unless you change the ability of a knife to cause injury). The risk is a product of the Severity, the likelihood (or occurrence) and the controls you use. Given the severity is usually unchanging, the only way to reduce the risk is to work on the other two...the easiest is the controls in use. Shame that our cousins across the pond seem to prioritise a ‘right’ over the ‘risk’ (I know I am mixing points) - the problem there is the ambiguity on a 27 word statement, yet quite happily ignoring the first four words of said statement. Hence no need to explain why Joe doesn’t need to show why he might need a weapon capable of killing hundreds of people in less than a minute!?😳
For everyone wanting a legal knife that is small and very useful, I recommend the Nitecore Titanium Keychain Knife ntk05. It is something as unique as a folding razor blade, with a handle made out of titanium, with changeable razor blades. It is a slip joint, so it has no lock, but it has very strong detents. It is super light and small, yet, you can easily cut cardboard with it.
The uk. Only place where you could get arrested for carrying a butter knife or a potato peeler. I wonder what was going through the minds of those on the parlimentary committee when they drafted this law? Probably "can't let the peasants have weapons, they might damage each other and the lord might have a spot of bother getting them to harvest the potatoes. Homoerotic wresling and boxing only!" The judge did create great mischief. Incedently I live in a high knife crime area, I don't think the plastic gangster kids who do most of the stabbing think about what the law is but some suburban busybody in a safe area will try to "confiscate" their neighbour kids camping and fishing knife citing this ass of a law.
Most schoolboys back in the early 50s had a pen knife in their pocket, along with their marbles and ciggy cards. They were readily available in most newsagents and tobacconists, usually with one or two blades of not more than perhaps 2.5 inches (63mm).....How times change.
as a kendoka amongst other things i have an immediate respect for you,also i subbed on the lockdown when i found you,thank you for your brave legal stance ,ki ken tai,bless my friend!
I forgot about a swiss army knife on a return flight between Glasgow and London. It was in my rucksack (i use it for work) and forgot to remove it before heading to the airport. No issues on the way down to London, but I was stopped at the security gate in Gatwick. The blade was less than 3 inches, but i couldn't bring it on the flight and so had to abandon the knife at the airport. Understandable of course, and Im glad that was the only outcome. I thought for a minute I was in real legal trouble for a genuine mistake. The security guard was so understanding and very professional (felt the need to say this as there always seems to be people complaining about airport security)
I carried my Leatherman with the driver attachments for years before I reaslised the locking blades made it illegal, now I just carry my Victorinox. Such a pain as having decent pliers was so useful. Often wonder if it would be possible to challenge the law about safety locks on blades.
This helps clear up my own concerns. I would like to carry my Victorinox, like folk with their mobile, but I have to remain conscious about if it's ok to do so, depending where I am going or the activities I am using it for. Moreoften than not it stays in the house. Often I think about things like car accidents, rescue and first aid where a blade and it's supplementary parts would be vital in everyday scenarios. They can save lives as much, if not moreso, than take. The original intention is to use as a tool and for crafting. I know you're not here to debate whether the law is right or wrong, or as a judge put it, open to "mischief".
I have a Victorinox S.A.K. that I have in a belt pouch and yes like so many others it's used daily, in my home or out and about. I'm nearly 70 years old and have carried a knife of some description since my dad said it was O.K. when I was about 10 years old. Until recently I have carried a couple of scalpel blades in the coin section of my wallet, I removed them after watching BBB videos and realised that they were classed as a bladed item, that could have had me in trouble with our boys and girls in blue. I carried them because they have multiple uses including the removal of splinters, I handle a lot of wood. My preference would be to have a lock knife as an EDC but thanks to our severe knife laws, I can't legally do so outside of my own property. I can't even legally carry a small lock knife that was my late father-in-law's, the blade of which, is one and nine tenths an inch or forty-six mm, as far as my rheumy old eyes can make out. I personally think that our knife laws are ludicrous. Those of us who are decent people don't cut, stab or threaten people with our folding pocket knives. We also do not carry machetes, kitchen knives, screwdrivers or other implements for nefarious reasons but we are penalised for those who do.
Another informative video for which I am thankful. Interesting to hear about the Brooker/ DPP case law of which I was unaware. Does case law mean that a precedent has been set for further prosecutions on any given subject? And if so how are members of the public supposed to understand whether or not they are breaking the law? The governments own website states that the exception applies to pocket knives that ‘have a cutting edge no longer than 3 inches’ but Brooker/ DPP suggests that’s not the case. An explanation of how case law works in the wider judicial system would be appreciated as it seems to me it’s at best unfair to expect the public to adhere to laws of which they are unaware. Thanks.
One point: I have a Marling pocket knife. The Marling was/is a knife often used by sailors. They usually have a 3inch non-locking lambs-foot blade (a blade with no point) on one side and a locking Marlin spike on the other side - the spike is for undoing stubborn knots. Would that be seen as a lock knife?
Wow that is very useful to know, I had previously researched the law and was under the impression it was the sharp edge which had to be under three inches. I'm glad for that clarification. It does actually make sense because you could really take the piss with a 10-in knife with just the last three inches sharp.
While agreeing with you that it is useful to be apprised of case law, this is an absurdity, and will lead to b@st@rd coppers arresting decent members of the public while all the scum will carry what they want.
Cannot remember if I asked this before BUT what about a stanley knife blade in a plastic holder that is one of those plastic blade 'holders' that is slid out to remove a blade BUT does not lock in the holder when in the open position and also has a plastic blade cover to help stop accidental damage to a hand when using?
A few years back i had a couple of well used ones (the cheapo disposable ones) in my hobby bag (im a nerd, a few knives, some glue a few dice). On this fatefull day i was in a rush to be at an important appointment. I grabbed my bag, threw my camera in and shot off. TO COURT. Nothing heinous, just a nice family thing (adoption hearing). Just didn't think about the knives. The metal detector and security where puzzled. LOL. My genuine bafflement and embarassment apparently went a long way. Court thing ended, knives returned. What caused much more concern was the camera. We (the family) had checked and told "of course you can take some photos of the happy event". On the day "Of course YOU CANT take photos, and we will hold onto your camera just be sure". Got it all back after though. TLDR: DONT TAKE KNIVES AND CAMERAS INTO COURT. lol.
@@jamesmaybrick2001 You must have been mortified! I hope it didn't shake you up too much, how did you recover for your event? Can you be a bit clearer about the 'being able to take photos' bit for the duller of us? Please. I feel your pain, I went to very, very, very, white country of Finland, looking like Osama Bin Laden in a camo hoodie, wearing crocs, I had two Swiss Army Knives in my carry-on. I was wearing steel toe boots, and was really, unusually inquisitive about their security; because I used to be an x-ray tech, and it's an intense enough job, purely due to the responsibility you can only do it for around 20 minutes, before you have to take a break. I see all that looking back looks sus' AF. But I was just so excited to *fly*, I wasn't thinking. And worse is that I spent 45 minutes looking for those stupid knives to make sure they *weren't* in the bag (at 4am), and I failed at that. 😅 Anyway long story, short, they put you in like, a big cereal box, and irradiate your balls/ovaries nowadays. So that was my welcome to the 21st century. 😶
We don’t have a knife problem. We have a culture problem. I’ve carried a knife in my back pocket for 48 years (ever since my Grandad bought me one when I was 6). Everyone should always carry a knife at all times. It’s an essential tool that most people will use almost every day. A knife can save your life.
Same here carried a knife since being in the scouts back in the 70's, now carry a 3'' non locking Spiderco for packaging, work etc, As you say having a knife to cut through a seat belt can save a life, & in all those years, not once have I used it in self-defence.. But I could have....but chose not to, upbringing? conscience? actually both. Today if you haven't at least scarred another person you aye in the gang bruv..
@@sticksnstonespatriot1728its horseshit. Statistically more people die "mysteriously" in police custody than all knife and gun deaths COMBINED, EVERY YEAR.. its just the police trying to take what very few rights we still have using far less of a threat than they themselves pose the public as an excuse..
I have carried a UK legal pocket knife most of my life. At one time that included in my rotation a spyderco UKPK in my rotation. However I noticed at times people would be worried by the "Tactical" appearance of the knife. So to take into effect others feelings on the matter i changed my carry options to a mix of Swiss Army knives and sheepsfoot/warnclife blades. These tend to cause far less issues with non pocket knife people as they do not seem as threatening. As I am of the oppinion we are responsible for our tools and thus we should make them as acceptable to others as possible.
This law is a complete pain. On a farm you'd carry a penknife with a locking blade as a matter of course, because it's useful and safer. It's easy to forget to check your pockets when you go elsewhere. A law written for the cities by those that live there.
@@julianshepherd2038 If those who have seized power disallowing the people they rule over to be armed, or even carry certain tools or other possesions/items, under threat of violence (which includes using such tools themselves), is _not_ oppression then I don't know what is.
@@julianshepherd2038 can you explain why we had no gun laws and guns everywhere and less gun crime and no mass shootings .my grandparents in the uk used to carry revolvers and automatic pistols while travelling, that was really really normal they were middle class business people .I have Edwardian adverts for revolvers for cyclists
My husband had a tiny Swiss army style knife, about 2 cms long. He bought it while working in Seoul twenty-five years ago. He usually kept it in a suitcase while travelling. It had a tiny pair of scissors and a nail file in. When we were in our hotel in San Francisco I needed the scissors and he put it in his back pack. At San Francisco airport it was taken from him, the security man deeming it too dangerous. We miss it.
I live in Ireland and I'm a combat trained archer. Until 5 years ago, I used to attend officially arranged private competitions for archers, as in, a club I had friends in who would invite me down for a weekend competition. I paid my membership to cover membership etc. These competitions were arranged in public "treed" arreas with the County Council of the area we were competing in. They would close a large section of the treed area we were competing in. Our arrows can only be made in batches of 24 at a hefty price. None of use wanted to lose our arrows in the bush. I had a deep sea divers knive to cut my way through the bush to retrieve my arrow. I had my knive in its' scabbard, then wrapped in paper, then wrapped in tin foil, then wrapped in more paper then cellotaped to within an inch of its live. The arrows were kept in my bow case which was locked and the key kept attached to the strap of my bra. A deep sea divers knive is not legal to carry around, hence the way I had it wrapped. Made it obvious should I be spot checked, that it was not readily available for illegal use!
I have to tell you, I struggled when I saw 'treed' .. I just couldn't make sense of it!! It took me quite a few moments before It suddenly made sense... Ha ha maybe it's because I don't think I've ever seen it written down.. I'm sure I've said it plenty of times. It just made no sense for a moment. I wonder if I'm the only one...? Anyhow, I wanted to say, I wouldn't like to explain to a copper a combat knife, even if it was done up like a pass the parcel. I'd leave it at home. I love archery and wish I'd taken it up. I think its a wonderful thing to do. I hope you are still at it.. You said until 5 years ago?
Hadn't heard of combat archery, well not as a sporting discipline! I'll have to look it up. Are there limits on how many arrows you can own, over there? No restrictions in the UK, but shafts are commonly sold in dozens
As a fellow archer, I can confirm that you can legally carry your sheath knife in a public place when travelling to/from archery practice. My club (and a cooperative local police force) spent a lot of time and legal expenses investigating this. However, it really is ironic that you can carry the most dangerous killing weapon of medieval times - the English Longbow - without anyone challenging you.
@@rickbear7249 That's true. We can carry our archery bows and arrows in public to and from archery practice and events. I've shot from the English Longbow a few times, I love plinking with the English Longbow. I have a multi-purpose pocket knife complete with fork, spoon, scissors and selection of knives for when the group has lunch. I tend to lock that up.
I live in my self built camper van when I work and I have a 10" kitchen knife to cook with my camper has a full kitchen pots sink etc. I assume this is a good reason? Without a good knife I couldn't cook!
I carry a nice chunky, long wallet chain. Great for preventing pick pocketing, so a legal functional tool, if you will, but it is good for if say, someone does decide to pull a knife or other behaviour that is a threat to life.
I find a medium swizz army knife handy though I know there is a potential issue legally over the cockscrew function. The smaller knife I think is more useful than the larger
What is the legal issue with the corkscrew? I have carried a basic swiss army knife for decades and it has saved many an office party where nobody remembered to bring a dedicated corkscrew.
@@colemannee9898 I believe as it is a pointed article. To be honest I think as long as you are calm and not waving it about most sensible police will just ignore it.
This country is doomed, I recently bought a blister pack of 4 lighters from a cheap £1 store. The young lad serving me stumbled and mumbled something about having to wait for someone else, I could see he was under confident, but asked him to clarify what he said. His reply astounded me, he said because he was 16 he couldn't legally sell me the lighters and someone older had to serve me! This country is phucked.
Yup. I was amazed 3 or 4 years ago when I was queuing at a till and the cashier told a teenage girl that she had to be 16 to buy a box of matches. I'm retired, but from the age of about 10 I was considered responsible enough to go into another room , lay and light a coal fire, including holding yesterdays newspaper across thew fireplace to get it to draw. I mean - if we don't allow youngsters to have responsibilities, how can they learn to be responsible?
I was in a Tesco Express recently, and it was all kicking off in front of me. Apparently Tesco will not sell a can off non alcohilc Red Bull (250ml can, 80 mg of caffeine) to anyone under 25. But they will sell you a cappuccino (362ml) containing 325mg caffeine from the Costa coffee machine. I understand company policies, but this is just a farce
I have a similar (cheap) knife like the spiderco, however instead of the hole in the blade it has a threaded screw to aid opening (its actually now a silver rivet as the screw fell out). I assume this is illegal although I'mpretty sure I bought it in the UK. Also a technical question although no doubt common sense would prevail if ever it went to court, if the first 3 inches of a handle, behind the hinge of a knife were streamlined (ie flat and narrow to continue penetration beyong the blade), would that in theory be legal? ..I might add I have no designs in mind but I was curious. 🙂 Keep up the excellent work!
How long before a lazy judge decides that the whole exemption should be junked? The act does not require‘immediately’ folding. Nor does it use this definition of blade length. The act was carefully drawn and doesn’t need uninformed judges to add words that aren’t there in the act. A lock on a folding pocketknife is a safety feature not a threat to law and order. Our legislature decreed that me may carry a knife with a 3” cutting edge, it’s not for a judge to add restrictions not in the act, but to see that the act is enforced… as passed in to law!
I had a client who was convicted for possession. He had a folding knife that he used camping and fishing three weeks prior to his arrest. He had forgotten that it was in a pocket that wasn't used every day, it was a gloves pocket. The type that are in the middle of the chest next to the main zip and protected by a zip. He told me that he had checked the outside four and inside two but forgotten about the pocket and that the knife was in the pocket. He was attacked and the police arrived, they searched the assailant and him. He was arrested for possession and found guilty in crown court, he hadn't used the knife as he had not realised it was there.
The Spiderco in your example is a very interesting knife. The part of the hinged steel bit, immediately behind the sharpened edge, is where you place your index finger when holding the knife. So, is this blade or handle?
It's probably good practice to look at the length as how much would go into a target. The blade, sharp part or not, would continue on into a target if you were to stab it, however, the handle wouldn't.
It is technically known as a "ricasso", but the advice offered here (and elsewhere) is that for legal purposes you should look at the measurement from the tip of the blade to the handle,because that is what case law has established.
It should be made very clear that the good reason part doesn't apply to folding pocket knives as described, however police can often be power mad and still ask for a reason. Regardless of all of this, even though you don't legally need a reason to carry a folding pocket knife, if your reason for carrying it is a harmful reason, even self defence, it makes it a weapon and is illegal.
Perfectly reasonable, it's not just the police's job to arrest people breaking the law its also to be a deterrent to people breaking it in the first place. If you are seen with a legal knife and someone reports it is perfectly reasonable for the police to stop and even search you on reasonable suspicion grounds that it may be an illegal knife or you are carrying with an illegal intent
@@simonh6371 Having a (legal) knife out in many circumstances could be seen as suspicious unless you are raising a tin of beans in preparation to throw it is not. If you were peeling an apple with a knife (any knife) outside a school and someone reported this to the police it would be reasonable for the police to stop you. That doesn't mean you have broken the law but that is not required for the police to investigate. It's why you shouldn't carry (legal) knives without a good reason even if you don't need one. Not everything in life is about legal and illegal
@@jons9721 True. That's why I am careful not to be seen using a knife in front of people. In fact in the last years I don't think I've ever had to use it away from a workplace or home. On days off work I mostly carry a Swiss Army Knife, and mostly use the small one inch blade on it anyway. But I will never stop carrying a knife. Men have been carrying knives in some shape or form, sharpened flints before the Bronze and Iron Ages, for ever and the ability to use tools and make fire is what separates us from other mammals. Also I generally carry a first aid kit. Scissors (which are on my SAKs) are very useful in First Aid and I had to use them last week.
At the beginning you mention pocket knives as 'tools' then a little later you use your own knife as an example and say "it is immediately foldable at all times without any kind of mechanism". Most pocket knives that are 'tools' use a locking mechanism to keep them open for safety purposes (i.e. so they don't close on your fingers when you're using them). I personally have a Leatherman multi-tool which has a knife blade as one of the tools. I just measured the full length of the blade and it comes in at 2 15/16" (almost as if they are aware of the 3" ruling) yet, although the blade can be opened freely, there is a locking bar that must be depressed to close it. So am I correct in assuming, from what you say here, that because of that safety feature the multitool doesn't meet the requirements to be legally carried around?
Very useful BUT is the blade measured in a straight line from tip to handle, or is the curvature of the blade (and hence the resulting increase in length) taken into account?
Hello Triple B. Now I have a question regarding ‘A good reason’ … Now I have a severely damaged right wrist that has had 9 bone crunching operations on it to date, the last being last October where I had a full wrist replacement and a Ulnar head/DRUJ replacement done during the same operation. The initial injury happened back in 1985 and wasn’t seen to (For reasons I won’t go into here) … Anyway the surgeries have left me with severely reduced motor functions in my fingers and hand .. I can grip things like say a can of drink but I find it extremely difficult and painful to open a bag of crisps, a boxed sandwich and so on due to simply not being able to grip small edges with my fingers to open them, I even use a ‘Man Bag’ as I find it extremely difficult and painful to get into pockets in a pair of good fitting jeans for example. Now I have carried a very cheap folding knife for a while, buried in my man bag, not in the attempt to hide it but so that it’s not quickly accessible… I come across across little tasks all the time whilst out and about where it helps me. I have tons of medical evidence, x-ray pictures, physiotherapist reports and so on to back up what I’m saying … Would you consider this a valid reason?? Now going on from there I actually bought myself a folding scalpel as the cheap one couldn’t keep an edge, therefore I had to put more pressure on the knife to use it which caused me discomfort but going by your description I conclude that it has a lock on it (Sort of lock you’d find on a spring assisted knife for example, which are now illegal to carry so I believe even if they are 3” or smaller, is that correct??) .. It also has a little thumb notch on the blade mount that makes it very easy for me to open with my left hand .. To close it I simply release it with my left hand and close it … The blades are around 2” long at the absolute most … Given what I have said above could I use this?? I haven’t took it with me as of yet so don’t worry. I remember ‘Lock Knives’ and they seem totally different to the mechanism of this scalpel … Anyway I’d be interested to hear your views.
This video, as well as most videos dealing with UK knife law, leaves me more confused than enlightened. Do you have to have an immediate need for a knife (e.g. fishing, work) for your reason to be "good"? What about "just in case"? That's why most people carry a Swiss Army knife, for general utility. Need to open a package? Slice some fruit? Open a bottle of wine? Tighten a screw? Remove a splinter? Lance a blister? I carry a Swiss Army Knife at all times for these reasons, but I may not be able to articulate them in advance. Does that mean that SAKs are effectively prohibited in most cases by UK law? What about a multi-bladed knife? Suppose I need a regular blade but not a reamer. Or a screwdriver but not a can opener. Do I have to have a "good reason" for every tool in my SAK? Personally, I think everyone should carry a utility-oriented pocket knife at all times. Society would be a lot safer. Long story, but I once rescued someone from the path of an oncoming train with a SAK. The platform was full of onlookers but I was the only one able to take action because I had a knife. I think some people prefer the public to be helpless in order maintain the illusion that the state is always there to help. They're not.
How legal is a Leatherman Supertool? Is this classed as a pocket knife or a multi purpose tool? It has pliers, wire cutter, flat blade screwdriver, Philips screwdriver, can opener and two blades one serrated one plane. Both blades are a fraction over 3 inches and lock into the open position, so as the blades lock open are they legal.
Whenever I'm riding one of my classic motorcycles, I have a multi-tool in my pocket which incorporates a folding knife blade. It would be no use at all as a weapon, because it folds so easily that I would be more likely to cut my own fingers off if I tried to stab someone with it (but I could give them a nasty pinch with the pliers).
So If you had a legal sized folding pocket knife for work duties HOWEVER the knife would lock into place once folded out and the reason for one that locks (one that will Not close unless you have to press something to allow ot to close) is so that when you're using it for a work purpose the knife cannot fold and catch your hands/fingers thus conforming to the Health and Safety at work act?
I'm subscribed, so there all you freeloaders! I've been carrying a sharp knife over three inches long with me for years and I hardly realised I had any issue with it! And I don't think I do.. My Leatherman in my toolkit. Edit: Seriously, I love my Leatherman, (Standard version) it's the most useful non standard tool I have and its a joy to use. Beautifully engineered.
Your Leatherman almost certainly has a locking blade and could land you in jail. I own a Surge, a Wave and a Skeletool. All illegal to carry in the UK/
so what your saying is only criminals are allowed to carry machetes around and law abiding citizen must hand over their property if the said criminal demands them
I have a Lansky World Legal, which is legally a folding pocket knife as described in the video, but the backspring is both very strong and has a half-stop and is very unlikely to fold on your fingers unless you were doing something stupid with it. The Lansky Madrock is a variation of the world legal and also the Boker Worldwide. Just some good knives if you want one you can carry with you at all times.
Locking blades have only been around since the late 60s. Before then every man carried a non locking penknife and used them every day. But almost all of them had all their fingers.
what about something like a svord peasant mini? they are advertised as uk legal but the actual overall length of the blade is around 5 inches. 2 inches of that is just part of the tang that folds into the handle, the actual "blade" bit is under 3 inches
I think the leather man bond is a good reason knife. As it is non locking however when open and closed up it isn't immediately fully foldable. Please see this as this is a very grey area
Also what about a retractable disposable utility knife, although the part that is sharp is quite small, if you measure the entire length of the blade, even though there are grooves where you can break off the end , will some times exceed 5” in length.
Your video was on the main page of google. Congratulations… I everyday carry a SIG P365 9mm & an Ontario Rat_1. What is you favorite pocket knife that can beat the rat_1???? Thank you for your comment & channel.
For all my youth, most "penknives", whatever the length of the blade, did not have blade locks. The exceptions were knives from Spain and French Opinels. When knives with locks became more widely available in the UK, it was a good thing for those of us who used them in our industries and occupations. Then, of course, the politicians and the duffers in wigs got together and banned them. This country is mad-keen on banning things, from knives to heating appliances; from meat to motor cars. It's Dystopia, not Utopia.
But they aren't banned. I use lock knives with larger blades every day at work. We can buy them, we can own them and we can use them. I just can't walk around with a fixed blade or locking blade or folding blade over 3 inches unless I have a reason to be carrying it. Just like I can own a shotgun, and transport it from my property to an area where I can shoot, but I can't sit with it on my lap in the city centre and drop a cartridge in the spout.
@@eberp9270 Quite so, but I was thinking more of the small pocket knives (aka "penknives") with locking blades that I would normally carry all the time, in place of a non-locking knife. I have, for example, a miniature locking knife that is smaller than the legal folding penknife that I carry (on the old principle that anyone should carry a bob, a penknife and a piece of string), yet I would be in trouble with that, and quite possibly anywhere. I have in the past carried a knife to and from my workplace (a seagoing fishing vessel), but it was never quite clear whether I was OK with it on me when I was going to work or returning home. I also see your point about shotguns. From my past shooting days of many years ago, I recall that I could carry one anywhere public with good reason, provided it was secured in some form of gun case. I would hesitate to carry anything like that today, with the police being what they now are.
Thanks for the clarification. Is there any case law on the locking mechanism? I note you said easily closed at any time, and I know you would have chosen those words carefully. I ask because I know how dangerous a blade is , in or out, if unlocked. All my folding pocket knives are locked when open but are easily closed by releasing the lock. Also, advise would be appreciated on larger non folding knives that I use for camping and other out door activities.
I find knives without a lock pretty safe to use. They are called slip-joint knives. If you use your knife for opening packages, and other lighter cutting tasks, you should have no problem using a slip joint. Modern slip joints also have several detents to make them less loose. That means there is your typical detent when the knife is closed keeping it in that position, a detent in the middle when opening the knife, and a detent when the knife is open and ready to be used.
BBB didn’t choose the words. It’s written in law that the knife must be able to be readily folded at all times without having to use a button, switch or release any mechanism to do so. I too was around when the U.K. Design Team were pinging ideas back and forth with Spydercos CEO Sal Glesser for the UKPK, (United Kingdom Pen Knife). The blade is a fraction under 3”, designed in such a way that the forefinger fits into the choil to prevent closing on the hand, and given very nice edge geometry to make it versatile. A strong backspring was designed to provide more security against closing. To this day, the UKPK and smaller Urban remain good pocket pals of mine, used on a daily basis for anything from opening a box to pointing a stick into a toothpick.
@@Naptosis Unfortunately Martyn gradually withdrew and then deserted it. Also a lot of the threads were ruined by Photobucket suddenly holding everyone to ransom by blocking content, rendering many of the tutorials worthless. A few of us are still about on Bushcraft U.K. and other forums. Is there private message function on here?
Could you take a look at a svord peasent mini knife and give me thoughts on whether that counts as legal or not. The extended tang is clamped over and held by the hand preventing the knife from closing, however the knife without a hand is readily closeable at any given time and is only held in place by friction. Also although the tang is extended, it can't really be used as a flipper in my opinion, but does having an extended tang still count as assisted opening?
From what I've seen about the Svord Peasant, the regular peasant is slightly over the legal length, but the Peasant Mini isn't. Also the friction folding part doesn't count towards the overall length, just from the tip of the blade to the beginning of the handle. Also, the extended tang doesn't count as assisted opening as it uses only your hand to open as opposed to an assisted opener which would use a spring.
@@rebelyelleasyrider sorry yes I meant the svord peasant mini knife. Quite right the regular svord knife doesn't have a legal blade length for the UK See this is what made me think because by that logic, any knife with a small tang for flipping the knife open, and nothing else such as the civivi foldis should technically be legal seeing as they don't have spring assisted opening and rely solely on the momentum of the hand. And yet in a previous video, it was mentioned that the civivi foldis was on the edge of the legal limit, because it was a flipper. What separates the svord peasent mini knife with it's much larger tang from the foldis with it's much smaller tang in terms of legality when they both work exactly the same? [Edit] sorry that was really rambly
@@themightychippy3756 I don't get the flipper rule myself either, considering Higonokami knives can be uk legal and have a much smaller and more flippable tab
During the working week, I have a multi tool with a locking blade on my belt. I do home delivery of furniture and have to unpack and assemble in the customers home. I went with the locking blade because its safer for use in this application. As its a work tool, would I still fall fowl of the law?
@@Steves_fish If you fall foul of the law you could end up doing bird? A lot of people here seem to chicken out of carrying street legal knives and duck the real issue. But I accept we can't have everyone swanning about with illegal knives.
As long as you're only carrying it on your way to work, during work and back from work. That is classed as a good reason. Carrying it out of work hours would not be a good reason.
The video is wrong. Brooker v DPP failed because section 139(2) of the Criminal Justice Act 1988 makes it an offence to have a bladed article in a public place. Brooker had a butter knife, which very clearly has a blade. Brooker v DPP just established that a knife does not need to be sharp to qualify as an article with a blade. The length of a folding pocketknife is defined in statute law, i.e. section 139(3). In this section it is the length of the cutting edge which is important. You cannot use Brooker v DPP to say that the plain English definition of section 139(3) no longer applies. A folding pocketknife meets the exemption of section 139(2) if length of its cutting edge does not exceed 3 inches.
Just asking if the item with out handle is a blade so dose the blade go past the pivot point into the handle? ( is the blade the hole metal part ) Or is it from the end of the handle?
I got knicked for carring a multitool, because the blade locked 2.5 inches like long. Thing is what really is the difference between a blade that locks and one doesn't. Both in the wrong hands will do the same damage.
I have the spyderco UK penknife. Fantastically designed for the UK market but the steel and bevel REALLY let it down it's almost impossible to get it properly sharp and it comes pretty much blunt.
@@phil251170 I have a spyderco sharpmaker and a leather strop glued to a piece of wood that I use for polishing knives with chisel polishing compound. All my other knives are like razors. The sypderco ukpn has awful steel and a terrible factory edge.
I’ve always carried a Swiss army in my car and on my motorcycle when I’m travelling. I never carry it in my pocket in public tho. Not sure what the police would do if I was stopped and searched! If its in my car is it still classed as carrying a knife? Until that happens I’ll continue to carry my Swiss Army Knife, as i often have to use it all but not very often I use the blade.
It says the blade may not exceed 3 inches, but it doesn't say anything about the haft, so theoretically you could keep the blade the same & make the haft really long, & carry a spear.
So let me get this CORRECT here, a Swiss Army Knife comes under the exemption. Also what if the "locking" mechanism was one that was a safety catch? Like one of my work knives (that knife complies with HSE)
Cutlery? I used to take my own to work on night shifts as the stuff in the kitchen at work was rubbish. I just checked and if I hold the knife like a dagger there's around 5.5" available to stick into someone, assuming I could even get the rounded blunt point through someone's clothing and skin.
Could you clarify that in this country you are still presumed innocent until proved guilty? If that is the case then surely it is not down to a person having a good reason to have a knife but for the law to prove otherwise ?
Innocent until proven guilty is a nice theory. The UK police presume everyone to be guilty until they can prove their innocence. That innocence need to be proven without hurting the ego of the cop.
That depends on the way the law is written. Merely possessing a proscribed weapon in public is an offence. If they prove “beyond reasonable doubt” you were carrying it then your’e guilty UNLESS you have a lawful reason to be doing so. Now the burden of proof has shifted. It’s no longer “beyond reasonable doubt” but you would need to show “on the balance of evidence” that you had a lawful cause to be in possession. Even if you are in legal possession of a blade, showing it as a threat immediately makes that possession illegal. Yes, knife crime is a problem, but at least we’re not stupid enough to believe that more knife carrying is the solution. A good guy with a knife is just one trigger event from becoming a bad guy with a knife.
So, if I walked into town and bought Fish & Chips and took them along to the park where I sat at a picnic table to eat them. I then pulled out a knife and fork from my cutlery drawer and set about my lunch. The knife is not folding and has a blade longer that 3". Would that be an offence? Also, you did not mention anything about the blade material. What if I took along a plastic knife and fork? That may be a silly question, but what if I took along one of my ceramic bladed knives?
I’m an ex PPL pilot and carried my Swiss Army knife on me for every flight, my reasoning was that I might need a blade to cut through the seatbelt or headset wires in the event of a crash. I also have a multi tool in my car that has a blade (under 3 inches and non locking), where do I stand legally in both of these instances?
Section 139 CJA 1988 permits the carrying of folding (non-locking) pocket knives with a blade below 3 inches, without valid reason. So both are ok to carry in public. Except for on school/college premises (see Section 139a CJA 1988).
I have certain disabilities that carrying a small blade alleviates- problems with restricted mobility in the right wrist, with accompanying loss of strength in that hand, plus avascular necrosis in the left shoulder accompanied by loss of muscle tissue on the same shoulder due to 2 debridement operations- it got really infected..... Carrying a sub 3 inch, non locking blade allows me to open cans of drink, packets of various foods, cut an apple when out and about- lots of little basic jobs. I'm pretty sure I'm OK as I keep within the exception, but what if I took a multitool- I have 3 and although the blades are small, they all lock. Which, I think makes them illegal to carry, even though they're safer to use. Anyone have any thoughts?
The locking knives would need a 'reasonable excuse' to carry legally. Like for your job. Would your disability count? Unfortunately the law is written purposefully vaguely.
So a law was made, I would imagine, following a degree of consultation with experts on knives. Then changed by a layman on the subject. So we now define a cutting edge in law to include an edge that cannot cut. I would love someone to address the elephant in the room. KITCHEN KNIVES.
There is no elephant here. You simply can't carry a kitchen knife in a public place without good reason. All those other knives that you're imagining, they are still legal to own (with a couple of exceptions). You just can't have them in your pocket in a public area unless there's a reason, such as you've just bought a set of kitchen knives from Asda and you're now taking them home.
Bored with this now. As I type I am looking at a pen ... Yes, that is ironic. Jason Bourne (in a movie) made good use of a 'Bic'. Are we not allowed to carry pens in public !?! Is The Law about Intent or potential ?
So I own a multi tool, and one of the tools is a 3” blade that can be opened by one hand a locks open. One is a 3” serrated blade that locks open, and one is a 3” saw blade, that locks open. It also has a file, pair of scissors, a screwdriver and a can opener. Is this legal ?
@@randomreviewz2628 Legal definition of a lock knife is “A locking blade is one that can be locked or refolded by pushing a button”. Mine has a liner lock and you just apply pressure to the side of the blade to unlock it, so no button.
I use a folding knife with a locking blade. Its the safer option. I prefer to not to cut my fingers when Im working with the knife. The UK legal knives are dangerous to the user. Im currently recovering from having a UK legal knife fold during use.
The law states that the 'cutting edge' of the blade must not be more than 3 inches. It needs to make it more clearer because you could have a non locking folding knife where the blade could be 5 inches long but the cutting edge could be only 3 inches long. I will try to explain by referring to the one you have. The thick metal bit where the blade starts from is not counted as the cutting edge. On your knife it looks about one third of an inch. What if that happened to be 2 inches long then your knife would technically have a 5 inch blade but still be legal because the cutting edge is 3 inches or less
I carry a small folding knife when shopping. I do this so I can remove and discard the packaging in the shop and hand it to them for recycling. Without a knife this is almost impossible. I shop on foot and the less to carry the better. But of course I forgot and got caught in the metal detectors at the County Court, I was bringing an eviction case so this was rather embarrassing. As you say, even genuine forgetfulness is not a defence but common sense prevailed and I was able to leave the knife with an official. Lesson learned.
@Homie Actually there was an incident several years ago in which a senior semi retired army officer was pulled by the Met while on his way to the airport to take up a posting as a military attache. Pillar of the establishment, in other words. His hand luggage set off a metal detector, they found such a kit and the view was taken that the 1 1/4" paper knife contained within it amounted to a fixed blade knife. He was ultimately obliged to accept a police caution.
I have an older Victorinox knife, had it for years and it has been very useful in my travels around the world. However, the blade is 3 1/4 inches and locks and so, under the ridiculous UK laws, is illegal. It is always in it's pouch, either in a backpack, light pack or camera bag so not on a belt or in my pocket, but nevertheless I am in no doubt that if stopped by the police and my bag searched they'd prosecute me simply for having it.... and that is where the "law" falls down in being seemingly blind to "intent". What about pointy sticks?
@@armchairgeneralissimo problem is a policeman could also be a tool. I've avoided carrying anything with a locking mechanism just in case. Not ideal but these are the times we are living in.
And as an added caveat, it is perfectly legal to own non UK legal pocket knife/knives, with locking handles, and blades longer than three inches. You just cannot take it out of your house for any reason. If you have one to open boxes from lets say Amazon, and it never leaves your property, that is perfectly fine. If you were a collector, and were to take several to a knife show in a case, you might just get away with having them outside of your home. But you would need to prove it.
Question, I have a filleting Knife in my sea fishing tackle box that I use for beach fishing , Can you confirm if this knife is illegal or not. it is in it's own sheath
Here's a question - I've got a SOG Paratool, it's not very good (poor quality and bad design) but has a non locking less than three inch blade. So complies with the law on pocket knives and I don't need a reason to carry it. I got it for exactly this purpose and I've used it a heck of a lot because I always have it with me. The problem is, if the knife was opened and then the rest of the tool closed down around it the knife is then blocked from closing. So it could be argued by an unreasonable person that it is then locked. Am I breaking the law? So many examples of how this law is complete nonsense - it's not effected knife crime at all because criminals still have access to proper knives, it's only honest law abiding people who have lost more freedom.
I carry a UK legal pocket knife and I use it pretty much everyday as the tool it is.
However, I will never take out with me if I'm off out for a drink or a night out. It's a sad state of affairs where we have to live in this world as a locking blade is safer for the operator
Same here. My reason for carrying one is to free animals tangled in nets etc which I've done a couple of times.
@@BigDuke6ixx I just find mine a really useful tool. It's a victorinox tinker small. Part of my every day carry
Thanks for this BBB. What about the long extending razor sharp knifes for cutting wallpaper etc. they have the segmented blade that you can break off when it blunts. Are they totally illegal on the street
@@Frogprince2 they really are a great tools
If I have a reason, I carry a Manix 2. If I don't, I carry a Victorinox Farmer.
@BlackBeltBarrister
Hi, I disagree.
Criminal Justice Act 1988, section 139
(3) This section applies to a folding pocketknife if the cutting edge of its blade exceeds 3 inches.
As you can see, it clearly says "cutting edge".
Companies such as Heinnie Haynes, import and sell knives in the UK based on this. That is, for example, not including the finger choil in the blade length.
BOOKER V DPP
to the best of my knowledge refers to a bladed article, that granted may not have been considered sharp, but the law doesn't say "sharp". It did however have a cutting edge, futhermore, it was in no way foldable, making the length of the cutting edge irrelevant.
An entirely different cattegory.
Please explain if you still think I'm missing something.
I've carried that Spyderco UK PK every day for 20 odd years. Many of us Brits worked with Spyderco to design that knife, so it was as safe as reasonably possible without a lock, and compliant with our legislation.
Still, however, there are bobbies that will try and confiscate it; though they are required to return it once they've confirmed with the station that it is, in fact, legal to carry without a 'reasonable' excuse.
@Mr DejavuKing @Mr DejavuKing Yes, it will be up to the officer, whether you have to wait to get it returned, after they've generally conferred with a colleague at the station.
Carrying penknives is legal, and has always been. I comply with, and respect the law, and the often thankless job police officers do. I have even been screened by British intelligence. I feel sorry for the MI5 officer who had to go through all the pictures of my cats and the back of my head.
Honestly I probably use the tweezers on my Swiss Army Knife more than the little folding penknife blade. But it's useful, and before I ever started, I checked with the legislation, and have kept up to date with it, as is my responsibility.
That's what this video is about!
@Mr DejavuKing @Mr DejavuKing I think you're right to be cautious, and it's completely understandable. But I've always stood out (I'm a weird colour) so I expect to be picked out and targeted. It doesn't bother me, and I volunteer the information say, about my folding knife to security and police officers.
I've also been attacked by criminals a fair few times for sticking out, twice were life or death situations, where I unfortunately had to become violent. I carried a penknife every time, and I always informed the police (once was outside a police station lol).
So since I expect to be questioned/held up, I try and be as helpful as possible.
But yes, it would be most positive if every police officer knew every intricacy of every law. They're only human though. Technology could perhaps bridge that gap with AI.
And the general public has, as you pointed out, an aversion to knives that they don't have for say, cars, which are many order of magnitude more dangerous and deadly than any folding knife.
What did you study, and to what conclusion did it make you come to, to be so cautious? If I may ask?
@mrdejavuking7395 "and that's that." No it isn't. The police are not judge and jury and never have been. And there is also a Desk sergeant before judge and jury. That is why we have such things as wrongful and unlawful arrest, for which compensation is paid. Your hysteria does little for the discussion.
I don't know how myself and fellow boy scouts survived in the 50's. We all carried long bladed sheath knives, and were actively encouraged to do so. No one got stabbed, not even threatened and we all reached adult hood. We were never asked to prove a good reason for having them. Does this mean that modern youngsters are stupid, or does it mean that the gov' likes to have full control over everyone.
It's curious how that works... that people who get properly trained in what a knife is for tend not to use them in an incorrect manner. It's almost like education is a good thing 🤔
@Homie I don't need to read up on it, I know the history well enough. And I know plenty of working class weans that never slashed a soul, despite having easy access to knives. Curiously, quite a lot of them had access to guns as well, and also never misused them either. It's the person that becomes the problem when they're ignorant. You don't solve that problem by allowing them to stay ignorant.
@Homie 'Middle Class', 🤣🤣🤣🤣. The council estate where I lived was about as rough as you can get, all coal miners and steel workers, but in the event of a fight, no one used a knife, just knuckles. Pull a knife and you were considered a coward, it was a rough place with bare knuckle fighting and other illegal activities, but a woman could walk through there at night and never be harassed.
Total control over you
People have less respect and tolerance for each other.
Daniel, the Brooker vs Dpp case was to find if a butter knife fell into the meaning of section 139 Cja 1988. They took the earlier case of revocation ‘is a screwdriver a bladed article’ within the meaning of section 139 and cross compared it. Successive discussions declared that a screwdriver didn’t fall within the meaning of section 139 as this would put too many limitations on everyday items carried by various people. However they did find that a blunt un sharpened butter knife was indeed a bladed item, and I agree completely with everything that you’ve said so far - however my dilemma here is within section 139, it makes direct comment on two parts of the blade as an exemption for a pocket knife to be within the meaning of that exemption. That the ‘cutting edge’ of the ‘blade’ must not exceed 3 inches. So up to this point ive never seen this challenged, if it makes the assumption that there is a cutting edge as part of the blade then the anatomy of that blade is being constructed from that meaning. If it were to say the blade length must not exceed 3 inches, then I’d have no ambiguity.but it talks about the blade and its cutting edge, they are two separate items and I would suggest that from the meaning within section 139 that they must be construed that way.
Bravo sir 👏
A 3 Inch blade and an inch finger choil is perfectly acceptable as the definition of a finger choil is an area designed to hold a knife securely, ergo an extension of the handle.
So what part of the blade would you measure ? The length of the cutting edge will increase with the curvature of the blade. An example would be that a blade measured with a straight ruler from tip to the handle may be 7.5cm but the cutting edge would be 8.3cm depending on the width of the blade. The wider the blade then the longer the cutting edge.
I'm so glad that you posted this! I need a multi tool to go with my travelling art set for opening tubes and sharpening pencils (I prefer to knife sharpen) thank you for letting me know what would be safe and legal to carry.
You’re welcome ☺️
Read the legislstion in the publicly accessable archive and you will see the real law says something vastly different to what this guys google search told him.. acts are worded very specifically and meticulously for a reason as im sure you can imagine, and what this guy says, and what the actual law says, are wildly different.
@@MDM1992 Different in what way?
I've put away the knives, and I encourage you all to do the same. I just carry the sawn off shotgun these days.
😂😂😂
I carry chainsaw in my car has to lose the machete 😊
Knifes...what ! "It isnt West Side Story anymore"....I forget the comedian that said it recently 😂
@@mr.145 I have no idea...But I'll check it out! 😸
Standard edc bro, standard.
Thanks BBB, as a knife collector I had always wondered about this specific issue. The only one I carry on my person is attached to my key chain; it is the Swiss Army Victorinox Mini Champ knife, as it has multiple useful tools, weighs a miniscule 40 grams and the longest blade is only 1⅝ inches.
Bad people are going to get hold of any kind of knife irrespective of the law.
Sadly true
But making it harder is better. Compare with the “criminals will get hold of a firearm” attitude in the US.
Before my accident, I studied under many Senseis. And each of them would say, much, the same; Inanimate objects don't kill people, psychopaths with inanimate objects do. - Alá John Wick with a pencil.
Chimpanzes can make pointy sticks, as can prisoners in total lockdown. You cannot legislate away such a simple creation. Treating the causes of people turning to violence is a more effective strategy.
@@Naptosis but the point is, and always should be (IMHO), while you can’t prevent 100% of psychopaths or otherwise so inclined persons, you reduce the occurrence by reducing the likelihood, the severity is always the same (unless you change the ability of a knife to cause injury).
The risk is a product of the Severity, the likelihood (or occurrence) and the controls you use. Given the severity is usually unchanging, the only way to reduce the risk is to work on the other two...the easiest is the controls in use.
Shame that our cousins across the pond seem to prioritise a ‘right’ over the ‘risk’ (I know I am mixing points) - the problem there is the ambiguity on a 27 word statement, yet quite happily ignoring the first four words of said statement. Hence no need to explain why Joe doesn’t need to show why he might need a weapon capable of killing hundreds of people in less than a minute!?😳
For everyone wanting a legal knife that is small and very useful, I recommend the Nitecore Titanium Keychain Knife ntk05. It is something as unique as a folding razor blade, with a handle made out of titanium, with changeable razor blades. It is a slip joint, so it has no lock, but it has very strong detents. It is super light and small, yet, you can easily cut cardboard with it.
The uk. Only place where you could get arrested for carrying a butter knife or a potato peeler. I wonder what was going through the minds of those on the parlimentary committee when they drafted this law? Probably "can't let the peasants have weapons, they might damage each other and the lord might have a spot of bother getting them to harvest the potatoes. Homoerotic wresling and boxing only!" The judge did create great mischief. Incedently I live in a high knife crime area, I don't think the plastic gangster kids who do most of the stabbing think about what the law is but some suburban busybody in a safe area will try to "confiscate" their neighbour kids camping and fishing knife citing this ass of a law.
Most schoolboys back in the early 50s had a pen knife in their pocket, along with their marbles and ciggy cards. They were readily available in most newsagents and tobacconists, usually with one or two blades of not more than perhaps 2.5 inches (63mm).....How times change.
as a kendoka amongst other things i have an immediate respect for you,also i subbed on the lockdown when i found you,thank you for your brave legal stance ,ki ken tai,bless my friend!
The most used part of my Swiss Army knife was the corkscrew. Now-a-days with wine bottles rarely having corks my Swiss Army knife is used a lot less.
😸😸😸
screwtop wine bottles? UK has really hit rock bottom now..
@@simonleeofficial I think it may be a general thing around the world to use screw caps rather than corks. I know Australia changed many years ago.
@Simon Norris switzerland here.. normally stick to italian or swiss wine. I can guess its Australian stuff?
@@simonleeofficial Australians just neck the bottle against a rock, doesn't matter what stopper is in it...
I forgot about a swiss army knife on a return flight between Glasgow and London. It was in my rucksack (i use it for work) and forgot to remove it before heading to the airport. No issues on the way down to London, but I was stopped at the security gate in Gatwick. The blade was less than 3 inches, but i couldn't bring it on the flight and so had to abandon the knife at the airport. Understandable of course, and Im glad that was the only outcome. I thought for a minute I was in real legal trouble for a genuine mistake.
The security guard was so understanding and very professional (felt the need to say this as there always seems to be people complaining about airport security)
I carried my Leatherman with the driver attachments for years before I reaslised the locking blades made it illegal, now I just carry my Victorinox. Such a pain as having decent pliers was so useful. Often wonder if it would be possible to challenge the law about safety locks on blades.
This helps clear up my own concerns. I would like to carry my Victorinox, like folk with their mobile, but I have to remain conscious about if it's ok to do so, depending where I am going or the activities I am using it for. Moreoften than not it stays in the house. Often I think about things like car accidents, rescue and first aid where a blade and it's supplementary parts would be vital in everyday scenarios. They can save lives as much, if not moreso, than take. The original intention is to use as a tool and for crafting. I know you're not here to debate whether the law is right or wrong, or as a judge put it, open to "mischief".
I have a Victorinox S.A.K. that I have in a belt pouch and yes like so many others it's used daily, in my home or out and about. I'm nearly 70 years old and have carried a knife of some description since my dad said it was O.K. when I was about 10 years old. Until recently I have carried a couple of scalpel blades in the coin section of my wallet, I removed them after watching BBB videos and realised that they were classed as a bladed item, that could have had me in trouble with our boys and girls in blue. I carried them because they have multiple uses including the removal of splinters, I handle a lot of wood.
My preference would be to have a lock knife as an EDC but thanks to our severe knife laws, I can't legally do so outside of my own property. I can't even legally carry a small lock knife that was my late father-in-law's, the blade of which, is one and nine tenths an inch or forty-six mm, as far as my rheumy old eyes can make out.
I personally think that our knife laws are ludicrous. Those of us who are decent people don't cut, stab or threaten people with our folding pocket knives. We also do not carry machetes, kitchen knives, screwdrivers or other implements for nefarious reasons but we are penalised for those who do.
Another informative video for which I am thankful. Interesting to hear about the Brooker/ DPP case law of which I was unaware. Does case law mean that a precedent has been set for further prosecutions on any given subject? And if so how are members of the public supposed to understand whether or not they are breaking the law? The governments own website states that the exception applies to pocket knives that ‘have a cutting edge no longer than 3 inches’ but Brooker/ DPP suggests that’s not the case. An explanation of how case law works in the wider judicial system would be appreciated as it seems to me it’s at best unfair to expect the public to adhere to laws of which they are unaware. Thanks.
One point: I have a Marling pocket knife. The Marling was/is a knife often used by sailors. They usually have a 3inch non-locking lambs-foot blade (a blade with no point) on one side and a locking Marlin spike on the other side - the spike is for undoing stubborn knots. Would that be seen as a lock knife?
Wow that is very useful to know, I had previously researched the law and was under the impression it was the sharp edge which had to be under three inches. I'm glad for that clarification. It does actually make sense because you could really take the piss with a 10-in knife with just the last three inches sharp.
While agreeing with you that it is useful to be apprised of case law, this is an absurdity, and will lead to b@st@rd coppers arresting decent members of the public while all the scum will carry what they want.
Spyderco Byrd Tern. Excellent knife. My favourite.
Cannot remember if I asked this before BUT what about a stanley knife blade in a plastic holder that is one of those plastic blade 'holders' that is slid out to remove a blade BUT does not lock in the holder when in the open position and also has a plastic blade cover to help stop accidental damage to a hand when using?
That's fine to carry if you need to use it. You cannot carry it around without a reasonable use-case for it however.
A few years back i had a couple of well used ones (the cheapo disposable ones) in my hobby bag (im a nerd, a few knives, some glue a few dice). On this fatefull day i was in a rush to be at an important appointment. I grabbed my bag, threw my camera in and shot off. TO COURT. Nothing heinous, just a nice family thing (adoption hearing). Just didn't think about the knives. The metal detector and security where puzzled. LOL. My genuine bafflement and embarassment apparently went a long way. Court thing ended, knives returned. What caused much more concern was the camera. We (the family) had checked and told "of course you can take some photos of the happy event". On the day "Of course YOU CANT take photos, and we will hold onto your camera just be sure".
Got it all back after though.
TLDR:
DONT TAKE KNIVES AND CAMERAS INTO COURT. lol.
@@jamesmaybrick2001 You must have been mortified! I hope it didn't shake you up too much, how did you recover for your event?
Can you be a bit clearer about the 'being able to take photos' bit for the duller of us? Please.
I feel your pain, I went to very, very, very, white country of Finland, looking like Osama Bin Laden in a camo hoodie, wearing crocs, I had two Swiss Army Knives in my carry-on. I was wearing steel toe boots, and was really, unusually inquisitive about their security; because I used to be an x-ray tech, and it's an intense enough job, purely due to the responsibility you can only do it for around 20 minutes, before you have to take a break.
I see all that looking back looks sus' AF.
But I was just so excited to *fly*, I wasn't thinking. And worse is that I spent 45 minutes looking for those stupid knives to make sure they *weren't* in the bag (at 4am), and I failed at that. 😅
Anyway long story, short, they put you in like, a big cereal box, and irradiate your balls/ovaries nowadays. So that was my welcome to the 21st century. 😶
We don’t have a knife problem. We have a culture problem. I’ve carried a knife in my back pocket for 48 years (ever since my Grandad bought me one when I was 6).
Everyone should always carry a knife at all times. It’s an essential tool that most people will use almost every day. A knife can save your life.
And where's that cultural change come from, we might ask?
@@rickbear7249 Foreign influences? We were a Trust Society but we’ve invited in lots of people from Honour Societies.
Same here carried a knife since being in the scouts back in the 70's, now carry a 3'' non locking Spiderco for packaging, work etc,
As you say having a knife to cut through a seat belt can save a life, & in all those years, not once have I used it in self-defence..
But I could have....but chose not to, upbringing? conscience? actually both.
Today if you haven't at least scarred another person you aye in the gang bruv..
We have a violent "brotha" problem....not a gun, knife, stick or stone problem
@@sticksnstonespatriot1728its horseshit. Statistically more people die "mysteriously" in police custody than all knife and gun deaths COMBINED, EVERY YEAR.. its just the police trying to take what very few rights we still have using far less of a threat than they themselves pose the public as an excuse..
I have carried a UK legal pocket knife most of my life. At one time that included in my rotation a spyderco UKPK in my rotation. However I noticed at times people would be worried by the "Tactical" appearance of the knife. So to take into effect others feelings on the matter i changed my carry options to a mix of Swiss Army knives and sheepsfoot/warnclife blades. These tend to cause far less issues with non pocket knife people as they do not seem as threatening. As I am of the oppinion we are responsible for our tools and thus we should make them as acceptable to others as possible.
This law is a complete pain. On a farm you'd carry a penknife with a locking blade as a matter of course, because it's useful and safer. It's easy to forget to check your pockets when you go elsewhere. A law written for the cities by those that live there.
You're so oppressed.
@@julianshepherd2038 : This is what oppression looks like in the real world.
@@julianshepherd2038 you are a clown.
@@julianshepherd2038 If those who have seized power disallowing the people they rule over to be armed, or even carry certain tools or other possesions/items, under threat of violence (which includes using such tools themselves), is _not_ oppression then I don't know what is.
@@julianshepherd2038 can you explain why we had no gun laws and guns everywhere and less gun crime and no mass shootings .my grandparents in the uk used to carry revolvers and automatic pistols while travelling, that was really really normal they were middle class business people .I have Edwardian adverts for revolvers for cyclists
My husband had a tiny Swiss army style knife, about 2 cms long. He bought it while working in Seoul twenty-five years ago. He usually kept it in a suitcase while travelling. It had a tiny pair of scissors and a nail file in. When we were in our hotel in San Francisco I needed the scissors and he put it in his back pack. At San Francisco airport it was taken from him, the security man deeming it too dangerous. We miss it.
I live in Ireland and I'm a combat trained archer. Until 5 years ago, I used to attend officially arranged private competitions for archers, as in, a club I had friends in who would invite me down for a weekend competition. I paid my membership to cover membership etc. These competitions were arranged in public "treed" arreas with the County Council of the area we were competing in. They would close a large section of the treed area we were competing in. Our arrows can only be made in batches of 24 at a hefty price. None of use wanted to lose our arrows in the bush. I had a deep sea divers knive to cut my way through the bush to retrieve my arrow. I had my knive in its' scabbard, then wrapped in paper, then wrapped in tin foil, then wrapped in more paper then cellotaped to within an inch of its live. The arrows were kept in my bow case which was locked and the key kept attached to the strap of my bra. A deep sea divers knive is not legal to carry around, hence the way I had it wrapped. Made it obvious should I be spot checked, that it was not readily available for illegal use!
I have to tell you, I struggled when I saw 'treed' .. I just couldn't make sense of it!! It took me quite a few moments before It suddenly made sense... Ha ha maybe it's because I don't think I've ever seen it written down.. I'm sure I've said it plenty of times. It just made no sense for a moment. I wonder if I'm the only one...?
Anyhow, I wanted to say, I wouldn't like to explain to a copper a combat knife, even if it was done up like a pass the parcel. I'd leave it at home.
I love archery and wish I'd taken it up. I think its a wonderful thing to do. I hope you are still at it.. You said until 5 years ago?
Hadn't heard of combat archery, well not as a sporting discipline! I'll have to look it up.
Are there limits on how many arrows you can own, over there? No restrictions in the UK, but shafts are commonly sold in dozens
As a fellow archer, I can confirm that you can legally carry your sheath knife in a public place when travelling to/from archery practice. My club (and a cooperative local police force) spent a lot of time and legal expenses investigating this. However, it really is ironic that you can carry the most dangerous killing weapon of medieval times - the English Longbow - without anyone challenging you.
@@rickbear7249 That's true. We can carry our archery bows and arrows in public to and from archery practice and events. I've shot from the English Longbow a few times, I love plinking with the English Longbow. I have a multi-purpose pocket knife complete with fork, spoon, scissors and selection of knives for when the group has lunch. I tend to lock that up.
Thank you for linking to a legal one this time. The last one I saw, you had actually linked to a locking knife.
I live in my self built camper van when I work and I have a 10" kitchen knife to cook with my camper has a full kitchen pots sink etc. I assume this is a good reason? Without a good knife I couldn't cook!
I carry a nice chunky, long wallet chain. Great for preventing pick pocketing, so a legal functional tool, if you will, but it is good for if say, someone does decide to pull a knife or other behaviour that is a threat to life.
Could you do a break down for the legality of multi tools like a leather man please
With summer coming, should we all check our picnic baskets and cutlery. Or is the rest of the picnic in it's basket a reasonable excuse to use?
I find a medium swizz army knife handy though I know there is a potential issue legally over the cockscrew function. The smaller knife I think is more useful than the larger
What is the legal issue with the corkscrew? I have carried a basic swiss army knife for decades and it has saved many an office party where nobody remembered to bring a dedicated corkscrew.
@@colemannee9898 I believe as it is a pointed article.
To be honest I think as long as you are calm and not waving it about most sensible police will just ignore it.
This country is doomed, I recently bought a blister pack of 4 lighters from a cheap £1 store. The young lad serving me stumbled and mumbled something about having to wait for someone else, I could see he was under confident, but asked him to clarify what he said. His reply astounded me, he said because he was 16 he couldn't legally sell me the lighters and someone older had to serve me! This country is phucked.
The same rule applies if you are buying alcohol, if thee teller is under 18 they have to have and adult serve you.
Yup. I was amazed 3 or 4 years ago when I was queuing at a till and the cashier told a teenage girl that she had to be 16 to buy a box of matches. I'm retired, but from the age of about 10 I was considered responsible enough to go into another room , lay and light a coal fire, including holding yesterdays newspaper across thew fireplace to get it to draw. I mean - if we don't allow youngsters to have responsibilities, how can they learn to be responsible?
Not old enough to be trusted to sell a lighter but old enough to work as a slave
I was in a Tesco Express recently, and it was all kicking off in front of me. Apparently Tesco will not sell a can off non alcohilc Red Bull (250ml can, 80 mg of caffeine) to anyone under 25. But they will sell you a cappuccino (362ml) containing 325mg caffeine from the Costa coffee machine. I understand company policies, but this is just a farce
Nanny state. Doesn't matter if the law makes sense as long as freedoms are continuously eroded.
I have a similar (cheap) knife like the spiderco, however instead of the hole in the blade it has a threaded screw to aid opening (its actually now a silver rivet as the screw fell out). I assume this is illegal although I'mpretty sure I bought it in the UK.
Also a technical question although no doubt common sense would prevail if ever it went to court, if the first 3 inches of a handle, behind the hinge of a knife were streamlined (ie flat and narrow to continue penetration beyong the blade), would that in theory be legal? ..I might add I have no designs in mind but I was curious. 🙂
Keep up the excellent work!
How long before a lazy judge decides that the whole exemption should be junked? The act does not require‘immediately’ folding. Nor does it use this definition of blade length. The act was carefully drawn and doesn’t need uninformed judges to add words that aren’t there in the act. A lock on a folding pocketknife is a safety feature not a threat to law and order. Our legislature decreed that me may carry a knife with a 3” cutting edge, it’s not for a judge to add restrictions not in the act, but to see that the act is enforced… as passed in to law!
I had a client who was convicted for possession. He had a folding knife that he used camping and fishing three weeks prior to his arrest. He had forgotten that it was in a pocket that wasn't used every day, it was a gloves pocket. The type that are in the middle of the chest next to the main zip and protected by a zip. He told me that he had checked the outside four and inside two but forgotten about the pocket and that the knife was in the pocket. He was attacked and the police arrived, they searched the assailant and him. He was arrested for possession and found guilty in crown court, he hadn't used the knife as he had not realised it was there.
The Spiderco in your example is a very interesting knife. The part of the hinged steel bit, immediately behind the sharpened edge, is where you place your index finger when holding the knife. So, is this blade or handle?
It's probably good practice to look at the length as how much would go into a target. The blade, sharp part or not, would continue on into a target if you were to stab it, however, the handle wouldn't.
It is technically known as a "ricasso", but the advice offered here (and elsewhere) is that for legal purposes you should look at the measurement from the tip of the blade to the handle,because that is what case law has established.
When carrying a stanley knife in a tool kit a good idea to remove the blade from the handle and put it elsewhere in the toolkit separately ?
First aid is a good reason.
Try cutting open someone's jeans leg to access an injury.
Good for lifting splinters out
It should be made very clear that the good reason part doesn't apply to folding pocket knives as described, however police can often be power mad and still ask for a reason. Regardless of all of this, even though you don't legally need a reason to carry a folding pocket knife, if your reason for carrying it is a harmful reason, even self defence, it makes it a weapon and is illegal.
I just quote the relevant part of Section 139 Criminal Justice Act 1988 to them.
Perfectly reasonable, it's not just the police's job to arrest people breaking the law its also to be a deterrent to people breaking it in the first place. If you are seen with a legal knife and someone reports it is perfectly reasonable for the police to stop and even search you on reasonable suspicion grounds that it may be an illegal knife or you are carrying with an illegal intent
@@jons9721 If it can be construed as having been in a threatening manner yes but the same applies to a tin of beans in a Tesco bag.
@@simonh6371 Having a (legal) knife out in many circumstances could be seen as suspicious unless you are raising a tin of beans in preparation to throw it is not. If you were peeling an apple with a knife (any knife) outside a school and someone reported this to the police it would be reasonable for the police to stop you. That doesn't mean you have broken the law but that is not required for the police to investigate.
It's why you shouldn't carry (legal) knives without a good reason even if you don't need one. Not everything in life is about legal and illegal
@@jons9721 True. That's why I am careful not to be seen using a knife in front of people. In fact in the last years I don't think I've ever had to use it away from a workplace or home. On days off work I mostly carry a Swiss Army Knife, and mostly use the small one inch blade on it anyway. But I will never stop carrying a knife. Men have been carrying knives in some shape or form, sharpened flints before the Bronze and Iron Ages, for ever and the ability to use tools and make fire is what separates us from other mammals. Also I generally carry a first aid kit. Scissors (which are on my SAKs) are very useful in First Aid and I had to use them last week.
At the beginning you mention pocket knives as 'tools' then a little later you use your own knife as an example and say "it is immediately foldable at all times without any kind of mechanism". Most pocket knives that are 'tools' use a locking mechanism to keep them open for safety purposes (i.e. so they don't close on your fingers when you're using them).
I personally have a Leatherman multi-tool which has a knife blade as one of the tools. I just measured the full length of the blade and it comes in at 2 15/16" (almost as if they are aware of the 3" ruling) yet, although the blade can be opened freely, there is a locking bar that must be depressed to close it.
So am I correct in assuming, from what you say here, that because of that safety feature the multitool doesn't meet the requirements to be legally carried around?
Welcome to the weird and nonsensical world of UK law
Very useful BUT is the blade measured in a straight line from tip to handle, or is the curvature of the blade (and hence the resulting increase in length) taken into account?
As the law is to reduce the possible depth of penetrating wounds, I would imagine it is just the straight line length.
I was always lead to believe it was the cutting edge.
Hello Triple B. Now I have a question regarding ‘A good reason’ … Now I have a severely damaged right wrist that has had 9 bone crunching operations on it to date, the last being last October where I had a full wrist replacement and a Ulnar head/DRUJ replacement done during the same operation. The initial injury happened back in 1985 and wasn’t seen to (For reasons I won’t go into here) … Anyway the surgeries have left me with severely reduced motor functions in my fingers and hand .. I can grip things like say a can of drink but I find it extremely difficult and painful to open a bag of crisps, a boxed sandwich and so on due to simply not being able to grip small edges with my fingers to open them, I even use a ‘Man Bag’ as I find it extremely difficult and painful to get into pockets in a pair of good fitting jeans for example. Now I have carried a very cheap folding knife for a while, buried in my man bag, not in the attempt to hide it but so that it’s not quickly accessible… I come across across little tasks all the time whilst out and about where it helps me. I have tons of medical evidence, x-ray pictures, physiotherapist reports and so on to back up what I’m saying … Would you consider this a valid reason?? Now going on from there I actually bought myself a folding scalpel as the cheap one couldn’t keep an edge, therefore I had to put more pressure on the knife to use it which caused me discomfort but going by your description I conclude that it has a lock on it (Sort of lock you’d find on a spring assisted knife for example, which are now illegal to carry so I believe even if they are 3” or smaller, is that correct??) .. It also has a little thumb notch on the blade mount that makes it very easy for me to open with my left hand .. To close it I simply release it with my left hand and close it … The blades are around 2” long at the absolute most … Given what I have said above could I use this?? I haven’t took it with me as of yet so don’t worry. I remember ‘Lock Knives’ and they seem totally different to the mechanism of this scalpel … Anyway I’d be interested to hear your views.
This video, as well as most videos dealing with UK knife law, leaves me more confused than enlightened. Do you have to have an immediate need for a knife (e.g. fishing, work) for your reason to be "good"? What about "just in case"? That's why most people carry a Swiss Army knife, for general utility. Need to open a package? Slice some fruit? Open a bottle of wine? Tighten a screw? Remove a splinter? Lance a blister? I carry a Swiss Army Knife at all times for these reasons, but I may not be able to articulate them in advance. Does that mean that SAKs are effectively prohibited in most cases by UK law? What about a multi-bladed knife? Suppose I need a regular blade but not a reamer. Or a screwdriver but not a can opener. Do I have to have a "good reason" for every tool in my SAK? Personally, I think everyone should carry a utility-oriented pocket knife at all times. Society would be a lot safer. Long story, but I once rescued someone from the path of an oncoming train with a SAK. The platform was full of onlookers but I was the only one able to take action because I had a knife. I think some people prefer the public to be helpless in order maintain the illusion that the state is always there to help. They're not.
How legal is a Leatherman Supertool? Is this classed as a pocket knife or a multi purpose tool? It has pliers, wire cutter, flat blade screwdriver, Philips screwdriver, can opener and two blades one serrated one plane. Both blades are a fraction over 3 inches and lock into the open position, so as the blades lock open are they legal.
Whenever I'm riding one of my classic motorcycles, I have a multi-tool in my pocket which incorporates a folding knife blade. It would be no use at all as a weapon, because it folds so easily that I would be more likely to cut my own fingers off if I tried to stab someone with it (but I could give them a nasty pinch with the pliers).
So If you had a legal sized folding pocket knife for work duties HOWEVER the knife would lock into place once folded out and the reason for one that locks (one that will Not close unless you have to press something to allow ot to close) is so that when you're using it for a work purpose the knife cannot fold and catch your hands/fingers thus conforming to the Health and Safety at work act?
I'm subscribed, so there all you freeloaders!
I've been carrying a sharp knife over three inches long with me for years and I hardly realised I had any issue with it! And I don't think I do.. My Leatherman in my toolkit.
Edit: Seriously, I love my Leatherman, (Standard version) it's the most useful non standard tool I have and its a joy to use. Beautifully engineered.
Your Leatherman almost certainly has a locking blade and could land you in jail. I own a Surge, a Wave and a Skeletool. All illegal to carry in the UK/
@@twatmunro Aha OK, it is always in a toolkit though, not on my person. Yes the blades lock.
@@twatmunro PS someone pinched my Wave off site... But I do prefer the original, it looks so nice, even if the Wave is probably the better tool.
@@twatmunro PPS Ha, ha @Twat...??
I carry the Spyderco UKPK as shown in your video. SO can I assume it's legal to carry so long as I'm sensible where I go with it?
Yes it is.
Are opinel knives legal to carry around ?I always had one in my handbag to prepare food for my kids when we were out and about
Government Web site say !THE CUTTING EDGE of the blade must not exceed 3 inches?
Is that 3" from the handle or from where the blade is attached inside the handle?
The obvious answer is from the handle but the law is the law
so what your saying is only criminals are allowed to carry machetes around and law abiding citizen must hand over their property if the said criminal demands them
Or die, depending on the whim of the criminal. Welcome to the UK.
I value my fingers so a locking blade is a must for me.
I have a Lansky World Legal, which is legally a folding pocket knife as described in the video, but the backspring is both very strong and has a half-stop and is very unlikely to fold on your fingers unless you were doing something stupid with it.
The Lansky Madrock is a variation of the world legal and also the Boker Worldwide. Just some good knives if you want one you can carry with you at all times.
Locking blades have only been around since the late 60s. Before then every man carried a non locking penknife and used them every day. But almost all of them had all their fingers.
@@simonh6371 "Almost all of them" .... who wants to be the ones that don't ?
@@simonh6371 Locking blade knives have been around for hundreds of years....
what about something like a svord peasant mini? they are advertised as uk legal but the actual overall length of the blade is around 5 inches. 2 inches of that is just part of the tang that folds into the handle, the actual "blade" bit is under 3 inches
Chopsticks, knitting needles, scissors, pencils, table cutlery, umbrellas, where does this end, sharp fingernails?????
I think the leather man bond is a good reason knife. As it is non locking however when open and closed up it isn't immediately fully foldable. Please see this as this is a very grey area
Also what about a retractable disposable utility knife, although the part that is sharp is quite small, if you measure the entire length of the blade, even though there are grooves where you can break off the end , will some times exceed 5” in length.
You can't carry that without good reason because even if you only have a part of the blade protruding, it locks in place.
Your video was on the main page of google.
Congratulations…
I everyday carry a SIG P365 9mm & an Ontario Rat_1.
What is you favorite pocket knife that can beat the rat_1????
Thank you for your comment & channel.
Thank you 😊 🙏
For all my youth, most "penknives", whatever the length of the blade, did not have blade locks. The exceptions were knives from Spain and French Opinels. When knives with locks became more widely available in the UK, it was a good thing for those of us who used them in our industries and occupations. Then, of course, the politicians and the duffers in wigs got together and banned them. This country is mad-keen on banning things, from knives to heating appliances; from meat to motor cars. It's Dystopia, not Utopia.
But they aren't banned. I use lock knives with larger blades every day at work. We can buy them, we can own them and we can use them. I just can't walk around with a fixed blade or locking blade or folding blade over 3 inches unless I have a reason to be carrying it. Just like I can own a shotgun, and transport it from my property to an area where I can shoot, but I can't sit with it on my lap in the city centre and drop a cartridge in the spout.
@@eberp9270 Quite so, but I was thinking more of the small pocket knives (aka "penknives") with locking blades that I would normally carry all the time, in place of a non-locking knife. I have, for example, a miniature locking knife that is smaller than the legal folding penknife that I carry (on the old principle that anyone should carry a bob, a penknife and a piece of string), yet I would be in trouble with that, and quite possibly anywhere. I have in the past carried a knife to and from my workplace (a seagoing fishing vessel), but it was never quite clear whether I was OK with it on me when I was going to work or returning home. I also see your point about shotguns. From my past shooting days of many years ago, I recall that I could carry one anywhere public with good reason, provided it was secured in some form of gun case. I would hesitate to carry anything like that today, with the police being what they now are.
Thanks for the clarification. Is there any case law on the locking mechanism? I note you said easily closed at any time, and I know you would have chosen those words carefully. I ask because I know how dangerous a blade is , in or out, if unlocked. All my folding pocket knives are locked when open but are easily closed by releasing the lock. Also, advise would be appreciated on larger non folding knives that I use for camping and other out door activities.
I find knives without a lock pretty safe to use. They are called slip-joint knives. If you use your knife for opening packages, and other lighter cutting tasks, you should have no problem using a slip joint. Modern slip joints also have several detents to make them less loose. That means there is your typical detent when the knife is closed keeping it in that position, a detent in the middle when opening the knife, and a detent when the knife is open and ready to be used.
BBB didn’t choose the words. It’s written in law that the knife must be able to be readily folded at all times without having to use a button, switch or release any mechanism to do so.
I too was around when the U.K. Design Team were pinging ideas back and forth with Spydercos CEO Sal Glesser for the UKPK, (United Kingdom Pen
Knife). The blade is a fraction under 3”, designed in such a way that the forefinger fits into the choil to prevent closing on the hand, and given very nice edge geometry to make it versatile. A strong backspring was designed to provide more security against closing. To this day, the UKPK and smaller Urban remain good pocket pals of mine, used on a daily basis for anything from opening a box to pointing a stick into a toothpick.
@@Supernice65 One of us! What ever happened to the old forum?
@@Naptosis Unfortunately Martyn gradually withdrew and then deserted it. Also a lot of the threads were ruined by Photobucket suddenly holding everyone to ransom by blocking content, rendering many of the tutorials worthless. A few of us are still about on Bushcraft U.K. and other forums. Is there private message function on here?
I have the exact same spyderco its ok but i find the lack of a lock makes it unsafe
Could you take a look at a svord peasent mini knife and give me thoughts on whether that counts as legal or not.
The extended tang is clamped over and held by the hand preventing the knife from closing, however the knife without a hand is readily closeable at any given time and is only held in place by friction.
Also although the tang is extended, it can't really be used as a flipper in my opinion, but does having an extended tang still count as assisted opening?
From what I've seen about the Svord Peasant, the regular peasant is slightly over the legal length, but the Peasant Mini isn't. Also the friction folding part doesn't count towards the overall length, just from the tip of the blade to the beginning of the handle.
Also, the extended tang doesn't count as assisted opening as it uses only your hand to open as opposed to an assisted opener which would use a spring.
@@rebelyelleasyrider sorry yes I meant the svord peasant mini knife. Quite right the regular svord knife doesn't have a legal blade length for the UK
See this is what made me think because by that logic, any knife with a small tang for flipping the knife open, and nothing else such as the civivi foldis should technically be legal seeing as they don't have spring assisted opening and rely solely on the momentum of the hand. And yet in a previous video, it was mentioned that the civivi foldis was on the edge of the legal limit, because it was a flipper.
What separates the svord peasent mini knife with it's much larger tang from the foldis with it's much smaller tang in terms of legality when they both work exactly the same?
[Edit] sorry that was really rambly
@@themightychippy3756 I don't get the flipper rule myself either, considering Higonokami knives can be uk legal and have a much smaller and more flippable tab
During the working week, I have a multi tool with a locking blade on my belt. I do home delivery of furniture and have to unpack and assemble in the customers home. I went with the locking blade because its safer for use in this application. As its a work tool, would I still fall fowl of the law?
Well it's a reason. Is it a good reason?.. That IMHO is the problem with the law- it's all bit subjective when you can do time for it.
No, the law is purposefully aimed to allow just that type of usage.
@@rossgoodley5176 Yes, it's purposefully vague IMHO.
@@Steves_fish If you fall foul of the law you could end up doing bird?
A lot of people here seem to chicken out of carrying street legal knives and duck the real issue.
But I accept we can't have everyone swanning about with illegal knives.
As long as you're only carrying it on your way to work, during work and back from work. That is classed as a good reason. Carrying it out of work hours would not be a good reason.
The video is wrong.
Brooker v DPP failed because section 139(2) of the Criminal Justice Act 1988 makes it an offence to have a bladed article in a public place. Brooker had a butter knife, which very clearly has a blade. Brooker v DPP just established that a knife does not need to be sharp to qualify as an article with a blade.
The length of a folding pocketknife is defined in statute law, i.e. section 139(3). In this section it is the length of the cutting edge which is important.
You cannot use Brooker v DPP to say that the plain English definition of section 139(3) no longer applies.
A folding pocketknife meets the exemption of section 139(2) if length of its cutting edge does not exceed 3 inches.
Just asking if the item with out handle is a blade so dose the blade go past the pivot point into the handle? ( is the blade the hole metal part ) Or is it from the end of the handle?
I got knicked for carring a multitool, because the blade locked 2.5 inches like long. Thing is what really is the difference between a blade that locks and one doesn't. Both in the wrong hands will do the same damage.
I have the spyderco UK penknife. Fantastically designed for the UK market but the steel and bevel REALLY let it down it's almost impossible to get it properly sharp and it comes pretty much blunt.
Get yourself a Serge Panchenko Slipjoint Razor. Takes utility knife blades and is legal to carry.
Victorinox do a really good pen type sharpening stone. I use it on all of my blades. It leaves a good long lasting edge.
@@phil251170 I have a spyderco sharpmaker and a leather strop glued to a piece of wood that I use for polishing knives with chisel polishing compound. All my other knives are like razors. The sypderco ukpn has awful steel and a terrible factory edge.
The Spyderco UKPK is available in a range of steels
@@srspoweris it possible yours is faulty? I've had three UKPKs (two in BD1, one in S30V) and they all take a hair-popping razor edge.
I’ve always carried a Swiss army in my car and on my motorcycle when I’m travelling. I never carry it in my pocket in public tho. Not sure what the police would do if I was stopped and searched! If its in my car is it still classed as carrying a knife? Until that happens I’ll continue to carry my Swiss Army Knife, as i often have to use it all but not very often I use the blade.
It says the blade may not exceed 3 inches, but it doesn't say anything about the haft, so theoretically you could keep the blade the same & make the haft really long, & carry a spear.
More than that, it doesn't say blade, it says "cutting edge of its blade exceeds 3 inches" I don't think he's right.
Are there any variations of the rules when carrying a pen knife or multi tool?
Is a folding and locking fork considered a blade ?
So let me get this CORRECT here, a Swiss Army Knife comes under the exemption. Also what if the "locking" mechanism was one that was a safety catch? Like one of my work knives (that knife complies with HSE)
So with that idea, could a metal ruler be classed as a blade that is dull with no point?🤔
Cutlery? I used to take my own to work on night shifts as the stuff in the kitchen at work was rubbish. I just checked and if I hold the knife like a dagger there's around 5.5" available to stick into someone, assuming I could even get the rounded blunt point through someone's clothing and skin.
By that definition an icing spatula is a deadly weapon
Could you clarify that in this country you are still presumed innocent until proved guilty? If that is the case then surely it is not down to a person having a good reason to have a knife but for the law to prove otherwise ?
Innocent until proven guilty is a nice theory.
The UK police presume everyone to be guilty until they can prove their innocence. That innocence need to be proven without hurting the ego of the cop.
That depends on the way the law is written.
Merely possessing a proscribed weapon in public is an offence. If they prove “beyond reasonable doubt” you were carrying it then your’e guilty UNLESS you have a lawful reason to be doing so. Now the burden of proof has shifted. It’s no longer “beyond reasonable doubt” but you would need to show “on the balance of evidence” that you had a lawful cause to be in possession.
Even if you are in legal possession of a blade, showing it as a threat immediately makes that possession illegal.
Yes, knife crime is a problem, but at least we’re not stupid enough to believe that more knife carrying is the solution. A good guy with a knife is just one trigger event from becoming a bad guy with a knife.
This is the UK here we're guilty until proven innocent.
Post Coronation Day that is a big ask!
So, if I walked into town and bought Fish & Chips and took them along to the park where I sat at a picnic table to eat them. I then pulled out a knife and fork from my cutlery drawer and set about my lunch. The knife is not folding and has a blade longer that 3". Would that be an offence? Also, you did not mention anything about the blade material. What if I took along a plastic knife and fork? That may be a silly question, but what if I took along one of my ceramic bladed knives?
I’m an ex PPL pilot and carried my Swiss Army knife on me for every flight, my reasoning was that I might need a blade to cut through the seatbelt or headset wires in the event of a crash.
I also have a multi tool in my car that has a blade (under 3 inches and non locking), where do I stand legally in both of these instances?
Both sound reasonable by the law.
Section 139 CJA 1988 permits the carrying of folding (non-locking) pocket knives with a blade below 3 inches, without valid reason. So both are ok to carry in public. Except for on school/college premises (see Section 139a CJA 1988).
Can I ask, what is the law regarding carrying a Sgian Dubh Scottish sock knife?
I have certain disabilities that carrying a small blade alleviates- problems with restricted mobility in the right wrist, with accompanying loss of strength in that hand, plus avascular necrosis in the left shoulder accompanied by loss of muscle tissue on the same shoulder due to 2 debridement operations- it got really infected.....
Carrying a sub 3 inch, non locking blade allows me to open cans of drink, packets of various foods, cut an apple when out and about- lots of little basic jobs.
I'm pretty sure I'm OK as I keep within the exception, but what if I took a multitool- I have 3 and although the blades are small, they all lock. Which, I think makes them illegal to carry, even though they're safer to use. Anyone have any thoughts?
The locking knives would need a 'reasonable excuse' to carry legally. Like for your job. Would your disability count? Unfortunately the law is written purposefully vaguely.
I work as a gardener and on way , to whilst at and whilst at work I carry 3inch lock knife .
So a law was made, I would imagine, following a degree of consultation with experts on knives. Then changed by a layman on the subject. So we now define a cutting edge in law to include an edge that cannot cut. I would love someone to address the elephant in the room. KITCHEN KNIVES.
There is no elephant here. You simply can't carry a kitchen knife in a public place without good reason. All those other knives that you're imagining, they are still legal to own (with a couple of exceptions). You just can't have them in your pocket in a public area unless there's a reason, such as you've just bought a set of kitchen knives from Asda and you're now taking them home.
@@eberp9270 Word salad.
@@ianrosie4431 I prefer Waldorf, but only when the waldorfs are fresh.
I think most city people will say no to carrying a knife us country bumpkins use one daily
Bored with this now.
As I type I am looking at a pen ... Yes, that is ironic.
Jason Bourne (in a movie) made good use of a 'Bic'.
Are we not allowed to carry pens in public !?!
Is The Law about Intent or potential ?
Its mainly about hurt feelings and police ego.
So I own a multi tool, and one of the tools is a 3” blade that can be opened by one hand a locks open. One is a 3” serrated blade that locks open, and one is a 3” saw blade, that locks open. It also has a file, pair of scissors, a screwdriver and a can opener. Is this legal ?
Locks - not legal unless you have a good reason
@@randomreviewz2628 Legal definition of a lock knife is “A locking blade is one that can be locked or refolded by pushing a button”. Mine has a liner lock and you just apply pressure to the side of the blade to unlock it, so no button.
As long as one of the blades do not abide by the restriction, then the whole multitool is restricted.
@@hugheffo that still counts as a locking blade
question what about a multitool and or a legal pocket knife that has 2 blades ,
I use a folding knife with a locking blade. Its the safer option. I prefer to not to cut my fingers when Im working with the knife.
The UK legal knives are dangerous to the user. Im currently recovering from having a UK legal knife fold during use.
The law states that the 'cutting edge' of the blade must not be more than 3 inches. It needs to make it more clearer because you could have a non locking folding knife where the blade could be 5 inches long but the cutting edge could be only 3 inches long. I will try to explain by referring to the one you have. The thick metal bit where the blade starts from is not counted as the cutting edge. On your knife it looks about one third of an inch. What if that happened to be 2 inches long then your knife would technically have a 5 inch blade but still be legal because the cutting edge is 3 inches or less
I carry a small folding knife when shopping. I do this so I can remove and discard the packaging in the shop and hand it to them for recycling. Without a knife this is almost impossible. I shop on foot and the less to carry the better. But of course I forgot and got caught in the metal detectors at the County Court, I was bringing an eviction case so this was rather embarrassing. As you say, even genuine forgetfulness is not a defence but common sense prevailed and I was able to leave the knife with an official. Lesson learned.
@Homie Actually there was an incident several years ago in which a senior semi retired army officer was pulled by the Met while on his way to the airport to take up a posting as a military attache. Pillar of the establishment, in other words. His hand luggage set off a metal detector, they found such a kit and the view was taken that the 1 1/4" paper knife contained within it amounted to a fixed blade knife. He was ultimately obliged to accept a police caution.
I have an older Victorinox knife, had it for years and it has been very useful in my travels around the world. However, the blade is 3 1/4 inches and locks and so, under the ridiculous UK laws, is illegal. It is always in it's pouch, either in a backpack, light pack or camera bag so not on a belt or in my pocket, but nevertheless I am in no doubt that if stopped by the police and my bag searched they'd prosecute me simply for having it.... and that is where the "law" falls down in being seemingly blind to "intent". What about pointy sticks?
What about a little manual lock on a folding blade, I have my camping one for cutting
Technically illegal as the lock makes it a fixed blade and hence illegal.
@@docsmellyfella But it would be legal as whilst out camping the knife would be considered a tool.
@@armchairgeneralissimo problem is a policeman could also be a tool. I've avoided carrying anything with a locking mechanism just in case. Not ideal but these are the times we are living in.
Carrying a knife to protect yourself seems a good reason to me.
And as an added caveat, it is perfectly legal to own non UK legal pocket knife/knives, with locking handles, and blades longer than three inches. You just cannot take it out of your house for any reason. If you have one to open boxes from lets say Amazon, and it never leaves your property, that is perfectly fine.
If you were a collector, and were to take several to a knife show in a case, you might just get away with having them outside of your home. But you would need to prove it.
Question? How does the law react if I could put together what amounts to an arrow that is thrown by hand and not a bow is involved ?
Question, I have a filleting Knife in my sea fishing tackle box that I use for beach fishing , Can you confirm if this knife is illegal or not. it is in it's own sheath
i wonder if this applies to practice blades for hema and other martial arts that use them? not the folding part but the blade length issue
where is the 3" mesured from ? is it a straight line down the middle of the blade or the curve of the blade as the curved part could be longer than 3"
Here's a question - I've got a SOG Paratool, it's not very good (poor quality and bad design) but has a non locking less than three inch blade. So complies with the law on pocket knives and I don't need a reason to carry it. I got it for exactly this purpose and I've used it a heck of a lot because I always have it with me.
The problem is, if the knife was opened and then the rest of the tool closed down around it the knife is then blocked from closing. So it could be argued by an unreasonable person that it is then locked. Am I breaking the law?
So many examples of how this law is complete nonsense - it's not effected knife crime at all because criminals still have access to proper knives, it's only honest law abiding people who have lost more freedom.