Can I fix this faulty Amstrad 2086?
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- Опубліковано 9 лип 2024
- I've had this machine sitting in storage for a couple of years now but done very little with it. Its been far to long since I did anything with a retro PC and the old Amstrad certainly needs some love but since I last used it, it's developed a fault. So for part 1, can I fix both the PC and the Monitor?
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Chapters
00:00 Intro
00:58 Overview of problems
01:49 PC tear down
07:41 Motherboard tour
10:55 Looking for a short
12:01 Inside the PSU
12:51 Floppy drive
13:48 Hard drive
14:43 Found the problem
22:31 Testing the computer
23:53 Will the hdd boot
24:46 Tour of the HDD
31:50 Monitor tear down
34:34 Sketchy bit
36:41 Leaky caps
40:49 New caps
45:00 Monitor testing
51:45 Conclusion - Наука та технологія
As a staunch Amiga fan, I'd have appreciated a trigger warning when innocent Amiga disks were tainted by being put into a PC. 😉 So by this model, Amstrad had stopped putting the power supply in the monitor, which is a good development. I'd agree that the mouse driver is a likely candidate to keep. LOL at "Two days later, so it is".
I was wondering if anyone would notice the Amiga disk 😅. Just a bit of fun with the Belfast accent so it is 😂
It was common to find an Amiga demo disk with some other pirated game copied over it but at least that was keeping in the Amiga ecosystem. At least the label hasn't been written over and to be honest, that's the collectible part, most don't even use the disks and have switched to gotek or whdload.
Haha, I reacted aswell xD
Great job Glen =D Used to service those, and the monitors all the time! We had a contract with a company that sent us around 20 at a time to fix lol!
Hope it brought back a few memories. One was enough to fix, don't think I could handle the stress of 20 monitors 😅
Did you ever service those Amstrad laptops from the 90s?
A real blast from the past indeed, reminds me of my 1st PC, an Amstrad PC1640 (picked it up in Belfast !) - the PSU for the base unit was in the monitor, a real nightmare!
That's the previous generation of systems before this one then. Glad they removed the PSU out of the monitor for this generation of system though as having it in the monitor just sounds like more "fun" for trouble shooting.
Those 3 height adjustments are for the 3 vertical refresh frequencies of cga, ega and vga. If you look on the back of the line output transformer (flyback) you might see 2 adjustment pots. on is for A1 voltage (effects the brightness) and the other is for focus. As the CRT ages you'll need to increase the A1 (Anode 1) on a Sony Trinitron its the G2 (Grid 2) increasing these will give you more brightness without affecting the focus as much as winding the brightness up. Turning it up too much will result in flyback lines though. Once you have the brightness better, then try to adjust the focus. It probably won't make much difference, but I have seen in cheaply produced monitors that these have never been adjusted in the factory and have made a huge difference.
The flyback does indeed have adjustment on the back of it so yes I'll give that a go and maybe it'll breath a bit more life into the screen. Thanks for the tip!
Great stuff Glenn, I enjoyed that one:) The big advantage of that particular ESR meter is its ability to check the caps in-circuit, so you could just nip around those other caps without desoldering. It has saved me hours!
My biology teacher finally replaced her HP 286 running DOS 5.0 and MS Works with something newer around the time that CV was written so some people did use computers of that age in the late 90s but that was very unusual, at least in central Europe. I do remember my dad swearing because a colleague from Germany had sent him an article for publication, typed on a C64 and printed on fanfold paper, around 1997. My dad ended up having someone re-type the article from the printout to get it in a usable format. Someone else sent him a file probably created in Samna Word (the person claimed the file had been created in Word but the file ending was .sam). Converting that was fun as well, the only way we could figure out at that time was importing it as plain text and removing a whole bunch of special characters using find and replace.
It's always interesting to hear of folk who did use these machine back when they were just deemed as obsolete. I was perhaps just lucky that I went from my Amiga 1200 to a Windows 95 machine then later replaced that with a Windows 98 rig towards the end of the 90s.
@@CRGI just remembered another incident with plenty of media coverage. Austrian kidnapper Wolfgang Priklopil caused the police considerable headaches because all of his digital notes were on a C64 - in 2006.
I like how my filthy closet transition into a quaint retro collection in absence of any observers
Oh I had one for these for my collage work. Well in fact it was the later 2286 model but not much different, it still had a 30gb hard drive. My proud moment was to write a batch file to call up a menu to start my programs on it :).. loved the machine. I still think to date they had some of the clearest monitors to date with a very black screen tube :).
Sounds like you had a lot of fun with your machine. I have a batch file like that on my Olivetti 286, it is a handy thing to have. I've been given a few tips for tweaking the monitor a bit more to hopefully improve the picture so all being well I'll be able to breath a bit more life into it.
@@CRGI always wanted a sound blaster card for my machine but could only afford the Adlib 😢😢🤣🤣
Nice. Boost reminds me of Borland Sidekick.
Yes it does seem very similar to that although maybe a little more basic.
Just what I was thinking. Sidekick was installed on the first PC I used - an actual IBM PC XT - at my first job. I don't think it ever got used.
That was he first PC I ever used - at work. It did have DOS 3.3 and Windows 2. We mainly used it for a PCB design program called EasyPC, and for playing a really naff Indycar game while nobody was looking.
A lovely computer. My uncle had one that we played Maniac Mansion, Keen: Goodbye Galaxy and PGA Golf on in about 1990. He threw it away years ago unfortunately so I’ll keep an eye out for one for myself. I used my Amstrad PCW 8256 up until 2000!
I would not have though an 8086 would run something like PGA Golf but I must look into that as I do enjoy a good golf game.
Wonderful looking machine. My first ever PC was the 386dx version, in the exact same case. I bought it second hand. Was the only way I could afford to jump to PC at the time. I have a very soft spot for these but I've not seen a single 386dx variant hit the market. It's usually the 286.
Around the early 1990s my friend had an Amstrad PC2286, and I'm certain Amstrad also produced a PC2386. My friends 2286 had a Miniscribe 30 or maybe 40 Mb HDD plugged into an ISA card, as supplied from new, because the original on-board HDD slot had some problems and wasn't useable. My memory of it may be slightly fuzzy.
My brother, after seeing the 2286 thought he'd found one to buy for not a lot of money, bought it, and then was mightily upset that it was the 2086. Much slower, less software compatibility, etc.
Not sure what happened to either machine. One thing I did like about these Amstrad machines was that the monitor sat flush into a recess in the top of the case, and under that was above the battery slots, and on the left in the recess where the power switch sat was a volume control for the built-in PC speaker. I've never seen that on any other PC.
Things I did hate were the plastic of the case, and the generally lower quality that obviously saved Amstrad some money. Also, not being able to upgrade the memory wasn't so great, but maybe a memory card could be installed. I really don't know, as I never tried. Last thing I hated was there was no CMOS settings to edit until you ran a SETUP utility on one of the provided floppies. I'm guessing that would be fairly specific to each model too.
It is a lovely looking system and maybe with a little cleaning I can get it looking even better.
The plastic feeling of the case is as you say from Amstrads cost cutting exercise but it does seem to be well enough made for what it is. You mentioned the CMOS but I'm not even sure this machine has any such settings, rather there is a switch block at the back which seems to set some basic things. I'll have to remember to talk about this in the next part.
"Two days later, so it is" 😂
That's us naw
Great Video as usual. I remember working on these systems decades ago.
One tip, clean the board with white vinegar to neutralise the alkaline from the capacitors then clean with IPA.
Glad to hear you enjoyed the video and thanks for the tip. I'll be sure to use a little vinegar next time.
If there is a lot of wear on the crt I'd just use it as is replace leaking caps only and enjoy what life is left in the tube. I wouldn't invest to much money unless you find a tube with less hours on it. Just enjoy it. It's not your primary computer and this is just another reason to turn it on and not worry about adding hours to the tubes.
Absolutely, while I do want to use this machine to some extent its not going to get any huge amount of time spent on it so with the leaky caps replaced the monitor will be fine for what I need. I have been given a few tips that I need to try which might get a little bit more performance out of the CRT so will give that a go then just enjoy it for what it is.
great video very interesting to watch. not many detailed videos are uploaded now.
I'm glad you were able to boot Workbench on it. LOL
GURU MEDITATION 81000001
I had the Amstrad PC1640HD. So peed at myself that I physically smashed the crap out of it when I finally upgraded to a 'real' PC. The PSU in the monitor was effing stupid, as was using an 8088 processor to save a couple of bucks over the 8086. That 20Gb full height 5.25" MFM HDD was a beast though!
Fantastic video. Great diagnostics and very useful for me. Thanks
Thanks, glad you enjoyed it.
I have 2386 with 386DX 20 MHz but there is MFM HDD. I read somewhere that Amstrad didn't have 100% working IDE controller so they used MFM but You have IDE drive - strange. It is very important to have correct Amstrad keyboards to these komputer because they are not working with any other keyboard and it is impossible to buy converter. Great video.
Thanks, glad you enjoyed the video. Yes, I had read that about the keyboard but it also seems the mouse on these was bespoke to the Amstrad range of computers.
@@CRG thank You for information about mouse. This problem is easier to solve because it is possible to connect RS232 mouse. People often don't know about these details.
I understand that Sugar soap helps to neutralise any acerbic damage to Amstrad products...
That puns so bad if you were my Apprentice I have to say You're Fired
The focus can be adjusted by the focus control on the line output transformer.
Thanks again for the tip, I'll try this and hopefully it'll help.
Had a PC2086 without the hard drive (poor student, had to wait a few months and bought a 32mb hard card). Was my first PC and decent enough, got me through 3 years of college.
nice work getting this back working. Sweet looking machine. Crank up the Screen pot on the flyback a wee bit to get some brightness back there.
For the horizontal width, monitors usually have a Width coil in the vicinity of the flyback . At 43.06 it's most likely the vertical coil with a ferite or carbon rod in the center. You can turn this with a plastic too (a metal screwdriver will apply too much strength and destroy the rod so be carefull) to change the width a bit. The blue cap beside it is most likely the width cap, changing it slightly it can also help you gain some width back if you can be bothered going down that route.
tbh it looks fine as it is so I'd leave that alone :)
I'll try to adjust the pot on the back of the flyback and see if it helps. Thanks for the info on the horizontal. I've since got a plastic tool for such things but as you say it's not too bad so maybe best left as it.
Wow, what a neat setup! An 8086 with an XT HD and VGA. The only other XT HD I have seen came with an Amiga A590 and it wouldn't spin up. Maybe I should check the caps...
I have an XT drive from an A590 that I want to try and image at some point. I wonder if I could use this complete along with an XT-IDE to do that. If you're drive is dead it certainly would be worth checking over the caps on it, you never know, it might be that simple.
My A590 came with a SCSI drive. But that was very soon replaced with a 120, then a 240MB drive instead of the small 20MB one
OMG - I had one of these! I loved it
It certainly is an interesting machine. It's my first time with a 8086 system so it'll be fun to test out with some old titles.
i think it worth re capping and adding memory ect..i like it! playing some games would be cool...nice job glenn ! also sorting the rust out would be good!
I've got a few idea for upgrades and more RAM is certainly on the cards.
Would love to have a copy of the park and color pattern utility. I'm restoring a 2286 Amstrad PC (our first family computer) and I remember both of those utilites on there.
I can certainly make them available once I get them off the drive.
Oh! I have one of these in a cupboard. Like yours, it's been sitting in there for a few years. There was (& presumably still is) a problem with the monitor, it would be fine to start with & then would get more & more out of focus. Must dig it out & have a look at it. Great video :)
Thanks, glad you enjoyed the video. Might just be a case that your monitor needs a tweak or maybe some of its caps are failing too.
I'd definitely make an image of the drive, who knows if the DOS isn't patched for some weirdness of this machine.
I can certainly try to image the HDD.
I've also got the same monitor (PC14-CD) though judging by little dust on the inside I don't think it's been used much. Regardless it still takes a good while to warm up and reach good brightness levels - about 30 to 45 minutes, which is very odd. Wonder if it could be a design quirk of the monitors circuitry?
Maybe I just need to leave it for a bit longer then. Its been ran for maybe 30 minutes at a time but not much more than that.
Any chance you could image the drive and make it available for download? After any personal stuff is removed obviously. p.s. Every video you do gets better and better, keep up the good work.
I can certainly try to. Any ideas how I would go about imaging an XT drive like this?
Install an XT IDE card or an IDE controller card in one of the ISA slots and copy the files on the HDD to a CF card or another HDD.
@@CRGmaybe a couple of ways you could do it but probably depend if you have the bits to do it though. think the easiest would be If you have a PC that can take the 8bit ISA HD and capable of running Linux just dd it to an image file. Other way would be a parallel port zip drive but like I say it all depends if you have the tools to do it. If its going to cause you a load of hassle don't worry about it I don't want to be the cause of holding up your video production....
@@CRG I went old school & used Laplink to copy the contents of my one 😁
One CRT I have was so dim it couldn't really be read in normal lighting anymore. I increased the B+ voltage a bit and it looks fine now. Not the recommended way to fix a CRT but it was either that or throw it out.
Whatever you need to do to fix it. I've been given a few tips that will hopefully breath a bit more life into this screen for me so will try those and see how it goes.
@@CRGIf all else fails there is always the B+ voltage. :)
26:57 They always work fine, don't they? :D
They do indeed, was a silly statement to make on my part!
lol the calc test :P
I've been waiting for someone to pick up on it 😂
@@CRG lol ah the good ol' school days of having a calculator :P
Didn't Amstrad PCs ship with GEM? (Perifractic had one if memory serves).
Not sure, any literature I can find of this machine says dos 3.3 and windows.
Yes, or at least mine has GEM
PC1640 shipped with GEM, PC1512 likely did too. 2000 series shipped with Windows 2
Great video - I have an Amstrad pc1640hd and the monitor is showing a snowy picture. After watching your video a recap might be in order..?
Possibly, although I'd wonder if snow was not something interfering with the signal.
@@CRG I checked the motherboard as the person I got it from switched it on and it went bang… the monitor provides power to the pc, so I thought it might have been the caps in the monitor.
Recapping can make sense. Depends on your own expression of the Board.
While not in the video I tested a few more of the existing caps on the monitor and while granted they were still in circuit they certainly seemed to test ok. But yes for longevity a full recap certainly wouldn't do any harm.
@@CRG on a socket a board recently i just replaced the bulged caps around the cpu. The others looked good. Then i tested it and installed xp outside a case. Afrer testing and the install some of the good looking ones startet to bulge too. Just personal expierience. But the amiga should have higher quality caps, as it is older.
Pretty odd for a 1988 PC to be all 3½ inch drives, I guess that explains the external disk drive connector, honestly kinda cool for a Turbo-XT, I assume they meant for you to have all your software on DD floppies.
I believe my friend who had a PC2286 version of this also had a 5.25" fdd for it that plugged in to that external drive connector.
The external drive connector is indeed for a 5.25" drive but I've not been able to find out much about it beyond a passing reference in one article (and of course what Simon mentioned above). But I'm sure there were plenty of people out there with the basic version of this machine just running everything from floppy. I know I was certainly happy doing that in the early 90s on my Amiga.
@@SimonSideburns I have the external 5.25 floppy drive with my 2086. Took me a while to get it working as it was defaulting to 720k & no bios screen. Found out that you have to run a program to set it as 360k
@@turntheblueiris4626 Oh yes, I remember the very limited CMOS settings were changed by running a SETUP executable file on one of the supplied floppy disks.
Could those light blue capacitors on the monitor board be polyester caps? It would explain their longevity and why they don't leak corrosive goo all over the place.
Do you maybe mean polymer capacitors? I don't think I've ever seen a polyester cap in that type of configuration and are polyester caps not non-polarised? Even at that I'm not sure polymer caps were a thing when this was new but I'm by no means an expert so could be wrong (usually am 😅)
@@CRG Ah yes, I meant polymer caps not polyester! Wasn't aware that they're a relatively new type of composition but I have seen some people mention using polymers when recapping to prevent future leaking.
If only Amiga had this non-planar 256 color MCGA mode. That kinda suggests that Amstrad aimed at gamers with this machine. I don't think MCGA was that common.
Well the marketing blurb I found would make you think the 2000 range was all aimed at the business market but I'm sure the ability to play a few games was a nice benefit for anyone who bought one.
@@CRGPerhaps Amstrad should have equipped the ill-fated Sinclair PC 200 with such graphics. (Or just forgotten about the whole thing and not bothered!)
Hello, my father had one and in France it came with Dos 3.30 and Windows 2.03. I buy one recently and I have not your chance with the HDD. As I remember reading, there are different configuration, RLL hard drive and some sort of XT-IDE (you have) and different floppy controller. Mine support 1.44M (otherwise no stated to support it) but warning the main floppy drive must have ID 0 (and not ID 1 as PC "standard" floppy drive), I install a Gotek and 1.44 floppy image work perfectly.
Are you sure your system is the 2086? I only ask because the 2286 and 2386 had support for 1.44M floppy drives. If yours is the 2086 I'd love to know what floppy controller it has. Maybe I could upgrade mind to read 1.44M disks too.
@@CRGYes it is a pc-2086 with an 8086 (mine is branded Siemens and my father was branded AMD like you), I replace the CPU with a NEC V30. I will check for the floppy controller.
@@johann9768thanks, I appreciate you going to the trouble of helping.
@@CRG It is a UM8272A like you. With my gotek I have no problem with 1.44Mb image (I test installing Dos 6.22 without problem)
Is it not standard to image the hdd?
I'll look into making an image of the drive
Aaaah local accent on UA-cam!! Subscribed!! #Amiga4ever
Always great to hear of other local people interested in this retro tech, thanks for subscribing!
@@CRG My A4000T needs work, can you do it? Got a BFG9060 running at 100MHz but the termination on the Z3 bus doesn't work properly at that speed. The solution is active terminators instead of resistor packs. There's seven of them that need soldered in. I'm pretty handy woth a soldering iron but wouldn't wanna risk it. I see you build cards so it'll be wee buns for you!
I've never worked on a 4000 before but it sounds straight forward enough. Let me do a little homework on exactly what is required and I'll get back to you.
@@CRG it's an A4000T. Matze from Amibay has made the active terminators. Unfortunately most of the information is in German on the A1k forum.
@@KarlHamiltonYeah I found the thread on A1K. Looks simple enough, you'd need six of the boards and the components associated with them but I'm happy to do it for you. Probably best to move to e-mail (casualretrogamer@outlook.com) or feel free to jump on my discord (link in video description)
no wonder its broke putting Amiga Workbench into it. Would have given it a brain anurism, like putting petrol into a steam engine lol.
I was wondering if anyone would notice the Amiga disk 😅
Jam in a new inductor. New ones are tiny and only cost a couple bucks.
wasn't that what you called an inductor a resister
It's identified on the board by L# (can't remember the number) but L typically means inductor.
Boost looks a little like Sidekick.
It does but maybe just a little stripped back from that.
I have never seen a Rubycon go bad. Could they be fakes?
Very much doubt it, I don't think faking of Japanese caps was even a thing in the 1980s. Amstrad were budget but they were reputable, and typically contracted the big Japanese/Korean electronics companies to assemble stuff for them.
And I doubt a fake cap would be old enough to drop its guts to that degree!
Yeah as said above I would doubt its fake. Most likely just a combination of age and the proximity to the heat sink adjacent which stressed the cap causing it to fail.
T4 is the DMA / PIT / PIC IC
Thanks for the info
OOh, the crystals are held down with chinese semen.
I can only hope not but I'm not testing it so will have to take you at your word
Will it run Win 11 and Office 365 2024? 😅
Just as well as it runs Crysis 😉
@@CRG 😀
@@CRG Brilliant Channel by the way and your thought process.
I miss the old days, as I used to repair these types of computers and equipment, not far from Microsoft in Reading Uk
Thanks
@@CRG ps - You can adjust the Focus / Brightness / Purity and Geometrics
I have a very expensive tube booster here that rejuvenates tubes.
Old Monitors are the best as everything is adjustable, even the focus