Viper V2 PRO is TEARING our Community APART!
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- Опубліковано 23 сер 2024
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👇 PULL IT DOWN FOR THE GOOD STUFF 👇
FINALLY able to release the full review for the Viper V2 Pro. This has been leaked everywhere but we finally have a 'Superlight' treatment for the Razer Viper Ultimate that includes reduced weight, new optical switches, sensor upgrades, and some more prominent side buttons - but comes at a cost. Both to features and to your wallet.
✅GET THE VIPER V2 PRO (affiliate links):
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Amazon UK - COMING SOON
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Amazon UK - amzn.to/2YXSVIY
Best Buy US - bestbuy.7tiv.n...
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Tysm for the shoutout! Coolest thing that has happened since starting fresh reviews! Impeccable review as always. Camera work, lighting and editing just insane and the tennis ball segment had me lmao 🙌🏽
Happy to do it brother. Keep up that super solid work 💪🏼
@iTsNick ty!!!
Well deserved shoutout bro
Hi there fresh :), you were right, after more time and swapping out wireless and wired, you cant feel wireless, it must of been work related arm stress due to the job i did at that time.
So glad love your vids have been wathing on multiple accounts
This video is fresh so just let me say you're killing it Brian! Keep doing you, we're here for it!
Appreciate you man!
Really solid review, and good call on the dock not being as relevant for those of us with keyboard's wired with USB-C. I've LOVED the dock but as i've swapped more toward the orochi, it kinda just sits there. Absolutely right on the price call, but then again people do be paying for final mouse.
Yeah I’ll stick to my ultimate the weight isn’t an issue to me and I love the dock! Great review as always!
Thanks!
Same here. VPU is better imo.
@@victorvallecano9952 In what what? Everything about this mouse is better
@@disrespect3 Viper ultamite has 2 more buttons on the side, rgb, and wireless charging for the same price it comes with the dock and the pro doesn't,
I'll keep my Viper ultamite too
The dock on my Basilsk Ultimate is one of the primary reasons I stick with this mouse. I hate cables so the dock is a blessing. Love the straight forward info drop.
i mean for most ppl, a magnetic cable is convernient enough if not even easier than to dock the thing.
@@EnnTomi1 facts!!! I keep forgetting that’s a thing now
also synapse fucks up the docks lighting repeatidly
Awesome to see that shoutout of Haus and Fresh, two great dudes who know their stuff!
Gotta pass the torch with the mouse reviews. Those two and Boardzy got it on lock.
@@badseedtech Hardware Unplugged also for more hands on impressions!
Best part of this release for me is that it'll lower the price of the old viper. $150 is just such a hard sell for me on mice.
yea it's insane you can buy the viper ultimate with dock for $80 right now.
It’s the same price as gpx??
@@guy5140 It was but now you can usually find it on sale
@@guy5140 people complain about the $150 price tag yet forget what the price of the gpx is/was.
@@crispyexcal204 yup and it's not usb-c, viper v2 pro is for sure an upgrade.
like the honesty. after using the viper ult vs some lighter mice i really wanted a ligher viper, but now i almost main the XM1RGB and i really wanna try the XM2W way more then this
I think they will have the same 3395 sensor. XM2W is the only mouse that has my interest (might be too big tough) until an Orochi V2 Pro.
@@Frencho9 new orochi with sub 55gr please
Agree love the VU but prefer below 70 typically however really enjoy the symm 2 and its 75 i think but basically a viper mini.
@@mantapdjiwa9768 Optical V3 switches and Focus Pro sensor for Motion Sync and glass surface tracking would be killer for a portable mouse like the Orochi V2. I don't think they can cut weight that much with the swappable AA/AAA battery design it has, maybe honeycomb the base of the mouse where the stickers go and the inner black shell where the batteries fit and you can go down from 65-66g to 59-60g with an AAA battery. I don't want them to compromise much on build quality nor remove the AA/AAA battery system ( usb type C+ internal rechargeable battery won't be lighter IMHOthan my 7g 750mha Pale blue AAA battery (rechargeable) or an 8g tenevolt. Worst case you remove the AA slot and just leave a centered AAA slot to shes even more weight.
That professional fumble.. So great. Thanks for including it. As a lefty, the move away from ambi mice is killing me. It doesn't look like I'll ever find anything to compete with my Roccat Kova. I like having 6 side buttons and the lefty Naga is a really awkward shape for me to lift off with. I love what Logitech did with the modular buttons on the g903 but having the extra 2 buttons on the Kova is really nice.
conclusion part is where i remembered why i followed you since you were 30k on subs, mad respect.
Appreciate that!
Dedicated studio space?! Let's go! Keep up the great work brother.
Nice to shout out other creators. Your review was top notch. One of the few that mentioned the storage of the dongle.
I have the Viper Ultimate with the v2 switches and superglide glass mouse feet. Between how good it performs, its light weight, and awesome coating, I have no need for anything else. I was originally considering the G303 Shroud that Badseed uses before I got the Viper Ultimate but that design is a pretty polarizing one.
where did you get the v2 switches
Which mousepad do you use?
Congrats for new studio, and thanks for the crisp review as always. 🙌🔥
you put a ton of work into your videos and it shows... probably the nicest and most creative photography out of all the tech channels... wish you make more videos...
MY glorious model D has held up perfectly.
I agree, I dont believe the upgrade is worth the price, ill stick with my viper ultimate with superglides tbh. Sad that it took Razer so long after superlight came out to respond with competition. BANGER review though.
Had to be supply chain issues. Feel like we’ve been waiting for awhile
@@badseedtech I was about to get a superlight, should i buy this instead
@@finnweldon6423 superlight is sightly cheaper and does basically the same thing, cant really go wrong with either
@@LoafedLife thankd
Love Viper Ultimate I bought 2 years ago. Only thing that wore off is the left side grip has a smooth spot where my thumb usually sits. The grip in itself is great, because it stays clean and feels good.
I tried looking for replacements but couldn't find any, sadly.
I have it on sale right now in my store. Would you say its worth the buy for 70 dollars, compared to the gpro superlight, I like the side grips due to my hands getting sweaty so I think I would like the razer version, but what do you think? I cant decide wether to get the cheaper viper ult, or the expensive superlight- I want to make the right option.
@@cookies3294
Short version: If you don't mind either a blank smooth spot after 2 years of 12+ hours daily use, trying your hand at DIY rubber pads or replacing it with another mouse then 70$ is a good price for the wireless version in my opinion. Never tried the gpro. Go for the one that has the best fit and weight for your hand. (Viper has a V2 without rubber at a similar price)
Long version: I can only help you as much as saying that I still use it since July, 8th 2020 for 12+ hours a day. The rubber on my thumb side is completly smooth at the spot my thumb rests.
For me that isn't such a big issue. I got used to it and don't notice it as much but I don't have sweaty hands and live in a cooler environment.
If I buy a new mouse I will probably buy the V2 and buy some extra rubber pads that can be easily replaced. I also tried the Razer Viper mini that has no pads and liked it quite a lot. (actually hoping for a wireless version for that one)
Hope it helps
The weight of the Viper Ultimate is good for me as I find anything lighter than that a bit too light for the shape. My model seems to have a good feeling albeit lightweight click on the main mouse buttons and the thumb buttons are high enough for my tastes (anything is better than the original Intellimouse Explorer 3.0 where the back thumb button sinks into the body) and feel crisp. I find I use the dock as a set it and forget it kinda thing where when I'm ready to use it I can pick it up and switch it on.
Maybe I'll get the V2 Pro when it's on sale for around $100. The G303 Shroud can be had (for right now) $120 at Best Buy and I may give it a try. So far I've been daily driving the Orochi v2 and Glorious Model D Minus Wireless with the Viper Ultimate coming in when the D minus is charging and I want something larger than the orochi (which isn't all that often). Maybe I should lay off trying out new mice and keyboards...
On the dongle subject, I might add that the fact that you can't store it is also a bad point for people that move a lot with a laptop for example. You don't always want to leave it, it can damage the USB port, or the dongle, or both and that's a costly repair.
That's part of the reason why I went with the Aerox 3 : it had bluetooth so I just use it instead of connecting a dongle when I need a mouse on my laptop to browse through photos, edit in lightroom, that kind of stuff and when I'm back home, I just have to flick a switch and it's back to gaming time on a desktop.
You can't do that with either the Superlight or the v2 Pro, that's unfortunate for mice that pricey
On the sensor section : I've played in Overwatch competitions for a few years (retired now), but I honestly couldn't tell the difference between a 3335 or 3389 sensor. Almost every sensor is good for very competitive use nowdays, it's not because it's not at the top of the sensor foodchain that it's bad. I've even used an old Rival 100 with a crappy, old optical sensor in it and it was still decent and had no real issues tracking my aim. Don't get hung up on sensor model, watch the firmware instead, disasters like the Cooler Master MM 731 can still happen (hopefull fixed by now)
Haha that Cooler Master mouse was EXACTLY what I was referring to on that bit.
That is kinda shit not having BT on the flagships - I love that on the DA V2
@@badseedtech I don't know if there is a real world reason why the bluetooth isn't there? I don't know some kinf of BS argument like "the Micro USB is a couple grames lighter than the USB-C port".
I mean a little BT reciever wouldn't add that much weight, would it?
I’m so glad they finally added USB C, but man I wish they would’ve added a top DPI button
Its tough I’ve thought about switching to a “higher end” mouse for a while but the price is hard. After riding out the model O- til the model O wireless cane out and still using that with no real issues. Its tough to spend double the cost not knowing if I’ll even like it.
g pro x is super safe, i have viper ultimate and orochi but always go back to that. i have a endgame xm2w preordered too and will definitely get the viper v2pro
@@shizukulover thanks for the input! And yeah i know they’re well loved mice but everyone has preferences so id just hate to spend it and end up going back to my model o.
@@coryford7440 I also have GPX, G303 and Fnatic Bolt recently, and I think I loved my Viper more than all of those, if not for some things... they actually fixed all (!) in the V2 (right side buttons, grip, thumb button position and weight).
I think I can finally say I'll have a mouse I can safely main for years.
We are all STILL waiting for that viper mini ultimate.
My small right hand agrees to this.
I recently brought a razer viper v2 pro i love it but the funny thing is I had a razer death adder 2013 for 9 years and going from 300 grams to 58 was a little hard for me at first but i put the grips on and it was amazing
Aerox 3 user here, where I disabled all lighting to preserve battery life : it keeps going for about 2 weeks (+/- 3 days depending on how much I use the mouse) with about 5 hours of daily use (around 10hrs on weekends, browsing or gaming), so around 80/90 hours of battery life on average. Keep in mind that the sensor is a PWM 3335 variant (low powered sensor) and that the battery is bigger, and the mouse heavier compared to both the Superlight and the Viper v2 Pro.
Battery life with RGB on is also considerably lower, instead of recharging every 2 weeks, it's down to 1 week/ 1 week and a half depending on the daily usage.
Here ya go for battery comparisons
(I don't own any Roccat wireless mouse)
Good to see the jump to USB-C. Nothing's more frustrating than a 150 dollar peripheral with a dingy micro usb port from 2011 (cough cough Logitech)
Yo nice as always Brian. You're always refreshing and easy on the eyes. Thanks for a great review man. Cheers.
0:23 "lol wtf" 😂
I went from a model o wireless to the V2 pro, and it was the best choice I've ever made
does the shape suit you better on the V2? I'm assuming why you prefer it more significantly. I'm deciding between the two as well as the g pro x
I was doing great with the glorious model O wireless, but here I am 7 months later and the scroll wheel is toast
Great review ❤ Got answers to all of my questions
Big boy BadSeed back with a rodent review! Great review as always, thanks for the shoutout!
You know I had to come out of mouse retirement for this one. Keep killing it out there man!
An USA youtuber giving a shoutout to a Finnish youtuber, ok it's offcial guys Suomi is joining NATO! Lots of headshots incoming! (If Saana's killer looks were enough!)
Originally was really excited for this mouse but I have the wireless naga too, I share the charging dock between the 2 mice whichever one isn't in use goes on the dock. So honestly not supporting the dock is a literal deal breaker for me as its just really convenient
Why two mice? Maybe on a per game basis?
Plugging into USB C cable overnight once a week isn't even a rational consideration. At all.
Just ordered this on amazon to try it out but have a feeling I will eventually return it and go back to my trusted 30 dollar viper mini. Can't beat that mouse.
may i ask how is it?
I think the tennis ball is to let u know “ our mouse is lighter than a tennis ball. Or maybe not lolol
Ive bought the viper v2 pro (white) as a second setup mouse. I have the Viper Ultimate as well and I have to say the difference is minimal. Tho the v2 pro does have a benefit on its weight (and you do notice when playing a lot of high paced quick flick shooters) I still wouldn't recommend to upgrade when you already have an ultimate, the build quality on the ultimate just seems a lot more solid. For some players tho, it might be nice to customize the rubber grips on their own, compared to the build in rubber grips for the Viper Ultimate.
Where I live the ultimate cost the same as the viper v2 pro. Would you recommend the viper v2 pro or the viper ultimate for the same price?
Did you notice a shape change? I maimed the viper ultimate for 7 months and noticed a difference in the curvature and the width of the v2 pro flares
Notification gang.
Loved the RVU and definitely gonna love this one aswell. Lesgooo
Yeah, staying on ultimate. Thank you for at good review as always !! Hate the buttons on right side thou.
I usually skip or get super annoyed at the sponsor plugs in videos these days but the way you do it is top class. Great content!
Thanks!
It’s so beautiful 😭
Just like Brian
Aw shucks
Great review. I feel like the loss of the dock is a non issue anyway, 90% of the time my viper doesn’t even get good enough contact with the dock for charging and it’s easy enough to plug in and charge the mouse.
Definitely not the first time I’ve heard that about the dock lately. I think I just went through a phase where I wanted ALL the things on my desk and now its really minimal
Yeah but what makes viper ultimate is unique is because of the dock xd
@@THEpro1ST no, it's more of a gimmick than an actual useful feature for most people.
For anyone reading, the fix was cleaning it with rubbing alcohol
love the very objective review and objective, neutral recommendation.
I bought this mouse today after months of using Viper Mini, and i can say i'm very happy!
It's perfectly fit my hands ( Medium size )
I have bought before Razer Deathadder v3 pro but it's so big and i didn't like the handle so i return it.
People with who like razer mini, i will recommend for you this mouse
This is by far the most precise, lightest, and most comfortable gaming esports FPS mouse, period! Just loving it!!!
Thanks for the alternate recommendations before going to play the big bucks. I feel like other reviewers just say buy it or don’t buy it.
Good to see somebody appreciates that. Its tough for me to review a product as if the rest of the market doesn’t exist.
I always watch your review for an honest one!
EDIT: Got the V2 and you are absolutely right that the lighter shell makes it a bit louder. My right click noticeably louder .
Very solid review, thank you, and ABSOLITELY AGREE about the price/cost - utter BS.
Been rocking the orochi v2 and I've loved it especially for the price point and that it's small for my little girl hands.
Not gonna drop over $100 on a mouse especially when the performance compared to the price is so miniscule for us commonwealth players.
150 is a tough price to pay but that lower weight and usb charging is a must for me, so i think ill sell my ultimate and get this one
Me waiting for the mini version:
"Sorry you're still waiting" 👁👄👁
Great review! Does the new texture feel like the Orochi V2's texture? Also, I'm curious why you think the other brands will outlast the Glorious in terms of longevity. So glad you're able to be posting videos again regularly!
Thanks! And yeah, similar to Orochi but slightly more textured - feels really good. And the Glorious comment just comes from so many people reaching out to express that they felt their mice deteriorated over the course of 6-12 months. I’m currently long-term testing a retail unit to see if I have any issues.
@@badseedtech Thanks for the reply man, really appreciate it
I bought the Viper Ultimate some time ago for 80 bucks and it's a very good mice, only downside is the sticky surface on the dock wears out extremely fast, mine bearly sticks anymore without having it moving around at all.
You tried cleaning the bottom silicon ring with just water?
@@badseedtech that's it. a good clean with a moist/damp cloth fixes that.
Clean it with warm water very gently (you can add just a bit of soapy water if you want but not required, don't use any other cleaning product). It's a very soft and extremely flat rubber that adheres to stuff and not an adhesive so it doesnt really wear out, it just gathers dust (or gets damaged/loses its flatness) and stops adhering to surfaces. Clean it carefully and gently and it will feel like new again. Clean the surfaces where you will be "sticking" it before actually placing it down.
Geat review as always! Have you taken a look at the roccat kone xp? Very few reviews out there for it
i love the feel of razers switches, but can’t stand any of their mice except for the viper/mini due to shape and weight so this is perfect for me! and i love the loud clicks.
Dude. I use the Viper Ultimate. Love it. However, since I bought it (less than a year ago) it has lost the rubber on the left side. More and more kept coming off until I decided to just take it off completely. Also I've taken off the back shell. More comfortable to use. It looks like a proper frankenstein now but I like it better this way. I've always HATED these sidebuttons and really never use them. Maybe time to pick up the bro, frankenstein it, and start using sidebuttons...
loved the review! Hope they release the viper mini wireless soon.
I love the shape of the viper ultimate but switched to the superlight because the difference in weight was very noticeable for me. For someone like me, this is an exciting mouse. I get my preferred shape at a lighter weight, better side buttons, better stock feet, and crispier switches. I didn't like the side grips of the viper ultimate so having the grips be optional was a plus for me. Worth the price? I thought the superlight was worth it, and I think the viper v2 pro is as well.
I rlly hate the big hump on the gpw x. Idk if the Razer viper v2 pro has a low hump if it does I might buy cause the big hump rlly rlly annoys me when I’m gaming.
@@frogidty Yes it's lower than the gpx superlight but you should definitely check out the shape of the viper before getting it
@@imKhokie ok
Waiting for that M42 wireless review, so dam keen!
the weight of my viper ultimate never bothers me cause I simply put up my dpi to 1400 so the weight isn't slowing me down at all
This review convinced me to sub. Such a informative review. I think I’ll get this for the usb c and the side buttons. But usb c is probably the biggest thing for me
I love your style, production and dammit your charm so much I would watch you revue a spatula, then buy which ever one you recommend! And my current one is getting a little old..
you didn't mention some of the feature they did add with this versus the ultimate, I think motion sync is a pretty big upgrade and I doubt any top tier mouse to come out from this point on won't have it. Not to mention you can get the hyperpolling dongle to get 4k polling rates which does make a big noticeable difference from the regular viper ultimate and even the super light x
1-2ms lower latency with the dongle is now considered a big noticable difference? I bet 99% of the people wouldnt notice a difference in a blind test
@@ThunderingRoar i never mentioned latency both of the features I mentioned are to do with polling rates, and a 4k polling rate vs 1k like on the p gpro is definitely noticeable
@@jaselee117 yeah and higher polling rate mainly affects latency?
@@ThunderingRoar no it doesn’t…. Polling rate is the frequency your mouse takes readings from the sensor, latency is the time it take to reach your computer both important but separate things
@@jaselee117 feel free to check out Optimum Tech's video on the 8k Hz razer mouse, the higher polling rate does reduce latency by pretty much exactly 0.875ms (1/1000 - 1/8000)
I generally agree with almost all your perspectives and reviews on products, but I was kind of surprised by your take on this mouse. But that's what I like about you, you just tell it like it is and don't sugar coat anything. Logi pulled the same stunt when they released their Superlight X (lighter, no RGB, outdated 20M Omrons, no more pure ambi mouse, etc.) and to this day, the price point STILL hovers around $129.99 to $159.99 (saw this at Best Buy at this price point) to this day! As for the Viper v2 Pro, I have a fingertip hybrid clawish type of grip and this mouse is a dream. Granted, it took me a while to get used to the shape in conjunction with its amazing 58 gram weight (no holes too!). Coming from a 71 gram XM1r, this thing feels like a feather. Overall, I really liked the mouse and yeah, the price point feels like a sucker punch but it's literally the same stunt Logitech pulled. At that point, it starts to feel like a Xbox vs. Sony or Logitech vs. Razer brand loyalty debate.
6:32 me being here because my MOWs sensor is going bad:
I was gonna buy it, but after watching your video I changed my mind. Sticking with my viper ultimate. Thanks mate.
Best of luck on the move!
i remember this used to be an audio channel, i remember when a bearded man promised the next video will be audio gear related, those promises never materialized
mystical bald bearded gymnasium man
Funny how they put a tennisball in there since it weights the same as the mouse :D
wow a nice shoutout to one of my top mouse reviewers. Hausgaming and FreshReviews!
amazing review, i wish it was sold in brazil at least, so we could try it aswell..
Was that GMK Dracula on the keyboard in the background of the sound test?
goddd i JUST bought a g303 shroud. i may have to go pick this up though
I miss going to frys, trying out all the new cool mice and then returning them untill u find the 1 that best suits you
I’m using a Steelseries prime wireless, I charge it once a week, never turn the light on.
Who cares about the light on this mouse, it’s finally right handed exclusively.
The problem wasn’t the side buttons, it was the symmetrical shape, horrible discomfort….I can’t believe I didn’t know about this launch, I’m buying one rn.
The mic boosting here might be misleading as to how loud to actually is. Used this mouse yesterday and it isn’t much louder than a viper mini
i wonder if that dude knows how awesome he is
Nice review as always
I’m only tempted to upgrade for that new clean white one ngl
How on earth is this video sooo good. DAMN
finaly no buttons on the right side! was a deal breaker for me
Really just want a Razer equivalent of the Aerox 3 wireless. Just stick Bluetooth and a dongle compartment on the Viper V2 pro, and you’ve got my sale.
Been rocking Pulsar Xlite V1 since release. I used this for countless of hours grinding and it's still A1. It's true that $150 is a bit too much but can't really blame them since people are willing to pay the price specially finalmouse shills.
What I want from Razer, is a lightweight version of the Naga Pro *SHAPE* without the additional button plates.
Great review! It’s a little old now having released last year but the Origin One X from Ninjutso is another solid wireless mouse around the $80 price range. Lightweight and USB C charging. I love that mouse
It looks like a great mouse but every pic or video I see the coating always looks oily and fingerprinted to all hell. Its tough for me to get past that.
We have the same issue with both the Viper and the GPW/GPX, these clicks just wobble, if not initially, soon after you start using it. It is bearable on the v2 pro though. On the VU I had to buy 6 units to get a good one, which was a mercury from the first batch they released.
that hollow click is prolly deadened by those additional grips you can add
This was honest and fair. Don't blame just Razer for the price, blame the competition and Razer for the price.
Been waiting for this!
It looks like a really awesome mouse, but I would rather get the XM1 wireless. It has better build quality imo and a better shape for me. I used the viper ultimate for 1 year, but switched off of it because the front just wasn't narrow enough and the button height is pretty high. I wish that Razer made some improvements to the shape to make it more comfortable, creating a shape like a smaller XM1 or slimmed down GPX.
no such thing as xm1 wireless it’s xm2w and we don’t know anything about the build quality since it hasn’t been reviewed yet
I wanted this about a year ago, but then the G303 dropped and yeah.... G303 gang. Maybe I'll wait for the mini.
No idea about that, but I'm looking forward for testing the Xtrfy M42 Wireless :)
This mouse looks really awesome, however I think my Starlight12 Small will still be nicer to me if I can get it in a working condition. The Viper Mini Ultimate however ohohoho 😭
Good Edit
Ad only in the end
Honest opininion
and a very nice beard
Crazy it’s $150 gonna wait till the holidays and get it a for a deal . I pick up my viper ultimate and don’t think I need a lighter mouse so not in a rush I bet it is a big difference when you have both of them side by side Forsure
I still have a Brand new Icemat Glass, if you remembe that brand before Steelseries ;).
0:22 - I watched another review that suggested the tennis ball was included because it is the same weight as the mouse (for comparison purposes).
Great review! Quick question: what's the keyboard and keycap set you've got featured in the background? See 2:48 for reference.
Thanks! That is the GrayStudio Space65 III board in ‘Darth Vadar’ and its wearing GMK Dracula keycaps with the Hi-Lite kit
@@badseedtech Dope! Thanks for the info!
If only they ever made this in a smaller form factor for us small handed users 😢
spot on review, 100% agree with all what you ve said. espicially the price, even glorious officially stated anything cost more than 120$ is just a pure scam since they know well enough how much is it to make a mouse.
personally, really wish there is more love towards ergo shape from big brand......(well only logitech and razer)
Nice review and comparison... I used previously the glorious D- and I loved it, except for the cable. I tried the wireless version but I had a doble clic issue, I returned. Next I tried the logitech superlight I didn't like the shape, and I hated the micro USB port...SO, WHICH WIRELESS MOUSE DO YOU RECOMMEND FOR SOMEONE WHO LOVED THE GLORIOUS D MINUS?
Pulsar Xlite V2 Mini.
@@garethg8226 it is out of stock everywhere
@@Games_and_Tech Hold out for it. It’s worth the wait.
@@garethg8226 I will
i would say go for the model D minus again if you loved that shape. you were probably just unlucky