Eggman's getaway train in Shadow's RT is only vulnerable on the sides. If you're shooting the back, it won't do damage. This is true across all difficulties.
I remember seeing a video about Sonic 3 and Knuckles' scoring system (by the guy who makes music theory videos on Sonic games) and it gave me some insight how the ranking system seen in the games featured in this video had its roots in there. Sonic 3's manual actually encouraged jotting your score for each zone down, and the way you get good scores in that game is similar to how you get good ranks in SA2 and Heroes, and to some extent Unleashed. Exploring the levels to find extra rings and whatnot, avoiding traps like springs that slow down your run, all the while maintaining a good pace and avoiding damage (which becomes more risky as the level goes on and becomes more difficult). The ranking system more or less made the checklist less mental, though I've seen complaints that they dislike when the game visibly scolds you for not performing as well as it likes you to. Though I feel like the saving grace for the ranking systems in most games is that its not necessarily required if all you want is to beat the game's main storyline, its a side activity you can tackle to get more out of the game. When good ranks take more effort to obtain its generally more rewarding than games that hand them out like candy ala Forces. Ofc the process has to be fun too but that should be obvious.
Okay but score based rank games have just been jotting off a checklist. It doesn't reward mastery otherwise speedrunners would get constant a ranks since they are the best at the games. When you see someone beat city escape in under a minute and get an E rank its insulting. There is nothing skillful about wasting time killing enemies for score and oftentimes slowing down for menial tasks and halting player flow just to get a better score. Unleashed score system works in both versions thanks to the concepts executed flawlessly like action chains and of course the enemy placement system and impeccable stage design.
@@dave9515 That depends on the game, too. Not all score based games have the same faults that Sonic games have. Some games just simply reward you a good/top rank for simply playing well enough. As for Sonic games, Unleashed without question has the best score based ranking system. It still has its minuscule flaws, but no where near as flawed as a game like Colors, imo.
Glad I came across this video, I like how you kept an open mind (or at least admitted when nostalgia or biar might come into play) and made an effort to explain what exactly was enjoyable and what not :)
While the score based ranking system is my favorite, I think there is a lot of fun that can be had with time based ranking system Lost World for example, I love Sonic Lost World for how fun it is to control and how it manages to encourage the player to explore the stages while having time based rankings, the levels are big, and what encourages the player to explore around those stages are the Red Rings, Animal Capsules and even numbered rings, which are usually in alternative sections, places you'll not normally go, using gimmicks to unlock or reach those Red Rings, it's really fun to go after them And then, S Ranking in another hand, it has a separate mode for it, like a Time Attack, and you rush as fast as possible to the end of the stage, and that ranking system is actually REALLY good for me, not only the times for the stages are super tight, forcing you to discover faster routes and learning how to use Sonic's moveset to the fullest, but you also have to learn how to master Sonic's moveset and the stages to begin with, you'll have to explore those stages to find WHICH route is the fastest, and the exploration goes into things such as the Red Rings and Animal Capsules I mentioned before, you explore those stages while going after those collectables, and during those runs you already might learn some routes for your speedrunning later, and Lost World has a really fun and satisfying moveset for you to use especially after you learn and master it It's a reason why I don't dislike Gens and Frontiers also having time based ranking systems as well, as much as I think Lost World does the best because it has more collectables (those being the animals), and really tight S rank times in Gens, it's still fun since you still have a lot of routes and Red Rings hidden throughout the stages, which make you explore them, but the ranking system in Gens has times so forgiving that it's not as fun to become better and faster in those stages (although I still do because even if I'll not get rewarded with an S Rank, it still is fun to get faster on the stage on my own) And in Frontiers, while the times are not as forgiving as Gens, it still is quite forgiving, and the levels are more straightlined than Gens too, especially since most of the times the Red Rings are hidden throughout the main routes for some reason unlike all the other games where they are in alternative routes, and both Extreme Mode and The Final Horizon help the game's case a bit Extreme Mode made the times tighter, less forgiving And the Final Horizon open up some of the stages and give other objectives to encourage the player to explore, with the Moon Rings, Numbered Rings, Animal Rescue and Secret Goal exit
Itd be good if they had a score based ranking system, as well as a bronze/silver/gold medal for time. (Speaking of, I really recommend the trackmania series, id recommend nations forever, which is the demo for united forever, but its real long, i havent checked out the free2play one)
I mean in Generations you had the doppelganger race which is basically just a time trial with much tighter S rank times compared to the base levels. You also had online leaderboards for fastest times.
I wasn't aware Unleashed HAD DLC until people in my chat pointed out some Frontiers stages were based on it. Too be fair, I played the Wii version, which didn't have any. But if I'd had the PS3 version I probably would've liked the DLC levels. I agree with most of what you say about ranking systems, and it does kinda suck that it's only time-based. It also means you generally need separate runs of the level for Red Rings and Rank, I guess you can self-imposed challenge yourself to do both at once but that's not a substitute for a better system. Sonic Colors' ranking system still bothers me because they put too much focus on score over time, to the point where stalling with Wisp powers was sometimes required, which feels very "un-Sonic" to me.
About Frontiers, I recently found out that one of the Cyberspace levels takes a part of Sky Sanctuary Act 1 from Generations. It's one of the levels from the desert area
@@Hyp3rSonic A lot of the Frontiers stages are based on either Generations or Unleashed. I didn't notice much since I hadn't played those games in a long time.
11:09 I love this. This is the Sonic equivalent of that one scene in Breaking Bad: Mike: "Ask her if she's still there" Chow, in Mandarin: "Peng, are you still there?" Peng, in Mandarin: "Of course I'm still here! Where else can I go?! What is going on?! I have a husband and kid at home, I have to go home and take care of them! You do not pay me enough, somebody got killed right in front of me!" Chow: pauses Chow, in English: "She says yes"
Both systems can work. Gens & Frontiers were too easy but overcame that by bein fun. SA2 had u doin stupid shit like exploits to stall so it's more fun to ignore entirely. They're far on both ends.
I mean I feel like that’s the point of collectibles scattered throughout the stage. To encourage the player to explore the alternate routes. Making the rank tied to time imo is the most engaging ranking system. Making it score based makes it tedious on subsequent retries because of all the extra stuff you have to do each time as you attempt to get the highest rank. I feel like it’s just doing stuff for the sake of doing stuff since it’s not naturally something the player does in their casual playthrough. On top of this, I just think it’s the most natural thing to base your rank off of. I mean it is *Sonic* after all. He’s known for going fast. So base your challenge off of him going fast. It’s the most intuitive way to go about it, imo. Really though, just have both, among other ways of challenging the player. I mean the backbone of Sonic is the replayability, imo. There’s no reason to choose one or the other, if I were a game designer.
10:45 I always thought expert mode in Shadow The Hedgehog was training for G.U.N, because shadow works for G.U.N. after the events of the game (we see this in 06)
i knew 06 was jank but having climbing properties dictated by the object instead of the character is such a weird way of doing it. not daying it's bad since many games have walls and floors with unique properties but for a climbing character it'd make sense for any detection to check for a no climbing property verses every single wall in their designated area for it. that's not even the game being rushed it's straight bad programming.
i highly agree that score should return...however.. cyberspace 1-2 is as popular as it is because it is one of the very few instances where the player is challenged for the S rank, and i think the level is fun because of that hell even the extreme difficulty in frontiers makes every S rank time strict as possible and i think going for the S rank that way is just as fun as pulling off stylish moves funny enough, you showed footage from the final horizon stages for stages where "the S rank is tied to getting a progression item", but the ranks don't even matter in final horizon, they're just there i simply dont use homing dash or the spindash in frontiers because its far more fun to just engage with the level design and find more creative ways to reach the goal than just using a fly button, i think that would help you see how much more fun they can be when you remove the overpowered elements
It actually didn't take me too long to get the S-Rank on 1-2. If I remember, it probably took me at least 1 hour, but this was almost 2 years ago(I got the game on Christmas 2022) Btw, im not trying to brag. Anyways, it's definitely one of my favorite Sonic levels in general
That's why I said the time based structure does have its moments, but unfortunately levels like 1-2 are the exception and not the rule, so at this point in time I still think the score based stuff is more engaging. 1-2 is pretty cool though, probably my favorite level in that game
@@sauce987654321I just like speedrunning in general. For example, I do it for rayman Legends, Persona games, rayman origins, Rayman 3 HD, Crash 1 Remake, Celeste, Alien Hominid HD, Tales of Arise, Super Bomberman R and Bomberman Act Zero, Genshin Impact, and other games. Also, Rocket Knight! (The xbox 360 game) Also, I rarely ever do full game speedruns. I usually play a specific level or section(of an area) For Genshin Impact, I only speedrun the Test Runs. For Tales of Arise, I usually speedran specific bosses or modes like Arena For Persona 3 Reload, Persona 5 Tactica and Persona 5 Strikers, I usually speedrun specific battles, bosses or sections. (The levels are called Missions/Quests in Tactica) Finally, I did actually speedrun Danganronpa 1 and 2 before. Of course, I only did specific parts of the game.
A fun fact about the Night DLC stages in Unleashed is that a bunch of them are based on unused sections of the main levels. Dragon Road's DLC for example starts in a normally inaccessible area at the end of the main act. We know these areas were meant to be part of the main stages at some point thanks to the few Unleashed prototypes that we have access to. Why these parts of the levels were scrapped, I have no idea. Too long, maybe?
ChaosX mentioned in his roadmap for Project 06's final release that we would be getting the Very Hard DLC stages. I look forward to seeing how people's opinions on those stages change.
Thanks for this, nice conclusion at the end! Yeah, Sonic games are very hand holding these days because they amount mostly to automation and not enough level design that encourages the player to gain speed, especially with the boost games. I would like 3d Sonic to utilise more what the classics did, but build on it with Sonic's modern moveset. Also, there's Rise of Lyric extreme mode. I know it's not a Sonic game, but I don't see anyone talk about it, not even the wiki, so I wonder what it does. What's the hardest Sonic game you've played?
To add context to Shadow's radical highway train damage issue. I think you have to hit the actual front car to damage it. I've recently replayed that level and lost because the train got away. I never had that issue as a kid but i noticed i was only shooting the back. Once i had bullets hit the side, it died quickly. Still janky though.
Super great vid on an aspect of Sonic games no one really talks about nowadays Also I can’t believe he didn’t include the not at all lazy frontiers extreme mode 😢
The Difficulty mindset really reminds me when I finally clicked with Payday 2 Death Sentence One Down difficulty. I haven't played in a while but I am somewhat certain I probably still got it, even if my muscle memory is more atuned to RAID:World War 2's "Tank and heal from pickups" compared to Payday 2's "cautiously and tactically assess your situation, if you are a shot away from death in DSOD, place a FAK and become a bit more bold in killing enemies so that in either respect you heal" It helps that the game has some amazing ish skills with an admitedly bad balance but melee skills that complement reloading are life savers. It's why I have grown an appreciation to games like that. DSOD is not a FAIR difficulty by any stretch, but is doable and has quite the strategy and gameplan involved, not to mention that build making is how you respond to problems, those problems being either common heavy enemy types that are abundant and need minimum focus and time to dispatch, shield killing which can either be armor piercing or grenade launchers as they also compliment crowd control or knockback skills and Bulldozer kill strategies which either involve a rocket launcher a DPS check or even more curious enough sawing their faces with Overkill skill.
@@Knuxfan24 they are, that's why thier size is only a couple of Kb, with all of them having the size of 1,7 Mb while Unleashed single level packs are hundreds of Mb.
I see frontiers combat as its own thing, comparing it to others i think is kinda not gett8ng the point with it. I kinda see it as an enhanced version of spamming the homing attack to enemies, tho uh i do wish the hard mode was like hard hard
Came here to say this. I think it does enough to change the level design and aesthetics to be engaging, but the ranking system is too easy. I would put SLW3DS hard mode above 06, Heroes and Shadow's at the very least
I actually havent played Lost World 3DS so I didnt know it had a hard mode. I did some research before starting the video just in case I missed something but I guess it didnt help lmao
Hard disagree, Expert Mode is cool but because of the streamlined structure it locks out a lot of the alternate paths and some of the cool quirks of each level, so a lot ends up lost in translation. Not to mention it would destroy the foundation of what the game is and how the narrative works if the game was just expert mode
@@seematahir5970 issue is that to complete the game you have to beat Westopolis at least 10 times. Now I understand the idea that it's supposed to reinforce replayability while you simultaneously chasing the carrot kinda like how Star Fox 64 had that, except it was a skill check which would then reflect on whether you got the score for a medal in a planet however, unlike 64, a game over didn't boot you back to the roots begining, it'd merely kick you to thr continue screen to pick to the start of the level rather than the last checkpoint. It's admittedly how I beat the game as a kid over heroes (yeah I was that bad that I'd get stuck on Act 2 of levels, which I always dreaded because I knew a slip up would send me back to the tedious walk in the park).
@@artyom2801 that's a fair point to make but that jus needs a tweak to not force a whole ten replays of that level rather than upendin the whole system
@@nightlydata2181 that or make the A ranking harder as noted by other people that A ranking in some of the Shadow The Hedgehog stages and missions are a walk in the park because of the scoring method.
on the topic of ranking systems, honestly sonic forces is the worst cause for whatever reason they implemented a daily log in bonus like it's a mobile game which acts as a score multiplier meaning the game literally gets easier the longer you play it continiously, when the ranks weren't even that difficult to begin with.
Hi man nice video but frontiers has difficulties easy normal hard and expert and in pretty sure forces has it too not entirely sure on forces but i know for a fact frontiers bas hard mode
Imo the standouts are Perfect Chaos and Egg Dragoon, PC gets a brand new 3D section halfway through the level and ED is just way more engaging of a fight with the staggered attack windows and faster recovery times. Silver and Shadow get some cool changes too but they're less notable, and then with the Classic bosses I hardly notice a difference, lol
@@seematahir5970 DER takes a few more hits and the timing window on the arm-screen-attack is shorter, Metal re-arranges his attack patterns to give him more invul, so you can't just cheese him in 3 quick hits.
So we're just gonna brush off 06 with an "06 standards" joke as if it doesn't have some of the most stellar level design in the whole franchise because we gotta feed the already absurdly overfed "06 bad haha" crowds, OK makes sense. Sonic creators would be a lot more enjoyable to watch if they all didn't deliver the classic Heroes, ShtH, 06, RoL, Colors, S4, Lost World and Forces jabs pretty much none of us enjoy. And for the train section you have to shoot the sides of the train in the Shadow Episode, Hard Mode and Very Hard Mode, it's literally the same in the entire game. In your footage you're targeting the rear, that does no damage.
As someone who adores 06, I think he was pretty fair about it. He acknowledged what he liked and gave the levels he thought were good their flowers. But with a game like 06 it's hard to blame players for struggling, and he explained his issues beyond just "hurr durr game bad".
@@seematahir5970 The jabs were many and unnecessary. The critique of the Very Hard DLC was fair (which is why, you might notice, I never brought that into question to begin with).
The unleashed dlc is basically hard mode if it had a hard mode
Eggman's getaway train in Shadow's RT is only vulnerable on the sides. If you're shooting the back, it won't do damage. This is true across all difficulties.
THIS 👍
The lag in Wave Ocean is caused by the breaking bridges, physics calculations in general are rather taxing for '06.
I remember seeing a video about Sonic 3 and Knuckles' scoring system (by the guy who makes music theory videos on Sonic games) and it gave me some insight how the ranking system seen in the games featured in this video had its roots in there. Sonic 3's manual actually encouraged jotting your score for each zone down, and the way you get good scores in that game is similar to how you get good ranks in SA2 and Heroes, and to some extent Unleashed. Exploring the levels to find extra rings and whatnot, avoiding traps like springs that slow down your run, all the while maintaining a good pace and avoiding damage (which becomes more risky as the level goes on and becomes more difficult).
The ranking system more or less made the checklist less mental, though I've seen complaints that they dislike when the game visibly scolds you for not performing as well as it likes you to. Though I feel like the saving grace for the ranking systems in most games is that its not necessarily required if all you want is to beat the game's main storyline, its a side activity you can tackle to get more out of the game. When good ranks take more effort to obtain its generally more rewarding than games that hand them out like candy ala Forces. Ofc the process has to be fun too but that should be obvious.
Okay but score based rank games have just been jotting off a checklist. It doesn't reward mastery otherwise speedrunners would get constant a ranks since they are the best at the games. When you see someone beat city escape in under a minute and get an E rank its insulting. There is nothing skillful about wasting time killing enemies for score and oftentimes slowing down for menial tasks and halting player flow just to get a better score. Unleashed score system works in both versions thanks to the concepts executed flawlessly like action chains and of course the enemy placement system and impeccable stage design.
@@dave9515 That depends on the game, too. Not all score based games have the same faults that Sonic games have. Some games just simply reward you a good/top rank for simply playing well enough.
As for Sonic games, Unleashed without question has the best score based ranking system. It still has its minuscule flaws, but no where near as flawed as a game like Colors, imo.
0:07 I relate so much. I died so many times in the tutorial section of mario galaxy, and for other mario games I used to ask for help to my mom
I have bad news but, you missed Lost World 3DS.
Twas a great video regardless
Someone else pointed that out the second I posted it lmao. I never played the 3DS version of Lost World so I must have just missed it 😭
Glad I came across this video, I like how you kept an open mind (or at least admitted when nostalgia or biar might come into play) and made an effort to explain what exactly was enjoyable and what not :)
While the score based ranking system is my favorite, I think there is a lot of fun that can be had with time based ranking system
Lost World for example, I love Sonic Lost World for how fun it is to control and how it manages to encourage the player to explore the stages while having time based rankings, the levels are big, and what encourages the player to explore around those stages are the Red Rings, Animal Capsules and even numbered rings, which are usually in alternative sections, places you'll not normally go, using gimmicks to unlock or reach those Red Rings, it's really fun to go after them
And then, S Ranking in another hand, it has a separate mode for it, like a Time Attack, and you rush as fast as possible to the end of the stage, and that ranking system is actually REALLY good for me, not only the times for the stages are super tight, forcing you to discover faster routes and learning how to use Sonic's moveset to the fullest, but you also have to learn how to master Sonic's moveset and the stages to begin with, you'll have to explore those stages to find WHICH route is the fastest, and the exploration goes into things such as the Red Rings and Animal Capsules I mentioned before, you explore those stages while going after those collectables, and during those runs you already might learn some routes for your speedrunning later, and Lost World has a really fun and satisfying moveset for you to use especially after you learn and master it
It's a reason why I don't dislike Gens and Frontiers also having time based ranking systems as well, as much as I think Lost World does the best because it has more collectables (those being the animals), and really tight S rank times
in Gens, it's still fun since you still have a lot of routes and Red Rings hidden throughout the stages, which make you explore them, but the ranking system in Gens has times so forgiving that it's not as fun to become better and faster in those stages (although I still do because even if I'll not get rewarded with an S Rank, it still is fun to get faster on the stage on my own)
And in Frontiers, while the times are not as forgiving as Gens, it still is quite forgiving, and the levels are more straightlined than Gens too, especially since most of the times the Red Rings are hidden throughout the main routes for some reason unlike all the other games where they are in alternative routes, and both Extreme Mode and The Final Horizon help the game's case a bit
Extreme Mode made the times tighter, less forgiving
And the Final Horizon open up some of the stages and give other objectives to encourage the player to explore, with the Moon Rings, Numbered Rings, Animal Rescue and Secret Goal exit
Itd be good if they had a score based ranking system, as well as a bronze/silver/gold medal for time.
(Speaking of, I really recommend the trackmania series, id recommend nations forever, which is the demo for united forever, but its real long, i havent checked out the free2play one)
I mean in Generations you had the doppelganger race which is basically just a time trial with much tighter S rank times compared to the base levels. You also had online leaderboards for fastest times.
Make both the time attack mode and the score attack mode good 👍
I wasn't aware Unleashed HAD DLC until people in my chat pointed out some Frontiers stages were based on it. Too be fair, I played the Wii version, which didn't have any. But if I'd had the PS3 version I probably would've liked the DLC levels.
I agree with most of what you say about ranking systems, and it does kinda suck that it's only time-based. It also means you generally need separate runs of the level for Red Rings and Rank, I guess you can self-imposed challenge yourself to do both at once but that's not a substitute for a better system. Sonic Colors' ranking system still bothers me because they put too much focus on score over time, to the point where stalling with Wisp powers was sometimes required, which feels very "un-Sonic" to me.
About Frontiers, I recently found out that one of the Cyberspace levels takes a part of Sky Sanctuary Act 1 from Generations.
It's one of the levels from the desert area
@@Hyp3rSonic A lot of the Frontiers stages are based on either Generations or Unleashed. I didn't notice much since I hadn't played those games in a long time.
@@BigKlingyWAIT!!! I think the level is 2-7!!!
11:09 I love this. This is the Sonic equivalent of that one scene in Breaking Bad:
Mike: "Ask her if she's still there"
Chow, in Mandarin: "Peng, are you still there?"
Peng, in Mandarin: "Of course I'm still here! Where else can I go?! What is going on?! I have a husband and kid at home, I have to go home and take care of them! You do not pay me enough, somebody got killed right in front of me!"
Chow: pauses
Chow, in English: "She says yes"
Both systems can work. Gens & Frontiers were too easy but overcame that by bein fun. SA2 had u doin stupid shit like exploits to stall so it's more fun to ignore entirely. They're far on both ends.
I live on the third floor of my apartment. If you can get in through my window, you deserve to do whatever you want.
This video’s good but also you have the best pfp I’ve ever seen
I mean I feel like that’s the point of collectibles scattered throughout the stage. To encourage the player to explore the alternate routes. Making the rank tied to time imo is the most engaging ranking system. Making it score based makes it tedious on subsequent retries because of all the extra stuff you have to do each time as you attempt to get the highest rank. I feel like it’s just doing stuff for the sake of doing stuff since it’s not naturally something the player does in their casual playthrough.
On top of this, I just think it’s the most natural thing to base your rank off of. I mean it is *Sonic* after all. He’s known for going fast. So base your challenge off of him going fast. It’s the most intuitive way to go about it, imo.
Really though, just have both, among other ways of challenging the player. I mean the backbone of Sonic is the replayability, imo. There’s no reason to choose one or the other, if I were a game designer.
10:45 I always thought expert mode in Shadow The Hedgehog was training for G.U.N, because shadow works for G.U.N. after the events of the game (we see this in 06)
Earned a new sub! Keep up the good work!
i knew 06 was jank but having climbing properties dictated by the object instead of the character is such a weird way of doing it.
not daying it's bad since many games have walls and floors with unique properties but for a climbing character it'd make sense for any detection to check for a no climbing property verses every single wall in their designated area for it.
that's not even the game being rushed it's straight bad programming.
Ay man I’m watching this at like 2am W video and W UA-cam for recommending me this channel
i highly agree that score should return...however..
cyberspace 1-2 is as popular as it is because it is one of the very few instances where the player is challenged for the S rank, and i think the level is fun because of that
hell even the extreme difficulty in frontiers makes every S rank time strict as possible and i think going for the S rank that way is just as fun as pulling off stylish moves
funny enough, you showed footage from the final horizon stages for stages where "the S rank is tied to getting a progression item", but the ranks don't even matter in final horizon, they're just there
i simply dont use homing dash or the spindash in frontiers because its far more fun to just engage with the level design and find more creative ways to reach the goal than just using a fly button, i think that would help you see how much more fun they can be when you remove the overpowered elements
It actually didn't take me too long to get the S-Rank on 1-2. If I remember, it probably took me at least 1 hour, but this was almost 2 years ago(I got the game on Christmas 2022)
Btw, im not trying to brag. Anyways, it's definitely one of my favorite Sonic levels in general
That's why I said the time based structure does have its moments, but unfortunately levels like 1-2 are the exception and not the rule, so at this point in time I still think the score based stuff is more engaging. 1-2 is pretty cool though, probably my favorite level in that game
@@Hyp3rSonicSince you’re so into the time trial/attack aspect of Sonic games, are there other games you like to do this in?
@@sauce987654321I just like speedrunning in general. For example, I do it for rayman Legends, Persona games, rayman origins, Rayman 3 HD, Crash 1 Remake, Celeste, Alien Hominid HD, Tales of Arise, Super Bomberman R and Bomberman Act Zero, Genshin Impact, and other games. Also, Rocket Knight! (The xbox 360 game)
Also, I rarely ever do full game speedruns. I usually play a specific level or section(of an area)
For Genshin Impact, I only speedrun the Test Runs.
For Tales of Arise, I usually speedran specific bosses or modes like Arena
For Persona 3 Reload, Persona 5 Tactica and Persona 5 Strikers, I usually speedrun specific battles, bosses or sections. (The levels are called Missions/Quests in Tactica)
Finally, I did actually speedrun Danganronpa 1 and 2 before. Of course, I only did specific parts of the game.
@@sauce987654321games like Rayman Origins and Legends, Rocket Knight, Persona, Celeste, and Danganronpa. I rarely do full-game runs, btw
A fun fact about the Night DLC stages in Unleashed is that a bunch of them are based on unused sections of the main levels. Dragon Road's DLC for example starts in a normally inaccessible area at the end of the main act. We know these areas were meant to be part of the main stages at some point thanks to the few Unleashed prototypes that we have access to.
Why these parts of the levels were scrapped, I have no idea. Too long, maybe?
Cant wait for the DLC levels to make it into Project 06, shit's gonna be peak
I’m suprised you didn’t mention the knuckles play through from 3K and Mania
Same
What about the Knuckles route from Sonic and Knuckles? Also, his route from Sonic Mania?
Also, Trip's Story from Superstars?
Amy from Sonic Advance 1?
ChaosX mentioned in his roadmap for Project 06's final release that we would be getting the Very Hard DLC stages. I look forward to seeing how people's opinions on those stages change.
Me: Why is his intro so long?
Him: Now I’d like to talk about my Patreon…
Me: Oh, financial problems, gotta get that watch time revenue
Thanks for this, nice conclusion at the end! Yeah, Sonic games are very hand holding these days because they amount mostly to automation and not enough level design that encourages the player to gain speed, especially with the boost games. I would like 3d Sonic to utilise more what the classics did, but build on it with Sonic's modern moveset. Also, there's Rise of Lyric extreme mode. I know it's not a Sonic game, but I don't see anyone talk about it, not even the wiki, so I wonder what it does. What's the hardest Sonic game you've played?
9:09 is that artificial chaos fluid?
To add context to Shadow's radical highway train damage issue. I think you have to hit the actual front car to damage it. I've recently replayed that level and lost because the train got away. I never had that issue as a kid but i noticed i was only shooting the back. Once i had bullets hit the side, it died quickly. Still janky though.
Super great vid on an aspect of Sonic games no one really talks about nowadays
Also I can’t believe he didn’t include the not at all lazy frontiers extreme mode 😢
The Difficulty mindset really reminds me when I finally clicked with Payday 2 Death Sentence One Down difficulty. I haven't played in a while but I am somewhat certain I probably still got it, even if my muscle memory is more atuned to RAID:World War 2's "Tank and heal from pickups" compared to Payday 2's "cautiously and tactically assess your situation, if you are a shot away from death in DSOD, place a FAK and become a bit more bold in killing enemies so that in either respect you heal"
It helps that the game has some amazing ish skills with an admitedly bad balance but melee skills that complement reloading are life savers.
It's why I have grown an appreciation to games like that. DSOD is not a FAIR difficulty by any stretch, but is doable and has quite the strategy and gameplan involved, not to mention that build making is how you respond to problems, those problems being either common heavy enemy types that are abundant and need minimum focus and time to dispatch, shield killing which can either be armor piercing or grenade launchers as they also compliment crowd control or knockback skills and Bulldozer kill strategies which either involve a rocket launcher a DPS check or even more curious enough sawing their faces with Overkill skill.
31:55 oooh, are you a fan of sonic CD then? that's like, its entire point :P
Yeah Sonic CD is awesome :)
I love Sonic CD!
Chao ChaoChao Chao Chao ChaoChao Chao Chao
12:53 no it didn't, all the DLC were on disc day 1, and buying DLC's from online store just allows you to access them.
'06's DLCs are NOT on the disc.
@@Knuxfan24 they are, that's why thier size is only a couple of Kb, with all of them having the size of 1,7 Mb while Unleashed single level packs are hundreds of Mb.
As an '06 modder, I can safely say they aren't. They're small because they consist of a few Lua files (to set up the DLC) and a few SET files.
@@Knuxfan24isn't that supposed to be DLC? then it not supposed to be already on the disc. You have to buy the DLC yourself. Is that correct?
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Agree 🔥🔥🔥
12:31 HE SAID THE LINE 😦😱😱😱
I see frontiers combat as its own thing, comparing it to others i think is kinda not gett8ng the point with it. I kinda see it as an enhanced version of spamming the homing attack to enemies, tho uh i do wish the hard mode was like hard hard
seeing the very hard mode in 06 just makes me wish it was in P06...
It's coming in the next (psuedo-final) update!
You forgot about lost world 3ds’s hard stages
Came here to say this. I think it does enough to change the level design and aesthetics to be engaging, but the ranking system is too easy. I would put SLW3DS hard mode above 06, Heroes and Shadow's at the very least
I actually havent played Lost World 3DS so I didnt know it had a hard mode. I did some research before starting the video just in case I missed something but I guess it didnt help lmao
@@JP2427 it’s ok just thought I’d tell you
Fucking exposed urself at the beginning ur done buddy !!! Peak video!!!! 💯
Shadow's Hard Mode is how the base game should've been, a level rush without the stupid missions
They really wanted that Star Fox 64 design apparently of doing things in a level to go up or down.
Hard disagree, Expert Mode is cool but because of the streamlined structure it locks out a lot of the alternate paths and some of the cool quirks of each level, so a lot ends up lost in translation.
Not to mention it would destroy the foundation of what the game is and how the narrative works if the game was just expert mode
@@seematahir5970 issue is that to complete the game you have to beat Westopolis at least 10 times. Now I understand the idea that it's supposed to reinforce replayability while you simultaneously chasing the carrot kinda like how Star Fox 64 had that, except it was a skill check which would then reflect on whether you got the score for a medal in a planet however, unlike 64, a game over didn't boot you back to the roots begining, it'd merely kick you to thr continue screen to pick to the start of the level rather than the last checkpoint.
It's admittedly how I beat the game as a kid over heroes (yeah I was that bad that I'd get stuck on Act 2 of levels, which I always dreaded because I knew a slip up would send me back to the tedious walk in the park).
@@artyom2801 that's a fair point to make but that jus needs a tweak to not force a whole ten replays of that level rather than upendin the whole system
@@nightlydata2181 that or make the A ranking harder as noted by other people that A ranking in some of the Shadow The Hedgehog stages and missions are a walk in the park because of the scoring method.
you seem like someone who would have needed help with the Great Ape Vegeta QTE on Dragon Ball Z: Ultimate Tenkaichi
on the topic of ranking systems, honestly sonic forces is the worst cause for whatever reason they implemented a daily log in bonus like it's a mobile game which acts as a score multiplier meaning the game literally gets easier the longer you play it continiously, when the ranks weren't even that difficult to begin with.
0/10 no sonic lost world 3ds hard mode
Hi man nice video but frontiers has difficulties easy normal hard and expert and in pretty sure forces has it too not entirely sure on forces but i know for a fact frontiers bas hard mode
Generations had hard mode bosses. But it ain't much of a difference
I love the hard mode versions!
Imo the standouts are Perfect Chaos and Egg Dragoon, PC gets a brand new 3D section halfway through the level and ED is just way more engaging of a fight with the staggered attack windows and faster recovery times.
Silver and Shadow get some cool changes too but they're less notable, and then with the Classic bosses I hardly notice a difference, lol
@@seematahir5970 DER takes a few more hits and the timing window on the arm-screen-attack is shorter, Metal re-arranges his attack patterns to give him more invul, so you can't just cheese him in 3 quick hits.
So we're just gonna brush off 06 with an "06 standards" joke as if it doesn't have some of the most stellar level design in the whole franchise because we gotta feed the already absurdly overfed "06 bad haha" crowds, OK makes sense. Sonic creators would be a lot more enjoyable to watch if they all didn't deliver the classic Heroes, ShtH, 06, RoL, Colors, S4, Lost World and Forces jabs pretty much none of us enjoy.
And for the train section you have to shoot the sides of the train in the Shadow Episode, Hard Mode and Very Hard Mode, it's literally the same in the entire game. In your footage you're targeting the rear, that does no damage.
As someone who adores 06, I think he was pretty fair about it. He acknowledged what he liked and gave the levels he thought were good their flowers. But with a game like 06 it's hard to blame players for struggling, and he explained his issues beyond just "hurr durr game bad".
@@seematahir5970 The jabs were many and unnecessary. The critique of the Very Hard DLC was fair (which is why, you might notice, I never brought that into question to begin with).
@@KOTSOSMC2002I beat the Hard Mode for Sonic! (Not the v
Very Hard Mode tho. Never got the DLC