I'd definitely say that Wii Fit Trainer is the most balanced character. She always remarks on how all the other characters are wobbling when she fights them
"You can't expect to be throwing around a 100lb fist and be able to dart around all over the place." Yeah, that'd be dumb. Now make it a 100lb sword on the other hand and then give it to cloud and apparently that's perfectly fine
Sonic at least 30 percent when you combos with spin charge into nair. He's also the fastest character and his cartoon hands, cartoon feet are unreasonably disjointed. He also has an invincible recovery that reaches incredibly far, a combo throw that converts into death, and invincibility on spindash. Also has incredible rolling, spotdodge and airdodge frame data.
uhh, cloud is a Super SOLDIER as stated in his original game, sooo he naturally has the super human strength(because jenova cells). Plus regardless of that, cloud actually has rather sluggish frame data(so many people will tell you this)
dude you dont have to apologize so much. It's normal to have real life problems and then you should focus on them more than youtube because its just dumb to be under real life pressure and work on videos on the same time so its fully understandable to you to take off couple months
I agree, his videos are top quality, only proving that he was making all that time worth it. And beyond being a youtuber, he's a human being like all of us who has his own life to deal with. I appreciate everything this channel offers no matter how long the wait.
Priority works in different ways in smash. A bigger hitbox might hit you before your puny one could. However, What if you crouched and avoided that big hit box and threw out your puny hitbox? Then yours would land and not theirs. Also, some hitboxes are transcendent, like Martha dancing blade. This means the hitbox won't collide with any other hitboxes, giving it a greater chance that you will hit them first or at least trade hits on each other. Basically, it comes down to range of a hitbox, how close your body is to your hitbox vs how close theirs is to their hitbox, and whether the move is transcendent or not. Also, super armor or intangibility will make your moves hit them and you won't be knocked back.
Priority doesn't exist in smash 4. It's merely a mix of hitboxes, hurtboxes, active frames, i-frames, and armor frames. Take Cloud up air, fast startup, tons of active frames, gigantic hitbox, and disjointed with very very low (spatially) hurtbox; that's why that move beats so many other moves. Moves don't cancel, it's just that one hits and the other doesn't. It's like in boxing when both strike pretty much at the same time, but one is faster and more precise, so it lands full blow and knocks down so fast that the other punch loses power and becomes just a slight tap, so one puncher goes down and the other one doesn't.
Moves can clank (I'm assuming this is what you meant by cancel out). It happens with ground-to-ground moves, like jabs, tilts and smashes. If there's a (I think) 9% difference in attack power, the stronger move will prevail and beat out the weaker move. Like how a smash attack will beat out a jab. But if the difference in % is below 9, the moves will just clank and no move comes out. Air-to-airs (like a b-air vs another b-air) will always just have both moves come out and both players get hit by each other's move. I'm p sure Esam made a vid on it a while back.
No matter what he says in this video, I'm always gonna think that a sonic player is gonna time me out when I hear the announcer say the blue blur's name
So many people really hate Sonic. They claim it's because of time-outs, but even if a Sonic player never time-outs people will still hate you. This is part of the reason I never play Sonic in Smash anymore. Sometimes people just get so toxic...
Pro1lex oh, you know what? You're right! I guess I should've just kept playing Sonic and have no one play with me or quit at the beginning of a match! Pretty much everyone in the Smash community hates Sonic. In other words, no one wants to play against Sonic. People refusing to play against you because of the character you play isn't "a personal problem"' it ruins the enjoyment of the game.
Scuffle that's still a personal problem though because you don't have people to practice with. there will be that someone who wants to play an obnoxious matchup to get better at it or are we going to pretend playing against say DK Bayo or a Bowser who knows your habits isn't also very frustrating. You just have bad luck with finding people to play
Two archetypes you missed: 1. Joke Character. The opposite of the Master of All, the Joke Character generally has poor capabilities across board, or alternatively a crippling weakness that overshadows otherwise acceptable stats. Generally intentional, and often has other humorous elements to them. Examples would include: Pichu (Melee) Dan Hibiki (Street Fighter) Unown (Pokemon) Mr. Satan/Hercule (Most DBZ games) 2. Lethal Joke Character. The lethal joke character can take on one of three different forms. The first one is a joke character with an intentionally overpowered but extremely hard to use ability. For example, Phoenix Wright in UMvC3. The second form is a joke character that happens to be broken in some way so that they become overpowered. For example, Roll in... one of the Capcom VS games. I can't remember which one. Finally, there's the intentional hilariously overpowered character. This one's the least common since it's poor balance, but you'll come across them in hobby games every now and then. For example, the MUGEN character "F1", which is literally just the F1 key and instant-kills the opponent at the start of a match. Examples: Phoenix Wright (UMvC3) Mr. Satan/Hercule (the one DBZ game he's actually _good_ in) Jigglypuff (Sm4sh) Rare Akuma (MUGEN)
@@jimmymoth2521 A character simply being silly doesn't make that character a joke character. A joke character has to be intentionally bad in a comedic way.
uhh, that wasn't what created Anything Goes. pretty sure people have been doing 6 arceus trolling in anything goes since like gen 4 or 5 been out. it's been here since early days pre pokemon showdown IIRC.
dddmemaybe Anything Goes didn't exist before ORAS, 6th generation, aka MegaRayquaza's release. I think you're referring to Uber that while very similar is a different tier.
Just wanted to let you know that I enjoy your videos! They are some of the most high quality content I've seen on UA-cam, even on par with game theory! I hope you make it through your tough times, and continue to keep doing what you do best!
My smash corner: you cant wave a hundred pound fist and expect it to be fast Smash ultimate: bowser aka the heavist charter in the game, his movement is as fast, I'f not faster than most medium weight My smash corner: so that means he takes a long time to kill other players right? Smash ultimate: no
What about the character who specailizes in long range attacks like Samus, Megaman, and Simon Belmont? Or possibly the characters in games that have low attack power. but gains a boost when hurt either gradually like lucario or once a certain threshold is passed like Spring Man in ARMS
“You can’t throw a hundred pound fist and expect to dart all over the place” Path of Radiance Ike says Hi Also exactly why Goku shouldn’t be in smash along with a number of reasons
Since you asked, an archetype I see (and play as) is what I'll call a "punisher." The name is due to the way that the smash community uses the term "punish" for when a option is thrown out at the player and reacted to beneficially. As a Zelda main, I keep this playstyle in mind constantly as her moves are typically too slow/risky to just throw out, thus I'll use her as an example. A lot of her playstyle is about playing around the opponent and finding the perfect time to strike. Lightning kicks (Forward and backward Aerials) are a prime example of this as it requires a lot of spacing, anticipation and timing to land effectively. When done correctly, you get a really solid hit exemplifying power and satisfaction behind the commitment. On the other hand, missing or connecting with the sour spot can often leave a large opening for your opponent to counter, and as result encouraging the use of it to only be done when confident about the probability of its success. Zelda's kit is really unique and I really like this idea for a defensive character: Not specifically strong at lessening her damage taken, but focusing more on hitting hard when your opponent makes a mistake.
This is a pretty interesting subject, but it's kind of shallow coverage of the archetypes. I'd personally like to see this subject expanded to cover the entire roster. I don't even know how I'd classify some of the characters in Smash 4 that I rarely use. That would be actually fulfilling content to me! I'd love to see it happen!
An Archetype that's a personal favourite of mine with games is what I like to call the Technician Archetype, a character which has a heavy focus on utelizing their kit to setup a plan before executing it. These would be characters like Duck Hunt or Snake from brawl, being able to utelize their can and sticky bomb respectively to set up combo's just right...when all goes according to plan.
Another archetype that I've seen in Smash and other games is the puppet character. Whether the puppet mimics the main char (Ice Climbers), you mainly use the puppet for attacking (Sasori in Naruto), or you happen to control both characters at the same time but both have different abilities (Carl Clover and Ada Clover from BlazBlue)
It's worth mentioning that a character doesn't have to have ALL of his/her stats be better than average for the character to be OP. They just need their strengths to more than make up for their weaknesses. For example, Fox in Melee. Many of Fox's moves have shorter than average range/reach, but his speed and attack power more than make up for what he lacks in range. Sometimes all it takes is one or two exeptional stats to make a character rediculously powerful.
2:24 Pichu in ultimate is about as glass cannon as you can get. it literally damages itself by attacking yet it has an INSANE combo game. oh and i think just via the nature of smash, a glass cannon is going to be a fragile speedster, every time. you just cant have a slow glass cannon in smash.
The lightning bruiser: A character that excels in power, durability and speed that still has a major drawback that prevents them from being perfect. Examples being Bowser in Smash 4, Captain, Charizard, Roy in Smash 4, and maybe Wolf in Brawl.
Smash is also all about the archetypes that go "grab-based", "melee attacker", "tool-belt" and others. I'd like Nintendo to put more mii options that fit all the class-like archetypes. I want a mii mage, a mii with tons of weird tools, and whatever else we can figure out is relevant.
I heard someone describe smash bros characters using mario tennis archetypes and it makes a lot of sense to me. The all-arounder type, like mario, is a jack of all trades, with no glaring strengths or weaknesses. The power type, like bowser or ganondorf, is slow but powerful. The speedy type, like sonic or pikachu, is weak but fast and uses hit and run tactics. The technique type, like sheik or pac man, is high skill high reward and generally difficult to use without a lot of practice and knowledge of how the game works. The last type, tricky, like peach, has some kind of unique property or attribute that makes fighting them difficult for those who arent used to fighting them, and generally have playstyles that dont translate well to other characters
Maybe I'll be Pikahu Im already the death of Pikahu What about Little Mac? I already dropped his recovery Then i'll be Bayonetta *NERF* Boyonetta ok kill me if you want lol
In Smash 4, by primary archetype are zoners. Lucas, Duck Hunt, and Robin. The one exception to this being Ryu. Even then, Ryu wants to force approaches. In ArcSys fighters, I tend toward "the weirdos." In Blazblue Central Fiction, my two are Susano'o and Hakumen, who work on wildly different systems than the rest of the cast. In Skullgirls, it's resource management characters, with my team being Robo-Fortune/Squigly/Beowulf. The three all have some personal thing they need to manage, in addition to the team's meter.
You could make the argument where Fox's weakness in Melee is his range, which makes him a master of almost everything. Of course, this is circumvented by his amazing speed and power (relative to how great his speed is). The only "range" that Fox has is his SH double laser, but it has mainly seen its sole use against Jigglypuff, where being at a certain percent and unstaling your moves matter a lot. Compared to other top tiers, they can outrange Fox (Falco's laser/puff bair/Marth's sword+grab, etc) Against other top tiers, SHDL is mostly unwise to do as Fox has better tools to use such as his speed and hitboxes (shine, nair, dair, bair, etc). Not to mention it is easy to catch Fox lasering and potentially dying from something simple as Sheik's boost grab or Falco's laser.
Life comes first, no need to say sorry to anyone. Though it is nice to see how humble you are, can't wait for the next video be it days or months! Good stuff!
There's an archetype I've notice myself, though I'm not exactly sure if it fits into your sorting type when it comes to archetypes. I call it the "Wacky RNG" archetype. Basically, It's a character that either has a very strange and unpredictable moveset, and also has some RNG factors to help them out. Example can include Luigi, Mr. Game & Watch, and Pac-Man. Luigi for his taunt spike and Green Missile; G&W for his Judge and Bucket; and Pac-Man for his fruits, Trampoline, and Fire Hydrant. These characters are generally hard to approach as you aren't exactly certain on what they will pull out next, not to mention they can be very challenging to master due to their strangeness. To me however, that just raises their appeal! The strangeness and unpredictability can really make a character like that shine. Though the RNG factor can be sometimes infuriating for the opponent, it just makes that sweet, sweet misfire or "9" all the better.
Hm, maybe you can call it "Trickster" or "Irregular" or something like that? The only thing I have to say is that Pacman doesn't have that much RNG in his moveset except for the fly path of the spaceship projectile (unless I forgot about any others). Anyway, I usually enjoy playing these kinds of characters. ^^
Trickster works perfectly actually. Pac-Man is my main BTW, but I can't pull those insane combos that you usually see Pac-Man players do, sadly... But I still love him all the same! ^.^
That is like... wow... the exact same thing. Also, good to see another Pac-Main (assuming that's what you're implying). Honestly, Pac-Man needs more attention IMO. He's just a wacky and strange characters that everyone seems to ignore even though he got about the same hype as Megaman when he was announced...
"Who would want to play such a game. It's shallow, it's boring, it's repetitive." *Didn't stop Melee from being a dumpster fire of Foxes, Falcos and Shieks when there were other plenty of other options.*
I wouldn't say that Bayo is the best example of the Master of all archetype. She has great mobility, disadvantage, combo game and advantage, but her killing power besides her bullshit moments is surprisingly lackluster, and he neutral game, comparing to other Top Tiers, is average at best. I would say that Cloud is a better description of said archetype, since he has good combo game, decent recovery, great neutral game and one of the best killing power of the game. Diddy is also a good example,. with pretty good stats on every category besides his online decent killing power.
His recovery is extremely less than decent, considering it only has vertical height, cannot snap to the ledge, and has vulnerability throughout the entire move. Even limit break up-b is vulnerable.
Honestly I'd say all of the top tiers in Sm4sh are op w/a critical weakness preventing them fom exploiting their extreme strengths to the fullest. Cloud has godly speed, range and power at the cost of the 2nd worst recovery in the game. Bayonetta has absurd combos & kill potential but is sluggish in frame data & mobility Shiek is the best at dealing damage but the worst at killing of the top tiers Diddy is an exception, being all-around good, but nothing absolutely stands out attribute-wise, making him closest to a typical Master of All Rosaluma has damage & range, but both Luma & Rosalina are frail, and Rosa alone is a mid-tier. Any other tops that I forgot?
One character archetype you didn't mention is the Trickster. A good example I suppose would be Teddie from Persona 4 Arena. These are characters with specials that have variable effects or just straight up tricky specials that make them difficult to hit or allow them to combo in a way the rest of the cast can't. I'm not sure if this really exists in Smash, but I guess Game & Watch is the best example with his Judgement special
Fox is a better example of a fragile speedster imo. The definition of speed in movement and option coverage, but just as light as pikachu (worse horizontal and better vertical survivability ofc), with a much worse recovery (your other qualifier of fragility). He also hits light a truck though so maybe he defines the combination of a glass cannon/fragile speedster mix. great video!
No projectile, no reflector, no easy combo game (like from a d-throw) and overall horrendous frame data. He has Monado arts, sure, but he's still missing a lot.
oussama mrissa Shulk is not average. He's sort of a mild mighty glacier. Note how the speed art still doesn't help his frame data and how his buster or Smash art makes him insanely strong.
7 років тому
Franchezco Lamont Counters suck anyways (besides Bayo and Corrin), Mario's F.L.U.D.D. is far superior.
In pm, I feel like every character fits between 5 types. Speed- uses speed to overwhelm and combo the opponent (fox) Projectile- uses one or more great projectiles to reliably win neutral and open into their combos/kills (toon link) Range- uses their far range to outspace the opponent and reliably win neutral that way (marth) Wall- uses extremely fast and hard hitting moves to become impossible to approach and harshly punish every mistake an opponent makes (peach) Super Armor- uses super armor/crouch canceling as a primary method to win neutral and hit the opponent much harder than they were hit (bowser) Then other characters fit between these. Falco is a speed/projectile. Dedede is a range/armor. Ex.
Delaberry Really no need to post your comment here saying how I shouldn't have posted my comment in the first place just to show how you don't like my joke.
i'm not just showing how i don't like your joke, i'm giving you the advice of not bringing this topic for no reason just because you don't believe there are more than two genders.
Delaberry Can't you tell he's striving to trigger you? And that he's 100% having success doing so? Can't you see he's basking in your sensitivity about the matter? In your last comment you're basically saying "Stop it, you're upsetting me". He loves this, just don't feed him PS. Also guys, i would not advise clicking on the link of that guy, he's spamming it in other comments as well, my antivirus nose is picking something up here. Just be advised
Because fighting game, I'm surprised you didn't go a lil more into fighting game archetypes. Like the "Zoner", who wanna play keep away and play long and mid range games or "Rush Down" type characters that wanna keep up close with pressure. Because some of the types you mention here can apply a variety of ways when applied to how the character is decided aside from there raw stats. I think there's some interesting design dialog that could be made about those being tossed in the mix and how they change things up further.
One thing you missed out about the all rounder/average character is that they are typically the tutorial character. Not needing a lot of strategy or knowledge on the game to win. Cause unlike others which have drawbacks to deal with you don't really have anything to plan around thus making it easier
A better example of jack of all, master of none would be Pit/DP. Mario's combo game and crazy good recovery on aerial and bonkers start up on grounded moves tends to put him on the higher end of the spectrum closer to a master of all.
One archetype I find very often is the one that stacks so many debuffs on you that your fighting prowess is impaired to the degree that you do close to nothing at all. I think the Final Fantasy series started to call them Manipulators.
two Glass Cannon characters that I actually Use in Games are Cammy ((SFV)) and Evil Ryu ((USF4)) both have a Great Offensive game with Damaging combos. But Evil Ryu has low stun and Cammy has below average health
The banned Pokémon were usually mythical as which mean that you have to go to an event to get them. Which is unfair to those who can’t go to those events
I'd definitely say that Wii Fit Trainer is the most balanced character. She always remarks on how all the other characters are wobbling when she fights them
Yoshiyo T. Waiting for this to become top comment
Lmao
I think Mario is the most balanced character since I arbitrarily think everyone else should be balanced around him.
*Ice climbers drop out of nowhere*
"You're wobbling"
Yoshiyo T. Pit*
I'm alive. Sorry for not uploading for so long. Just had to get through some road bumps in life. Hope you find video interesting!
Don't worry :D
YES MSC IS ALIVE!!
My Smash Corner good I was just started rewatching you
So glad you're okay man, don't push yourself!
My Smash Corner YOUR life comes first. Hope you're all good now. Thanks for the dope content, ur a beast 👏👍
"You can't expect to be throwing around a 100lb fist and be able to dart around all over the place." Yeah, that'd be dumb. Now make it a 100lb sword on the other hand and then give it to cloud and apparently that's perfectly fine
Sonic at least 30 percent when you combos with spin charge into nair. He's also the fastest character and his cartoon hands, cartoon feet are unreasonably disjointed. He also has an invincible recovery that reaches incredibly far, a combo throw that converts into death, and invincibility on spindash. Also has incredible rolling, spotdodge and airdodge frame data.
uhh, cloud is a Super SOLDIER as stated in his original game, sooo he naturally has the super human strength(because jenova cells). Plus regardless of that, cloud actually has rather sluggish frame data(so many people will tell you this)
Fate besides best counter you described Cloud again lol
Cloud can't kill you at 25 percent like bayo can
Cloud is a bullshit character but tbh sonic is worse because sonic can win off of like 1 button. Sonic is so easy lol
dude you dont have to apologize so much. It's normal to have real life problems and then you should focus on them more than youtube because its just dumb to be under real life pressure and work on videos on the same time so its fully understandable to you to take off couple months
Nikkechu^, oh hi.
I agree, his videos are top quality, only proving that he was making all that time worth it. And beyond being a youtuber, he's a human being like all of us who has his own life to deal with. I appreciate everything this channel offers no matter how long the wait.
1:14 "Bam, perfect balance."
**Someone uses a Wii Remote*
Seems legit.
Gamerix / Rix lol
"pErFeCt BaLaNcE"
I main Wiimote >: |
that's me with my first time...
I main one of the joy cons on the switch.
Shulk is a jack of all trades, and can be a master of one depending on the monado art currently in use
"You can't be throwing around a hundred pound fist and expect to be able to dart all over the place."
>Doomfist says hi
Its basically a falcon punch but the hurtbox covers everything
Superior Man Not at all. The falcon punch sucks in all incarnations besides possibly 64.
Doomfist says hi? how about Bayonetta says hi. Bayonetta fitts the "Mary Sue" archetype if you ask me.
DJack276 It's a good thing no one asked you, because you haven't a clue what a Mary Sue even is.
GIR177 good thing no one asked you.
Do a video on PRIORITY! How does Priority works and what IS it?
Why do some moves cancel out others.
Priority works in different ways in smash. A bigger hitbox might hit you before your puny one could. However, What if you crouched and avoided that big hit box and threw out your puny hitbox? Then yours would land and not theirs. Also, some hitboxes are transcendent, like Martha dancing blade. This means the hitbox won't collide with any other hitboxes, giving it a greater chance that you will hit them first or at least trade hits on each other. Basically, it comes down to range of a hitbox, how close your body is to your hitbox vs how close theirs is to their hitbox, and whether the move is transcendent or not. Also, super armor or intangibility will make your moves hit them and you won't be knocked back.
Priority doesn't exist in smash 4. It's merely a mix of hitboxes, hurtboxes, active frames, i-frames, and armor frames.
Take Cloud up air, fast startup, tons of active frames, gigantic hitbox, and disjointed with very very low (spatially) hurtbox; that's why that move beats so many other moves. Moves don't cancel, it's just that one hits and the other doesn't.
It's like in boxing when both strike pretty much at the same time, but one is faster and more precise, so it lands full blow and knocks down so fast that the other punch loses power and becomes just a slight tap, so one puncher goes down and the other one doesn't.
Moves can clank (I'm assuming this is what you meant by cancel out). It happens with ground-to-ground moves, like jabs, tilts and smashes. If there's a (I think) 9% difference in attack power, the stronger move will prevail and beat out the weaker move. Like how a smash attack will beat out a jab. But if the difference in % is below 9, the moves will just clank and no move comes out.
Air-to-airs (like a b-air vs another b-air) will always just have both moves come out and both players get hit by each other's move. I'm p sure Esam made a vid on it a while back.
ESAM made a video on this a long time ago
ua-cam.com/video/uyCLnC-ejPQ/v-deo.html
There are also transcendent hitboxes which is another part to learn about. Sm4sh is weird when it comes to moves going at one another.
The fairest matchup is obviously ness/lucas vs villager/rosalina
oussama mrissa No its Ganon vs. Sanic.
oussama mrissa lucas doesnt struggle as bad as ness with rosa
Knight Lorenzo No way, it's obviously in Ganons favor.😏
melvin st fleur Oh right, I forgot up-tilt completely shuts down Sanic.
It's Ryu-Pika
No matter what he says in this video, I'm always gonna think that a sonic player is gonna time me out when I hear the announcer say the blue blur's name
So many people really hate Sonic. They claim it's because of time-outs, but even if a Sonic player never time-outs people will still hate you. This is part of the reason I never play Sonic in Smash anymore. Sometimes people just get so toxic...
WibbL That's what makes it a good mixup
Scuffle if you submit to other people's opinions of you, then that sounds like a personal problem...
Pro1lex oh, you know what? You're right! I guess I should've just kept playing Sonic and have no one play with me or quit at the beginning of a match! Pretty much everyone in the Smash community hates Sonic. In other words, no one wants to play against Sonic. People refusing to play against you because of the character you play isn't "a personal problem"' it ruins the enjoyment of the game.
Scuffle that's still a personal problem though because you don't have people to practice with. there will be that someone who wants to play an obnoxious matchup to get better at it or are we going to pretend playing against say DK Bayo or a Bowser who knows your habits isn't also very frustrating. You just have bad luck with finding people to play
I’m starting to get the impression
that this guy likes kirby
Thanks sherlock, I definently didn't know that from the thumbnail.
@@epicgeometric672 That seems like a joke C-X 3 made. If so, r/woosh
Two archetypes you missed:
1. Joke Character. The opposite of the Master of All, the Joke Character generally has poor capabilities across board, or alternatively a crippling weakness that overshadows otherwise acceptable stats. Generally intentional, and often has other humorous elements to them. Examples would include:
Pichu (Melee)
Dan Hibiki (Street Fighter)
Unown (Pokemon)
Mr. Satan/Hercule (Most DBZ games)
2. Lethal Joke Character. The lethal joke character can take on one of three different forms.
The first one is a joke character with an intentionally overpowered but extremely hard to use ability. For example, Phoenix Wright in UMvC3.
The second form is a joke character that happens to be broken in some way so that they become overpowered. For example, Roll in... one of the Capcom VS games. I can't remember which one.
Finally, there's the intentional hilariously overpowered character. This one's the least common since it's poor balance, but you'll come across them in hobby games every now and then. For example, the MUGEN character "F1", which is literally just the F1 key and instant-kills the opponent at the start of a match.
Examples:
Phoenix Wright (UMvC3)
Mr. Satan/Hercule (the one DBZ game he's actually _good_ in)
Jigglypuff (Sm4sh)
Rare Akuma (MUGEN)
He WAS a joke, how he's the glassiest glass cannon that ever cannoned
Ronald mcdonald in the rivals of aether steam workshop fits in this category
Wario or Luigi in smash 4?
@@jimmymoth2521
A character simply being silly doesn't make that character a joke character. A joke character has to be intentionally bad in a comedic way.
@@VestedUTuber so more like magikarp from pokemon
Charizard is an acception to the mighty glacier, since he is faster than cloud without limit
That's why you don't put wings on a Tarrasque.
This is what a buffed Charizard would look like: shorturl.at/fmqyJ
8:17
Meta Knight: I taught you well.
TV Tropes is the best, more people should know about it.
Can we all take a minute to appreciate that 56 damage attack by goombario at 4:29.
Took a picture of it and put it on my fridge.
The reason i find shulk so cool design wise is because his dynamic playstyle includes every one of these without making him rounded like mario.
The 2 samus missles not colliding at 1:03 grinded my gears
if you bring op pokemon, why did you didn't mention mega rayquazza, it was too powerful, that they had to ban him from Ubers and create Anything Goes
Mauricio Marquez So your saying we should sign a petition to nerf Greninja.
uhh, that wasn't what created Anything Goes. pretty sure people have been doing 6 arceus trolling in anything goes since like gen 4 or 5 been out. it's been here since early days pre pokemon showdown IIRC.
dddmemaybe Anything Goes didn't exist before ORAS, 6th generation, aka MegaRayquaza's release.
I think you're referring to Uber that while very similar is a different tier.
Anything goes was created for Mega Raquayza. At first I thought it wasn't, but apparently it was. (www.smogon.com/smog/issue39/anything-goes)
HES ALIVE!!! Don't sweat anything, just keep on living.
Ayyy you're alive!
I'd say another common archetype would be techskill reliant, because of how some characters rely on their tech to achieve success within matches
That's the definition of Shulk lol.
Excuse you, but I'd like evidence of Shulk mains being a higher intellectual other world race to the Pac-Mains.
Greninja, peach, Ryu, and Shulk
Yeah, that's definitely an archetype. Characters that can do really well at high-level play, but suck at low level play.
I mean nicko barely uses any shulk tech and still does super well :p
I honestly think your right. Mario isn't the Jack of all stats character. It actually Pit. He is probably the most balanced character in the game.
I see what you mean
Just wanted to let you know that I enjoy your videos! They are some of the most high quality content I've seen on UA-cam, even on par with game theory! I hope you make it through your tough times, and continue to keep doing what you do best!
My smash corner: you cant wave a hundred pound fist and expect it to be fast
Smash ultimate: bowser aka the heavist charter in the game, his movement is as fast, I'f not faster than most medium weight
My smash corner: so that means he takes a long time to kill other players right?
Smash ultimate: no
The most even match-up in all of fighting gaming:
Ryu and Ken in Street Fighter 1.
"uAhM aCtUaCkTuAlLy"
nah peach vs daisy ultimate
@@paulakroy2635 imma tell you right now your a fool...
*SANS VS BANJO*
I think at this point I like this series more than the combo tutorials. These are always packed with information and your voice is very soothing
What about the character who specailizes in long range attacks like Samus, Megaman, and Simon Belmont?
Or possibly the characters in games that have low attack power. but gains a boost when hurt either gradually like lucario or once a certain threshold is passed like Spring Man in ARMS
“You can’t throw a hundred pound fist and expect to dart all over the place”
Path of Radiance Ike says Hi
Also exactly why Goku shouldn’t be in smash along with a number of reasons
Since you asked, an archetype I see (and play as) is what I'll call a "punisher." The name is due to the way that the smash community uses the term "punish" for when a option is thrown out at the player and reacted to beneficially. As a Zelda main, I keep this playstyle in mind constantly as her moves are typically too slow/risky to just throw out, thus I'll use her as an example. A lot of her playstyle is about playing around the opponent and finding the perfect time to strike. Lightning kicks (Forward and backward Aerials) are a prime example of this as it requires a lot of spacing, anticipation and timing to land effectively. When done correctly, you get a really solid hit exemplifying power and satisfaction behind the commitment. On the other hand, missing or connecting with the sour spot can often leave a large opening for your opponent to counter, and as result encouraging the use of it to only be done when confident about the probability of its success. Zelda's kit is really unique and I really like this idea for a defensive character: Not specifically strong at lessening her damage taken, but focusing more on hitting hard when your opponent makes a mistake.
This is a pretty interesting subject, but it's kind of shallow coverage of the archetypes. I'd personally like to see this subject expanded to cover the entire roster. I don't even know how I'd classify some of the characters in Smash 4 that I rarely use. That would be actually fulfilling content to me! I'd love to see it happen!
An Archetype that's a personal favourite of mine with games is what I like to call the Technician Archetype, a character which has a heavy focus on utelizing their kit to setup a plan before executing it. These would be characters like Duck Hunt or Snake from brawl, being able to utelize their can and sticky bomb respectively to set up combo's just right...when all goes according to plan.
"I know she isn't in smash but tracer is a perfect example."
To think Tracer now has a chance to be DLC in SSBU....what a world we live in.
Another archetype that I've seen in Smash and other games is the puppet character. Whether the puppet mimics the main char (Ice Climbers), you mainly use the puppet for attacking (Sasori in Naruto), or you happen to control both characters at the same time but both have different abilities (Carl Clover and Ada Clover from BlazBlue)
What about Master of None?
That's players like us
That's me
You noticed me!
It's worth mentioning that a character doesn't have to have ALL of his/her stats be better than average for the character to be OP. They just need their strengths to more than make up for their weaknesses. For example, Fox in Melee. Many of Fox's moves have shorter than average range/reach, but his speed and attack power more than make up for what he lacks in range. Sometimes all it takes is one or two exeptional stats to make a character rediculously powerful.
don't even have notifications on lol
2:24 Pichu in ultimate is about as glass cannon as you can get. it literally damages itself by attacking yet it has an INSANE combo game.
oh and i think just via the nature of smash, a glass cannon is going to be a fragile speedster, every time. you just cant have a slow glass cannon in smash.
The other archetype I can think of is grappler.
The lightning bruiser: A character that excels in power, durability and speed that still has a major drawback that prevents them from being perfect. Examples being Bowser in Smash 4, Captain, Charizard, Roy in Smash 4, and maybe Wolf in Brawl.
I've never clicked so fast
I love the way he says "purple". It just sounds adorable for some reason.
3:18
Just gonna save this timestamp here, just in case...
Inb4 the female 4th fighter's pass character is revealed
Smash is also all about the archetypes that go "grab-based", "melee attacker", "tool-belt" and others. I'd like Nintendo to put more mii options that fit all the class-like archetypes. I want a mii mage, a mii with tons of weird tools, and whatever else we can figure out is relevant.
3:24 I'm AlReADY TrAcER!!!
Ok I'll stop...
I think what truly defines a character archetype is the way the player uses them
You did such a great job finding examples and clips of each of the archetypes from a variety of media, and the editing is impeccable.
I heard someone describe smash bros characters using mario tennis archetypes and it makes a lot of sense to me. The all-arounder type, like mario, is a jack of all trades, with no glaring strengths or weaknesses. The power type, like bowser or ganondorf, is slow but powerful. The speedy type, like sonic or pikachu, is weak but fast and uses hit and run tactics. The technique type, like sheik or pac man, is high skill high reward and generally difficult to use without a lot of practice and knowledge of how the game works. The last type, tricky, like peach, has some kind of unique property or attribute that makes fighting them difficult for those who arent used to fighting them, and generally have playstyles that dont translate well to other characters
Maybe I'll be Pikahu
Im already the death of Pikahu
What about Little Mac?
I already dropped his recovery
Then i'll be Bayonetta
*NERF* Boyonetta
ok kill me if you want lol
I wish I didn’t see this
@@fus5363 at least you didnt think of it ;-;
In Smash 4, by primary archetype are zoners.
Lucas, Duck Hunt, and Robin. The one exception to this being Ryu. Even then, Ryu wants to force approaches.
In ArcSys fighters, I tend toward "the weirdos." In Blazblue Central Fiction, my two are Susano'o and Hakumen, who work on wildly different systems than the rest of the cast.
In Skullgirls, it's resource management characters, with my team being Robo-Fortune/Squigly/Beowulf. The three all have some personal thing they need to manage, in addition to the team's meter.
smash 4 trope: fire emblem character with down b counter. (except robin)
Melee trope: spacey with lazer, shine and phantasm
You could make the argument where Fox's weakness in Melee is his range, which makes him a master of almost everything. Of course, this is circumvented by his amazing speed and power (relative to how great his speed is).
The only "range" that Fox has is his SH double laser, but it has mainly seen its sole use against Jigglypuff, where being at a certain percent and unstaling your moves matter a lot. Compared to other top tiers, they can outrange Fox (Falco's laser/puff bair/Marth's sword+grab, etc)
Against other top tiers, SHDL is mostly unwise to do as Fox has better tools to use such as his speed and hitboxes (shine, nair, dair, bair, etc). Not to mention it is easy to catch Fox lasering and potentially dying from something simple as Sheik's boost grab or Falco's laser.
10:00 YES
The
Fucking
Rollers
Life comes first, no need to say sorry to anyone. Though it is nice to see how humble you are, can't wait for the next video be it days or months! Good stuff!
i like men.
The Trickster:
Above average stats, hard too pull off.
HE'S A L I V E !
Here's something to think about: Bait and Punishers, Spacers, and Walls as archetypes fits most of the smash roster well
Your voice almost made me go to sleep.
TheOneWhoPlays ASMR
In a good way tho
"The fairest matchup is a ditto"
Thanks for breaking the laws of logic Lucario.
There's an archetype I've notice myself, though I'm not exactly sure if it fits into your sorting type when it comes to archetypes. I call it the "Wacky RNG" archetype. Basically, It's a character that either has a very strange and unpredictable moveset, and also has some RNG factors to help them out. Example can include Luigi, Mr. Game & Watch, and Pac-Man. Luigi for his taunt spike and Green Missile; G&W for his Judge and Bucket; and Pac-Man for his fruits, Trampoline, and Fire Hydrant. These characters are generally hard to approach as you aren't exactly certain on what they will pull out next, not to mention they can be very challenging to master due to their strangeness. To me however, that just raises their appeal! The strangeness and unpredictability can really make a character like that shine. Though the RNG factor can be sometimes infuriating for the opponent, it just makes that sweet, sweet misfire or "9" all the better.
Hm, maybe you can call it "Trickster" or "Irregular" or something like that? The only thing I have to say is that Pacman doesn't have that much RNG in his moveset except for the fly path of the spaceship projectile (unless I forgot about any others).
Anyway, I usually enjoy playing these kinds of characters. ^^
Trickster works perfectly actually. Pac-Man is my main BTW, but I can't pull those insane combos that you usually see Pac-Man players do, sadly... But I still love him all the same! ^.^
Haha same for me! Though sometimes I get lucky and I manage to pull of something really cool (and then never be able to repeat it haha).
That is like... wow... the exact same thing. Also, good to see another Pac-Main (assuming that's what you're implying). Honestly, Pac-Man needs more attention IMO. He's just a wacky and strange characters that everyone seems to ignore even though he got about the same hype as Megaman when he was announced...
Alexander Potec Croagunk in Pokken?
Love the graphics and animations.
Very informative and well compiled.
why didn't i get a notification?!
A Captain Falcon Main you can be subscribed but not have notifications enabled
You just have to click the bell to enable them
Thomas Fatzinger i have legit all notifications on, i didnt get one for this video.....
UA-cam: we are youtube; ain't gotta explain shit
Everyone: >:|
You give me a CoreAgaming vibe but mainly focused on smash. I love it. Best of luck with life.
We need a new Bayo video or a Sonic combo video
MinionMan123 we dont
Ew
MinionMan123 No, stop
MinionMan123 I don't play bayo or sonic, but okey
Don't apologize for spaced out uploads. Life happens. Keep at it!!
Fox: *taunts*
Me: *triggered*
Pichu: *taunts*
Me: heh look at him go
"Who would want to play such a game. It's shallow, it's boring, it's repetitive."
*Didn't stop Melee from being a dumpster fire of Foxes, Falcos and Shieks when there were other plenty of other options.*
I wouldn't say that Bayo is the best example of the Master of all archetype. She has great mobility, disadvantage, combo game and advantage, but her killing power besides her bullshit moments is surprisingly lackluster, and he neutral game, comparing to other Top Tiers, is average at best. I would say that Cloud is a better description of said archetype, since he has good combo game, decent recovery, great neutral game and one of the best killing power of the game. Diddy is also a good example,. with pretty good stats on every category besides his online decent killing power.
His recovery is extremely less than decent, considering it only has vertical height, cannot snap to the ledge, and has vulnerability throughout the entire move. Even limit break up-b is vulnerable.
Honestly I'd say all of the top tiers in Sm4sh are op w/a critical weakness preventing them fom exploiting their extreme strengths to the fullest.
Cloud has godly speed, range and power at the cost of the 2nd worst recovery in the game.
Bayonetta has absurd combos & kill potential but is sluggish in frame data & mobility
Shiek is the best at dealing damage but the worst at killing of the top tiers
Diddy is an exception, being all-around good, but nothing absolutely stands out attribute-wise, making him closest to a typical Master of All
Rosaluma has damage & range, but both Luma & Rosalina are frail, and Rosa alone is a mid-tier.
Any other tops that I forgot?
Pup Catte are you sure Ganon is not number 2 worst recovery? Cloud has an okay recovery.
Alex Duran Nah, ganon has amazing range on his ledge snap. If he grabs an opponent with the up b he can up b again.
Semystic well I guess he does have a better recovery with that, but, is cloud really second worst?
One character archetype you didn't mention is the Trickster. A good example I suppose would be Teddie from Persona 4 Arena. These are characters with specials that have variable effects or just straight up tricky specials that make them difficult to hit or allow them to combo in a way the rest of the cast can't. I'm not sure if this really exists in Smash, but I guess Game & Watch is the best example with his Judgement special
Lava Hound(From 'Clash Royale) is best example of Stone Wall
Fox is a better example of a fragile speedster imo. The definition of speed in movement and option coverage, but just as light as pikachu (worse horizontal and better vertical survivability ofc), with a much worse recovery (your other qualifier of fragility). He also hits light a truck though so maybe he defines the combination of a glass cannon/fragile speedster mix. great video!
Shulk has a bit of everything. So i think he takes mario's spot
No projectile, no reflector, no easy combo game (like from a d-throw) and overall horrendous frame data. He has Monado arts, sure, but he's still missing a lot.
Well, Mario doesn't have counter. Thank god...
Franchezco Lamont but he does have...
THE CAPE
oussama mrissa Shulk is not average. He's sort of a mild mighty glacier. Note how the speed art still doesn't help his frame data and how his buster or Smash art makes him insanely strong.
Franchezco Lamont Counters suck anyways (besides Bayo and Corrin), Mario's F.L.U.D.D. is far superior.
Love the Love, Simon post for Ike on the Miiverse stage.
Technically Zenyatta has the lowest health, but you the point across :)
My Overwatch corner confirmed?
I thought scout was a better example since he is the original, but whatever.
Scout would definitely be a better example, since he has double jumps and better air control
In pm, I feel like every character fits between 5 types.
Speed- uses speed to overwhelm and combo the opponent (fox)
Projectile- uses one or more great projectiles to reliably win neutral and open into their combos/kills (toon link)
Range- uses their far range to outspace the opponent and reliably win neutral that way (marth)
Wall- uses extremely fast and hard hitting moves to become impossible to approach and harshly punish every mistake an opponent makes (peach)
Super Armor- uses super armor/crouch canceling as a primary method to win neutral and hit the opponent much harder than they were hit (bowser)
Then other characters fit between these. Falco is a speed/projectile. Dedede is a range/armor. Ex.
Look at it like a spectrum? Just like gender right? *Badumtsssss I'm here all week but I will leave now..
Remember when there were just 2 genders?
Pepperidge Farm remembers
really no need to bring up this topic here just to show everyone you dislike SJWs or something
Delaberry Really no need to post your comment here saying how I shouldn't have posted my comment in the first place just to show how you don't like my joke.
i'm not just showing how i don't like your joke, i'm giving you the advice of not bringing this topic for no reason just because you don't believe there are more than two genders.
Delaberry Can't you tell he's striving to trigger you? And that he's 100% having success doing so?
Can't you see he's basking in your sensitivity about the matter? In your last comment you're basically saying "Stop it, you're upsetting me". He loves this, just don't feed him
PS. Also guys, i would not advise clicking on the link of that guy, he's spamming it in other comments as well, my antivirus nose is picking something up here. Just be advised
Your video style is looking super crisp. Keep it up.
Legend has it that if you reply early enough,
My Smash Corner responds...
Legend has it that MSC only responds if it's a comment that disagrees with the thoughts in the video..
Because fighting game, I'm surprised you didn't go a lil more into fighting game archetypes. Like the "Zoner", who wanna play keep away and play long and mid range games or "Rush Down" type characters that wanna keep up close with pressure. Because some of the types you mention here can apply a variety of ways when applied to how the character is decided aside from there raw stats. I think there's some interesting design dialog that could be made about those being tossed in the mix and how they change things up further.
Fck Meta Knight
Just don't play brawl
Darkloit Meta Knight fucks you
Darkloit I'd fuck Meta Knight
Lucario is absolutely a glass cannon! He literally becomes stronger the more he gets hit.
wouldn't that defeat the purpose of a glass cannon to not be able to take hits
One thing you missed out about the all rounder/average character is that they are typically the tutorial character. Not needing a lot of strategy or knowledge on the game to win. Cause unlike others which have drawbacks to deal with you don't really have anything to plan around thus making it easier
Sandbag would be a "Thwimp" archetype: Slow and Light, but strong.
When I thought of “arch types”, I kinda thought you meant “player styles”. Like the aggressive, defensive, etc.
If Little Mac's a Glass Cannon, then I'd feel bad for Glass Joe if he were playable.
Just in time, I was going to do a video on the Ganondorf archetype in fighting games
A better example of jack of all, master of none would be Pit/DP. Mario's combo game and crazy good recovery on aerial and bonkers start up on grounded moves tends to put him on the higher end of the spectrum closer to a master of all.
*>Ike = +ATK -SPD*
*>Doubles almost everything in FE9 and to an extent FE10*
One archetype I find very often is the one that stacks so many debuffs on you that your fighting prowess is impaired to the degree that you do close to nothing at all.
I think the Final Fantasy series started to call them Manipulators.
Thank you for making videos :) good luck in life
Nostalgia!!☺️🧁🔰
RIP My naivety.
The dynamo is slow but a BIG drawback is the ink it uses up. You use it too much you can't use it anymore. It's only like four flings.
YAY! Another MSC special!
Lucario is a mighty glacier at 0% and a glass cannon at 150%
two Glass Cannon characters that I actually Use in Games are Cammy ((SFV)) and Evil Ryu ((USF4)) both have a Great Offensive game with Damaging combos. But Evil Ryu has low stun and Cammy has below average health
you for got the REAL master of all kirby
kirby has his own class it is called "High boi" this means he can get realy high up in smash.
The ditto is the most even matchup until it's Brawl Snake dittos lol.
The banned Pokémon were usually mythical as which mean that you have to go to an event to get them. Which is unfair to those who can’t go to those events