Hey guys, loved this 2 parter! That Jane is a special instrument. I typically like the low wind pickups, but I think that for the most part these modern PAF style pickups sound great, especially when recorded. Most of us would have a really difficult time differentiating them from the originals when listening to a recording. I'm sure it's probably a different story when you're in the room. Cheers
Wow...the Flynn's...have serious mojo...I am SUPREMELY impressed! I love my Wizz's...but damn these Flynn's sound great! Well done sir! Second place, '60 355.
The low wind Flynns sounded the closest, if that's what you're after. And i know I am. However, the Murrays sounded juicy, and i liked them too. God, I could listen to the Gunstreet guy for hours. I learned a lot.
Leaving the original P.A.F's out of this comparison i liked the Murray wound P.A.F the most. IMHO it had a lot of the characteristics of a old P.A.F i like.
Pearly might have been 11 years old when the first ZZ Top album was made, but don’t forget that the old growth rainforest wood Gibson used in the 50’s was ancient. Possibly even a hundred of years old etc. Much older than the new growth used today to make guitars.
…and not everyone dries their wood the same as well. So many variables but more than likely Pearly is just a well made guitar made at the right time by the right people, played by the right person. 👌🏻
I always prefered the Oscar, but here the winner is Jane clearly ( maybe you guys changed the strings or tightened the truss rod or something - here she outperformed the Oscar for me ). Glad to see you back 🎸
Tried to find web site to look what you have for sale and couldn’t get on! Love that you two were back on you tube love your shows keep it going!!! You have been missed 😀👏
To my ears, the '58 sounded the best, but that may just be my tinnitus! Seriously, the "58 tone sounded warmer and richer than the others. Although, I feel like it might get "woofly" if you added overdrive. The Flynn low wound also sounded really good straight into the amp. The high wound sound like they would be really good overdriven.
Ringing in your ears IS supposed to be there. It's called blood flow. If the blood flow sound is loud then there's a pressure difference between the sections of your ear. I've had over 50 perforated ear drums. I've had blood pouring out of my ears. I have perfect hearing still. Your ears DO repair themselves. But of course you take care of your ears too.
It’s great to see you guys making videos again! In the comparison mix videos I liked the 355 the best actually then the early 60 burst. And then after that it was just different flavors your favorite ice cream brand. They all sounded in the mix like a Gibson with humbuckers, but they all sounded different variations of excellent and would say the reissue with repro pups sounded just as good as the real pafs. Just slightly different just like the 58 gold top sounded different from the 60 burst. I did think the stock r7 I liked the least but still sounded great overall
The Flynn's for me, hands down! I thought that the 'low wind' sounded mighty close to Jayne's voice and that the 'high wind' corresponded similarly to Oscar, but those are just my subjective opinions. Really great to see you guys, and thanks for the uploads! Btw, could we please have a short (or long lol) feature on the Worthington double-cutaway "LP" that Pat owns? Maybe a little history and such on those guitars and their builder Rich Worthington? Also maybe some history on Ed Seeling, the founder of "Silver Strings Music & Repair", and the man who commissioned the Worthington DC's. Pretty please?
Thanks for all the work you’ve done putting this together lads. All sound great, I don’t have any favourite, an embarrassment of riches for sure. Take care
Glad the cataract treatment went OK, Pat. About 20 years ago, my uncle bought a whole new (CRT) TV set because he thought the tube was wearing out. The new set didn’t make much difference but getting his eyes fixed sure did.
Good to see y'all. I had cataract surgery a couple of years back. I'm in mid '50s, but they developed as a side-effect of one of my glaucoma drops. Anyhoo, just to say, anyone out there who's due the op and a bit anxious. Don't worry. Doesn't hurt. You feel like you've got a hair in your eye for a couple of weeks while they heal, but it's no more than that. Like Pat said, it's like someone switched the lights on.
It always seemed odd that everyone thinks the craftsman/women of the fifties just didn’t pay attention or care about their work. But, we covet the instruments they made as the best. I tend to think they had vast pride in their work and excellent attention to detail. Hence the legendary guitars and pups!
I agree that they took great pride in the way they worked, but I don't think Abigail yabarra, was a clinical research electrician. I dig where you are COMMING from.
But guitarists think that people who can build a modern city CAN'T BUILD a guitar. I hate to tell you IDIOTS that if china can build a skyscraper building, then they can also easily build a guitar.
The reason there is a controversy over wood is because those who say that the the pickup can only ring out what the strings give it are actually right. There are situations in building the right acoustics for a concert hall that have the answer. Architect's discuss how and what frequencies the wood can absorb. So the right piece of wood can deny the strings to get frequencies we do not want by absorbing them. That is why wood maters.
What's doug & pat's pickup suggestion for an aftermarket mint les paul? I have mint Gibson Burstbucker pro pickups. Or relic billy gibbons pearly gates. Or relic Seymour Duncan's antiquity 1st issue pickups? I have made the pearly gates pickups do perfect eliminator type of sound. Sharp dressed man sound. Or something else?
They all sound real good. Pick ups are old devices, they aren't magic.If you played my old walnut " The Paul," you'd be surprised how close you come to your legendary paf tone.
But doug and pat don't want you to hear those tones. Should I be dumping the Hendrix sounds for these quazi Clapton or loozer gibbons squashed sounds? That guy just BS's so much. Zztop greatest hits on CD was a real low point 👉 in my life accept for the CD player's ability to replay hush a billion times in a row.
I thought about this comment last night and just wanted to say that D&P always point to the ZZTop First album as their tonal benchmark which is backs up my first comment about old Marshalls and Celestions with pulsonic cones. So that certainly isn't a 'loozer" recipe! I enjoy the guys videos because they home in on exactly what made all those classic albums great gearwise and why all of us can't enough of those iconic tones. @@Gma7788
"What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence." This is Hitchen's razor. Take this for what it's worth which, coincidentally, is exactly what this video is worth. As evidence it's worthless; as entertainment, it's not bad.
The ES 335 is all over the place. The 1960 is flying! The 1958 is still under tight control and on the runway ready to take off. The 1st aftermarket pickup is a tone version and looses all the singing qualities. The 2nd aftermarket pickup is a fat tone version. No flying or runway qualities. The 3rd aftermarket pickup is flying but it's a thick tone version with no clarity or crisp notes. The clear winner is the 1960. Followed closely by the 1958. The others are a long way off. These 2 inspired me to immediately go play my perfectly quarter sawn timber les paul.
I’m actually looking for a nice R8. It would be cool to own a Doug & Pat guitar- I’d probably lie and tell everyone it was a very limited edition Gibson “GEEZER” model
@@DFraserHomes me too,and the ones that I could sing in C, or b#/flat or the spot where sharp would be, makes it easier. Brian Thanks for responding I usually don't have anyone to talk about these things anymore.
I like to use didgeridoo wood for my spacers, just kidding but I just learned there is a difference between Eastern and Michigan maple, I'm curious to test the tone difference.
the 355, 60 and one of the middle ones the guitar was alittle more over the track, the 355 you were getting more pinch harmonics out of and thats my pick. but they all, to my ear sounded great in the track but i think you could pull any lp off the wall and it would compare, that is if you felt good about playing it.
@@DFraserHomes it was painfully long for all of us. But I enjoy the he'll out of it. I like to make light of it,but we need these guys to work on the guitars. There's a guy in Detroit Mike koonts, Whose one of these geeky geniuses. Incredibly talented.
Couldn't hear any difference in the two vintage LP's. Slight differences in the R7's. All sounded great. If I h ad to choose I liked the 335 the best, but I always liked the sound of that guitar. A good friend had an SG when they were still branded as a "Les Paul" model which always had a great sound, really cut through the mix I think he used a Fender Bandmaster amp?
TWO Doug and Pat videos in ONE day = Happiness
Great videos!! The vintage Gibsons sound incredible. Please don't make us wait too long for the next Video. Love the channel, Thanks.
Only set they said even came close was Amber Spirit of 59 set...with A5's.
Hey guys, loved this 2 parter! That Jane is a special instrument. I typically like the low wind pickups, but I think that for the most part these modern PAF style pickups sound great, especially when recorded. Most of us would have a really difficult time differentiating them from the originals when listening to a recording. I'm sure it's probably a different story when you're in the room. Cheers
Jane was my fav in the comparo. Loved the underwound Flynns, too. Great to watch you again folks.
Man that’s a great tone! Great to see you two roosters again. Keep rockin
Oh yeah so glad to see the boys back!!!! Greetings all the way from Croatia!
Wow...the Flynn's...have serious mojo...I am SUPREMELY impressed! I love my Wizz's...but damn these Flynn's sound great! Well done sir! Second place, '60 355.
The low wind Flynns sounded the closest, if that's what you're after. And i know I am. However, the Murrays sounded juicy, and i liked them too. God, I could listen to the Gunstreet guy for hours. I learned a lot.
Sean has a passion for what he's doing on par with the pickup makers. We learned a lot too. D&P
@@DFraserHomes yeah, it shows, man. His whole oeuvre is what you need once you get pups that you like.
Enjoyed the show. I think it can be like going down a rabbit hole when you get into the pros and cons of guitar pickups.
My ears melted with that great blues guitar track and those awesome tones!
Welcome back! Thanks for posting - a perfect Saturday morning with Doug, Pat some PAFs and a Greenback. Mmm, mmm, mmm 😛
great show, thanks
Yes, what he said about early goldtops, they do sound single coilish, they sound the closest to P90s to my ears....for me, this is the sound!
I love these guys, keep up the good work, more P90's please.
Leaving the original P.A.F's out of this comparison i liked the Murray wound P.A.F the most. IMHO it had a lot of
the characteristics of a old P.A.F i like.
❤Thankyou!😊
@@murrayguitarpickups9545 👍
Pearly might have been 11 years old when the first ZZ Top album was made, but don’t forget that the old growth rainforest wood Gibson used in the 50’s was ancient. Possibly even a hundred of years old etc. Much older than the new growth used today to make guitars.
…and not everyone dries their wood the same as well. So many variables but more than likely Pearly is just a well made guitar made at the right time by the right people, played by the right person. 👌🏻
I had a lens transplant in my ONE eye about 4 years ago. Piece of cake and it did improve my distance eyesight! Now I can see how my guitar sounds.
Love this show!! Thanks!
I always prefered the Oscar, but here the winner is Jane clearly ( maybe you guys changed the strings or tightened the truss rod or something - here she outperformed the Oscar for me ). Glad to see you back 🎸
So the biggest question is after testing all these aftermarket pafs over the years what are your favorite ones?
Tried to find web site to look what you have for sale and couldn’t get on! Love that you two were back on you tube love your shows keep it going!!! You have been missed 😀👏
It's not on the web site, especially since our web master died (really). Send us an email and we'll get the info to you. D&P
To my ears, the '58 sounded the best, but that may just be my tinnitus! Seriously, the "58 tone sounded warmer and richer than the others. Although, I feel like it might get "woofly" if you added overdrive. The Flynn low wound also sounded really good straight into the amp. The high wound sound like they would be really good overdriven.
Ringing in your ears IS supposed to be there.
It's called blood flow.
If the blood flow sound is loud then there's a pressure difference between the sections of your ear.
I've had over 50 perforated ear drums.
I've had blood pouring out of my ears.
I have perfect hearing still.
Your ears DO repair themselves.
But of course you take care of your ears too.
As always love the show guys
So Happy 😂 you guys are Back 🎉THAT R7 GOLDIE 🔊 sounds Dam Good Stock
They chucked a wobbly and left UA-cam for a while.
Or was it a hissy fit.
Not sure which.
love the clarity of the Flynn low wind neck pu
It’s great to see you guys making videos again! In the comparison mix videos I liked the 355 the best actually then the early 60 burst. And then after that it was just different flavors your favorite ice cream brand. They all sounded in the mix like a Gibson with humbuckers, but they all sounded different variations of excellent and would say the reissue with repro pups sounded just as good as the real pafs. Just slightly different just like the 58 gold top sounded different from the 60 burst. I did think the stock r7 I liked the least but still sounded great overall
The Flynn's for me, hands down!
I thought that the 'low wind' sounded mighty close to Jayne's voice and that the 'high wind' corresponded similarly to Oscar, but those are just my subjective opinions.
Really great to see you guys, and thanks for the uploads!
Btw, could we please have a short (or long lol) feature on the Worthington double-cutaway "LP" that Pat owns? Maybe a little history and such on those guitars and their builder Rich Worthington? Also maybe some history on Ed Seeling, the founder of "Silver Strings Music & Repair", and the man who commissioned the Worthington DC's. Pretty please?
They preferred the Amber Spirit of 59 set. They said it came closer to Oscar than any other set, and they actually met with the winder Wolfgang.
Thanks for all the work you’ve done putting this together lads. All sound great, I don’t have any favourite, an embarrassment of riches for sure. Take care
Great show guys. I really hope Pats still around for the next show too.
Glad the cataract treatment went OK, Pat. About 20 years ago, my uncle bought a whole new (CRT) TV set because he thought the tube was wearing out. The new set didn’t make much difference but getting his eyes fixed sure did.
Pete is the man! He is winding the best pick ups out there right now. So glad you got him on the show
Wrong.
Good to see y'all.
I had cataract surgery a couple of years back. I'm in mid '50s, but they developed as a side-effect of one of my glaucoma drops. Anyhoo, just to say, anyone out there who's due the op and a bit anxious. Don't worry. Doesn't hurt. You feel like you've got a hair in your eye for a couple of weeks while they heal, but it's no more than that.
Like Pat said, it's like someone switched the lights on.
I found trying not to bend over, all THOES DROPS, and being able to pick up my guitar for 5 days a hassle. No pain and no more glasses/contacts
Pete kicks ass…. He’s a bonafide player/gear head and super passionate about his craft.
Yes! A new D&P video!!!
Doug and Pat🏆🏆The Gold Standard
It always seemed odd that everyone thinks the craftsman/women of the fifties just didn’t pay attention or care about their work. But, we covet the instruments they made as the best. I tend to think they had vast pride in their work and excellent attention to detail. Hence the legendary guitars and pups!
Thanks for the hang time.
I agree that they took great pride in the way they worked, but I don't think Abigail yabarra, was a clinical research electrician.
I dig where you are COMMING from.
But guitarists think that people who can build a modern city CAN'T BUILD a guitar.
I hate to tell you IDIOTS that if china can build a skyscraper building, then they can also easily build a guitar.
😂look at the homes built between 1887-1967 and you will see those houses hold up where the homes built today are made from particle boards.
Cheers from Adrogue..!!! looking good guys...!!!
okay I made it to the next show! I'm not somebody who needs to be told 4 times!!
We couldn't risk it. Har! D&P
The reason there is a controversy over wood is because those who say that the the pickup can only ring out what the strings give it are actually right.
There are situations in building the right acoustics for a concert hall that have the answer. Architect's discuss how and what frequencies the wood can absorb.
So the right piece of wood can deny the strings to get frequencies we do not want by absorbing them. That is why wood maters.
We agree, you can feel the vibrations of the instrument in your hands and body even when not plugged in. D&P
loved to hear you reference Peter Sodlers the famous typing error
Wonderful chat
Great discussion,with a cup of tea and biscuit, ,,,,🤔
Yousa! Im so glad you're back!
Won't be for long.
sweeeeeet! wearing my pat & doug shirt!!
Insanely informative
that 58 gold top was standout - I heard Paul kossoff in there for sure!!
I heard the 60's but not some specific player.
Music’s cool. 🤙🤙
Great show! Question. If the logo and merch has Doug on the left & Pat on the right why is the opposite in your videos? Hmmm.
ABOUT TIME !!!!!! 🤘
Great to see u 2 young whippersnappers 😅 🎸🔊🎶
What's doug & pat's pickup suggestion for an aftermarket mint les paul?
I have mint Gibson Burstbucker pro pickups.
Or relic billy gibbons pearly gates.
Or relic Seymour Duncan's antiquity 1st issue pickups?
I have made the pearly gates pickups do perfect eliminator type of sound. Sharp dressed man sound.
Or something else?
I can Dig it. 🤙🤙❤️
They all sound real good. Pick ups are old devices, they aren't magic.If you played my old walnut " The Paul," you'd be surprised how close you come to your legendary paf tone.
It's funny you mention "The Paul", I played one at a jam session a few years ago and it actually sounded quite good. Doug
Nobody wanted to buy the Paul here for years so I decided to talk about it and it sold quickly after that.
I haven't seen it since.
Surprise SURPRISE!!!
Not bad Dougie
A few more years of Lessons and you will get there. ,😀
The other main factor in those classic PAF tones were the 60's Marshall amps loaded with Celestions with the epic tones of Pulsonic tones!🤘👍🤘
That's the truth! D&P
But doug and pat don't want you to hear those tones.
Should I be dumping the Hendrix sounds for these quazi Clapton or loozer gibbons squashed sounds?
That guy just BS's so much.
Zztop greatest hits on CD was a real low point 👉 in my life accept for the CD player's ability to replay hush a billion times in a row.
I thought about this comment last night and just wanted to say that D&P always point to the ZZTop First album as their tonal benchmark which is backs up my first comment about old Marshalls and Celestions with pulsonic cones. So that certainly isn't a 'loozer" recipe! I enjoy the guys videos because they home in on exactly what made all those classic albums great gearwise and why all of us can't enough of those iconic tones. @@Gma7788
"What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence." This is Hitchen's razor. Take this for what it's worth which, coincidentally, is exactly what this video is worth.
As evidence it's worthless; as entertainment, it's not bad.
All three of you guys are as burnt as Tom Boucovic and Joe Walsh's lost blue Tele with stars on it.
But legend has it that,
It was a start.
Profound.
What's doug and pat's suggestion for buying a collection of guitars 🎸 as if doug and pat were starting over?
The tone hounds are back !!!!!
The secret is that there is no secret.
Wow,man.
How does he feel about the solder joints.
Immediately, first 30 seconds. It sounds like Dave Stephens saying it is the closest thing.
I was not aware of any gold tops in 58,and 59, but it makes sense.
They all can't be flame tops.
The change from the gold top to sunburst finish was somewhere in 1958 but not January 1st. D&P
@@DFraserHomes very good, I didn't know that. Cool, I never was able to find out about racks of guitars ,made in bunches.
Guitarists think that whole countries can't build a guitar.
The ES 335 is all over the place.
The 1960 is flying!
The 1958 is still under tight control and on the runway ready to take off.
The 1st aftermarket pickup is a tone version and looses all the singing qualities.
The 2nd aftermarket pickup is a fat tone version. No flying or runway qualities.
The 3rd aftermarket pickup is flying but it's a thick tone version with no clarity or crisp notes.
The clear winner is the 1960.
Followed closely by the 1958.
The others are a long way off.
These 2 inspired me to immediately go play my perfectly quarter sawn timber les paul.
I’m actually looking for a nice R8. It would be cool to own a Doug & Pat guitar- I’d probably lie and tell everyone it was a very limited edition Gibson “GEEZER” model
We would back you up on that. D&P
You might end up sounding like jack fossil instead of Billy tea.
Guitar Tone, is what you like.
Hey guys ,do you remember what song you were playing in the pics, with the bursts.
It looks like you are playing Chuck Berry chords, rocking away.
Hard to say, we did a lot of songs in A that looked like that. D&P
@@DFraserHomes me too,and the ones that I could sing in C, or b#/flat or the spot where sharp would be, makes it easier. Brian
Thanks for responding I usually don't have anyone to talk about these things anymore.
I think Doug found Pat's true calling.. modeling.😉
I was in Milan last Spring, we got inspired. Sort of. D&P
I like to use didgeridoo wood for my spacers, just kidding but I just learned there is a difference between Eastern and Michigan maple, I'm curious to test the tone difference.
9:40 through the whole video i was waiting to hera that beat up fender amp.
the 355, 60 and one of the middle ones the guitar was alittle more over the track, the 355 you were getting more pinch harmonics out of and thats my pick. but they all, to my ear sounded great in the track but i think you could pull any lp off the wall and it would compare, that is if you felt good about playing it.
For me ..
FiMatzio SD
Or
Jim Wagner ECT Couls
🎵r0ck0n Doug and Pat and Jane and Oscar 🎵
Hey Doug, where did you find this harness guy, NASA..
In Portland where we live. Great info, it made my head hurt. Doug
@@DFraserHomes it was painfully long for all of us. But I enjoy the he'll out of it.
I like to make light of it,but we need these guys to work on the guitars.
There's a guy in Detroit Mike koonts,
Whose one of these geeky geniuses.
Incredibly talented.
The ‘60 355 sounded the best IMHO. But those Pete Flynn’s (low wind) sounded very good
Nylon 70,mm.picks.
Actually 60,mm.for strumming.
Plexiglass and made out of metal and aluminum electric guitars sound just like wood guitars.
These recordings are are. ...ffs the signal chain COMEON.
EMAIL SENT about one of the guitars you are selling!👍
Couldn't hear any difference in the two vintage LP's. Slight differences in the R7's. All sounded great. If I h
ad to choose I liked the 335 the best, but I always liked the sound of that guitar. A good friend had an SG when they were still branded as a "Les Paul" model which always had a great sound, really cut through the mix I think he used a Fender Bandmaster amp?
He's designed to play dungeons and dragons.
Basically .......
A good PAF.desigen sound is in the WOOD of the guitar..
East or West, wood must be kiln dried, hopefully aged ,in gibbos,
I understand 20 40,yrs.
I wonder what kind of tone he could get on acid.
What
I didn't understand a God damn thing he said.
Me thinks the "Boys" found a true geek. In a good way.
why is he talking about his PAF when they weren't even PAF. I found his quite thin and brittle for a PAF. they are meant to sound creamy
They’re not “meant” to sound anything except a P-90 without the hum. What they can or can’t sound like is a different story…