One more bit of information to insure your Leica is properly loaded. After the baseplate is installed, shutter cocked, and the slack taken out via the rewind knob, you should see the two red dots in the center of the rewind knob spin during each of the following frame advances in the roll.
Thanks so much for this tutorial. I recently got an M4 and a friend showed me and loaded it the right way only to realize later that the lead never caught in the “tulip” and ended up shooting a blank roll. So I became overly cautious and load film like how you did. But now I’m going to try again with the correct way. My M4 didn’t come with a manual so I didn’t know about lifting and advancing with the rewind lever first.
Thank you for the video Gary. I learnt the hard way last year when I shot 2 rolls of 36 frames, all blank. Painful. This is why the indicator of the rewind knob moving is very important.
Hey Gary, great you took the time to re-explain, and re-record, the loading method. I was one of the guys saying you where doing it wrong 😊. I do not crank it twice after taking the slack out of the film to avoid tension on the springs inside the camera If I don’t take a picture immediately. Cheers and looking forward to see your next video.👍
Glad that there is now a second video on YT where someone loads it correctly. It’s crazy how many people call it difficult or bad and even make wrong tutorials about it… even though all would be remedied by simply reading the manual. IMO it’s one of the easiest systems and allows you to get 38 shots with no problems.
The more I watch your videos, the more I want an M and a 28mm for street photography in cities…😂 Ruben Radding almost never focuses his (he range focuses only) and it just looks like fun too use it.
great explanation. the problem of sticking fingers in is that it could damage the shutter tension if you accidentally poked it. that's why it's best to just leave that shutter plane area free of anything!
I wind the film with the film reel BEFORE inserting it into the camera (of course I'm careful not to let the tail enter completely into the canister). So it's already under tension from the beginning and I don't have to pull out the rewind button to tension the film. I insert, two empty shots to bring the film to pose 1 and I'm ready. It's easier and faster.
There are several videos on this topic. I've had an M7 and currently an M4-P. About 50% of the time loading this way (according to manual) will lead to the sprockets not being engaged and the film not advancing properly. Don't know why that is, but it is and there's plenty of people with the same issue. Even Dan Tamarkin, who sells hundreds of cameras, makes sure the sprockets are engaged. It only takes one second more to make sure they are aligned, even if you don't wind before closing up, as Dan does in his video. There's no wrong way if the camera works properly once you close the bottom plate!
Tamarkin’s way of loading it - watching his video - uses up about half the roll of film before he closes the back…. Half joking. Do you wonder what that tulip shape thing is on the film plate? That guides the film into the correct position so the film is properly aligned as you start winding on. If you wind on the Tamarkin way before you close it up, the film can become misaligned on the spool which may lead to feeding issues as you start shooting. That happened to me when I used the Tamarkin way before I found a copy of the manual online. Think about it more simply, who knows what they are doing - the engineers at Leica who designed and built the camera - or some guy who ignores the instructions?
The back flap makes it much easier to load than on the old pre M Leicas. No cutting leader or putting the shutter on Bulb and going through the open shutter to straighten the film.
and every time I load mine, i do just like you did! Always messing with the leader to make sure it was on sprocket top and bottom...PITA!! Question for you, do you leave camera ready to shoot and if so, do you put it on B---bulb....or advance and shoot, leaving it where you have to advance when ready to shoot next time
Advance the film and have it ready to shoot, unless you are worried about accidentally pressing the shutter button. The shutter springs are always partially tensioned - more after winding, less after shooting, but never "fully wound." They won't wear out by leaving the camera ready to shoot.
So, was reading the manual for the MP (getting over a cold) and read the “Notes” section on page 77 - “As with any ready to use film, the leader must be trimmed.” I think you and 99.9999% of us are still doing it wrong.😮
Thank you for your inquiry. Unless your leader is damaged or you're bulk-loading film, the standard leader from most film manufacturers should work fine in your camera.” Thanks!
So… I wrote back and mentioned that the translation may have been a bit off, and was surprised to receive a thoughtful response - “I agree, the wording can be confusing despite it technically being correct. It would be more easily understood if worded, “film should have a trimmed leader similar to standard ready-to-use film”.” Very interesting and really to the bottom of this huge issue. LOL The fact that a real person from Leica responded so thoughtfully, says a lot about Leica being a quality company. I enjoy my MP and know it was worth every penny. Happy shooting!
Ok I took a look at page 77. I saw that reference to trimming the film in the notes. I believe that is referring to film whose leader isn’t cut. Most major maker film is already pre cut. If you bulk load your rolls, then you would have to cut the leader. I think that is what the manual refers to in that instance.
A lot easier than loading an M2 or M3 which used the older take out spools. Later M2’s ie M2R had the same spool as the M4 and later film M’s. Leica made a modification kit for the older M’s but these are now hard to find and are costly. I’m just an old f*rt and use the old spools. Also my Leica IIIa uses the take out spools. Like a math problem there are often more than one way to solve it. Just like @goesch after closing I advance the film twice. On M2’s you have to set the counter next. Also after closing the back and bottom plate on the older take up spool, use rewind knob to partially rewind film until there’s tension then advance film and make sure the dots on the rewind knob rotate…..if not then sprockets not aligned so check. If they do rotate and advance was smooth then you’re ok to start shooting. On newer Leica’s with the newer take up spool, which doesn’t come out, after closing back and bottom plate partially advance film before rewinding on the rewind crank until there’s tension then advance film and make sure your rewind crank moves then you’re set to go. You learn to check the rotation of the rewind after a couple of times when you have a short rewind and find your 36 shots were lost because your film didn’t advance. …. One downside of film but then with digital make sure you have charged batteries lol
yes, quite a learning curve, as, apart from some Minolta and other point & shoot film cameras of the 70's this is the ONLY camera which loads this way the canon and Nikon load with a door that opens toward you. one other step, HERE you must decide to put the winder grip on, or just the plate, as, like some other slr designs the film chamber must be breeched to add the drive, so you CANT do it when a roll is in, unlike say a 120 roll hasselblad 503CW or 205Fcc, which has its motor drive on the body crank, these cameras have it on the base of the body. PS this loading must be done this way, as for reloadable 'cans' there is a locking sleeve as part of the can's design, a knob on the sleeve rotates it in sync with the door locker, they interlock, so you physically cant shift the film as the sleeve covers the film opening in the can itself.
@@LensForgotten maybe it is intuitive?, perhaps once memorised, and for me, as an Autistic, thinking of it like : guide in roughly, shut door, anchor film leader with sprockets, tension up, wind-up, set. seems a logical way of setting up. and now, from this video coming to the realisation its 'idiot proof' is a good sense to have, esp. for first timers with Leica cameras.
I don't do this method because the first time I tried to do it "the correct way", closed the bottom, and started advancing - it tore my film apart. For info, I have a Leica M6 2022 reissue.
@@LensForgotten Nope. I don't deny the possibility of me messing something up when loading the film, but ever since that one time, I haven't tried doing it the Leica way, so I keep pushing the film and aligning it with my fingers myself, then I advance the lever slightly to see if the teeth go into the notches and move the film. Only then I close the lid and advance it a couple of times.
This doesnt work with my M4-p. I tried 3 or 4 times but it failed to load. Only way was to ensure the sprocket holes where aligned, and advance the frame.
@@LensForgotten Update! Spent a lot more time practicing with a dummy roll, and now it works as expected. My process: Drag the leader across into the indicated spot, and ensure the canister is all the way down. Then put the base plate on. I then put some tension on the rewind knob and advance. Works perfectly now.
However it’s too slow😂can do this if it’s the only camera you have, I load Mamiya 7 the same way as my mp or the other way around. If you do this every time it’s gonna be hard to use like iiif😂
I read the manual too and did it their way. I had two films messed up bc didn’t got taken and I had to open, re do it, etc. it works for me better to do it by aligning it myself
One more bit of information to insure your Leica is properly loaded. After the baseplate is installed, shutter cocked, and the slack taken out via the rewind knob, you should see the two red dots in the center of the rewind knob spin during each of the following frame advances in the roll.
YES! 100% true
Thanks so much for this tutorial. I recently got an M4 and a friend showed me and loaded it the right way only to realize later that the lead never caught in the “tulip” and ended up shooting a blank roll. So I became overly cautious and load film like how you did. But now I’m going to try again with the correct way. My M4 didn’t come with a manual so I didn’t know about lifting and advancing with the rewind lever first.
Witht he M4 YMMV...Let us know how you make out.
Thank you for the video Gary. I learnt the hard way last year when I shot 2 rolls of 36 frames, all blank. Painful. This is why the indicator of the rewind knob moving is very important.
:-) Yes, Those maybe optional IMHO. Get more bang for your buck!
Hey Gary, great you took the time to re-explain, and re-record, the loading method. I was one of the guys saying you where doing it wrong 😊. I do not crank it twice after taking the slack out of the film to avoid tension on the springs inside the camera If I don’t take a picture immediately. Cheers and looking forward to see your next video.👍
Thanks again! Yes I think the two crank maybe optional at the end if you want to get some more on the roll.
Glad that there is now a second video on YT where someone loads it correctly. It’s crazy how many people call it difficult or bad and even make wrong tutorials about it… even though all would be remedied by simply reading the manual. IMO it’s one of the easiest systems and allows you to get 38 shots with no problems.
100% :-) Yes, it is a breeze to load now.
thanks! I should get my MP in a couple of weeks and I'll certainly follow your suggestion
All I can say is this helped me a bunch. Thank you
Glad it helped!
Thanks for this video
The more I watch your videos, the more I want an M and a 28mm for street photography in cities…😂 Ruben Radding almost never focuses his (he range focuses only) and it just looks like fun too use it.
Go for it! You'll love it
i am sure it works that way, i have been doing it the "uncorrect" way forever and never had an issue with a roll
Sure, I was one that felt that way too. I just wanted to explain the "makers" way of doing it.
Thanks for the information. I'm already started saving for the MP. 4:33 there's no ISO 160 setting, but what ISO setting would you put for Porta 160?
The 2 tick marks between 100 and 200 are for ISO 125 and ISO 160
great explanation. the problem of sticking fingers in is that it could damage the shutter tension if you accidentally poked it. that's why it's best to just leave that shutter plane area free of anything!
Yes, the MP innerts are very fragile.
I wind the film with the film reel BEFORE inserting it into the camera (of course I'm careful not to let the tail enter completely into the canister). So it's already under tension from the beginning and I don't have to pull out the rewind button to tension the film. I insert, two empty shots to bring the film to pose 1 and I'm ready. It's easier and faster.
I hear ya. Thanks for watching ! Enjoy your Leica!
I have been opening the door and pushing the film up, but only half a advance. Ill try this out next time.
Let us know how it worked for you!
This is awesome
Love the MP. Hate the cost of film now.
I also did it the wrong and complicated way until I found a manual for the M4-P I bought used many years ago.
Great video Gary thank you for publishing this information. Do you know if the same loading approach applies to the Leica M6?
It is the same for all film Ms that have the tulip spool - M4, M4-2, M4-P, M5, M6, M7, MP, M-A.
With the M6 YMMV...... Some say it works the same
thanx much was wondering if I was loading my m-a correctly 🤔
You're welcome!
Same goes for an m6 , the leica loading system works , dont even need to tighten the rewind knob
There are several videos on this topic. I've had an M7 and currently an M4-P. About 50% of the time loading this way (according to manual) will lead to the sprockets not being engaged and the film not advancing properly. Don't know why that is, but it is and there's plenty of people with the same issue. Even Dan Tamarkin, who sells hundreds of cameras, makes sure the sprockets are engaged. It only takes one second more to make sure they are aligned, even if you don't wind before closing up, as Dan does in his video. There's no wrong way if the camera works properly once you close the bottom plate!
Sure, as I said it's up to you. I just wanted to make a video showing the way the manual says to do it. YMMV
Tamarkin’s way of loading it - watching his video - uses up about half the roll of film before he closes the back…. Half joking. Do you wonder what that tulip shape thing is on the film plate? That guides the film into the correct position so the film is properly aligned as you start winding on. If you wind on the Tamarkin way before you close it up, the film can become misaligned on the spool which may lead to feeding issues as you start shooting.
That happened to me when I used the Tamarkin way before I found a copy of the manual online. Think about it more simply, who knows what they are doing - the engineers at Leica who designed and built the camera - or some guy who ignores the instructions?
would this work for leica m4p or m6, since the rewind mechanism is different?
Essentially the same....
The back flap makes it much easier to load than on the old pre M Leicas. No cutting leader or putting the shutter on Bulb and going through the open shutter to straighten the film.
Totally get you! The back flap is a lifesaver. Loading film used to feel like a mini workout!
and every time I load mine, i do just like you did! Always messing with the leader to make sure it was on sprocket top and bottom...PITA!! Question for you, do you leave camera ready to shoot and if so, do you put it on B---bulb....or advance and shoot, leaving it where you have to advance when ready to shoot next time
No messin' just addressin'
Advance the film and have it ready to shoot, unless you are worried about accidentally pressing the shutter button. The shutter springs are always partially tensioned - more after winding, less after shooting, but never "fully wound." They won't wear out by leaving the camera ready to shoot.
I follow the manual instructions, but I still often waste 4-5 exposures getting to to load properly. Maybe I’m not rewinding enough?
Take up the slack with the rewind knob
So, was reading the manual for the MP (getting over a cold) and read the “Notes” section on page 77 - “As with any ready to use film, the leader must be trimmed.” I think you and 99.9999% of us are still doing it wrong.😮
Thank you for your inquiry. Unless your leader is damaged or you're bulk-loading film, the standard leader from most film manufacturers should work fine in your camera.” Thanks!
I’ll take a took at my manual.
So… I wrote back and mentioned that the translation may have been a bit off, and was surprised to receive a thoughtful response - “I agree, the wording can be confusing despite it technically being correct. It would be more easily understood if worded, “film should have a trimmed leader similar to standard ready-to-use film”.” Very interesting and really to the bottom of this huge issue. LOL The fact that a real person from Leica responded so thoughtfully, says a lot about Leica being a quality company. I enjoy my MP and know it was worth every penny. Happy shooting!
Ok I took a look at page 77. I saw that reference to trimming the film in the notes. I believe that is referring to film whose leader isn’t cut. Most major maker film is already pre cut. If you bulk load your rolls, then you would have to cut the leader. I think that is what the manual refers to in that instance.
Pro tip: just advance twice after closing it, not three times. Most of the time you get a shot more on your roll without any light leaks.
Yes, get more value on that roll! I agree!
A lot easier than loading an M2 or M3 which used the older take out spools. Later M2’s ie M2R had the same spool as the M4 and later film M’s.
Leica made a modification kit for the older M’s but these are now hard to find and are costly. I’m just an old f*rt and use the old spools. Also my Leica IIIa uses the take out spools.
Like a math problem there are often more than one way to solve it. Just like @goesch after closing I advance the film twice. On M2’s you have to set the counter next.
Also after closing the back and bottom plate on the older take up spool, use rewind knob to partially rewind film until there’s tension then advance film and make sure the dots on the rewind knob rotate…..if not then sprockets not aligned so check. If they do rotate and advance was smooth then you’re ok to start shooting.
On newer Leica’s with the newer take up spool, which doesn’t come out, after closing back and bottom plate partially advance film before rewinding on the rewind crank until there’s tension then advance film and make sure your rewind crank moves then you’re set to go.
You learn to check the rotation of the rewind after a couple of times when you have a short rewind and find your 36 shots were lost because your film didn’t advance. …. One downside of film but then with digital make sure you have charged batteries lol
As from coming from an M2, yes much much easier.
yes, quite a learning curve, as, apart from some Minolta and other point & shoot film cameras of the 70's this is the ONLY camera which loads this way the canon and Nikon load with a door that opens toward you.
one other step, HERE you must decide to put the winder grip on, or just the plate, as, like some other slr designs the film chamber must be breeched to add the drive, so you CANT do it when a roll is in, unlike say a 120 roll hasselblad 503CW or 205Fcc, which has its motor drive on the body crank, these cameras have it on the base of the body. PS this loading must be done this way, as for reloadable 'cans' there is a locking sleeve as part of the can's design, a knob on the sleeve rotates it in sync with the door locker, they interlock, so you physically cant shift the film as the sleeve covers the film opening in the can itself.
Yes, it is not the most intuitive but it works for sure.
@@LensForgotten maybe it is intuitive?, perhaps once memorised, and for me, as an Autistic, thinking of it like : guide in roughly, shut door, anchor film leader with sprockets, tension up, wind-up, set. seems a logical way of setting up. and now, from this video coming to the realisation its 'idiot proof' is a good sense to have, esp. for first timers with Leica cameras.
I don't do this method because the first time I tried to do it "the correct way", closed the bottom, and started advancing - it tore my film apart. For info, I have a Leica M6 2022 reissue.
I can't say what happened in your case. Have you had a tech take a peek inside to make sure it's all good?
@@LensForgotten Nope. I don't deny the possibility of me messing something up when loading the film, but ever since that one time, I haven't tried doing it the Leica way, so I keep pushing the film and aligning it with my fingers myself, then I advance the lever slightly to see if the teeth go into the notches and move the film. Only then I close the lid and advance it a couple of times.
I’d rather load it wrong if it means not having the whole roll go blank or do a 36 multiple exposures on the first frame.
Sure, I get it.
This doesnt work with my M4-p. I tried 3 or 4 times but it failed to load. Only way was to ensure the sprocket holes where aligned, and advance the frame.
Interesting. Good to know.
@@LensForgotten Update! Spent a lot more time practicing with a dummy roll, and now it works as expected. My process: Drag the leader across into the indicated spot, and ensure the canister is all the way down. Then put the base plate on. I then put some tension on the rewind knob and advance. Works perfectly now.
Don’t touch the pressure plate with your fingers. It says that in the manual as well.
Yes, I keep my fat fingers away!
However it’s too slow😂can do this if it’s the only camera you have, I load Mamiya 7 the same way as my mp or the other way around. If you do this every time it’s gonna be hard to use like iiif😂
LOL...... agreed
If you want to have fun, load a Barnack.
I want to get a barnack someday
I read the manual too and did it their way. I had two films messed up bc didn’t got taken and I had to open, re do it, etc. it works for me better to do it by aligning it myself
Interesting.
Well, I get 38-39 photos per roll…
Sure, I like to rawdog it maybe an extra frame or two.... :-) Just skip the two advances at the end, and you'll be doing well.
Does it matter
why am I watching this video? I can't afford a leica
See my "Cheap Leica VIdeo" to find the best way to save money