Can our Mk5 VW Golf GTI beat a Mk8 Golf R with these mods? | PH Project Car Pt.3
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- Опубліковано 15 чер 2023
- Our GTI gets treated to new coilovers, tyres and Audi S3 brakes. How much time is it worth on track?
Resisting the urge to chuck more power at it, we turn our attention to giving PH Project Car's chassis a serious makeover using parts and accessories found on eBay. Sticking to our strict budget of £10,000 - including the car - we splash out on delicious new BC Racing coilovers, bag a full set of Nankang NS2R semi-slick tyres and give the front brakes a fresh with Brembo discs, Ferodo pads and new callipers. Yes, they say GTI on them but they've actually come off an Audi S3 and likely put on another GTI at some stage). Suffice to say, our GTI feels a whole lot quicker than before, but is it enough to overthrow our Golf R 20 Years rival on track? Cam heads to Curborough to find out...
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PH Project Car Part 1: • We’re building a VW Go...
PH Project Car Part 2: • Can our Mk5 VW Golf GT...
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Watch the full series here:
Episode 1 - ua-cam.com/video/FC4ngNWCr7I/v-deo.html
Episode 2 - ua-cam.com/video/XyudaCE4YUk/v-deo.html
Episode 4 - ua-cam.com/video/3imFVfUPvbs/v-deo.html
Episode 5 - ua-cam.com/video/wUgyPIrUCOk/v-deo.html
Episode 6 - ua-cam.com/video/jnCaRevMJfQ/v-deo.html
Just 3 seconds difference between an age-old Mk5 and the very latest (and most powerful) Golf Mk8. That's incredible.
Over a 30s lap it’s a lot
The track is tiny. On a bigger track the difference will much larger. 3 secs is a lot on any track
@@dF-ww8md Most track experienced people will know that but it's still a good effort
3 seconds slower sound close, but people who know, know it isn’t. 3 seconds is a huge distance. Not forgetting the tiny distance travelled, over a real distance, that will increase massively. What of time and nothing to be chuffed about.
@@SM0KE_0RIG1NAL Yeah yeah, yeah. everyone’s a racing pro on this platform and knows more than everyone else. It’s still a decent effort. Enough of the semantics Poindexter
Mk5 GTI is an icon!
This has me super excited. I currently just started my build on my UA-cam channel and knowing that a couple of changes on my Mk6 GTI and I could have so much improvement on the track. It’s currently stage one.
At the end, make sure you get the pro driver to drive it to see how close he can get. (not saying your a bad driver at all haha)
Haha, you’ll have to keep watching to find out 😉
Awesome series! I drive a Mk5 GTI myself so this is really fun to see!
Thanks very much for watching!
Great video guys!
Impressive difference over a short track
Great episode, closing the gap, very impressive! Stance looks spot on to me 🤙🤙🤙
You guys are near enough spot on, the callipers are from the S3 8P, Edition 30 GTI and the R32. I will say I already miss my black MK5 GTI after I part exchanged it a few weeks back for an E92.
The 345mm brakes never came on the edition 30, they were the 312mm ones like the normal GTi.
And funnily enough I sold my e90 last month and bought a black mk5 GTi. So much more fun 😉
Amazing!
Great gains from only doing handling improvements!
So many underestimate how crucial handling is when modifying their cars. 🤓
I reckon it would be quite close with the Golf R, once the power gains are done on the GTI
Good luck!
Good video. Excited for this as I have a mk5 now. I use it for spirited driving and always looking for ways to make it a little more "awake"
Really enjoying this! More please
Yeah upload more and more
Good effort. Put a thicker rear roll bar on and have all them heavy seats out.
Leave the seats in. It's a daily driver, and it's lining up against the R which has all it's seats. But yes, thicker rear sway bar for sure, understeer will be gone.
Those mods really should be at the top of the list of anybody wanting to tinker with their car. People always chase more power, but regardless of engine output, you only have four bits of rubber connecting you to the road! Tyres, brakes and suspension. Always!
Looks sensational guys. Well done. When do I get to pick it up?
liked before I view the video, love to see what's next
Thanks for the kind words! Lots more to come
Rear sway bar is a must
Very impressive!! Would be interested to see how it would be if they used the same driver
Stay tuned...
Seized callipers in my mk5 gti are the bane of my life
Enjoyed that. Can't really see how it's going to go much quicker unless you take some weight out of it.
Interesting result, so far. Can't wait to see what you do next.
I guess a stage 1 engine upgrade?
I recall seeing an article on upgrading the MkV from the late 00's, and BBR did a modified lower suspension arm that introduced some negative camber into the front suspension, and that apparently made a huge difference to the front end grip and car balance.
I believe the same can be achieved with lower control arms off some Audi TT models, or more expensively with arms made by Supaloy from Australia.
Also you could make up some foam bolsters to stop you sliding around on those big leather seats - worth a second on their own! 😅
I’m liking this build! Those brakes are 345mm and were fitted to s3, leon Cupra and mk6 golf r’s
Oh yeah and mk5 r32
@@mrvolkswagon1710 and Passat R36 I think?.
@@mcjdubpower exactly
@@elazotacunaos4752 I have them on my mk5 😉
Anti Lift Kit and LSD for grip get a remap stage 2+ from R Tech Nicky Gower is the man Airtec2 Intercooler best brakes are Audi TTRS better stopping if needs must and Ko4 Turbo from ED30 or S3 and also same driver for both cars Good Luck
The mk5 still looks great. I own an mk6 GTI with k04 and an mk6R stock, and the mk5 is my second favorite generation behind them. If I found one with an mk6 interior I'd be all over it.
Put the pro driver in that mk5 and I bet he'd shave another couple of seconds off that lap.
Love the ph project keep it coming
An impressive improvement but,b from what I could gather, there's a lot more tweaking available in just the suspension. If it's still under steering, tightening up the rear will bring it closer to balance as it'll make the back more skittish and even up with the front, letting you play with balanced slip on corners.
Needs a rear sway bar upgrade, first mod I did to my MKV when I bought it 15 years ago. Massive improvement.
Same set up on my mk4 u got NS-2R shoes it stops and corners a remap with a few bolt ons would get closer to the time be better than spending it elsewhere really other than stripping the interior which was not the plan i imagine
When I buy stuff from eBay it doesn’t come wrapped in eBay branded boxes and stickers
You can purchase packaging from them which is obviously branded.
Check out the Tyrolsport brake caliper stiffening kit, it will transform the brake pedal feel & overall performance 👌👌
Brakes are off my old GTI 😅 they've been well used but worked a treat!
has anyone used the tires they fitted as daily tires or are they better suited to just being track tires?
i like this video
In the last episode I hope you do the brake test again as I'd always assumed better brakes mostly meant better fading rather than better stopping power. Glad to be proved wrong though!
Cheers 👍
You're correct. Bigger brakes provide better heat dissipation, not bigger stopping power. The original brakes were already more than capable at locking the wheels up. Only wider tyres increase stopping power
rear swaybar only upgrade. and a anti lift kit for the fronts to stop any wheel hop. dont do front sway bar or the car will still be understeery.
The $10k is purely spent on parts alone right? I feel like labour and install adds up to significantly more
Hope much unsprung weight did the new, bigger brakes add? I'm not sure improved heat dissipation will be utilised doing the occasional, short lap. Presumably, the coilovers would have reduced weight?
Bingo! That’s why on my MK5 I kept the stock disc but I used the Porsche 986 calipers instead and she stops on a dime. Also, the Porsche calipers are 12 pounds lighter and later I added 2 piece rotors which shaved off another 7 pounds.
Rear anti roll bar, braided brake lines should've been a definite too.
Some of the fastest times in GTI are done in comfort mode.
Megane RS265 with a remap. Job done, no parts required.. would not help the narrative of the sponsored content though.
Camber and allignement next, should be cheap
great mod series here PH. Just one thing you've not considered though is cost of labour, most people don't have the luxury of having their own workshop! Would be interesting to know what the cost would actually come to with this
Replacing Disks, calipers, and suspension could be within the skill set of many home mechanics , with a beginners tool kit, and a handy mate for guidance. Maybe there's a follow-up video of the nitty gritty of the swaps
Really need that brake upgrade, or is the tyre upgrade already sufficient for the few laps you'll do on track? "bigger brakes, more stopping power", I recommend: ua-cam.com/video/Ql9eYh31kTw/v-deo.html
I would save on the brakes (both cost and more importantly weight). It's absolutely not needed for such a small track, better cooling will not be an advantage in 30 seconds and the stopping power is always limited by tires. Some Toyo R888 on lighter wheels, a nice front wheel alignment and a rear antiroll bar would make a nice improvement for sure.
I hope you make the last lap time with the same driver
Bigger brakes dont give more stopping power. It just dissapates heat quicker. Tyres is what stops the car
Interesting results obviously replacing tired components is going to give results anyway and shame you are doing the Curborough figure of 8 Lap totally the wrong way, the times don’t mean a lot to us that know the venue
That’s Ferodo 🤦🏻♂️ it was a long day…
Baggins? 😅
Awesome work ,goin to b an r beater
So what size was the stock brakes vs the upgrads?
Stock front rotors are 312mm and these upgraded ones from the 8P S3/mk5 R32/mk6 R are 345mm. In my opinion, it would have been enough (or better and cheaper) to upgrade the stock rears which have 286mm solid rotors to the S3's calipers and 310mm ventilated rears with upgraded pads all round.
@@reomero don't need to do the rears in my opinion.
That's a big upgrade on the front :)
I run 330mm Tarox 6's on the front and 256 vented on the rear on my Mk4.
If that was a golf edition 30 with a map and them mods it would of beat the now golf
Put a bigger rear sway bar on and kiss goodbye to the understeer.
on nurburgring those 3 seconds would actually be half a minute.
Do you think you can get it over a speed bump?
Why choose the golf R when there’s the cs
It’s proven time after time quicker around a track
Now the ECU and TCU are unlocked when both are mapped and hardware added (both use the same, the bhp is the same
Ours is stage 2 with 458.9
exactly the same more or less output as the demo R the company has
round the Anglesey track it was over a second quicker 🤷♂️
I would have done the test on 3 laps
Mk6 gti the best
K04 turbo bolt on by Turbo direct SA..more Power baby
Hope i win this
You don’t have to keep nodding at us, we’re watching
Stock MK5 GTI brakes are horrible, but replacing the stock calipers with Porsche 986 calipers transforms how the car brakes!
They're actually good if in good condition. I put new discs, pads and new fluid and it stopped amazingly.
@@daddyof3gaming522 trust me I maintain my car with quality parts and I will attest that the stock brakes with all the stuff you mentioned don’t even compare to how it now operates with the Porsche calipers.
Decat, remap, add on wavetract LSD and drive by the same pro driver for next episode
I feel like the damping adjustment is quite misleading. It isnt really making the coilovers harder or softer.
I don't understand how you can compare the two cars when you have a pro driver in one & not the other? That could easily knock a second off the comparable lap times on its own, even on such a short circuit.
We're trying to show what gains the everyday enthusiast can make from their car, which we'll go into more in the next episode. Will Charles drive our GTI? Keep watching to find out...
@@PistonHeadsTV 👍
You are a little bit scared of speed bumps I sense
Terrified
The MK5 is by far the best GTI ever made. 👍
True🔥🔥
Those Nankangs are the worst tyres I've ever had on a car
Not as bad as the old Toyo proxes TR1s, they were terrible.
ELIMINATED body roll. ELIMINATED😆thanks to EBay
Maybe a stage 2 will make it faster than the golf R
Nankang NS2R are rubbish! Overheat too fast, and have low tolerance to heatcyles... You should try the AR's1
@pistonheads Please tell me you corner weighted the GTI? If you did by just eye you are leaving time at each corner of the track. Plus no mention of body bracing. Clearly you have not autocrossed or done track days. Because the stock GTI is a wet noodle. But if you are new and have little seat time in a properly set up car you will never know
The host seemed nervous about the modifications, not like someone who is used to modifying cars at all, much less for the track..
erm same size pads means same brake force -- it's physics
Looking for seconds on a track and complaining about stiffness....🤷♂️ The point of damping adjustment is to optimally use a semi-slick/track day tyre advantage as it's stickier than a normal one. And don't underestimate the stiffness of the tyre wall as well, that changes perception of a suspension stiffness also.
Be clear as to what you want to achieve... Beat the mk8 r around a track or build a comfortable grand tourer, these are vastly different goals. It seems like you're having a bit of dilemma. This was frustrating to watch.
No. It’s just you’re dim 🤦♂️
MK8 with no mods... Throw a couple grand at it and watch it walk away
The Mk8 is already a bit dearer than a Mk5 - way over the 10k budget.
eBay sponsored…?
I think that’s pretty clear.
Is this one of those shitty competitions that can only be won by UK residents? I’d happily pay to have the car shipped to Australia if it isn’t.
Guess what, we can’t enter Australian competitions either. We just don’t cry about it 🥲
Why would you want to win this? UK has better parts for so much less, but their cars are crusty rusbuckets after only a few years! I can’t believe hoe much rust & corrosion this has on the underside. Here in Australia 🇦🇺 our MK5 GTI’s are still looking brand new underneath.
@@sunsetgarage755so true, even worse the further north you go (Scotland) I looked at a Jap import mk5 GTi once, that was immaculate!
Nankangs are garbage. I feel you should have gone with he same tire the mk8 has to be or some pilot sports.
£2000 spent and literally no improvement to speed
2.4 seconds faster doesn't sound like no improvement.
@@PistonHeadsTV You probably would have saved that time just having a better driver - the mods you made have no actual performance increase other than handling
@@anony-mousexthey should put the pro driver in the GTI when it’s finished. 2.4 seconds per lap is pretty impressive. With further mods and some driver training I reckon they’ll match the R anyway.
I always regarded pistonheads as enthusiast oriented.
Narration, word choice, and concept(puzzling at times, but "we will understand soon enough") is so cookie cutter and seen many times, that this series has been cringy to watch.