Hey Paul great video. I bought the Mk 2 back in March. I couldn't be happier with it. Does a fantastic a fantastic job with just distilled water. I pulled the filter out after 50 cleaning and couldn't believe how black it was. I really does clean beyond what the naked eye can see.
Tried your regime including Tergikleen prewash and a Degritter MKII X 6, on an old first issue Jackson Brown album from the ‘70s. Really fantastic result! Thanks.
Hi Paul, Great video. Have you compared the Degritter MK2 with the KLaudio LP200T and a DIY URCM (i.e. Elma Elmasonic P120H Ultrasonic Cleaning Batch with dual 40kHz and 80kHz frequencies and a 5 LP Spinner i.e. like the Kuzma RD unit) ? If you haven't yet, are you planning to ? Reason I ask these questions is trying to determine best way to go. I have been cleaning all of my records (have about 700 of them, mostly new / mint condition or second hand near mint with a few VG and VG+ conditions) over the past years on my trusty Keith Monks Classic RCM (what the BBC used to use in their Archive Dept) with a pre-wash, main wash (with Keith Monks Discovery Record Cleaning Fluid) and then a final rinse with distilled water. Yet I still hear pops and clicks (I am a critical listener i.e. mostly listen to my vinyl on my TOTL Headphone System consisting of a Hifiman EF1000 Headphone & Speaker Amp with Susvara Headphones connected to my CH Precision P1 Phonostage with X1 External Power Supply which is connected to my Kuzma XL DC TT fitted with a Kuzma 4Point 11" arm & MSL Eminent Ex cartridge) even if I repeat this washing regime on my Keith Monks RCM a further once or twice more. Hence me thinking of buying a URCM to give all of my records the Ultrasonic final clean treatment. Your thoughts on the above would be much appreciated.
I am sure that the Degritter MK2 is the best cleaner that you can buy but in Canada, it sells for $4000.00+, I chose the manual cleaner that Paul recommended a while ago. It might not be an equal solution to cleaning records but It is very affordable, Vinyl Styl Deep Groove Record Washer System at $125.00 CDN. Thanks for the review. Take care.
Hi Paul, thank you for such a detailed video on the degritter. Following your advice of using tergikleen for 6 cycles and then a rinse, would the water need to be changed for the rinse, considering there's now tergikleen in the water?
I personally wait until around 30 washes and then change (depending on the condition of the vinyl you're cleaning). Yes, the water is being contaminated but I find the contamination level is not enough to impact the clean up to 30 times. BUT. But. I know people who have two baths. One for rinsing only and that's a great thing. I support it. I might do that myself in the future. For now? I'm happy with my lower-cost system.
Excellent Paul & a very worthwhile watch. I bought the MKII in May & have to say, it's outstanding in everyway, much better than my Audio Desk. I too love how the MKII monitors the whole process right through. I have also added a Disco Antistat after watching another one of your videos, because of "attrition". 99% of the LPs I buy are secondhand, but my "minimum" acceptance for these 50 year old & older copies, is at least VG++ or EX, so I now use the Disco Antistat first, to help with the odd bit of fingerprint grease, before I move it to the Degritter. To say the MKII is good, is an understatement, but worth every single penny. Did you have a link to the actual solution & method of cleaning before you let the Degritter do it's thing?
Sure - check out the Description, there's links in there and really? There's no need if you have a Degritter 2, to bring in a Disco. The Degritter does everything the Disco does but better.
Incredible review Paul, just about to part exchange my Mk 1 for a Mk 2 thanks to a deal from Degritter. My only disappointment is that they both seem to have a shelf life which unless I’m mistaken isn’t made clear by Degritter who otherwise are an excellent company
@@tommy-6597 Based on feedback in Degritter Users Group there’s a fair few people who’s Degritter MK1 packed in somewhere between 1000-1500 uses. Degritter have been very good at replacing them. A lot of people suspect it’s more likely if you use the higher setting.
i'm still on the fourth or fifth Audiodesk; i got the first in 2008 or so and i experienced all the teething issues the first ultrasonic fully automatic record cleaning machine had. Gläss sold a LOT of their invention - but they also replaced a ton of them for free with entirely new RMCs. however, all ultrasonic machines will fail, sooner or later. having electric motors surrounded with water *is* ultimately flirting with desaster. especially if the machine is not used daily (which btw. was the #1 cause of failure for the Gläss. if used daily, they strangely last longer.) it has never bothered me that the Audiodesk "grips" the reecords with O-rings - even though the 2nd or 3rd did chew up an LP once. but i must have cleaned around 10k LPs over the years, so one damaged LP is acceptable. (what wasn't acceptable that it was a mint copy of jennifer warnes' "the hunter" before the first play.) two things: a/ in your video on Mk I you suggest a thorough rinse to remove the surfectant… others pay Last good money for a surfactant that is supposed to stay on the vinyl… b/ a gppd friend of mine builds super high quality cartridges for a living. and he repairs his carts after the cleaning lady once more dropped the arm… anyway: i regularly have him inspect and clean my/his carts. before i had the Gläss, he once showed me a stylus under the microscope with dirt almost baked to the cantilever and the stylus. he scalded me for washing my records prior to playing them (at the time, i still had a VPI). he reminded me that even though the record will *look* dry and shiny, it still is slightly damp in the grooves. since the air is full of fine dust particles, they will settle on the LP during play and form a nice compound with the remaining water molecules and the heat produced by the enormous weight per surface of the stylus during play. since then, and even with the Gläss, i clean my LPs and then put them away. they will only be played at least one day after washing them. changing my drying/spinning regime did the trick and he never had to scald me again… do the same, and don't spin your LPs right after one cycle, then again after the next… they're still damp.
Thanks for your comment and yes, I was very happy with my Audiodesk - the original and Pro. And then I heard the Degritter. Re. surfactant? Look, everyone has their pet vinyl cleaning systems so do whatever makes you happy and is pleasing to your ears but for me? Well, a stylus will 'play' whatever is underneath it. Doesn't matter what it is I can hear surfactant being 'played'. If you put something between the stylus and the groove, it will dull the sound. I've done the tests and I've heard the before and after. For me? Get it all off. Everything. I want to play grooves, not some third-party liquid. Next? Never had issues with the drying element of the Degritter. Or the Audio Desk, for that matter. Never heard any issues because of either of those. I'm not really sure what the issue is on that point. As for caked stylii? Yep, seen that too. I put that down to inadequate stylii cleaning. Which is why I use the DS Audio dry cleaner pad and never go near alcohol. My stylii are always clean. But again, hey, whatever works for you. I'm not here to preach, only to report my findings. It's up to you if you wish to take note or ignore :)
Interesting. The sound quality stuff seems a bit much, but this is hifi after all. I’m just hoping that this reduces the crackling and surface noise, which i haven’t much luck with VPIs or humming guru. I’ve never really heard any difference from cleaning in general, let alone sonic improvements
Hi Paul Your video on the Degritter MK2. I’ve never used an Ultrasonic Vinyl Cleaner. I have the Keith Monks Prodigy which uses the vacuum or suction method. Have you ever thought of reviewing the Prodigy or do you feel that the Ultrasonic method is far superior? On the back of your review, I really am thinking about purchasing the Degritter MK2
I want to review the KM machine, I've asked him, he's happy to go for it, I'm happy to go for it, it should have happened ages ago, I have enthused about his tech and designs, I have asked him to marry me and run away to the Bahamas together...I've really tried. But I sense a reluctance because of my positive comments on ultrasonic cleaners. So KM thinks i'm now anti RCM-type machines. I have no idea where that has come from. Too many whiskeys at 3am perhaps? It's all balls because I love the wholly manual Disco Antistat to bits of God's sake and I have not long done a 10,000 word guide on my website on cleaning vinyl with a RCM and...and.... So yes. You can sense my frustration can't you? :)
Thanks for the review Paul. How do rate the Degritter Mk2 against the Klaudio and Audio Desk record cleaners? These seem to be at the top end of the record cleaning tree.
Hi Steve - never had the opportunity to review the Klaudio. I think, when I was trying to grab one, they were unavailable. The Degritter is superior to the Audio Desk though. By far.
Thanks for another great and informative video Paul! For a little over a year now I am using the Degritter (+1000 heavy cleaning cycles done). I also followed your cleaning instructions (incl Tergikleen and so on) and give every record the six-time cleaning cycle, followed by one without the Tergikleen. Since the Mark II removes the release agent residu far better than the first Degritter does, I wonder if starting your first (or first two) cleaning cycles without the surfactant would make any sense. And that would be because after these two cycles the surfactant doesn't have to bother with the release agent residu and might do even a better job.
Hi Bart and thank you for hanging on in there with me on this vinyl cleaning malarkey. I see what you're getting at but no, you really need the surfactant to be there. It's an enabler, it helps the Degritter to get closer to that release agent. The minimal alcohol in the bath removes oil smears, you might say but the cavitation process is the only thing that will get rid of the gunk and the gunk can be sheilded and protected by surface tension. To get rid of the surface tension, you need a surfactant. That's all it does, remove surface tension. Without it, the Degritter is less efficient.
@@TheAudiophileMan thanks for your fast response Paul. I will be going for the Mk2 and will keep on using that surfactant from the first cleaning cycle on.
Going to press, I wasn't sure about trade ins which is why I didn't mention it but it's good to know that they are undertaken that. Thanks for the update.
@@TheAudiophileMan hi Paul, do you already have an opinion about the audible improvement where it concers the number of times you run a cleaning cycle on the mk2? Is that still six as is on the mk1? (Both for never before Degritter'ed' records and records that already saw a heavy-duty 6-time run on the mk1).
Informative as always. Have you tested if the mk2 also needs six cycles before the sonic stops improving? I have the mk1 now and use the same process you do when cleaning, ie surfactant, make up brush etc, but if the mk2 requires fewer cycles on top of giving better sound over all I think an upgrade is worth it. Thanks!
Will be surprised if this question is read or replied to but here goes :) what are you getting after 8 full cleaning cycles that you aren't getting after 7: i love my Mark II I use it almost daily, best purchase ive made in a while. however i do not clean each record a full 8 TIMES what am i missing?
OK - firstly, eight *cycles* as opposed to cleans per se. So: add surfactant to the vinyl surface/wash/dry. That's a cycle and that's more effective than a 'clean'. On a general level, I find enough sonic improvements from cycles 1-6 to warrant that attention. As I said in the vid, cycles five and six decreased in efficiency but were still worth it. . Why go to 7 and 8? Because I wanted to make sure the Mk.I (and let's not forget, that's what we're talking about here, I did 8 cleans on the Mk.I) was taken out of the game. All variables would be removed. By cleaning a record eight times on a Mk.I meant that the Mk.I was no longer improving the target review vinyl disc sonically after each clean. So clean No.8 would now, at this stage, sound the same as, say, clean No.30. At this stage I had no idea what the improvements from Mk.I to Mk.II would sound like, how much there would be or in fact, if there would be any. So, I had to make sure that when I moved the Mk.I clean vinyl to the Mk.II, any improvements I heard were down - solely - to the Mk.II. That there was no possible influence, even in a tiny way, from the Mk.I. I think that extensive preparation helped the review. At least, in terms of what heard. Hope that helps.
great video ! Interesting to me the so many cycles are necessary with a really expensive Unit....My Klaudio 200S does not require that much tryings to be really clean and dust free.......
It doesn't need that many cycles, Robert. Not for most people. As I say in the video, that's just me. I would probably be exactly the same with the 200S. In my opinion, as good as they are, ultrasonic cleaners are not magic bullets. They are excellent tools. Nothing more. They are but one element in a basket of tools that I use to clean a record.
@@TheAudiophileMan ..thx. for your comment.I now understand your position.I also clean the very dirty ones first with my Hannl Machine for better results at the end...But you're right, for perfect results it's very time consuming...
Paul, I have. Mark 2 Degritter and want to know the step-by-step of how you clean with your Degritter.....even if I have to pay for that 'process'...what I do now is close to what I understand you do, so I would like to try using my Degritter Mark 2 EXACTLY as you do. Please release your process ! PLEASE !!
Congrats of your purchase, as they say and well, right. OK. To save you time and money, I recommend this. Read this vinyl guide. It's aimed at manual cleaning via a Disco Antistat.. I do have another Guide aimed at RCMS. The Ultrasonic Cleaner guide hasn't been written yet. That's ok though because if you read the vinyl preparation section of this Guide, that will be the prep I recommend to ultrasonic cleaning. Here's the link: theaudiophileman.com/vinyl-cleaning-guide-part-1-manual-cleaning/ The first part explains the 'whys' and after that there's a step by step on the tools you need and then the process itself. Just filter out the Disco references and you'll be fine. Any questions after reading this, give me a shout. It looks like a lot to take in and do but once you've done it a few times then it's very easy.
@@TheAudiophileMan Thank you. I look forward to the update for UltraSonic cleaners, and am digesting the link you humbly provided. My only question is how long do you wait after each heavy cycle? The Degritter Mark 2 has more "intense" heavy cycles, and gets the water hot MUCH QUICKER than the Mark 1....had a record or two get slight warps with 5 heavy cycles....BUT THE SOUND WAS SOOOOOOOOO WORTH IT !!
You shouldn't be warping your records with a Degritter. That is concerning. And you shouldn't have to wait either. Well, I suppose I do for a minute or so because I'm reapplying surfactant to the vinyl surface but not long. Does your machine have enough space around it to 'breath'? Where do you live, in a hot climate?
I have at least half a meter of space on each side....some sides over 1 meter of open space for the DeGritter to 'vent'. It is Summer here....but I COULD run the Air Conditioner 2 meters away while I run the DeGritter....that might help. Also, I only apply the surfactant mix one of the wash cycles....do you reapply before each round? Do you do any cycles without surfactant? Are all your DeGritter cycles "Heavy" ?
@@MrNicks-gn8jc yes, each and every cycle. The only cycle without surfactant is the final rinse. And yes, always heavy. See if applying surfactant each cycle cools your bath water too. Just doing that might help.
Hello, interesting video. Great job and thank for it. This kind of device is the reason why I stay away far from vinyl since 1986. Far too much things (and money) to do to preserve them from moistrure and dust. In addition to that. I live in French West Indies where humidity and heat simply warp them 😳. You men are very courageous. Best.
Thank you. Although really? You don’t need this box to play vinyl. Any more than you need a large salary, media attention and a 60,000 crowd to play football. The Degritter just provides the tool to enhance and improve the experience. If you want to play football. You need a ball. If you want to play vinyl, get a record player. The music itself is the point.
No, you have three options of choice, quick, medium or heavy. In most cases one of those depending on the vinyl condition does the job. I maybe clean a second time I in 30,
What if you _don't_ have the budget for a $5200 *AUD ultrasonic record cleaner? I've heard some of the more affordable ultrasonic record cleaners operate at a lower frequency that can damage vinyl over time.
My recommended budget cleaner is the Disco Antistat. There are plenty of good RCMs out there too. Check out my guides in the description. And vinyl is safe with the Degritter. On a micro level, of course, vinyl is in a continuous state of degradation (as am I) but nothing egregious, that is…
hello very good informative videos .have watch for a while now subscribed ,not sure if i can ask here but i have a ar xb turn table showing its age and need an upgrade locked down either the fluance rt 82 or a lp120x whatch all the videos but still cant decide running nad 3130 so no pre amp needed thanks
Here is what I said in my 120 review, comparing it to the *RT81*: "I would say that, in relation to the 120x, the Fluance is a tad warmer, a little bit sweeter than the 120x and for some that will be immensely attractive. In fact, I did enjoy the listening experience from the Fluance. It is packed with information, lots of detail and provides an attractive tonal balance around the soundstage. That is, the upper and lower frequencies exist in a sonic harmony so music sounds at ease, relaxed and very approachable. The 120x is more realistic, though. The 120x adds far more space and air in the soundstage and the upper mids provide extended dynamic reach. In fact, the dynamic range from the 120x is extended either end with bass being both organic but more precise. I mentioned that acoustic guitar strum bite and the raft of information around that simple motion. There was much more information around this area from the 120x. The Fluance nodded towards the acoustic guitar strums but never dwelt upon it so it held less importance in the mix. The 120x wanted you to hear it and feel its significance. The same should be said of the later cymbal taps which offered greater delicacy and fragility via the 120x. " The 82 will be similar to that but a bit better than the 81. Hope that helps.
@@TheAudiophileMan thank you for the info I did whatch your video on the 120x vs rt81 and I was hoping that the RT 82 would just push it over the finishing line ,would that be a good assumption,if so consider your input and experience as the defining push for me to buy thanks
So what does this say about all of us who shelled out several thousands of dollars and bought the first, or Mark I version? It now almost sounds inferior. Maybe Degritter should offer a trade-up program.
Hi Matthew. There may have been some misunderstanding here. Maybe I didn't explain myself properly. When you review any one new product, it's useful to have known references to compare that too and to then remove as many variables as possible from those references so that any resultant sonic changes are from the new product only and are not the result of a reference changing things in the background. I will often spend hours removing reference-based variables before I actually review a product. The 3 hour clean was initiated to remove the Mk.I from producing any of those variables. That is, once I had spent so much time and effort cleaning the review vinyl on the Mk.I, I knew that the Mk.I was done. Subsequent cleans on that machine by the same disc was not going to produce any sonic changes, however subtle. At that point, any changes in sound quality were going to be the result of cleaning by the Mk.II. So, at this point, if I then cleaned with the Mk.II and heard no improvements, then I would know that the Mk.II offered nothing new in sonic terms. In fact, I heard immediate improvements after a single Mk.II clean. So I knew something different was happening here. As for the Japan album? When I stated, "For Japan after the Mk.I clean there was a noticeable harsh edge across the tip of the upper mids. It wasn’t egregious but the edge was noticeable. The unstable midrange and treble extremes highlighted the music and not in a good way. This live album showed how out of control the frequencies were in the large auditorium. They lacked control and the sound added a chaotic feel to the presentation." That was with my baseline impression, after using my reference kit. Which meant the Mk.I.
You don't have to buy it, Matthew. I heartily recommend the Disco Antistat (see my Vinyl Guide for this machine in the Description). I also recommend a number of RCMs out there. There is choice if you care to look for it.
Hey Paul great video. I bought the Mk 2 back in March. I couldn't be happier with it. Does a fantastic a fantastic job with just distilled water. I pulled the filter out after 50 cleaning and couldn't believe how black it was. I really does clean beyond what the naked eye can see.
Fully agree with your findings Paul, heard the same improvements and I also did not expect to hear those.
Thanks!
That’s very kind of you, Clarence - thank you for your support!
Excellent video Paul.
How many revolutions do you choose for rinsing and how often do you change the rinsing water?
Tried your regime including Tergikleen prewash and a Degritter MKII X 6, on an old first issue Jackson Brown album from the ‘70s. Really fantastic result! Thanks.
Glad I could be of help.
Hi Paul, In DG mk1 vid there was discussion around optimum no. of cycles. Do those numbers hold for the mk 2 or are fewer required?
Hi Paul, Great video.
Have you compared the Degritter MK2 with the KLaudio LP200T and a DIY URCM (i.e. Elma Elmasonic P120H Ultrasonic Cleaning Batch with dual 40kHz and 80kHz frequencies and a 5 LP Spinner i.e. like the Kuzma RD unit) ? If you haven't yet, are you planning to ?
Reason I ask these questions is trying to determine best way to go. I have been cleaning all of my records (have about 700 of them, mostly new / mint condition or second hand near mint with a few VG and VG+ conditions) over the past years on my trusty Keith Monks Classic RCM (what the BBC used to use in their Archive Dept) with a pre-wash, main wash (with Keith Monks Discovery Record Cleaning Fluid) and then a final rinse with distilled water.
Yet I still hear pops and clicks (I am a critical listener i.e. mostly listen to my vinyl on my TOTL Headphone System consisting of a Hifiman EF1000 Headphone & Speaker Amp with Susvara Headphones connected to my CH Precision P1 Phonostage with X1 External Power Supply which is connected to my Kuzma XL DC TT fitted with a Kuzma 4Point 11" arm & MSL Eminent Ex cartridge) even if I repeat this washing regime on my Keith Monks RCM a further once or twice more.
Hence me thinking of buying a URCM to give all of my records the Ultrasonic final clean treatment.
Your thoughts on the above would be much appreciated.
I am sure that the Degritter MK2 is the best cleaner that you can buy but in Canada, it sells for $4000.00+, I chose the manual cleaner that Paul recommended a while ago. It might not be an equal solution to cleaning records but It is very affordable, Vinyl Styl Deep Groove Record Washer System at $125.00 CDN.
Thanks for the review. Take care.
Great Video! Thanks
Good info as always Paul. Thank you
Hi Paul, thank you for such a detailed video on the degritter. Following your advice of using tergikleen for 6 cycles and then a rinse, would the water need to be changed for the rinse, considering there's now tergikleen in the water?
I personally wait until around 30 washes and then change (depending on the condition of the vinyl you're cleaning). Yes, the water is being contaminated but I find the contamination level is not enough to impact the clean up to 30 times. BUT. But. I know people who have two baths. One for rinsing only and that's a great thing. I support it. I might do that myself in the future. For now? I'm happy with my lower-cost system.
@@TheAudiophileMan ok👍 looking forward to my degritter purchase! Need to get the mold out of my Beatles first pressings. :)
Excellent Paul & a very worthwhile watch. I bought the MKII in May & have to say, it's outstanding in everyway, much better than my Audio Desk. I too love how the MKII monitors the whole process right through. I have also added a Disco Antistat after watching another one of your videos, because of "attrition". 99% of the LPs I buy are secondhand, but my "minimum" acceptance for these 50 year old & older copies, is at least VG++ or EX, so I now use the Disco Antistat first, to help with the odd bit of fingerprint grease, before I move it to the Degritter. To say the MKII is good, is an understatement, but worth every single penny. Did you have a link to the actual solution & method of cleaning before you let the Degritter do it's thing?
Sure - check out the Description, there's links in there and really? There's no need if you have a Degritter 2, to bring in a Disco. The Degritter does everything the Disco does but better.
Incredible review Paul, just about to part exchange my Mk 1 for a Mk 2 thanks to a deal from Degritter. My only disappointment is that they both seem to have a shelf life which unless I’m mistaken isn’t made clear by Degritter who otherwise are an excellent company
Please elaborate??
@@tommy-6597 Based on feedback in Degritter Users Group there’s a fair few people who’s Degritter MK1 packed in somewhere between 1000-1500 uses. Degritter have been very good at replacing them. A lot of people suspect it’s more likely if you use the higher setting.
i'm still on the fourth or fifth Audiodesk; i got the first in 2008 or so and i experienced all the teething issues the first ultrasonic fully automatic record cleaning machine had. Gläss sold a LOT of their invention - but they also replaced a ton of them for free with entirely new RMCs. however, all ultrasonic machines will fail, sooner or later. having electric motors surrounded with water *is* ultimately flirting with desaster. especially if the machine is not used daily (which btw. was the #1 cause of failure for the Gläss. if used daily, they strangely last longer.)
it has never bothered me that the Audiodesk "grips" the reecords with O-rings - even though the 2nd or 3rd did chew up an LP once. but i must have cleaned around 10k LPs over the years, so one damaged LP is acceptable. (what wasn't acceptable that it was a mint copy of jennifer warnes' "the hunter" before the first play.)
two things: a/ in your video on Mk I you suggest a thorough rinse to remove the surfectant… others pay Last good money for a surfactant that is supposed to stay on the vinyl…
b/ a gppd friend of mine builds super high quality cartridges for a living. and he repairs his carts after the cleaning lady once more dropped the arm… anyway: i regularly have him inspect and clean my/his carts. before i had the Gläss, he once showed me a stylus under the microscope with dirt almost baked to the cantilever and the stylus. he scalded me for washing my records prior to playing them (at the time, i still had a VPI). he reminded me that even though the record will *look* dry and shiny, it still is slightly damp in the grooves. since the air is full of fine dust particles, they will settle on the LP during play and form a nice compound with the remaining water molecules and the heat produced by the enormous weight per surface of the stylus during play. since then, and even with the Gläss, i clean my LPs and then put them away. they will only be played at least one day after washing them. changing my drying/spinning regime did the trick and he never had to scald me again… do the same, and don't spin your LPs right after one cycle, then again after the next… they're still damp.
Thanks for your comment and yes, I was very happy with my Audiodesk - the original and Pro. And then I heard the Degritter.
Re. surfactant? Look, everyone has their pet vinyl cleaning systems so do whatever makes you happy and is pleasing to your ears but for me? Well, a stylus will 'play' whatever is underneath it. Doesn't matter what it is I can hear surfactant being 'played'. If you put something between the stylus and the groove, it will dull the sound. I've done the tests and I've heard the before and after. For me? Get it all off. Everything. I want to play grooves, not some third-party liquid.
Next? Never had issues with the drying element of the Degritter. Or the Audio Desk, for that matter. Never heard any issues because of either of those. I'm not really sure what the issue is on that point. As for caked stylii? Yep, seen that too. I put that down to inadequate stylii cleaning. Which is why I use the DS Audio dry cleaner pad and never go near alcohol. My stylii are always clean. But again, hey, whatever works for you. I'm not here to preach, only to report my findings. It's up to you if you wish to take note or ignore :)
> @TheAudiophileMan I've heard that the Audiodesk is not an actual cavitation machine.
Interesting. The sound quality stuff seems a bit much, but this is hifi after all. I’m just hoping that this reduces the crackling and surface noise, which i haven’t much luck with VPIs or humming guru. I’ve never really heard any difference from cleaning in general, let alone sonic improvements
Hi Paul
Your video on the Degritter MK2.
I’ve never used an Ultrasonic Vinyl Cleaner. I have the Keith Monks Prodigy which uses the vacuum or suction method. Have you ever thought of reviewing the Prodigy or do you feel that the Ultrasonic method is far superior?
On the back of your review, I really am thinking about purchasing the Degritter MK2
I want to review the KM machine, I've asked him, he's happy to go for it, I'm happy to go for it, it should have happened ages ago, I have enthused about his tech and designs, I have asked him to marry me and run away to the Bahamas together...I've really tried. But I sense a reluctance because of my positive comments on ultrasonic cleaners. So KM thinks i'm now anti RCM-type machines. I have no idea where that has come from. Too many whiskeys at 3am perhaps? It's all balls because I love the wholly manual Disco Antistat to bits of God's sake and I have not long done a 10,000 word guide on my website on cleaning vinyl with a RCM and...and.... So yes. You can sense my frustration can't you? :)
Thanks for the review Paul. How do rate the Degritter Mk2 against the Klaudio and Audio Desk record cleaners? These seem to be at the top end of the record cleaning tree.
Hi Steve - never had the opportunity to review the Klaudio. I think, when I was trying to grab one, they were unavailable. The Degritter is superior to the Audio Desk though. By far.
I’ve bought the surf ant triton you recommended what product do you use to spread the drops over the actual vinyl
Check out the vinyl prep section of this Guide. Any issues, give me a shout: theaudiophileman.com/vinyl-cleaning-guide-part-1-manual-cleaning/
Thanks for another great and informative video Paul! For a little over a year now I am using the Degritter (+1000 heavy cleaning cycles done). I also followed your cleaning instructions (incl Tergikleen and so on) and give every record the six-time cleaning cycle, followed by one without the Tergikleen.
Since the Mark II removes the release agent residu far better than the first Degritter does, I wonder if starting your first (or first two) cleaning cycles without the surfactant would make any sense. And that would be because after these two cycles the surfactant doesn't have to bother with the release agent residu and might do even a better job.
Hi Bart and thank you for hanging on in there with me on this vinyl cleaning malarkey. I see what you're getting at but no, you really need the surfactant to be there. It's an enabler, it helps the Degritter to get closer to that release agent. The minimal alcohol in the bath removes oil smears, you might say but the cavitation process is the only thing that will get rid of the gunk and the gunk can be sheilded and protected by surface tension. To get rid of the surface tension, you need a surfactant. That's all it does, remove surface tension. Without it, the Degritter is less efficient.
@@TheAudiophileMan thanks for your fast response Paul. I will be going for the Mk2 and will keep on using that surfactant from the first cleaning cycle on.
Just had contact with Degritter, there is a trade-in possibility for Mk1 owners. But you probably knew ;)
Going to press, I wasn't sure about trade ins which is why I didn't mention it but it's good to know that they are undertaken that. Thanks for the update.
@@TheAudiophileMan hi Paul, do you already have an opinion about the audible improvement where it concers the number of times you run a cleaning cycle on the mk2? Is that still six as is on the mk1? (Both for never before Degritter'ed' records and records that already saw a heavy-duty 6-time run on the mk1).
Can someone recommend a sd card I just bought a Philips 16 GB and doesn’t work
Informative as always. Have you tested if the mk2 also needs six cycles before the sonic stops improving? I have the mk1 now and use the same process you do when cleaning, ie surfactant, make up brush etc, but if the mk2 requires fewer cycles on top of giving better sound over all I think an upgrade is worth it. Thanks!
Yes, I was planning to look into this later on, along with pre-soak, multi-bath rinse washing, etc. So what this space, Mike.
@@TheAudiophileMan Thanks, I will do so.
Will be surprised if this question is read or replied to but here goes :) what are you getting after 8 full cleaning cycles that you aren't getting after 7: i love my Mark II I use it almost daily, best purchase ive made in a while. however i do not clean each record a full 8 TIMES what am i missing?
OK - firstly, eight *cycles* as opposed to cleans per se. So: add surfactant to the vinyl surface/wash/dry. That's a cycle and that's more effective than a 'clean'.
On a general level, I find enough sonic improvements from cycles 1-6 to warrant that attention.
As I said in the vid, cycles five and six decreased in efficiency but were still worth it. .
Why go to 7 and 8? Because I wanted to make sure the Mk.I (and let's not forget, that's what we're talking about here, I did 8 cleans on the Mk.I) was taken out of the game. All variables would be removed.
By cleaning a record eight times on a Mk.I meant that the Mk.I was no longer improving the target review vinyl disc sonically after each clean. So clean No.8 would now, at this stage, sound the same as, say, clean No.30.
At this stage I had no idea what the improvements from Mk.I to Mk.II would sound like, how much there would be or in fact, if there would be any. So, I had to make sure that when I moved the Mk.I clean vinyl to the Mk.II, any improvements I heard were down - solely - to the Mk.II.
That there was no possible influence, even in a tiny way, from the Mk.I. I think that extensive preparation helped the review. At least, in terms of what heard.
Hope that helps.
great video ! Interesting to me the so many cycles are necessary with a really expensive Unit....My Klaudio 200S does not require that much tryings to be really clean and dust free.......
It doesn't need that many cycles, Robert. Not for most people. As I say in the video, that's just me. I would probably be exactly the same with the 200S. In my opinion, as good as they are, ultrasonic cleaners are not magic bullets. They are excellent tools. Nothing more. They are but one element in a basket of tools that I use to clean a record.
@@TheAudiophileMan ..thx. for your comment.I now understand your position.I also clean the very dirty ones first with my Hannl Machine for better results at the end...But you're right, for perfect results it's very time consuming...
Paul, I have. Mark 2 Degritter and want to know the step-by-step of how you clean with your Degritter.....even if I have to pay for that 'process'...what I do now is close to what I understand you do, so I would like to try using my Degritter Mark 2 EXACTLY as you do.
Please release your process ! PLEASE !!
Congrats of your purchase, as they say and well, right. OK. To save you time and money, I recommend this. Read this vinyl guide. It's aimed at manual cleaning via a Disco Antistat.. I do have another Guide aimed at RCMS. The Ultrasonic Cleaner guide hasn't been written yet. That's ok though because if you read the vinyl preparation section of this Guide, that will be the prep I recommend to ultrasonic cleaning. Here's the link: theaudiophileman.com/vinyl-cleaning-guide-part-1-manual-cleaning/ The first part explains the 'whys' and after that there's a step by step on the tools you need and then the process itself. Just filter out the Disco references and you'll be fine. Any questions after reading this, give me a shout. It looks like a lot to take in and do but once you've done it a few times then it's very easy.
@@TheAudiophileMan Thank you. I look forward to the update for UltraSonic cleaners, and am digesting the link you humbly provided.
My only question is how long do you wait after each heavy cycle? The Degritter Mark 2 has more "intense" heavy cycles, and gets the water hot MUCH QUICKER than the Mark 1....had a record or two get slight warps with 5 heavy cycles....BUT THE SOUND WAS SOOOOOOOOO WORTH IT !!
You shouldn't be warping your records with a Degritter. That is concerning. And you shouldn't have to wait either. Well, I suppose I do for a minute or so because I'm reapplying surfactant to the vinyl surface but not long. Does your machine have enough space around it to 'breath'? Where do you live, in a hot climate?
I have at least half a meter of space on each side....some sides over 1 meter of open space for the DeGritter to 'vent'.
It is Summer here....but I COULD run the Air Conditioner 2 meters away while I run the DeGritter....that might help.
Also, I only apply the surfactant mix one of the wash cycles....do you reapply before each round? Do you do any cycles without surfactant? Are all your DeGritter cycles "Heavy" ?
@@MrNicks-gn8jc yes, each and every cycle. The only cycle without surfactant is the final rinse. And yes, always heavy. See if applying surfactant each cycle cools your bath water too. Just doing that might help.
Hello, interesting video. Great job and thank for it. This kind of device is the reason why I stay away far from vinyl since 1986. Far too much things (and money) to do to preserve them from moistrure and dust. In addition to that. I live in French West Indies where humidity and heat simply warp them 😳. You men are very courageous. Best.
Thank you. Although really? You don’t need this box to play vinyl. Any more than you need a large salary, media attention and a 60,000 crowd to play football. The Degritter just provides the tool to enhance and improve the experience. If you want to play football. You need a ball. If you want to play vinyl, get a record player. The music itself is the point.
Hi Paul
If you haven’t had the opportunity to review The Keith Monk’s Prodigy, you are more than welcome to review mine.
Just a thought 🤷♂️
Very nice of you but I will decline because, when the company finds out, there may be ructions that I didn't go through them first. Politics, eh? :)
Good one, thanks.
So you spend 3k, and still needs 6 cleaning cycles to get a perfect cleaning?
No. You can stick with one. But the capacity is there if you want to explore further. There’s flexibility in there to suit different users.
No, you have three options of choice, quick, medium or heavy. In most cases one of those depending on the vinyl condition does the job. I maybe clean a second time I in 30,
What if you _don't_ have the budget for a $5200 *AUD ultrasonic record cleaner? I've heard some of the more affordable ultrasonic record cleaners operate at a lower frequency that can damage vinyl over time.
My recommended budget cleaner is the Disco Antistat. There are plenty of good RCMs out there too. Check out my guides in the description. And vinyl is safe with the Degritter. On a micro level, of course, vinyl is in a continuous state of degradation (as am I) but nothing egregious, that is…
Great video I was waiting for it. Thinking about buying the Mark 2 but I wasn't sure if it was better than the mark 1. 😊
hello very good informative videos .have watch for a while now subscribed ,not sure if i can ask here but i have a ar xb turn table showing its age and need an upgrade locked down either the fluance rt 82 or a lp120x whatch all the videos but still cant decide running nad 3130 so no pre amp needed thanks
Do you have a budget?
@@TheAudiophileMan yes around £260 max but seen very good reviews of the rt82
Here is what I said in my 120 review, comparing it to the *RT81*: "I would say that, in relation to the 120x, the Fluance is a tad warmer, a little bit sweeter than the 120x and for some that will be immensely attractive. In fact, I did enjoy the listening experience from the Fluance. It is packed with information, lots of detail and provides an attractive tonal balance around the soundstage. That is, the upper and lower frequencies exist in a sonic harmony so music sounds at ease, relaxed and very approachable.
The 120x is more realistic, though. The 120x adds far more space and air in the soundstage and the upper mids provide extended dynamic reach. In fact, the dynamic range from the 120x is extended either end with bass being both organic but more precise.
I mentioned that acoustic guitar strum bite and the raft of information around that simple motion. There was much more information around this area from the 120x. The Fluance nodded towards the acoustic guitar strums but never dwelt upon it so it held less importance in the mix. The 120x wanted you to hear it and feel its significance. The same should be said of the later cymbal taps which offered greater delicacy and fragility via the 120x. " The 82 will be similar to that but a bit better than the 81. Hope that helps.
@@TheAudiophileMan thank you for the info I did whatch your video on the 120x vs rt81 and I was hoping that the RT 82 would just push it over the finishing line ,would that be a good assumption,if so consider your input and experience as the defining push for me to buy thanks
Why refer to the previous Degritter….as THE BASIC Degritter?
So what does this say about all of us who shelled out several thousands of dollars and bought the first, or Mark I version? It now almost sounds inferior. Maybe Degritter should offer a trade-up program.
I think the company is undertaking trade ins - send them an email for details.
@@TheAudiophileMan Thank you, Paul. I'll do just that.
this is an expensive channel to watch before payday!
too good/persuasive!
Apologies ;)
3:30 Cue Don Ho.
why not a 9.5? :)
3hours cleaning on 1 record.. I think that's a little xtreme..U didnt mention the crappy sound of the Japan lp in ur first degritter review.. Why??
Hi Matthew. There may have been some misunderstanding here. Maybe I didn't explain myself properly. When you review any one new product, it's useful to have known references to compare that too and to then remove as many variables as possible from those references so that any resultant sonic changes are from the new product only and are not the result of a reference changing things in the background.
I will often spend hours removing reference-based variables before I actually review a product.
The 3 hour clean was initiated to remove the Mk.I from producing any of those variables. That is, once I had spent so much time and effort cleaning the review vinyl on the Mk.I, I knew that the Mk.I was done. Subsequent cleans on that machine by the same disc was not going to produce any sonic changes, however subtle.
At that point, any changes in sound quality were going to be the result of cleaning by the Mk.II. So, at this point, if I then cleaned with the Mk.II and heard no improvements, then I would know that the Mk.II offered nothing new in sonic terms. In fact, I heard immediate improvements after a single Mk.II clean. So I knew something different was happening here.
As for the Japan album? When I stated, "For Japan after the Mk.I clean there was a noticeable harsh edge across the tip of the upper mids. It wasn’t egregious but the edge was noticeable. The unstable midrange and treble extremes highlighted the music and not in a good way. This live album showed how out of control the frequencies were in the large auditorium. They lacked control and the sound added a chaotic feel to the presentation." That was with my baseline impression, after using my reference kit. Which meant the Mk.I.
lol, my $49 Amazon ultrasonic cleaner does the same exact thing... The Degritter is disgustingly overpriced.
More audio elitism at 2500GBP...Of course the proles can buy an inferior cleaner etc.. Griping at the price... The mark up on it is xcessive
You don't have to buy it, Matthew. I heartily recommend the Disco Antistat (see my Vinyl Guide for this machine in the Description). I also recommend a number of RCMs out there. There is choice if you care to look for it.