The commenter saying Maya isn't to blame is unhinged. She threw a party, let those guys in, with full knowledge of their gang affiliation, *LEFT THE HOUSE* and *LEFT HER SISTER WITH STRANGERS, UNSUPERVISED* . She's an accomplice.
It's reddit, everyone wants to spin the narrative. Add to this not really reading the post and people go wild. I can see how someone would want to justify Maya before the update, especially with how little OP described her behaviour at party, and after with the consequences, but it's clear now she was at fault
yeah mcd run? why? i feel like she set the whole thing up. maybe she wanted her sister to be as degenerate as her so she wouldnt feel bad (yes, a lot of women work like that)
The rape is the 4 mens fault who did it and only their fault. Maya however is at fault for basically trafficking her sister. The cops took her in so it says to me she had more involvement than simply leaving. She tried to get her to get with a boy 3 years older (that is already too old for her 2 year max or it is rape because even if she wanted him shes not capable of true consent they are not peers with that big of an age gap. Kids do so much growing so quickly so its not like being 25 with a 28 year old by then that age gap isnt an issue. She then let the boy harass her and left her alone with him. For her words to her mom throughout this like Lucy is being a baby mom you always jump in to defend her I believe she intentionally let this happen. The fact shes grieving the loss of the friendship. I bet you hes not talking to her because he got in trouble not her cutting him off because he raped her sister. Shes mad she cant be friends with him anymore. She blames Lucy for that too. Her words tell me she purposely set this up. Shes at fault for breaking rules with a party, shes at fault for neglecting her sister at best trafficking her at worst and that would be EQUALLY as bad as raping her herself though still a seperate crime to the rape itself. She could have left her there and them to not choose to rape her so the actions of rape were their choice and only on them. Even if they hadnt raped her the sister was neglectful at best but potentially trying to get her sister hurt at worst and she should still have been severely punished for that. She needs to be punished for what she did and they need to be punished for what they did. Shes jealous of baby sister and shes the middle child they tend to feel left out (they dont tend to do shite like this but the feelings of neglect would be typical for a middle child). She did this because shes jealous of her.
Its not because they were there parties attract all sorts of types. However what says set up to me is a number of things. She tried to get her sister with the damn near grown one who isnt a peer was too old for her. She let him harass her all night. When talking to the cops they decided she needed to be in trouble too. That alone could be a mistake but all all the things no I dont think it was. Then add she has no remorse, but more telling is she also told people knowing the news hadnt released sisters name. She is INTENTIONALLY hurting her in other ways. Shes playing dumb about it and then gaslighting about it claiming lucy is being dramatic. Most telling thing is the resentment from the words about mom always defending Lucy even when shes being a baby about it. Psychologically look at her being the middle child too. No that doesnt excuse it most middle children dont do shite like this but I mean they do tend to feel left out or neglected. Oldest got alone time with parent before they came along, parent bonded with oldest alone. The baby will be the baby the last one. It is a natural thing that happens that the middle child feels neglected. However in this case she has severe resentment to the point she thinks its no big deal she got raped. Shes more mad that it came between her and her friend the rapist the worst one of the rapists. I bet you ANYTHING that he stopped being friends with her when he got in trouble. Shes 18 mom cant force her not to be his friend and shes mad she lost her friend. Yeah she did it definitely on purpose but for no other reason than she resented her sister. Asking why she told so many people her sister was the one raped is pointless. She isnt stupid she knew it would hurt her more and she did it on purpose.
I was thinking the same thing or at least there’s a good chance especially if some of the comments are true about her involvement in drugs or gang activity.
Agreed. A smart and loving sister would have if she only went to such a party because a smart and loving sister wouldn’t have invited them or had such a party in the first place.
@@jeffwilliams9866 uk as a big sister with a little sis and lots of younger cousin no way in hell i would ever put them in the same room with thungs let alone trying to set her up with one of them and u bet any piece of shit would end up in ER if i find them harrasing her dont care friend or not.simple. throughout the story i was just shocked . ok fine even if it was an accident and hypothetically she didnt know her friends were associated with thugs HOW CAN YOU CALL YOUR OWN SIS DRAMATIC AFTER WHAT HAPPENED. thats just pure disgusting . she wasnt remorseful at allll in fact i doubt this bother her in the slightest except for the fact that her dear friends ended up in jail.
@@syminreed3922 true, and there’s a chance she set her sister up for that intentionally which others suggested and I believe there’s good probability she did do that intentionally given her behavior and apparent lack of concern or responsibility for what happened to her sister.
"I wanted to open Lucy up, she was sitting by me the whole party." Uh, so, a 14 year old wanted to stick to her sisters side during a party with people SHE doesnt know...? Yeah, Maya only cared about the party and the popularity she would get from it.
Nope she did this intentionally. She has no empathy that she was raped, she says she didnt rape her so she didnt do anything wrong, more so than any of this was her telling mom she always sides with Lucy even when shes "being a baby". Middle children tend to have resentment that is natural but not to this level they would try to put their baby sister with someone too old for her and let him harass her. Shes more resentful the rapist didnt want to be her friend anymore because hes in trouble than she is that he raped her sister. Shes 18 mom cant make her not be friends with him, shes mad she cant be his friend and mad mom isnt more worried about that. She knew as well that no one told Lucys name in the paper. Asking her why she told people was pointless she is just going to lie and gaslight and she did. She said they were being dramatic and its no big deal and everyone knew anyway.. when they didnt and she knew that. That was an intentional malicious thing she did plus the resentment and victim blaming shes doing while acting like mom should have coddled her instead for having to spend a night or two in jail...... yeah all around this was malicious and intentional. She didnt care about the party she cared about herself, her goals, her wants, her anger towards her little sister and mom, and she tried to get this guy to get with her. Shes mad he stopped being her friend/rapist/worst of the rapists when he got caught
Big sisters don't like their little sisters tag along all the time. But you bet in this situation I'd be the one scolding my sister if she left my eye sight. Heck. Don't even let go of my hand. Not even having the party in 1st place.
I have the feeling Maya wanted to join that gang and used her sister to get it, and it is disgusting. I hope she face the consequences of her actions and that OP disowns her.
if your kid chooses to join a gang before they're out of your house it's your fault as the parent, I'm sorry. I was friends with an ex gang member and he joined the gang coz he was neglected and they made him feel seen and like he had a family. I've heard that from nearly every kid who joins a gang. That they joined coz it felt like family and someone having your back and like you'd be assured safety to some degree. Kids usually join gangs because they don't feel supported in other areas. Like yes, Maya grew up to be awful, but lets not let OP off the hook for making this monster. Basically, if this were your kid, you can kick her out, but that doesn't band aid over the fact that you raised the monster you're booting out of your home, it just let's you pretend you had no part in it and makes it easier for you alone.
@@abarbienamedken3334 Don't you put the whole blame on the parent, while yes some of the blame MAY lay with the parent, we do not know that. what we do know is that Maya left her sister with men that were affiliated with gangs, all alone, and it is HER fault she got assaulted. I do not like how you're trying to push the view away from the kid toward the parent, I grew up in a shitty household, poverty and abuse, but guess what? I had my sisters back and she had mine, and while it wasn't all happiness and rainbows I learnt my weak spots and worked to better them on my own. Seeking validation, joining a gang etc is no excuse for knowingly putting your sister in danger
@@abarbienamedken3334dude some kids are just assholes. Lets not act like any 16-18 yr old doesnt know what they’re doing. They aren’t babies ffs. I’m 19, do you know just how many people my age from younger ages understand that what Maya did was absolutely fucked? Maya is 18, shes not 10.
For me this is in layers; OP is even entertaining the idea of forgiving Maya, OP is letting Maya remain in the home. OP isn't pursuing criminal charges against Maya.
@scottpelletier7095 She didn't let her stay. She sent her to live with her grandparents, as for criminal charges, there really isn't anything to charge her for, that'll actually stick, and op already admitted her blunder to helping her with the child endangerment charge.
"I wanted her to open up", coupled with everything else, screams orhestration. She's fr a sociopath. Likely rationalised some form of jealousy of her younger sister, especially as she complained about emotional neglect... as an adult!
Hi, sociopathy is not a diagnosis! It's usually what people call Antisocial Personality Disorder or another cluster b like histrionic or narcissism. Would you be shocked if I told you it is incredibly rare for these disorders to simply be genetic (and if they were the signs are extremely obvious if you're paying attention for the first 18 years of your daughters life and therapy is extremely helpful for these disorders). It is more common, however, for them to be a result of childhood neglect! Most of these disorders are either a cry for attention like borderline and histrionic, while others are based on feeling you can literally only rely on yourself and everyone else will fail you or other people take away from your ability to care for yourself, like with narcissism or antisocial. Basically what I'm saying is sociopathy is 9 times out of 10 a result of childhood neglect. Lucy having an unhealthy attachment with her sister (Defending her after her actions led to a traumatic event.) and then asking her mom if she ruined their family shows that this is a dysfunctional home from the start. I also felt like it was my fault my home was being ripped apart when my parents found out about my brother assaulting me, but that's coz my parents lack of communication and the anger I felt every time I was near them. Not communicating is also neglect. What I'm saying is that Maya was most likely neglected her whole life along with the other kids in the family and this is just the manifestation of all that neglect the kids faced. And now the mom is confused as to how her kid ended up this way. News flash, its the mom's fault!
Maya is at fault here. She didn't care that her sister was assaulted. She's playing the victim card. She knew these guys were criminals and still,left her sister alone with these thugs. I hope they got long prison sentences. Selling the house is a good idea. Lucy probably doesn't feel safe there. Maya needs to own up to what she did. Call me evil if you want but I would not allow her in the new house until she apologizes. You can help her financially until gets on her feet. But Maya needs to learn accountability. Just sayin.
100% right! Maya didn't even feel sorry for what she did and all she did was hug her sister. She even said she overheard her sister she probably hasn't even been talking or hanging out with her sister. I pray Lucy can move on from this trauma and hopefully realize how selfish her sister really is. And Lucy's sister in law is a WAYYY better sister than Maya.
You're a better person than me. If I were the mother I would never allow that Maya girl in my house ever again. She clearly showed no regrets and dismisses what happened to her sister, which was her fault, and sees it as an inconvenience to her. There's something really disturbing about that girl. People like that could easily lie and beg for forgiveness but never mean it, they just play a role to get what they want. If she were regretful she had been so since day one. Not just because her mom told her off.
Yeah Maya needed to learn a lot of things her mother never taught her apparently. And then the mother has the gull to be like "I don't know how this happened! She must have been born a sociopath and I somehow failed to notice for the 18 years I was responsible for her health including her mental health!" and then fails to realize sociopathy is 90% of the time a personality disorder that's the result of neglect and this taking place in the family proves its dysfunctional to begin with. This doesn't happen in happy, functional families with good parenting and communication... Y'all are letting the mom too off the hook while still saying Maya needs to learn like yes she does, I wonder who was supposed to have taught her that though. Wild.
It is MAYA's FAULT, she invited gangmembers into your HOME, what the f did she think would happen? drink tea? she set her little sister up to get r word.
You know 100% Maya gave her sister to the gang leader to get into the gang. The therapist needs to lose their license for even thinking r*pe was an accident. 🤬
To be fair, we don't know what exactly therapist was told by Maya. We know what happened from OP's perspective and who those friends were, but it seems like Maya only talked how it 'affected' her, and could spin it like her friends don't talk to her/ she don't have time or attention because 'Lucy is dramatizing'.
@@ritaerror7829 Yeah, given how she was apparently vague on who the culprits might have been (when she knew full well that one of them had been harassing her), it's entirely possible she spun a story to the therapist.
Maya definitely strikes me as a sociopath. She's dangerous to herself and to others, the fact that she cared more about "losing a friend" than about her sister? That's a tell-tale sign right there. Holy shit, this story made my stomach churn either way. I'm disgusted and appalled with how this whole thing went down and with the fact that Maya knew these dudes were no good, yet she let them harass her sister anyway. The fact she left right before they SA'ed her is just troubling. My heart goes out to OP and especially to Lucy. I can't even fathom how traumatized that poor girl is from what happened. Something tells me she won't ever fully recover from this, even with years of therapy. I'm sorry if I'm rambling, I have family that was SA'ed so this hits home with me. This is the first time a story made my stomach churn like this in a long time.
It almost sounds like her (Maya’s) convenient departure was PLANNED and Maya possibly had an ACTIVE part in sister’s assault. I hope not but by some of her actions and the comments, it’s a real possibility. If she was doing drugs or was trying to join the gang or both, then the chances of her being even more involved by planning it, is much stronger.
@@jeffwilliams9866 also, it was a party with adult men, pretty sure that if not drugs, there was at least alcohol. She's old enough to know how bad it can get! And I think Lucy could too... like, she just got to her room and go to sleep? Pretty sure she locked the door at least, but the guys STILL get inside (unless they have weird doors without lock, but still)
As someone who was SA'd by my older brother and my parents acted shocked like OP, I blame the mother. Sociopathy doesn't happen without neglect (its rare for it to be genetic and not caused by trauma/neglect and its not even a diagnosis, it's usually a personality disorder that is very noticeable to non-neglectful parents and easily treatable with therapy especially at young ages.) This shit doesn't happen in happy functional homes where the parents are paying attention to their kids mental health. This happens in neglectful dysfunctional families. "I raised you better!" clearly not. My parents said that to my brother and yet I heard my dad say marital SA doesn't exist. The parents are never innocent when a kid turns out this bad. My dad also said he was the one who suffered most in this scenario coz it was his kids when I was literally the one who got SA'd by my own brother who I trusted but yanno. I can't stand parents who end up letting their trauma in the scenario get in the way of taking care of their traumatized kid. The fact Lucy is blaming herself for breaking up the family shows OP is not doing a good enough job of communicating with her and also hiding her obvious disdain for the problem she raised. Happy kids with good parents don't turn into bad people like this. My heart bleeds for Lucy who was the victim of all of this. I don't feel an ounce of pity for the mother though. As someone who was a Lucy, I will NEVER give the parents any pity in these scenarios where one kids poor raising leads to the other being traumatized. If OP's hurting, fucking good, your parenting led to this so I do not care, just don't let it get in the way of you supporting the actual victim.
Maya needs to go to jail for setting up her minor sister. She was responsible for her safety and well being and not only failed the job, but was the cause of it. She sounds like a sociopath.
The fact that the sister cared more about losing a "friend" then her sister getting violently attacked is purely DISGUSTING. I'm sure Maya would feel different if SHE was the one who got attacked instead.
I have a hunch but his sounds like a damn set up. She threw the party, she invited these men, she tried to set her sister up with one of them, conveniently leaves, and withholds the names of her 'friends' during a police investigation... The lack of remorse on her end and attempting to excuse and down play a violent SA, and deciding to mourn the loss of her friendship with one of these monsters instead be outraged on her sister's behalf, is pretty telling where she is on this. This girl can't be trusted and shouldn't be around her sister. Because I feel like this would not be a one time incident
So grateful to the later posters who expressed genuine concern for Lucy’s and OP’s mental well-being. Ensuring that Lucy has a strong support base, and learning that her Brother and S-I-L are taking an active part in encouraging and supporting her.
Imagine what the commenters' reaction would have been if it were an older brother who had left his adolescent sister in the home with several grown men. Saying that Maya is not at fault, when she threw the party, is psychotic.
My parents paid me to watch my brother when they were out for the night. The first time I was 13 and he was 9 (we’re Gen Xers ..) I remember about the 2nd or 3rd time, I ended up having to call my parents because he was running a fever, had a headache and was bleeding from his ear (small droplets - he suffered a lot of ear infections around that time of life). When they came home, I had him on the couch with my brand new pillow (really soft and comfortable to lay on) and had given him some children’s Tylenol. Thankfully, it was just another ear infection, but I was still very anxious. He could be an incredibly annoying little brother, but I could NEVER imagine letting him get injured or assaulted if there was absolutely anything I could do to stop it!!
It's 100% Maya’s fault and she should've been charged the same as the grapists. She brought 4 grown a$$ men into the house, knew they were in a gang and were criminals, allowed her sister to get harassed and had Lucy’s boundaries pushed, did nothing when those men hurt Lucy, told people what happened to Lucy, focused on her own selfish feelings about this rather than Lucy, and then kept victim blaming her and brought up how Lucy was talking to a guy, like she somehow deserved what happened to her for just being a teenaged girl. All this and Maya denied any accountability. I know the courts didn't say it, but Maya sounds like an accomplice to me.
That Maya girl is a psychopath. Plain and simple. Shows no shame and no remorse and yes, it was 💯 her fault what happened. She had one job, to take care of her sister and she goes and exposes her to criminals. OP just move with your other daughter and don't tell your psycho daughter your address. Keep her at arm's length like forever. Some people are just rotten.
Something tells me maya set her sister up. Hence the unwillingness to give names,perhaps its time for op to change the will and go full nc with maya,just in case.
The fact that the sister literally went on to tell everyone about what happened to her sister after her sister asked her not to, and then said she had to get over it disregarding the fact that she is still a CHILD. Maya is likely a sociopath or psychopath. Like, legit, this seems like she’s lacking empathy for her sister.
She all but gift wrapped her sister for a known rapist. Even assuming it wasn't deliberate, and I'm not convinced it wasn't, she is still largely to blame for all of it, and in the aftermath, she just tries to twist the whole thing to her benefit.
The parent may not fully blame Maya for everything....BUT I DO. Said events would never have happened if she had done as she was told or even been more responsible. Her actions were what led to it happenening thus she is fully responsible for it all.
This will affect Lucy even to the point of ptsd when her own son's (if she has them) are playing making random noise jumping out on her etc she may not cope well with things like that, and not know why
The thing is, whether or not she was trying to set up her sister to get her assaulted is completely irrelevant, because she had made multiple purposeful choices to allow this to happen: 1. She threw a party despite not being allowed 2. She didnt invite any of her sister's friends 3. She invited several grown adult men who she fully knew had gang associations 4. She left her alone with the gang members without giving a heads up, and 5. She didnt have anyone watch over her while she was gone. She had several opportunities to prevent this from happening. She could have abstained from throwing a party. She could have not invited people she fully knew were gang members. She could have taken her sister with her when going outside. She has permanently ruined her sister's life by being ignorant, irresponsible, and (speculatively) downright malicious. Not only that, but the fact that she had the gall to ask why she should apologize makes her evidently repulsive and unforgivable. If i was the parent, i quite frankly would have fought for the harshest punishment she could have gotten in court and any love i had for her would have disappeared into thin air the moment she told people her sister got assaulted without her sister agreeing to people being told about it.
I absolutely believe it was a set up. Even an idiot wouldn't leave a 14 year old alone with adults that were harassing her all night. Maya knew these men were criminals, she knew they were gang affiliated, she brought them there; Lucy's attack was Maya's fault.
Full disclosure as someone in the field, the counselor is going to be more on the side of whomever the designated client is, that's kind of the job and a bit of what makes therapy hard when they bring someone else in because who is the client in this situation. Depending on how long therapy has been going on, it may be too early also to even challenge the client on some things even if we want to because its still building rapport and we want to make sure it doesn't cause the client to want to terminate the therapeutic relationship. Often earlier on we want to see the world from their view and provide tools and techniques to help cope with internal stressors before we start asking questions that could see if there are alternative views. A kind of stabilize their footing and ensure they have the means to begin exploring more raw areas.
I see the point, but just asking, WHO is the client when the parents are paying? Like, on one hand the kid is having therapy and might decide to end it (but depending on age might be a bit forced by parents to go anyway), but if you insult parents that are paying, they will probably terminate anyway? I know Maya is old enough to be client herself, but just wondering if she were younger and dependent on mom, will counselor still do the same?
@@ritaerror7829 The client would be the person attending the sessions, the main times this can get challenging to navigate is kinda like an unofficial couples counseling, and sometimes official couples and family counseling where it may be challenging. I'm not actively practicing so it has been a while since I've brushed up on the state laws & ACA code of ethics. IIRC even if the parents are paying and the client is minor, confidentiality still reigns supreme unless the client is a threat to themselves, or others. A counselor will contact a guardian in cases where the client cannot give consent due to age or otherwise if that client is in danger / being harmed or is one to others. The counselor is likely going to be on the side of the client as it is the nature of the relationship to be an assistant in navigating the journey with the client. The reactions of the counselor are going to likely vary based on the counselors theoretical foundation. Not all counselors are the same, not just in personality but approach. You've probably heard of CBT Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, but that's really just one of many theoretical approaches to therapy and not all are applicable to the same clients, or even the same presenting problems. The way they handle a client is likely going to be different than say how one handles a client who has a foundation in Freudian approach. Since I do not know the hypothetical counselor in this story, I cannot tell you what her approach is, we're lacking significant information for me to even begin to distinguish that. Regardless though, even if the client cannot terminate the relationship, I.E being forced to go by a parent, It's a getting further with honey than vinegar approach in a very loose way of putting it. Do you think the child, or, young adult in this case, is going to open up if I start asking questions out of the gate that challenge their held inner world views? Do you think if the client is in denial that they're likely to feel comfortable and trust me if I come on too early? There are some approaches like solution focused therapy that do have means of going at this, but it also is going to be as effective as the clients willingness to change. The client here, Maya, is clearly resistant, and that could be from a plethora of reasons, once more I don't know her, I'm not counseling her, so its all second hand information. The counselor was likely just as surprised on some information because we don't have it all either, we rely on our clients being truthful with us, but sometimes the truth is hard to come out, hence, rapport, rapport, rapport. If you are curious on a lot of the ethical rules of therapy and maybe some of it will answer some other questions that we have to follow, google ACA code of ethics 2014. The first result from counseling is a PDF file that lists the ethical ruleset that counselors in America have to follow, not including any additional state legislature. Breaches of these ethical boundaries can result in a review that could end in punishments of requiring more training, education, probation, suspension and permanent loss of right to practice based on severity. My apologies If I missed anything or went in a weird direction, it's 5 am for me hahaha
@@ritaerror7829Client means patient in this context. My insurance may pay for my therapy but I’m still the client. The point stands if a parent is paying. But I think the therapist effed up. They should be on the clients side on one on one meetings especially in early meetings but more neutral when a session is used as family therapy. Usually a therapist is always aware that they hear their clients pov and other have their own pov. Also they usually should be aware that clients may lie for whatever reason. I can’t imagine how the therapist could have ever agreed that OP wasn’t fair to maya, regardless off maya left out in her sessions. A quick rundown of what happened with just the essentials and leaving out details that make her look even worse should have been more than enough for the therapist to see that maya effed up majorly. With rundown I mean: Maya: I threw a party and invited a lot of people while mom was at work work and I watched my sis 14f. After a while I left and she was r during my absence. Therapist: How do you feel about what happened? maya: I miss my friend. Therapist: ???
Not only was it 100% her fault she tried to play the victim to her pysch and TOLD 27 people in a group chat for attention. Disgusting, disown and disengage. Maya did all these horrible things to be popular and get attention, don't give her any ever again. She needs a pysch that can actually help her become a better person instead of feeding into her bs.
There's two possibilities here. ONE: Maya invited GROWN MEN over while her mom was out, encouraged the harassment of her sister all night long, then abandoned her sister to be assaulted, and she's merely a horrifically and willfully neglectful sister. Or TWO: it was a setup, and when Lucy wouldn't participate willingly, Maya arranged for her unwilling participation, and she's an accomplice to literal gang members. Which of these scenarios is forgivable?
Will people with serious issues like R please stop going to "therapists"?! They are NOT psychiatrists, have less schooling and training, and are basically no different than any one on social media in your DMs.The reason this therapist was so manipulated by Maya is because she has never had the training and experience a psychiatrist or psychologist has. Neither one of those would have fallen for Maya's pity party BS. They would have diagnosed her very obvious disorder (could be sociopath, could be bipolar, could be extreme narcissism, or any number of things a therapist cannot diagnose or treat). Therapists have done more harm for patients than ever in recent years. All good insurances pay for mental help with a real professional psychiatrist and psychologist. If yours doesn't, get a new one.
I never think i would say this before, but i hope maya gets the same medicine/karma what her sister went through just to know the pain of it. And this time she would be alone without any support she could lean.
Maya needs to go to jail. There is only one cause to this situation. That is Maya, who cares how ignorant she was. That is no excuse. Maya shouldn't ever be in charge of or have children ever.
@@jeffwilliams9866 id just let her know that, so she never does it again. I couldn't prosecute my own daughter. The school is the main problem now, no way she should set foot in that school with everyone knowing. Needs to move away to put the previous life as far out of mind as possible. Keep the other daughter at arms length a little bit, she clearly doesn't get it at all
It might be hard to prove? Like with saying it to therapist to talk about the situation, it is in "closed space" and supposed to stay here. She could say that those were "close friends that deserved to know and wouldn't tell anyone" and if it was told to others they just deducted what happened because Lucy just stopped showing to school or something. If it were a public post on social media then maybe, but this might not count by law... depending on the lawyer at least
op as a mom must not be aware that maya did drugs... this kind of behaviour is someone who's already doing drugs, that she saw her criminal friends as people cool to hang out with... the whole story, I agree with op reaction to her daughter maya, but then as a mom I think she missed the part when her daughter maya has become the druggie or criminal gang to do all that stuff without remorse
She probably tried to trust her kid, and "everyone as a teen is rebelious". Though even if she knew, what was she supposed to do? Whenever Maya was responsible for Lucy or not, she would still throw party when mom was out. She was already in therapy, and it seemingly didn't help. With her attitude, neither talks or grounding would help her. And just knowing wouldn't be enough to send her... somewhere, dunno, camp? To parents? It could even backfire at OP
@@ritaerror7829 I'm saying, the period of time when Maya was still under her "jurisdiction" as a "mother", teen age, or whatever age, she must have missed that time when her own daughter grow up and befriend the wrong people and became druggie... people don't change overnight...if Maya is her daughter too, she would have watch Maya grow just like how she is protective over Lucy and would have known when her daughter changed to a different person - I'm saying the period of time before all this happens, did she always put Maya as baby sitter to Lucy?
@@radziahradzi probably the son was a babysitter before he moved out. And my point is, what should a mother do when seeing those signs? Yeah, they don't change overnight, but again, what should be done?
@@ritaerror7829 mother should spend more time with them, before that happens. That you say big bro could be babysitting her before he left, probably shows the mom didn't parent her kids, letting the kids babysit themselves, that's one of the reasons that lead to wrong selection of friends
Anyone who ever says it's not the job of an older sibling to look after the younger sibling in the absence of parents is just sh1t. Whenever there is a household, all family members automatically have to assume roles based on situations, and that's how family works & moves forward. I am 40 now, and I remember that both my parents worked and needed to leave us alone (with no sitter affordability) for a couple of hours a few times a week. I was tasked with watching my younger sister, i remeber us of when i was in 6th or 7th grade so 12-13, and she was 4 year yonger than me. This is the normal family duty of the elder sibling. Family is a support-based social structure, which is why it has value.
There's been another update in the form of an r/AITAH post, where she asked if she'd be the asshole if she withheld Maya's portion of the inheritance from her father (which was being kept until she was 18). She didn't spell out what Maya did but the top comments read her post history and were in favor of Maya not getting a cent.
I heard stories about girls helping guys in situations like this cause the girl as a crush on one of the guys. So yeah, she's mad that her crush went to jail. And it was a set up.
open your eyes OP Maya set lucy up . Maya is 90% responsible for orchistrating this those men were just happy to enjoy this opportunity provided to them.
Maya put her in a dangerous situation 18 is old enough to know better,then left her in a house with strangers. I couldn't get over this. Send her away before you do something you'll regret.
The fact that you can state that you don’t hate your daughter shows your love as a mother; it is NOT wrong to love your child even when they do wrong, but you are also not wrong to in your feelings toward Maya. If she had done as she had been asked, this situation would never have happened. She may not have been the cause, but she was the catalyst.
Apparently Maya never checked on Lucy after getting back from her McDonald's 'run', that seems to cement the reality on top of all the other details that she cares nothing about her. It would be understandable if the mother disowns Maya but unfortunately Lucy will most likely take on the additional burden of believing she caused it. I hope Lucy can find the help she needs to heal and eventually thrive.
I think the part that bothered me the most was the explanation that Maya had been 'trying to put Lucy with this one guy'. Like...what does that mean? Does that mean she was saying 'hey, stand next to this guy instead of me for a while', does it mean she was trying to get Lucy to *talk* to this guy, or was she trying to get her *14 year old* sister to hook up with this guy? Like...maybe I'm more effected by this because I find the notion of sex at all disgusting, but the thought of Maya even *suggesting* a 14 year old be sexually active with *anyone* that 14 year old had not expressed enthusiastic interest in beforehand is stomach churning for me. I don't have enough details to make any actual calls on this, and luckily I don't have to, but I hope OP and Lucy are healing, and that Maya is in a situation that doesn't allow her to cause more harm, accidentally or otherwise. I also hope that OP talked with that therapist that Maya was going to, explaining the actual facts of the case and the current home life, because if that person heard the same story we did about how this happened and was still calling it an 'accident', then that person should not be responsible for the mental health of vulnerable people. It seems likely to me that Maya simply doctored the story to make it sound like she had a lot less culpability for the situation that allowed this to happen. Its possible that she *does* feel bad but is reacting to that guilt by trying to minimize the events. A lot of people do that, will feel shame for something but talk themselves out of it by recontextualizing it as 'not actually that big a deal'. So there's a couple of ways this therapist could have heard a doctored story, but if they didn't, and they *knew* the real details of the night and still agree that Lucy was 'being dramatic' over an 'accident'? I feel like you should report that person somewhere, to some sort of governing body that checks in on whether or not medical professionals should loose their licenses. I've heard of a few terrible therapists who allow their personal agendas to infect what they tell people, and I've read stories of ruined families because of these people, so...if there's a way to get bad therapists out of the profession, it should happen.
Maya is a problem. Coincidentally, my older sister is also named Maya. She has caused problems for me, encouraged her friends to verbally harass me in our home, and still lies about who I am as an adult (who doesn’t interact with her). My parents knew Maya displayed all of this behavior and did nothing about it. Not even a, “don’t do that.” In short, good for that mom for trying to protect her family from Maya. I hope the mother here continues to protect her family and not soften or allow Maya back in her home before she’s done the work and has proven she is no longer intentionally hurtful.
Maya screwed up big time. The bigger problem is the fact that she does not appreciate the severity of her actions - only that she is being targeted for all the things against her. The therapist is only going by what what Maya said and chances are she painted a rose-tinited version of the incident. But until she understands her role and the consequences of her actions, there can never be forgiveness for her. The fact that she was protecting the identity of her friends was the breaking point. I am surprised that this alone did not get her kicked out of the house for good. She chose her friends over her family. That is unacceptable.
In the first account, it seems the bridesmaids were quite thoughtless to suggest one last adventure. It's likely she wouldn't have considered it if they hadn't brought up the idea.
Maya probably wrote the 1st comment: both said she wasn't the one at fault for what 4 men did to her sister despite OP clearly said she was paid to look after her sister. Now, if you wanna argue that setting Lucy up is part of the job, well... it exposes who you really are
The girl that says to just blame the men is that annoying person to talk to, she just hates men, that girl, caused everything she knew, she knew it all but didn't do anything she probably knew what they were going to her sister and that's why she left, I feel so sorry for the mother, and it's probably a good idea that the father doesn't know.
Everyone needs counseling. I would have loved for my parents to punish my sister for what she did to me. Or even acknowledge what she did to me. Make maya work at a grape crisis center, homeless shelter. Or other insightful job. R is something that doesn't go away. And have future reactions that maya will never see. I assume maya acting out because of dad gone not something else. But she needs to get passed her issues or she has a long life of hurt in front of her. To this day my sister has not revealed what happened to her as a child. But mayas deliberate incompetence is causing significant harm to others. Set her straight now. She should be with someone else. If her impulsiveness is leading to felonies who knows what else is next.
Omg! Maya may have actually set her sister up. She knew exactly what her friends were capable of. It will be hard but OP has to cut off her oldest daughter, the sociopath. I’m so very sorry for OP & Lucy.
i dislike this person, has a view on how a family needs to be and seems really not wanting it to be broken trying to find any reason to get maya back in the house, doenst want to talk to her oldest son even if its the biggest deal that they may have had, just because she again has a view on how newly wedded needs to be, i dont get really good vibes to where all this i going, lucy needs so much more care than what i´m seing displayed and an only mom more centrated in if she can have her daughter (maya) back, she said so much details of how likely this was a set up, she said such horrifics things and should be in jail, what op is trying to do is forgiving somethig she has no right in forgiving
This is the problem when you are a (probably loving) parent of a criminal. It was bad, and OP feels it with the whole "disliking" thing, but she can't just accept how her "own sweet kid" could do that. Also with the son, she said Lucy was in hospital, so maybe she wanted her to be stable before sharing the news (not great if Lucy wouldn't make it, but also with how she was assulted by people probably his age she could think it wouldn't be the best for him to come), and then said she was going out with son's wife, so they did get to know and support Lucy
Maybe it's just me and the autism, but I've always been very strict with rule following so there's no way this would ever have happened to my younger siblings. I'm also very paranoid, so there's no way I would have left her unsupervised around strange men.
I have a pretty thick skin. I literally study true crime and SA cases because I want to be a counselor and advocate for victims of SA and DV as my future career, but this story just absolutely broke me. I have never sobbed at a reddit story like I did here. I have a little sister that i'm close to, with just a slightly larger age gap between us than Maya and Lucy, which is why I think this hit especially hard. And if one of my "friends" did that to her, I would probably face a felony myself with what I would do to them. It is absolutely despicable how Maya treated her sister, I genuinely don't understand in the slightest why she did what she did and what she said in the aftermath without her being a sociopath and/or prioritizing joining a gang over her own sister, which would mean that she purposely set her up. I don't blame the mom one bit, she sounds like a wonderful mom and i'm so glad that at least she + Lucy's brother and his wife are standing up for Lucy.
I like to think I have thick skin too. I help out boys subjected to abusive upbringings, neglect, physical abuse and so on. But even so, this was especially hard to listen to, the men deserve the worst kind of treatment in prison and even that would not be justice. You will hear stories thay you will wish you could unhear and everyday you will think about the sheer state of our world. There's not enough people in the world who can stomach this type of thing and make a difference, so I sincerely wish you the very, very, very best of luck in your pursuit to support victims of abuse.
Maya is definitely at fault, she’s the one who threw the party and invited those men and left her sister alone with them. Hell,?I would argue she set her sister up to get SA’ed cause why else invite all those men over and then leave her sister alone???
Well, it was a house she and her late husband purchased and lived in, probably most their lives. So indeed it had sentimental value. But I bet even OP had dilemma and probably gonna end up selling it anyway
This is exactly when you grab the belt and keep all the doors in the house open for everyone to hear her pain for hours, while on call with her friends
Lmao I can't believe Maya is still alive right now, but that's what you get with a single mom. Hope Lucy can get away from all these losers and get on the path to healing.
Everyone is focusing on the wrong thing, yes Maya is largely to blame for the scenario but also you are missing that this is the behavior of a child who has not been parented right. I hate to say this but anytime a parent says "I raised you better than this" most of the times what they meant was they never sat down and had an actual conversation they just assumed the kid knew better which is neglectful parenting. If your kid is to the point of throwing huge parties behind your back, associating with known criminals, not caring about your other kid's assault, I'm sorry but that's not normal behavior. You can say "Oh she's a sociopath" but sociopathy is not a diagnosis it's usually a symptom of a disorder. Usually those are personality disorders which me and my spouse have. Most people with personality disorders have been abused or gone through trauma (typically severe neglect) that they had to process alone. it is rare for a personality disorder to be purely genetic and not trauma based. This means the daughter had to have been showing signs of mental illness far before this incident. Also why is the mother getting self-help books instead of paying for her own therapy? This is too specific for self help books. I'm tired of "I did everything, I even bought self help books!" but then they don't go to therapy. Why? Are you scared they may mention your parenting as part of why this all happened? Also my wonder is if Maya does feel guilty for what happened but it's easier for her to cope by shutting down and dissociating from the extent of the damage. I also wonder if Maya was so adamant about not losing her "friend" because she didn't feel supported by her family and he manipulated her into thinking he was there for her when really he was taking advantage of her not feeling seen. Happy kids don't do drugs (the mom mentioned pot smoking). Happy kids don't associate with gangs/known violent criminals. Happy kids have a healthy relationship with their siblings (the youngest even seems to have an unhealthy attachment style with her sister, not wanting to blame her and feeling it's her fault the family is falling apart which also shows a lack of communication in the house that leads to assumptions being made like this). Happy kids don't show signs of sociopathy. Happy kids don't have unhealthy attachment styles with friends to the point of it splitting them open to have to ditch them after they assault their family. As someone who grew up with a sociopathic older brother who WAS my assaulter, not just friends with but was the one who did it, I'm sick of parents who act like they had nothing to do with their kid turning into a monster. It is your fault as a parent. Good parents don't raise bad kids. Even with mental illness, you get them help and are open to that and don't treat them like an incurable monster. If you have to say "I raised you better" then clearly you didn't. If you start hating your kid, well you're who made them who they are, they're probably matching your energy. If you start thinking your kid is a monster, remember you made them that way. tl;dr yes Maya is partially to blame but the mother has no right to sit here and act like "Wow this hell child, who raised her?" like you did, ma'am. You didn't teach her consent, you didn't give her enough attention and help to not feel more seen by convicted felons than you, etc. etc. Yes Maya grew up to be a terrible sister, but if she did, then that's on her parentage and I'm tired of people acting like the parents had no hand when a kid turns out this backwards.
Everyone's like "If Maya were my kid" "If this were my kid" if this were your kid you'd be a terrible parent and don't get to fantasize about punishing said child because you fucked up somewhere. As someone who was SA'd by my older brother and my parents swear up and down they did everything right with him (They absolutely did not, they were so abusive I have 4 trauma disorders from them alone), I will never give an ounce of pity to parents who's poor parenting led to one of their kids doing something that causes the other kid to be SA'd. You either failed to notice mental health issues and get them help or you caused the mental health issues to begin with. If Maya were my kid this never would've happened because I would've noticed Maya's mental health issues and gotten her help or I wouldn't have caused my kid to be so mentally ill by being a terrible parent. I'll say it again for the people in the back: Good parents don't raise bad people!
I'm 1 of 3. My brother and I are wonderful people. My sister is an awful person. Her son is a sweetheart. Mom raised us the same way her dad did, someone my sister admired greatly, it was perfect if it was coming from grandpa. My mom has finally had to go low contact this past year. My sister is 42 now. There are lots of parents who shouldn't have ever been parents who raise good people, like you. You were born good, and so were damaged, but remained at your core good. The reverse is also true. You can't raise a person born evil into being a good person.
It is 100% Maya's fault (besides the r*pists), and I honestly fail to see how the mom is to blame here. The actions that she took afterwards were correct, and she is at least supporting her daughter. Maya is the worst sister i've ever heard of
Gee OP, maybe Maya wouldn't be such a mess and sneaking parties if she didn't have to give up her entire childhood to raise Lucy. OP is just as guilty.
wow, babysitting your siblings as a 18 year old while living in the family house to a single mother. Wow, such abuse. Get off your high horse, i baby sit my siblings all the time i have never once tried to push a stranger on my siblings and never left them with a house full on STRANGERS to get food. Maya left her sister ALONE in house full of people LUCY DOESNT KNOW. She abandoned her sister. You're the type of person to sit and watch someone R another and then laugh saying it was sex.
@ItzPubby OP said they had the arrangement for years aka Maya has been babysitting Lucy every day long before she was 18. She's been parentfied. My own mother was widowed with 3 kids. Know what she didn't do? Have me raise my siblings for years. She had 2 day jobs and made sure to give me time to still be a teen. OP and Maya are both guilty.
Maya was babysitting. As the other person who replied said, babysitting isn't abuse. I suggest you STFU and understand OP is good mom. You're a bad person for assuming OP is neglectful.
@@GLoLChibs Having your kids be this monstrous isn't the usual outcome from being neglected. They just rebel and not intentionally harm their siblings.
@Dustin81 Except she wasn't monstrous nor did she intentionally hurt her sibling. It's not unheard of for siblings to try and hook their siblings up with friends. Maya had been babysitting Lucy daily for YEARS. Her life was go to school, go home and care for Lucy while OP was at work. Any parent who can type out 'Before anyone says Lucy is my kid so she's my responsibility I paid Maya good money to watch Lucy and we've had this arrangement for years' is not a good parent. She's playing victim just as much as Maya is and shares just as much of the blame. Maya is nothing but a live-in nanny to OP and OP tried putting a price tag on Maya giving up her childhood. What good is it to pay her well when she can never go anywhere? What was OP going to do when Maya graduated, tell her she couldn't leave home because she needs her nanny? Because that's the mentality of parents who refuse to even entertain the notion they fucked up in some way when one of their kids suffers or gets in trouble. Maya messed up inviting people over and leaving, that's not her being intentionally evil.
The commenter saying Maya isn't to blame is unhinged.
She threw a party, let those guys in, with full knowledge of their gang affiliation, *LEFT THE HOUSE* and *LEFT HER SISTER WITH STRANGERS, UNSUPERVISED* . She's an accomplice.
It's reddit, everyone wants to spin the narrative. Add to this not really reading the post and people go wild. I can see how someone would want to justify Maya before the update, especially with how little OP described her behaviour at party, and after with the consequences, but it's clear now she was at fault
And it also says she was encouraging them to hit on her sister and trying to encourage her sister to get with one of them? That's fucking weird man.
That not wanting to cooperate sealed the deal for me.
Don't forget she tried to set her up with one of the guys who was too old for her sister.
@@JaredGivens1 She also refused to give their names to the police although she clearly knew who it was, wanting to defend at least her one "friend".
it IS MAYA's fault. she threw the party, invited grown men and left her sister
Right? She wasn't the one who did the deed, but she was the one who enabled it by inviting thugs
yeah mcd run? why? i feel like she set the whole thing up. maybe she wanted her sister to be as degenerate as her so she wouldnt feel bad (yes, a lot of women work like that)
Had plenty of chances to prove she regretted it, but clearly she had other plans 🤷♂️
She knew exactly what she was doing. She pimped out her sister to her gang and was an accomplice.
The rape is the 4 mens fault who did it and only their fault. Maya however is at fault for basically trafficking her sister. The cops took her in so it says to me she had more involvement than simply leaving. She tried to get her to get with a boy 3 years older (that is already too old for her 2 year max or it is rape because even if she wanted him shes not capable of true consent they are not peers with that big of an age gap. Kids do so much growing so quickly so its not like being 25 with a 28 year old by then that age gap isnt an issue.
She then let the boy harass her and left her alone with him.
For her words to her mom throughout this like Lucy is being a baby mom you always jump in to defend her I believe she intentionally let this happen. The fact shes grieving the loss of the friendship. I bet you hes not talking to her because he got in trouble not her cutting him off because he raped her sister. Shes mad she cant be friends with him anymore. She blames Lucy for that too. Her words tell me she purposely set this up. Shes at fault for breaking rules with a party, shes at fault for neglecting her sister at best trafficking her at worst and that would be EQUALLY as bad as raping her herself though still a seperate crime to the rape itself. She could have left her there and them to not choose to rape her so the actions of rape were their choice and only on them. Even if they hadnt raped her the sister was neglectful at best but potentially trying to get her sister hurt at worst and she should still have been severely punished for that. She needs to be punished for what she did and they need to be punished for what they did. Shes jealous of baby sister and shes the middle child they tend to feel left out (they dont tend to do shite like this but the feelings of neglect would be typical for a middle child). She did this because shes jealous of her.
It was 100% a set up. Why would all these grown men be in your house otherwise.
Glad I’m not the only one who thinks this.
Its not because they were there parties attract all sorts of types. However what says set up to me is a number of things. She tried to get her sister with the damn near grown one who isnt a peer was too old for her. She let him harass her all night. When talking to the cops they decided she needed to be in trouble too. That alone could be a mistake but all all the things no I dont think it was. Then add she has no remorse, but more telling is she also told people knowing the news hadnt released sisters name. She is INTENTIONALLY hurting her in other ways. Shes playing dumb about it and then gaslighting about it claiming lucy is being dramatic. Most telling thing is the resentment from the words about mom always defending Lucy even when shes being a baby about it.
Psychologically look at her being the middle child too. No that doesnt excuse it most middle children dont do shite like this but I mean they do tend to feel left out or neglected. Oldest got alone time with parent before they came along, parent bonded with oldest alone. The baby will be the baby the last one. It is a natural thing that happens that the middle child feels neglected.
However in this case she has severe resentment to the point she thinks its no big deal she got raped. Shes more mad that it came between her and her friend the rapist the worst one of the rapists.
I bet you ANYTHING that he stopped being friends with her when he got in trouble. Shes 18 mom cant force her not to be his friend and shes mad she lost her friend.
Yeah she did it definitely on purpose but for no other reason than she resented her sister. Asking why she told so many people her sister was the one raped is pointless. She isnt stupid she knew it would hurt her more and she did it on purpose.
After hearing the update, I'm pretty sure Maya set Lucy up for her attack. Don't ever let her around Lucy again.
I was thinking the same thing or at least there’s a good chance especially if some of the comments are true about her involvement in drugs or gang activity.
All she had to do was take her younger sister with her. Full stop. She set her up.
Agreed. A smart and loving sister would have if she only went to such a party because a smart and loving sister wouldn’t have invited them or had such a party in the first place.
Basically pimped her own sister out, evil
@@jeffwilliams9866 uk as a big sister with a little sis and lots of younger cousin no way in hell i would ever put them in the same room with thungs let alone trying to set her up with one of them and u bet any piece of shit would end up in ER if i find them harrasing her dont care friend or not.simple. throughout the story i was just shocked . ok fine even if it was an accident and hypothetically she didnt know her friends were associated with thugs HOW CAN YOU CALL YOUR OWN SIS DRAMATIC AFTER WHAT HAPPENED. thats just pure disgusting . she wasnt remorseful at allll in fact i doubt this bother her in the slightest except for the fact that her dear friends ended up in jail.
@@syminreed3922 true, and there’s a chance she set her sister up for that intentionally which others suggested and I believe there’s good probability she did do that intentionally given her behavior and apparent lack of concern or responsibility for what happened to her sister.
@@jeffwilliams9866 A smart sister wouldn’t have those men there in the first place first place.
"I wanted to open Lucy up, she was sitting by me the whole party." Uh, so, a 14 year old wanted to stick to her sisters side during a party with people SHE doesnt know...? Yeah, Maya only cared about the party and the popularity she would get from it.
Nope she did this intentionally. She has no empathy that she was raped, she says she didnt rape her so she didnt do anything wrong, more so than any of this was her telling mom she always sides with Lucy even when shes "being a baby". Middle children tend to have resentment that is natural but not to this level they would try to put their baby sister with someone too old for her and let him harass her.
Shes more resentful the rapist didnt want to be her friend anymore because hes in trouble than she is that he raped her sister. Shes 18 mom cant make her not be friends with him, shes mad she cant be his friend and mad mom isnt more worried about that.
She knew as well that no one told Lucys name in the paper. Asking her why she told people was pointless she is just going to lie and gaslight and she did. She said they were being dramatic and its no big deal and everyone knew anyway.. when they didnt and she knew that. That was an intentional malicious thing she did plus the resentment and victim blaming shes doing while acting like mom should have coddled her instead for having to spend a night or two in jail...... yeah all around this was malicious and intentional.
She didnt care about the party she cared about herself, her goals, her wants, her anger towards her little sister and mom, and she tried to get this guy to get with her. Shes mad he stopped being her friend/rapist/worst of the rapists when he got caught
Big sisters don't like their little sisters tag along all the time. But you bet in this situation I'd be the one scolding my sister if she left my eye sight. Heck. Don't even let go of my hand. Not even having the party in 1st place.
I have the feeling Maya wanted to join that gang and used her sister to get it, and it is disgusting. I hope she face the consequences of her actions and that OP disowns her.
if your kid chooses to join a gang before they're out of your house it's your fault as the parent, I'm sorry. I was friends with an ex gang member and he joined the gang coz he was neglected and they made him feel seen and like he had a family. I've heard that from nearly every kid who joins a gang. That they joined coz it felt like family and someone having your back and like you'd be assured safety to some degree. Kids usually join gangs because they don't feel supported in other areas. Like yes, Maya grew up to be awful, but lets not let OP off the hook for making this monster.
Basically, if this were your kid, you can kick her out, but that doesn't band aid over the fact that you raised the monster you're booting out of your home, it just let's you pretend you had no part in it and makes it easier for you alone.
It's the fault of peer pressure@@abarbienamedken3334
@@abarbienamedken3334 Don't you put the whole blame on the parent, while yes some of the blame MAY lay with the parent, we do not know that. what we do know is that Maya left her sister with men that were affiliated with gangs, all alone, and it is HER fault she got assaulted. I do not like how you're trying to push the view away from the kid toward the parent, I grew up in a shitty household, poverty and abuse, but guess what? I had my sisters back and she had mine, and while it wasn't all happiness and rainbows I learnt my weak spots and worked to better them on my own. Seeking validation, joining a gang etc is no excuse for knowingly putting your sister in danger
@@abarbienamedken3334dude some kids are just assholes. Lets not act like any 16-18 yr old doesnt know what they’re doing. They aren’t babies ffs. I’m 19, do you know just how many people my age from younger ages understand that what Maya did was absolutely fucked? Maya is 18, shes not 10.
At this point, I'd just disowned Maya, and move and not tell anyone where I was going.
For me this is in layers; OP is even entertaining the idea of forgiving Maya, OP is letting Maya remain in the home. OP isn't pursuing criminal charges against Maya.
@scottpelletier7095 She didn't let her stay. She sent her to live with her grandparents, as for criminal charges, there really isn't anything to charge her for, that'll actually stick, and op already admitted her blunder to helping her with the child endangerment charge.
My thoughts too. My God, am I glad to be a mom to only one child.
"I wanted her to open up", coupled with everything else, screams orhestration. She's fr a sociopath. Likely rationalised some form of jealousy of her younger sister, especially as she complained about emotional neglect... as an adult!
That's what I'm thinking. She felt bad for how innocent Lucy was, so she wanted to corrupt her. Happens a lot in mostly female friend groups.
Hi, sociopathy is not a diagnosis! It's usually what people call Antisocial Personality Disorder or another cluster b like histrionic or narcissism. Would you be shocked if I told you it is incredibly rare for these disorders to simply be genetic (and if they were the signs are extremely obvious if you're paying attention for the first 18 years of your daughters life and therapy is extremely helpful for these disorders). It is more common, however, for them to be a result of childhood neglect! Most of these disorders are either a cry for attention like borderline and histrionic, while others are based on feeling you can literally only rely on yourself and everyone else will fail you or other people take away from your ability to care for yourself, like with narcissism or antisocial.
Basically what I'm saying is sociopathy is 9 times out of 10 a result of childhood neglect.
Lucy having an unhealthy attachment with her sister (Defending her after her actions led to a traumatic event.) and then asking her mom if she ruined their family shows that this is a dysfunctional home from the start. I also felt like it was my fault my home was being ripped apart when my parents found out about my brother assaulting me, but that's coz my parents lack of communication and the anger I felt every time I was near them. Not communicating is also neglect.
What I'm saying is that Maya was most likely neglected her whole life along with the other kids in the family and this is just the manifestation of all that neglect the kids faced. And now the mom is confused as to how her kid ended up this way. News flash, its the mom's fault!
Maya is at fault here. She didn't care that her sister was assaulted. She's playing the victim card. She knew these guys were criminals and still,left her sister alone with these thugs. I hope they got long prison sentences. Selling the house is a good idea. Lucy probably doesn't feel safe there. Maya needs to own up to what she did. Call me evil if you want but I would not allow her in the new house until she apologizes. You can help her financially until gets on her feet. But Maya needs to learn accountability. Just sayin.
100% right! Maya didn't even feel sorry for what she did and all she did was hug her sister. She even said she overheard her sister she probably hasn't even been talking or hanging out with her sister. I pray Lucy can move on from this trauma and hopefully realize how selfish her sister really is. And Lucy's sister in law is a WAYYY better sister than Maya.
You're a better person than me. If I were the mother I would never allow that Maya girl in my house ever again. She clearly showed no regrets and dismisses what happened to her sister, which was her fault, and sees it as an inconvenience to her. There's something really disturbing about that girl. People like that could easily lie and beg for forgiveness but never mean it, they just play a role to get what they want. If she were regretful she had been so since day one. Not just because her mom told her off.
Yeah Maya needed to learn a lot of things her mother never taught her apparently.
And then the mother has the gull to be like "I don't know how this happened! She must have been born a sociopath and I somehow failed to notice for the 18 years I was responsible for her health including her mental health!" and then fails to realize sociopathy is 90% of the time a personality disorder that's the result of neglect and this taking place in the family proves its dysfunctional to begin with. This doesn't happen in happy, functional families with good parenting and communication...
Y'all are letting the mom too off the hook while still saying Maya needs to learn like yes she does, I wonder who was supposed to have taught her that though. Wild.
Uncovered your eyes, Maya set Lucy up.
thinking the same thing.
It is MAYA's FAULT, she invited gangmembers into your HOME, what the f did she think would happen? drink tea? she set her little sister up to get r word.
OP should change her will so that Maya doesn’t inherit anything.
This was absolutely a set up. That poor girl. And the fact others heard the screaming and didn't do anything is disgusting.
Maya totally set her up by pushing one of the guys on her. She's 100% to blame.
You know 100% Maya gave her sister to the gang leader to get into the gang. The therapist needs to lose their license for even thinking r*pe was an accident. 🤬
To be fair, we don't know what exactly therapist was told by Maya. We know what happened from OP's perspective and who those friends were, but it seems like Maya only talked how it 'affected' her, and could spin it like her friends don't talk to her/ she don't have time or attention because 'Lucy is dramatizing'.
@@ritaerror7829 Yeah, given how she was apparently vague on who the culprits might have been (when she knew full well that one of them had been harassing her), it's entirely possible she spun a story to the therapist.
@@MsAnimefan95I think thats exactly what happened
Maya definitely strikes me as a sociopath. She's dangerous to herself and to others, the fact that she cared more about "losing a friend" than about her sister? That's a tell-tale sign right there.
Holy shit, this story made my stomach churn either way. I'm disgusted and appalled with how this whole thing went down and with the fact that Maya knew these dudes were no good, yet she let them harass her sister anyway. The fact she left right before they SA'ed her is just troubling.
My heart goes out to OP and especially to Lucy. I can't even fathom how traumatized that poor girl is from what happened. Something tells me she won't ever fully recover from this, even with years of therapy.
I'm sorry if I'm rambling, I have family that was SA'ed so this hits home with me. This is the first time a story made my stomach churn like this in a long time.
Yes, this is awful 😢
It almost sounds like her (Maya’s) convenient departure was PLANNED and Maya possibly had an ACTIVE part in sister’s assault. I hope not but by some of her actions and the comments, it’s a real possibility. If she was doing drugs or was trying to join the gang or both, then the chances of her being even more involved by planning it, is much stronger.
@@jeffwilliams9866 also, it was a party with adult men, pretty sure that if not drugs, there was at least alcohol. She's old enough to know how bad it can get! And I think Lucy could too... like, she just got to her room and go to sleep? Pretty sure she locked the door at least, but the guys STILL get inside (unless they have weird doors without lock, but still)
Ugh, yes! I totally agree and I think that this is probably one of the most heart wrenching stories I've seen.
As someone who was SA'd by my older brother and my parents acted shocked like OP, I blame the mother. Sociopathy doesn't happen without neglect (its rare for it to be genetic and not caused by trauma/neglect and its not even a diagnosis, it's usually a personality disorder that is very noticeable to non-neglectful parents and easily treatable with therapy especially at young ages.)
This shit doesn't happen in happy functional homes where the parents are paying attention to their kids mental health. This happens in neglectful dysfunctional families.
"I raised you better!" clearly not. My parents said that to my brother and yet I heard my dad say marital SA doesn't exist. The parents are never innocent when a kid turns out this bad. My dad also said he was the one who suffered most in this scenario coz it was his kids when I was literally the one who got SA'd by my own brother who I trusted but yanno. I can't stand parents who end up letting their trauma in the scenario get in the way of taking care of their traumatized kid. The fact Lucy is blaming herself for breaking up the family shows OP is not doing a good enough job of communicating with her and also hiding her obvious disdain for the problem she raised.
Happy kids with good parents don't turn into bad people like this.
My heart bleeds for Lucy who was the victim of all of this. I don't feel an ounce of pity for the mother though. As someone who was a Lucy, I will NEVER give the parents any pity in these scenarios where one kids poor raising leads to the other being traumatized. If OP's hurting, fucking good, your parenting led to this so I do not care, just don't let it get in the way of you supporting the actual victim.
Maya needs to go to jail for setting up her minor sister. She was responsible for her safety and well being and not only failed the job, but was the cause of it. She sounds like a sociopath.
The fact that the sister cared more about losing a "friend" then her sister getting violently attacked is purely DISGUSTING. I'm sure Maya would feel different if SHE was the one who got attacked instead.
I have a hunch but his sounds like a damn set up. She threw the party, she invited these men, she tried to set her sister up with one of them, conveniently leaves, and withholds the names of her 'friends' during a police investigation...
The lack of remorse on her end and attempting to excuse and down play a violent SA, and deciding to mourn the loss of her friendship with one of these monsters instead be outraged on her sister's behalf, is pretty telling where she is on this.
This girl can't be trusted and shouldn't be around her sister. Because I feel like this would not be a one time incident
So grateful to the later posters who expressed genuine concern for Lucy’s and OP’s mental well-being. Ensuring that Lucy has a strong support base, and learning that her Brother and S-I-L are taking an active part in encouraging and supporting her.
Imagine what the commenters' reaction would have been if it were an older brother who had left his adolescent sister in the home with several grown men.
Saying that Maya is not at fault, when she threw the party, is psychotic.
My parents paid me to watch my brother when they were out for the night. The first time I was 13 and he was 9 (we’re Gen Xers ..) I remember about the 2nd or 3rd time, I ended up having to call my parents because he was running a fever, had a headache and was bleeding from his ear (small droplets - he suffered a lot of ear infections around that time of life). When they came home, I had him on the couch with my brand new pillow (really soft and comfortable to lay on) and had given him some children’s Tylenol. Thankfully, it was just another ear infection, but I was still very anxious. He could be an incredibly annoying little brother, but I could NEVER imagine letting him get injured or assaulted if there was absolutely anything I could do to stop it!!
It's 100% Maya’s fault and she should've been charged the same as the grapists. She brought 4 grown a$$ men into the house, knew they were in a gang and were criminals, allowed her sister to get harassed and had Lucy’s boundaries pushed, did nothing when those men hurt Lucy, told people what happened to Lucy, focused on her own selfish feelings about this rather than Lucy, and then kept victim blaming her and brought up how Lucy was talking to a guy, like she somehow deserved what happened to her for just being a teenaged girl.
All this and Maya denied any accountability. I know the courts didn't say it, but Maya sounds like an accomplice to me.
Grapist? Was there fruit involved?
@@jeffwilliams9866 YT shadowbans/delete comments with sensitive words, people don't wanna risk it
@@jeffwilliams9866remove the g- it’s for censorship
Maya would be disowned. She clearly can't be helped. She 100% set her sister up. She's a psychopath/sociopath .
That Maya girl is a psychopath. Plain and simple. Shows no shame and no remorse and yes, it was 💯 her fault what happened. She had one job, to take care of her sister and she goes and exposes her to criminals. OP just move with your other daughter and don't tell your psycho daughter your address. Keep her at arm's length like forever. Some people are just rotten.
I’d get Maya tested for possibly being a socio or psychopath.
Something tells me maya set her sister up.
Hence the unwillingness to give names,perhaps its time for op to change the will and go full nc with maya,just in case.
The fact that the sister literally went on to tell everyone about what happened to her sister after her sister asked her not to, and then said she had to get over it disregarding the fact that she is still a CHILD. Maya is likely a sociopath or psychopath. Like, legit, this seems like she’s lacking empathy for her sister.
She all but gift wrapped her sister for a known rapist. Even assuming it wasn't deliberate, and I'm not convinced it wasn't, she is still largely to blame for all of it, and in the aftermath, she just tries to twist the whole thing to her benefit.
The parent may not fully blame Maya for everything....BUT I DO. Said events would never have happened if she had done as she was told or even been more responsible. Her actions were what led to it happenening thus she is fully responsible for it all.
This will affect Lucy even to the point of ptsd when her own son's (if she has them) are playing making random noise jumping out on her etc she may not cope well with things like that, and not know why
The thing is, whether or not she was trying to set up her sister to get her assaulted is completely irrelevant, because she had made multiple purposeful choices to allow this to happen:
1. She threw a party despite not being allowed
2. She didnt invite any of her sister's friends
3. She invited several grown adult men who she fully knew had gang associations
4. She left her alone with the gang members without giving a heads up, and
5. She didnt have anyone watch over her while she was gone.
She had several opportunities to prevent this from happening. She could have abstained from throwing a party. She could have not invited people she fully knew were gang members. She could have taken her sister with her when going outside. She has permanently ruined her sister's life by being ignorant, irresponsible, and (speculatively) downright malicious. Not only that, but the fact that she had the gall to ask why she should apologize makes her evidently repulsive and unforgivable. If i was the parent, i quite frankly would have fought for the harshest punishment she could have gotten in court and any love i had for her would have disappeared into thin air the moment she told people her sister got assaulted without her sister agreeing to people being told about it.
I absolutely believe it was a set up. Even an idiot wouldn't leave a 14 year old alone with adults that were harassing her all night. Maya knew these men were criminals, she knew they were gang affiliated, she brought them there; Lucy's attack was Maya's fault.
Full disclosure as someone in the field, the counselor is going to be more on the side of whomever the designated client is, that's kind of the job and a bit of what makes therapy hard when they bring someone else in because who is the client in this situation. Depending on how long therapy has been going on, it may be too early also to even challenge the client on some things even if we want to because its still building rapport and we want to make sure it doesn't cause the client to want to terminate the therapeutic relationship. Often earlier on we want to see the world from their view and provide tools and techniques to help cope with internal stressors before we start asking questions that could see if there are alternative views. A kind of stabilize their footing and ensure they have the means to begin exploring more raw areas.
Thank you for the insight on how counselors work. I was a livid with that counselor in this story, but it makes more sense after reading your comment.
I see the point, but just asking, WHO is the client when the parents are paying? Like, on one hand the kid is having therapy and might decide to end it (but depending on age might be a bit forced by parents to go anyway), but if you insult parents that are paying, they will probably terminate anyway? I know Maya is old enough to be client herself, but just wondering if she were younger and dependent on mom, will counselor still do the same?
@@ritaerror7829 The client would be the person attending the sessions, the main times this can get challenging to navigate is kinda like an unofficial couples counseling, and sometimes official couples and family counseling where it may be challenging. I'm not actively practicing so it has been a while since I've brushed up on the state laws & ACA code of ethics. IIRC even if the parents are paying and the client is minor, confidentiality still reigns supreme unless the client is a threat to themselves, or others. A counselor will contact a guardian in cases where the client cannot give consent due to age or otherwise if that client is in danger / being harmed or is one to others.
The counselor is likely going to be on the side of the client as it is the nature of the relationship to be an assistant in navigating the journey with the client. The reactions of the counselor are going to likely vary based on the counselors theoretical foundation. Not all counselors are the same, not just in personality but approach. You've probably heard of CBT Cognitive Behavioral Therapy, but that's really just one of many theoretical approaches to therapy and not all are applicable to the same clients, or even the same presenting problems. The way they handle a client is likely going to be different than say how one handles a client who has a foundation in Freudian approach. Since I do not know the hypothetical counselor in this story, I cannot tell you what her approach is, we're lacking significant information for me to even begin to distinguish that.
Regardless though, even if the client cannot terminate the relationship, I.E being forced to go by a parent, It's a getting further with honey than vinegar approach in a very loose way of putting it. Do you think the child, or, young adult in this case, is going to open up if I start asking questions out of the gate that challenge their held inner world views? Do you think if the client is in denial that they're likely to feel comfortable and trust me if I come on too early? There are some approaches like solution focused therapy that do have means of going at this, but it also is going to be as effective as the clients willingness to change. The client here, Maya, is clearly resistant, and that could be from a plethora of reasons, once more I don't know her, I'm not counseling her, so its all second hand information. The counselor was likely just as surprised on some information because we don't have it all either, we rely on our clients being truthful with us, but sometimes the truth is hard to come out, hence, rapport, rapport, rapport.
If you are curious on a lot of the ethical rules of therapy and maybe some of it will answer some other questions that we have to follow, google ACA code of ethics 2014. The first result from counseling is a PDF file that lists the ethical ruleset that counselors in America have to follow, not including any additional state legislature. Breaches of these ethical boundaries can result in a review that could end in punishments of requiring more training, education, probation, suspension and permanent loss of right to practice based on severity. My apologies If I missed anything or went in a weird direction, it's 5 am for me hahaha
@@ritaerror7829Client means patient in this context. My insurance may pay for my therapy but I’m still the client. The point stands if a parent is paying. But I think the therapist effed up. They should be on the clients side on one on one meetings especially in early meetings but more neutral when a session is used as family therapy. Usually a therapist is always aware that they hear their clients pov and other have their own pov. Also they usually should be aware that clients may lie for whatever reason. I can’t imagine how the therapist could have ever agreed that OP wasn’t fair to maya, regardless off maya left out in her sessions. A quick rundown of what happened with just the essentials and leaving out details that make her look even worse should have been more than enough for the therapist to see that maya effed up majorly.
With rundown I mean:
Maya: I threw a party and invited a lot of people while mom was at work work and I watched my sis 14f. After a while I left and she was r during my absence.
Therapist: How do you feel about what happened?
maya: I miss my friend.
Therapist: ???
Shit excuse
Maya is a monster.
Damn Lucy was 14??? And Maya left her alone with a bunch of men whom SHE invited?! Oh hell no. Lash out a Maya, she needs to be held accountable.
Not only was it 100% her fault she tried to play the victim to her pysch and TOLD 27 people in a group chat for attention. Disgusting, disown and disengage. Maya did all these horrible things to be popular and get attention, don't give her any ever again. She needs a pysch that can actually help her become a better person instead of feeding into her bs.
How dare people defend maya, what the actual fuck is wrong with reddit sometimes
Get over Maya’s actions. I would not be able to. She betrayed her family and continues to do so. Send her away.
There's two possibilities here. ONE: Maya invited GROWN MEN over while her mom was out, encouraged the harassment of her sister all night long, then abandoned her sister to be assaulted, and she's merely a horrifically and willfully neglectful sister. Or TWO: it was a setup, and when Lucy wouldn't participate willingly, Maya arranged for her unwilling participation, and she's an accomplice to literal gang members. Which of these scenarios is forgivable?
Will people with serious issues like R please stop going to "therapists"?! They are NOT psychiatrists, have less schooling and training, and are basically no different than any one on social media in your DMs.The reason this therapist was so manipulated by Maya is because she has never had the training and experience a psychiatrist or psychologist has. Neither one of those would have fallen for Maya's pity party BS. They would have diagnosed her very obvious disorder (could be sociopath, could be bipolar, could be extreme narcissism, or any number of things a therapist cannot diagnose or treat). Therapists have done more harm for patients than ever in recent years. All good insurances pay for mental help with a real professional psychiatrist and psychologist. If yours doesn't, get a new one.
Bears are safer than Maya.
I never think i would say this before, but i hope maya gets the same medicine/karma what her sister went through just to know the pain of it. And this time she would be alone without any support she could lean.
Maya needs to go to jail. There is only one cause to this situation. That is Maya, who cares how ignorant she was. That is no excuse. Maya shouldn't ever be in charge of or have children ever.
Isn't it against the law to identify a victim to the public
Especially a minor
Couldn’t they charge her on that if so with a new crime she can get.iron window resort time for?
@@jeffwilliams9866 id just let her know that, so she never does it again. I couldn't prosecute my own daughter. The school is the main problem now, no way she should set foot in that school with everyone knowing. Needs to move away to put the previous life as far out of mind as possible. Keep the other daughter at arms length a little bit, she clearly doesn't get it at all
It might be hard to prove? Like with saying it to therapist to talk about the situation, it is in "closed space" and supposed to stay here. She could say that those were "close friends that deserved to know and wouldn't tell anyone" and if it was told to others they just deducted what happened because Lucy just stopped showing to school or something. If it were a public post on social media then maybe, but this might not count by law... depending on the lawyer at least
op as a mom must not be aware that maya did drugs... this kind of behaviour is someone who's already doing drugs, that she saw her criminal friends as people cool to hang out with... the whole story, I agree with op reaction to her daughter maya, but then as a mom I think she missed the part when her daughter maya has become the druggie or criminal gang to do all that stuff without remorse
She probably tried to trust her kid, and "everyone as a teen is rebelious". Though even if she knew, what was she supposed to do? Whenever Maya was responsible for Lucy or not, she would still throw party when mom was out. She was already in therapy, and it seemingly didn't help. With her attitude, neither talks or grounding would help her. And just knowing wouldn't be enough to send her... somewhere, dunno, camp? To parents? It could even backfire at OP
@@ritaerror7829 I'm saying, the period of time when Maya was still under her "jurisdiction" as a "mother", teen age, or whatever age, she must have missed that time when her own daughter grow up and befriend the wrong people and became druggie... people don't change overnight...if Maya is her daughter too, she would have watch Maya grow just like how she is protective over Lucy and would have known when her daughter changed to a different person - I'm saying the period of time before all this happens, did she always put Maya as baby sitter to Lucy?
@@radziahradzi probably the son was a babysitter before he moved out.
And my point is, what should a mother do when seeing those signs? Yeah, they don't change overnight, but again, what should be done?
@@ritaerror7829 mother should spend more time with them, before that happens. That you say big bro could be babysitting her before he left, probably shows the mom didn't parent her kids, letting the kids babysit themselves, that's one of the reasons that lead to wrong selection of friends
or pay her suppliers with something other than cash.she set her own s,ster as payment
Anyone who ever says it's not the job of an older sibling to look after the younger sibling in the absence of parents is just sh1t. Whenever there is a household, all family members automatically have to assume roles based on situations, and that's how family works & moves forward. I am 40 now, and I remember that both my parents worked and needed to leave us alone (with no sitter affordability) for a couple of hours a few times a week. I was tasked with watching my younger sister, i remeber us of when i was in 6th or 7th grade so 12-13, and she was 4 year yonger than me. This is the normal family duty of the elder sibling. Family is a support-based social structure, which is why it has value.
I would have no shame to disown maya. None! Erase my name off that birth certificate
Holy shit. Is Maya a psychopath? Her lack of emotion is terrifying.
EDIT: Whoop there is it.
DO NOT LET HER BACK IN LUCY'S LIFE
There's been another update in the form of an r/AITAH post, where she asked if she'd be the asshole if she withheld Maya's portion of the inheritance from her father (which was being kept until she was 18). She didn't spell out what Maya did but the top comments read her post history and were in favor of Maya not getting a cent.
Yeah totally Maya's fault none of it would have happened had she not thrown a party. I would have disowned her.
I heard stories about girls helping guys in situations like this cause the girl as a crush on one of the guys. So yeah, she's mad that her crush went to jail. And it was a set up.
If that happened to my kid and the other knew she'd be on the street and disowned permanently
open your eyes OP Maya set lucy up .
Maya is 90% responsible for orchistrating this those men were just happy to enjoy this opportunity provided to them.
Maya put her in a dangerous situation 18 is old enough to know better,then left her in a house with strangers. I couldn't get over this. Send her away before you do something you'll regret.
The fact that you can state that you don’t hate your daughter shows your love as a mother; it is NOT wrong to love your child even when they do wrong, but you are also not wrong to in your feelings toward Maya. If she had done as she had been asked, this situation would never have happened. She may not have been the cause, but she was the catalyst.
Maya remaining alive in the first place is a danger to Lucy . Withholding her "friend's " name who is her sister's r@p!st?
Apparently Maya never checked on Lucy after getting back from her McDonald's 'run', that seems to cement the reality on top of all the other details that she cares nothing about her. It would be understandable if the mother disowns Maya but unfortunately Lucy will most likely take on the additional burden of believing she caused it. I hope Lucy can find the help she needs to heal and eventually thrive.
poor Lucy 😢😢😢 and Maya totally set her up!!!!
I think the part that bothered me the most was the explanation that Maya had been 'trying to put Lucy with this one guy'. Like...what does that mean? Does that mean she was saying 'hey, stand next to this guy instead of me for a while', does it mean she was trying to get Lucy to *talk* to this guy, or was she trying to get her *14 year old* sister to hook up with this guy? Like...maybe I'm more effected by this because I find the notion of sex at all disgusting, but the thought of Maya even *suggesting* a 14 year old be sexually active with *anyone* that 14 year old had not expressed enthusiastic interest in beforehand is stomach churning for me. I don't have enough details to make any actual calls on this, and luckily I don't have to, but I hope OP and Lucy are healing, and that Maya is in a situation that doesn't allow her to cause more harm, accidentally or otherwise.
I also hope that OP talked with that therapist that Maya was going to, explaining the actual facts of the case and the current home life, because if that person heard the same story we did about how this happened and was still calling it an 'accident', then that person should not be responsible for the mental health of vulnerable people. It seems likely to me that Maya simply doctored the story to make it sound like she had a lot less culpability for the situation that allowed this to happen. Its possible that she *does* feel bad but is reacting to that guilt by trying to minimize the events. A lot of people do that, will feel shame for something but talk themselves out of it by recontextualizing it as 'not actually that big a deal'. So there's a couple of ways this therapist could have heard a doctored story, but if they didn't, and they *knew* the real details of the night and still agree that Lucy was 'being dramatic' over an 'accident'? I feel like you should report that person somewhere, to some sort of governing body that checks in on whether or not medical professionals should loose their licenses. I've heard of a few terrible therapists who allow their personal agendas to infect what they tell people, and I've read stories of ruined families because of these people, so...if there's a way to get bad therapists out of the profession, it should happen.
The law held Maya responsible. Maya served her up.
Maya is a problem. Coincidentally, my older sister is also named Maya. She has caused problems for me, encouraged her friends to verbally harass me in our home, and still lies about who I am as an adult (who doesn’t interact with her). My parents knew Maya displayed all of this behavior and did nothing about it. Not even a, “don’t do that.” In short, good for that mom for trying to protect her family from Maya. I hope the mother here continues to protect her family and not soften or allow Maya back in her home before she’s done the work and has proven she is no longer intentionally hurtful.
What kind of human is Maya? No remorse for her sister and affiliated with Gang?!
Maya screwed up big time. The bigger problem is the fact that she does not appreciate the severity of her actions - only that she is being targeted for all the things against her. The therapist is only going by what what Maya said and chances are she painted a rose-tinited version of the incident. But until she understands her role and the consequences of her actions, there can never be forgiveness for her. The fact that she was protecting the identity of her friends was the breaking point. I am surprised that this alone did not get her kicked out of the house for good. She chose her friends over her family. That is unacceptable.
In the first account, it seems the bridesmaids were quite thoughtless to suggest one last adventure. It's likely she wouldn't have considered it if they hadn't brought up the idea.
Maya probably wrote the 1st comment: both said she wasn't the one at fault for what 4 men did to her sister despite OP clearly said she was paid to look after her sister. Now, if you wanna argue that setting Lucy up is part of the job, well... it exposes who you really are
The girl that says to just blame the men is that annoying person to talk to, she just hates men, that girl, caused everything she knew, she knew it all but didn't do anything she probably knew what they were going to her sister and that's why she left, I feel so sorry for the mother, and it's probably a good idea that the father doesn't know.
You just know if Maya was a brother that comment would be totally different
Everyone needs counseling.
I would have loved for my parents to punish my sister for what she did to me. Or even acknowledge what she did to me.
Make maya work at a grape crisis center, homeless shelter. Or other insightful job. R is something that doesn't go away. And have future reactions that maya will never see.
I assume maya acting out because of dad gone not something else. But she needs to get passed her issues or she has a long life of hurt in front of her. To this day my sister has not revealed what happened to her as a child. But mayas deliberate incompetence is causing significant harm to others.
Set her straight now. She should be with someone else. If her impulsiveness is leading to felonies who knows what else is next.
Omg! Maya may have actually set her sister up. She knew exactly what her friends were capable of. It will be hard but OP has to cut off her oldest daughter, the sociopath. I’m so very sorry for OP & Lucy.
this sounds like maya set this up.
Holy shit, wth is wrong with the people defending Maya
Even before the update her guilt is objective
i dislike this person, has a view on how a family needs to be and seems really not wanting it to be broken trying to find any reason to get maya back in the house, doenst want to talk to her oldest son even if its the biggest deal that they may have had, just because she again has a view on how newly wedded needs to be, i dont get really good vibes to where all this i going, lucy needs so much more care than what i´m seing displayed and an only mom more centrated in if she can have her daughter (maya) back, she said so much details of how likely this was a set up, she said such horrifics things and should be in jail, what op is trying to do is forgiving somethig she has no right in forgiving
This is the problem when you are a (probably loving) parent of a criminal. It was bad, and OP feels it with the whole "disliking" thing, but she can't just accept how her "own sweet kid" could do that.
Also with the son, she said Lucy was in hospital, so maybe she wanted her to be stable before sharing the news (not great if Lucy wouldn't make it, but also with how she was assulted by people probably his age she could think it wouldn't be the best for him to come), and then said she was going out with son's wife, so they did get to know and support Lucy
yeahhhh dis own that one i would
Maya set Lucy up. I agree with the other commenters, I think Maya is a sociopath.
My advice? Invest in a wood chipper.
This story makes me sick to my stomach. I hope to god its fake
Maybe it's just me and the autism, but I've always been very strict with rule following so there's no way this would ever have happened to my younger siblings. I'm also very paranoid, so there's no way I would have left her unsupervised around strange men.
I have a pretty thick skin. I literally study true crime and SA cases because I want to be a counselor and advocate for victims of SA and DV as my future career, but this story just absolutely broke me. I have never sobbed at a reddit story like I did here. I have a little sister that i'm close to, with just a slightly larger age gap between us than Maya and Lucy, which is why I think this hit especially hard. And if one of my "friends" did that to her, I would probably face a felony myself with what I would do to them.
It is absolutely despicable how Maya treated her sister, I genuinely don't understand in the slightest why she did what she did and what she said in the aftermath without her being a sociopath and/or prioritizing joining a gang over her own sister, which would mean that she purposely set her up. I don't blame the mom one bit, she sounds like a wonderful mom and i'm so glad that at least she + Lucy's brother and his wife are standing up for Lucy.
I like to think I have thick skin too. I help out boys subjected to abusive upbringings, neglect, physical abuse and so on. But even so, this was especially hard to listen to, the men deserve the worst kind of treatment in prison and even that would not be justice. You will hear stories thay you will wish you could unhear and everyday you will think about the sheer state of our world. There's not enough people in the world who can stomach this type of thing and make a difference, so I sincerely wish you the very, very, very best of luck in your pursuit to support victims of abuse.
Maya is definitely at fault, she’s the one who threw the party and invited those men and left her sister alone with them. Hell,?I would argue she set her sister up to get SA’ed cause why else invite all those men over and then leave her sister alone???
*Where's The Video With The Rest Of The Updates!*
There are no new updates as of now, except for the ones in the video. I’ll keep an eye out and post them if any new update is posted.
After the whole story… Maya wanted that to happen to her
Geez I really really dislike maya
It sounds like maya did set her up
Sentimental value??????? On a house your child was SA’d in???? Wow!
Well, it was a house she and her late husband purchased and lived in, probably most their lives. So indeed it had sentimental value. But I bet even OP had dilemma and probably gonna end up selling it anyway
Dont blame OP for this. It was obviously sentimental way before this.
Shame the story was cut short.
is there a reddit link?
Lets be honest you should disown 18.
Maya is a monster
Excuse me! She's still going to prom?
Holly sh....
It all happenedunder mayas watch it is her fault
This is exactly when you grab the belt and keep all the doors in the house open for everyone to hear her pain for hours, while on call with her friends
0:17 well crap, stopped enjoying this story after that
Lmao I can't believe Maya is still alive right now, but that's what you get with a single mom. Hope Lucy can get away from all these losers and get on the path to healing.
WTF?
Everyone is focusing on the wrong thing, yes Maya is largely to blame for the scenario but also you are missing that this is the behavior of a child who has not been parented right. I hate to say this but anytime a parent says "I raised you better than this" most of the times what they meant was they never sat down and had an actual conversation they just assumed the kid knew better which is neglectful parenting.
If your kid is to the point of throwing huge parties behind your back, associating with known criminals, not caring about your other kid's assault, I'm sorry but that's not normal behavior. You can say "Oh she's a sociopath" but sociopathy is not a diagnosis it's usually a symptom of a disorder. Usually those are personality disorders which me and my spouse have. Most people with personality disorders have been abused or gone through trauma (typically severe neglect) that they had to process alone. it is rare for a personality disorder to be purely genetic and not trauma based. This means the daughter had to have been showing signs of mental illness far before this incident.
Also why is the mother getting self-help books instead of paying for her own therapy? This is too specific for self help books. I'm tired of "I did everything, I even bought self help books!" but then they don't go to therapy. Why? Are you scared they may mention your parenting as part of why this all happened?
Also my wonder is if Maya does feel guilty for what happened but it's easier for her to cope by shutting down and dissociating from the extent of the damage. I also wonder if Maya was so adamant about not losing her "friend" because she didn't feel supported by her family and he manipulated her into thinking he was there for her when really he was taking advantage of her not feeling seen.
Happy kids don't do drugs (the mom mentioned pot smoking). Happy kids don't associate with gangs/known violent criminals. Happy kids have a healthy relationship with their siblings (the youngest even seems to have an unhealthy attachment style with her sister, not wanting to blame her and feeling it's her fault the family is falling apart which also shows a lack of communication in the house that leads to assumptions being made like this). Happy kids don't show signs of sociopathy. Happy kids don't have unhealthy attachment styles with friends to the point of it splitting them open to have to ditch them after they assault their family.
As someone who grew up with a sociopathic older brother who WAS my assaulter, not just friends with but was the one who did it, I'm sick of parents who act like they had nothing to do with their kid turning into a monster. It is your fault as a parent. Good parents don't raise bad kids. Even with mental illness, you get them help and are open to that and don't treat them like an incurable monster. If you have to say "I raised you better" then clearly you didn't. If you start hating your kid, well you're who made them who they are, they're probably matching your energy. If you start thinking your kid is a monster, remember you made them that way.
tl;dr yes Maya is partially to blame but the mother has no right to sit here and act like "Wow this hell child, who raised her?" like you did, ma'am. You didn't teach her consent, you didn't give her enough attention and help to not feel more seen by convicted felons than you, etc. etc. Yes Maya grew up to be a terrible sister, but if she did, then that's on her parentage and I'm tired of people acting like the parents had no hand when a kid turns out this backwards.
Everyone's like "If Maya were my kid" "If this were my kid" if this were your kid you'd be a terrible parent and don't get to fantasize about punishing said child because you fucked up somewhere.
As someone who was SA'd by my older brother and my parents swear up and down they did everything right with him (They absolutely did not, they were so abusive I have 4 trauma disorders from them alone), I will never give an ounce of pity to parents who's poor parenting led to one of their kids doing something that causes the other kid to be SA'd.
You either failed to notice mental health issues and get them help or you caused the mental health issues to begin with.
If Maya were my kid this never would've happened because I would've noticed Maya's mental health issues and gotten her help or I wouldn't have caused my kid to be so mentally ill by being a terrible parent.
I'll say it again for the people in the back: Good parents don't raise bad people!
I'm 1 of 3. My brother and I are wonderful people. My sister is an awful person. Her son is a sweetheart. Mom raised us the same way her dad did, someone my sister admired greatly, it was perfect if it was coming from grandpa. My mom has finally had to go low contact this past year. My sister is 42 now. There are lots of parents who shouldn't have ever been parents who raise good people, like you. You were born good, and so were damaged, but remained at your core good. The reverse is also true. You can't raise a person born evil into being a good person.
OP just needs to kick Maya out. No further support, financial or otherwise. I don't understand inflicting her on her grandparents...
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Mom, this is all your fault. Sorry but it is. Blaming Maya is gross. Get them help and get yourself help as well. This one is on you mom. Fix it.
It is 100% Maya's fault (besides the r*pists), and I honestly fail to see how the mom is to blame here. The actions that she took afterwards were correct, and she is at least supporting her daughter. Maya is the worst sister i've ever heard of
Gee OP, maybe Maya wouldn't be such a mess and sneaking parties if she didn't have to give up her entire childhood to raise Lucy. OP is just as guilty.
wow, babysitting your siblings as a 18 year old while living in the family house to a single mother. Wow, such abuse. Get off your high horse, i baby sit my siblings all the time i have never once tried to push a stranger on my siblings and never left them with a house full on STRANGERS to get food. Maya left her sister ALONE in house full of people LUCY DOESNT KNOW. She abandoned her sister. You're the type of person to sit and watch someone R another and then laugh saying it was sex.
@ItzPubby OP said they had the arrangement for years aka Maya has been babysitting Lucy every day long before she was 18. She's been parentfied. My own mother was widowed with 3 kids. Know what she didn't do? Have me raise my siblings for years. She had 2 day jobs and made sure to give me time to still be a teen.
OP and Maya are both guilty.
Maya was babysitting. As the other person who replied said, babysitting isn't abuse. I suggest you STFU and understand OP is good mom. You're a bad person for assuming OP is neglectful.
@@GLoLChibs Having your kids be this monstrous isn't the usual outcome from being neglected. They just rebel and not intentionally harm their siblings.
@Dustin81 Except she wasn't monstrous nor did she intentionally hurt her sibling. It's not unheard of for siblings to try and hook their siblings up with friends.
Maya had been babysitting Lucy daily for YEARS. Her life was go to school, go home and care for Lucy while OP was at work. Any parent who can type out 'Before anyone says Lucy is my kid so she's my responsibility I paid Maya good money to watch Lucy and we've had this arrangement for years' is not a good parent. She's playing victim just as much as Maya is and shares just as much of the blame. Maya is nothing but a live-in nanny to OP and OP tried putting a price tag on Maya giving up her childhood. What good is it to pay her well when she can never go anywhere? What was OP going to do when Maya graduated, tell her she couldn't leave home because she needs her nanny? Because that's the mentality of parents who refuse to even entertain the notion they fucked up in some way when one of their kids suffers or gets in trouble. Maya messed up inviting people over and leaving, that's not her being intentionally evil.