Its intimidating at first to get into tuning stuff yourself. I think this video is VERY helpful to anyone willing to learn. Once again giving Hot Rodding back to the people!! Keep killing it man!
Spicy big cam big turbo 😂 thanks Matt! Not only for rescaling it for me but also showing me how you did it. I'll have to watch this one a few times haha
This video is awesome! So much info and helped a lot setting up a base tune. I’m working on my first E85 build and was lost when it come to initial timing values and what the LS likes typically. Working on a typical garage build e85 single turbo build. Would be awesome to see similar video as it applies to typical turbo, cam, intake, injector style build. Thanks Matt!
@@edwinrosado9712 exactly what it says. 😂 It copies the fuel axes over to the spark table so you don’t have to input it manually. Matt’s always got a method to his madness, so I was just wondering if there was a reason he chose to do it manually or if it’s just a personal preference type of thing.
Thanks Matt !! Learned a bunch here , my NA setup bucks in low RPMs, stick car , going to build a proper timing table and see if I can help it out , SS3 cammed lq4 . Sounds like I need to add some timing and lower the A/F listening to ya build these tables
Does adding resolution to the kpa axis in the off boost portion of the map like this help with start up and low load low rpm drive ability ? I have a 2.5 bar map sensor and have only the bottom quarter of the kpa axis dedicated to offboost and I’m having a lot of trouble with hot and cold starts.
@@SloppyMechanics thanks. Car seems to love 14psi on wastegate and wot stuff but the hot and cold starts are kicking my arse. Also fighting a high rpm coming to a stop sign or red light scenario.
@@SloppyMechanics I open the throttle blade and ignition is great but revs on come to a stop.... close the blade back up thing needs full pedal to start but gets rid of the high idle deal, I’m doing tps auto set etc but just missing something else I think, I’m getting there tho.
now do you have one for pump gas turbo cars? link me if you already have a video. trying to learn how to tune on a holley sniper/single turbo/ford 302.
Matt in your experience over the years do you feel that 93 pump gas with water/meth can handle just as much timing as e85? or is it generally a few degrees lower? im currently around 15.5 lbs and 16.5 degrees while spraying with dual 625ml nozzles.
My area of operation is right but the number on the actual map are weird. From 0 down is ok but into boost it goes 70's-80' to 115-130 an the max is 150. Is there something that needs changed. 3# -7# it's like not enough from what it thinks it should be.
Has any body had their wide bands fail? I love the terminator x over all I just worry how the whole thing relies on just that expensive sensor imagine it fails on a long trip lol
@@SloppyMechanics I read some reviews of saying that their wide band failed and defaulted to something crazy like 35afr and that it flooded their engines? Is that only possible during the learning stages or when you say you dont need it to run correctly does that mean it can run without it as a hole?
For me Lb/Hr is WAY easier than VE because if you have a good estimate on the Hp (and proper injector specs) you can build a fuel table that will be surprisingly close. When I started building custom Holley tunes (for motorcycles) I used dyno graphs to build the fuel tables and I was honestly shocked how close my first ever normally aspirated Holley tune was. It was a 250Hp Dragbike and Max CL Correction on the FIRST dyno pull was only 7% (not kidding) but I have done others that weren't nearly as close (mainly because I wasn't able to get the proper Injector Off Times)...
"14.7 is federally mandated." 😂 Joking aside, several people are confused where that comes from. Maybe this is helpful: One gram of pure gasoline requires about 14.7 grams of oxygen to burn perfectly. Thus the "air to fuel ratio" in a perfect situation is 14.7:1. Oxygenators pull that number down (because oxygen), so real world oxygenated fuel requires less air - and thus a lower ratio. Ethanol counts as an oxygenator. Pure ethanol is 9:1, perfect e85 (good luck finding that) is about 9.8:1, methanol is more flammable with around 6:1, etc.
so, no joke, why is it "perfect" its my understanding that the 14.7 is the cleanest burning mixture, again bringing up the emissions example i stated, as we all know a car will, start run idle WOT at 12.0 AFR without issue. assuming gasoline scale with no asshole bias winning factors
@@SloppyMechanics it's perfect in a chemistry sense; when the oxidation reaction (aka "burning" in this case) finishes, all of the compounds that went into the reaction come out burned; the chemical equation is perfectly balanced. In the real world, air isn't completely consistent, fuel isn't pure, and more importantly, the mixture isn't perfectly evenly distributed. You get pockets in the cylinder where there's more fuel, velocity changes things, air is left behind from the previous explosions... So reality means you often have to add more fuel to maximize the energy released in the part of the cylinder that does burn.
A good rule for pump gas is 14 lb of boost and 14° of timing for each pound of boost less than that you add one degree for each pound of boost more than that you subtract one degree. LS engines like 20-26 degrees full throttle timing at 100kpa, the timing should scale down from there to the 14 degrees mentioned
@@driftutv8274 Yes. I've been doing this on the side for 7 years and I personally don't think it's possible to run 20 lb on an LS on pump gas with any amount of timing but if you try the table in the video on pump gas you will be looking for a new engine. I usually limit people to 11 psi on straight pump which is what general motors does with all the factory supercharged engines. Also at that boost level the power difference between say 12° of timing and 18° of timing is not that dramatic so I always err on the side of safety. If it's someone else's car I also go down to 12.0 air fuel ratio at only 5 lb of boost and then reaching up to 11.5 by 11 psi. I know that's kind of excessive but I haven't had anyone come back with broken pistons either.
I feel like the first day of Chinese math class with a Spanish teacher in grad school, Matt. I tried to keep up..... like a flat tire does.
Thank you Matt. These TermX vids are invaluable 👍👍
Its intimidating at first to get into tuning stuff yourself. I think this video is VERY helpful to anyone willing to learn.
Once again giving Hot Rodding back to the people!! Keep killing it man!
Time for some sloppy class! Thanks Matt!
ok so now im terrified of the holley spark table dammit. lol. I have so much to learn and thats a good thing. thanks for doing this.
So many thanks Matt, I believe I'm slowly starting to grasp all the tuning wizardry.
Spicy big cam big turbo 😂 thanks Matt! Not only for rescaling it for me but also showing me how you did it. I'll have to watch this one a few times haha
Thank you!! Really appreciate you sharing your experience with this
I had to watch this video a few times. Thank you for the lesson.
Would love to see more videos like this, thanks for all the great knowledge and tips
This video is awesome! So much info and helped a lot setting up a base tune. I’m working on my first E85 build and was lost when it come to initial timing values and what the LS likes typically. Working on a typical garage build e85 single turbo build. Would be awesome to see similar video as it applies to typical turbo, cam, intake, injector style build. Thanks Matt!
Great video. Exactly the same way I go about it as well. Fast, effective, gets the thing on the road/dyno to see what it really wants ASAP 👍🏻
Found this while looking for videos on fuel enrichment... looks like I’ll be rescaling my tables now 🤣 thanks for the video!
Yesssss more Holley videos the better
When you moved to the Spark table, why didn't you just use the "copy fuel axes" feature?
@@edwinrosado9712 exactly what it says. 😂 It copies the fuel axes over to the spark table so you don’t have to input it manually. Matt’s always got a method to his madness, so I was just wondering if there was a reason he chose to do it manually or if it’s just a personal preference type of thing.
Yup, easier and faster...
Thank you for the education.
The ECU's been drawin' DEICKS
Matt can you do a video with working with the learn fuel table
This is some good shit. Thanks Matt.
If you re-scale just the boost vac. Columns; wouldn't driving in learn mode re-scale the chart for you?
Yes
You have to make sure your targets are right after a fuel scale change
Thanks Matt !! Learned a bunch here , my NA setup bucks in low RPMs, stick car , going to build a proper timing table and see if I can help it out , SS3 cammed lq4 . Sounds like I need to add some timing and lower the A/F listening to ya build these tables
On stick cars with a big cam, it usually helps to pull a bunch of timing in the area where it bucks.
@@dnchevyguy3 thanks for the tip , going to take it out this weekend and tweak the tune see if I can fix it
This info should work all the way thru holley line up from entry level sniper on up
Does adding resolution to the kpa axis in the off boost portion of the map like this help with start up and low load low rpm drive ability ? I have a 2.5 bar map sensor and have only the bottom quarter of the kpa axis dedicated to offboost and I’m having a lot of trouble with hot and cold starts.
absolutely if you need it, segmenting portions for drivability on a street car will drastically improve driving
@@SloppyMechanics thanks. Car seems to love 14psi on wastegate and wot stuff but the hot and cold starts are kicking my arse. Also fighting a high rpm coming to a stop sign or red light scenario.
@@SloppyMechanics I open the throttle blade and ignition is great but revs on come to a stop.... close the blade back up thing needs full pedal to start but gets rid of the high idle deal, I’m doing tps auto set etc but just missing something else I think, I’m getting there tho.
now do you have one for pump gas turbo cars? link me if you already have a video. trying to learn how to tune on a holley sniper/single turbo/ford 302.
Matt in your experience over the years do you feel that 93 pump gas with water/meth can handle just as much timing as e85? or is it generally a few degrees lower? im currently around 15.5 lbs and 16.5 degrees while spraying with dual 625ml nozzles.
My area of operation is right but the number on the actual map are weird. From 0 down is ok but into boost it goes 70's-80' to 115-130 an the max is 150. Is there something that needs changed. 3# -7# it's like not enough from what it thinks it should be.
Has any body had their wide bands fail? I love the terminator x over all I just worry how the whole thing relies on just that expensive sensor imagine it fails on a long trip lol
I haven’t had an issue with 40 or so installs also if you tune the car you don’t need the wideband at all for it to run correctly
@@SloppyMechanics I read some reviews of saying that their wide band failed and defaulted to something crazy like 35afr and that it flooded their engines? Is that only possible during the learning stages or when you say you dont need it to run correctly does that mean it can run without it as a hole?
Would these tunes work on small cube 323 twin turbo 63mm? Or get me in ball park? I really need help
Did you mean to be in Lb/Hr instead of VE when messing with the fuel table???
For me Lb/Hr is WAY easier than VE because if you have a good estimate on the Hp (and proper injector specs) you can build a fuel table that will be surprisingly close.
When I started building custom Holley tunes (for motorcycles) I used dyno graphs to build the fuel tables and I was honestly shocked how close my first ever normally aspirated Holley tune was. It was a 250Hp Dragbike and Max CL Correction on the FIRST dyno pull was only 7% (not kidding) but I have done others that weren't nearly as close (mainly because I wasn't able to get the proper Injector Off Times)...
How do you change the map kpa to psi
4:33 where did you get 80? You pointed down low at a number around 55
His mouse is offset down and to the left the whole video, the part he is talking about in your example is the top left most number in the table.
"14.7 is federally mandated." 😂
Joking aside, several people are confused where that comes from. Maybe this is helpful: One gram of pure gasoline requires about 14.7 grams of oxygen to burn perfectly. Thus the "air to fuel ratio" in a perfect situation is 14.7:1. Oxygenators pull that number down (because oxygen), so real world oxygenated fuel requires less air - and thus a lower ratio. Ethanol counts as an oxygenator.
Pure ethanol is 9:1, perfect e85 (good luck finding that) is about 9.8:1, methanol is more flammable with around 6:1, etc.
so, no joke, why is it "perfect" its my understanding that the 14.7 is the cleanest burning mixture, again bringing up the emissions example i stated, as we all know a car will, start run idle WOT at 12.0 AFR without issue. assuming gasoline scale with no asshole bias winning factors
@@SloppyMechanics it's perfect in a chemistry sense; when the oxidation reaction (aka "burning" in this case) finishes, all of the compounds that went into the reaction come out burned; the chemical equation is perfectly balanced.
In the real world, air isn't completely consistent, fuel isn't pure, and more importantly, the mixture isn't perfectly evenly distributed. You get pockets in the cylinder where there's more fuel, velocity changes things, air is left behind from the previous explosions... So reality means you often have to add more fuel to maximize the energy released in the part of the cylinder that does burn.
Do you switch learn off or turn it down after doing this?. Or just leave it as is.?
Always leave learn on or when you fill up with different types of gas or change altitudes the system will not compensate
Would this spark table work for pump gas? If not where would you adjust timing at for pump? Thanks!!
A good rule for pump gas is 14 lb of boost and 14° of timing for each pound of boost less than that you add one degree for each pound of boost more than that you subtract one degree. LS engines like 20-26 degrees full throttle timing at 100kpa, the timing should scale down from there to the 14 degrees mentioned
Chip Currey thanks chip! So 100kpa meaning atmosphere or 0psi and then scale from 20-26 down to 14deg at 14psi?
@@driftutv8274 Yes. I've been doing this on the side for 7 years and I personally don't think it's possible to run 20 lb on an LS on pump gas with any amount of timing but if you try the table in the video on pump gas you will be looking for a new engine. I usually limit people to 11 psi on straight pump which is what general motors does with all the factory supercharged engines. Also at that boost level the power difference between say 12° of timing and 18° of timing is not that dramatic so I always err on the side of safety. If it's someone else's car I also go down to 12.0 air fuel ratio at only 5 lb of boost and then reaching up to 11.5 by 11 psi. I know that's kind of excessive but I haven't had anyone come back with broken pistons either.
Chip Currey awesome thanks for the reply!
No k thanks bye? Disappointed
You give WAY too much info out for free. . . .