Where does Magic's story come from?
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- Опубліковано 21 жов 2024
- Read the Official Chapters: bit.ly/MTG_Sto...
The story for Magic: The Gathering is massive. It spans 30 years worth of sets, and features a huge roster of characters, locations, and important events. But where does it all come from? And how can you benefit from it as a player?
Join Ryan in this special story time where we talk about narrative structure, the complications of lore, and...Star Wars?
Become a Lore Mage: bit.ly/Patreon...
Still waiting on that animated Netflix show....😅
OMG I almost forgot about that!!
@@christianvigil487 I'm starting to think WOTC and Netflix forgot, too
I'd love as series of films that told the story of Yawgmoth.
The Russo brothers did us dirty 😅
And we will continue waiting.
I originally just played the game and didn’t care about the story. I found a bunch of characters I liked, so I started to read their stories and now I’m a fan of magic storylines. Reading the story answers a lot of questions you have about your favorite characters
As far as the whole 'knowing the story gives you insight into future cards' thing goes - since Quint's spark ignited in MOM, we know hes gonna pop up as a planeswalker in a future set (assuming his spark didn't immediately get ruptured, which would be a bummer) and if you know anything ABOUT Quint and the school he goes to, the most thematically appropriate upcoming plane for him to pop up on is Ixilan. Which means we can reasonably assume Ixilan will give us a new Boros colored planeswalker that cares about spirits and the graveyard, given what Quint's cards have cared about in the past.
The story is why I'm here. Played Magic when I was in middle school, got the Godzilla and Transformers cards as fun collectibles, but seeing the current set was about Urza and Mishra got me interested in seeing what's going on with Magic beyond a few fun collectibles for a binder. Really appreciate channels like this making the story more accessible!
Lore is reading the back of the baseball card, story is tuning in to watch the game
Yet another reason I enjoy playing the "Block" format. You can get really invested in the part of the plane/story that you enjoyed the most.
Usually the saying goes "you get what you paid for" but in Magic it's the other way around. Paid stories like Eldraine were garbage while the free stories are "better" at least when they're not skipping important details or being inconsistent
I'm looking forward to Quint's story as he uncovers history 😁
It's weird I didn't mind eldraine to much because we got a unique albeit not a great one however I liked the got style of kingdom with the different kingdoms being different colored aligned
@@tylerkister4628 Though that is the usual for alignments in each world. Like guilds on Ravnica. Maybe if they added more intrigue, I would've been distracted from the convoluted story we got
Quint is one of the only modern characters that interests me.
I'll defend the theros books I paid for, the story of Elspeth on Theros was great!
The difference in someone doing something for money vs having genuine inspiration and the drive to see that fulfilled as a result.
As always, love seeing your content first thing in the mornin, Ryan and Nicole!
Love me a little storytime on my lazy sunday.
I love your channel because you keep a relatively neutral take on the stories and just tell them like they are, while also asking both funny, and serious questions about the plot holes. And in all honesty, you are the only thing that keeps me in touch with the Magic story. It was technically the Mending storyline that was a wet towel on my enjoyment of the stories set in the Magic multiverse. Llorwynn rekindled it a bit (yeah, I know it wasn't the greatest story, but it was fun and enjoyable, and completely self-contained) but I just haven't been able to find enjoyment in the stories, and the new Phyrexian Saga murdered it and buried what small Spark I had left.
I don't have faith in Magic, but I will still be here, especially for Mustache Minute.
I only got into this channel when I wanted to know what the story was in Phyrexia: All Will Be One, but I am pleasantly surprised at how entertaining it is and I love these videos. Your descriptions are so thorough! Keep doing your amazing work!
As it so happens, I think I enjoy MTG _Lore_ more than I enjoy MTG _story_ - and I think it's an important distinction to have.
I enjoy magic story just fine, there have been some great character moments and some compelling narratives but what I like most is combing through these tales and gleening more information about the multiverse that MTG is set in through details that have been added. Given enough time, any story turns into lore and it's fun to see this rich history being built in front of my eyes as I've played along for the last 13-odd years.
Magic Arcanum scratches a vorthos itch like few other magic "lore" channels do because of Ryan and Michelle's intense focus on the narrative aspect of the card game. Only Ryan can get me excited at the prospect of seeing a historical set portraying the original Elder Dragon War (core set 2020 doesn't count) or attempting to despatch Elesh Norn by casting Mirroden Avenged after its blocked a 2/2 Knight token
But I will forever be the person reminding people that canonically every burgeoning artificer race on every plane in the multiverse will make an ornithopter
I usually just come to here for a recap of the story. You do a fantastic job of telling it. Keep up the awesome videos.
Thanks! Comments like this keep me going! 😅
Huh, I've heard you talk about story spotlight cards for years now, always thought they were identified as such in some online source, did not realize it was physically printed on the card.
I came back to the game after a 20 year hiatus with The Brother's War (nostalgia got me in this instance). I've gone from an Artifact heavy deck revolving around Yotian Dissident to a more general counter deck with MoM's Botanical Brawler. Been getting tore up pretty bad thinking of switching over to a Zhalfir inspired Knight deck. Being gone so long, I only really know Mirrodin, Dominaria, and Old School Kamigawa. So maybe I should celebrate returning to the game by making a flavorful deck in honor of Magic's newst-oldest Plane.
I miss the time when MTG stories were self contained. Like Kamigawa, or Lorwyn-Shadowmoor, Or Mirrodin. Like there wasnt such an overlording story with the same 5-20 characters. Kamigawa Story was trying to find out why the spirits were attacking Humans and find a way to end the war.
Original Ravnica was about the life and death of Agrus Kos.
but then look at the last 10 or so sets. All having one main story where it is just a continuous narrative. i want self contained stories back.
both is good, like they did an okay job with the story of the phyrexian. You had all this planes little self contained stories and in the background this manace grew slowly. I think this is the best way to have story for mtg, the problem is that everything is rushed and low quality
I think the discussion of Lore vs Story is really interesting when you look at the Dark Souls or Elden Ring story and lore videos that get put out, the lore is really interesting, but it takes someone putting the pieces together and then presenting it as a story for it to be engaging. You might pick up pieces of it as you play, you’ll follow certain paths and you’ll come across the body of an NPC you met 16 hours ago, but until you watch Vaati’s 2 hour Lore video on “that one guy who died there” you can’t really put the whole thing together.
And when you do, suddenly it all fits together, you’ll see something in the story and think “OH I recognise that! It was an item I found behind the windmill, I didn’t realise it connected to… OH! THAT DEAD GUY!” And it becomes so much more engaging.
This is exactly what I say in the video though: games often substitute lore for a story. Collecting breadcrumbs over the course of a game, and then needing an outside source to explain how these things are all connected is not my idea of an engaging experience. You, as the player, are creating your own story as you go (and that's fine. Lots of games embrace this sort of emergent storytelling, like Minecraft, where you basically pick your setting and decide what adventures happen to your main character) but that is still a far cry from a narrative arc (with a clear beginning, middle, and end.)
I don't have a lot of experience with Dark Souls and its kin, but I have to assume that by collecting bits of scattered lore, you are not getting a clear narrative arc. You might over time be able to piece together an order of events, but that's not the same thing. (And this is still different from non-linear storytelling, like we see in a lot of Tarantino films, for example.)
So yeah, you're not the first person to bring up this series in the comments here, but based on what people have told me I remain unconvinced that this is any sort of novel way to tell a story. It sounds a lot more like what I cautioned against in the video, which is lore in place of a story.
@@MagicArcanum I definitely agree with your points, lore is not a substitute for story. And I think a huge part of why the Dark Souls series is held in such high regard by people for it's world is because of external sources.
Like, if magic sets were only cards, but people loved it because they came to you to put together the pieces and give them a story to tie the cards together.
Your channel is a treasure.
I'm predicting a future indestructible Tezzeret card, no idea how would it work but sure it happens
We don't know if he kept his spark.
I never even noticed the uncanny similarity between Ryan and Bruce until he pointed it out. Now I can't stop seeing it.
Loved that Decipher Star Wars CCG
What about a video about history of magic story (and lore). When does the first flavor text appeared? When wizards published the first story article? At which point the Dominaria became small for all the characters? And so on..
Wow I never thought about this. Super interesting. Very cool distinction. Keep up the good work!
Amazing,thanks so much Ryan!
This reminds me an awful lot of Jim Stephanie Sterling, and their Objective Reviews. Love it!
I love coming here listening to Bruse-Tarl telling stories. 😂
What is lore? Baby don't hurt me, don't hurt me, no more!
You certainly are a wise one.
You have earned my respect.
@@happyslapsgiving5421
What is this feeling, that's put me in my place?
A hot red burning on the side of my face.
I feel the blood rush to my cheek. tears start to fill my eyes
and my lips are trembling but I can't speak...
I'm trying, oh, I'm trying not to cryyyyyyyy!
I just got slapped across the face, my friend
I just got slapped... Yes it really just happened
Everybody saw it! And everybody laughed and clapped
It was awesome! The way I just got slapped!
I love his take on the cards because I have a literal war of the spark commander deck that is my favorite to play
Win con is board wipe + elder spell +nicol bolas the dragon god
Your videos continue to entertainment and fill my noggin with knowledge. But, I have to agree I would like to see more stories dealing with the legendary creatures of the realm than the Planeswalkers. And while I love Jace, Ajanji, Karn, and so many others; I'd love to see these characters as just legendary creatures once in a while. They don't have to be all encompassing all the time and they don't have to always drive the narrative.
I wish the stories where avaliable online and in paper from, the WAR novel while not written greatly was a great thing as far as distribution.
Although it most likely wont happen, I wish that they could retell old stories under their new system so that you could consume their story for free in one place. They could set up the story in a chronological system starting from way back in the day and i'd read all of it in a heartbeat.
Even though it wasn't free, I really liked star wars novels' system before disney bought them. A list in the book of the chronological order of when everything happened gave me an interesting challenge to read all the books. I could consume them separately, of course, but it really appealed to me.
I like that i can come to MagicArcanum to find any information i would need to know for the story all in one place!
lol i just realized the image behind the video is of the "Royal Portuguese Reading Room" a famous brazilian library. I recognized by the name of Machado de Assis on the sign. That's lore for you guys...
Honestly, at this point I need a refresher who's where and what he/she is doing. So much lore that some stories haven't been touched in years.
Mr bald Lorewizard guy speaking to his camera and telling me sweet stories. I like it.
him explaining the nuance of lore and story feels like void or skull knight explaining the laws of casualty
I want a live action show. 4:3 aspect ratio, 90's styled corn and earnest in its seriousness. The Urza stuff leading all the way up to Invasion. I'd have cast Christopher Lloyd as Urza.
All the old designs too. No modernized versions of their costumes. All giant shoulder pads and everything
Ryan, perhaps (someday) instead of the 'Mustache Minute' you will might be allowed the time to give us an 'Eyebrow Hour'.
Haha I appreciate the enthusiasm but if you knew how much I stressed over meeting the expectations for a compelling Mustache Minute already, you'd know why I'm unlikely to attempt a full hour! 😅
Nice summary. Now that the phyrexians are dealt with (at least for now), I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on who will be the next big villains in the magic story.
I suspect we'll take a break from "big" villains for a while, and enjoy stories focused on singular planes and their own conflicts, which might be complicated by outsiders arriving via omenpaths. Tezzeret might also show up from time to time, but I think for now he wants to lay low and recover from the trauma endured working for Bolas and then Norn basically back to back. Oko might be meddlesome from time to time as well, and Kasmina is still a bit of a wild card, but beyond that, I think we're entering an era of pretty tame stories, and I'm excited for it.
@@MagicArcanum One idea I also had was Calix becoming a bigger threat to planeswalkers, like seeing them as "defying fate" with their actions or something.
Love the Decipher Star Wars Ccg callback!
Man I had so much fun with the old VS system.
My vorthos deck is called Saskia's Dommy Mommies. Yes it's a Saskia deck with only muscle mommies just as Saskia intends.
I always thought lore = what happened and story = how it happened?
What are your thoughts about piece of lore being so built out, they eventually do weave the tapestry of a story? If you think this is possible, how much lore do you need to tip it over into story?
As an example, I'd proffer the "story" told by Dark Souls, Elden Ring, and other FromSoft games. While character side stories absolutely happen while you are playing the game, the "main story" told actually occurred long before your character made their way through this world. As such, you piece together "lore" from locations and item descriptions until you have an idea of said "main story".
To me, the Magic story *could* be told in such a way - as I think they kinda used to do in older sets, before they had an official story on the website. Just flavor text and card art, fill in the gaps yourself. What if every token had some evocative, short text on the back, a la item descriptions in Soulsborne games?
In any case, thanks for the great content!
I think in the games you are describing, the story is about your character learning about history. How that knowledge shapes their actions and influences their path would be a story itself, but no matter how much lore you collect about what happened 'before,' you are still not experiencing it, and I don't think any amount of facts about that event ever become a story of their own.
So I've read they're calling Aftermath a "micro set" and the 2 stories I've already read, (beyond repair & she who breaks the world) are the only stories they're doing which is a little disappointing. Is any of this true, and are you waiting until the official release of the set on May 12th to do a story video?
As far as I can tell, those were the only two stories. I'm working on my recap video next, and it should be ready in about a week, right as the set itself goes on sale.
Great content.
I still want the netflix castlevania team to make an markov origin story. That would be intense.
I am very interested in the story for this upcoming set called "Lord of the Rings: Tales of Middle-Earth," would you consider doing a video on it as more spoilers are released? There's not a lot of info available at the moment but my friends and I predict it will take place on Vryn and that maybe Nicol Bolas will return as the "Lord of the Rings" but I'd be interested to hear your take. Are we going to see a completely new villain since Phyrexia was defeated? Is "Middle-Earth" a location on Vryn (or another plane perhaps), or does it sort of metaphorically refer to how MtG planes are inspired by real-world cultures but still have a degree of separation that makes them feel fantastical? And will this set in any way relate to the "Warhammer" set that came out a few months ago - they still haven't released ANY story content about that and I'm really confused about the aesthetic. I know New Capenna had magic cars but these Warhammer characters are riding around in tanks and wielding actual guns and such. What plane does this take place on and why have none of the planeswalkers ever mentioned it?
I hope you address these questions in the future. Thanks for another great video!
I believe Lord of the Rings will take place in China. The realm "Middle-Earth" is a reference to China's historic identity as the Middle Kingdom. And the Rings are obviously the Ten Rings from Chinese history, as recently seen in the movie Shang-Chi and the Ten Rings. This implies the Lord of the Rings will be the Mandarin.
if starwars battlefront 2 (2005) has taught me anything, a y-wing is actually much better at eliminating key points on a space station than an x-wing
The Rebels knew the Y-Wings were better; that's why they were the first wave of attack. The X-Wings were supposed to fly cover, but after all the Y's were destroyed, Red Squadron had to make the trench run.
In my "what if..." scenario though, I'm saying if Luke was part of that first group of Y-Wings, would he have been shot down like the rest of them? Or would he have destroyed the Death Star sooner, and saved more Rebel pilots (like Biggs?)
Where's a good place to get the books on Magic I want to start from the beginning
I wish you luck on that, the lack of care throughout the lore and story is reflected on the lack of availability to view them
The internet.
Ryan desburrando a la audiencia! Maestro!!!
"What is the magic story?"
A mess
How did you find out that bald plus mustache was a good look for you? Because it is; it does look good. I just dont know how one arrives there. Its pretty bold.
I started losing my hair around age 30, and saw a lot of my peers adopting "bald but with a full beard" and I decided to try something a little different. Once a year or so I grow out the rest of the beard (mostly out of laziness) but this has become my iconic look and I always find my way back to it.
Good job, Mustache Man! :)
I'm sorry but you cannot convince me that you and Bruse Tarl are the same person. I have never seen the two of you in the same room at the same time. Coincidence?!
Dude. You've got an English degree and your viewers aren't stupid. Why not just explain a three act structure? Maybe it's my experience with D&D, but I'm pretty used to distinguishing between the playing pieces and the plays themselves. That's probably why I like reading the campaign setting books so much more than anything else. I prefer lore to story (though a part of that might have something to do with...let's call them questionably wise decisions being made with the plot from time to time).
There are even some good examples out there in popular culture to draw from. J.J. Abrams and his loosely associated crew are very good at building a universe and filling it with lore, but the stories they tell with it often don't turn out in a satisfactory fashion. That is, after all, what the stupid Mystery Box is all about. Of course, in so doing they set themselves up for failure, because OF COURSE I like my story better than what you just barfed on me, because mine doesn't involve a smoke fist beating one of the most interesting characters to death. You dummies. You big, stupid, dumb dummies. Mr. Eko deserved better.
But I digress. The Abrams diaspora - and it might be good to focus on Lindelof in particular here - all have this particular quirk of talent to one extent or another. Damon is always going to give good lore. Lost is one of the single best shows in the history of television for sparking the imagination of the viewers and giving them a way to feel like they're participating in the storytelling (if only in their imagination). In practice, though, sometimes you get The Leftovers (easily top 10 shows ever developed, back to front, and I will fight you and I will win if you want to argue about that) and sometimes you get Lost (I actually don't hate the ending, because I think it's really the only one that particular story could have had, but I do wish that somebody would pick up and revive the lore and do more with the universe, because a guy named Christian Shepherd carefully guiding a bunch of people - some of whom had little affection for one another - into the shining white life of some sort of after-afterlife doesn't feel like it pays off the promise of an island full of magic light with a frozen donkey wheel that teleports it around the world). They give good lore.
On the other hand, you've got somebody like Vince Gilligan. Vince could not possibly give any fraction less of a crap about the lore of his universes. How did Tuco rise to power? I don't know - shut up, nerd, his job is to get Walter into the life). Vince Gilligan tells stories. He has a masterful grasp of character, and when he is called upon to draw from the lore of his creations...well, I only know of the one case and I found the first season of Saul to be a little bit shaky before he just made a fart sound with his mouth and decided these were the thing he was interested in.
This is a rich topic, man. Let's get educational about this. Where has story violated lore? Has that been good or bad? How much of a story does Magic even have? Who are the protagonists? If UA-cam weren't currently philosophically opposed to having channels with more than one show, I'd say that was a perfect show to fit on this channel.
I fell in love with the game because the story was more fleshed out in the cards.
It all feels so rushed now :(
Animated Netflix show 👀
I see you Ryan😂
I for one miss the novels, reading the story on a screen just doesn't immerse me like the books did.
I LOVE THIS!
I love the stach
At the risk of overciting fromsoftware, souls games work as a lore focused story
It's rare that something that happens in the present has a big effect in your story, you're mostly a detective or a Watson stumbling through a binch of clues that happened aeons ago with no connective tissue to make them narratives
The personal story of your character usually involves just killing 4 bosses then killing The Boss, it's barely there compared to what happened before
(I'd say magic is failing in this too lol)
I need Davriel to be in the story again please
Ok I'll make some calls
I will pay X to combine the last X mustache minutes into one larger video. Then tap out. Then concede.
WOTC should hire you to handle MTG story - your 14 min video have more thought put into it than entire story since Origins.
differentiating between multiverse lore and the story of a single plane block is what irks me the most in magic storytelling, like uhh ok so planeswalkers are gods, oh but wait no not anymore, and then oh hey now its time to explain this one place for 10 min to build up to what the nerfed walkers do, etc etc
Love your content but never got into the lore even after 27 years of playing with some breaks. I've heard the lore in the background and people discussing it at shops so I have some knowledge but none the characters of the multiverse are compelling. Magic is the greatest game on Earth imo but it has nothing to do with knowing who Garruk or Nicol Bolas are. There is nothing about Lilianna, Mishra, or any character that are special to the average player. You could put any green card in place of Nissa and no one I know would care. For me, this game is all about casting awesome spells, attacking with crazy creatures, and having fun. The names and backstories have no bearing on enjoyment. In fact, if someone brings up lore during a game, it's distracting and time consuming. Just play.... I have heard about some who don't play and only read the lore. That is insane to me lol
Do I hear a bit of hostile "wink, wink, nudge, nudge" on that Netflix comment?
Heads Up,
There's a Nintendo DS Game called "Marvel Trading Card Game" that uses the Versus System (I would know, I own a copy). I'm sure there's an emulator online or you could record the DS screen somehow to take screen-grabs of the cards.
I also own a copy of that game, but unfortunately the Reservist mechanic came about in the Avengers expansion which was well after the game was made, and since it never got DLC or anything for the newer cards, I still wouldn't be able to find examples of the ones I'm describing in the video.
Ah, well I guess it has been a while since I played, but even so, the images you linked to are way too small / low resolution to use on screen in my own videos. Thanks anyway, though!
@@MagicArcanum Oh well, I totally understand. Gotta maintain that crispy channel quality.
Priest of Forgotten Gods has nothing to do with Ilharg or the Eternalized Gods. It is a call back to the Cult of Yore who worship beings like the Nephilim.
I'm sure you know that but your video does imply the opposite.
I know it has nothing to do with the Eternalized Gods, but it still informed my prediction (which wasn't necessarily for the eternalized gods.) I figured we'd see Ilharg, and maybe other ancient gods of Ravnica rise up to fight against Nicol Bolas. That was still a bold prediction, because god-typed creatures hadn't yet appeared in any set taking place on that plane.
I don't think using Priest here implied she's what led me to predict God Eternals specifically. It was more of a general "something big is coming" feeling, which ended up being right.
Of course Thalia won't die, they NEED to reprint her card....,......
PRIMO!
I keep trying to get into the story but the quality of the writing on the short stories just isn't very good.
Too bad the writers now are completely unaware of the history of worlds they're writing about. Note that hazoret has two arms again in MOM. Kinda doubt it just grew back. More like the artist had no clue she had lost previously.
I think its more that:
A) they dont have enough time to explain such things and dont give enough resources to communicate them
B) with so much going on I dont wnst to thing about the logistical noghtmare of synchronizing all these artits
Mistakes are bound to happen and I dont think its the artists‘ fault
It was replaced with a Lazotep arm.
Take a look at Hazoret in both the multiverse legend version and the normal card art. The other arm is blue, showing it's rebuilt with lazotep
If you take a close look at the art pieces from MOM with Hazoret in them, her missing arm has been replaced with a lazotep one. Meaning she or the Scarab God had the mummies of Amonkhet fashion her a new arm. So this is one of the examples of the story writers/artists actually following lore instead of ignoring it.
According to the wiki (which I'm not saying has to be right, just as a point of reference), it does say that the arm didn't just grow back, but she made a kind of prosthesis for herself out of lazotep. But even without that, the fact that every plane's gods are different in their... tangibility and nature might mean that we might not know e. g. Amonkhet's gods as well as we thought. For instance, we still don't really know what the three Bolas gods were before they got corrupted.
😮
I thought you were a loremage. But you are actually a storymage?
Well as I say in the video, many people - including myself - are guilty of using the terms interchangeably. Ironically, I got the term from the Magic story, when we met Loremage Elowen of Castle Vantress.
Magic's story used to be worth reading for its depth. Nowadays it's just used to showcase the ineptitude of the current writers.
Strongly disagree. I think the writers are doing the best they can, but they're being asked to juggle a lot of things by the game's designers and other shareholders. Individual stories are quite well written; it's the larger connected narrative that suffers, and that's not the fault of any individual writer.
The story has always been the driving source of appeal for me, but over the last 5 years, imo the writing has been such a let down. It hurts, honestly.
Ryan, do you worry that players “aren’t paying attention” so much as WOTC can’t get it together with story telling? You do a better job explaining the story than the actual brand owner.
I think their methods right now are fine, but probably under-utilized. I have another video covering how I'd expand the Magic IP and introduce more people to the story and just raise general awareness and interest for the game.
Magics Story died with Lukka for me. Every other planeswalker is kinda generic and boring.
Thanks for the star wars episode iv spoiler!!! 😢