This is so true! I have more than 50 games I have started on, but never finished. After a long struggle I finished one game, because I promised to do it. The game got 10K downloads in a week so I have no regrets. Now i need to work on updating the game.
I once read an article that had an awesome diagram explaining how to approach game development. For the life of me I can't seem to find that article anywhere but I wrote it down on paper and it's stuck on the wall right above my screen. It went something like this: 1. Your game isn't finished! 2. Finish the shittiest possible version 3. Do you still want to work on it? (if yes) 4. Make it better 5. Play test 6. Jump back to step 3 (if no) 7. Ship it! This has really made a huge difference in my game development approach. I hope this will help someone else.
This is cool dude! If you find the article shoot it to me. Yeah for sure working in iteration cycles seems to be a much better approach to building anything digital.
lobeznoPurpura maybe. But you have to make a couple of shitty games first to learn from your mistakes and eventually make a better one. Noone makes a perfect game first try.
I dont think you need to worry about that at the beginning. Unless you market your game like crazy and it gets a ton of exposure. Most small games hardly get noticed anyway unless you actually make the effort of getting it out there.
Over 50 folders full of incomplete games! The funny thing is I come back and play them and go, damn that was actually quite fun! I have a Massive Shiny Object Syndrome, I've found the way I overcame it was to just write it down in a book at least that way I can conceptualize everything and get it out my system... by that time... I'm ready to go back to my project!
Thanks for the tip man! Funny story I actually bought a journal just for this purpose. Its filled with game ideas, mechanic illustrations, interesting game concepts I found in random games, etc. I also keep a folder of screenshots from random games that I like or that inspire me, so I can sort of save that inspiration but not act on it and get distracted. Thanks for sharing man!
Not a game developer, but writing software for over 20 years now and I must have hundredths of projects that never got finished. You name it, I've probably built it, 95% of the way that is. Useful and workable to me, but never a polished product.
Dude same. I have more tech startups on my harddrive then the front page of Forbes has. But they are incomplete. Been training myself to get addicted to finishing instead of starting.
Man this helped me very much. I was just at the point to start another project but this video popped out on youtube right before I was going to click Create New Project :)) It was at the right moment. Thank you for all your great videos!
This is the 2nd video I've watched on your channel. The 1st being the intro video on your channel page. I never realized how much I needed a pep talk like this. My main problem is that I will work on something for a long time, feel like I'm going nowhere with it, and take a break. Sometimes I come back to the project, other times I don't. This is really good inspiration to finish what I am working on. How you don't allow yourself to work on the thing you want to work on until the previous thing is done sounds like great advice to actually finish what you start. Likewise with quitting projects. I discovered that one on my own a few years back, but I still don't say "I quit" often enough. But if I can make myself work on one thing at a time and dedicate a set amount of time to work on it, I can actually finish. Thank you. It looks like you have a lot of other good content that will be useful to check out. So I just subscribed. I never realized how much I needed to hear some of this. And sometimes even if you know that you need to finish, hearing someone else put it into perspective really helps.
Hi I'm about to write big comment here, but I really want to share with you my point of view about this because I may have found a motivation to pass over this problem. I'm struggling with this problem since I've started to create stuff, which is when I was 6 or something. I'm getting over it bit per bit now by simply reducing the scope as you said, but it's really hard to reduce the scope, because I always think that there's not enough features in my game to make it interesting and enjoyable for players. So I think like this : What do I want? Making games and create new universes. Why? Because I love to see my ideas taking life. When? Everytime, because of the shiny syndrome. For Who? (very important) FOR THE PLAYERS! Not for me! The games are for the players, and what want the players? To play games. So as long as you give the player something to play, it's enough, they won't see what you think is ''missing'' in your game, they'll appreciate it, buy it, share it, and that's freaking awesome! And trust me, this sensation is way better than finding a new shiny object. Try with a little project, share it and you'll be surprised how people actually really enjoy what you've done, and how you actually love that! You'll be more addicted to that than finding new shiny objects. Keep in mind that games are for the players, you won't actually play your own game like players do, isn't it? So give them games, don't stop having the syndrome, but cut your ideas in chunks that can be games themselves, create them, share them, so you can enjoy both your new shiny object found and the pleasure to see people play what you've made.
Hey man, thank you for being so real. Seeing fellow game devs (even with much more experience than I am) struggling with similar problems really helps out. Thank you for your videos
Everytime when i start a new project, i work on that proj hard everyday, and the funny thing about me is: at a point when i am left with a week or two of work... i mean the proj is good as done just a week of work left i start becoming extremely lazy and worse i loose motivation... i kno a lot of people might think maybe its becoz the proj didnt turn out to be what i expected NO. infact its better than what i expected, but i just loose the desire to complete them. But after watching this video, for the next few weeks i will be completing all of the projects i have ever started... Only those which matters most though... COMMIT, COMMIT COMMIT... Thanks mate.
I deal with this problem with something that I call "creative trash folder" whatever I come with an idea that don't work/add to existing project or idea about new project while working on something, I write it down and put it to the folder. That let's me kinda forget it, but also later I can use it in future for inspiration.
I do that too. If I don't write an idea down and get it out of my head, it'll keep rattling around in there making me want to drop what I'm doing and work on it. So I give myself a little time to write/draw whatever I've thought of so I can put it aside and get back to the main project.
Hey man, I just really want to thank you for this video. The casual language, the simple explanation, the examples and context behind it, it was really helpful. I've overwhelmed myself with projects ranging from creating songs to creating books to creating videos but as of now, I'm really going to put down all the shiny objects and commit to one. I never even thought about what my project attention span was before this video.
Yeah, I used to have this and would dream of making different kinds of games, now I counter it by writing the scope, project plans, and ideas in a word document. Oddly, it makes it much more manageable and plausible when going to design it.
Great advise. I suffer from this a lot - especially when learning a new engine. I switched to Unreal about 6 months ago, and probably have 6 game ideas started. A lot of it is useful, learning shaders and logic stuff, trying to piece it all together. Now I've got a main project in unreal and making good progress. Sometimes I think you have to get an idea off your chest or you'll dwell on it... if you have an idea for some new tech that you keep coming back to and it doesn't fit your current project. We all probably have more game ideas than we can ever complete, new ideas creep in all the time - these days I just give into them and do the experiments etc - its good as long as you can get back to the main project afterwards. I think the best ideas come quickly but need to brew - like spend 1 day on whatever is keeping you awake, then put it aside - the chances are the best ideas will develop and form the next project. I've started 6 projects in 6 months - but learned so much along the way that it greatly reinforces the chances of my main project being completed. I am limiting myself to 2 projects at a time - 1 project in Unreal for VR, and one project for various platforms in AGK (App Game Kit)... the Unreal project is quite intense and the AGK project is very relaxed. After a long day of game development, I like to relax by developing a game :). I'd say I complete about 1/3rd of my projects, which is really quite prolific I think! - one sure fire way to help a project to completion is to enter a competition... half my completed projects were for compo's, and they really help you address a strict deadline - something that indie projects often lack I think... indies can't keep taking 3 years to write a game - technology changes too quickly for that.
Yeah the strict deadlines of game jams are very helpful because they force you to publish. Most developers are perfectionists and will take forever trying to make something perfect.
I have this problem and I feel like I would be so much more successful if I got over it. I am a creative person to be honest and I could do good with so many projects and stuff, learning to code games, drawing, painting, making stories but then I just stop and completely ignore the idea. :/
Really great video! You are very poised, human and real, so it is easy to listen to and take your advice. Thanks for taking the time to share and upload this. Needed this right now for a complex project I'm working on.
I'm not a programmer or game Dev, but I am a concept creating amateur. Small things like purely conceptual add-ons for my personal favorite games (did an overhaul-concept for Hogs of War, not long ago) get finished, but my own concept for a game is on hold now for roughly 5 months. Sure, the scope of that concept is quite massive (RPG, Skill-system, Moveset, Storyboard, characterization, world building, timeline, damage calculation, buffs/debuffs, UI etc...) but still it is a good thing. I stopped it a around 120 or so pages with the Skill-system 80% complete and the story still stuck at the start of chapter 2 of (weird enough, I have a rough image of it in my head already). Everything else was complete. The problem is I think, that I just can't motivate myself to go on with the project, because I know I will never be able to publish it myself. One person can't program such a massive game on his/her own and all game studios in my country are more or less specialized in other genres. Sure, I may be able to sell it to someone, but then nobody would ever know that I did anything for the project, although all mechanics and the story were conceptualized by me.
Very nice advice and tips. The weirdest for me is that i have finished a game years a go, not a sellible product of course, but its playable it has the basic stages of a game, main menu, some levels, a score scene, and a ending, even if its a bit buggy becouse my lack of knowledge at that point years ago. Since then i have been struggling with this issue, over and over new projects and new projects. I think its becouse of both, the shiny object sindrome and the overhuge scope to my actuall capacity. Always that i do lets call it a restart, i reduce the scope but seems like never is enough and in the proces of reducing the scope i got over exited on how its going and that, and i end thinking i could do more but im not and always at some point even after months of working i found a dead end where is impossible for only me to develope the thing. I suppouse i should do the oposite way, start at the most basic shit i could do and the increase the scope anytime i finish something playable.
OMG, I AM AN ARTIST, BUT I CAN RELATE TO THIS SO HARD. I went through this exact stuff, SOOOOO HARD in LittleBigPlanet, like I spent hundreds upon hundreds of hours building stuff in that game, on dozens of dozens of levels, and I only ever published TWO. But It is affecting me so badly RN because I constantly start artworks and never get anywhere, especially with my level of perfectionism. thank you so much for even talking a second about it.
I made a decision to start a big game. However, i'm going to sticky only on it's core mechanics. I will reduce amount of content so the "big game" start to be smaller. I'm thinking about joining game jams while i develop the game just to relax and show myself that i can finish something (even tought game jam games aren't a 'complete' game).
I too suffer from this, big time. I also overscope projects easily. One advice I have, which I've done a bit recently: write down your new shiny ideas in detail and keep them for later. When it's written, you're kind of done already, it may not be as shiny anymore, and you can continue on your current project. You can always pick one of those shiny ideas next project.
I've never heard this problem being referred to as the shiny object syndrome but now that I think about it, it makes a lot of sense. I never understood the people who have to have the newest something (like phone or whatever) when they really didn't need it but now I guess that is pretty similar to how I always have to start a new story, whether I'm planning a game or a comic or a novel, I love starting way too much and my plans are ludicrously gigantic. Atm I'm working on a smallish platformer project that I'm fully commited to finishing so that I can actually show it to people!
Hey bro, I've just started making videos. I'm not great at it but I keep doubting myself and jumping onto the next "shiny object" lol... I just wanted to say thanks, I needed this. I think it's really a life skill more than just about one aspect of my life too.
good advice and I started a game yesterday and I'm only giving myself 1 month to complete it. I'm going to give it 2 simple mechanics and the rest of the work is going into production to make it look and sound decent enough. It's probably a guarantee I'll go over it but not by much the 1 month mark will tell me when I need to stop adding features and just complete the game. I just want to actually make a game, lol!
I keep starting FPS games but then I get an idea about a Battle Royale game and then I move on to that instead. I then decided to create a FPS with a Battle Royale mode. Then if I want to keep switching from FPS to Battle Royale, I'll still be making progress on one game because they are both in one game
I torn. I think I do have shiny object syndrome but I'm justifying it by saying "I need to get an artist for the assets. In the mean time, I'll work on xxx". I literally have no talent for art, and rather than try to learn, I'd prefer to focus on what I do know how to do. That would be coming up with interesting ideas and coding an engine in Game Maker and find someone to either partner with for art or possible commission the work (if I truly believe the game will earn back what I've spent).
We all come up with all kinds of excuses to keep starting. But you have to stop yourself. You can also use your constraints to your advantage. Why not try making a game with basic shapes?
Whats up with the timer on philophobia's website? Like a month ago it said it will be launched in few days. I really anticipated, and then boom it 365 days again.
When you are just learning would you suggest doing a whole project to learn all the concepts like tools ,coding, physics, collision etc.. or make small things just do collision or just do some collision thing you want to learn ?
This is actually not that bad, as long as you start with new concepts and make them good - finishing the game doesn't matter. You can take all what you've created (and haven't finished) and learned and put it in a new project you finish and create a really good game. It's how I learn, it's how I've been making games and started out. Although yes, it can be really bad sometimes. Good video though.
Hey dude, appreciate it! My thoughts are finishing the project doesnt matter from the perspective of learning. I agree. But from the perspective of life...I think starting things and not finishing them is a bad habit that hinders your progress.
I hate when labels are put unto things lol i was so happy not knowing that my zombie projects are called zombie projects. I still come back to them! but it takes me a while to cycle back through all my unfinished things, but I get through them while compiling a new list of shiny objects. The ideas never stop and I want it all at once.
this made me think about my skills as a game developer, im going to be completely honest here regardless of the embarrassment, i wanted to make games when i was 9, i started out wanting to Play test games and be lazy like that, but then i realized why tell other people what i think they should add to a game when i can make a game myself and customize every aspect of the game myself. so i told my mom i wanted to make games and she went online to search and she found Khan Academy from that time i was so excited to start learning how to make a game, so i started learning HTML/CSS on KA, i learned a little bit of SQL and i started on Javascript because it was too hard for me learn, even python confused me when i was using Code academy. when i was 13 i joined Scratch (the code block dev site) and i make games there because its easy for me to understand, and i try to learn a coding language and it just confuses me i cant do it, but i know if i stay ONLY on scratch im not going to get anywhere in the game development area of life. im 15 now and still dont know anything useful for programming on anything other than scratch or a Website. i feel useless i dont know where to start, what language to learn for making games, and when i do make a game on scratch i overhype it so much and i find that at the end of production i dont get many people to look at it. i just want to know where to start, how to start, and what i have to do. Thanks guys, BTW i love your videos...
Well, it is very important to keep motivation. You have a full life ahead of you, so start by finding out which part of game development you like. If it is the logic/programming, just make small not-good-looking games that rely on that. If you like art, just start creating concepts. If you like story writing, just start writing in a notebook. But if you like to 'add' to games that are already out there: watch out. You just experienced that it is hard to even start building games, let alone finish a game and above all finish a good looking game. Just stop allowing yourself taking things for granted and learn to accept that a lot of things in live have a dear cost to them. And then start with a small game that i just for you, that you love making and love improving. Start with gamemaker or Unity, and do 2D games with art or scripts that you get for free from the interwebs. Give it time. You learn with each project. And when you have like 3 years (and a few finished projects) in it you have a bit of experience and are above the matter you can start taking on bigger things.
If your goal is making games, an engine like Unity is good to learn. You'll need to learn how to find tutorials though, such as YT videos or StackOverflow posts.
Hype of new project, like anything else have expiration date. clock is ticking from a wery start, that’s the unwritten rule i can say of life. So, mastering to hold actual project under the spotlight of “shinny object” Along with execution has to be primary goal.
All the time, I've published one app though. It was my first game and idea I made and after that I seem to be creating projects now and then stopping and creating a new concept...it is a struggle haha. It seems once you get to the heavy part of the project you slow down and lose that urge to keep going? Thats my opinion
[OFF TOPIC] Hey Tim, I need advice. So I've been training myself in Android Studio lately because i want to go into mobile development. It's going alright and slowly but surely I'm learning to make decent apps for android. But I want to make mobile games as well, not just applications. However, I don't really know which software to use. I've looked at Construct 2 because of your livestreams, but I don't know how well it can handle mobile and whether there's better options out there.
I like construct 2 and since it's a 2d engine it's easier for a novice like me to pick up. I'll go 3D when I feel like I got enough experience making games. CS2 is a solid engine I haven't heard of complaints exporting to mobile.
Hey Karel, so if you know Android studio, you can install something like Cordova, which is a wrapper for HTML projects. SO then you can export from construct 2 to html, and then wrap it natively with Android studio and cordova. Also, construct 3 has a direct to APK export option so that may be worth a choice. I like unity but its a little too big and bulky for me.
I most definitely suffer from SOS. Let me explain something that I especially struggle with. I know that my best chance of completing a game is to focus on a simple, single mechanic, mobile type game. The problem is I also think, and have heard from others, that my chances of completing a game are higher if I work on a game that I would actually play myself. I am not interested in simple, single mechanic, mobile type games! It's hard to work on a game that I am not interested in playing. I bore quickly of simple mobile games. I install them, they seem cool for a few minutes, then I am pretty much done with them. It's tough. What I like is always competing with what I know I should work on.
Essa fase inicial de Criar um jogo é muito fácil. Afinal ter idéias é um coisa espontânea, creio que gasta quase nada de energia. Logo depois vem a fase difícil que é produzir o jogo. Parece lógico para mim que o seu cérebro queira se viciar e ficar apenas na primeira fase.
Readed in a book about procrastination associated with perfectionnisme.(about pple of cours) for watever reason you think your gonne be somewhere ,or finish somthing in a certain time , make sur you allways dubble the time you was first thinking about, its gonne relax you from stress (some pple can only work or do things with stress on) but your gonne be on time to ;) thx for you vids
thx for vid and yeah a lot of info in web who make a shiny galaxy of object for me when i have something shiny i keep focus on it allways but newbie in biz (only 6 months) let see what happend further see ya
For new developers: If you dropped one project - it's not a problem! But if you have 5-10 unfinished, "I'm still working on them" games - you are not honest with yourself! I think, you can have 2, maximum 3 "in progress" projects. If you have more than 3 - mark one of them "dead"!
The scope getting out of hand is particularly bad for loners, you have no brainstorming sessions to tell you if some of your ideas are crazy and one is probably going to be the worst Yes-man/woman one can have.
Watching Tim's video really brought the idea of limiting scope home. My first few games are going to be small ones and I'll keep making small games till I get a solid understanding of game development.
Rick Rouse I've had interactive fiction game ideas blown out of all logical proportion to the point that they had become open world RPGs, only then do you realize that it's either going to take an absurd amount of time or the result will be mediocre.
You are correct man! Its really easy as a solo dev to get an idea at 1am and spend the next few hours creating it when you have no plan or concept of how it affects everything else. Its something you have to work on and really hone your skill in.
Just say fuck it when it goes to pretty polish jobs, reduce gameplay until a handicapped can play the game, find your strongest spots and build around them. Participate in game jams that are limiting you both in time and else. Commit...to not a suicide!
An interesting story, that about "shiny object syndrome". I, personally, think some people are "blessed with suck/cursed with awesome" by having a fertile imagination that generates a lot of kinda fun ideas... That take too much effort to be effectively realized, at least by one person. A fruitful fantasy is a bit of liability here: you imagine stuff to be much cooler AND much easier done than actually. So when you get to actually "making stuff", you can quite easily get tired or bored - or scared by amount of work of what you have no idea HOW to approach, and hide that by "tired or bored", too! And it can, yes, get to be quite a pattern. I, for one, tried much more story/poems/fanfiction writing than gamedev - and I can attest that, yes, "limiting your scope" works very well for some time, because you can write a good enough stuff on the energy of pure enthusiasm. But if it takes a bit longer, some kind of pessimism/learned helplessness/"common sense" kicks in: like, "who needs this stuff anyway? why should I waste my precious little energy to create something that no one, ever, will need or want or like or even simply KNOW?". Absence of hope for the future of stuff that you make limits the scope to small projects. In the game developement I never actually got to finish anything =(, because it is sometimes enough to just make reality the "most tasty 5%" of an idea, and it is enough for YOU - and, as for others, "no one will ever care anyway", so "the more bland 95%" get tossed away. Also, there are already lot of people who are more energetic, crafty, resourcefull, who go out and do stuff, and I'll never have a chance to out-compete them anyway. So I, personally, do not have enough "pure enthusiasm energy" (yet!) to complete a gaming project, even one small by scope. As for "simply commit", it seems to me a bit of a strange advice - it's, like, just restating the problem again. After all, unability to commit is the problem ITSELF, no? So, if anything, commiting is not simple - at least for me. Although, just yesterday, I've came up with an idea of "sacrificing" new ideas for old projects. Like, when you have a new shiny idea, telling itself - "hey pal, remember the GREAT idea you had time ago, and made into some kind of project? It was not less worthy of being made than your new shiny idea. So, maybe you go CONTINUING your old idea instead of new one? At least as long as you DO have an old idea to be completed?" It's like some "if-then structure": if you have an old idea still uncompleted, then there is no sense starting a new one which will share the same sad fate. Well, at least as the old idea still IS one you WANT to complete! If that's not the case anymore - well, putting the zombies to rest is the way to go, yeah. Not being afraid to bury the zombies, btw, might deserve a mighty separate "advice #3", by the way: the way the human psyche works, we have a kind of "energy economy" in our heads, and even all-but-formally buried, but still formally not buried zombies might leech some energy off of us. Also, I wanted to point out that even zombie-killed projects, unfinished ones, should receive proper burial gratitude by us; after all, they almost always teach us, give us experience, even if a tiny one, of better knowing how to work with our tools, of this feeling that "actually making stuff IS possible!". Although, yeah, it's kinda a shocking truth that "Yeah, it is possible to make stuff, but it's hard and you're often apathethic and a bit lazy for that." =(
I can't believe that every single animation I start, I do it happily and in the end I fucking hate it and delete everything, and repeat everything, And I never get better because I don't even finish the 25% Of it! I hate my mind so much! I just wish I for ONCE Get to finish my stuff, see it, and don't want to punch myself in the face...
It's crazy how much success comes down to just committing rather than having the skills.
I know right!? Work = progress.
This is so true! I have more than 50 games I have started on, but never finished. After a long struggle I finished one game, because I promised to do it. The game got 10K downloads in a week so I have no regrets. Now i need to work on updating the game.
Joonas Miettinen holy crap that’s amazing what’s is your game I want to see
I once read an article that had an awesome diagram explaining how to approach game development. For the life of me I can't seem to find that article anywhere but I wrote it down on paper and it's stuck on the wall right above my screen. It went something like this:
1. Your game isn't finished!
2. Finish the shittiest possible version
3. Do you still want to work on it?
(if yes)
4. Make it better
5. Play test
6. Jump back to step 3
(if no)
7. Ship it!
This has really made a huge difference in my game development approach.
I hope this will help someone else.
This is cool dude! If you find the article shoot it to me. Yeah for sure working in iteration cycles seems to be a much better approach to building anything digital.
I found it. www.gamasutra.com/blogs/RosstinMurphy/20150224/237145/FINISH_YOUR_GAME.php
Sweet dude! Thanks!
lobeznoPurpura maybe. But you have to make a couple of shitty games first to learn from your mistakes and eventually make a better one. Noone makes a perfect game first try.
I dont think you need to worry about that at the beginning. Unless you market your game like crazy and it gets a ton of exposure. Most small games hardly get noticed anyway unless you actually make the effort of getting it out there.
I've had this problem since the 90's
I am going to finish my project. No distractions, full commitment.
Awesome dude! If you want to post in our discord I'm sure plenty of people will help and hold you accountable! Don't get discouraged.
Did you do it?
Interested to know as well!
did u
howd it go?
Over 50 folders full of incomplete games! The funny thing is I come back and play them and go, damn that was actually quite fun! I have a Massive Shiny Object Syndrome, I've found the way I overcame it was to just write it down in a book at least that way I can conceptualize everything and get it out my system... by that time... I'm ready to go back to my project!
Thank you for sharing what you've learnt, I appreciate these videos so much!
Thats a great idea! I will try that one :)
Thanks for the tip man! Funny story I actually bought a journal just for this purpose. Its filled with game ideas, mechanic illustrations, interesting game concepts I found in random games, etc. I also keep a folder of screenshots from random games that I like or that inspire me, so I can sort of save that inspiration but not act on it and get distracted. Thanks for sharing man!
The funny thing is come back and play them and go 😂
My silence is lost 😂
Not a game developer, but writing software for over 20 years now and I must have hundredths of projects that never got finished. You name it, I've probably built it, 95% of the way that is. Useful and workable to me, but never a polished product.
Dude same. I have more tech startups on my harddrive then the front page of Forbes has. But they are incomplete. Been training myself to get addicted to finishing instead of starting.
Man this helped me very much. I was just at the point to start another project but this video popped out on youtube right before I was going to click Create New Project :)) It was at the right moment. Thank you for all your great videos!
This is the 2nd video I've watched on your channel. The 1st being the intro video on your channel page. I never realized how much I needed a pep talk like this. My main problem is that I will work on something for a long time, feel like I'm going nowhere with it, and take a break. Sometimes I come back to the project, other times I don't. This is really good inspiration to finish what I am working on. How you don't allow yourself to work on the thing you want to work on until the previous thing is done sounds like great advice to actually finish what you start. Likewise with quitting projects. I discovered that one on my own a few years back, but I still don't say "I quit" often enough. But if I can make myself work on one thing at a time and dedicate a set amount of time to work on it, I can actually finish. Thank you. It looks like you have a lot of other good content that will be useful to check out. So I just subscribed. I never realized how much I needed to hear some of this. And sometimes even if you know that you need to finish, hearing someone else put it into perspective really helps.
Hi I'm about to write big comment here, but I really want to share with you my point of view about this because I may have found a motivation to pass over this problem.
I'm struggling with this problem since I've started to create stuff, which is when I was 6 or something. I'm getting over it bit per bit now by simply reducing the scope as you said, but it's really hard to reduce the scope, because I always think that there's not enough features in my game to make it interesting and enjoyable for players.
So I think like this :
What do I want? Making games and create new universes.
Why? Because I love to see my ideas taking life.
When? Everytime, because of the shiny syndrome.
For Who? (very important) FOR THE PLAYERS! Not for me!
The games are for the players, and what want the players? To play games. So as long as you give the player something to play, it's enough, they won't see what you think is ''missing'' in your game, they'll appreciate it, buy it, share it, and that's freaking awesome! And trust me, this sensation is way better than finding a new shiny object. Try with a little project, share it and you'll be surprised how people actually really enjoy what you've done, and how you actually love that! You'll be more addicted to that than finding new shiny objects.
Keep in mind that games are for the players, you won't actually play your own game like players do, isn't it? So give them games, don't stop having the syndrome, but cut your ideas in chunks that can be games themselves, create them, share them, so you can enjoy both your new shiny object found and the pleasure to see people play what you've made.
Hey man, thank you for being so real. Seeing fellow game devs (even with much more experience than I am) struggling with similar problems really helps out. Thank you for your videos
Everytime when i start a new project, i work on that proj hard everyday, and the funny thing about me is: at a point when i am left with a week or two of work... i mean the proj is good as done just a week of work left i start becoming extremely lazy and worse i loose motivation... i kno a lot of people might think maybe its becoz the proj didnt turn out to be what i expected NO. infact its better than what i expected, but i just loose the desire to complete them. But after watching this video, for the next few weeks i will be completing all of the projects i have ever started... Only those which matters most though... COMMIT, COMMIT COMMIT... Thanks mate.
I know dem feels dude. I do the same exact thing. Thats why this concept is so important to me, and its why I started finish friday!
Beautiful story that brings laughter.
I deal with this problem with something that I call "creative trash folder" whatever I come with an idea that don't work/add to existing project or idea about new project while working on something, I write it down and put it to the folder. That let's me kinda forget it, but also later I can use it in future for inspiration.
I do that too. If I don't write an idea down and get it out of my head, it'll keep rattling around in there making me want to drop what I'm doing and work on it. So I give myself a little time to write/draw whatever I've thought of so I can put it aside and get back to the main project.
Hey man, I just really want to thank you for this video. The casual language, the simple explanation, the examples and context behind it, it was really helpful. I've overwhelmed myself with projects ranging from creating songs to creating books to creating videos but as of now, I'm really going to put down all the shiny objects and commit to one. I never even thought about what my project attention span was before this video.
Tim, I appreciate all the work you have done on here and the free content you put out on youtube
Yeah, I used to have this and would dream of making different kinds of games, now I counter it by writing the scope, project plans, and ideas in a word document. Oddly, it makes it much more manageable and plausible when going to design it.
Great advise. I suffer from this a lot - especially when learning a new engine. I switched to Unreal about 6 months ago, and probably have 6 game ideas started. A lot of it is useful, learning shaders and logic stuff, trying to piece it all together. Now I've got a main project in unreal and making good progress. Sometimes I think you have to get an idea off your chest or you'll dwell on it... if you have an idea for some new tech that you keep coming back to and it doesn't fit your current project. We all probably have more game ideas than we can ever complete, new ideas creep in all the time - these days I just give into them and do the experiments etc - its good as long as you can get back to the main project afterwards. I think the best ideas come quickly but need to brew - like spend 1 day on whatever is keeping you awake, then put it aside - the chances are the best ideas will develop and form the next project. I've started 6 projects in 6 months - but learned so much along the way that it greatly reinforces the chances of my main project being completed. I am limiting myself to 2 projects at a time - 1 project in Unreal for VR, and one project for various platforms in AGK (App Game Kit)... the Unreal project is quite intense and the AGK project is very relaxed. After a long day of game development, I like to relax by developing a game :). I'd say I complete about 1/3rd of my projects, which is really quite prolific I think! - one sure fire way to help a project to completion is to enter a competition... half my completed projects were for compo's, and they really help you address a strict deadline - something that indie projects often lack I think... indies can't keep taking 3 years to write a game - technology changes too quickly for that.
Yeah the strict deadlines of game jams are very helpful because they force you to publish. Most developers are perfectionists and will take forever trying to make something perfect.
I have this problem and I feel like I would be so much more successful if I got over it. I am a creative person to be honest and I could do good with so many projects and stuff, learning to code games, drawing, painting, making stories but then I just stop and completely ignore the idea. :/
Really great video! You are very poised, human and real, so it is easy to listen to and take your advice. Thanks for taking the time to share and upload this. Needed this right now for a complex project I'm working on.
This is me. Straight up. I was laughing throughout the whole intro at how accurate it was
I'm not a programmer or game Dev, but I am a concept creating amateur. Small things like purely conceptual add-ons for my personal favorite games (did an overhaul-concept for Hogs of War, not long ago) get finished, but my own concept for a game is on hold now for roughly 5 months. Sure, the scope of that concept is quite massive (RPG, Skill-system, Moveset, Storyboard, characterization, world building, timeline, damage calculation, buffs/debuffs, UI etc...) but still it is a good thing. I stopped it a around 120 or so pages with the Skill-system 80% complete and the story still stuck at the start of chapter 2 of (weird enough, I have a rough image of it in my head already). Everything else was complete.
The problem is I think, that I just can't motivate myself to go on with the project, because I know I will never be able to publish it myself. One person can't program such a massive game on his/her own and all game studios in my country are more or less specialized in other genres. Sure, I may be able to sell it to someone, but then nobody would ever know that I did anything for the project, although all mechanics and the story were conceptualized by me.
I’m working on animation and I have like 10 unfinished projects that I forgot about.. It’s so cluttered and it’s annoying..
Hahaha
Same here! 😂
Very nice advice and tips. The weirdest for me is that i have finished a game years a go, not a sellible product of course, but its playable it has the basic stages of a game, main menu, some levels, a score scene, and a ending, even if its a bit buggy becouse my lack of knowledge at that point years ago. Since then i have been struggling with this issue, over and over new projects and new projects. I think its becouse of both, the shiny object sindrome and the overhuge scope to my actuall capacity. Always that i do lets call it a restart, i reduce the scope but seems like never is enough and in the proces of reducing the scope i got over exited on how its going and that, and i end thinking i could do more but im not and always at some point even after months of working i found a dead end where is impossible for only me to develope the thing. I suppouse i should do the oposite way, start at the most basic shit i could do and the increase the scope anytime i finish something playable.
Looks like most developers have this problem, I am here listening as a web developer... Thank you for this content
OMG, I AM AN ARTIST, BUT I CAN RELATE TO THIS SO HARD. I went through this exact stuff, SOOOOO HARD in LittleBigPlanet, like I spent hundreds upon hundreds of hours building stuff in that game, on dozens of dozens of levels, and I only ever published TWO. But It is affecting me so badly RN because I constantly start artworks and never get anywhere, especially with my level of perfectionism. thank you so much for even talking a second about it.
I made a decision to start a big game. However, i'm going to sticky only on it's core mechanics. I will reduce amount of content so the "big game" start to be smaller. I'm thinking about joining game jams while i develop the game just to relax and show myself that i can finish something (even tought game jam games aren't a 'complete' game).
You are my game dev spirit animal
I too suffer from this, big time. I also overscope projects easily. One advice I have, which I've done a bit recently: write down your new shiny ideas in detail and keep them for later. When it's written, you're kind of done already, it may not be as shiny anymore, and you can continue on your current project. You can always pick one of those shiny ideas next project.
Thank you, Tim. Great advice.
I've never heard this problem being referred to as the shiny object syndrome but now that I think about it, it makes a lot of sense. I never understood the people who have to have the newest something (like phone or whatever) when they really didn't need it but now I guess that is pretty similar to how I always have to start a new story, whether I'm planning a game or a comic or a novel, I love starting way too much and my plans are ludicrously gigantic. Atm I'm working on a smallish platformer project that I'm fully commited to finishing so that I can actually show it to people!
Hey bro, I've just started making videos. I'm not great at it but I keep doubting myself and jumping onto the next "shiny object" lol... I just wanted to say thanks, I needed this. I think it's really a life skill more than just about one aspect of my life too.
good advice and I started a game yesterday and I'm only giving myself 1 month to complete it. I'm going to give it 2 simple mechanics and the rest of the work is going into production to make it look and sound decent enough. It's probably a guarantee I'll go over it but not by much the 1 month mark will tell me when I need to stop adding features and just complete the game. I just want to actually make a game, lol!
Good luck man! And congrats! im sure GDU would love to give you some feedback if you join the site.
i get this all the time as someone who wants to be a video content creator. best of luck to those dealing with this.
UA-cam didn't recommended it. I searched for it.
I keep starting FPS games but then I get an idea about a Battle Royale game and then I move on to that instead. I then decided to create a FPS with a Battle Royale mode. Then if I want to keep switching from FPS to Battle Royale, I'll still be making progress on one game because they are both in one game
I torn. I think I do have shiny object syndrome but I'm justifying it by saying "I need to get an artist for the assets. In the mean time, I'll work on xxx". I literally have no talent for art, and rather than try to learn, I'd prefer to focus on what I do know how to do. That would be coming up with interesting ideas and coding an engine in Game Maker and find someone to either partner with for art or possible commission the work (if I truly believe the game will earn back what I've spent).
We all come up with all kinds of excuses to keep starting. But you have to stop yourself. You can also use your constraints to your advantage. Why not try making a game with basic shapes?
Whats up with the timer on philophobia's website? Like a month ago it said it will be launched in few days. I really anticipated, and then boom it 365 days again.
When you are just learning would you suggest doing a whole project to learn all the concepts like tools ,coding, physics, collision etc.. or make small things just do collision or just do some collision thing you want to learn ?
This is actually not that bad, as long as you start with new concepts and make them good - finishing the game doesn't matter. You can take all what you've created (and haven't finished) and learned and put it in a new project you finish and create a really good game. It's how I learn, it's how I've been making games and started out. Although yes, it can be really bad sometimes. Good video though.
Hey dude, appreciate it! My thoughts are finishing the project doesnt matter from the perspective of learning. I agree. But from the perspective of life...I think starting things and not finishing them is a bad habit that hinders your progress.
I hate when labels are put unto things lol i was so happy not knowing that my zombie projects are called zombie projects. I still come back to them! but it takes me a while to cycle back through all my unfinished things, but I get through them while compiling a new list of shiny objects. The ideas never stop and I want it all at once.
this made me think about my skills as a game developer, im going to be completely honest here regardless of the embarrassment, i wanted to make games when i was 9, i started out wanting to Play test games and be lazy like that, but then i realized why tell other people what i think they should add to a game when i can make a game myself and customize every aspect of the game myself. so i told my mom i wanted to make games and she went online to search and she found Khan Academy from that time i was so excited to start learning how to make a game, so i started learning HTML/CSS on KA, i learned a little bit of SQL and i started on Javascript because it was too hard for me learn, even python confused me when i was using Code academy. when i was 13 i joined Scratch (the code block dev site) and i make games there because its easy for me to understand, and i try to learn a coding language and it just confuses me i cant do it, but i know if i stay ONLY on scratch im not going to get anywhere in the game development area of life. im 15 now and still dont know anything useful for programming on anything other than scratch or a Website. i feel useless i dont know where to start, what language to learn for making games, and when i do make a game on scratch i overhype it so much and i find that at the end of production i dont get many people to look at it. i just want to know where to start, how to start, and what i have to do. Thanks guys, BTW i love your videos...
Well, it is very important to keep motivation. You have a full life ahead of you, so start by finding out which part of game development you like.
If it is the logic/programming, just make small not-good-looking games that rely on that. If you like art, just start creating concepts. If you like story writing, just start writing in a notebook.
But if you like to 'add' to games that are already out there: watch out. You just experienced that it is hard to even start building games, let alone finish a game and above all finish a good looking game.
Just stop allowing yourself taking things for granted and learn to accept that a lot of things in live have a dear cost to them.
And then start with a small game that i just for you, that you love making and love improving. Start with gamemaker or Unity, and do 2D games with art or scripts that you get for free from the interwebs.
Give it time.
You learn with each project. And when you have like 3 years (and a few finished projects) in it you have a bit of experience and are above the matter you can start taking on bigger things.
If your goal is making games, an engine like Unity is good to learn. You'll need to learn how to find tutorials though, such as YT videos or StackOverflow posts.
I do it all the time
So do I! We need to start a support group.
that was good bro. Thank you!
Hype of new project, like anything else have expiration date. clock is ticking from a wery start, that’s the unwritten rule i can say of life.
So, mastering to hold actual project under the spotlight of “shinny object” Along with execution has to be primary goal.
All the time, I've published one app though. It was my first game and idea I made and after that I seem to be creating projects now and then stopping and creating a new concept...it is a struggle haha. It seems once you get to the heavy part of the project you slow down and lose that urge to keep going? Thats my opinion
The last 10% is really the last 90% for sure!
[OFF TOPIC] Hey Tim, I need advice. So I've been training myself in Android Studio lately because i want to go into mobile development. It's going alright and slowly but surely I'm learning to make decent apps for android. But I want to make mobile games as well, not just applications. However, I don't really know which software to use. I've looked at Construct 2 because of your livestreams, but I don't know how well it can handle mobile and whether there's better options out there.
I like construct 2 and since it's a 2d engine it's easier for a novice like me to pick up. I'll go 3D when I feel like I got enough experience making games. CS2 is a solid engine I haven't heard of complaints exporting to mobile.
I know about this one. Not good.
Hey Karel, so if you know Android studio, you can install something like Cordova, which is a wrapper for HTML projects. SO then you can export from construct 2 to html, and then wrap it natively with Android studio and cordova.
Also, construct 3 has a direct to APK export option so that may be worth a choice.
I like unity but its a little too big and bulky for me.
Great video!
Thanks!
I most definitely suffer from SOS. Let me explain something that I especially struggle with. I know that my best chance of completing a game is to focus on a simple, single mechanic, mobile type game. The problem is I also think, and have heard from others, that my chances of completing a game are higher if I work on a game that I would actually play myself. I am not interested in simple, single mechanic, mobile type games! It's hard to work on a game that I am not interested in playing. I bore quickly of simple mobile games. I install them, they seem cool for a few minutes, then I am pretty much done with them. It's tough. What I like is always competing with what I know I should work on.
thanks for the video!
But how do you decide which project is worth actually finishing verses working on another project that could be better?
I have a video on knowing when to quit. Search my channel!
Essa fase inicial de Criar um jogo é muito fácil. Afinal ter idéias é um coisa espontânea, creio que gasta quase nada de energia. Logo depois vem a fase difícil que é produzir o jogo.
Parece lógico para mim que o seu cérebro queira se viciar e ficar apenas na primeira fase.
Readed in a book about procrastination associated with perfectionnisme.(about pple of cours)
for watever reason you think your gonne be somewhere ,or finish somthing in a certain time , make sur you allways dubble the time you was first thinking about, its gonne relax you from stress (some pple can only work or do things with stress on) but your gonne be on time to ;)
thx for you vids
Thanks for the comment!
thanks dude, good vid
I couldn’t even finish this video
thx for vid
and yeah a lot of info in web who make a shiny galaxy of object
for me when i have something shiny i keep focus on it allways
but newbie in biz (only 6 months)
let see what happend further see ya
God I have enough pixel art to make Super Mario World 3 times scattered over different abandoned projects folders
Thank you very much!
Now I'll have to commit to my projects
Ik this is super old but thank my friend I needed to hear this -
There are 24 projects that are about 5% finished in my pc...
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh you sound like me. Ive been on a mission lately to go through every single folder and either finish it or quit it.
I have this syndrome too and I HATE it. I really need to fix my habits so I can release something. Perhaps one of my games, Asteroids Beyond. :)
My problem is I work one 4 project at the same time ...
Man, you just described me in the intro
I have this syndrome it kills me in me on all my life perspectives
0:08 Yes I do!
Gracias amigo.
This is how I beat shiny object syndrome...
I turned of the lights.
kewl stuff.
I do this oftenly
For new developers:
If you dropped one project - it's not a problem! But if you have 5-10 unfinished, "I'm still working on them" games - you are not honest with yourself! I think, you can have 2, maximum 3 "in progress" projects. If you have more than 3 - mark one of them "dead"!
The scope getting out of hand is particularly bad for loners, you have no brainstorming sessions to tell you if some of your ideas are crazy and one is probably going to be the worst Yes-man/woman one can have.
Watching Tim's video really brought the idea of limiting scope home. My first few games are going to be small ones and I'll keep making small games till I get a solid understanding of game development.
Rick Rouse I've had interactive fiction game ideas blown out of all logical proportion to the point that they had become open world RPGs, only then do you realize that it's either going to take an absurd amount of time or the result will be mediocre.
You are correct man! Its really easy as a solo dev to get an idea at 1am and spend the next few hours creating it when you have no plan or concept of how it affects everything else. Its something you have to work on and really hone your skill in.
youtube knows
Thanks for the advice my friend. I'll come later to finish watching the vid...
I didn't finish watching this
Just say fuck it when it goes to pretty polish jobs, reduce gameplay until a handicapped can play the game, find your strongest spots and build around them. Participate in game jams that are limiting you both in time and else. Commit...to not a suicide!
An interesting story, that about "shiny object syndrome".
I, personally, think some people are "blessed with suck/cursed with awesome" by having a fertile imagination that generates a lot of kinda fun ideas... That take too much effort to be effectively realized, at least by one person.
A fruitful fantasy is a bit of liability here: you imagine stuff to be much cooler AND much easier done than actually.
So when you get to actually "making stuff", you can quite easily get tired or bored - or scared by amount of work of what you have no idea HOW to approach, and hide that by "tired or bored", too!
And it can, yes, get to be quite a pattern. I, for one, tried much more story/poems/fanfiction writing than gamedev - and I can attest that, yes, "limiting your scope" works very well for some time, because you can write a good enough stuff on the energy of pure enthusiasm.
But if it takes a bit longer, some kind of pessimism/learned helplessness/"common sense" kicks in: like, "who needs this stuff anyway? why should I waste my precious little energy to create something that no one, ever, will need or want or like or even simply KNOW?". Absence of hope for the future of stuff that you make limits the scope to small projects.
In the game developement I never actually got to finish anything =(, because it is sometimes enough to just make reality the "most tasty 5%" of an idea, and it is enough for YOU - and, as for others, "no one will ever care anyway", so "the more bland 95%" get tossed away. Also, there are already lot of people who are more energetic, crafty, resourcefull, who go out and do stuff, and I'll never have a chance to out-compete them anyway. So I, personally, do not have enough "pure enthusiasm energy" (yet!) to complete a gaming project, even one small by scope.
As for "simply commit", it seems to me a bit of a strange advice - it's, like, just restating the problem again. After all, unability to commit is the problem ITSELF, no? So, if anything, commiting is not simple - at least for me.
Although, just yesterday, I've came up with an idea of "sacrificing" new ideas for old projects. Like, when you have a new shiny idea, telling itself - "hey pal, remember the GREAT idea you had time ago, and made into some kind of project? It was not less worthy of being made than your new shiny idea. So, maybe you go CONTINUING your old idea instead of new one? At least as long as you DO have an old idea to be completed?" It's like some "if-then structure": if you have an old idea still uncompleted, then there is no sense starting a new one which will share the same sad fate.
Well, at least as the old idea still IS one you WANT to complete! If that's not the case anymore - well, putting the zombies to rest is the way to go, yeah.
Not being afraid to bury the zombies, btw, might deserve a mighty separate "advice #3", by the way: the way the human psyche works, we have a kind of "energy economy" in our heads, and even all-but-formally buried, but still formally not buried zombies might leech some energy off of us.
Also, I wanted to point out that even zombie-killed projects, unfinished ones, should receive proper burial gratitude by us; after all, they almost always teach us, give us experience, even if a tiny one, of better knowing how to work with our tools, of this feeling that "actually making stuff IS possible!". Although, yeah, it's kinda a shocking truth that "Yeah, it is possible to make stuff, but it's hard and you're often apathethic and a bit lazy for that." =(
That describes half my life to a T.
0 dislikes. For once, people make the right decisions.
Lol theres always one dude. He doesnt bother me. At least he tells me what he thinks.
I can't believe that every single animation I start, I do it happily and in the end I fucking hate it and delete everything, and repeat everything, And I never get better because I don't even finish the 25% Of it! I hate my mind so much! I just wish I for ONCE Get to finish my stuff, see it, and don't want to punch myself in the face...
NOOO........ yes...
pls change this horrible intro music
I couldn’t even finish this video
OMG! :)))