"But they are, you know that, right?" "I'm not a person who talks to a lot people" "Sorry, could you repeat that?" ^ the video in 3 lines. saved you all 50 minutes. you're welcome.
Yes the black community respects people of great talent who are successful because of their artistic talent. This is similar to selling drugs apparently.
yeah. his pov is so cynical and downtrodden. he thinks very little of the black community, which despite what he says..I'm guessing is not a monolithic hive mind.
@Dylan James I might be one of the very few people who will give a little credence to this argument, just because I understand it from personal experience. I see what you're trying to say, that if someone is in a bad situation in life, they need to work their ass off in order to succeed. However, it's entirely unfair to look at this group who has been historically put down, is continuing to suffer from these injustices and say "if *all* of them just work harder, they'll get better." That is completely ridiculous, the idea that people should only be able to live a good life if they work extremely hard (and when I say extremely hard, I mean the average black guy having to put in 2-3 times the work the average white guy does just to live a good life) is stupid. The idea that "only you can bring yourself up" is semi-true, but you can't just say "if x people aren't willing to work 20x as hard to make a decent living, then they deserve their suffering" because that's incredibly cruel. This isn't even a feels over reals thing either, this is just me having morals and ethics and not wanting people to suffer just because they are less fortunate than me and have to put in way more work than me to even the scales, whilst you're out here suggesting if they aren't willing to put in the work, they deserve poverty and death. Do you see why a lot of republicans/conservatives/idiots tend to stick with denying systemic racism exists rather than suggesting black people should just overcome it (and yes, denying systemic racism exists is still really stupid, just a little less stupid than implying that people suffering should just overcome their challenges)?
lol @ 24:00 - Black suburban guy here, can confirm. I feel the temptations of the hustle everyday. Even now, as I work on my data structures homework, I'm just itchin' to sell a rock or two. TL NOTE: "Rock" refers to "Crack Rock", a type of illicit substance popular within poor black neighborhoods or 'hoods'.
Gangsta 101: You sling them rocks to get stacks. Them stacks give ya sway. Yo sway make that booty jiggle. ( first you get the money, then you get the power, then you get the women)
His argument is pretty much, "In a 100 meter dash, if you get kneecapped right before the race starts, then it's your fault if you don't win the race. Bootstraps." The hell man.😑
More like "it's your choice if you don't finish the race". Which it is. Now this doesn't say anything about the fairness of the situation, but technically it's still a choice. On this precise point he is not incorrect.
Theodolphe in the context of life, what does “finishing the race” symbolize? Life isn’t about the finish, it’s about how you got there.... finishing just means you lived and died... there’s nothing special about that.
Eexpers holding people to the same standard assumes everyone started on the same level with the same opportunity. The effects of overt racism are still prevalent. That didn’t just disappear after the civil rights era.
Man I'm a black person and I work my ass off and follow the law to the t and I don't think ive effectively made it okay to be racist towards me this actually hurt bruh.
"Why are blacks more violent" "They just are." "Could it be socio-economic reasons?" "Yeah, that's it." "And it's not their fault they had that start right?" "Right" "So how do we blame them for causing black problems" "Because it's a choice." That's a trainwreck boys.
So lemme get this straight. The only thing that can help the black community in america is by individuals inside the community pulling themselves up by their boot straps without outside help. Even though we know that outside help enables us to make better decisions (with people outside of black people). But it won't help here (because of culture) and we expect the black community to make the harder decision of lifting themselves up(in spite of their culture) and somehow this is better or easier than getting the help that we've already agreed helps everybody else because black people have a unique culture. But the culture can change but we're arguing as if won't. And on top of all of this we're making this argument when we understand that we've been more or less not doing anything and the problem isn't really getting any better. And to top it all off the fact that it's possible to statistically predict how people will act when given a specific environment means that doing nothing will tend to result in individuals climbing out but the probability of the majority of a group as a whole doing the same thing becomes exponentially less likely the larger the group is. This just doesn't seem like a feasible method if you want to realistically see any sort of change unless you're talking about thousands of years instead of hundreds.
''It’s simple man. It’s not a choice. You don’t choose the situation you’re born into. PERIOD!!!''-------- but you do choose whether you are going to initiate violence or not--------- whether you are going to continue to hang around a ghetto neighborhood after high school graduation or take financial aid and leave that neighborhood
robinsss you’re arguing about a “choice” to remove yourself from a situation you had no choice but to be in. Contrast that with someone who was born middle class. They never have to make that “choice”. That’s 2 different standards for people are supposedly “equal”.
@@hueyfreeman4366 ''''''''you’re arguing about a “choice” to remove yourself from a situation you had no choice but to be in. Contrast that with someone who was born middle class. They never have to make that “choice”.''''''' that doesn't change the fact that once you are grown and qualify for college financial aid you have a choice whether to take the aid and go to school or hang around the neighborhood
You can ask that question I suppose, but the existence of that stat says nothing about the cause. This is why it is so frustrating speaking to people who present stats as if they proved something other than that a thing occurred.
Follow a logical conversation? I am trying to find logic at all in your statements. It seems like your assertion is based on how you feel rather than any basis in fact. What specifically about "black culture" is causing the issue? In what ways have you been exposed to it so you can examine it? Are other races exposed to that "culture"? If so, how has that "culture" effected those other races? The stat itself, does not say anything about the causes. What other evidence do you have that it is black culture? "Can I ask you why young black males make up 3% of the population and commit 51 % of the murder?" The answer to that question is that there is no one single answer. Meaning that there are too many variables to point to one reason. Many different reasons have been pointed to for this statistic, but none of them alone can bear the weight of contradictory evidence. So, saying it is just the culture of black people(who have MANY different cultures), seems odd and a little on the lazy side when trying to think about complex topics.
Dez E. The problem is that you think people are bringing up these stats to try to insult you or say they're better than you. But that's really not the point. It doesn't matter who is doing most of the murders, we want to try and stop all murder of course. But if you're going to claim that police are racist for having a higher presence in certain black neighborhoods, THEN people bring up the murder stats to refute your claim. If there stop being MULTIPLE murders a night in some of these areas then I guarantee there will also be less cops. They aren't there because people are smoking weed. This is very obvious basic shit. And you keep talking about "the cause". I guess by that you mean white racism (taking a wild guess lol). But the thing is that if a black guy murders another black guy, then the cause really really was not white racism. Sorry. It wasn't white racism from the past, and it isn't white racism in the present. It was THAT GUY who murdered the other guy. He was the cause. It was his fault. He should not have murdered someone. The stats aren't just some random numbers. They are ACTUAL PEOPLE getting murdered. And I'm sorry, if you think white people somewhere miles away in another neighborhood being less racist is going to magically stop murders in black neighborhoods, you're a special kind of retarded. The problem is maybe that YOU are being too emotional here and aren't thinking rationally. Clearly your ego is way to tied up in demographic stats rather than your own personal life and accomplishments. This is I think why you need to blame someone else if your ethnicity isn't "winning" on average in any given area. It's really getting super old and comes off as incredibly pathetic. I would recommend chilling and looking at things objectively. Stop being paranoid about white people judging you.
yeah. this guy doesn't understand incentives. how a poor person is more incentivized to rob someone than a rich person, that that choice is weighted by this, and that it can be really hard to say no---all because of the environment you were born into.
Let me get this straight, Destiny's argument that we shouldn't expect them to make outstanding decisions because it is unlikely for that to happen with anybody, is wrong according to this guy because he's talking about statistics, about probability and apparently that's not the issue. But then this guy says discriminating against black people is okay because statistically it is more likely that they're carrying a firearm? Isn't that straight up hypocritical?
This is literally the same issues Destiny had with the Lauren Southern debate, he wanted to talk about these issues about how they fail to make the right choices, and when asked to go a level deeper to why they make the wrong choices he just floundered and went back to talking about how they should make the right choices but they don't so it's their fault.
Did this dude argue that Stop and Frisk is a good thing, admit and apologize that he didn't know what Stop and Frisk actually did, and then STILL supported stop and frisk? Dude is Republicaning at a Hannity grade level.
"Woah! Miss, who locked you in this steel cage in the middle of nowhere?" "I don't know but can you let me out so I don't die?" "That is NOT my responsibility. It's your choice to get yourself out of this situation!" "But it's locked.." "SO THAT MAKES IT IMPOSSIBLE? IT'S STILL A CHOICE!"
Except this guy isn't a Libertarian. He never argued against the police, prison system, drug war, and other factors that hold the Black community back. A Libertarian would argue against the necessity of all of those things.
Why does this guy think that cultural change can't be influenced by outside pressure? It literally happens all the time to communities around the world and yet black culture is somehow immune to such pressure?
This is one of the few times in life I've felt true fascination. How.. in all the miracles needed to happen to create the universe and all the progress people have made.. how is it possible for someone's entire worldview be shaped not by data, but by the words "I don't know. It just is." I'm gonna have a really hard time wrapping my head around this one. Kudos to Destiny for having so much patience with this guy
Let's put some things into perspective here. Slavery was abolished around 152 years ago. The modern human being has been around for 200k years. The earth has been around for about 4billion years.
He said black people only respect the hustle and that the culture of black communities don't respect people who work hard and make decisions to better there lives. HE DOESN'T UNDERSTAND THE FUCKING WORD HUSTLE.
This guy's got me on emotional level. I can clearly tell he's been hurt by the black community in many ways and that's how he ended up in this position. I strongly think he feels he's been betrayed by the community and the culture and has demonized it because of that. I think that's where Destiny missed, his position can't be logic'd out of. Makes me sad hearing his voice when he talks about these issues.
I try to interact with as many people across the political and social perspective as I can, and in my experience, this is actually how most people speak. Even those who are fairly educated have trouble avoiding using baseless assertions; particularly outside their area of expertise. I do this sometimes too, but the goal is to be aware of it and work on recognizing when you don't reeeealy know if what you're saying is accurate.
Destiny: "I guess I would hope that as the society and conditions around a community improve, the culture of that community would improve to reflect that over time as well?" other dude: "..............NO."
As someone who grew up in South Bronx this guy has no idea what he's talking about. Most people want to succeed. They just don't have enough opportunities to.
"Culture doesn't improve, it changes" I wonder if there is something to describe one thing turning into another thing that is better.. Like if one thing changes into something better.. its changing not improving.. wow.
Much respect to Destiny for dealing with this guy calmly and not referring to him as an 'Uncle Tom'. I had an issue with Destiny when he used this term previously. It would have been too easy to label this guy as that and dismiss him. People like this caller are truly an embarrassment. He is actively shitting on his own 'community' and the sad thing is, I think the guy is genuinely unaware of this. He isn't being malicious, he is just ignorant. You should have asked this him what the was doing to help his community, other than run around spreading shit about black people and supporting racist polices that ensures the cycle continues. What a complete tool.
As he an uncle Tom? Probably. I think to dismiss fucked up shit happening to a person so easily is very dehumanizing. So I wouldn't be surprised if he was. He also never wanted to tackle how an why such a community can ride, when destiny would say culture is a reaction to the environment. He's also very unreasonable to expect people to choose the best choice, shit just doesn't work that way. Anyway all that aside, at the end of the day. You still have to play cards you were given. Even if it's a fucked up hand. So he's not technically wrong, the change has to come from within. Ala Jordan Peterson. "Clean your room"
The guy makes an argument for the individual by choice but then applies the group to it makes no sense. Saying black people as a group face certain circumstances because of lack of wealth doesn't mean an individual who commits violence won't face the full consequences. And saying the group faces that does not justify the individual choice but does allow people to know where it comes from and how to alleviate it in the future.
His argument is that black people in bad environments need to be literally perfect human beings. What the fuck is the point of making an argument if it has zero basis in reality?
As an avid listener of hip hop, this guy frustrates me. The reason why drug dealing is often referenced in hip hop is because most hip hop artists come from impoverished backgrounds where a decent chunk of people sold drugs to either fund their lifestyles or invest into what woukd evolve into a future career such as making music. The art simply reflects the reality of what people go through.
This guy's beliefs are distilled contradiction. "Blacks are where they are because of socio-economics and laws in 1960s." contradicts "Blacks just need to make a choice to rise above." Pick one, not both. Either economics affects peoples abilities to make choices or it doesn't.
you seem to have forgotten the socio part of socio-economic--------- the social part is the part we can accept or reject------ in this case that means the poor black culture that has many high negative aspects
"What you're really asking me is, if it's okay to discriminate." "Sure." "Yes." "....wh......WHY?" "That person is statistically more likely to have a firearm on them." According to what statistics? O_o
“I’m from the inside..” Meaning I’m black, so I know I’m right... and you’re not black so you can’t argue against me... argumentum ad verecundiam. (also known as: argument from authority, appeal to false authority, appeal to unqualified authority, argument from false authority, ipse dixit) Description: Using an authority as evidence in your argument when the authority is not really an authority on the facts relevant to the argument.
"If you get put in a bad situation and you choose not to get out, is it the fault of the person who put you in that bad situation that you choose not to get out?" What an asinine question. A more appropriate question would be "If someone puts you in a bad situation from which you are unable or unlikely to escape, does that person bear some responsibility for your fate?" The answer is undoubtedly "yes"! If I kidnap someone and he or she hurts him- or herself trying to escape my clutches, I will be held responsible. It's called causation!
Destiny: "I guess I would hope that as the society and conditions around a community improve, the culture of that community would improve to reflect that over time as well?" other dude: "..............NO." --___--
I was going to do timestamps for this debate but not even half way through, there’s just nothing. It’s the same point over and over again. This guy is just a robot that found a magic phrase “it’s a choice” that allows him to never engage with anything remotely challenging ever again.
What “black community” is he referring to? He seems to be talking about his own personal perceptions on a particular neighborhood or set of acquaintances. It’s either that or I’m listening to the real Clayton Bigsby.
This is the perfect example of “bring them down to your level” intellectually. This guy was making arguments and biting bullets I never thought even the most conservative republicans would ever make cause they’d know how ridiculous they sound. Jeez. Also, this guy kinda talks like Mr. Girl
I remember when I first made friends that weren't from the inner city. It blew my mind the difference in outlook. To them, the dream was like being a ceo or running a business. That was the "good life" to shoot for. But for my friends from the city the dream was to be a kingpin, to flip drugs/hustle. Blew my mind the difference in outlook. As soon as I changed my environment my outlook changed and my life changed as a result.
@@khadi7454Some ghettos are made, some evolve naturally. In the past, our outlook was very much determined by our location. With the rise of the information age I really do hope that the widespread access to people from other areas will help to smooth out the huge disparities in the way of thinking between inner city and outer city. There has to be both a mentality change and a policy change. If we give help in the form of money or tradable commodities it is only natural that those things will be traded or sold illegally to gain access to things like drugs either for consumption or distribution depending on the person. We need to help people stop looking at money as a means to get those things and instead look at it as a means to improve their lives.
@@khadi7454 The greatest change in mentality/stress/ for me was when I realized that if all I did was save up 1 paycheck worth of money and didn't break into it, I could SIGNIFICANTLY reduce my stress. Living paycheck to paycheck sucks but there are usually ways to save little bits, even a dollar or two here and there can add up to a better mental state.
Cuberth there is so many racist assumptions and historical inaccuracies in this one post...this what Destiny is talking about...you people speak with no actual historical reference😂it’s all anecdotes and bullshit...you don’t acknowledge Gerrymandering, redlining, the war on drugs, convict leasing, unfair schools, health disparities, environmental racism, lead paint in section 8 housing....is this really how you go about life? With no history at all?
“It’s not about responsibility, it’s about ability” Responsibility- the opportunity or ability to act independently and make decisions without authorization. The word “ability” is in the definition of the word “responsibility”. Basic fuckin vocabulary.
“Change needs to come from within....from their leaders” “I accept stop and frisk even if I’m not doing anything harmful or illegal to another person but just because it’s what the frisked needs to do to feel assured”
When Destiny started talking about that racism isn’t as big a problem anymore, and the guy replied that he wasn’t talking about racism as the problem, but essentially ‘black culture/community’, I freaking lost it. Basically: ‘Racism isn’t that big a deal anymore,’ ‘No no, racism isn’t the problem, it is black people.’
He was also wrong on the stats, black people were actually less likely to have any illegal stuff on them while stop and frisk was in place. So again holy shit.
""The white man wants black men to stay immoral, unclean and ignorant. As long as we stay in these conditions we will keep on begging him and he will control us. We never can win freedom and justice and equality until we are doing something for ourselves!" -Malcolm X
Destiny: *talks about the likelihood someone will make a choice while saying choice 20 times in sentence Other Guy: but does that stop it from being a choice?
It seemed like he agreed with Destiny on a lot of points, but then he'd just default into "It's a choice" mode even if it meant contradicting what he just agreed with and said just moments ago. To put this in another perspective: It would be like explaining why open borders are a bad thing, agreeing that it was a bad thing, and then all of a sudden saying "open borders are a good thing". Why are they good? "Because they just are". Just pure dogmatism.
it's like a giant circle with a thousand variables swirling around. that this guy boldly proclaims that improving the environment in poor black communities just would NOT slowly improve the culture he speaks of, I think is cynical of him.
this dude is unironically more racist than all the ethnostate dudes, that destiny's debated, combined. it's pretty sad that this person thinks so little of black people tbh especially since he's black.
why would black people choose to be discriminated against lol?? this guy can’t explain any argument or even make sense. he’s always saying “it’s a choice,” “it just is.”
"I'm not one who talks to a lot of people"
OH YOU DON'T SAY
AND THEN WHEN HE SAID " I'm talking from an insider's point of view "
THAT NIGGA WAS STILL ON THE OUTSIDE
"But they are, you know that, right?"
"I'm not a person who talks to a lot people"
"Sorry, could you repeat that?"
^ the video in 3 lines. saved you all 50 minutes. you're welcome.
😂😂😂😂
"you think Jaiden Smith will grow up to be a drug dealer?"
"hip hop artist... not too far off..."
FUCKING END MY LIFE RIGHT NOW
and that doesnt make his statement any better, but thanks for assuming my political stances, oh bastion of knowledge and reason
Yes the black community respects people of great talent who are successful because of their artistic talent. This is similar to selling drugs apparently.
Right, right, right
n a s h i Hahaha
name me one hip hop artist that is respected in the black comunity that isnt involved in drugs (just taking them/ rapping about sick weed n shit)
A black American arguing away his own rights? Bizarre times
he's hispanic. Theres no way he's black, i think he's lying.
@@geekaleek whats his name
@Andrew Stevenson whats that?
@@geekaleek they’re not mutually exclusive identities, genius.
When a white liberal shoves you own oppression down your throat, let them. They are doing it to help.
This guy is who these racists are talking about when they say "I'm not racist, I have a black friend."
They will take one of us and use them to speak against/ignore the masses. Idk who they are fooling but themselves.
They love their tokens.
Am I the only one who feels bad for this dude? So disillusioned.
yeah. his pov is so cynical and downtrodden. he thinks very little of the black community, which despite what he says..I'm guessing is not a monolithic hive mind.
@Dylan James the dude who doesn't understand the concept of probability is a realist.. LOL
@Dylan James It's hard to "bring yourself up" when you aren't provided the tools to do so.
Dylan James that’s like cutting someone’s legs off and then asking them run, what this guy is saying fucking dumb
@Dylan James I might be one of the very few people who will give a little credence to this argument, just because I understand it from personal experience. I see what you're trying to say, that if someone is in a bad situation in life, they need to work their ass off in order to succeed. However, it's entirely unfair to look at this group who has been historically put down, is continuing to suffer from these injustices and say "if *all* of them just work harder, they'll get better." That is completely ridiculous, the idea that people should only be able to live a good life if they work extremely hard (and when I say extremely hard, I mean the average black guy having to put in 2-3 times the work the average white guy does just to live a good life) is stupid.
The idea that "only you can bring yourself up" is semi-true, but you can't just say "if x people aren't willing to work 20x as hard to make a decent living, then they deserve their suffering" because that's incredibly cruel. This isn't even a feels over reals thing either, this is just me having morals and ethics and not wanting people to suffer just because they are less fortunate than me and have to put in way more work than me to even the scales, whilst you're out here suggesting if they aren't willing to put in the work, they deserve poverty and death. Do you see why a lot of republicans/conservatives/idiots tend to stick with denying systemic racism exists rather than suggesting black people should just overcome it (and yes, denying systemic racism exists is still really stupid, just a little less stupid than implying that people suffering should just overcome their challenges)?
“It’s never happened in human history”
“Well, human history is not that old”
Lmfao
I'll save you a listen. The fan has no empathy for anyone, everything is a choice inside of a vacuum.
lol @ 24:00 - Black suburban guy here, can confirm. I feel the temptations of the hustle everyday. Even now, as I work on my data structures homework, I'm just itchin' to sell a rock or two.
TL NOTE: "Rock" refers to "Crack Rock", a type of illicit substance popular within poor black neighborhoods or 'hoods'.
Sell to make some... STACKS?
Gangsta 101:
You sling them rocks to get stacks.
Them stacks give ya sway.
Yo sway make that booty jiggle.
( first you get the money, then you get the power, then you get the women)
everybody gangsta until black people be gangsta
😂😂😭😭 The satire is brilliant. Shoutouts to "UrbanDictionary.com"
Labeling yourself a “black suburban guy” was redundant
His argument is pretty much, "In a 100 meter dash, if you get kneecapped right before the race starts, then it's your fault if you don't win the race. Bootstraps."
The hell man.😑
Just make the choice to be healthy again. Always a good meme
More like "it's your choice if you don't finish the race". Which it is. Now this doesn't say anything about the fairness of the situation, but technically it's still a choice. On this precise point he is not incorrect.
i'm not done yet, but that sounds like a pretty accurate summary so far
Theodolphe in the context of life, what does “finishing the race” symbolize?
Life isn’t about the finish, it’s about how you got there.... finishing just means you lived and died... there’s nothing special about that.
Eexpers holding people to the same standard assumes everyone started on the same level with the same opportunity.
The effects of overt racism are still prevalent. That didn’t just disappear after the civil rights era.
According to this guy's logic: If you're not a scientist, you're basically a drug dealer.
Peppy Basically nobody is trying in his eyes. Fuck this guy. lol
EsotericOccultist fuck off with that shit. You're either purposely interpreting destiny wrong or an idiot if that's what you think he said.
Man I'm a black person and I work my ass off and follow the law to the t and I don't think ive effectively made it okay to be racist towards me this actually hurt bruh.
Razor ikr! lol
Vincent Disilva I'm sorry I am gonna look at it that way because in no way is what this person said ok I'm sorry but discrimination isn't ok
+fewwef weffefwf Ok first of all fuck you for having that username holy shit. Second of all, lmao that comment is hilarious.
You must not be part of black culture because you work hard.
Yeah that's basically the reasoning that guy in the vid was using.
I just know this will be a trainwreck of a video lol
It's not.
It really is.
"Why are blacks more violent"
"They just are."
"Could it be socio-economic reasons?"
"Yeah, that's it."
"And it's not their fault they had that start right?"
"Right"
"So how do we blame them for causing black problems"
"Because it's a choice."
That's a trainwreck boys.
polymorph ine The guy's been pumpin too much Larry Elder
And it sums up the whole fucking video.
''It's still a choice though...''
So lemme get this straight. The only thing that can help the black community in america is by individuals inside the community pulling themselves up by their boot straps without outside help. Even though we know that outside help enables us to make better decisions (with people outside of black people). But it won't help here (because of culture) and we expect the black community to make the harder decision of lifting themselves up(in spite of their culture) and somehow this is better or easier than getting the help that we've already agreed helps everybody else because black people have a unique culture. But the culture can change but we're arguing as if won't.
And on top of all of this we're making this argument when we understand that we've been more or less not doing anything and the problem isn't really getting any better. And to top it all off the fact that it's possible to statistically predict how people will act when given a specific environment means that doing nothing will tend to result in individuals climbing out but the probability of the majority of a group as a whole doing the same thing becomes exponentially less likely the larger the group is. This just doesn't seem like a feasible method if you want to realistically see any sort of change unless you're talking about thousands of years instead of hundreds.
this guys whole argument is "just don't be poor loooool"
I know I’m 2 years late.. but, I think his whole argument is “just don’t be black”. I wonder if he still feels the same 2 years later.
@@roxi2798 I know I’m 3 months late, but yeah I wonder the same
@@IMFEELINGJOLLY I know I’m 2 months late but I agree
“But it’s their choice”
It’s simple man. It’s not a choice.
You don’t choose the situation you’re born into. PERIOD!!!
''It’s simple man. It’s not a choice.
You don’t choose the situation you’re born into. PERIOD!!!''-------- but you do choose whether you are going to initiate violence or not--------- whether you are going to continue to hang around a ghetto neighborhood after high school graduation or take financial aid and leave that neighborhood
robinsss you’re arguing about a “choice” to remove yourself from a situation you had no choice but to be in.
Contrast that with someone who was born middle class. They never have to make that “choice”.
That’s 2 different standards for people are supposedly “equal”.
robinsss the poor person is burdened with more responsibility to make the “right choice”.
@@robinsss unless you’re denied financial aid because of the neighborhood you were born in.
@@hueyfreeman4366 ''''''''you’re arguing about a “choice” to remove yourself from a situation you had no choice but to be in.
Contrast that with someone who was born middle class. They never have to make that “choice”.'''''''
that doesn't change the fact that once you are grown and qualify for college financial aid you have a choice whether to take the aid and go to school or hang around the neighborhood
This guy was literally just spouting rhetoric used to justify racism
like affirmative action?
You can ask that question I suppose, but the existence of that stat says nothing about the cause. This is why it is so frustrating speaking to people who present stats as if they proved something other than that a thing occurred.
I suppose it was some weird coincidence that you presented the stats in your question. A question you believe that you know the answer to. Got it
Follow a logical conversation? I am trying to find logic at all in your statements. It seems like your assertion is based on how you feel rather than any basis in fact. What specifically about "black culture" is causing the issue? In what ways have you been exposed to it so you can examine it? Are other races exposed to that "culture"? If so, how has that "culture" effected those other races? The stat itself, does not say anything about the causes. What other evidence do you have that it is black culture?
"Can I ask you why young black males make up 3% of the population and commit 51 % of the murder?"
The answer to that question is that there is no one single answer. Meaning that there are too many variables to point to one reason. Many different reasons have been pointed to for this statistic, but none of them alone can bear the weight of contradictory evidence. So, saying it is just the culture of black people(who have MANY different cultures), seems odd and a little on the lazy side when trying to think about complex topics.
Dez E. The problem is that you think people are bringing up these stats to try to insult you or say they're better than you. But that's really not the point. It doesn't matter who is doing most of the murders, we want to try and stop all murder of course. But if you're going to claim that police are racist for having a higher presence in certain black neighborhoods, THEN people bring up the murder stats to refute your claim. If there stop being MULTIPLE murders a night in some of these areas then I guarantee there will also be less cops. They aren't there because people are smoking weed. This is very obvious basic shit.
And you keep talking about "the cause". I guess by that you mean white racism (taking a wild guess lol). But the thing is that if a black guy murders another black guy, then the cause really really was not white racism. Sorry. It wasn't white racism from the past, and it isn't white racism in the present. It was THAT GUY who murdered the other guy. He was the cause. It was his fault. He should not have murdered someone. The stats aren't just some random numbers. They are ACTUAL PEOPLE getting murdered. And I'm sorry, if you think white people somewhere miles away in another neighborhood being less racist is going to magically stop murders in black neighborhoods, you're a special kind of retarded. The problem is maybe that YOU are being too emotional here and aren't thinking rationally. Clearly your ego is way to tied up in demographic stats rather than your own personal life and accomplishments. This is I think why you need to blame someone else if your ethnicity isn't "winning" on average in any given area. It's really getting super old and comes off as incredibly pathetic. I would recommend chilling and looking at things objectively. Stop being paranoid about white people judging you.
this guy seems to think that all crime is a malicious act that people can just opt in and out of
yeah. this guy doesn't understand incentives. how a poor person is more incentivized to rob someone than a rich person, that that choice is weighted by this, and that it can be really hard to say no---all because of the environment you were born into.
@@westingtyler1 Incentive what incentive? He robs another poor person though.
Let me get this straight, Destiny's argument that we shouldn't expect them to make outstanding decisions because it is unlikely for that to happen with anybody, is wrong according to this guy because he's talking about statistics, about probability and apparently that's not the issue.
But then this guy says discriminating against black people is okay because statistically it is more likely that they're carrying a firearm?
Isn't that straight up hypocritical?
This is literally the same issues Destiny had with the Lauren Southern debate, he wanted to talk about these issues about how they fail to make the right choices, and when asked to go a level deeper to why they make the wrong choices he just floundered and went back to talking about how they should make the right choices but they don't so it's their fault.
Did this dude argue that Stop and Frisk is a good thing, admit and apologize that he didn't know what Stop and Frisk actually did, and then STILL supported stop and frisk?
Dude is Republicaning at a Hannity grade level.
37:15 Him: What you're really asking me is if it's okay to discriminate.
Destiny: Sure.
Him: Yes.
Destiny: ... Error: File not found.
Super big fan of Destiny, keep up the good work and remember to stay safe.
Dawigas good luck buddy.
was that a threat?
"Woah! Miss, who locked you in this steel cage in the middle of nowhere?"
"I don't know but can you let me out so I don't die?"
"That is NOT my responsibility. It's your choice to get yourself out of this situation!"
"But it's locked.."
"SO THAT MAKES IT IMPOSSIBLE? IT'S STILL A CHOICE!"
Yooo😂
“It’s only statistics”
Wow!!!! He calls using statistics a “cop out”?
Wtf??? Is this reality or naw???
"It's their fault even though it's not their fault that they're in the position they're in now?"
"Right!"
The conversation, in a nut shell
3 minutes in and already hearing some great libertarian free will memes, this is gonna be good.
I was thinking the same thing. Libertarian free will meme was the core of this conversation.
Wow a real life trap! I thought you only existed in memes and dreams
i love you lol
o-onii chan
Except this guy isn't a Libertarian. He never argued against the police, prison system, drug war, and other factors that hold the Black community back. A Libertarian would argue against the necessity of all of those things.
Why does this guy think that cultural change can't be influenced by outside pressure? It literally happens all the time to communities around the world and yet black culture is somehow immune to such pressure?
Also the "make better choices" meme is utterly broken if you grow up not knowing what those better choices look like.
Ｈｅ ｆｏｕｎｄ ｔｈｅ ｗｅｅｄ
This guy took the boondocks to serious.
This is one of the few times in life I've felt true fascination. How.. in all the miracles needed to happen to create the universe and all the progress people have made.. how is it possible for someone's entire worldview be shaped not by data, but by the words "I don't know. It just is."
I'm gonna have a really hard time wrapping my head around this one. Kudos to Destiny for having so much patience with this guy
"human history is not that old" is the dumbest thing I've heard today.
Let's put some things into perspective here. Slavery was abolished around 152 years ago. The modern human being has been around for 200k years. The earth has been around for about 4billion years.
So ?
Do you not grasp the concept of time or numbers? Humans on earth are as "new" as it gets bruh.
He said "human history" my dude.
How can i tell if someone is trolling or just stupid?
I feel like I got second stage cancer from this dude. I need some chemo quick.
HE FOUND THE WEED
He said black people only respect the hustle and that the culture of black communities don't respect people who work hard and make decisions to better there lives. HE DOESN'T UNDERSTAND THE FUCKING WORD HUSTLE.
“That’s the issue, right?”
“It’s their culture”
“I’m sorry, can you repeat the question?”
This dudes working memory is a fuckin mess.
This is hard to listen to.
How are people like, randomly jumping into the voice chat? I'm confused and out of touch, apparently.
This guy's got me on emotional level. I can clearly tell he's been hurt by the black community in many ways and that's how he ended up in this position.
I strongly think he feels he's been betrayed by the community and the culture and has demonized it because of that.
I think that's where Destiny missed, his position can't be logic'd out of.
Makes me sad hearing his voice when he talks about these issues.
Why do Destiny's opponents speak in baseless assertions?
Welcome to humanity. Where the average human doesn't give two shits about facts.
I try to interact with as many people across the political and social perspective as I can, and in my experience, this is actually how most people speak. Even those who are fairly educated have trouble avoiding using baseless assertions; particularly outside their area of expertise. I do this sometimes too, but the goal is to be aware of it and work on recognizing when you don't reeeealy know if what you're saying is accurate.
can you say that again sorry I got distracted
what baseless assertion did he make?
Destiny: "I guess I would hope that as the society and conditions around a community improve, the culture of that community would improve to reflect that over time as well?"
other dude: "..............NO."
This was very frustrating to listen to. Dude talks super slow and Everytime destiny responds he asks "one more time? Sorry I was doing other shit"
"Human History is not that old"
I've never face palmed so hard...
DESTINY, HE FOUND THE WEED!!!
He doesn't speak for all of us
As someone who grew up in South Bronx this guy has no idea what he's talking about. Most people want to succeed. They just don't have enough opportunities to.
"Culture doesn't improve, it changes"
I wonder if there is something to describe one thing turning into another thing that is better.. Like if one thing changes into something better.. its changing not improving.. wow.
This mans doesn't understand that culture isn't intrinsic to a human being.
But he found the weed tho
Much respect to Destiny for dealing with this guy calmly and not referring to him as an 'Uncle Tom'.
I had an issue with Destiny when he used this term previously. It would have been too easy to label this guy as that and dismiss him.
People like this caller are truly an embarrassment. He is actively shitting on his own 'community' and the sad thing is, I think the guy is genuinely unaware of this. He isn't being malicious, he is just ignorant.
You should have asked this him what the was doing to help his community, other than run around spreading shit about black people and supporting racist polices that ensures the cycle continues.
What a complete tool.
As he an uncle Tom? Probably. I think to dismiss fucked up shit happening to a person so easily is very dehumanizing. So I wouldn't be surprised if he was. He also never wanted to tackle how an why such a community can ride, when destiny would say culture is a reaction to the environment. He's also very unreasonable to expect people to choose the best choice, shit just doesn't work that way.
Anyway all that aside, at the end of the day. You still have to play cards you were given. Even if it's a fucked up hand. So he's not technically wrong, the change has to come from within. Ala Jordan Peterson. "Clean your room"
@@Wolfsins Uncle Tom is a racist term
The guy makes an argument for the individual by choice but then applies the group to it makes no sense. Saying black people as a group face certain circumstances because of lack of wealth doesn't mean an individual who commits violence won't face the full consequences. And saying the group faces that does not justify the individual choice but does allow people to know where it comes from and how to alleviate it in the future.
His argument is that black people in bad environments need to be literally perfect human beings. What the fuck is the point of making an argument if it has zero basis in reality?
As an avid listener of hip hop, this guy frustrates me.
The reason why drug dealing is often referenced in hip hop is because most hip hop artists come from impoverished backgrounds where a decent chunk of people sold drugs to either fund their lifestyles or invest into what woukd evolve into a future career such as making music. The art simply reflects the reality of what people go through.
I love how all these free will warriors love to point to statistics when it is convenient to them
This was pretty infuriating, you handled it pretty well though, nice one.
This guy's beliefs are distilled contradiction. "Blacks are where they are because of socio-economics and laws in 1960s." contradicts "Blacks just need to make a choice to rise above." Pick one, not both. Either economics affects peoples abilities to make choices or it doesn't.
you seem to have forgotten the socio part of socio-economic--------- the social part is the part we can accept or reject------ in this case that means the poor black culture that has many high negative aspects
“Human history is not that old”
Aiite, I’m out. I need a full day to prepare for this cringe.
Destiny, he FOUND the WEED
This conversation was literal cancer...
crystal butler like getting stabbed 1000 times by a plastic butter knife
"What you're really asking me is, if it's okay to discriminate."
"Sure."
"Yes."
"....wh......WHY?"
"That person is statistically more likely to have a firearm on them."
According to what statistics? O_o
"He found the weed "
Systemic issues can only be solved systemically, believing anything else is wishful thinking.
“I’m from the inside..”
Meaning I’m black, so I know I’m right... and you’re not black so you can’t argue against me...
argumentum ad verecundiam. (also known as: argument from authority, appeal to false authority, appeal to unqualified authority, argument from false authority, ipse dixit) Description: Using an authority as evidence in your argument when the authority is not really an authority on the facts relevant to the argument.
"If you get put in a bad situation and you choose not to get out, is it the fault of the person who put you in that bad situation that you choose not to get out?"
What an asinine question. A more appropriate question would be "If someone puts you in a bad situation from which you are unable or unlikely to escape, does that person bear some responsibility for your fate?" The answer is undoubtedly "yes"! If I kidnap someone and he or she hurts him- or herself trying to escape my clutches, I will be held responsible. It's called causation!
He doesn’t speak for anyone but himself and his racist viewpoints.
Destiny: "I guess I would hope that as the society and conditions around a community improve, the culture of that community would improve to reflect that over time as well?"
other dude: "..............NO."
--___--
"Yes, but it hasn't happened yet."
"We shouldnt help them because we didnt help them yet" this guy is a beast
THEY FOUND THE WEED DESTINY
But Destiny....... He found the weed!
This guy literally sees blacks as “statistics” and not as individuals
I was going to do timestamps for this debate but not even half way through, there’s just nothing. It’s the same point over and over again.
This guy is just a robot that found a magic phrase “it’s a choice” that allows him to never engage with anything remotely challenging ever again.
What “black community” is he referring to? He seems to be talking about his own personal perceptions on a particular neighborhood or set of acquaintances. It’s either that or I’m listening to the real Clayton Bigsby.
This is the perfect example of “bring them down to your level” intellectually. This guy was making arguments and biting bullets I never thought even the most conservative republicans would ever make cause they’d know how ridiculous they sound. Jeez.
Also, this guy kinda talks like Mr. Girl
He hates his black skin
This sounds exactly like the Carl debate
"In this situation, the constitution doesn't matter"
LMFAO
I remember when I first made friends that weren't from the inner city. It blew my mind the difference in outlook. To them, the dream was like being a ceo or running a business. That was the "good life" to shoot for. But for my friends from the city the dream was to be a kingpin, to flip drugs/hustle. Blew my mind the difference in outlook. As soon as I changed my environment my outlook changed and my life changed as a result.
Cuberth that’s the point of a ghetto...
@@khadi7454Some ghettos are made, some evolve naturally. In the past, our outlook was very much determined by our location. With the rise of the information age I really do hope that the widespread access to people from other areas will help to smooth out the huge disparities in the way of thinking between inner city and outer city. There has to be both a mentality change and a policy change. If we give help in the form of money or tradable commodities it is only natural that those things will be traded or sold illegally to gain access to things like drugs either for consumption or distribution depending on the person. We need to help people stop looking at money as a means to get those things and instead look at it as a means to improve their lives.
@@khadi7454 The greatest change in mentality/stress/ for me was when I realized that if all I did was save up 1 paycheck worth of money and didn't break into it, I could SIGNIFICANTLY reduce my stress. Living paycheck to paycheck sucks but there are usually ways to save little bits, even a dollar or two here and there can add up to a better mental state.
Cuberth there is so many racist assumptions and historical inaccuracies in this one post...this what Destiny is talking about...you people speak with no actual historical reference😂it’s all anecdotes and bullshit...you don’t acknowledge Gerrymandering, redlining, the war on drugs, convict leasing, unfair schools, health disparities, environmental racism, lead paint in section 8 housing....is this really how you go about life? With no history at all?
The self hate is real
The choice argument is a cop out ... I hate it when people bring it up
and it is really frustrating that Destiny struggles with this so much.
One of those debates that the guy Destiny is talking to is just really hard to listen to. What a nightmare.
"They just are"
Do I really need to watch the rest of this video? I know what's going to happen
There are plenty of rich people that have drugs. Hollywood is one of them
why are these debates like 10 times more entertaing at night time?
everything is better at night, music, movies, weed, food, sex, etc.
“It’s not about responsibility, it’s about ability”
Responsibility-
the opportunity or ability to act independently and make decisions without authorization.
The word “ability” is in the definition of the word “responsibility”. Basic fuckin vocabulary.
“Change needs to come from within....from their leaders”
“I accept stop and frisk even if I’m not doing anything harmful or illegal to another person but just because it’s what the frisked needs to do to feel assured”
When Destiny started talking about that racism isn’t as big a problem anymore, and the guy replied that he wasn’t talking about racism as the problem, but essentially ‘black culture/community’, I freaking lost it.
Basically:
‘Racism isn’t that big a deal anymore,’
‘No no, racism isn’t the problem, it is black people.’
52:00 'I enjoyed the conversation.'
did you Destiny? DID YOU REALLY?!?
He was also wrong on the stats, black people were actually less likely to have any illegal stuff on them while stop and frisk was in place. So again holy shit.
""The white man wants black men to stay immoral, unclean and
ignorant. As long as we stay in these conditions we will keep on begging him and he will control
us. We never can win freedom and justice and equality until we are doing something for
ourselves!" -Malcolm X
Destiny: *talks about the likelihood someone will make a choice while saying choice 20 times in sentence
Other Guy: but does that stop it from being a choice?
It seemed like he agreed with Destiny on a lot of points, but then he'd just default into "It's a choice" mode even if it meant contradicting what he just agreed with and said just moments ago.
To put this in another perspective: It would be like explaining why open borders are a bad thing, agreeing that it was a bad thing, and then all of a sudden saying "open borders are a good thing". Why are they good? "Because they just are". Just pure dogmatism.
where in the fucking world does culture influence environment FIRST?
please someone give me an example.
it's like a giant circle with a thousand variables swirling around. that this guy boldly proclaims that improving the environment in poor black communities just would NOT slowly improve the culture he speaks of, I think is cynical of him.
this dude is unironically more racist than all the ethnostate dudes, that destiny's debated, combined. it's pretty sad that this person thinks so little of black people tbh especially since he's black.
17:29 is when the guy realizes his own shit isn't adding up
Why isn’t this guy supreme ruler of the universe he’s not making the right choices smh
The simplicity of this Guy’s mind is so wild to me. It must be so nice to not be burdened with virtually any critical thinking skills
Something tells me this guy watches a lot of motivation video.
"its only statistics" oh wow you mean data indicative of the situation?
why would black people choose to be discriminated against lol?? this guy can’t explain any argument or even make sense. he’s always saying “it’s a choice,” “it just is.”