Great video! I have a shop full of tools I don't use. The question I now ask myself is " Do I love this tool or do I just love the idea of using this tool."
I had wondered what happened to the CNC, was looking forward to another series, as I am seriously contemplating one for small one-off projects like signs etc. Good to know we are not alone in mistaken purchases! My worst was also a table saw, which I gave away and replaced.
Many moons ago I bought a triton router and a UKJ router table for it for a specific project. Promptly life threw me a curve ball and so they sat unused for a number of years whilst we moved and children grew. I eventually managed to use the router to build a nice gaming table topper in the initial lockdown. I decided to finally fit the router to the table and discovered the rather expensive plate it came with had a bow to it, around 0.5mm in the middle along the long side. It turned out there was a bad batch/known issue with these plates around when I got it and I just never noticed, had I they would have exchanged it for me. The vendor assures me this will be "fine" but I can't get past knowing its bent, and they no longer sell the 6mm plates only a 10mm which to me is rather telling. I am sure I'll just get on with it one day but somewhat spendy shed ornament how every you cut it. Runner up is a "bargain" evolution mitre saw that I saw on sale in B&Q and had to have. It can't even cut a 2x6 so the first proper job it would have been useful for I ended up with a speed square and a battery circular saw!
Dear Peter, it’s unusual for a professional to admit to mistakes as you have done. It just gives me more respect for you. When I’m debating which brand of something to buy I go to a product review site. You often find out surprising facts about a product which better informs your choice. If the model you’re interested in is not reviewed then that is reason enough to leave it alone. Cheers.
Great insight into regretful purchases I’m sure we’ve all made! Most of my worst buys have been via auction sites where I have saved maybe up to 50% off retail but then failed to account for a 2 hour round trip to collect the item, and that they normally don’t perform how they should, hence the seller selling them! I now only (mostly) buy new, and use sites like yours to give me guidance on the pros and cons of kit I’m interested in. Thanks for the informative videos, I’ve learnt a lot from you.
One of your best videos, Peter. Sharing mistakes is a great way to help others learn. It's less about the product and more about what led you to make the decisions. The last example with the eBay purchase and money burning a hole in your pocket is probably something we can all relate to. So too, the example of buying a product that is perfectly good in its own right, such as the CNC machine, and yet establishing that it isn't a big enough part of your common workflow to warrant the outlay, time spent setting up and space it takes up. Great video. Humility like this is always great to see on a channel like yours. Thank you! 👍
Think of it as community service - you buy them so we don't have to. I don't really have any expensive regret tools, just random piles of small ones that seemed like a good idea but I don't end up using them. Worse are the small really useful tools that I have lent or misplaced, and can't find anywhere to replace. The most expensive in that vein is my habit of buying TIG welders, using them for a few years, then selling them because I'm moving and haven't used them for a while. I'm about to buy my third... Oh, and my 285mm circular saw (10"?). Which I included in the project cost when I built a shed out of 75mm coolstore panels, but it's proved impossible to resell. Even the guy who offered $50 failed to turn up and actually buy it.
I looked at the “fan in a can” too…. Really glad I went for the box style after hearing that. It seemed ideal on paper, but always good to have a real world test to show what something is like!
Great vid, I appreciate the insight. I agree 100% on CNC as it's not right for everyone. I do have one and I keep finding new ways to use it. My worst tool purchase is a mig welder. I thought I would make metal table legs and it still remains new in box after 2 years. 300us was a great deal at the time. I should really sell it, but I can't bring myself to let go.
It is a good idea cutting by using the jigsaw a few milimeters fron the scribe line and with a fee degrees of inclination, this will help you to fit the infill as close as posibles to the wall bay using the rasp.
Graco Ultra. My experience too, rubbish after the first 5 minutes. (First one replaced under warranty, second one patchy at best.) If I need to spray I use my Graco 390PC, it just works. The Ultra just sits on the shelf...
I'm wondering if the table saw is still surplus to your workflow, maybe you could consider donating it to the Men in Sheds charity workshops. I'm sure that might be a least painful and rewarding way out! Just a thought. 🤔👍😀
We all buy something that in the end turns out to be a bit of rubbish. I read the reviews on tools and this can help but it is not foolproof. I bought a biscuit joiner that cuts slots at an angle that turns out to be the opposite angle for the joining piece. It is completely useless. I can't in good conscience sell it to anyone, so it has turned out to be a live and learn. I think about welding it up and squaring it up but it is really not worth the trouble.
Hi Peter just like to add i know how you feel when you talk about the PayPal money not being real & the overwhelming auction when you seem to think you found a great price on a item & to wait for the item to arrive & after all the setup to find you purchased a dull item & especially when you have spent so much & due to size will cost you the same amount sending back will leave you being much aware next time. So my point is we all be there mate so don't put yourself down buddy look at it as more of an experience in buying rubbish tools...
Don't feel bad about things you shouldn't have bought your not alone.I have a few locked away in Pandora's cupboard in the corner of the garage. It fills me with dread when ever I go near it, when asked iam reluctant to explain what's inside.
Those Graco Handhelds are notorious for the pump failing. Big issue is it operated as a airless but the pump internals are some sort of plastic. I had 3 painting colleagues who cursed the thing. I bought a HVLP turbine and spray gun instead. Never let me down yet
I lovemy Graco cordless. Its a little heavy on the wrist fully loaded but it works like a champ on trim and doors. I would NEVER use it for a full room thats just crazy talk. I do clean it and keep pump armor in it when not in use. Graco really should have included a cap to plug the port I had to 3d print one so the pump armor would not leak out
hey Peter! Give the Fuji Q5 HVLP Turbine a look over, I'm a Cabinet Maker out of canada and I've been very happy with the results of the finish and quality of the unit. I would say the graco handheld units are more of a hobbyist tool hence the attractive price point, where the Q5 is more of a serious bit of kit. when used with 3m's pps2 system it's honestly rock solid and painless to use. Be a bit more open to spray finishing and don't let poor quality tool sour your taste to the possibilities spraying offers!
I sold an old, rubbish, table saw on marketplace. I did an honest and fair description and explained my issues with the saw to the buyer. He was happy as it filled a need he had. As long as you are open your conscience should be clear when selling / giving away. Interesting to hear about the CNC. We are just on the cusp of buying one (getting tax payments out of the way first) as we are looking at doing one off or small runs of items. Another good video Mr M! Thanks.
Thanks Aby! For one-offs and small runs a CNC is perfect - it’s just not something I really do, and even the smaller machines like mine take up a chunk of bench space in a small workshop. 👍
yep, sold my Lamello as well after about a year. Even with having both Domino's, still rely on conventional and pocket hole screws, and traditional joinery.
The only one I didn't guess was the table saw (maybe I missed those videos). I'm especially not surprised about the Lamello and the Greco. I was looking for a a spray system about the same time as you and went Fuji in the end because I was concerned about the lifetime of the pump in the Greco. The Lamello is a good looking idea but at the price it would have to be absolutely perfect in every way and it wasn't clear it was. I think you summed up the issue with CNC perfectly and the same arguments hold for 3D printers. I certainly wouldn't invest any time in that table saw, the design is fundamentally wrong and there's nothing you can do about that. Just list it honestly with the limitations it has and let the buyer decide if it's worth it.
@@10MinuteWorkshop Just because it doesn't suit your needs doesn't mean that another person won't find use in it... They may want something relatively lightweight with a sliding table and the direct drive motor doesn't effect them in terms of precision/noise/accuracy etc...
@@jigsey. oh yea.. totally get and understand that... Just meant that when he talked about not feeling like it was something he'd feel comfortable selling on to someone else, it might be a saw that suited someone else's needs
Agree completely except with the 3D printer part. It has been way more useful in the shop than I ever imagined it would be. Up there with my Domino. I've found so many unexpected use cases for it - vacuum hose adapters for all the tools that don't directly fit the Festool vac, dust extractor parts, flanges, all sorts of special hooks and brackets to hang tools on the wall, replacement parts for my tools (such as broken triggers and even bits of housing, gears, sprockets, motor flange adapter plates) fixtures and fittings for lights, all sorts of workholding adapters for MFT holes, shallow depth hinge spacers. And I'm relatively new to Fusion. There are people out there that have more skill and print router tables for palm routers and, complex dovetail of fingerjoint jigs, not counting all the 3D printed marking and spacing cotraptions Peter himself uses. By now I can't imagine not having a 3D printer for sop projects. I do however agree with the CNC router part - it is a way more limited tool than a 3D printer, loud as hell, slow and makes so much dust even with a dust extractor. Even if You're good with CAD software, the price, space it takes up and how rarely it's needed - makes more sense to send the drawings to a shop that has a large and more robust and precise CNC machine and have them route the parts.
I bought the Graco Ultra after seeing your videos, didn’t need the Ultramax as I only use water based paint. I used various paints, Dulux, Tikkurila, Benjamin Moore and it was ok, then the pump went and I got it replaced under warranty. The pump went again after about a year so I bought a new pump and replaced it myself which took about 30 seconds and I started using Sayerlack paint and nothing else. What a difference using that paint has made! Great, flawless finish, it’s almost if my Graco loves it. Yeah the pump will go again and it’ll cost me £170 for a new one but it pays for itself. I treat my Graco pretty badly now, I leave it with paint sitting in it for days on end and clean it out when I feel like it but it doesn’t seem to affect its performance. It seems all the cleaning, flushing it through with water, wrapping it in cotton wool after every use wasn’t good for it. Treat it mean, keep it keen…
Interesting, thanks! Never used sayerlack, but Alastair Johnson does at over at freebird and he rates it highly. Good to know it makes the Graco happy too! 👍👍
Absolutely loving reading through all these comments!! Very apparent how everyone is different. I wouldn't be without my table saw, but it is a huge 3 metre sliding bed jobby that I got for a steal. My domino joiner however has just sat in the box so far after buying one based on watching too many youtubers! I got the Graco Ultra too based on the "playing at spraying" series and am personally pleased with it so far.
I bought my Graco after watching your series and I'm in the same boat. Pump went WAY too soon and it doesn't make any sense to replace. Waste of money in the long run
I bought a large batch of powertools from a bankruptcy auction of a construction company. Quality tools, but they hadn't been used kindly. I spent many days cleaning them up and going through all the missing parts and accessories. I like to keep my tools clean and in good shape, so eventually ended up just replacing most of them with new tools.
Oh... Peter haven't we all made terrible buys... but, we tell ourselves it looked so good and it looked like the answer to all our wood working dreams. I still think you're on the up side I could have done a video... "Oh crap why did I buy these 10 dumb tools!" Got up early this morning and watched several Track Saw videos... your tip on the Strawbyte jig... just brilliant! Keep up the good work!
really interesting video Peter! one of my worst purchases was the old festool combination bevel for the rails. Whatever I did with it I couldn't get it accurate enough at any angle. Ended up buying a rail square from FC Tools in Scotland and that was a game changer! I believe festool have recently made a new angle stop, so clearly they didn't think the old one was much good either!
I also bought one of these on the strength of being a Festool. Could never understand how such a poor design could get past the product planners and testers at the company.
It's nice that you fussed up to your bad buys. Most guys just leave them on a shelf buried under scraps of wood and sawdust. We have always been taught in the States that European tools are always the best which is why I'm a Bosch Man but online tool sales has allowed bad tools to make it to the general population of idiots like me who want it no matter what the cost or how much room it takes up. Thank you.
Thanks James! Doctors bury their mistakes and architects plant ivy; woodworkers have them in the corner of the workshop, getting in the way, and taunting us all the time! 😂👍
Thank you, Peter. It's always reassuring to realise that many of us have access to more money than sense. I think we get afflicted with a mad kind of heat that forces us to empty our wallets and buy these really unsuitable devices !!
Good to see that bad buys are not limited to hobbyist woodworkers only! In the comments it becomes obvious that UA-cam vids play a big part in decision making and it doesn’t always turn out to be the best decisions.
I have often marvelled at the way you manage without a table saw. I don't know the Lutz but there *are* others! I look forward to more "post-retirement" videos in 2022.
Hi Peter, thanks for your honest review on the zeta after you had it a bit. Some years ago there was a huge wave here on youtube about the zeta which made it tempting of course. Today I actually never see it used again by the initial reviewers in their projects which to me looks more like it had been a lamello-birthday-marketing run to promote it. I also use a zeta but I more rely on the clamex and find the newer clamex flexus a very nice addition apart from the divario ( i never used). That said, I am not a professional user but it really helped me a few times to fix wobbly furniture with fixed shelf levels or so to stiffen it up a bit. For knock down furniture it is nice, but from a more allround approach I'd opt for a domino as it is more versatile in most cases due to the size of the connectors. I also more use the tenso as a prefixture so that it is less cumbersome to set clamps which is also nice, but of course not what marketing tells you ;-)
As long as we learn from our mistakes. I can't say what my worse purchases are - usually the cheapest ones. Saying that my 500 quid 2001 1.2 petrol Kangoo van has been a gem, it's now starting to cost a bit to keep it roadworthy but have you seen the cost of vans at the moment!!!!
As a long-time viewer, I KNEW the table saw would top your list😄. My experience with the Graco sprayer has been similar to yours. It's totally unreliable, which, in my opinion, is the cardinal sin for a tool (or employee). Thanks for all you do!
Hi I have 2 10 inch Bosch table saw they run nicely and also have dewalt 54v portable table saw to take with me at work and is the best saw...so accurate
My worst buy was an evolution fury table saw. As you raise and lower the blade, it goes in and out of square with the fence by several degrees. For 200 quid I wasn't expecting too much quality, but I at least thought raising and lowering the blade would be within its ability
@Nathan Lucas - interested in your comments upon Evolution Fury table saw. Built to a price, but it was indeed the price (£162 in 2016) that got me into a table saw frame of mind for my diy and hobbyist interests. Mine does not suffer the alignment issue you have experienced, although the fence precision and adjustment is only just adequate. For me, this table saw has been a great enabler and I have tackled many projects that I probably would not otherwise have been interested in doing (using my circular saw). Nonetheless, I would like a better one, but it has to be portable.
@@adrianlw2750 have you got any ideas how to stop the blade twisting side to side? If I could sort that it would be perfectly adequate for most stuff I do with it. Anything that I need super precision for, I've got a cast iron bodied saw now too
@@nathanlucas6465 I have had a look at mine, and delved underneath, following your request…. It is all a pretty solidly constructed/engineered machine, and when everything is tightened as it should be, there is no free-play in my blade in any direction (slight normal blade flexing apart). You may have done various checks already (apologies if you have!) but for good measure… With machine unplugged from mains, can I suggest four elements: 1. The green tilt-locking knob (fig.26 on page 20 of my manual) must be fully tightened. Check it hasn’t worked loose. Whilst “0” should be blade vertical, actual vertical should be checked after other checks below have been done. 2. Remove blade guard, remove the green table access plate (one screw), raise blade to highest setting, and check tightness/locking of the blade on its shaft. It should be rock-solid. Replace removed parts. 3. There are four Allen bolts, two at each end of the access plate, on the table top. Make sure these are fully secure/tightened with suitable Allen key. These secure the top pivoting point of the whole motor/blade mechanism. Again, should be rock-solid. 4. There are four further Allen bolts on table top, nearer the edges. Check for tightness, as if these are loose, the motor mechanism could unintentionally move and throw out blade alignment. I hope this helps - and apologies again if you’ve already carried out these checks. I cannot see anything else that could be giving you the problem you have.
Wow there are some expensive tools on that list. Glad I am not the only one living with bad purchases. My worst one was a scroll saw, was not expensive but still hardly ever use it and just occupies space.
Peter, I have to agree with you on these. For instance CNC machines. If they are at all useful in a typical woodworking shop then size matters. The bigger the better, but the price goes up astronomically with size. Unless you have a monster sized shop they take up valuable space that more appropriate tools could use.
Ha ha Snap mine was also a table saw and same eBay auction scenario. Axminster TS250 PHD required for alignment, T-Slot rails incompatible with any available accessories, table insert and slot / fence/ mitre adjustment and Dust extraction are awful. A bit like my first car it has definitely given me a list of things I must check on my next table saw Before purchase 🤣
Though it was bought a long time ago, mine is a Leigh dovetail jig. I bought the biggest, baddest, and most expensive model they had at the time. I could do full, variable spaced through dovetails in a 24” panel and so much more 😉. Had so many plans to make beautiful blanket chests and other solid hardwood furniture. In the end, it was very complex to set up and dial in, I had to purchase a secondary book to guide me, and all I got out of it was a dozen or so kitchen drawers with half-blind dovetails. I’ve been carrying it around from shop to shop for the last 30 years. I still will consider Leigh jigs, but only their simplest ones. Otherwise if I really need dovetails, I cut them by hand………. But there is the Shaper Origin, maybe …………
I have deliberately avoided buying a dovetail jig because I know that I would not use it frequently enough to remember how it works and would be back at square one each time reading the instructions. So all my drawers are made with dominos even though dovetails would be so much nicer.
Okay It's a Dremel I bought a near new flexible kit then a drill press then router table then too many bits and then a Dremel Trio with a folding handle that needs it own bits, but I don't just use it I even have set up on a table ready to go but it doesn't hahaha hiding my depression now should I sell it hmmm
I'm a big CNC guy. Built a handful of them for a small business I used to run. Happy to do drawings before projects. That said, they aren't for everyone and I no longer have one in my shop. They are good for multiples, complex surfaces, tight tolerances, or planing slabs. The Shaper Origin really interests me, and might interest you, because you can have a portable router with infinite complex templates built into it for pocketing hardware, dowel holes, bowties, etc etc.
@@10MinuteWorkshop You're damned right there, I've been a fan of the Origin since it's inception many years ago - an eye-watering 3 grand now - just not worth it ! And my worst tool, a Clarke biscuit jointer - used for three biscuits and couldn't even punt it on Gumtree, I'll add it to your pyre with the tablesaw LOL 😁😁😁
I've got a shaper origin and it does things nothing else can in my workshop, but not regularly enough to warrant the cost for me so I'll be selling it soon!
Now that’s a video I would like to see Peter. How to improve a table Saw. I have the triton work station with table saw module but I’d love to see what you could do with your saw. I at one stage had the Aldi saw with Jon heise fence plans and was impressed but it gave up here’s the triton. Please let’s see what you can do with your
I bought a 'workshop' fan on an auction site. I thought it would fit in the back wall of a garden shed and I could convert it into a spray booth. I won the auction and travelled half-way across New Zealand to collect it, ('across' it's not too far). The bloody thing was 800mm in diameter, all steel shroud - weighed about 70Kg and was rated at 11000Cfm. (Yes, eleven thousand!). After a great struggle involving 2 of us we finally got it in the shed but lying on it's side. A year later and it hasn't moved - it's now covered in seed trays, leaf rakes and plastic pots.
I love this video. What rare honesty. I have been watching Peter for years and he just gets better. I find the CNC thing exactly the same way. Quite the fad but not that useful for regular guys like me. Thanks, Peter.
I agree with you about the Lamello P2. Bought one to quicken the building of a number of cabinets. Just could not get on with it. In the end used the trusty dominos
I realise that sprayer is small and portable, but a modest compressor and decent spray gun is still quite easy to move around and will be very reliable.
Brilliant Honesty on what worked and what hasn't. I try to judge all my tools on the basis of general usage levels across projects. I love my table saw, router, planer, jointer. The Festool domino is good, but I don't use it much and every time I do, I have to re-learn or I make some stupid mistakes, so its really a useful tool but quite frustrating. My CNC is similar, in that it takes a lot of design and other work to get it to produce things and they are never quite good enough or take 3 prototype versions before I'm ready to make the final piece. In general I try to keep to simple 2D stuff on the CNC.
I started with an Earlex Paint sprayer, which is nothing more than a vacuum cleaner in reverse, then upgraded to a Fuji sprayer. Both systems are excellent. I still use the Earlex at my cabin from time to time and get great results. I have used airless sprayers before and they can be a huge pain in the ass when they don't work well. The problem is that the paint is under very high pressure which is hard on all the parts, so they would just fail more often.
My worst buy is not a bad tool but it has sat around in my garage since new after being used once in three years of ownership. It is a Festool Domino, and it was used to install 6 dominoes in its first week and has stayed in the box ever since. I only bought it because I binge-watched an almost endless stream of videos on UA-cam where this guy called Peter made fantastic bits of furniture and cabinets and other stuff with one, and so I persuaded myself that my life was incomplete without one of my own...
I'll happily take it off your hands... really fancy one but could never justify the price. Though maybe that's me falling into your same trap, having watched endless youtube videos of people using them.
@@PSD9763 Thanks for the offer, Paul. But, as Aye Captain suggests, I am going to hang onto it in the hope that one day the Domino and I hit it off and we start making beautiful furniture together!
In general I am in the same situation but I could resist so far. Now I regularly have this dream of my 89 year old me finally buys the festool domino to do his last woodworking project and than asks himself why he hasn't bought it at the age of 39.
I also purchased a Festool Domino based almost entirly from watching Peters videos - I got mine second hand after Peter made the very valid point that second hand prices of Dominos means I could buy one, use it for a year or so and then sell it for the same price I paid for it. That was the plan, however now, 2 plus years later you would need to prize it out of my cold dead hand before I ever sold it. I have made loads of cabinets and draws for my workshop and more recently for my home using 18mm sheet material and the Domino makes life so easy and acurate. I have only ever used the one cutter in it and so far only ever used 5 x 30 Dominos but I've used 100's of them over the past 2 years.
Could always be worse. I always say "I never learned anything on a good day", lol. At least you have the generosity to share this and help us all to feel a bit better about some of our learning experiences.
For someone new to woodworking as a hobby that tablesaw will be great. Fitted with a new multiplex top and diy ripfence it will take years before they grow above it’s possibilities… would switch that lutz any time with my kinzo… the other tools would be awesome to own, but probably would almost never use them, just like you.
Just chiming in a update from America.. bought a Makita saw Monday it was jacked up main post in back was bent.. Had to return it and couldn’t get an exchange.. bought a ridgid brand.. can get it to cut square at all.. fence has som wierd Allen size I don’t have.. though it might have been 5.5 mil but no luck.. This channel spoiled me by teaching me better work methods.. and now I realize how junky many products truly are..
I saw take that “table saw” outside and introduce it to thermite! I scrap, in pieces, any tool I feel is not worthy. I don’t want some else getting in trouble with it! Thanks
I have a tool box dedicated to "little used" tools, ie I don't need them cluttering up my other tool boxes. But they are all relatively small and cheap compared to yours! I just got rid of a cheap small table saw which a friend now has to chop up wood for his wood burner - yes, it was that inaccurate!
Another great video Peter. Very entertaining and educational. Enthusiasm does get the better of us sometimes. I was dead keen to get a table saw (after watching all the chaps in the US cutting everything on one). I'm sure someone has used one to cut their birthday cake. But after watching your videos, I am happy with my track saw and I think my fingers are happy with my choice. I really like your considered humour ... this time 'more table than saw'.
Re the table saw I know the feeling. I bought one boxed up & site unseen so asked to see a display model of it. The dealer said that this was the only one they had as they are not dealing with this company anymore!! For some reason I bought it anyway . It took forever to assemble & has more nuts & bolts to put it together than the Forth bridge. I hate the bloody thing!
I also bought a table saw 1,5 years ago in a rush because it was a good deal on Ebay. The saw is actually good but the dust collection is so bad that I never use it. It is a good example what can happen when things fit to 90% but the missing 10% are actually very important. Thanks for the video!
Hah! It's ironic that it was your "Playing with Spraying" videos that convinced me to by the Graco Ultramax! I've had mine for about a year now and I only use it occasionally and for small jobs. So far it's worked well for me and I'm happy with it.
I got the anniversary Zeta P2, and I love it. I use it mostly for Clamex since they're almost invisible (especially if you choose carefully the location) or for standard biscuits. I never used the Tenso connectors, because to me they seem good to replace a nailer (like to hold in place cabinet profiles, for example) but currently I do not need them. Also a nailer in the long run will probably be way cheaper and more reliable. My worst buys so far have been: - a Trend pocket hole jig, with all the bells and whistles. It literally saw no use up to day (got it almost 3 years ago). Again, having some extra money generally lead to bad purchases 😅; - a dowelling jig, fantastic piece of kit which costed me 70€ or something like that. At the time, I still had to figure out I was a "biscuits man" and tried to go with something nicer than nails and screws. I probably used that 3-4 times, just to figure out that, as Mike Pekovich says, dowels are great at "slightly misalign your work pieces". I still have mixed feeling about my Precisio CS50: it's a great tool, but more often than not I reach my TS55 instead. That's on me tho, because I probably had the wrong expectation when I bought it. I was hoping to have a small panel saw replacement, but in reality the sliding table is only for relatively small pieces. It's great to do small cabinet doors and drawers, so I guess even if I got it for the wrong reason, I was able to find a usage for it. Still not sure if it was worth the money tho. Best!
I mentioned the shonky aluminium top, the weird semi-sliding table, the terrible fence. Throw in the lousy depth of cut due to the direct-drive blade, and what else is there to say? The induction motor is nice and quiet - but then it should be! 🤷♂️
I almost would agree with you about CNC, until I began using V-Carve, it saved my cnc shop, and I couldn't be happier now. The Saw, set it on fire,,,satisfaction is worth it
Happy New Year. Not sure this counts as a tool, I bought a car on a Saturday, which blew up on the Wednesday. £2000 up the creek. Oh the joys of youth. I am glad to say that my wood working tools so far have only wasted about £10 on a small spoke shave that I just can't get on with.
I had that saw, absolutely hated it. I used the motor to make a my own table saw which I managed with for a couple of years, but don’t waste your time, just take the hit and get a decent saw. I haven’t looked back.
I've had a Zeta, along with several kits of Tenso, Clamex, etc and an Invis kit sitting in their systainers for over 5 years and they haven't seen daylight. Impulse buying can be a very bad thing! It does frustrate me that you've had issues with the Grayco as it's a tool that on paper suits a bunch of my use cases ... but when you look into it the pump "life" and the replacement cost of the pump, it makes it a very expensive alternative to aerosol cans! Something I'm considering is the about to be released Makita 270mm 40V cordless circular saw. I believe it's track compatible and (is this a stretch?) I also believe the Makita saws will run on a Festool track. Trackless the saw will cut ~100mm so it has the potential to make my Festool corded HK85 look like an expensive shelf decoration! Anyway, a bad table saw is the worst tool in the workshop ... you'll hate it till it's gone! I live in a warm climate year round now and I'm about to build a large workshop. I've recently got into the habit of sanding items and sawing sheets outside so I've decided to make the workshop an indoor/outdoor affair with cutting and sanding benches located in a way that lets nature do a lot of the DC but I still think its critical to ensure air quality in the workshop. PPE is something that I will not compromise on and I'm glad you upgraded to the Record.
Great video. About time some more youtube I know everything admit to getting stuff wrong like the rest of us. I have a small shop with adequate tools to get me started but on my list would have to be the Evolution double mitre saw and triton track saw. Track saw cut 5mm off square out of the box and after adjustment still cuts a trench!! Evolution just doesn't have enough power. Awful machine.
My worst purchase was the biscuit joiner. I've had it for years and never used it! Total waste of time and money! Why not do some kind of quiz/raffle/give-away on the saw? I'm sure there are plenty of budding woodworkers out there that can't afford a table saw would love that, I know when I was starting out I would of had it!
👍 Only when you have overcome the disappointment and embarrassment of failing can you see past your ego and teach others to learn from your mistakes. Well done.
3 for me; I have the Domino 500, and just love it. On a whim I bought the 700XL, ‘because I wanted it’ along with a load of accessories. 9 months later, having literally not used it even once.. I sold it to a very happy guy making gates, and lost about £300 or so in the process. (You’ll have to pry the 500 from my cold dead hands.) The other was at a similar point (I had some ££) I decided like you to look at spraying - bought a top flight Graco HVLP pro comp with pressure pot, and also the Graco Gx21 airless with hopper and extensions.. HVLP went straight into use, and is just superb, awesome results, easy to clean and being the big powerful one is surprisingly quick at larger areas without mess, as well as the smaller stuff. The Airless though, is about to be advertised for sale, literally unused, was a mad purchase, ideal for a decorator in empty homes but not for me. Lastly, the Mafell tracksaw that blew my mind, wonderful machine, love it to bits - decided to buy a cordless variant, just as a fabulous deal came up on the new cordless Festool so bought that - the Mafell hasn’t been used once since, despite being kept for indoor use I still reach for the festool every time. Also going to be up for sale!
Hi Peter, I'm with you on the Tenso connectors and only use them on specific joints. For me the Lamello Zeta turns into one of the best purchases I've made as soon as there's a few angled carcasses to knock out (using Clamex connectors). The huge amount of time saved in avoiding awkward clamp ups soon made me view the hefty price tag of the tool in a different light. The newer Flexus connectors have also helped out massively. Perhaps the worst thing about the Zeta is when you have to buy new stock of the connectors. Even though you try to price them into a job, the initial forking out is painful and you can't help but think you're being had over! Excellent video as usual. Cheers!
Well that is a good group. The saw table, with the fence that obviously is un-reliable. Yes I have one of another make, but aluminium top. For a time I bolt a part sheet of MDF on top. Helped but of couse didn't last as the MDF (non MR) expanded through mosture. Like you mine is a good surface to lay thing on. Space saver, not.
I feel the pain at 1minute 48seconds. Reminds me of oversized IKEA wardrobes, only ever stable when located flush to a solid wall. At least I know what toys NOT to buy.
My worst buy was the Mirka Deros. I find it annoying that you have to hold the switch while sanding and it has a clumsy connection for the vacuum cleaner. One month after the warranty expired the machine died. Everything inside was destroyed by a problem in the control electronics. The repair cost was almost equal to a new one. I was told that I was not the only one with this problem. Nevertheless, no compensation was possible. Losing €450 for a machine for your hobby does hurt. Since then I have been working with a Festool ETS EC. No more Mirka for me.
Hi AJR, I think you've been pretty unlucky with the Mirka, sounds really bad on their part. As a furniture restorer, I use mine every single day, sometimes for hours, and I have never had a problem, in three years. In fact, two of my colleagues, in separate businesses, have bought them too after seeing how mine was, and they swear by them too. The only slight bugbear is the cost of the Abranet discs, but there are cheaper alternatives, not as good. I fairness I have also used a friend's Festool, and it was first class. Anyway, you found a better machine for you.
Surely one of your most serious videos ever😉. Nobody is perfect. But buying some junk tools is not a problem. Allways buying junk tools without learning curve - that is a real problem. My first Lidl table saw was junk for some Euros just to learn what is junk - so it was worth every Euro (although it does the job for the first minor projects). Followed by an Mafell Erika from the 80's for 50(!) Euros, fantastic. It's my darling since 15 years, accurate and sexy. Not speaking from my Felder BF 6-31 which is another world of luckiness and value...
I only use the Tenso for joints I will glue I don't think they are designed to hold any weight unless they are glued and they are bit cheaper than the clamex
It’s the glue joints that started the issue - having to clamps joins that are held together with self-clamping fittings is absurd. I put in the comedy moment of the cabinet collapsing because it’s the kind of light handling - turning a cabinet from base to end - that I’d do without a second thought with a dry-fit Domino or Dowel carcass. 🤷♂️👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop I use them as I would formerly use a wood biscuit for alignment and hold while the glue dries I don't use any clamps. but I also don't move it for the first hour like any other glue-up. I don't expect the fitting to provide anything other than alignment and hold for the drying. if I want a stronger hold I use a clamax I bought the peanut connecter but I never use it I always reach for my lamello
Nice honest video mate, what about a durability test on the table saw........ tie it to the back of the van and drag it around some waste ground see how long it lasts 🤣🤣👍
Have you tried to change out the router on the computer aided machine there may be a less loud machine u may have to change out the holding head, i do believe that the learning curve on the drawing side can be real steep
I remember a video where Matthias Wandel compared a CNC machine cutting a gear vs him cutting the same gear on a band saw. I think that he reached the same conclusions as you: For one-off parts the setup time of a CNC machine is just not worth it. I think that 3D printers and CNC machines are more popular in the "maker" community. As for me, I work as a software developer as my day job so that last thing that want is even more screen time.
Really surprised at the lamello zeta. Almost bought it myself but ended up going for mafell double doweller. It was also pricey if bit less so but my logic was that dowels will be always available and also once i found a fitting that will do for flat packing all my boxes were ticked. In the event I realised that compared to lamello (or any bisquit machine) you have to be so precise that it is actually annoying so my way of doing it now is drilling one of the holes in two goes slightly off to either side of the mark therefore creating a slightly oval hole and that totally solves the problem. Lamello still easier to use in ply as the way the blade runns/cuts into the material it gives less resistance so I'm still considering a lamello too for those projects where less strog joints are fine. Oh well we can't have it all but then Mike Farrington having both made me feel less crazy for wanting it! Also it might take a while to start using a tool but they dont go off so what. I used to never use my multitool and thought of selling it but as my skillset grew eventually I started to use it regularly and I still dont use it often but when I do I would really find it difficult to use other tool/method so it was worth it in the end. (I should also say I'm a pro so different rules apply to diyers I'm sure!)
Zeta’s a great machine - badly let down by the Tenso fittings, IMHO. Had the Duo Doweller for a while, found it very hard work. Again, lovely machine, superb engineering, but a lot of coin just to put in dowels, and as you say no wiggle-room at all! 👍
Buying a no-name vac for the shop instead of buying a proper one like a Festool or similiar. Didn't fit any tools and after 3 years neither vac or parts could be found anywhere. And buying a green bosch circular saw with its flimsy plastic guiderail - I'm still surprised to have all ten fingers.
Great video, I don't think you should waste any time with that table saw, get rid & gain a bit more space. I can see your point about the CNC and the same could be applied to my 3D printer, sometimes its quicker to make a couple of parts in less time than it takes to design it and print it, but for other bits I need it's great to set it off batch printing while I get on with other stuff. Oh, and thanks for the LT Jig, very impressed 👍 👏.
Thanks! Yes, the LT jigs are a case in point; no way I could make those on my CNC in the kind of volume I need, and even prototyping them is a waste of time because the guy who does the work is just so much better at the software than I am. 👍
Wow! I had never really expected the Lamello to misperform like that. You must have been really pi$$ed off. Makes me feel not so bad about not being able to afford one now 😂
Apollo hvlp the 7700 is far superior to the airless graco. 1000x better finish. Cleaner, easy to use on small and huge jobs. If you have to paint a wall you can. I have painted hundreds of linear feet of fence with it. I have also touched up single cabinet faces. Just change a pot. Jist about any type of finishes too.
The 7700 is a spray gun - you still need a compressor or turbine - that costs as much as the self-contained Graco. The Graco was bought for one specific job where hvlp was a non-starter. 👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop i bought the graco, used it on one job and returned it to the store because of its lack of performance. the versitility of a pneumatic is essential for any labor trade. The cost of getting into specific types of tools is lowered substantially. I think a lot of small shops are completely missing the most important production tool in the market. For the price of 1 high end electric orbital, one could buy a 3, 5, and 6 pneumatic that works just as good or even better and weigh 1/2 as much and still has epic dust collection. Its just like these guys with $2k worth of overweight battery powered nail guns. $600 and they could have gotten a whole system of nailers which are faster, lighter, smaller, more adjustable and have a life of 5x to 10x of the battery operated part. Then if they needes to spray a finish, a $50 hvlp from harbor freight could give them any quality finish they could Imagine and a $300 hvlp could deliver it with speed and quality consistently day after day. They could also shoot glues for veneers. Shoot for the $2k they drop, they could have had a full set of sanders, and nailers, and a sprayer. Just doesn't make sense. The tools that are available is just endless and they can be CHEAP. I have a drill, its less then 2 inches deep on a 6 inch neck which can get in the tightest spots, the tool options are wild.
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What amazes me more is amount of tools and machine you managed to fit in your small workshop.
To that comment, I will add....the amount of work Peter does in his shop.
Great video! I have a shop full of tools I don't use. The question I now ask myself is " Do I love this tool or do I just love the idea of using this tool."
That's a great confessional. Occasionally it's good to be the example for others to learn from our pain 🙂
I had wondered what happened to the CNC, was looking forward to another series, as I am seriously contemplating one for small one-off projects like signs etc. Good to know we are not alone in mistaken purchases! My worst was also a table saw, which I gave away and replaced.
Many moons ago I bought a triton router and a UKJ router table for it for a specific project. Promptly life threw me a curve ball and so they sat unused for a number of years whilst we moved and children grew. I eventually managed to use the router to build a nice gaming table topper in the initial lockdown. I decided to finally fit the router to the table and discovered the rather expensive plate it came with had a bow to it, around 0.5mm in the middle along the long side. It turned out there was a bad batch/known issue with these plates around when I got it and I just never noticed, had I they would have exchanged it for me. The vendor assures me this will be "fine" but I can't get past knowing its bent, and they no longer sell the 6mm plates only a 10mm which to me is rather telling. I am sure I'll just get on with it one day but somewhat spendy shed ornament how every you cut it.
Runner up is a "bargain" evolution mitre saw that I saw on sale in B&Q and had to have. It can't even cut a 2x6 so the first proper job it would have been useful for I ended up with a speed square and a battery circular saw!
Dear Peter, it’s unusual for a professional to admit to mistakes as you have done. It just gives me more respect for you. When I’m debating which brand of something to buy I go to a product review site. You often find out surprising facts about a product which better informs your choice. If the model you’re interested in is not reviewed then that is reason enough to leave it alone. Cheers.
Great insight into regretful purchases I’m sure we’ve all made! Most of my worst buys have been via auction sites where I have saved maybe up to 50% off retail but then failed to account for a 2 hour round trip to collect the item, and that they normally don’t perform how they should, hence the seller selling them! I now only (mostly) buy new, and use sites like yours to give me guidance on the pros and cons of kit I’m interested in. Thanks for the informative videos, I’ve learnt a lot from you.
One of your best videos, Peter. Sharing mistakes is a great way to help others learn. It's less about the product and more about what led you to make the decisions. The last example with the eBay purchase and money burning a hole in your pocket is probably something we can all relate to. So too, the example of buying a product that is perfectly good in its own right, such as the CNC machine, and yet establishing that it isn't a big enough part of your common workflow to warrant the outlay, time spent setting up and space it takes up.
Great video. Humility like this is always great to see on a channel like yours. Thank you! 👍
Thank you! 🙌 Confession's good for the soul; now I feel cleansed enough to go out and buy that Shaper Origin I've had my eye on... 👍 😂
Think of it as community service - you buy them so we don't have to.
I don't really have any expensive regret tools, just random piles of small ones that seemed like a good idea but I don't end up using them. Worse are the small really useful tools that I have lent or misplaced, and can't find anywhere to replace. The most expensive in that vein is my habit of buying TIG welders, using them for a few years, then selling them because I'm moving and haven't used them for a while. I'm about to buy my third...
Oh, and my 285mm circular saw (10"?). Which I included in the project cost when I built a shed out of 75mm coolstore panels, but it's proved impossible to resell. Even the guy who offered $50 failed to turn up and actually buy it.
I looked at the “fan in a can” too…. Really glad I went for the box style after hearing that. It seemed ideal on paper, but always good to have a real world test to show what something is like!
Great vid, I appreciate the insight. I agree 100% on CNC as it's not right for everyone. I do have one and I keep finding new ways to use it. My worst tool purchase is a mig welder. I thought I would make metal table legs and it still remains new in box after 2 years. 300us was a great deal at the time. I should really sell it, but I can't bring myself to let go.
Thanks so much for your blatant honesty. We all get caught up in excitement or the hype of something but most guys won’t admit it.
It is a good idea cutting by using the jigsaw a few milimeters fron the scribe line and with a fee degrees of inclination, this will help you to fit the infill as close as posibles to the wall bay using the rasp.
Graco Ultra. My experience too, rubbish after the first 5 minutes. (First one replaced under warranty, second one patchy at best.) If I need to spray I use my Graco 390PC, it just works. The Ultra just sits on the shelf...
I'm wondering if the table saw is still surplus to your workflow, maybe you could consider donating it to the Men in Sheds charity workshops. I'm sure that might be a least painful and rewarding way out! Just a thought. 🤔👍😀
Long gone, and unfortunately Men’s Sheds don’t really have a presence in London. 🤷♂️👍
We all buy something that in the end turns out to be a bit of rubbish. I read the reviews on tools and this can help but it is not foolproof. I bought a biscuit joiner that cuts slots at an angle that turns out to be the opposite angle for the joining piece. It is completely useless. I can't in good conscience sell it to anyone, so it has turned out to be a live and learn. I think about welding it up and squaring it up but it is really not worth the trouble.
Hi Peter just like to add i know how you feel when you talk about the PayPal money not being real & the overwhelming auction when you seem to think you found a great price on a item & to wait for the item to arrive & after all the setup to find you purchased a dull item & especially when you have spent so much & due to size will cost you the same amount sending back will leave you being much aware next time.
So my point is we all be there mate so don't put yourself down buddy look at it as more of an experience in buying rubbish tools...
Don't feel bad about things you shouldn't have bought your not alone.I have a few locked away in Pandora's cupboard in the corner of the garage. It fills me with dread when ever I go near it, when asked iam reluctant to explain what's inside.
Those Graco Handhelds are notorious for the pump failing. Big issue is it operated as a airless but the pump internals are some sort of plastic. I had 3 painting colleagues who cursed the thing. I bought a HVLP turbine and spray gun instead. Never let me down yet
Can't win them all. Thanks for your honesty. I to don't have enough volume to have a CNC or a 3D printers. I farm those out when needed.
I lovemy Graco cordless. Its a little heavy on the wrist fully loaded but it works like a champ on trim and doors. I would NEVER use it for a full room thats just crazy talk. I do clean it and keep pump armor in it when not in use. Graco really should have included a cap to plug the port I had to 3d print one so the pump armor would not leak out
hey Peter! Give the Fuji Q5 HVLP Turbine a look over, I'm a Cabinet Maker out of canada and I've been very happy with the results of the finish and quality of the unit. I would say the graco handheld units are more of a hobbyist tool hence the attractive price point, where the Q5 is more of a serious bit of kit. when used with 3m's pps2 system it's honestly rock solid and painless to use. Be a bit more open to spray finishing and don't let poor quality tool sour your taste to the possibilities spraying offers!
I sold an old, rubbish, table saw on marketplace. I did an honest and fair description and explained my issues with the saw to the buyer. He was happy as it filled a need he had. As long as you are open your conscience should be clear when selling / giving away.
Interesting to hear about the CNC. We are just on the cusp of buying one (getting tax payments out of the way first) as we are looking at doing one off or small runs of items.
Another good video Mr M! Thanks.
Thanks Aby! For one-offs and small runs a CNC is perfect - it’s just not something I really do, and even the smaller machines like mine take up a chunk of bench space in a small workshop. 👍
I'm in Portugal and could do with a crappy table saw for cutting firewood. So just pop it in the post box. Thank you!
yep, sold my Lamello as well after about a year. Even with having both Domino's, still rely on conventional and pocket hole screws, and traditional joinery.
The only one I didn't guess was the table saw (maybe I missed those videos). I'm especially not surprised about the Lamello and the Greco. I was looking for a a spray system about the same time as you and went Fuji in the end because I was concerned about the lifetime of the pump in the Greco. The Lamello is a good looking idea but at the price it would have to be absolutely perfect in every way and it wasn't clear it was. I think you summed up the issue with CNC perfectly and the same arguments hold for 3D printers. I certainly wouldn't invest any time in that table saw, the design is fundamentally wrong and there's nothing you can do about that. Just list it honestly with the limitations it has and let the buyer decide if it's worth it.
Thanks! Yeah, though I may just pull the motor out if the saw and dump the rest! 🤷♂️👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop Just because it doesn't suit your needs doesn't mean that another person won't find use in it... They may want something relatively lightweight with a sliding table and the direct drive motor doesn't effect them in terms of precision/noise/accuracy etc...
@@fred_fred Peter is only giving his thoughts on the products, he's says throughout the video...
@@jigsey. oh yea.. totally get and understand that... Just meant that when he talked about not feeling like it was something he'd feel comfortable selling on to someone else, it might be a saw that suited someone else's needs
Agree completely except with the 3D printer part. It has been way more useful in the shop than I ever imagined it would be. Up there with my Domino. I've found so many unexpected use cases for it - vacuum hose adapters for all the tools that don't directly fit the Festool vac, dust extractor parts, flanges, all sorts of special hooks and brackets to hang tools on the wall, replacement parts for my tools (such as broken triggers and even bits of housing, gears, sprockets, motor flange adapter plates) fixtures and fittings for lights, all sorts of workholding adapters for MFT holes, shallow depth hinge spacers. And I'm relatively new to Fusion. There are people out there that have more skill and print router tables for palm routers and, complex dovetail of fingerjoint jigs, not counting all the 3D printed marking and spacing cotraptions Peter himself uses. By now I can't imagine not having a 3D printer for sop projects.
I do however agree with the CNC router part - it is a way more limited tool than a 3D printer, loud as hell, slow and makes so much dust even with a dust extractor. Even if You're good with CAD software, the price, space it takes up and how rarely it's needed - makes more sense to send the drawings to a shop that has a large and more robust and precise CNC machine and have them route the parts.
I bought the Graco Ultra after seeing your videos, didn’t need the Ultramax as I only use water based paint. I used various paints, Dulux, Tikkurila, Benjamin Moore and it was ok, then the pump went and I got it replaced under warranty. The pump went again after about a year so I bought a new pump and replaced it myself which took about 30 seconds and I started using Sayerlack paint and nothing else. What a difference using that paint has made! Great, flawless finish, it’s almost if my Graco loves it. Yeah the pump will go again and it’ll cost me £170 for a new one but it pays for itself. I treat my Graco pretty badly now, I leave it with paint sitting in it for days on end and clean it out when I feel like it but it doesn’t seem to affect its performance. It seems all the cleaning, flushing it through with water, wrapping it in cotton wool after every use wasn’t good for it. Treat it mean, keep it keen…
Interesting, thanks! Never used sayerlack, but Alastair Johnson does at over at freebird and he rates it highly. Good to know it makes the Graco happy too! 👍👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop yeah it was Alastair that recommended Sayerlack to me 👍🏻
That graco is renown for problems. Have a look at one of the "hopper" spray units, so much better!
Absolutely loving reading through all these comments!! Very apparent how everyone is different. I wouldn't be without my table saw, but it is a huge 3 metre sliding bed jobby that I got for a steal. My domino joiner however has just sat in the box so far after buying one based on watching too many youtubers! I got the Graco Ultra too based on the "playing at spraying" series and am personally pleased with it so far.
I bought my Graco after watching your series and I'm in the same boat. Pump went WAY too soon and it doesn't make any sense to replace. Waste of money in the long run
I bought a large batch of powertools from a bankruptcy auction of a construction company. Quality tools, but they hadn't been used kindly. I spent many days cleaning them up and going through all the missing parts and accessories. I like to keep my tools clean and in good shape, so eventually ended up just replacing most of them with new tools.
Oh... Peter haven't we all made terrible buys... but, we tell ourselves it looked so good and it looked like the answer to all our wood working dreams. I still think you're on the up side I could have done a video... "Oh crap why did I buy these 10 dumb tools!" Got up early this morning and watched several Track Saw videos... your tip on the Strawbyte jig... just brilliant! Keep up the good work!
Thanks! 👍
really interesting video Peter! one of my worst purchases was the old festool combination bevel for the rails. Whatever I did with it I couldn't get it accurate enough at any angle. Ended up buying a rail square from FC Tools in Scotland and that was a game changer! I believe festool have recently made a new angle stop, so clearly they didn't think the old one was much good either!
I also bought one of these on the strength of being a Festool. Could never understand how such a poor design could get past the product planners and testers at the company.
It's nice that you fussed up to your bad buys. Most guys just leave them on a shelf buried under scraps of wood and sawdust. We have always been taught in the States that European tools are always the best which is why I'm a Bosch Man but online tool sales has allowed bad tools to make it to the general population of idiots like me who want it no matter what the cost or how much room it takes up. Thank you.
Thanks James! Doctors bury their mistakes and architects plant ivy; woodworkers have them in the corner of the workshop, getting in the way, and taunting us all the time! 😂👍
Thank you, Peter. It's always reassuring to realise that many of us have access to more money than sense. I think we get afflicted with a mad kind of heat that forces us to empty our wallets and buy these really unsuitable devices !!
Good to see that bad buys are not limited to hobbyist woodworkers only! In the comments it becomes obvious that UA-cam vids play a big part in decision making and it doesn’t always turn out to be the best decisions.
I have often marvelled at the way you manage without a table saw. I don't know the Lutz but there *are* others!
I look forward to more "post-retirement" videos in 2022.
Hi Peter, thanks for your honest review on the zeta after you had it a bit. Some years ago there was a huge wave here on youtube about the zeta which made it tempting of course. Today I actually never see it used again by the initial reviewers in their projects which to me looks more like it had been a lamello-birthday-marketing run to promote it.
I also use a zeta but I more rely on the clamex and find the newer clamex flexus a very nice addition apart from the divario ( i never used).
That said, I am not a professional user but it really helped me a few times to fix wobbly furniture with fixed shelf levels or so to stiffen it up a bit.
For knock down furniture it is nice, but from a more allround approach I'd opt for a domino as it is more versatile in most cases due to the size of the connectors.
I also more use the tenso as a prefixture so that it is less cumbersome to set clamps which is also nice, but of course not what marketing tells you ;-)
THanks for the confessional. Go in peace, my son. You are absolved. Good to know I'm not the only one!
👍
As long as we learn from our mistakes. I can't say what my worse purchases are - usually the cheapest ones. Saying that my 500 quid 2001 1.2 petrol Kangoo van has been a gem, it's now starting to cost a bit to keep it roadworthy but have you seen the cost of vans at the moment!!!!
As a long-time viewer, I KNEW the table saw would top your list😄. My experience with the Graco sprayer has been similar to yours. It's totally unreliable, which, in my opinion, is the cardinal sin for a tool (or employee). Thanks for all you do!
Hi I have 2 10 inch Bosch table saw they run nicely and also have dewalt 54v portable table saw to take with me at work and is the best saw...so accurate
My worst buy was an evolution fury table saw. As you raise and lower the blade, it goes in and out of square with the fence by several degrees. For 200 quid I wasn't expecting too much quality, but I at least thought raising and lowering the blade would be within its ability
@Nathan Lucas - interested in your comments upon Evolution Fury table saw. Built to a price, but it was indeed the price (£162 in 2016) that got me into a table saw frame of mind for my diy and hobbyist interests. Mine does not suffer the alignment issue you have experienced, although the fence precision and adjustment is only just adequate. For me, this table saw has been a great enabler and I have tackled many projects that I probably would not otherwise have been interested in doing (using my circular saw). Nonetheless, I would like a better one, but it has to be portable.
@@adrianlw2750 have you got any ideas how to stop the blade twisting side to side? If I could sort that it would be perfectly adequate for most stuff I do with it. Anything that I need super precision for, I've got a cast iron bodied saw now too
@@nathanlucas6465 I have had a look at mine, and delved underneath, following your request…. It is all a pretty solidly constructed/engineered machine, and when everything is tightened as it should be, there is no free-play in my blade in any direction (slight normal blade flexing apart). You may have done various checks already (apologies if you have!) but for good measure…
With machine unplugged from mains, can I suggest four elements:
1. The green tilt-locking knob (fig.26 on page 20 of my manual) must be fully tightened. Check it hasn’t worked loose. Whilst “0” should be blade vertical, actual vertical should be checked after other checks below have been done.
2. Remove blade guard, remove the green table access plate (one screw), raise blade to highest setting, and check tightness/locking of the blade on its shaft. It should be rock-solid. Replace removed parts.
3. There are four Allen bolts, two at each end of the access plate, on the table top. Make sure these are fully secure/tightened with suitable Allen key. These secure the top pivoting point of the whole motor/blade mechanism. Again, should be rock-solid.
4. There are four further Allen bolts on table top, nearer the edges. Check for tightness, as if these are loose, the motor mechanism could unintentionally move and throw out blade alignment.
I hope this helps - and apologies again if you’ve already carried out these checks. I cannot see anything else that could be giving you the problem you have.
Wow there are some expensive tools on that list. Glad I am not the only one living with bad purchases. My worst one was a scroll saw, was not expensive but still hardly ever use it and just occupies space.
Mine too but it was given to me so I will probably give it to someone else so it can sit on their bench not being used. 😂😂
Peter, I have to agree with you on these. For instance CNC machines. If they are at all useful in a typical woodworking shop then size matters. The bigger the better, but the price goes up astronomically with size. Unless you have a monster sized shop they take up valuable space that more appropriate tools could use.
reg. Graco: for small workshops like yours and for cabinetry I would go with something with less overspray. Maybe an HVLP or an XVLP by Wagner...
I have the graco ultra cordless. It's been fantastic.
Ha ha Snap mine was also a table saw and same eBay auction scenario. Axminster TS250 PHD required for alignment, T-Slot rails incompatible with any available accessories, table insert and slot / fence/ mitre adjustment and Dust extraction are awful.
A bit like my first car it has definitely given me a list of things I must check on my next table saw Before purchase 🤣
Though it was bought a long time ago, mine is a Leigh dovetail jig. I bought the biggest, baddest, and most expensive model they had at the time. I could do full, variable spaced through dovetails in a 24” panel and so much more 😉. Had so many plans to make beautiful blanket chests and other solid hardwood furniture. In the end, it was very complex to set up and dial in, I had to purchase a secondary book to guide me, and all I got out of it was a dozen or so kitchen drawers with half-blind dovetails. I’ve been carrying it around from shop to shop for the last 30 years. I still will consider Leigh jigs, but only their simplest ones. Otherwise if I really need dovetails, I cut them by hand………. But there is the Shaper Origin, maybe …………
Ooo - shaper origin! 😯🤔😆👍
Welcome to the club Todd. I can add to that the Leigh mortise & tenon jig, used only for a couple of stools :(
I have deliberately avoided buying a dovetail jig because I know that I would not use it frequently enough to remember how it works and would be back at square one each time reading the instructions. So all my drawers are made with dominos even though dovetails would be so much nicer.
@@pcb1962 For dovetails look at Rob Cosman's videos. He has some nice and expensive tools to do them by hand. But they are perfect!
Okay It's a Dremel I bought a near new flexible kit then a drill press then router table then too many bits and then a Dremel Trio with a folding handle that needs it own bits, but I don't just use it I even have set up on a table ready to go but it doesn't hahaha hiding my depression now should I sell it hmmm
I'm a big CNC guy. Built a handful of them for a small business I used to run. Happy to do drawings before projects. That said, they aren't for everyone and I no longer have one in my shop. They are good for multiples, complex surfaces, tight tolerances, or planing slabs.
The Shaper Origin really interests me, and might interest you, because you can have a portable router with infinite complex templates built into it for pocketing hardware, dowel holes, bowties, etc etc.
Yes! Very interested in the shaper origin; just wish it didn’t cost so much! 😬
I liked it too, till i saw the price, plus it is only 2D, which is pretty obvious I know. The Trend looks stunning, but the cost is ridiculous.
@@10MinuteWorkshop You're damned right there, I've been a fan of the Origin since it's inception many years ago - an eye-watering 3 grand now - just not worth it ! And my worst tool, a Clarke biscuit jointer - used for three biscuits and couldn't even punt it on Gumtree, I'll add it to your pyre with the tablesaw LOL 😁😁😁
I've got a shaper origin and it does things nothing else can in my workshop, but not regularly enough to warrant the cost for me so I'll be selling it soon!
@@neilscrivener5011 what sorts of things does it do well? in which areas did it disappoint?
Now that’s a video I would like to see Peter. How to improve a table Saw. I have the triton work station with table saw module but I’d love to see what you could do with your saw. I at one stage had the Aldi saw with Jon heise fence plans and was impressed but it gave up here’s the triton. Please let’s see what you can do with your
I bought a 'workshop' fan on an auction site. I thought it would fit in the back wall of a garden shed and I could convert it into a spray booth. I won the auction and travelled half-way across New Zealand to collect it, ('across' it's not too far). The bloody thing was 800mm in diameter, all steel shroud - weighed about 70Kg and was rated at 11000Cfm. (Yes, eleven thousand!). After a great struggle involving 2 of us we finally got it in the shed but lying on it's side. A year later and it hasn't moved - it's now covered in seed trays, leaf rakes and plastic pots.
😂 Classic! Eleven thousand CFM! There’s be nothing left in the workshop - it’s all be outside, shredded! 🙌👍
I love this video. What rare honesty. I have been watching Peter for years and he just gets better.
I find the CNC thing exactly the same way. Quite the fad but not that useful for regular guys like me.
Thanks, Peter.
Thank you! I do the silly things so that you don't have to! 😂 👍
I agree with you about the Lamello P2. Bought one to quicken the building of a number of cabinets. Just could not get on with it. In the end used the trusty dominos
Man, i would be super bummed out by that table saw too, that sucks!
I realise that sprayer is small and portable, but a modest compressor and decent spray gun is still quite easy to move around and will be very reliable.
The Graco was bought for a specific job where a compressor and gun wasn’t an option. 👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop now I’m
curious, why a compressor and a gun wouldn’t be an option? You had to carry it somewhere with many steps and no lift?
"I'm tempted to take it outside and set alight to it!" That's brilliant 😉😆
Well, it will be for a short period while the aluminium goes up! 😂 🔥
Brilliant Honesty on what worked and what hasn't. I try to judge all my tools on the basis of general usage levels across projects. I love my table saw, router, planer, jointer. The Festool domino is good, but I don't use it much and every time I do, I have to re-learn or I make some stupid mistakes, so its really a useful tool but quite frustrating. My CNC is similar, in that it takes a lot of design and other work to get it to produce things and they are never quite good enough or take 3 prototype versions before I'm ready to make the final piece. In general I try to keep to simple 2D stuff on the CNC.
I started with an Earlex Paint sprayer, which is nothing more than a vacuum cleaner in reverse, then upgraded to a Fuji sprayer. Both systems are excellent. I still use the Earlex at my cabin from time to time and get great results. I have used airless sprayers before and they can be a huge pain in the ass when they don't work well. The problem is that the paint is under very high pressure which is hard on all the parts, so they would just fail more often.
My worst buy is not a bad tool but it has sat around in my garage since new after being used once in three years of ownership. It is a Festool Domino, and it was used to install 6 dominoes in its first week and has stayed in the box ever since. I only bought it because I binge-watched an almost endless stream of videos on UA-cam where this guy called Peter made fantastic bits of furniture and cabinets and other stuff with one, and so I persuaded myself that my life was incomplete without one of my own...
I'll happily take it off your hands... really fancy one but could never justify the price. Though maybe that's me falling into your same trap, having watched endless youtube videos of people using them.
I didn't use mine for the first several years either. Now I use it all the time. I just had to get comfortable with it. Don't sell it yet.
@@PSD9763 Thanks for the offer, Paul. But, as Aye Captain suggests, I am going to hang onto it in the hope that one day the Domino and I hit it off and we start making beautiful furniture together!
In general I am in the same situation but I could resist so far. Now I regularly have this dream of my 89 year old me finally buys the festool domino to do his last woodworking project and than asks himself why he hasn't bought it at the age of 39.
I also purchased a Festool Domino based almost entirly from watching Peters videos - I got mine second hand after Peter made the very valid point that second hand prices of Dominos means I could buy one, use it for a year or so and then sell it for the same price I paid for it. That was the plan, however now, 2 plus years later you would need to prize it out of my cold dead hand before I ever sold it. I have made loads of cabinets and draws for my workshop and more recently for my home using 18mm sheet material and the Domino makes life so easy and acurate. I have only ever used the one cutter in it and so far only ever used 5 x 30 Dominos but I've used 100's of them over the past 2 years.
Could always be worse. I always say "I never learned anything on a good day", lol. At least you have the generosity to share this and help us all to feel a bit better about some of our learning experiences.
For someone new to woodworking as a hobby that tablesaw will be great. Fitted with a new multiplex top and diy ripfence it will take years before they grow above it’s possibilities… would switch that lutz any time with my kinzo… the other tools would be awesome to own, but probably would almost never use them, just like you.
Your table saw reminds me of my mafell Erika purchase....luckily I was able to sell it off
Just chiming in a update from America.. bought a Makita saw Monday it was jacked up main post in back was bent..
Had to return it and couldn’t get an exchange.. bought a ridgid brand.. can get it to cut square at all.. fence has som wierd Allen size I don’t have.. though it might have been 5.5 mil but no luck..
This channel spoiled me by teaching me better work methods.. and now I realize how junky many products truly are..
I saw take that “table saw” outside and introduce it to thermite! I scrap, in pieces, any tool I feel is not worthy. I don’t want some else getting in trouble with it! Thanks
i felt the same about my zeta bought a standard blade now use it as a regular biscuit jointer
Yes Peter, we all make similar mistakes. The positive thing about it is, we are smarter for having done it.
Super fun ... enjoyed your honesty. Really laughed out loud. Be well.
Thank you! You too! 👍
I have a tool box dedicated to "little used" tools, ie I don't need them cluttering up my other tool boxes. But they are all relatively small and cheap compared to yours! I just got rid of a cheap small table saw which a friend now has to chop up wood for his wood burner - yes, it was that inaccurate!
Another great video Peter. Very entertaining and educational. Enthusiasm does get the better of us sometimes. I was dead keen to get a table saw (after watching all the chaps in the US cutting everything on one). I'm sure someone has used one to cut their birthday cake. But after watching your videos, I am happy with my track saw and I think my fingers are happy with my choice.
I really like your considered humour ... this time 'more table than saw'.
Re the table saw I know the feeling. I bought one boxed up & site unseen so asked to see a display model of it. The dealer said that this was the only one they had as they are not dealing with this company anymore!! For some reason I bought it anyway . It took forever to assemble & has more nuts & bolts to put it together than the Forth bridge. I hate the bloody thing!
We've all been there Peter, and no doubt will be again in the future. But its all part of the huge learning curve we call life!
I also bought a table saw 1,5 years ago in a rush because it was a good deal on Ebay. The saw is actually good but the dust collection is so bad that I never use it. It is a good example what can happen when things fit to 90% but the missing 10% are actually very important.
Thanks for the video!
Hah! It's ironic that it was your "Playing with Spraying" videos that convinced me to by the Graco Ultramax! I've had mine for about a year now and I only use it occasionally and for small jobs. So far it's worked well for me and I'm happy with it.
I got the anniversary Zeta P2, and I love it. I use it mostly for Clamex since they're almost invisible (especially if you choose carefully the location) or for standard biscuits. I never used the Tenso connectors, because to me they seem good to replace a nailer (like to hold in place cabinet profiles, for example) but currently I do not need them. Also a nailer in the long run will probably be way cheaper and more reliable.
My worst buys so far have been:
- a Trend pocket hole jig, with all the bells and whistles. It literally saw no use up to day (got it almost 3 years ago). Again, having some extra money generally lead to bad purchases 😅;
- a dowelling jig, fantastic piece of kit which costed me 70€ or something like that. At the time, I still had to figure out I was a "biscuits man" and tried to go with something nicer than nails and screws. I probably used that 3-4 times, just to figure out that, as Mike Pekovich says, dowels are great at "slightly misalign your work pieces".
I still have mixed feeling about my Precisio CS50: it's a great tool, but more often than not I reach my TS55 instead. That's on me tho, because I probably had the wrong expectation when I bought it. I was hoping to have a small panel saw replacement, but in reality the sliding table is only for relatively small pieces. It's great to do small cabinet doors and drawers, so I guess even if I got it for the wrong reason, I was able to find a usage for it. Still not sure if it was worth the money tho.
Best!
Yes, my Zeta is the anniversary model, and totally agree with you about Clamex - great connectors! 👍👍
I felt that when you talked about the depth of cut on that tablesaw. Not to mention that it fails as a functional tool.
I mentioned the shonky aluminium top, the weird semi-sliding table, the terrible fence. Throw in the lousy depth of cut due to the direct-drive blade, and what else is there to say? The induction motor is nice and quiet - but then it should be! 🤷♂️
@@10MinuteWorkshop I hope it was clear that I meant that I felt your pain. What a useless excuse for a table saw.
I almost would agree with you about CNC, until I began using V-Carve, it saved my cnc shop, and I couldn't be happier now. The Saw, set it on fire,,,satisfaction is worth it
Happy New Year. Not sure this counts as a tool, I bought a car on a Saturday, which blew up on the Wednesday. £2000 up the creek. Oh the joys of youth. I am glad to say that my wood working tools
so far have only wasted about £10 on a small spoke shave that I just can't get on with.
I had that saw, absolutely hated it. I used the motor to make a my own table saw which I managed with for a couple of years, but don’t waste your time, just take the hit and get a decent saw. I haven’t looked back.
I've had a Zeta, along with several kits of Tenso, Clamex, etc and an Invis kit sitting in their systainers for over 5 years and they haven't seen daylight. Impulse buying can be a very bad thing!
It does frustrate me that you've had issues with the Grayco as it's a tool that on paper suits a bunch of my use cases ... but when you look into it the pump "life" and the replacement cost of the pump, it makes it a very expensive alternative to aerosol cans!
Something I'm considering is the about to be released Makita 270mm 40V cordless circular saw. I believe it's track compatible and (is this a stretch?) I also believe the Makita saws will run on a Festool track. Trackless the saw will cut ~100mm so it has the potential to make my Festool corded HK85 look like an expensive shelf decoration! Anyway, a bad table saw is the worst tool in the workshop ... you'll hate it till it's gone!
I live in a warm climate year round now and I'm about to build a large workshop. I've recently got into the habit of sanding items and sawing sheets outside so I've decided to make the workshop an indoor/outdoor affair with cutting and sanding benches located in a way that lets nature do a lot of the DC but I still think its critical to ensure air quality in the workshop. PPE is something that I will not compromise on and I'm glad you upgraded to the Record.
Great video. About time some more youtube I know everything admit to getting stuff wrong like the rest of us. I have a small shop with adequate tools to get me started but on my list would have to be the Evolution double mitre saw and triton track saw. Track saw cut 5mm off square out of the box and after adjustment still cuts a trench!! Evolution just doesn't have enough power. Awful machine.
My worst purchase was the biscuit joiner. I've had it for years and never used it! Total waste of time and money!
Why not do some kind of quiz/raffle/give-away on the saw? I'm sure there are plenty of budding woodworkers out there that can't afford a table saw would love that, I know when I was starting out I would of had it!
Same here, I couldn't get on with the biscuit jointer. Now using an ancient dowling jig which I find to be functional.
👍 Only when you have overcome the disappointment and embarrassment of failing can you see past your ego and teach others to learn from your mistakes. Well done.
3 for me; I have the Domino 500, and just love it. On a whim I bought the 700XL, ‘because I wanted it’ along with a load of accessories. 9 months later, having literally not used it even once.. I sold it to a very happy guy making gates, and lost about £300 or so in the process. (You’ll have to pry the 500 from my cold dead hands.) The other was at a similar point (I had some ££) I decided like you to look at spraying - bought a top flight Graco HVLP pro comp with pressure pot, and also the Graco Gx21 airless with hopper and extensions.. HVLP went straight into use, and is just superb, awesome results, easy to clean and being the big powerful one is surprisingly quick at larger areas without mess, as well as the smaller stuff. The Airless though, is about to be advertised for sale, literally unused, was a mad purchase, ideal for a decorator in empty homes but not for me. Lastly, the Mafell tracksaw that blew my mind, wonderful machine, love it to bits - decided to buy a cordless variant, just as a fabulous deal came up on the new cordless Festool so bought that - the Mafell hasn’t been used once since, despite being kept for indoor use I still reach for the festool every time. Also going to be up for sale!
Hi Peter, I'm with you on the Tenso connectors and only use them on specific joints. For me the Lamello Zeta turns into one of the best purchases I've made as soon as there's a few angled carcasses to knock out (using Clamex connectors). The huge amount of time saved in avoiding awkward clamp ups soon made me view the hefty price tag of the tool in a different light. The newer Flexus connectors have also helped out massively.
Perhaps the worst thing about the Zeta is when you have to buy new stock of the connectors. Even though you try to price them into a job, the initial forking out is painful and you can't help but think you're being had over!
Excellent video as usual. Cheers!
Thanks! Yes, huge fan of the Clamex, especially on bevels, as you say - but yes, re-sticking is a painful experience! 👍
Well that is a good group. The saw table, with the fence that obviously is un-reliable. Yes I have one of another make, but aluminium top. For a time I bolt a part sheet of MDF on top. Helped but of couse didn't last as the MDF (non MR) expanded through mosture. Like you mine is a good surface to lay thing on. Space saver, not.
I feel the pain at 1minute 48seconds. Reminds me of oversized IKEA wardrobes, only ever stable when located flush to a solid wall. At least I know what toys NOT to buy.
My worst buy was the Mirka Deros. I find it annoying that you have to hold the switch while sanding and it has a clumsy connection for the vacuum cleaner. One month after the warranty expired the machine died. Everything inside was destroyed by a problem in the control electronics. The repair cost was almost equal to a new one. I was told that I was not the only one with this problem. Nevertheless, no compensation was possible. Losing €450 for a machine for your hobby does hurt. Since then I have been working with a Festool ETS EC. No more Mirka for me.
Hi AJR, I think you've been pretty unlucky with the Mirka, sounds really bad on their part. As a furniture restorer, I use mine every single day, sometimes for hours, and I have never had a problem, in three years. In fact, two of my colleagues, in separate businesses, have bought them too after seeing how mine was, and they swear by them too. The only slight bugbear is the cost of the Abranet discs, but there are cheaper alternatives, not as good. I fairness I have also used a friend's Festool, and it was first class. Anyway, you found a better machine for you.
Fantastic video, full of wisdom, thanks Peter
Surely one of your most serious videos ever😉. Nobody is perfect. But buying some junk tools is not a problem. Allways buying junk tools without learning curve - that is a real problem. My first Lidl table saw was junk for some Euros just to learn what is junk - so it was worth every Euro (although it does the job for the first minor projects). Followed by an Mafell Erika from the 80's for 50(!) Euros, fantastic. It's my darling since 15 years, accurate and sexy. Not speaking from my Felder BF 6-31 which is another world of luckiness and value...
same for my x carve,, big ideas but a pain in practice..
I only use the Tenso for joints I will glue I don't think they are designed to hold any weight unless they are glued and they are bit cheaper than the clamex
It’s the glue joints that started the issue - having to clamps joins that are held together with self-clamping fittings is absurd. I put in the comedy moment of the cabinet collapsing because it’s the kind of light handling - turning a cabinet from base to end - that I’d do without a second thought with a dry-fit Domino or Dowel carcass. 🤷♂️👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop I use them as I would formerly use a wood biscuit for alignment and hold while the glue dries I don't use any clamps. but I also don't move it for the first hour like any other glue-up. I don't expect the fitting to provide anything other than alignment and hold for the drying. if I want a stronger hold I use a clamax I bought the peanut connecter but I never use it I always reach for my lamello
Nice honest video mate, what about a durability test on the table saw........ tie it to the back of the van and drag it around some waste ground see how long it lasts 🤣🤣👍
Cheers Dan! That might be an option! Or thermite, as someone suggested earlier! 💥😂👍
Have you tried to change out the router on the computer aided machine there may be a less loud machine u may have to change out the holding head, i do believe that the learning curve on the drawing side can be real steep
I remember a video where Matthias Wandel compared a CNC machine cutting a gear vs him cutting the same gear on a band saw. I think that he reached the same conclusions as you: For one-off parts the setup time of a CNC machine is just not worth it.
I think that 3D printers and CNC machines are more popular in the "maker" community. As for me, I work as a software developer as my day job so that last thing that want is even more screen time.
Really surprised at the lamello zeta. Almost bought it myself but ended up going for mafell double doweller. It was also pricey if bit less so but my logic was that dowels will be always available and also once i found a fitting that will do for flat packing all my boxes were ticked. In the event I realised that compared to lamello (or any bisquit machine) you have to be so precise that it is actually annoying so my way of doing it now is drilling one of the holes in two goes slightly off to either side of the mark therefore creating a slightly oval hole and that totally solves the problem. Lamello still easier to use in ply as the way the blade runns/cuts into the material it gives less resistance so I'm still considering a lamello too for those projects where less strog joints are fine. Oh well we can't have it all but then Mike Farrington having both made me feel less crazy for wanting it! Also it might take a while to start using a tool but they dont go off so what. I used to never use my multitool and thought of selling it but as my skillset grew eventually I started to use it regularly and I still dont use it often but when I do I would really find it difficult to use other tool/method so it was worth it in the end. (I should also say I'm a pro so different rules apply to diyers I'm sure!)
Zeta’s a great machine - badly let down by the Tenso fittings, IMHO. Had the Duo Doweller for a while, found it very hard work. Again, lovely machine, superb engineering, but a lot of coin just to put in dowels, and as you say no wiggle-room at all! 👍
Buying a no-name vac for the shop instead of buying a proper one like a Festool or similiar. Didn't fit any tools and after 3 years neither vac or parts could be found anywhere. And buying a green bosch circular saw with its flimsy plastic guiderail - I'm still surprised to have all ten fingers.
Great video, I don't think you should waste any time with that table saw, get rid & gain a bit more space. I can see your point about the CNC and the same could be applied to my 3D printer, sometimes its quicker to make a couple of parts in less time than it takes to design it and print it, but for other bits I need it's great to set it off batch printing while I get on with other stuff. Oh, and thanks for the LT Jig, very impressed 👍 👏.
Thanks! Yes, the LT jigs are a case in point; no way I could make those on my CNC in the kind of volume I need, and even prototyping them is a waste of time because the guy who does the work is just so much better at the software than I am. 👍
Wow! I had never really expected the Lamello to misperform like that. You must have been really pi$$ed off. Makes me feel not so bad about not being able to afford one now 😂
Other people seem really happy with it, so I’m assuming it’s me; worth it for the Clamex though! 💪👍
Apollo hvlp the 7700 is far superior to the airless graco. 1000x better finish. Cleaner, easy to use on small and huge jobs. If you have to paint a wall you can. I have painted hundreds of linear feet of fence with it. I have also touched up single cabinet faces. Just change a pot. Jist about any type of finishes too.
The 7700 is a spray gun - you still need a compressor or turbine - that costs as much as the self-contained Graco. The Graco was bought for one specific job where hvlp was a non-starter. 👍
@@10MinuteWorkshop i bought the graco, used it on one job and returned it to the store because of its lack of performance. the versitility of a pneumatic is essential for any labor trade. The cost of getting into specific types of tools is lowered substantially. I think a lot of small shops are completely missing the most important production tool in the market. For the price of 1 high end electric orbital, one could buy a 3, 5, and 6 pneumatic that works just as good or even better and weigh 1/2 as much and still has epic dust collection. Its just like these guys with $2k worth of overweight battery powered nail guns. $600 and they could have gotten a whole system of nailers which are faster, lighter, smaller, more adjustable and have a life of 5x to 10x of the battery operated part. Then if they needes to spray a finish, a $50 hvlp from harbor freight could give them any quality finish they could Imagine and a $300 hvlp could deliver it with speed and quality consistently day after day. They could also shoot glues for veneers. Shoot for the $2k they drop, they could have had a full set of sanders, and nailers, and a sprayer. Just doesn't make sense. The tools that are available is just endless and they can be CHEAP. I have a drill, its less then 2 inches deep on a 6 inch neck which can get in the tightest spots, the tool options are wild.