Thanks for watching everyone! As many of you rightfully noted, I was a bit premature on the end of the current Camaro. As for the rest, be sure to read the story for more technical information and additional driving impressions: www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a44675712/2024-ford-mustang-dark-horse-drive/
Why worry about facts and details Carlso? And why would the 6th Gen Camaro "not exist anymore" because GM decided to end production? Are you telling me someone is coming for my 6th Gen SS 1LE and they are going to crush it and all others? Not good and I'd still not own a mustnag.
well when youre so much better than your competitors, even when theyre significantly faster on track, and they go out of production because of it leaving you alone in the segment you can charge whatever the hell you want.
As a Camaro guy, I’d love to get one of these in a few years, as it’s really grown on me. But these prices are getting insane, especially while there’s supposedly going to be a Shelby coming as a 2026 model. (Yes, I know I should get the Camaro but it’ll be harder to find one speced the way I’d like it)
I’m a mustang guy, and when I saw this new dark horse replace the mach1- which was a beautiful car, btw- I put in an order for a ZL1 1LE. But I just heard back from Chevy and they canceled my order 🙃 so now, I guess it’ll be this ugly mug
I was hoping that Ford would have given us a lighter street legal version of the Mustang let’s say a perf. pack 2, 300 to 400 lbs lighter in the 3500-3600 lbs range. But still good job and thank’s to Ford for keeping the V8 Mustang alive.
Carlos is the best reviewer hands down! Car is killer, but that price? Crazy how times have changed. My first brand new Mustang GT 1985 loaded $12.6k out the door. In 2013 I purchased a Mustang GT Premium with the Brembo brakes, $32K out the door. Now a Dark horse loaded and with dealer mark-ups, $70-$80k? I would only buy used if and ever used prices come back to reality.
The average new car price in 1985 was around $11,000... so by comparison your 85 Mustang GT would've cost about $55k in today's money. That's about what a loaded 7th Gen GT would cost today. The average new car price in 2013 was about $31,000. In today's money your 2013 GT Premium would've cost $49,500 - again, right in line with what you'd pay for a 7th Gen GT. Car prices are in fact, "in line with reality"... salaries just haven't kept pace with inflation which is why everything else "seems" so expensive. All that aside, I'm really impressed with new Mustang, but I'm not in any rush to sell my 2020 Camaro LT1 6-speed. If I was buying a 7th Gen Mustang, I'd want a no-option bare-bones basic GT with the manual...but giving up my TR6060 for an MT82 seems like a step backwards. And if I had "Dark Horse" money, I'd just buy a Camaro ZL1 (while supplies last).
@Glibzer no i mean lets say ur accelerating from second or thrid gear . U can feel when u reach 7 k that the acceleration force has stopped. Maybe it has to do with my 3.55 ratio on an eu performance pack gt
@Glibzer no i mean lets say ur accelerating from second or thrid gear . U can feel when u reach 7 k that the acceleration force has stopped. Maybe it has to do with my 3.55 ratio on an eu performance pack gt
It's disappointing to hear that the front end of this car is vague and uncommunicative like reviews for the GT mentioned. Trying to guess what the front end is doing while on track is not a good time.
@dennishilligoss7386 you don't have to be an accomplished driver to appreciate the benefit of a car that communicates what the front wheels are doing well. Cars with a lack of feel are less confidence inspiring and not as satisfying in my opinion
Always look forward to your reviews, Carlos! I love the blue Dark Horse. I always preferred the Camaro over the Mustang but this is another Mustang I wouldn't mind having! With the manual of course.
@@gigi9467 Yea, the SS 1LE or the ZL1 1LE are some of the best sports cars for the money! The Alpha chassis was such a win for Chevy. I think they use the Alpha chassis for the new Cadillac CT5-V Blackwing, which is probably why it's so damn good, even as a 4 door sedan!
@ornsteinoftheabyss, You would be correct, Sir!! I keep saying it…when GM built the 6th Gen “Tracky” Camaro, they built A MASTERPIECE!! This is objectively true. There’s no way a muscle car gets to *also be a legit sports car, but GM did it..👍
@@bird-man4022 It is truly a shame that the Camaro is going away. It has been the best rivalry to the Mustang and one of the best looking cars Chevy ever made, next to the Vette. I really hope they don't taint the name and turn it into an SUV like Ford did with the Mustang.
It’s called evolution. We’re moving forward. Things do change, and not stay the same. Same with this car. We all love it to be the same old mustang we remembered, but the technology has changed. Instead of complaining, we should embrace it and enjoy it for what it is. I personally like it.
About that redline/limiter thing: Some owners will, indeed, take advantage of that extra room on the tach. No doubt there will be several aftermarket options to address that. It also seems the steering "improvements" that are on all the versions, which seems like the right approach, took some of the feel out, the opposite of what it sounds like they were going for. I would think, too, some of the other issues are software related and will be worked out when it hits the streets. Monumental effort, though, and ecstatic it even exists!
The steering is perfectly where it should be feel wise. Have fun knuckling the steering wheel every drift or hard corner. U ppl never been to a track in your life.
70-80k for a 2 door pony car that weighs 3,975 (!) and is slower than my C6 vette which has the venerable LS3 and TR-6060 and weighs 750lbs less that we bought for 27k with 11k miles. Seriously, I don't get the appeal but I applaud Ford for making an honest-to-goodness V8 with a MT.
The Camaro’s rear visibility is crap, but that Alpha Platform is just unbeatable. I’ve driven a standard v6 RS from Enterprise rental and modified SS (750hp) in San Francisco last year. Rented from Hertz. Drove from San Francisco to Napa. I couldn’t see anything out the back window, but the Camaro was absolutely planted to the road. I touched 130mph several times. A Dodge TRX kept testing me on that uphill pull after the Bay Bridge. He didn’t know I had some extra juice. 😂 Also, coming back one of them darn CHiPs officers on a Harley rolled up next to me and gave me the look-“I’m watching you.” I want to say, “Let’s Go” so bad. 😂
I've heard the same about the steering feel. Why would it be lacking? Why would Ford continue to make a car that has a numb feeling to the steering? As sensual as this car is, it's amazing to me that they haven't gone for the throat on that aspect of it. Think about it- the sound of the car is amazing. It's a visually appealing car- beautiful. The smell of leather, rubber, gas- F-me! Love it! Somehow they either didn't or forgot that the feel from the road is just as important as the other things a driving enthusiast loves about a sports car. Good job, Ford, but ya could'a been awesome, is what it sounds like.
@@X2AstroFN Look at a 1965 Mustang fastback. The curvy rear quarter panels were already there. In 1967 they were made wider and more sculpted, then in 1969 they were made even wider and boxier. The 2024 Mustang looks based off the 1967 Mustang Fastback.
What makes the mustang a better driver’s car is outward visibility, you don’t feel like you’re in a pill box. Plus the car has good lines, it’s a classic shape. I still prefer 6th gen mustang design. The new one’s front and rear design is a little divisive for me.
Thank God we got some real Mustang enthusiast in this chat and not some Ford ball washers . And hell yes the Shelby GT350 and MACH 1 are better in so many ways.
Dark Horse Premium with manual transmission, the handling pack and Recaros is $71,505. The Camaro ZL1 comes with Recaros, its standard suspension and 1LE SS are the same, and its $69,995. Go to the ZL1 1LE and its $77,495. So for less money than the Dark Horse you get 650hp and a 3907lbs curb weight or for $6000 more than the Dark Horse Premium wiht handling and Recaros you get 650hp, 3853lbs curb weight and way more car overall. How does one on still go Camaro here? And while you can still buy an SS 1LE for under $50,000, you can throw on a cold air intake and a dyno tune and turn that 460hp near that 500hp mark and still come out way cheaper and lighter than the Dark Horse.
The reasons you outlined is exactly why I bought my 2020 Camaro LT1 6-speed when I was cross-shopping Mustang/Challenger. The Camaro is a better overall value.
The Darkhorse Looks alright I need to see it in person. it's only 500hp though. my charger hellcat would blow it doors off. for 60k it would be a good value
FYI the print article refers incorrectly to "Vapor Blue" as the darker color that mutes that accents (confusing with Dark Ember, which is the dark blue offered in the '24). Vapor Blue is the bondo clearcoat, err, light gray/kinda not really blue color offering.
Just checked the consumer site and it looks correct to me. Vapor Blue Metallic is the darker, somewhat hue-shifting blue. I don't see Dark Ember; did you mean Dark Matter?
I must be gettting old because it looks like a modern Camero. and it doesnt have that muscle car feeling with the big touch screens. I hope Shellby, Steeda, Hennessey, Roush, can give it some more muscle car feel.
The fuel cutoff for my 22 GT is 7300 rpm and the gauge goes to 8. The GT350 had a special analogue gauge that went to 9k. Maybe they're going to do a new 350 with digital dash and want to keep it the same as the GT dash? Unlikely. also when modified these coyotes went over 8K rpm so youd have to have a seperate gauge to read the rpm so this could help that scenario.
Are you 100% positive on the fuel cutoff for the 22. 2018 and up should have 7400 rpm fuel cutoff. Unless tuned, that is the stock hard limiter on the s550.
Thats a properly done limiter...if youre waiting for redline you're gonna miss it, as drag racers we always put the shift indicator 200-300rpm below actual redline....especially in 1st or 2nd where the revs build fast.
Been hearing that in every review so far that the end feeling is almost gone. I just don't understand why they do that. I want to feel everything going on. Some of us above average drivers want that back!
Have a 2022 Camaro SS today and a had 2020 Bullitt a couple years back, BTW both Manual!!! Love the new screens in the Dark horse and the colors ... but in reality its the TREMEC that makes all the difference if you haven't had the chance... I like the Ford inside with all the bells and whistles, but the Camaro drives so much better (Transmission). This may be the mix we all needed!!!
The 1LE does exist and it's ok to say it feels more nimble to drive on the track than a mustang that costs +$20k more. Most people don't buy brand new cars. Used cars are a thing for much cheaper.
They need to have a package that does NOT have that big screen up front - I absolutely hate it! It looks like trash....I would rather have a gauge cluster than that crappy looking screen. Probably one smaller screen would be way better. I can't be the only one that thanks the large screen is crap. I love my 14GT and will probably just get the engine built before buying this Camaro/Mustang hybrid. The only thing I like about it is the Engine but I hear it's not tunable except by Company's Ford has chosen to mod it. Which makes me more likely to just refresh my vehicle.
Love the digital dash big time, makes the inside pop like driving in a space aged cockpit, it's about time Ford put some excitement inside the mustang finally.
O.M.G. that screen is simply shit! It's not mustang ! If pussy people want to play with digital screens...instead of driving a real car....go to Teslas......Don't buy a Mustang!.....
@georgemerusi299, I would love to see that matchup! Afterwards, I’d like to see the Darkhorse vs the 6th Gen SS1LE, given it laid down a slightly faster track time than the Z28, and it’s lighter weight.
So depressing. These cars are going away and the last few years we have left to try and grab one, all the dealers are price gouging the hell out of everything, making them unobtainable for many.
Great video...not necessarily a Ford fan but a V8 that revs to over 7K is never a bad thing. I know it's been a while, but Carlos was a great addition to the team, always enjoy his content. Keep the great vids coming!
All that heritage - washed away. Lost in a sea of digital wizardry. Goodbye Mustang, you were my first car _and_ my first broken heart. You cost me four girlfriends, two and half jobs and a copious amount of money as a teenager. Thank you for the fond memories. You will be sorely missed. Stay classy my friends.
All things change. Get over it or get left behind. It was time to leave the past behind and look toward the future. We're on the 7th generation for crying out loud. The whole retro themed styling is tired.
@@tri3pleagent The whole car is a legacy of the past. It's a heavy ass V8 manual. It is retro. Look toward the future? This thing will be no more here very soon.
@@ianstallings that's an over-simplification if I've ever heard one. I think you know that, too. I'm talking specifically about elements of design and styling, especially for the interior.
I have always loved LOVED the Mustang! Would never own one, but God I love its ruckus-ness. 😍 You posted up an amazing review and presented the car very well. Thank you!
The interior is so disconnected from past Mustang evolution in design. Could be a Kia, Hyundai who knows. Such an opportunity and history to build on and this seems to have fallen short.
I just can’t pay $75k for a dressed up Mustang GT Premium, when the Mustang GT500 used to sell at that price. I know vehicles are getting more expensive, but why would I buy a Mustang over a C8 Corvette? I’ve owned 6 Stangs with the years being between 03-2017, and I’m not sure if I could buy another because of the price.
The final nail in the coffin for internal combustion will be when electric cars finally go lightweight. Still...people get rid of cars every 3 to 5 years, where are all those toxic batteries going to? yunkyard? fumes, ground pollution? I'm glad a few manufacturers are investigating alternative fuels to keep internal combustion running.
But how will they make them lightweight. Those battery packs weigh more than most cars in itself. Maybe in 20 years, but I'm thinking the ICE will have made a comeback by then.
Okay, First of all the beginning drone shot of this video I swear I was looking at a Camaro . Second of all This Mustang was half ass done . Ford is acting like this Mustang is the biggest thing ever , Us as Mustang enthusiasts see right through this crap it's a S550 and a 1/2 , ECU locked, over-the-air updates Ford monitoring, not tunnable, voiding the warranty if tampered with. Ford is hand and hand with EPA . So why are you trying to sell this car so hard to us? It's not like the 2020 Shelby GT500 which was a total redesign. Now if you want to talk about some incredible engineering the GT500 is where its at . GOOD JOB FORD I will give you that 👍 No half ass job on that Mustang or MACH 1. Ask yourself what predominantly age group buys Performance Mustangs 21 to 30 NO 35 to 50 YES . This Mustang will never do what Dodge has done to grab the younger generation with the Hellcats, the Demons and so on. You don't always have to kiss the Ford ring to be a Ford fan .
The Dark Horse R pricing starts at 147KUSD, wow that's just crazy bonkers! God, you can get a base C8 Z06 for 107K or a fully equipped ZL1 package for just 128K!
Oh people are lol, the average person can’t afford the dark horse and the price is going to rise a lil every year on top of the already hefty price tag
I agree that the presenter gave the wrong reasons and connecting rods do not bring greater power. The dual air intake 80mm throttle bodies compared to previous generation single throttle body produces more air which enables more fuel to be supplied and as a result more power combined with a longer duration exhaust cam to help get out the extra air. Added to this there is an oil pan to reduce windage losses and a new left side exhaust manifolf to improve flow.
Yeah, a better explanation would've been something like they provided durability for the tune that gave it more power, or something like that. I was pretty ragged by the end of the day and could've been more accurate with word choice.
@@CarlosLago Having listened again to your explanation you were comparing the 480hp GT engine to the 500hp engine so the normal GT had the upgrade from previous gen Coyote engine due to the reasons I gave. However the reasons for the upgrade and difference between the Dark Horse 500hp engine and the Mustang GT 480 engine were not only engine tune. Road and Track in one of their articles mentioned the Dark horse engine in comparison has a stronger new crankshaft (again not power producing), forged connecting rods (not power producing), and new camshafts which are definitely power producing and probably the main reason.
Driver might be too physically large to fit in the C8. I’m feeling claustrophobic in my new 3LT C8 coupe with sport seats even though my previous 3 LT C7 felt quite roomy with the upgraded cushy seats. That’s what brought me to the mustang corral.
Personally I don't like the spoiler which I think spoils the lines of the car. Can you say at what speed you have to go before it has any effect? I still prefer my S550 especially the interior and instrument binnacle etc. Really helpful review thanks.
"But that car doesn't really exist anymore." Sure it does. The Camaro is still being produced, and it'll continue production into early 2024. I know because I just bought a new 1LE. So yes, a comparison between the two cars would definitely be relevant.
@karlhungus8946,, EXACTLY!! I’ll keep saying it..Our cars with Alpha chassis + 1LE Track Pack is a masterpiece. TBH, I want to see the Dark Horse manual (vs) SS1LE manual “head 2 head” on track. I’m willing to bet the difference between the two won’t be more than 2 seconds. We’re talking $45k for the Camaro (vs) $60-$70k for the new Mustang Dark Horse. Would track times and the “driving experience” justify the price difference?
I've done nothing but collect as many ICE engines as possible fer the last 10 years- I'm with you on the bittersweet end - 11' 5.0 Boss/ 15' ZO6/21' 392 Rubicon/ 22' TRX - maybe time fer one more 25' ZR1 perhaps
It will be interesting to see if this car (with the sticky Trofeos) will finally beat and be as durable as a Gen6 SS 1LE on the road course. Ford has kept throwing iterations at the SS 1LE and keeps coming up short while also being significantly more expensive than the Camaro.
@@brucetumblinjr7980forget about the Mach 1 , go to Throttle House lap times, Camaro ss 1le is even faster than a GT500 around a track. There is a reason why we never saw a single same day auto vs auto or manual vs manual ss 1le and mach 1 comparison. Give both cars the same tires, Camaro is clearly faster around a track. Ford never let that comparison happened, same goes for the regular GT350. Again Ford did not want that comparison done also. All we have is different day different track environment CarandDriver lap times, which does not reflect same day comparison. Hack that Mach1 even put down faster times than a GT350R 😂 which is not even possible.
I had considered buying one. After inspecting the fit and finish of several, at different dealerships. I elected not to buy! There were uneven body gaps, paint issues and an apparent lack of quality control. Instead, I purchased a Lexus LC500 coupe.
I am not a Ford person but once he said Recaro seats I changed my mind about Stangs. See I was in a very bad accident in '21 and was almost killed in a '19 ZL1. The Recaro Seats with all the nanny electronics saved my life and I got out with a busted left heel and fractured tibia. Let's just say I can piss a lot of metal detectors. Give me Recaro seats in this bad boy and I can be alright.
There are some that just have to have the “latest” of whatever. This car isn’t fundamentally better than the 16-21 GT350, which precludes me from even being curious. The move from S197 to S550 was big and deserved attention. This is just a new interior. Sorry Ford, I think you swung and missed.
Thanks for watching everyone! As many of you rightfully noted, I was a bit premature on the end of the current Camaro. As for the rest, be sure to read the story for more technical information and additional driving impressions: www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a44675712/2024-ford-mustang-dark-horse-drive/
Great review Carlos!!
Why worry about facts and details Carlso? And why would the 6th Gen Camaro "not exist anymore" because GM decided to end production? Are you telling me someone is coming for my 6th Gen SS 1LE and they are going to crush it and all others? Not good and I'd still not own a mustnag.
Best thing about the Dark Horse is it comes with an engine and not a motor!
Well said
$76k for a 5.0 never thought I'd see the day Ford is smoking crack
It'll be $90k at the dealer
The price isn't as confusing as it somehow manages to weigh 3900 lbs. It should easily be 200 lbs lighter.
@@JFinnsit is 4000 lbs in automatic not 3900 lbs.
well when youre so much better than your competitors, even when theyre significantly faster on track, and they go out of production because of it leaving you alone in the segment you can charge whatever the hell you want.
@@kahless0173😂😂😂
I will stick with my 2014 GT500!!😎
Just wondering what year did you get it?
@@FastFrank1408 2017
@@drfaticus cool. How much was it.
@@FastFrank1408 62K with less than 3500 miles on it
I'd never let go of that. Easily one of the top 3 best mustangs ever made.
As a Camaro guy, I’d love to get one of these in a few years, as it’s really grown on me. But these prices are getting insane, especially while there’s supposedly going to be a Shelby coming as a 2026 model. (Yes, I know I should get the Camaro but it’ll be harder to find one speced the way I’d like it)
Unfortunately soon you won’t be able to buy a new Camaro at all, let alone one in the correct spec
As a Camaro guy, you should stick to Camaros, as a car guy you should get whatever your heart desires.
@Chris-wt4qj😐
I’m a mustang guy, and when I saw this new dark horse replace the mach1- which was a beautiful car, btw- I put in an order for a ZL1 1LE. But I just heard back from Chevy and they canceled my order 🙃 so now, I guess it’ll be this ugly mug
@@jp23x Camaros are gone from production again..
I was hoping that Ford would have given us a lighter street legal version of the Mustang let’s say a perf. pack 2, 300 to 400 lbs lighter in the 3500-3600 lbs range. But still good job and thank’s to Ford for keeping the V8 Mustang alive.
yep, it's a bit of a pig and it looks like Ford stole the front clip off the Honda Civic/Accord. 🤣
The GT3 they've been teasing will probably be a lot lighter but I assume the cost will be outrageous.
To make it lighter just remove the back seats, trunk plastic, and carpet. Voila!
@@TML34 Yep, it is heavy, but not like the OUTGOING Camaro or Challenger.
Hard to do with all the "safety" the government mandates it must have.
Carlos is the best reviewer hands down! Car is killer, but that price? Crazy how times have changed. My first brand new Mustang GT 1985 loaded $12.6k out the door. In 2013 I purchased a Mustang GT Premium with the Brembo brakes, $32K out the door. Now a Dark horse loaded and with dealer mark-ups, $70-$80k? I would only buy used if and ever used prices come back to reality.
The average new car price in 1985 was around $11,000... so by comparison your 85 Mustang GT would've cost about $55k in today's money. That's about what a loaded 7th Gen GT would cost today. The average new car price in 2013 was about $31,000. In today's money your 2013 GT Premium would've cost $49,500 - again, right in line with what you'd pay for a 7th Gen GT. Car prices are in fact, "in line with reality"... salaries just haven't kept pace with inflation which is why everything else "seems" so expensive. All that aside, I'm really impressed with new Mustang, but I'm not in any rush to sell my 2020 Camaro LT1 6-speed. If I was buying a 7th Gen Mustang, I'd want a no-option bare-bones basic GT with the manual...but giving up my TR6060 for an MT82 seems like a step backwards. And if I had "Dark Horse" money, I'd just buy a Camaro ZL1 (while supplies last).
Agreed. For the price of this car, fix the front end!
That's a little like comparing apples to oranges. Price a speced out GT premium, not a Dark Horse.
you are the only reviewer who is bringing the soft limiter issue and i find it very true. i feel it very well in the 5.0 S550 manual too!
I don't seem to have this issue on my 2020.
I think its only because launch control is enabled, i see the LC i. The bottom
@Glibzer no i mean lets say ur accelerating from second or thrid gear . U can feel when u reach 7 k that the acceleration force has stopped. Maybe it has to do with my 3.55 ratio on an eu performance pack gt
@Glibzer no i mean lets say ur accelerating from second or thrid gear . U can feel when u reach 7 k that the acceleration force has stopped. Maybe it has to do with my 3.55 ratio on an eu performance pack gt
It's disappointing to hear that the front end of this car is vague and uncommunicative like reviews for the GT mentioned. Trying to guess what the front end is doing while on track is not a good time.
same. I was hoping the Dark Horse wouldn't have the same issue. Deal breaker for me, but still a cool car
That’s assuming your as an accomplished driver as the C/D driver
@dennishilligoss7386 you don't have to be an accomplished driver to appreciate the benefit of a car that communicates what the front wheels are doing well. Cars with a lack of feel are less confidence inspiring and not as satisfying in my opinion
@@wadesloanexactly! There is no excuse for this flaw
It’s also one opinion. Every other review has stated otherwise.
Always look forward to your reviews, Carlos! I love the blue Dark Horse. I always preferred the Camaro over the Mustang but this is another Mustang I wouldn't mind having! With the manual of course.
Thanks!
It loos like the camaro and the camaro has real sport car chops
@@gigi9467 Yea, the SS 1LE or the ZL1 1LE are some of the best sports cars for the money! The Alpha chassis was such a win for Chevy. I think they use the Alpha chassis for the new Cadillac CT5-V Blackwing, which is probably why it's so damn good, even as a 4 door sedan!
@ornsteinoftheabyss,
You would be correct, Sir!!
I keep saying it…when GM built the 6th Gen “Tracky” Camaro, they built A MASTERPIECE!!
This is objectively true.
There’s no way a muscle car gets to *also be a legit sports car, but GM did it..👍
@@bird-man4022 It is truly a shame that the Camaro is going away. It has been the best rivalry to the Mustang and one of the best looking cars Chevy ever made, next to the Vette. I really hope they don't taint the name and turn it into an SUV like Ford did with the Mustang.
It’s called evolution. We’re moving forward. Things do change, and not stay the same. Same with this car. We all love it to be the same old mustang we remembered, but the technology has changed. Instead of complaining, we should embrace it and enjoy it for what it is. I personally like it.
Nah. Hard pass on all these stupid screens. I'd just but used.
IMO the rivalry between the Camaro and Mustang made both of them better.
I did "no lift shift" on my 88 LX 5.0 after installed a centerforce clutch, Hurst shifter, and HD trans! It banged hard with the 3.55s in the read
About that redline/limiter thing: Some owners will, indeed, take advantage of that extra room on the tach. No doubt there will be several aftermarket options to address that. It also seems the steering "improvements" that are on all the versions, which seems like the right approach, took some of the feel out, the opposite of what it sounds like they were going for. I would think, too, some of the other issues are software related and will be worked out when it hits the streets. Monumental effort, though, and ecstatic it even exists!
The steering is perfectly where it should be feel wise. Have fun knuckling the steering wheel every drift or hard corner. U ppl never been to a track in your life.
Your my favorite car journalism. Man you have such a trustworthy vibe.
I'm a simple man. I see Carlos, I watch and upvote.
I do like that Blue, looks similar to 'Shark Blue' on my Porsche 911. Mustang looks muscular and ready for action. 😎
As a Shelby and GT3 owner.. I agree.
What an incredible and bittersweet review! Great job, Carlos!
70-80k for a 2 door pony car that weighs 3,975 (!) and is slower than my C6 vette which has the venerable LS3 and TR-6060 and weighs 750lbs less that we bought for 27k with 11k miles. Seriously, I don't get the appeal but I applaud Ford for making an honest-to-goodness V8 with a MT.
The Camaro’s rear visibility is crap, but that Alpha Platform is just unbeatable. I’ve driven a standard v6 RS from Enterprise rental and modified SS (750hp) in San Francisco last year. Rented from Hertz. Drove from San Francisco to Napa. I couldn’t see anything out the back window, but the Camaro was absolutely planted to the road. I touched 130mph several times. A Dodge TRX kept testing me on that uphill pull after the Bay Bridge. He didn’t know I had some extra juice. 😂 Also, coming back one of them darn CHiPs officers on a Harley rolled up next to me and gave me the look-“I’m watching you.” I want to say, “Let’s Go” so bad. 😂
Yeah you need to drive some mustangs if you think camaros are nice lol..
I've heard the same about the steering feel. Why would it be lacking? Why would Ford continue to make a car that has a numb feeling to the steering? As sensual as this car is, it's amazing to me that they haven't gone for the throat on that aspect of it. Think about it- the sound of the car is amazing. It's a visually appealing car- beautiful. The smell of leather, rubber, gas- F-me! Love it! Somehow they either didn't or forgot that the feel from the road is just as important as the other things a driving enthusiast loves about a sports car. Good job, Ford, but ya could'a been awesome, is what it sounds like.
So it's not a work out to drive around a track or drift..
When a 2022 Ford Mustang and a 2022 Chevy Camaro have a kid, this is what you get 🤔
The drone shot in the beginning of this video, I swear I was looking at a Camaro . 😂
@@tommyboyGT350😂😂😂😂😂
What many fail to realize is that the rear quarter panels were first on the Mustang in the 60’s before the Camaro.
@@EVsSuck777 negative
@@X2AstroFN Look at a 1965 Mustang fastback. The curvy rear quarter panels were already there. In 1967 they were made wider and more sculpted, then in 1969 they were made even wider and boxier. The 2024 Mustang looks based off the 1967 Mustang Fastback.
What makes the mustang a better driver’s car is outward visibility, you don’t feel like you’re in a pill box. Plus the car has good lines, it’s a classic shape. I still prefer 6th gen mustang design. The new one’s front and rear design is a little divisive for me.
Hate the interior and the rear styling. Feel the s550 variants (Gt350 and Mach 1) are much better looking.
Thank God we got some real Mustang enthusiast in this chat and not some Ford ball washers . And hell yes the Shelby GT350 and MACH 1 are better in so many ways.
Not necessarily a mustang guy. In my opinion they nailed the outside looks but I'm not a fan of the interior
Red looks good on this car
Impressed with the quality of the shots filmed in this video compared to other mustang dark horse driving reveals 🎉
Dark Horse Premium with manual transmission, the handling pack and Recaros is $71,505. The Camaro ZL1 comes with Recaros, its standard suspension and 1LE SS are the same, and its $69,995. Go to the ZL1 1LE and its $77,495. So for less money than the Dark Horse you get 650hp and a 3907lbs curb weight or for $6000 more than the Dark Horse Premium wiht handling and Recaros you get 650hp, 3853lbs curb weight and way more car overall. How does one on still go Camaro here? And while you can still buy an SS 1LE for under $50,000, you can throw on a cold air intake and a dyno tune and turn that 460hp near that 500hp mark and still come out way cheaper and lighter than the Dark Horse.
The reasons you outlined is exactly why I bought my 2020 Camaro LT1 6-speed when I was cross-shopping Mustang/Challenger. The Camaro is a better overall value.
The Darkhorse Looks alright I need to see it in person. it's only 500hp though. my charger hellcat would blow it doors off. for 60k it would be a good value
FYI the print article refers incorrectly to "Vapor Blue" as the darker color that mutes that accents (confusing with Dark Ember, which is the dark blue offered in the '24). Vapor Blue is the bondo clearcoat, err, light gray/kinda not really blue color offering.
Just checked the consumer site and it looks correct to me. Vapor Blue Metallic is the darker, somewhat hue-shifting blue. I don't see Dark Ember; did you mean Dark Matter?
@@CarlosLagoblue ember is the colorshifting dark blue. The vapor blue is light grayish blue.
It sounds amazing. Really does. It looks like a Camaro from the front which is really odd.
I must be gettting old because it looks like a modern Camero. and it doesnt have that muscle car feeling with the big touch screens. I hope Shellby, Steeda, Hennessey, Roush, can give it some more muscle car feel.
That’s a man’s man driving that great car. Great video and acting and driving. Damn.
For the price fully loaded you have to ask yourself, zl1-zl1 1le-m2-gt350/350r-hellcat-used gt500 possibly… what you gone pick ? 🤔
GT350 hands down!
But you see we have a lot of Ford ball washers commenting on this video 😅
Oh, man I'm gonna get me a dark horse it is sick lol .
Camaro ZL1 or SS1LE
@@tommyboyGT350Factz! I’ll take Alex word on it too!
The fuel cutoff for my 22 GT is 7300 rpm and the gauge goes to 8. The GT350 had a special analogue gauge that went to 9k. Maybe they're going to do a new 350 with digital dash and want to keep it the same as the GT dash? Unlikely. also when modified these coyotes went over 8K rpm so youd have to have a seperate gauge to read the rpm so this could help that scenario.
Are you 100% positive on the fuel cutoff for the 22. 2018 and up should have 7400 rpm fuel cutoff. Unless tuned, that is the stock hard limiter on the s550.
@@al151 I was in fact wrong and you were right, it is 7300.
Thats a damn good looking car.
You are only saying this because it looks like a Camaro.
S197 FOR LIFE!!!
Carlos is one of the few journalist I truly trusts
Can't wait to see more Carlos and @throttlehouse crossovers. I miss the Carlos Lago deep dives too.
Where
Thats a properly done limiter...if youre waiting for redline you're gonna miss it, as drag racers we always put the shift indicator 200-300rpm below actual redline....especially in 1st or 2nd where the revs build fast.
Been hearing that in every review so far that the end feeling is almost gone. I just don't understand why they do that. I want to feel everything going on. Some of us above average drivers want that back!
You don't drift so you wouldn't understand..
@@redsviewlong live Ken Block!
I really wish the Mustang was built on the Camaro platform.
Your a Moran.
I aint paying $60k on a stock stang ill enjoy my stock ctsv
Coupe?
Have a 2022 Camaro SS today and a had 2020 Bullitt a couple years back, BTW both Manual!!! Love the new screens in the Dark horse and the colors ... but in reality its the TREMEC that makes all the difference if you haven't had the chance... I like the Ford inside with all the bells and whistles, but the Camaro drives so much better (Transmission). This may be the mix we all needed!!!
How does this compare to a GT350R or Mach 1 with the handling pack?
It’s probably a lot like the Mach one, but with a little bit extra horsepower.
Why are you guys acting like this is a new car. It's the same old mustang with new clothes.
Cool looking Camaro. That shift knob is going to be brutal in an Arizona summer.
😂😂😂 I'm sticking with the real Camaro
Or Texas summer
Stick to your general motors crap.
Its hollow so it shouldnt absorb heat. My 2003 mach 1 is solid aluminum. It will burn you.
My Mustang came with Sport Cup 2’s with the Handling Package
No longer the case with the 7th gen Mustang.
@@CarlosLago I see
Dealer markups coming in hot already seen a couple at over 100k😮
The 1LE does exist and it's ok to say it feels more nimble to drive on the track than a mustang that costs +$20k more. Most people don't buy brand new cars. Used cars are a thing for much cheaper.
2023 Chevrolet Camaro SS rs 1le zr1 LMNOP abc
It's called a cumstang look at it Camaro and mustang had a baby
Facts
I'll Always Love Heroes Hayden Panettiere
The seats you were showing when mentioning the Recaros are the standard seats with the adjustable headrests.
I noticed that too, they they showed the Recaro's.
Thought people would be more excited about this car, but I think I'll stick with my ZL1 1LE for a few more years at least.
Great video and review. It was clear you were giving us a type of real world review Thanks, FD
Every car UA-camr just drove the DarkHorse, and are posting their vids at the same time, saying the same exact stuff. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
They need to have a package that does NOT have that big screen up front - I absolutely hate it! It looks like trash....I would rather have a gauge cluster than that crappy looking screen. Probably one smaller screen would be way better. I can't be the only one that thanks the large screen is crap. I love my 14GT and will probably just get the engine built before buying this Camaro/Mustang hybrid. The only thing I like about it is the Engine but I hear it's not tunable except by Company's Ford has chosen to mod it. Which makes me more likely to just refresh my vehicle.
Glass screen gauges are out of place, wrong car!
love the digital dash and can change it to multiple type screens, I wish my 2018 mustang had a digital dash than the two boring round gages !!!!
Love the digital dash big time, makes the inside pop like driving in a space aged cockpit, it's about time Ford put some excitement inside the mustang finally.
O.M.G. that screen is simply shit! It's not mustang !
If pussy people want to play with digital screens...instead of driving a real car....go to Teslas......Don't buy a Mustang!.....
Would love to see a Dark Horse vs 5th Gen Z/28. On paper it seems like a good comparision, even if the Z/28 is almost 10 years older.
2015 Camaro Z/28 with 7.0L engine got smoke by a 2015 GT350R with a 5.2L engine.
@georgemerusi299,
I would love to see that matchup!
Afterwards, I’d like to see the Darkhorse vs the 6th Gen SS1LE, given it laid down a slightly faster track time than the Z28, and it’s lighter weight.
Yeah ford #1 always
@@chucktaylor9190 It did when did this happen? According to LL Z/28 beat gt350r with all the frdo bandaids at VIR Grand Course.
I never thought I’d see the day where a mustang and a C8 corvette would overlap in price. 🤯
Interior with screens is a big improvement.
No hokey “ground speed”, craptastic one way toggle switches, etc.
Also no mt82…
So depressing. These cars are going away and the last few years we have left to try and grab one, all the dealers are price gouging the hell out of everything, making them unobtainable for many.
Nice looking Camaro
This would explain why 1 saw 3 s650s otw home from work on 24/27 last week
Great video...not necessarily a Ford fan but a V8 that revs to over 7K is never a bad thing. I know it's been a while, but Carlos was a great addition to the team, always enjoy his content. Keep the great vids coming!
All that heritage - washed away. Lost in a sea of digital wizardry.
Goodbye Mustang, you were my first car _and_ my first broken heart. You cost me four girlfriends, two and half jobs and a copious amount of money as a teenager.
Thank you for the fond memories. You will be sorely missed.
Stay classy my friends.
All things change. Get over it or get left behind. It was time to leave the past behind and look toward the future. We're on the 7th generation for crying out loud. The whole retro themed styling is tired.
@@tri3pleagent The whole car is a legacy of the past. It's a heavy ass V8 manual. It is retro. Look toward the future? This thing will be no more here very soon.
@@ianstallings that's an over-simplification if I've ever heard one. I think you know that, too. I'm talking specifically about elements of design and styling, especially for the interior.
@@tri3pleagent _"Opinion is the medium between knowledge and ignorance."_ *~Plato*
Stay classy my friend.
Lol where are there simple, heritage based pony cars?! Been gone for more than a decade.
I'm glad he said actual muscle car. Someone who finally knows the proper term.
I have always loved LOVED the Mustang! Would never own one, but God I love its ruckus-ness. 😍 You posted up an amazing review and presented the car very well. Thank you!
This looks a lot like the 6th Gen Camaro though.
‼️please someone tell me what’s the name of the song they used at time stamp 2:46🙏🏽
The interior is so disconnected from past Mustang evolution in design. Could be a Kia, Hyundai who knows. Such an opportunity and history to build on and this seems to have fallen short.
I just can’t pay $75k for a dressed up Mustang GT Premium, when the Mustang GT500 used to sell at that price. I know vehicles are getting more expensive, but why would I buy a Mustang over a C8 Corvette? I’ve owned 6 Stangs with the years being between 03-2017, and I’m not sure if I could buy another because of the price.
Manual transmission.
The final nail in the coffin for internal combustion will be when electric cars finally go lightweight. Still...people get rid of cars every 3 to 5 years, where are all those toxic batteries going to? yunkyard? fumes, ground pollution? I'm glad a few manufacturers are investigating alternative fuels to keep internal combustion running.
But how will they make them lightweight. Those battery packs weigh more than most cars in itself. Maybe in 20 years, but I'm thinking the ICE will have made a comeback by then.
Okay, First of all the beginning drone shot of this video I swear I was looking at a Camaro . Second of all This Mustang was half ass done . Ford is acting like this Mustang is the biggest thing ever , Us as Mustang enthusiasts see right through this crap it's a S550 and a 1/2 , ECU locked, over-the-air updates Ford monitoring, not tunnable, voiding the warranty if tampered with. Ford is hand and hand with EPA . So why are you trying to sell this car so hard to us? It's not like the 2020 Shelby GT500 which was a total redesign. Now if you want to talk about some incredible engineering the GT500 is where its at . GOOD JOB FORD I will give you that 👍 No half ass job on that Mustang or MACH 1. Ask yourself what predominantly age group buys Performance Mustangs 21 to 30 NO 35 to 50 YES . This Mustang will never do what Dodge has done to grab the younger generation with the Hellcats, the Demons and so on. You don't always have to kiss the Ford ring to be a Ford fan .
uh, ok
Its typical ford. That's what they do.
The Dark Horse R pricing starts at 147KUSD, wow that's just crazy bonkers! God, you can get a base C8 Z06 for 107K or a fully equipped ZL1 package for just 128K!
I expect Lund Racing to get rid of that rev limiter 😂
They won’t do it on this car.
@@mikehughes8023wait a couple months
That tesla's giant dash is....very gt mustang style man....!!
Congrats to Ford for creativity! 💪💪👏👏👏👏🤣🤣
Agree, it’s sad that the Camaro and Challenger are gone. Gonna be holding on to my Hemi R/T manual for a long time.
Don't blame you. I love my 66 Mustang with a 347!!
I would keep it forever if I were you. I want to find a decent 2012 Boss 302 and I want to be buried in it.
Wonder how the Roush is going to look
Where is double hump dash? Big screen just followed trend, it losts it’s heritage design
Proper name. US names hot cars properly. Unlike here in UK
Ford stepped back and sideways with this car only thing advanced about this car is the price
There are still a few Camaro SS 1LE's around. Get them while you can!
No thanks, I’m good!
Oh people are lol, the average person can’t afford the dark horse and the price is going to rise a lil every year on top of the already hefty price tag
its not making 500hp because of the connecting rods theyre just there to help hold things together. unless theres something else its just the tune.
I agree that the presenter gave the wrong reasons and connecting rods do not bring greater power. The dual air intake 80mm throttle bodies compared to previous generation single throttle body produces more air which enables more fuel to be supplied and as a result more power combined with a longer duration exhaust cam to help get out the extra air. Added to this there is an oil pan to reduce windage losses and a new left side exhaust manifolf to improve flow.
Yeah, a better explanation would've been something like they provided durability for the tune that gave it more power, or something like that. I was pretty ragged by the end of the day and could've been more accurate with word choice.
@@CarlosLago Having listened again to your explanation you were comparing the 480hp GT engine to the 500hp engine so the normal GT had the upgrade from previous gen Coyote engine due to the reasons I gave. However the reasons for the upgrade and difference between the Dark Horse 500hp engine and the Mustang GT 480 engine were not only engine tune. Road and Track in one of their articles mentioned the Dark horse engine in comparison has a stronger new crankshaft (again not power producing), forged connecting rods (not power producing), and new camshafts which are definitely power producing and probably the main reason.
Why would anyone take this over a well-equipped C8 for the same money? 🤔
Manual Transmission?
Driver might be too physically large to fit in the C8. I’m feeling claustrophobic in my new 3LT C8 coupe with sport seats even though my previous 3 LT C7 felt quite roomy with the upgraded cushy seats. That’s what brought me to the mustang corral.
Manual and it's a way better v8 architectural wise. These 5.0s will easily push 1200+ hp in the years to come
Plus the base c8s aren't cutting it lol. A z06+ or nothing
Because it’s not a Chevy.
Personally I don't like the spoiler which I think spoils the lines of the car. Can you say at what speed you have to go before it has any effect? I still prefer my S550 especially the interior and instrument binnacle etc. Really helpful review thanks.
Lol. People say Camaro doesn't exist anymore and it's still being built.
Production is set to end in January 2024, they're just being hyperbolic.
Is there going to be a new version of the GT500? Or, has that been killed off?
Looks pretty good in red. LOATH all the stupid screens though.
"But that car doesn't really exist anymore."
Sure it does. The Camaro is still being produced, and it'll continue production into early 2024. I know because I just bought a new 1LE. So yes, a comparison between the two cars would definitely be relevant.
@karlhungus8946,,
EXACTLY!!
I’ll keep saying it..Our cars with Alpha chassis + 1LE Track Pack is a masterpiece.
TBH, I want to see the Dark Horse manual (vs) SS1LE manual “head 2 head” on track.
I’m willing to bet the difference between the two won’t be more than 2 seconds.
We’re talking $45k for the Camaro (vs) $60-$70k for the new Mustang Dark Horse.
Would track times and the “driving experience” justify the price difference?
I love the Red or the Metallic blue
I've done nothing but collect as many ICE engines as possible fer the last 10 years- I'm with you on the bittersweet end - 11' 5.0 Boss/ 15' ZO6/21' 392 Rubicon/ 22' TRX - maybe time fer one more 25' ZR1 perhaps
3900 lbs ☠️ And they once called the AWD Twin Turbo R35 GTR that was slaying supercars when it was released, "fat" 🤣
15 years ago, cars on average were lighter and smaller.
It will be interesting to see if this car (with the sticky Trofeos) will finally beat and be as durable as a Gen6 SS 1LE on the road course. Ford has kept throwing iterations at the SS 1LE and keeps coming up short while also being significantly more expensive than the Camaro.
Dude where are you getting your information from? The SS 1LE is not faster then the Mach 1 with Handling Package on ANY track!
@@brucetumblinjr7980forget about the Mach 1 , go to Throttle House lap times, Camaro ss 1le is even faster than a GT500 around a track. There is a reason why we never saw a single same day auto vs auto or manual vs manual ss 1le and mach 1 comparison. Give both cars the same tires, Camaro is clearly faster around a track. Ford never let that comparison happened, same goes for the regular GT350. Again Ford did not want that comparison done also. All we have is different day different track environment CarandDriver lap times, which does not reflect same day comparison. Hack that Mach1 even put down faster times than a GT350R 😂 which is not even possible.
Different priorities. Chevy wanted good handling high up on the list. Ford cares slightly less about that. Both are excellent automobiles.
@@al151finally someone speaking facts
❤Thank you for sharing this beautiful car God bless you
what camera's are you using?
I had considered buying one. After inspecting the fit and finish of several, at different dealerships. I elected not to buy! There were uneven body gaps, paint issues and an apparent lack of quality control. Instead, I purchased a Lexus LC500 coupe.
Smart move and it comes as no surprise that "quality" is no longer "Job 1" at Frdo.
I am not a Ford person but once he said Recaro seats I changed my mind about Stangs. See I was in a very bad accident in '21 and was almost killed in a '19 ZL1. The Recaro Seats with all the nanny electronics saved my life and I got out with a busted left heel and fractured tibia. Let's just say I can piss a lot of metal detectors. Give me Recaro seats in this bad boy and I can be alright.
This guy looks and is dressed like Steve McGarrett from 5-0
I don't like the name or the logo... they had so many iconic names to choose from. Boss? Mach 1? Shelby GT?
Shleby
There are some that just have to have the “latest” of whatever. This car isn’t fundamentally better than the 16-21 GT350, which precludes me from even being curious. The move from S197 to S550 was big and deserved attention. This is just a new interior. Sorry Ford, I think you swung and missed.
Great looking car but needs boost and more power. 500 is not enough for a 4k lb car esp at elevation 😅
Man I just don’t think nothing can top my 18 1LE or my 350. I’ll have to check this out
I mean, the voodoo engine was definitely special.
They made it look like a Camaro but it still doesn’t drive like one 🤣🤷🏾♂️