I love how humble you are to point out in your videos where you have forgotten to do things. It is that honesty that makes me trust your videos, since I know all the info is there, even if it’s not presented perfectly the first time.
Although this is a totally acceptable technique for lowering someone, in a situation where speed of descent is needed, the MOFT knot pass should be used utilized. Thank you for putting this together!
Curious, at 13:55 you mention that you would need to build something to ascend to get back your cordelette, but isn't the point that you are leaving material on the wall? Why not leave it and come back later? Do you need it for something?
You could leave it if you are absolutely positive that the rappel gets you to safety. If there is any question then that cord may be necessary to further the self rescue.
on the first initial repel end, Is there a reason you don't add a barrel knot? or no because it's assumed for the rescue aspect the climber is tied off without a way to come off the rope
Why not just start with the Munter and pass the knot through it? That seems much faster and more efficient than starting with the grigri only to have to remove it from the system later
Definitely an option, I assume you mean the MOFT knot pass procedure. The issue with that and I may highlight this on a separate video is lowering 200 feet to the knot to pass on a munter will result in a huge amount of twist in the rope and you may get stuck. You maybe can mitigate this by lowering on a super munter and then taking out the super munter loop right before the knot, then putting the loop back in after the knot is passed. I'll try it out this weekend and see if that works and if it does, make a good video on it.
@@summitseekersexperience In my experience, just holding the brake strand absolutely parallel to the load strand takes care of the twisting issue. You might get one or two twists, but you get those (or more) with the rope running over the sideplate of the Grigri as well. Having the brake strand in that position is not always possible either, really depends on your stance at the anchor. I would much prefer letting the knot pass through the munter as well, that would be my go to method. Still very important to know all the other ways of lowering and doing load transfers though.
@@raphaelbeinhauer9242 Good insight. I'm gonna run a few tests this weekend and share with everyone some data. But yeah, knowing all the tools obviously opens up the most options and gives one the most confidence.
An offset figure 8 bend can be more dangerous and weak than the offset overhand bend. You can tie a figure eight bend ( figure eight in one strand, then retread the other strand through it ) but you should learn to trust the OOB well dressed with 30cm tails ( assuming both ropes are similar diameter. )
It's also easier to get stuck in a crevice when pulling the rope. The overhand bend is the standard for lowering on miltipitch routes with more than one rope because it is less likely to get stuck. He's not pulling the rope afterwards in this case so he could use the double fisherman's, but since the go to method is the overhand bend he preferred to use it.
I know that you americans use it a lot but we in europe, only for hard multipitch with a lot of falls use it, or at least it is just me. It is a lot of weight and the same rope manouver you should do it with prussiks. Alway climb safe
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I love how humble you are to point out in your videos where you have forgotten to do things. It is that honesty that makes me trust your videos, since I know all the info is there, even if it’s not presented perfectly the first time.
Thanks... I gave up trying to be perfect a long time ago.
@@summitseekersexperience “super good enough” - Black Diamond mechanical designers
Nice videos. I unexpectedly got into rock climbing a little over a year ago after moving to a new area. Channels like yours have kept me safe.
Rule number 1: Get off the mountain safe!
Such great content. Much appreciated.
thanks!!!
Another great one Jason
Although this is a totally acceptable technique for lowering someone, in a situation where speed of descent is needed, the MOFT knot pass should be used utilized. Thank you for putting this together!
for sure!
Very useful, thanks so much
Great video, thanks for the content!
yeah boi
Really informative- thanks
Curious, at 13:55 you mention that you would need to build something to ascend to get back your cordelette, but isn't the point that you are leaving material on the wall? Why not leave it and come back later? Do you need it for something?
Good point... I suppose you could leave it... if there was lightning right next to me, I would.
You could leave it if you are absolutely positive that the rappel gets you to safety. If there is any question then that cord may be necessary to further the self rescue.
on the first initial repel end, Is there a reason you don't add a barrel knot? or no because it's assumed for the rescue aspect the climber is tied off without a way to come off the rope
Correct, the climber is tied off closing the system.
why cant you just prussik the the rope , clove hitch for backup, bypass the knot and continue to use the grigri after the knot?
Why not just start with the Munter and pass the knot through it? That seems much faster and more efficient than starting with the grigri only to have to remove it from the system later
Definitely an option, I assume you mean the MOFT knot pass procedure. The issue with that and I may highlight this on a separate video is lowering 200 feet to the knot to pass on a munter will result in a huge amount of twist in the rope and you may get stuck. You maybe can mitigate this by lowering on a super munter and then taking out the super munter loop right before the knot, then putting the loop back in after the knot is passed. I'll try it out this weekend and see if that works and if it does, make a good video on it.
@@summitseekersexperience Awesome. Thank you for the feedback, I’m always trying to learn new things
@@summitseekersexperience In my experience, just holding the brake strand absolutely parallel to the load strand takes care of the twisting issue. You might get one or two twists, but you get those (or more) with the rope running over the sideplate of the Grigri as well. Having the brake strand in that position is not always possible either, really depends on your stance at the anchor. I would much prefer letting the knot pass through the munter as well, that would be my go to method. Still very important to know all the other ways of lowering and doing load transfers though.
@@raphaelbeinhauer9242 Good insight. I'm gonna run a few tests this weekend and share with everyone some data. But yeah, knowing all the tools obviously opens up the most options and gives one the most confidence.
Heyo, I’m a relatively novice climber and just wanted to ask if this is the “euro death knot” and if it wouldn’t just be safer to utilize a figure 8?
An offset figure 8 bend can be more dangerous and weak than the offset overhand bend. You can tie a figure eight bend ( figure eight in one strand, then retread the other strand through it ) but you should learn to trust the OOB well dressed with 30cm tails ( assuming both ropes are similar diameter. )
Why use they overhand bend instead of a double fisherman's knot? Isn't the double fisherman more secure?
It's also easier to get stuck in a crevice when pulling the rope. The overhand bend is the standard for lowering on miltipitch routes with more than one rope because it is less likely to get stuck. He's not pulling the rope afterwards in this case so he could use the double fisherman's, but since the go to method is the overhand bend he preferred to use it.
Why are yo carring a gri gri with two ropes?
If I'm belaying caterpillar I'll usually have a grigri. I normally do not not have a grigri although sometiems it may be in my pack.
In an emergency, there might be a second party on the route, and you can team up with them. Then you'd have two ropes.
can also simul rap if two ppl have grigri
@@mr.apartment Yes, but then you only get the 60m length, not 120m.
I know that you americans use it a lot but we in europe, only for hard multipitch with a lot of falls use it, or at least it is just me. It is a lot of weight and the same rope manouver you should do it with prussiks. Alway climb safe
I wanted to be first like… comment will do
for sure
Say grigri again