I have enabled the super thanks option for those that would like to donate to the channel. You can find it at the top of the comments. Click on it and you'll be able to help with the builds. Thanks everyone!!!!
I subscribed, I can't tell you how much I enjoyed listening to someone that fully understands all the engineering involved with this 2 stroke turbo project. I am looking forward to watching it hit the snow.
Flow test the air box. Pull it out plum in a air supply to the top of the air box and set it on the floor and run smoke thru it see if your volumes look the same. Could even set up flow meters on each carb inlet and try different baffles to even all carb inlets out.
I'm sure it will be fine Todd! It is very difficult to tell the difference between "Will this work OK?" and "What could be better?" after a couple cold ones.
Todd, your Airbox is indeed going to function perfectly. It's important to note that the pressure of 8 lbs of boost is evenly distributed throughout the entire airbox. Consider it this way: with your intake and compression strokes of your pistons, it's unlikely that it could simply provide more boost to the middle cylinder. The pressure would be evenly distributed. If you encounter any issues on your first run and its falling flat on its face, I would consider removing the baffle, It's certainly not advisable to restrict that airflow. That all depends on the backpressure your pipe makes. It may be just fine. Im just saying if you have any trouble I would advise to look there.
Todd. Boost is pressure. In other words in order to measure boost it has to fill up the charge tube's and in your case the box in order to read pressure" boost" . Therefore your whole box will have the same pressure so your box will work just like you want it to. Sleep well because you did a fine job.
You 'could' drill the holes larger on the two end carbs, so the air flows more at those ends and is more restricted in the center to distribute the flow better. This is how the engineers that make tissue dryers form tissue mills distribute the air across a 200" baffle. Air would enter from one end and exit through the dryer roll. To achieve even air flow, the holes in the baffle are smaller near the air entrance were smaller and they progressively got larger, or even no baffle plate at the far end to keep the air even in the chamber before exiting across the entire 200" dryer surface. Just a thought to consider and might be an easy modification to make. You could monitor air pressure with MAP sensors above each carb to make sure the pressure is even across the board and adjust the baffle holes as necessary
yes new video. just buttoned up the case on my 800 storm this afternoon. Cheers guys, if he leaves the decals off it looks like a mean mountain mod sled. also 3 fingers has a storm motor in it!?!?!?!?!?!?
My opinion on the airbox is that you're right about the pressure in the system being equal. The only drawback may be less flow to the mag side carburetor. I would make sure you use that side to monitor pressure and keep an eye on your plugs and exhaust temperature on each cylinder to ensure you have a safe air to fuel ratio. You can probably handle any discrepancy with jetting. Not likely to have a major issue with the power level you're likely to achieve. Good luck, awesome build!
SLP engine torque arm , and extra push arm , locks that motor in place , minimal twist clutch deflection , and a Venom Team tied Secondary clutch , best things I put on my machine ,
I pull tractor and have done extensive research on boost in manifolds and have learned that if you have 8 pounds of boost at the inlet of manifold it is equal through out the whole manifold.
Free tip: air flows almost the same boosted or not. 1Bar absolute pressure or 1.3bar nothing changes. Air does not get pushed in the cylinder by the turbo it just gets pressurized, then a pressure drop occurs when the piston passes the intake port and the air is “sucked” in same as a NA engine. The answer you are looking for is: if this air box would work NA it will work in a boosted application
Yeah hes good the pressure will equalize without issue as long as the area past the notch is will flow more past it than the stator carb can actually consume he will have no problems.
Your air box will be fine. The boost pressure will more than compensate for any flow rate issues that a small restriction in your air box could cause. If you read 8 psi of boost, the whole system will be at 8 psi. The outlet of the compressor wheel to each and every corner of the air box will be at 8 psi. I have tested this type of theory on diesel trucks- the pressure on one side of the intercooler is the same as the other.
Jason price at price performance here in Michigan would more than likely be able to answer your question about the boost air box. Look him up and reach out
Todd do you have any worrys of the boost pushing the slides of the carbs up and it going wfo. Not sure if this is an issue in low boost situations or not.
Boost pressure is a creation of restriction in the engine. The intake box you have made is going to work as a tank/reservoir and the cylinders will take from it as they need it. You'll be find todd.
Todd, you have to install the original graphics package… The graphic decals are what make the 92 650 “The Pumpkin” otherwise it’s just a black INDY… Secondly, I am with you on the intake manifold being charged with intake boost at a consistent pressure for each cylinder.
I'd do decals. From what I remember from a high performance automotive engines class is you want a smooth, unobstructed passageway for the air to flow before it enters carburetor.
Make an identical post tunnel between the other two carbs Make the inlet point towards the turbo. It'll have less pipe and better response Cut a hole in the back and find a 2025 take off air box valve from a boost. Thousands of folks replaced them with a trs valve
One of your subscribers probably has a valve laying around or you could just find a valve from any big twin id think. Then cover that with an outerwear or frogskin
Throw 3 boost gauges in the airbox in different locations.. For testing purposes. I'd guess it will be okay, though. Also... I've been watching some stuff on car guys doing blow-through carbureted turbo setups. They say the rule of thumb is base fuel pressure + boost pressure. So if the stock pump supplies 5, and you're running 8lbs boost, you need to be at 13lbs fuel pressure. Idk if that rule applies directly to your setup here, but it will be interesting to see you guys figure it out!
@ Looking forward to it! I don’t have the space, resources, or skills you guys do.. So I like to live vicariously through your UA-cam videos. You guys and Nutter give me the sled wrenching fix
So I have a grand national and the rear two cylinders are leaner than the front 4 so a guy developed a plate that sits between the plenum and the intake to help distribute the turbo air coming in more even. The company is RJC racing in the turbo Buick world. So I could see your center carb running more boost than the outer two. He used to use a leaf blower on an intake and show how more air is on the rear cylinder than the fronts. You can do the same and see which holes flow the most and least.
Couldn’t you weld some fittings in the top of the box to check pressure? That seems it would be simple and you could make sure the psi is the same in both ends of the air box. Or just watch the plugs or egt
What you will find is the mag side carb is going to run slightly different jetting as long as that box is sealed all 3 carbs will be fed . Boost will be slightly higher on the center hole and pto hole. Remember boost is a measurement of restriction. What makes the power gains is the volume of air at any given psi vers rpm. This is why I say you will find the mag side will be needing different jet sets . If you really want to avoid the jet nightmare you will face build the air box behind the steering shaft and extend the outlets to the carbs. Building a larger box will lower the psi but gain air volume naturally and same goes for building a smaller box will up the psi but lower available volume of air. At 8 to 10 psi you theoretical size of your box should be triple the cc of your engine to match the 1 to 1 ratio of volume to boost needed to make things happy an safe. As far as the fuel no at 8 to 10 psi you can infact get by with 93 but will need to retard the timing a few degrees.
I think the air box charge will be ok and not favour the centre carb because you are putting pressure in a total area no matter what’s in the way. That entire area will be under pressure and carbs will pull the charge in as they see fit
My 2cents on airbox for what it’s worth is solid baffle to deflect airflow off the center carb & somehow calculate the surface area each can take as the whole point of a box is to distribute air evenly…how to exactly is beyond my abilities tho hahah. You get it tho!
@@toddclyne3493 somehow you’ll have to get each car the same airflow obvi. in long run…will be tricky keeping it under hood, but best bet might be heading back to Nutter’s & somehow making an another fits under the hood as a collective airbox, but has splitter pipes to each port like those gasser dragsters so all the air comes into a box of sorts but then is distributed to the ports…might look wild tho lol. Someone commented to add the same steering clearance to the others side thus making all ports more equal which could also accomplish the same goal(?). I was concerned seeing the chassis at Princeton😂
I think I would finish Jason, and then decide if you want the the graphics or not. It may look naked once you guys get the bumper on with the nose cone and everything is sitting on there the way it should. As for the steering......PSC full hydro set up. Like a rock buggy. LoL
Gotta have decals ! Sorry Trenton but I’m old school ! I can see just the way it is but come on man …. Gotta have some decals ! Take care and Merry Christmas 🍺🍺
Jst cut and add two more tubes out the top on both sides of air box and connect them to one at the top. If u dnt think it’ll work so it’ll be even pressure on all sides but idk that’s jst my idea
Decals for sure, I’m no engineer but I can’t say I see an issue with your air box, modern turbo sled (Different fuel system and twin cylinders, I know) don’t have separate air horns for the different throttle bodies, not sure why you’d need them in this build either
I would make a simple pipe manifold over the top and keep the diffuser plate, just for the safety sake of not toasting that Beautiful engine. Just my $.02
Hey all ... I think they would be both be awesome black ,or with the full graphics. Why not intermittent... fade the original into a black ... either from front to back , or fading in from the bottom hot ,and fading into black. Very slightly... like a ghost image. Why can't you use a simulor intercooler design ,for the intake .? All my 2 cents . Love you all... Merry Christmas!!!
I have enabled the super thanks option for those that would like to donate to the channel. You can find it at the top of the comments. Click on it and you'll be able to help with the builds. Thanks everyone!!!!
Todd, that thing is aching for some old school orange pinstripes. And the 650 logo. No decals!
@@weshole find me a pinstriper 😁
Decals for sure. It would make it look and feel complete
Right on
I subscribed, I can't tell you how much I enjoyed listening to someone that fully understands all the engineering involved with this 2 stroke turbo project. I am looking forward to watching it hit the snow.
Flow test the air box. Pull it out plum in a air supply to the top of the air box and set it on the floor and run smoke thru it see if your volumes look the same. Could even set up flow meters on each carb inlet and try different baffles to even all carb inlets out.
I'm sure it will be fine Todd! It is very difficult to tell the difference between "Will this work OK?" and "What could be better?" after a couple cold ones.
😂 🍻
Man those sleds look amazing great job Todd,from Ontario Canada Todd.
@@Kq750. Hey thanks Todd
Todd, your Airbox is indeed going to function perfectly. It's important to note that the pressure of 8 lbs of boost is evenly distributed throughout the entire airbox. Consider it this way: with your intake and compression strokes of your pistons, it's unlikely that it could simply provide more boost to the middle cylinder. The pressure would be evenly distributed. If you encounter any issues on your first run and its falling flat on its face, I would consider removing the baffle, It's certainly not advisable to restrict that airflow. That all depends on the backpressure your pipe makes. It may be just fine. Im just saying if you have any trouble I would advise to look there.
Looking great looks rather stealthy with no decals 👍👍👍
Stealth mode activated 🥷
Decals for sure, looking good!!
@@matthewbegin3462 thanks
Decals 100% but looks bad ass as it is as well
Thanks
Do you know anyone nearby that could check cfm the carbs would be receiving…from the pressurized inbox? Just a thought looks awesome fellas!
@@petehanas63 there you go 🤔
Todd. Boost is pressure. In other words in order to measure boost it has to fill up the charge tube's and in your case the box in order to read pressure" boost" . Therefore your whole box will have the same pressure so your box will work just like you want it to. Sleep well because you did a fine job.
You 'could' drill the holes larger on the two end carbs, so the air flows more at those ends and is more restricted in the center to distribute the flow better. This is how the engineers that make tissue dryers form tissue mills distribute the air across a 200" baffle. Air would enter from one end and exit through the dryer roll. To achieve even air flow, the holes in the baffle are smaller near the air entrance were smaller and they progressively got larger, or even no baffle plate at the far end to keep the air even in the chamber before exiting across the entire 200" dryer surface. Just a thought to consider and might be an easy modification to make. You could monitor air pressure with MAP sensors above each carb to make sure the pressure is even across the board and adjust the baffle holes as necessary
@@jczaher very interesting and a great explanation
yes new video. just buttoned up the case on my 800 storm this afternoon. Cheers guys, if he leaves the decals off it looks like a mean mountain mod sled. also 3 fingers has a storm motor in it!?!?!?!?!?!?
Storm motor correct
I wish you luck. This sounds like an engineering nightmare.
Better stock up on the cold snacks. You’re going to need them. 😂👍
@@StreetersGarage 😂😂 thanks Tom 🍻
My opinion on the airbox is that you're right about the pressure in the system being equal. The only drawback may be less flow to the mag side carburetor. I would make sure you use that side to monitor pressure and keep an eye on your plugs and exhaust temperature on each cylinder to ensure you have a safe air to fuel ratio. You can probably handle any discrepancy with jetting. Not likely to have a major issue with the power level you're likely to achieve. Good luck, awesome build!
Side note, the hood looks amazing but I think it deserves decals for the view across the parking lot!
Looks great! I vote for decals.
@@brianwilber4347 👍
Todd don’t worry about your air box it’s gonna work just fine! The mag side will see just as much boost as the others
@@northwoodsrippers9639 great minds think alike 😁
SLP engine torque arm , and extra push arm , locks that motor in place , minimal twist clutch deflection , and a Venom Team tied Secondary clutch , best things I put on my machine ,
I'll be making all of that good stuff in time 😁
I love that sled!!! Definitely go with decals!
I pull tractor and have done extensive research on boost in manifolds and have learned that if you have 8 pounds of boost at the inlet of manifold it is equal through out the whole manifold.
Black and orange looks bad ass! I vote no badges!👌💪🇺🇲
@@HairlipButcher 😁
Free tip: air flows almost the same boosted or not. 1Bar absolute pressure or 1.3bar nothing changes. Air does not get pushed in the cylinder by the turbo it just gets pressurized, then a pressure drop occurs when the piston passes the intake port and the air is “sucked” in same as a NA engine. The answer you are looking for is: if this air box would work NA it will work in a boosted application
@@reminoel483 this was the explanation I think a lot of us was looking for. Thanks
Yeah hes good the pressure will equalize without issue as long as the area past the notch is will flow more past it than the stator carb can actually consume he will have no problems.
Decals for sure. Love the orange
Thanks
Your air box will be fine. The boost pressure will more than compensate for any flow rate issues that a small restriction in your air box could cause. If you read 8 psi of boost, the whole system will be at 8 psi. The outlet of the compressor wheel to each and every corner of the air box will be at 8 psi. I have tested this type of theory on diesel trucks- the pressure on one side of the intercooler is the same as the other.
@@beaterbutch3924 thanks for confirming my thoughts
Jason price at price performance here in Michigan would more than likely be able to answer your question about the boost air box. Look him up and reach out
Thanks
How much more power difference with the turbo?? Look's like a ton of work on an already amazing sled.
@@Kq750. 50 hp
Todd do you have any worrys of the boost pushing the slides of the carbs up and it going wfo. Not sure if this is an issue in low boost situations or not.
Boost pressure is a creation of restriction in the engine. The intake box you have made is going to work as a tank/reservoir and the cylinders will take from it as they need it. You'll be find todd.
beautiful sleds and workmanship it will be awesome when you are done for sure cheers
Thanks 👍
Todd, you have to install the original graphics package… The graphic decals are what make the 92 650 “The Pumpkin” otherwise it’s just a black INDY…
Secondly, I am with you on the intake manifold being charged with intake boost at a consistent pressure for each cylinder.
Same gearing and tooth drivers , what’s quicker ? 650 turbo , or 800 Storm
We'll find out I'm sure
Personally. I think it needs orange pin stripes, and no decals kind of look like a sleeper sled.
@@jonathanabeld2326 if there was someone in my area that still did pin strips I would be all over it. It's a dying art here in MN
And I also think as long as the turbo isn't blowing directly into that carb it would distribute pressure evenly
@@bradr464 thank you
I'd do decals. From what I remember from a high performance automotive engines class is you want a smooth, unobstructed passageway for the air to flow before it enters carburetor.
Make an identical post tunnel between the other two carbs
Make the inlet point towards the turbo. It'll have less pipe and better response
Cut a hole in the back and find a 2025 take off air box valve from a boost. Thousands of folks replaced them with a trs valve
That’s a good idea!
One of your subscribers probably has a valve laying around or you could just find a valve from any big twin id think. Then cover that with an outerwear or frogskin
Todd clyne video on a Sunday yes sirrr 💪🏼
Hope you enjoyed it!
Throw 3 boost gauges in the airbox in different locations.. For testing purposes. I'd guess it will be okay, though. Also... I've been watching some stuff on car guys doing blow-through carbureted turbo setups. They say the rule of thumb is base fuel pressure + boost pressure. So if the stock pump supplies 5, and you're running 8lbs boost, you need to be at 13lbs fuel pressure. Idk if that rule applies directly to your setup here, but it will be interesting to see you guys figure it out!
@@jjcdrummer it definitely does and I'll be getting into that. Thanks
@ Looking forward to it! I don’t have the space, resources, or skills you guys do.. So I like to live vicariously through your UA-cam videos. You guys and Nutter give me the sled wrenching fix
So I have a grand national and the rear two cylinders are leaner than the front 4 so a guy developed a plate that sits between the plenum and the intake to help distribute the turbo air coming in more even. The company is RJC racing in the turbo Buick world. So I could see your center carb running more boost than the outer two. He used to use a leaf blower on an intake and show how more air is on the rear cylinder than the fronts. You can do the same and see which holes flow the most and least.
with the boost i think it will be the same in each hole because the piston closes the intake off on the down stroke.
That black machine looks absolutely killer. I say no decals 👌
Decals or not, im going to love it either way 👍
Would a later model Polaris steering post that has an angle or off set work, i know some Polaris twins had that design
No decals. Moderate Orange pinstriping.
I wish someone in our area still did that
@@toddclyne3493 Yeah. First thing I used to do with a new sled was bring it to the painter.
Couldn’t you weld some fittings in the top of the box to check pressure? That seems it would be simple and you could make sure the psi is the same in both ends of the air box. Or just watch the plugs or egt
Orange backlit gauges?
🤔
I think Decals will look awesome!!
@@ScottMartin-y8i 👍
Wife says no decals. I say it must have decals absolutely!!! Again wife stated her opinion😂😂😂😂
@@jasonwilliams4729 happy wife you know the rest 😅
What you will find is the mag side carb is going to run slightly different jetting as long as that box is sealed all 3 carbs will be fed . Boost will be slightly higher on the center hole and pto hole. Remember boost is a measurement of restriction. What makes the power gains is the volume of air at any given psi vers rpm. This is why I say you will find the mag side will be needing different jet sets . If you really want to avoid the jet nightmare you will face build the air box behind the steering shaft and extend the outlets to the carbs. Building a larger box will lower the psi but gain air volume naturally and same goes for building a smaller box will up the psi but lower available volume of air. At 8 to 10 psi you theoretical size of your box should be triple the cc of your engine to match the 1 to 1 ratio of volume to boost needed to make things happy an safe. As far as the fuel no at 8 to 10 psi you can infact get by with 93 but will need to retard the timing a few degrees.
Yes to decals.
Need to do some CFD on the airflow in the air box…
@@gedertr right
Yes decals would be beautiful
@Isaac-sv7xt 😁
I think the air box charge will be ok and not favour the centre carb because you are putting pressure in a total area no matter what’s in the way. That entire area will be under pressure and carbs will pull the charge in as they see fit
@@ONEFASTDAK2 my thoughts also 😁
My 2cents on airbox for what it’s worth is solid baffle to deflect airflow off the center carb & somehow calculate the surface area each can take as the whole point of a box is to distribute air evenly…how to exactly is beyond my abilities tho hahah. You get it tho!
@@justinallen7979 beyond mine also 😅
@@toddclyne3493 somehow you’ll have to get each car the same airflow obvi. in long run…will be tricky keeping it under hood, but best bet might be heading back to Nutter’s & somehow making an another fits under the hood as a collective airbox, but has splitter pipes to each port like those gasser dragsters so all the air comes into a box of sorts but then is distributed to the ports…might look wild tho lol. Someone commented to add the same steering clearance to the others side thus making all ports more equal which could also accomplish the same goal(?). I was concerned seeing the chassis at Princeton😂
**Also can’t wait to see you & Trenton rippin it up on the trails with @Nutter & the crew this season🤘🏻
I think I would finish Jason, and then decide if you want the the graphics or not. It may look naked once you guys get the bumper on with the nose cone and everything is sitting on there the way it should. As for the steering......PSC full hydro set up. Like a rock buggy. LoL
@@BLKXJ96 good call on getting it all together first
Decals for sure and some pinstriping
Gotta have decals ! Sorry Trenton but I’m old school ! I can see just the way it is but come on man …. Gotta have some decals ! Take care and Merry Christmas 🍺🍺
I'd say save the decals for a stock build 92, the turbo sled needs some sweet pinstripes and just a 650 decal and maybe turbo in pinstripe too
Definitely should have decals, make it pop.
@@jackoboat will do
Also go decals on the hood
👍
Decal's for Sure !
@@snowflakesuperbike8294 😁
Skäl
😄
Decals, put an axillary boost bottle for sever demand
I think no decals. But maybe you could tape them up to see what it looks like?
Put me down for no decals. Looks sinister
@@davelowrey2421 right
Jst cut and add two more tubes out the top on both sides of air box and connect them to one at the top. If u dnt think it’ll work so it’ll be even pressure on all sides but idk that’s jst my idea
I believe you're airbox will be fine
Carbs should suck in the air pretty much equal
@@jeffreypatton3321 thanks for your opinion. It definitely helps
Needs decals, for sure
😁
Yes to the decals!
YES ON DECALS
@@jeffreyeldridge5070 thanks
Yeah I'd say do the decals on it to set it off or make it look good
Definitely with decals!
Decals for sure, I’m no engineer but I can’t say I see an issue with your air box, modern turbo sled (Different fuel system and twin cylinders, I know) don’t have separate air horns for the different throttle bodies, not sure why you’d need them in this build either
@@brpmd right on
Needs graphics for identity.
Without them I think it’ll get lost once it’s out with the rest of the collection.
@@StreetersGarage I agree Tom. Bastard is black and we probably don't need two all black sleds
@@toddclyne3493 Great point.
To bad you can't use ghost graphics for decals man that would look cool on that
@@bradr464 I agree 💯
I would make a simple pipe manifold over the top and keep the diffuser plate, just for the safety sake of not toasting that Beautiful engine. Just my $.02
😁
Decals all the way!
Put 500 decals on it , never open the hood at the Bar , let them wonder why they can’t keep up ! Triple sound would still give it away ?
It certainly would
Bet is ? Let’s race , looser buys all night , honest ? It’s a 500
That intake should be fine. It will make a difference. But probably not a big enough difference that it will matter
Merry Christmas
@@oldhomeguy8214 thanks and you also
Looks so good with out decals so I vote no decals
Decals yes but not factory colors need some orange mixed in on the Decals
@@jeffreypatton3321 absolutely
Put decals on it, cant beat 650 punpkin decals
Right on
don't put anything on it man it looks good black and orange
👍
Tough call. I would just scotch tape decals on and look at it for a day or two. It’s does look bad ass the way it is.
Why not just put a camel back into the mag side of the airbox at the top to free up a way for air to get to that side?
Ghost decals. And throw a set of orange bars on it.
Hey all ... I think they would be both be awesome black ,or with the full graphics.
Why not intermittent... fade the original into a black ... either from front to back , or fading in from the bottom hot ,and fading into black. Very slightly... like a ghost image.
Why can't you use a simulor intercooler design ,for the intake .? All my 2 cents . Love you all... Merry Christmas!!!
No decals, that looks sick like that
Central California watching
No question decals
Nice rxl
Thanks
Beartown striping Steve Lesinski flame job
When that air box has boost pressure in it that steering shaft notch will not effect cylinder balance! Take that baffle out!
I know what the solution is for the airbox equal boost issue. It's clear to me that you need two more turbos.
Decals 100%
@@jaydenleu2245 😁
Stock decals please! Otherwise it looks like it could be an Indy Trail.
It needs decals!
@@jrhaines30 👍
Decals…
👍
@Trenton She looks mean as is; no decals🤘🏻
@@justinallen7979 👍