Adding additional sockets to existing ringmain. Cjrelectrical
Вставка
- Опубліковано 7 жов 2020
- Electricians day adding additional bedroom sockets off an existing circuit. Testing out an old circuit.
Minor works certification.
Instagram cjrelectric...
This video is for entertainment purposes only please do not attempt to copy or recreate this video in any way.
Do so at your own peril!!! - Навчання та стиль
Loving the videos! love how neat all the wires are clipped under the floorboard. Every time I pull the floorboard in my old Victorian property or be in the roof and look at how the previous tenant done/got the wiring done it makes me heave and cry at the same time! The 50mm insulation sound like good approach and doesn't eat as much from the room.
Glad you like them!
Don’t recall anything in the Regs about age of cable.......continuity, current carry capacity, volt drop, insulation resistance all ok......then crack on old boy! It’s your signature on the certificate, design, construct, test and review. Loving the vids.
exactly it's about how it tests out. The NICEIC site doesn't even allow 7/.029-3/.029 as an option for test results. Bastards. It's fucking FINE. They're just after everyone's money. Bitter? HELL YES
Congrats on 40k!! Amazing
Thank you 👍
Chris you do good work with a good sense of humour and problem solve very calmly. Keep going mate you’re an inspiration.
A level head and analytical mind regarding trouble shooting is essential in electrical, mechanical, gas and pneumatic work. Anything involving high levels of energy and safety risk. I have seen people come to grief when rushed or in a poor state due to tiredness or "night before" concerns. I worked in a computer factory where all the heavy demanding work was done on Tuesdays to Thursdays, leaving Mondays and Fridays for general tidying up and paperwork. It was there on wiring jobs that I found out about the varying quality of output done on Mondays (not good) and Wednesdays ( the best ) and the absolute imperative need to keep a clear head when dealing with electrical work.
Excellent work and thanks for the content stay safe and take care
I see a Nick/Adam and Chris/James special coming sometime soon👍🏾 lost my stubby hammer in the loft☹️ well done for giving James the opportunity.
Maybe
Good video as usual, nice neat work. Only thing I may have done differently is put the boxes the other way around so the deeper box was to the front. That way no issues with things like usb sockets if they decide to go for it.
Good point Darren I agree but I will say is the new usb sockets on the market now fit within the 25mm back box.
That's a blast from the past, the old 7/029 stranded cable, I can just about remember my dad wiring our previous house with this in the early 1970s, it's was actually better to work with, much more flexible than solid 2.5mm cable.
Interested to see the double back box method for the hollow walls, more solid than the normal dry lining box fixing.
Great camerawork!
Real world mate sorry
Hi Chris thanks for sharing your video with me and I would love to see a lot more of your videos and also the video inspired me and I enjoy the video and the video is very useful
Nice bit of proper plumbing
Such a good build house. New coworker ...
The old school junction box method of cutting the insulation off ensures the ring will always be intact. It also means you can get more wires in safely. And the wires stay put.
I do it for those reasons if I can. Ring continuity is so important if you're stuck with ring final circuits. Only issue is needing to fit cpc sleeving.
Yeah. Although the wires don’t have anywhere to move in them. You could use earth tape.
That’s the best way I do the same
Snow so early? Love snow.. But my California didn't snow yet.. Cheer!
Great vid mate
I love the way you guys do electrical compared to here in Canada
Why not put the 25mm back box at the back and the 50mm box at the front? Give more stability and more room in the back for doing connections. I hate 25mm back boxes with sockets as it can get really tight.
35mm are bad enough for sockets, I second using the 50 on the front end.. but that's me. Cracking job all the same.
And then client calls later and asks one to be swapped for usb socket... bugger!
Click usb compatible with 25mm box
@@Cjrelectrical Fair play, I'll give them a check, I usually use Schneider, probably could put it on a 25mm but I always worry about wires getting pinched in a tight box.
That junction box in the floor probably has value as an antique!
Wow that outside licht is wireless 😇
Nice job and video
Excellent.
Have you taken James on as a full-time apprentice?
Great work lads. Enjoy your vids. Like the detailed explanations.. Perfect for us beginners.
Please explain.. Why galvanised capping wasn't used on wall?
Sorry before I get roasted by the pros I'm a beginner curiosity🤔 is normal 😉. Thanks
More adverts please, I love them !
🥱
Interesting double stacking the back boxes. Doing a similar thing (25mm batten + 50mm insulation + 12mm plasterboard). Was deciding between dry lining boxes or metal back boxes mounted on battens... good to have a 3rd option!
It looked like the second box tries to slide inside. maybe put the rear box backward so they are back to back it would be more stable.
What's wrong with dry lining boxes? Chris said he didn't like them but I'm not sure why.
@@tobysherring1369 wasn't it because they're plastic? Not a sparky myself but seems odd the regs say metal boards now, but plastic dry wall back box is OK? Bit odd if you ask me.
@@ItzD3fW1sH that could be it. But plastic faceplates and plastic conduit are still allowed. Where do you stop?
@@tobysherring1369 well that's it isn't it where do you draw the line. We just had a rewire and now have metal hager box. Guy said there's nout wrong with the old one we had... But regs were regs.
I still find it funny how over there you used to use stranded cable & now solid but here in Australia it's the opposite.
Hell I've got 70+ year old wiring in places and it's fine. There is a copper pipe, between 2 parts of the building concreted into the floors, which I'm guessing is mineral insulated inside. Because the walls are so thick I use that circuit to carry my LAN to the rest of the building using the Homeplug system and it is great for that too.
tbh as long as you put crimper ends on the cable it would be ok.
could someone tell me the name of thah black stuff CJR used on back boxex to prevent moisture damp .
I find most customers who have skirtingboard height sockets tend to want their sockets below 450mm. They always seem to think its too high and I have to agree it can look odd. I usually put them in at 400mm in that case. Near enough I guess...
Install it to what your customer wants.. if sockets are 300mm off shirt put yours in at that what change the height of 1or 2 sockets fir the sake of what the regs say?!.. it’s only guidance
It’s not a new build mate it’s a refurbishment so part m does not apply here.
as a DIYer i only use wago 221's for everything includng my light circuits (but not the cooker circuit which is 6mm T&E) is there any problem with using wago 221 for everything? I chose them as a one stop solution for my reno. since the handle up to 4mm T&E and up to 32amp but have i missed something a to why the pro's still use the other types of wago connector also? is it just cost per unit? or some technical reason?
No false radials when Chris is around!
tinned copper was not war shortage... it was just how it was done. originally it was to stop the copper affecting the rubber insulation. for several years, the manufacturers just carried on using tinned conductors with pvc insulation. Why change? When they were forced to change by switching to metric... they discontinued the tinning
Hiya what wagos would you have put on if that was a final ring instead of a radial cheers
If IR is OK on the cable and continuity OK, fine by me. Just check the physical integrity of the cable though, as moving it can cause IR to fail instantly. For the cost of a bit of 2.5 T&E I would just pull some new in for peace of mind. and copper is better than tinned copper on terminals too. Wago boxes i get from screwfix often have the mounting lug missing, i think the fall out in the storage bins in screfix lol. I always check before I leave the store now. Also, a tiewrap for MF compatibility is a bit of a nonsense really, but hey ho... lol Enjoyed that, hope your apprentice is doing great, get him off his phone though, that would annoy the hell out of me ;-) focus...
Please make sure you bully James and make him feel totally inadequate and ruin any chance of confidence he ever shows so he wants to quit the electrical industry every day he is an apprentice....Just to keep the tradition of the 80's and 90's going..ya know! (sarcasm)
Love seeing the upbringing the apprentices get in today's day relative to the olden days where coffin dodgers thought every counting second of the work day was meant for bullying or abusing apprentices to "tuffen them up".
Thumbs up, liking the content with you getting a helping hand to make jobs that much easier.
That attitude was/is arrogant and just breeds resentment IMHO. Not all the old days were good.
Given that the wall needs to be insulated (curious about that too) might it have been better not to fit back boxes at all at this point? Wait for new plasterboard and then fit plastic back boxes. Thanks for the videos, enjoy them all.
I think this is personal preference. If you fit metal boxes then you can be confident that your socket won't get insulated over. You also don't have to remember exactly where you left your cables in the wall in order to cut in your box. And you won't start cutting in the box to find studwork or other obstructions in the way. Metal boxes fixed solidly to a wall (or noggin) also tend to be a bit more solid when screwing back the faceplate.
Not to say there aren't good reasons to use dry lining boxes too, just that I can see why he chose to fit metal this time.
@@TheMattSturgeon Thanks for the reply. I take your point about personal preference. I was just thinking that if the client is batoning and insulating because of damp or condensation problems then attaching metal boxes to the cold wall may bridge the thermal gap and be somewhere warm moist air could condense. Also I find cutting plasterboard fit perfectly around an existing box is more of a faff than cutting new and pulling the cables through. But in this case Chris isn't fitting the plasterboard :-)
4:46 Hello James 👋
Hi sir We regularly did work on schools in my time . And they all had a program of replacing old bulkhead fitting for 2D type fittings . I was asked to replace a fitting mounted under an outside canopy . When I arrived the light was on . While waiting for the caretaker to get the key to the cupboard where the dis board was located . I thought I might as we take the cover of the fitting , and yes I did switch it off at the s/w . As the cover came down so did a torrent of water , not only was the fitting full but the cavity above was . So I got absolutely drowned. But the thing is how come that circuit continued to work ? . Obviously There was no R.C.D on the circuit , but you would have expected with that amount of water , a dead sort . No some how that just didn’t happen . I’m shore some of you out there will have had similar experiences . And if you’re wondering , I disconnected the relevant circuit at the D. B. Till the roof was repaired . Finally returning some time later to install a new fitting . Making sure to use plenty of silicon . Just seeing your good self with that outside light brought it all back . Great work as always , those wago boxes are definitely a big improvement on the old types. Keep up the good work Kind regards. Mike in the U.K. 👍
Yeah, pure water isn't a great conductor - try checking the resistance of distilled water some time!
@@tonyjover Add salt and minerals for extra spice lol.
Tony Quinsee-Jover hi sir yes you’ve definitely got a point , still I don’t think I’d like to put it to the test all the same 😄 I suppose it’s an electricians constant belief that water and electricity don’t make good bed fellows . Thank again for replying. Best wishes and kind regards from Mike in the U.K.
what are those keys to remove them bizzare screws called and where can you get one.....? external lamp needs replacing......... Great video :)
Chris, You need a head cam
I do own one but it’s a pain sorry
Seamed more like a body cam today.
I am just so surprised at the amount of hidden junction boxes and that is acceptable. Something that they don't allow in the US. Would suck if you had full interlocking wooden floor or tile for example, you could never get to it without ripping it all up.
They're only allowed in the UK if they are either accessible or maintenance free - a fairly recent standard that is deemed to not need future attention.
Yet I find a sht ton of them anyways imagine if it was code
Probably be cheaper to get access from the plasterboard ceiling underneath if they had unterlocking floor. Obviously if it was ground floor your goosed!
I mean sometimes it's the only way
Are wagos the industry standard?
Them old lights are worth a bit on eBay.
A previous owner had replaced all of my homes 50yo cable because it was aluminum. The late 60s was a sad time for electricians. At least they didn’t find an asbestos.
Have you seen sockitz allows for full IP rating while other works are carried out
Yeah good for plastering but not plaster boarding.
50 year old cables would be from 1970. Was plastic insulation not good in 1970 ? Does plastic wear out ?
why do you use 1mm for down lighters
Hi Chris, what chisel bit is that?
Mortar rake
I got a Mcalister level too 😂
Superb
I love these videos, proper late to the party! If you still look at these comments, how come those wagobox junctions down rate the connectors to 20a? On a 32a ring what’s the logic behind it all? Is it safe to use them? I’m not an electrician, just interested and I’m fed up of idiots in the comments moaning at this 🤣
Good vids all round recently. Just very weird camera work on the ladder 🤣
Sorry about that
If it’s stranded cable shouldn’t it be re wired?? Or is that just good practice rather than regs?
Where on earth did you get that from?
@@lewis94uk Probably confused it with TRS or VIR singles.
Where do u get work fron
I'm sure it was a slip of the tongue.
The red cable is the phase conductor not "the live" as neutral is also live.
If the cable's still pliable and passes the tests, why not?
Hi Chris can you answer a question for me is it a regulation to clip all electrical cables to the joists above a ceiling as I've ripped an old lath and plaster ceiling down today in a derelict house that has already had the first fix (the sparky has had all the upstairs floors up to feed for the downstairs lighting)
And all his cables are virtually hanging from the walls and none of them were clipped, just want to know where I stand with the customer as sparky is saying they don't 😂 just so you know they were just sat on top of the lath, now obviously will make it difficult for me to reboard with it looking like spaghetti junction
It's a good debate. Where practible yes but laying direct on plaster in a ceiling is a known method.
@@tresslerj1985 OK so it's not fire regs to have them clipped? I was always under the impression that it poses an electric hazard to fire fighters incase of a collapse of the ceiling in a fire because live wires will be hanging down, am I wrong? I'm literally just asking a question aswel so don't crucify me I'm not a sparky and havnt got that much knowledge of electrics so appreciate any feedback
Probably not on older buildings as say if it's under floorboards rewiring you wouldn't be able to get every single floorboard up for example to get at the cables to clip them, they would be drawn in especially lifting carpets and furniture as well.
And if in the loft they would mostly be layed between the joists.
It could also depends on how much time the electrician was given to wire the house if they have say quite a few to wire.
Obviously any new builds would be stricter where to place cable.
Sorry I can't give a regulation number off hand
NEW builds are likely to be different with building & Electrical regulations.
If it was me I’d be back to clip them all
@@paultipton743 OK that's great thanks for your take on the situation, suppose it makes sense really as like you say he couldn't really access every Joist but he has had most of the floor up but still, I'm not going to slate the bloke over a few clips if it's acceptable in circumstances thats good with me 👍
Byyyyeeeeeee! xD
They let you guys conceal joints in walls and floors? I would not recommend doing that. Asking for trouble
Would it of not been quicker to put new wiring in?
No the consumer unit is full and quite a long run from the bedroom. The circuit also fed downstairs so would of been a Rewire of 3/4 of the house sockets
Wouldn't it be cheaper to replace all the cables than to run around and test and troubleshoot?
You should get a go pro and head mount it for when you are filming up ladders and working on things which need both hands mate. It will make for much better content and everyone will appreciate it! Great channel though fella. Keep it up.
Really sorry I do have a go pro and head cam but quicker and easier for me to use the phone
@@Cjrelectrical Ahh dont be sorry, we all know what its like when your on the job fella!
7:39 is that someone's wedding ring in the floor?
Looks like an offcut of 15mm copper pipe
@@JohnWatkinsUK was going to type that lol, any tips for finding work experience in the uk for electricians?
Wondered where I lost mine
@@JohnWatkinsUK that still doesn't exclude it
I would have run new at least where it was readily accessible. At least from the first socket to the last accessible socket. It’s a false economy to reuse 50 -60 year old cable when new will give you another 60 or 70 years. By the time you strip out the old JBs and replace them you’d be better with new.
Is this a head cam? You're making me feel sick. Content nice.
cannot see what is going on
Chris not a dig but had to stop watching the video as the camera all over the shop man, getting dizzy looking at it. Video like your a surgeon doing delicate work, tks
Sorry about that
oof. Are all british houses built with hollow wooden floors and ceilings that people just drill their installation shit right through? 'Cause that's all I seem to see on british electrician channels. That's all so 50 years backwards.. (not to mention still doing ring circuits..)
I can't see what you are doing?
Quicker doin a rewire
You missed out
Not on this occasion I was lucky 👍
Look at the Huepar laser cheaper and it's really good can get one that pulses so it can be used like a rotating laser for when your doing you handy man jobs🤣.
Why you get called for being multi skilled really is bad.
I've had people tell me I'm a handyman.
I'm not I just offer the complete package and variety keeps me sane.
Can recommend the Imex LX22G Cross Line green beam Laser
I am Indian ELECTRATION for very experience at home lighting fitting
Your cable bends are a bit tight!
Getting dangerously close to fouling BS 7671 minimum internal radii of bend
This must be every single house in the uk will a 15mm hole cause that property any problems .... who knows
Electrical nonsense aside, did I spot Apple juice in the freezer?
I would advise against using old tinned copper(the wire flexes often over it's lifetime and is prone to flaking copper. copper tarnish may also be an issue) but if it meets code and that's what the contractor/owner wants there's not much you can do because it's customer decision. I would warn them and make them sign agreement that you never replaced the wire as per their request though.
How can the copper tarnish if it's tinned?
Imperial T&E
PVC twin
Older T&E wiring having fairly similar construction to today's cables. Conductors were stranded & tinned to prevent reaction with rubber insulation.
These old cables had a bit smaller earth wires than today's. They were also available with no earth conductor.
Several versions exist:
Ashathene T&E
Polythene sheath, precursor to PVC T&E
Lasts well
PVC outer VIR inner
an early T&E cable
where the inner rubber has failed, the tails can be sleeved
2 core Twin
no earth, used for lighting circuits, or power circuits with a separate (usually uninsulated) single run alongside to provide an earth conductor.
PVC and ashathene versions of this cable last well and are usually in good condition, but rubber does not last well long term.
PVC outer rubber inner cable can have its rubber ends sleeved to make it safe, as its only the ends where exposed to air where the rubber becomes brittle and falls off. Cable with rubber outer insulation can not be made safe this way.
Sizes:
1/.044" T&E = 1 mm²
3/.029 T&E
means 3 strands each of 0.029" diameter
used for lighting circuits
1.27 mm²
3/.036 = 1.94 mm²
7/.029 T&E
imperial 7 stranded version of 2.5mm² T&E
used for socket circuits until unstranded 2.5mm T&E was introduced around 1970
strands are 0.029" diameter = 0.74mm
xsa 2.9 mm², rated 25A continuous in 14th edition (with a rewirable fuse)
7/.036 = 4.5mm²
7/.044 = 6.5mm²
unstranded lighting cable also used
7/.052 = 9.35mm²
7/.064 = 14.5mm²
Red T&E
Early 1970s
@@Cjrelectrical thanks, Chris, my point with the previous commenter was that the idea of tinning is that it inhibits corrosion. I was hoping he would come back with some counter arguement to back up his comment
Totally agree the cable once cut back and made off again was in fantastic condition better in fact than newer twin and earth.
@@Cjrelectrical Sorry I got dyslexic and thought it was the copper platted onto tin wires.
May I suggest wagos be made off with a little more care and mechanical sympathy .. that was frighteningly hamfisted for an electrician.
Mate it’s really annoying when you point the camera at the wall for ages ....can’t you use a tripod? I like your vids but I don’t want to look at a wall for a few minutes
Every electrician loves looking at the wall for several minutes. It's the only time we get to think!
If the cable tests fine, it's ok to use. 50 yr old cable is usually better than shit from the 80s. MI can be good after 70 or 80 yrs. Ignore the NIC/napit/whoever who 'reccommend' rewiring after x number of years. brain dead marketing companies both of em. I've seen stuff from the 1960s still fine, and stuff from the early 2000's that's been DIY dave'd to hell.
The exception to that is that black rubber TRS shit. I've seen lead sheathed pass fine... but that 1930s-40s black rubber will fall apart if you look at it.
Green lasers are absolutely crap. You can hardly see them on white walls. Keep the Mac laser
Chris , you really need to do something about you're camera work , half the video is either staring at a brick wall or looking down at the floor
sorry
Yo mate get a gopro..
sorry to say but missed a lot ??
Chopping out for those boxes and allowing all the plaster and brick fragments to fall between the joist and wall ???? If that was ground level you are potentially causing a bridge for damp to cross over from the wall into the joist. Even if upstairs it's still just using the ceiling/floor void as a dump for the waste. Lazy workmansip mate. I would not be impressed. It takes just takes less than a minute to put a dust sheet or old towel underneath to collect the waste and then dispose of it.
All the floors were cleaned and hoover out after the job was finished the customer is taking every bit of plaster off the walls to batten our insulate and plasterboard. Thanks for the comment
@@Cjrelectrical Well you will have to let me know what vacuum cleaner can get down between a 2-3cm gap between the wall and joist to remove the crap that was totally unnecssarily put there. And you would not have to spend a lot of time hoovering it all up if you had prevented it getting there in the first place ! Sorry mate, no brainer.
All locations that were chased out had open floors the one that james did had a gap of about an inch easily accessible with my long hoover attachment.
@@Cjrelectrical Well look at it from purely a time pespective. You'd rather spend money employing your guy (or you) to spend time sucking up all the debris with your hoover (which will probably clog up regularly) than collect the debris as it is created by putting a sheet or old towel down so you can transfer it to a bucket in seconds ? I know which method I use. If you are chopping out in a room that still has carpet and furniture in it do you bother with dust sheets ? Or prefer to let everything get covered in dust so you can hoover it up and wipe the furniture down later ? Professionalism in the way you work is not just about how good you think you are at your particular trade/skill.
Don't want to me that guy, I like watching these videos to see an domestic environment. But put some safety shoes on, you cant have your apprentice having more sense than you.
What hazard are you suggesting he is failing to protect himself against?
I do normally wear them but I have a bad knee at the moment which the boots don’t help. Lighter boots needed.
Just because it's a domestic job doesn't mean that you shouldn't wear appropriate PPE. Walking around a partial floor where there may be exposed nails, large splinters etc, handling drills, knives etc that can fall on your feet... my risk assessment would call for safety footwear.
@@JimWhitaker I suggest you watch the video again, You cant tell me wearing safety boots would be the less safe alternative than shoes ?
A lot of talking and drinking coffee and testing wires.