Ooh, Desert Elves. Mabinogi had Desert Elves, and they were, earlier on in the Mabinogi story line, Connected to a stone obelisk called the Memory Tower, which shared everyone's memories with everyone else, giving a pseudo-Hive Mind Desert Elf race and I thought that was very cool.
I ran an Egyptian flavored (more or less) back in the 2nd Ed days..made an elf called a 'sun elf'..really easy, played the with weapon proficiencies- scimitar instead of longsword- ect
Yes! Those will resume next week! They totally escaped me for some reason and I forgot about them for a while, but they will make their triumphant return next Wednesday!
Cool video and great job on Paizo. However, I wonder: Don't all these "longevity" feats make the *elves*, instead of humans, the most versatile ancestry of 2e?
11:44 Yes and No :P It's a worse improved initative because it only works when you roll Perception. BUT what's great about it is that it lets you go first if you tie with an enemy in the initiative order, which is awesome!
I was about to say the same thing. It's better for characters who will almost always use perception, but Rogues and Face characters will find better use in Incredible Initiative.
I do love all of these deep dives but man Nonnat, it does make me miss those AD&D 2E and 3.5 days when races just came with the entire package :p Keep up the fantastic work!
Apparently, someone at Paizo is an Elfquest fan - i mean, telepathy, arctic elves and desert elves? Add wolf companions and you got pretty much the first 30 issues...
So quick question: If you take Elven Weapon Familiarity as an Elf Champion of Iomedae, does your longsword become a D10 due to deific weapon? Elven Weapon Familiarity states "martial elf weapons are simple weapons" and includes the longsword in its list. The Holy weapon of Iomedae is the longsword. I guess my main question is does the longsword count as a "martial elf weapon" even though it doesn't have the "elf" trait.
Sounds and looks like you need to take the Desert elf heritage yourself with that heat. XD I'm with you on the second level spell being a heightened level 1.
I was thinking the same thing, but not on Golarion. Darksun is a Wizard's property. I can't even think of any desert elves off the top of my head in Golarion.
I know desert elves have been mentioned a couple of times in various 1e supplements, but I don't know if they've been covered in any detail. "Elves of Golarion" mentions desert elves in a 1-sentence throwaway.
Having a crud ton of knowledge but not being able to use it all at the same time is a cool justification for why they aren't stupidly overpowered and serves as a reasonable balancing act as well; instead of saying oh they're just lazy it could be that despite their vast amount of experience each individual Elf is just one guy so it takes quite a bit of skill to consistently make use of all their knowledge. Also I think Wood Elves should have their Intelligence bonus and Constitution penalty reversed
quick question to anyone reading this. do you use an app like pathbuilder to build your characters? i love pathbuilder, but i noticed it's kind of lacking when you choose the witch dedication. doesnt show the familiar or the familiar abilties.....
Yes I use pathbuilder for the most part, it is just great quality overall and free or $5 to support them. It really is just too nice to not use. Players can literally make low level characters within minutes. Bonus if you use Foundry since you can directly import the characters! I haven't used familiars/animal companions much. You familiar abilities can change EVERY day so there really isn't much a point doing much with them for the app imo.
i keep dabbling with pathbuilder, and i stumbled upon something you said(that i somehow missed the first time) about ancient elves. the dedication HAS to be multiclass.....which really makes no sense given the explanation they give for it. if you've lived the equivalent of many human lives, you could have been an alchemist, but somehow not a beast master? or you could have been a champion but not a herbalist? a swashbuckler but not a pirate? a monk but not a martial artist? i hope there's an errata coming out to fix that.....
Hey Nonat, I know it's offtopic but I need an answer for this please.. If you cast Animate Dead (Zombies), how many actions do they have, 1 or 2? Since they're Slowed 1
They would have 2 actions. A zombie from the "Animate Dead" spell doesn't suffer from it's slowed condition because it's a "Minion". Minions don't regain actions per turn like normal characters. Instead, the zombie just gets 2 actions whenever you spend an action to sustain the spell, so the slowed condition does nothing to them.
@@Nonat1s Thank you very much!! I've been asking it to lots of people and half of them say they've 1 action and half say they've 2, the only agreement is: depends on the GM's interpretation. Where can I find what you just said?
I would allow a heightened 1st level spell as the 2nd level spell for Otherworldly Accumen if thats what the player wants. It's only once per day so it wouldn't be that big of a deal.
Hey man, I was playing abaut 8 months of a pathfinder campaign during the last year. I created some homebrew like an Earth Bloodline Sorcerer that I tried to keep pretty balanced while converting the idea from 1E. You mind if I send them to you for something of a quick intermission episode? I also have 2 ancestries but those are a bit insane as one is an obsure monstous race while the other is a take at an outsider halfbreed.
If you want to join the discord, feel free to DM them to me! If I got enough people interested, I would LOVE to start a series reviewing homebrew from other people! That'd be a blast!
Possibly the idea comes from going way back to dungeons and dragons the world of Athis elves lived in the desert running around… And just like drown it’s probably an idea that simply carried over to Pathfinder
i completely agree that ancient elf is overpowered. i've been trying to abuse the rules to make a powerful wizard. an ancient elf wizard with witch dedication and the patron that allows divine spells, and the metamagic thesis allows you to start at level 1 with a familiar, and metamagic, and being able to cast divine spells using intelligence as your casting attribute. that also allows you to cast 2 spells per round. you cast a spell that takes 2 actions, and then use 1 action to command your familiar to cast a 2-action spell. and that's just at level 1.
Your particular build doesn't really do that much and I think you are misunderstanding some things. You just get two divine cantrips and a weak familiar with one ability, it takes you to level 8 and 1 feat to get "okay" divine spellcasting. The good thing about Ancient Elf is it free up your level 2 feat if you were already going to take a multi-class dedications and really wanted a level 2 feat. It is definitely is really good especially when you compare to what most heritages do. I think you are misunderstanding familiars, you cant use them to cast spells for 1 action until very high level for a weak spell. The only way to cast a spell with a familiar is the spellcasting familiar ability which has to be 5 levels lower, so a minimum of level 11.
@@youtubenoremac3314 perhaps i got the familiar mechanics wrong. from what i understood your familiar counts as a minion. and your familiar spells arent cast by you, but by the familiar. and most spells take 2 actions to cast. and ordering minions(which includes familiars) takes 1 action. did i get those things correctly or not? so by choosing a patron that grants you the ability to cast divine spells, does that not mean you can learn divine spells? and that your spell casting attribute for them is intelligence?
@@sabin97 Oh I see where you getting that info from, your familiar is basically just a Witch spellbook. They aren't actually casting the spells on their turn themselves, familiars are almost all utility. There are definitely some creatives uses for them in combat though. When you get spellcasting they are completely different you can't just start putting divine spells into your Wizard Spellbook. I will try to explain... For a Wizard at level 8 You can prepare: 3 arcane spells for each level (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th) Assuming you take Basic Spellcasting at level 4 with Witch dedication at level 8... You can prepare: 1 divine spell for each level (1st, 2nd, 3rd) So for a level 8 Wizard with Basic Witch Spellcasting you can prepare... 3 arcane spells for each level (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th) 1 divine spell for each level (1st, 2nd, 3rd) So yes you can learn divine spells but they are separate and you prepare them in the Witch slots not the Wizard. Hopefully that helps, someone else could probably explain it better. There are a lot of PF2 feats/archetypes that can cause exceptions but for the most part every spellcasting archetype you take can't be cast from the other, this applies to spontaneous casters to, if you are a Sorcerer with Bard dedications you don't just get "more spells" they are separate spells.
@@youtubenoremac3314 maybe i misread you, but from what you typed it seems like you are describing a wizard with divine spells, casted with the intelligence modifier. weird. i was under the impression that familiars could cast spells. but apparently they cant. well i'm now assuming that they cant as nowhere does it explicitly say that they can.
@@sabin97 yes you can cast divine spells with intellect but you dont get decent divine spells for quite awhile. Once you are level 8 you do get okay spellcasting, at 12+ is when spellcasting dedications start to feel really good.
Hmm, it's hard to say due to vague rulings, but the general consensus is "No, you can't do this." Mostly because of the archetype text saying "You cannot select another dedication feat until you have gained two other feats..". It really comes down to your table, though. In my opinion, RAW, you could do it. My reasoning is that neither Ancient Elf or Trickster say "Select a dedication". They say "Pick a Class/Archetype and GAIN that dedication. So technically you aren't selecting the dedication specifically. You're picking the associated class, and gaining the dedication as a bonus. It's SUPER nit-picky though. Most people are saying it wouldn't fly in Organized Play.
Eldritch Trickster is a Rogue Racket, so yes. You wouldn't even need to be an Ancient Elf. Or did you mean to double down on dedications to essentially get a dip in 3 classes. You can not because the Dedication feats state: You cannot select another dedication feat until you have gained two other feats from the alchemist archetype.
If you are not in Organized play, ask your GM and see how they feel about it. Personally, i say yes, you can, BUT, you have to finish the requisites on one before you get to work the other... That is, until Paizo Errata's it out.
I thought I would bring this up because I forgot to bring it up under your human 101 video… You kept saying you don’t know where the idea comes from the humans are so stubborn and persistent… In just about every single fantasy world ever invented where they talk about the future if they do talk about the future… They talk about the magical race is dying out and humans being the only intelligent race left to control the world… This is where that comes from. Humans believe they are better than everybody else because they’re obnoxious and that’s the way humans behave… And eventually they will as a race outlive everybody else
This video is making me want to roll up an Ancestor Elf Barbarian who mixes spellcasting and raging combatant stuff. I know raging doesn't allow spellcasting, but I like the flavor. Already have a ton of ideas for such Elves in my own setting. XD I love this video.
I see it. Moment of Clarity. In terms of casting, I was originally thinking something like Imperial Sorcerer. Druid or Wizard might mesh better, but I like the options.
I don't like that Wandering Heart isn't optional. Now your cavern elf loses darkvision if they spend a week in the arctic and they have to spend a whole week underground to get it back. Spend a long time in the woods? Welp, lost you darkvision gotta spend a week in a cave without darkvision because you did something not really that unusual. Paizo releases an ocean terrain elf? Whelp going on a boat trip is really annoying now.
Ooh, Desert Elves.
Mabinogi had Desert Elves, and they were, earlier on in the Mabinogi story line, Connected to a stone obelisk called the Memory Tower, which shared everyone's memories with everyone else, giving a pseudo-Hive Mind Desert Elf race and I thought that was very cool.
I ran an Egyptian flavored (more or less) back in the 2nd Ed days..made an elf called a 'sun elf'..really easy, played the with weapon proficiencies- scimitar instead of longsword- ect
The ancestry and class deep dives are great. Keep them up. Also, could we continue with the archetype videos?
Yes! Those will resume next week! They totally escaped me for some reason and I forgot about them for a while, but they will make their triumphant return next Wednesday!
@@Nonat1s If you could do the Lost Omens archetypes after the Advanced Player's Guide ones, that would be fantastic!
Cool video and great job on Paizo. However, I wonder: Don't all these "longevity" feats make the *elves*, instead of humans, the most versatile ancestry of 2e?
11:44 Yes and No :P
It's a worse improved initative because it only works when you roll Perception. BUT what's great about it is that it lets you go first if you tie with an enemy in the initiative order, which is awesome!
I was about to say the same thing. It's better for characters who will almost always use perception, but Rogues and Face characters will find better use in Incredible Initiative.
I do love all of these deep dives but man Nonnat, it does make me miss those AD&D 2E and 3.5 days when races just came with the entire package :p Keep up the fantastic work!
You made me buy the Character Guide.
All of these deep dives are aces. I’m brand new to the system and love them so much. Making my first character tonight.
Apparently, someone at Paizo is an Elfquest fan - i mean, telepathy, arctic elves and desert elves? Add wolf companions and you got pretty much the first 30 issues...
I'd allow the a heightened 1st level spell for otherworldly accumen
So quick question: If you take Elven Weapon Familiarity as an Elf Champion of Iomedae, does your longsword become a D10 due to deific weapon? Elven Weapon Familiarity states "martial elf weapons are simple weapons" and includes the longsword in its list. The Holy weapon of Iomedae is the longsword. I guess my main question is does the longsword count as a "martial elf weapon" even though it doesn't have the "elf" trait.
Very cool stuff. I missed the Dwarf so I'm going to go back and check that out. Amazing work!
I'm new to pf2 and loving these ancestry guides. Any plans to do the other ancestries that are out now, the uncommon and rare stuff?
Yes! Not sure when, but I-m slowly working my way through ancestries in the order of which they came out!
@@Nonat1s awesome! Thanks for the reply :)
Sounds and looks like you need to take the Desert elf heritage yourself with that heat. XD
I'm with you on the second level spell being a heightened level 1.
All those longevity feats makes me want to be adopted by elves, although unfortunately many races die of old age before they reach 101
Desert elves? That's Dark Sun, but those elves have a lot more of a brutal flavor.
I was thinking the same thing, but not on Golarion. Darksun is a Wizard's property. I can't even think of any desert elves off the top of my head in Golarion.
I know desert elves have been mentioned a couple of times in various 1e supplements, but I don't know if they've been covered in any detail. "Elves of Golarion" mentions desert elves in a 1-sentence throwaway.
Its With_Crabby from Caffeine. Glad you’re doing well 😄
Having a crud ton of knowledge but not being able to use it all at the same time is a cool justification for why they aren't stupidly overpowered and serves as a reasonable balancing act as well; instead of saying oh they're just lazy it could be that despite their vast amount of experience each individual Elf is just one guy so it takes quite a bit of skill to consistently make use of all their knowledge.
Also I think Wood Elves should have their Intelligence bonus and Constitution penalty reversed
Hi man, I love your vids :3 Hope you get more viewers, it's useful stuff~
Good stuff, can't wait till we get to Lizardfolk
you mean iruxi
@@marthachampagne316 I do
quick question to anyone reading this.
do you use an app like pathbuilder to build your characters?
i love pathbuilder, but i noticed it's kind of lacking when you choose the witch dedication. doesnt show the familiar or the familiar abilties.....
Yes I use pathbuilder for the most part, it is just great quality overall and free or $5 to support them. It really is just too nice to not use. Players can literally make low level characters within minutes. Bonus if you use Foundry since you can directly import the characters! I haven't used familiars/animal companions much. You familiar abilities can change EVERY day so there really isn't much a point doing much with them for the app imo.
@@youtubenoremac3314
your spells can also change every day and yet they are included.
Desert Elves existed in a comic book series called ElfQuest
Old video, but had to add that Dark Sun setting also has them... basically out of necessity.
"You have to be one of these ethnicities that I'm not going to try to pronounce"
Proceeds to immediately try to pronounce them.
i keep dabbling with pathbuilder, and i stumbled upon something you said(that i somehow missed the first time) about ancient elves. the dedication HAS to be multiclass.....which really makes no sense given the explanation they give for it. if you've lived the equivalent of many human lives, you could have been an alchemist, but somehow not a beast master? or you could have been a champion but not a herbalist? a swashbuckler but not a pirate?
a monk but not a martial artist?
i hope there's an errata coming out to fix that.....
Thanks to this, I just might actually make an elf lol
Hey Nonat, I know it's offtopic but I need an answer for this please..
If you cast Animate Dead (Zombies), how many actions do they have, 1 or 2? Since they're Slowed 1
They would have 2 actions. A zombie from the "Animate Dead" spell doesn't suffer from it's slowed condition because it's a "Minion". Minions don't regain actions per turn like normal characters. Instead, the zombie just gets 2 actions whenever you spend an action to sustain the spell, so the slowed condition does nothing to them.
@@Nonat1s Thank you very much!! I've been asking it to lots of people and half of them say they've 1 action and half say they've 2, the only agreement is: depends on the GM's interpretation. Where can I find what you just said?
I would allow a heightened 1st level spell as the 2nd level spell for Otherworldly Accumen if thats what the player wants. It's only once per day so it wouldn't be that big of a deal.
Nonat1s, how i can play with drow in PF 2?
The Elven Longevity line is basically Taskmaster from Marvel! Hahahahaha!
Hey man, I was playing abaut 8 months of a pathfinder campaign during the last year. I created some homebrew like an Earth Bloodline Sorcerer that I tried to keep pretty balanced while converting the idea from 1E. You mind if I send them to you for something of a quick intermission episode?
I also have 2 ancestries but those are a bit insane as one is an obsure monstous race while the other is a take at an outsider halfbreed.
If you want to join the discord, feel free to DM them to me! If I got enough people interested, I would LOVE to start a series reviewing homebrew from other people! That'd be a blast!
Ancient elven eldritch rogues for dual dedication. Add ancestry paragon and dual class for real mix.
There are desert elves in Dragonlance’s Age of Mortals.
Elves: "Now I know Kung Fu."
0:42 the video starts
Possibly the idea comes from going way back to dungeons and dragons the world of Athis elves lived in the desert running around… And just like drown it’s probably an idea that simply carried over to Pathfinder
I have twitter for this type of purpose. Followed ^^
You're the best type of person. ♥
i completely agree that ancient elf is overpowered.
i've been trying to abuse the rules to make a powerful wizard.
an ancient elf wizard with witch dedication and the patron that allows divine spells, and the metamagic thesis allows you to start at level 1 with a familiar, and metamagic, and being able to cast divine spells using intelligence as your casting attribute.
that also allows you to cast 2 spells per round.
you cast a spell that takes 2 actions, and then use 1 action to command your familiar to cast a 2-action spell.
and that's just at level 1.
Your particular build doesn't really do that much and I think you are misunderstanding some things. You just get two divine cantrips and a weak familiar with one ability, it takes you to level 8 and 1 feat to get "okay" divine spellcasting. The good thing about Ancient Elf is it free up your level 2 feat if you were already going to take a multi-class dedications and really wanted a level 2 feat. It is definitely is really good especially when you compare to what most heritages do.
I think you are misunderstanding familiars, you cant use them to cast spells for 1 action until very high level for a weak spell. The only way to cast a spell with a familiar is the spellcasting familiar ability which has to be 5 levels lower, so a minimum of level 11.
@@youtubenoremac3314
perhaps i got the familiar mechanics wrong.
from what i understood your familiar counts as a minion. and your familiar spells arent cast by you, but by the familiar.
and most spells take 2 actions to cast.
and ordering minions(which includes familiars) takes 1 action.
did i get those things correctly or not?
so by choosing a patron that grants you the ability to cast divine spells, does that not mean you can learn divine spells? and that your spell casting attribute for them is intelligence?
@@sabin97 Oh I see where you getting that info from, your familiar is basically just a Witch spellbook. They aren't actually casting the spells on their turn themselves, familiars are almost all utility. There are definitely some creatives uses for them in combat though.
When you get spellcasting they are completely different you can't just start putting divine spells into your Wizard Spellbook. I will try to explain...
For a Wizard at level 8
You can prepare: 3 arcane spells for each level (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th)
Assuming you take Basic Spellcasting at level 4 with Witch dedication at level 8...
You can prepare: 1 divine spell for each level (1st, 2nd, 3rd)
So for a level 8 Wizard with Basic Witch Spellcasting you can prepare...
3 arcane spells for each level (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th)
1 divine spell for each level (1st, 2nd, 3rd)
So yes you can learn divine spells but they are separate and you prepare them in the Witch slots not the Wizard. Hopefully that helps, someone else could probably explain it better. There are a lot of PF2 feats/archetypes that can cause exceptions but for the most part every spellcasting archetype you take can't be cast from the other, this applies to spontaneous casters to, if you are a Sorcerer with Bard dedications you don't just get "more spells" they are separate spells.
@@youtubenoremac3314
maybe i misread you, but from what you typed it seems like you are describing a wizard with divine spells, casted with the intelligence modifier.
weird. i was under the impression that familiars could cast spells. but apparently they cant. well i'm now assuming that they cant as nowhere does it explicitly say that they can.
@@sabin97 yes you can cast divine spells with intellect but you dont get decent divine spells for quite awhile. Once you are level 8 you do get okay spellcasting, at 12+ is when spellcasting dedications start to feel really good.
Goblins next ?
Desert elves are in Dark sun. But they are quite different as a race compared to P2e.
Ancient elf fighter FTW.
Wait! You didn't finish Barbarians!
Barbarians will be finished tomorrow!
Thank you once again. I am making an elf barbarian and needed to freshen up on what I knew.
*Tosses inferior races into the fires of sacrifice*
I 💚 elves 🍃🍂
I doubt this works, but can you make an ancient elf eldritch trickster
Hmm, it's hard to say due to vague rulings, but the general consensus is "No, you can't do this." Mostly because of the archetype text saying "You cannot select another dedication feat until you have gained two other feats..".
It really comes down to your table, though. In my opinion, RAW, you could do it. My reasoning is that neither Ancient Elf or Trickster say "Select a dedication". They say "Pick a Class/Archetype and GAIN that dedication. So technically you aren't selecting the dedication specifically. You're picking the associated class, and gaining the dedication as a bonus.
It's SUPER nit-picky though. Most people are saying it wouldn't fly in Organized Play.
Eldritch Trickster is a Rogue Racket, so yes. You wouldn't even need to be an Ancient Elf.
Or did you mean to double down on dedications to essentially get a dip in 3 classes. You can not because the Dedication feats state: You cannot select another dedication feat until you have gained two other feats from the alchemist archetype.
@@linus4d1 That is where people argue that you don't select it. You gain it. (Personally I am on the fence of that debate)
If you are not in Organized play, ask your GM and see how they feel about it.
Personally, i say yes, you can, BUT, you have to finish the requisites on one before you get to work the other... That is, until Paizo Errata's it out.
I would say you could select the dedication feet for one, and after completing the requirements, immediately gain the second.
Read the Elf Quest comics to learn about desert elves.
Yeah elves are cool and all but bring on my boys! Halflings!
Desert elves were in 1e. Check gateway to the east....
Quadara ....
I thought I would bring this up because I forgot to bring it up under your human 101 video… You kept saying you don’t know where the idea comes from the humans are so stubborn and persistent… In just about every single fantasy world ever invented where they talk about the future if they do talk about the future… They talk about the magical race is dying out and humans being the only intelligent race left to control the world… This is where that comes from. Humans believe they are better than everybody else because they’re obnoxious and that’s the way humans behave… And eventually they will as a race outlive everybody else
This video is making me want to roll up an Ancestor Elf Barbarian who mixes spellcasting and raging combatant stuff.
I know raging doesn't allow spellcasting, but I like the flavor. Already have a ton of ideas for such Elves in my own setting. XD
I love this video.
Can't remember what it's called (on my phone ATM), but there is a barbarian feat that allows you to briefly pause your rage for a round.
@@DJchilcott Oh nice! I could look into that.
I see it. Moment of Clarity.
In terms of casting, I was originally thinking something like Imperial Sorcerer. Druid or Wizard might mesh better, but I like the options.
I don't like that Wandering Heart isn't optional. Now your cavern elf loses darkvision if they spend a week in the arctic and they have to spend a whole week underground to get it back. Spend a long time in the woods? Welp, lost you darkvision gotta spend a week in a cave without darkvision because you did something not really that unusual. Paizo releases an ocean terrain elf? Whelp going on a boat trip is really annoying now.
Dark Sun elves were desert elves
🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️ Damn it's stupid, that you can switch skills and feats everyday... just like that 🤦♂️
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