Your enthusiasm for this old machine is infectious! I’m loving how happy you were in getting and running this old girl. I hope she gives you many years of service.
This is a magical piece of engineering and I'm very much looking forward to seeing you integrate it into the charcoal project. That slow diesel thump it's a beautiful sound, none of the harshness of a modern, multi cylinder version. Glorious. Martin and Vivian, Rousay
@@sinisterhipp0 G'day, Nope, that's the actual Brand-Name. The product is about a 50/50 mixture of Kerosene or Petrol and Petroleum Ether.... Squirt it into the Intake Manifold of either a recalcitrant Petrol or Diesel Engine..., and if it can possibly fire up - then it will have a go ; and having run a bit then it will warm up & maybe run propperly after that. Just(ifiably ?) sayin', Have a good one... Stay safe. ;-p Ciao !
Best kept in the cupboard unless you want to bugger up an engine. You're better of with a heat gun,blowtorch or a bit of burning rag held up to the air intake
PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE YOU COMMENT! Yes, you're right, we should have kept cranking after the decompressor lever was moved. We weren't sure what we were doing but now it's clear. In our defense, it was really hard going! Also, the handle drops off very easily as soon as the flywheel spins faster than we can keep the pressure on, so it looks as if we weren't trying when we just couldn't keep up. It's worn on the edges and needs some repair. ALSO the decompressor lever has been repaired in the past. That's why it's works in a different direction to the manual. All it does is push the top of the valve in a little - it doesn't matter how quickly it is released. AND, as for the vibrations, I checked the rpm and it's not running too fast or too slowly. There's nothing missing. I just need to fix it down better - which I will! Thank you if you wanted to comment on these issues - I just don't want you to waste your time covering the same ground. Feel free to write something new though.
@@meex88hiphop Er ... actually quite the contrary. These engines are designed, and balanced, to be absolutely stationary. If "loose", the compression stroke "bucks" or "hops" the entire structure to move slightly, effectively ruining any designed rotational balancing.
@@sixmagpies ofcrs they were designed to be stationary but they wont "feel" better if they get bolted, on contrary, they will suffer greater material fatigue if you bolt them down. just because they are not moving when bolted, it doesnt mean the forces are not there in my opinion, if you have to bolt down a half ton engine to stop if from jumping, something is obviously off balance i would instead balance the flywheels and the counterweight rather than bolting it to the ground
@@meex88hiphop Never said anything about "feelings", sir .. but whatever you say. I'm just an old MS, retired in Ireland, who has been directly and solely responsible for signing off on the installation, commissioning and sea-trialling of some of the very largest diesel engines ever constructed by man. (MWM, B&V, Sulzer, Wartsilla, Hyundai.) Basics 1. Any rotational machinery suffering chaotic accelerations (movement) is quite impossible to balance. 2. One of the most important elements in the installation of large marine diesel machinery is the series of torsional vibration calculations that must be made before, during and after each event. We are not at home to "Wiggly bits" !
Wow I'm new to the cannel Tim so getting videos all squffy lol so I've obviously seen her working. But wow she's a beauty! So lucky to have her and god bless you for putting her to her intended use. I'm quite jealous chap lol
Hi Tim, when hand cranking do not put your thumb around handle but over the top, it will save a dislocated or broken thumb if and when a kickback occurs, have fun.
Hi Tim, in my experience of starting these things, the book is correct, you crank a couple of times to build up some inertia, and then pop the decompression lever and keep cranking for a couple more turns, the inertia in the flywheel will help you crank it over compression and its much more likely to start that way. After all, you're just hoping that the inertia will bring it through compression, so keeping cranking means that it tries to fire a couple of extra times and that will mean that it starts a lot quicker. I live near the Internal fire museum in Wales, and run a small preserved railway, where we have a hand started locomotive. Plus I have a Lister A and D awaiting some restoration - oh for the time for all these things eh? Good luck with your Banford, those single cylinder engines are great.
As the instructions say, keep cranking a few turns after dropping the de-compression lever. The crank handle will automatically disconnect when it fires even when you’re holding it. On our 2 cylinder Lister, on the tug boat, we de-com both cylinders then only start one cylinder. Once it starts banging, we engage second cylinder. 👍😃
@@magnusnielsen2648 It'll be okay as long as you keep all fingers on one side of the handle - if you grip it with your thumb around it it'll snap it clean in two but as long as you're mindful of what you're doing it shouldn't really be an issue (:
I’m glad I came across this. My dad recently caved and bought me a hit and miss engine. I am still learning how they work, but it’s been a fascinating journey so far. He has come to love the look of old vertical engines like yours here. My grandpa and I are on the hunt for one hopefully by Christmas. He has ole tractors.
I watched, I had a big grin on my face, I was entertained, I subscribed liked and hit the bell. Thankyou Tim for everything you have given me today. I have an engine exactly like yours, and you have inspired me to get it out from under the covers and into the shed for some prep work for starting it. Thanks again Tim and Sandra.
After a while you will probably find a way to start it reliably. For my 1950's tractor I use starting fluid, sprayed into the manifold as the original kygas starter has corroded away, but starter fluid polarises engine folk excessively, some believing it is a blessing from God, others a curse from the Devil. There were all manner of "crank avoidance" devices developed that included 12 gauge cartridge powered (no shot!), and various starters including ropes round the pulleys and similar heath robinson arrangements. All needing to be approached with extreme caution as crank injuries tend to be bad. I imagine a fast stop would be to decompress the engine, but sometimes my tractor will run when hot even if decompressed. Recently I had all my four injectors rebuilt and this has helped starting. It should be relatively easy and low cost to have a diesel injector shop check the spray pattern from your injector. Good Luck! Thanks for sharing!
Ahh, those days in my childhood. Every autumn in harvesting time, stationary motor and harvesting machine was pulled to our little farm. They were owned together by 3 farms. Starting the motor was celebration to little kid. Smell of petrol, cooling water running, smoke and sounds. Unforgettable. The results was kept in storage, and by winter milled. There was rat and mice poop within, but who cared? Maybe because off it, in age 63 I am still standing hard.
How wonderful to see one of these machines running again. In my childhood, I was raised on a sheep farm in outback Australia, and we used one of these machines to power the cutters for shearing the sheep. So the next thing to get, and connect to this machine, is the sheep shearing equipment.
The energy in the flywheel is what gets you over compression in the first couple turns. You do get enough to get over one compression at least, but you do need to keep cranking. It's a confidence and commit 100% to it thing. Well, at least in my experience with Lister and Ruston of the same size. Apart from the obvious hazard of flying off the handle, also please do change to not put your thumb around the handle. It might feel awkward but it is vital to save breaking your thumb. :-)
@@WayOutWestx2 fairly late but i cant stress enough what jam said about cupping the starting handle instead of wrapping thumb round, had a petter paz1 kick back randomly and dam near took me wrist out.
These engines are very easy to start . After you drop the compression lever keep cranking a couple more times on full compression it will fire. a lot of comments here are from people who don't anything. How do I know? I have several single cylinder diesel engines all start easily.
My 14 year old daughter can start my Lister CS3, the same type of setup as yours. What you are doing wrong is stop cranking when you release the decompression. The decompression is there to start being able to get momentum up, and when you have got enough, keep cranking as you release the decompression. Once you do a couple of full rotations with the decompression off, it should then fire. But please for the love of your hands, keep all 4 fingers and thumb on one side of the handle, otherwise, you will be able to share a great story of how you got no thumb.
We used to start cold reluctant diesel engines with a burning rag, soaked with petrol or paraffin, held near the air intake so it's pulling in hot , less dense, air. Not a move for the faint-hearted but very effective. The other thing we needed to be aware of doesn't apply to you Tim, make sure the boss wasn't around to see us doing it.
This is how I help my tractor to start. I just light a piece of newspaper and hold it under a hole in the intake manifold where there should be a heater fitted.
I good old building site trick. I used to do the same to start the old Perkins lump in my heap of a rangerover. Till I got a heater injector fitted. Really got some funny looks, especially in Tesco's car park! You need to remember to move the flames after a while, to allow the engine to get some oxygen. But it works a treat.
Be careful the burning rag don't get pulled in. An old mechanic told of adjusting the fuel timing depending on the fuel source. This was from pre WW2 and diesel was poorly refined and the Cetane rating maybe unregulated unlike today. If starting continues to be difficult, you might try ether through an orificed fitting, the miniscule amount wont hurt anything, or some old diesels used have a removable hollow bolt, the Bolt would be removed and a fuel pellet installed. These would help start the fire. Good Luck, your vid was most enjoyable, wish I was there. Peter
This reminds me of when I started work in London in a blacksmith's shop in 1948 at fifteen. The drill stands, saws, grinding and all the other machines were powered by overhead belt drives with belts running down to them. No belt or machine guards in those days. Those spinning belt wheels gave me the creeps. I can't wait to see what you hook up to your brute. With all your different projects on the go you must work twentyfour hours a day. I'm always eager for the next video. Sandra is very patient with you playing with your toys;-) Keep your thumbs back!
fabricate a metal , plastic or fiberglass cover for wheels on each side , and a tractor loader dc starter to spin the wheel to crank it to prevent any mishaps . it could be done .
You have the same problem I do. Horses. I've been waiting ten years for a new shop while we built a couple of horse structures and cleared three pastures 😐 - we are allegedly going to start work on my shop this year 🤔
Congratulations, governor! The only part I understood was the beautiful blue tarp it came with, but it's a fantastic machine and I'm glad you're taming it.
Tim, it's great to see you have an old diesel engine there and I can't wait to see what you attach to it in time. With too much technology these days it's nice to see these old things coming to life and being used as they were originally designed for.
My soul cries out for a concrete pad- a half ton of casting and flywheels jumping around like that is incredible wear on the bearings and valves and everything will suffer but I’m pretty certain you have a long term plan for this to prevent it from hopping off into the sea 🌊 :-) Can’t wait to watch this story unfold.
I wonder if there is a balance issue that could be addressed with counterweights. As for the hard start, perhaps a lighter fuel (kerosene/paraffin) could be used for the initial startup? Might be too much of a hassle though. This new toy looks like so much fun.
These single cylinder engines were often on trolleys, they do rattle around a fair bit, but they're pretty low revs, somewhere between 700 and 1000 on my ev1 of a similar age.
Watching other videos of similar single cylinder engines with a basic trolley to sit on they do NOT seem to shake near as bad as this one. Something seems wrong for sure.
As others have said, essential to keep cranking as you throw the decomp lever, if you stop it'll likely just bounce off the compression. Also hold the handle with all fingers and thumb on the back just in case it kicks back. Run it on a pure 5L bottle of diesel Purge (from Liquimoly) as it'll really give the valves, pump, injector, manifolds and cylinder a good clean. If you're really struggling to get it going, you can pre-heat the air intake (hair-drier is good). You can also, if you really must, give it a very quick spray of Easy Start and that'll certainly fire it up but it's best not to use that, as any engine that needs Easy Start is in need of mechanical attention.
If you "overflop" the bottom position, it does not start, because the upward movement break compression, when itˋs most needed. Donˋt flop it but grab it and turn it - thats what you did when it started.
Thanks, but this decompressor lever just pops out of position when deactivated, so it makes no difference how quickly it's released. (It's been repaired in the past, which is why it seems back to front..)
Fabulous, it is alive! Love old engines. I had a boat with a 1937 a Kelvin diesel in it that started on petrol paraffin mix before going onto diesel. Andy UK
I like how you put brand new modern engine oil in it, and only after a few cranks it's absolutely filthy. Shows how much better modern oils are at cleaning gunk out of engines. I bet after a few early oil changes and temprature cycles it'll be clean as a whistle inside. I remember my poor old 1980's Corolla I had when I was a student. over 200,000km on it, and it was filthy inside. I splurged some money on it and put some full synthetic in it and gave it 2 oil changes over about 3 months. When I popped the thing open. It looked brand new inside!..
No advice, but I gave an audible whoop! when it started the first time, I hope you can suss out the problems, can't wait to see the continuation of your projects, Tim!
With the decompression lever on get the diesel turning using the gas engine. Turning the diesel over like this builds up heat in the cylinder of the diesel which helps with starting. After 20 or 30 seconds release the decompression lever but keep the gas engine engaged. When the diesel starts disengage the gas engine and you are away. This arrangement really save you arms and the potential of injury. Sorry this was in two messages as my fat fingers got in the way. Good luck with your project.
I have ran these antique engines my whole life with my father. I agree with the poster that mentioned to not throw the compression relief handle any further than the pure 6 o’clock position. Also I understand that you are not anchored to a slab. At running speed your engine should bounce much less. It’s understandable for these things to go everywhere while they get to speed but they should smooth to a smaller vibration at proper running speed and yours doesn’t. I would check main bearings for wear, check crankshaft for true, and check flywheels for balance. If you want longevity out of this engine it needs to run smoother than what I’m seeing. Just my 2 cents, I’ll be eagerly awaiting the follow-up video…
As others have mentioned, starting the diesel is not easy without glow plugs or the burning rag on the air intake, something to heat up the air. The diesel cycle is based on adiabatic compression of the air and diesel mixture. If the cylinder and surrounding metal parts are cold, the heat from the adiabatic compression of the mixture will be absorbed in the metal and make it difficult to get the mixture to burn. All the "almost" starts contributed to warming up the metal and then eventually you were able to get this started. Good luck with the learning curve. The engine is an oldie-but-goodie. I look forward to seeing this in action in the future. Dave.
I have an old cement mixer (60’s or 70’s I think ,definitely pre 80’s ) with a Lister engine and-a starting system the same as your engine has . I turn the handle one handed and continue to turn after you release the compression lever , a couple of turns and once the engine starts the handle frees itself . Health and safety wouldn’t allow the likes of it to be used on a building site , now . Was left lying for years and I started it last October with only three or four attempts . Diesel single cylinder engines outlast any body there put on. Great engines .
I love these old engines. Something about the heavy-metal, high tolerance, run forever design makes me very happy. I've very glad you have one, Tim. Now you can build that textile factory I know you've been itching to do ;)
Here u go .you have to keep turning it . Like to have the crank handle to be on the crank so on the up stripe it is on compression. A few turns to build up speed then move decompress or to the run position . Get someone to do this for you .keep on cranking don't stop put some back into it . It's a bit of a knack .
@@WayOutWestx2 yes sorts the men out from the girls !!! It is something you get better at . I start a40 HP ronaldson and tippet . Others have tried I have given lessons . You will get better at it .
Hi Tim, just saw your video on the starting of an old Banford. I have farmed with one running my waterpump for irrigation. Every thing went well while trying to start. Yes a lot of poeple commented to turn the handle after flipping the decompresion handle, that is the right way. I can hear the sqeeking sound of the injector that indicates that the fuel presure is there. My suggestion is to check the injector nozzle, my view is that the injector nozzle is not making the spray mist as required that is why you suffer to start it. The injector nozzle when tested needs to make a spray mist, if i remember correctly as my father tought me (that is at about 110 bar presure test), but when doing the setting as soon as the injector started mist spraying it will be fine(just do the test 2 or 3 times to be sure) . I do believe if you fix the injector nozzle it will start so much easier
I’m sure Henry could assist with starting 🙂 I’ve seen people use air motors and a solid rubber wheel on the flywheel. Might save you from doing yourself an injury!
Looks fantastic Tim, can't wait to see what contraptions you build and hook up to it. Sorry I can't help with easier starting of these things, I have zero experience there. Craig
We in india have same engine... We used a open sprit flame on intake side for cold starts.... It literally sucked falme inside and started in one attempt even in coldest of temperatures
If you need help with the engine, Internal Fire museum in Wales might be able ot hook you up with someone who has knowledge about Bamford engines. I used to own a smaller model when we lived in UK as well as other stationary engines. Nice to se one being put to use. BTW; Lister D engines are used on 7 1/4" locomotives.
A trick I have seen with old tractor diesels is to have a hot air gun and blow hot air into the cylinder to warm it up before starting. I don't know how that would work on a single cylinder like this or where one would blow the hot air in. But it does a great job of heating up things allowing for a much easier start.
We used to replace the water in the block with boiling water to start the tractor on frosty mornings, drain the block at night and repeat the next day.
Hmmm. I did notice that for the first successful start it was the first time that you held the decompression handle and moved it positively to 6 o’clock - rather than spinning it. That said, that technique did not work on the second day....
Hello from Across the Pond, here in the United States! As an American, who's dealt with engines and motors most of my like, my first reaction to that old Hand-Smasher Manual Crank is to use an adaptor (a metal cup with a key-block, fit to the crank shaft end) attached to a Big drill, and turn it over like that. But, what do I know! You've built yourself a work-rail system. Any way, I look forward to whatever solution you come up with! Cheers :-)
I have helped in restoring several hit/and miss engines in the USA. Most were gas but a few were diesel. And I we used kerosene as fuel which is light diesel. Tractor fuel or Disulate fuel was used in carburetor engines after it had reached operating temp. I enjoyed seeing y’all start it. Today’s diesel is injected at high pressure. Into a high compression cylinder. I would guess that British equivalent of kerosene would have it purring. The injector may need cleaning.
Great stuff...I just got 1949 southern cross yb...from Australia running was having lot of trouble with fuel prime...ended up being high pressure fuel line...wasn't leaking...was sucking in air...the ends were very shiny ...had them glass bead blasted...to make ruff and be able to mate in with pump and injector.....did the trick on mine starts first time every time...not 2 to 3 hours like I first was doing too...but I still cranked and cranked just to hear it run when I first got it....best of luck...hope this helps
You book should have cold weather start instruction on how to heat combustion chamber diesel has a much higher combustion temperature than gasoline. That’s the reason why most modern diesel have a glow plug that gets the chamber to that temperature there should be something in your manual for cold weather starts and if you follow those instructions and regular weather it will make it start faster also. As suggested in the comments burning rags or using a Electric or propane charcoal starter or a little propane torch to get the Chambers give it up to temperature 52 ° to 92° Celsius, I did make lamps for this purpose in the day and they generally take about 10 minutes to get to temperature. Double check your weights of all this usually doesn’t use modern style lol it could be anywhere from a 30 to 90 weight oil. Too thick of oil could be slowing down your ability to crank it. And most times there was a different role for grazing the barons are desperate or for the crankshaft and then there may be some grease fittings also each one of these will be a different weight. Synthetics will probably add to the life of it but you’ll probably need to go 10 to 30 weight above from what suggested to get the same requirements. How’s that for a dual oil that is half regular and half synthetic is 5 to 15 weight about suggested Weight.
We used to crank the engine over thirty or so revs, slowly, to put a bunch of fuel into the cylinder (that squeak you hear every other rev is the fuel coming out of the injector) then we used to go full tilt and try to start the engine. This is equivalent to pushing in the excess fuel button on the side of the fuel pump on old tractors. You get a big gout of black smoke for a short while but it clears pretty quickly. That was on an old Lister engine. As regards the lube oil make sure you use the grade listed in the handbook. Some older engines burn through multigrade oil really quickly but run forever on monograde oil. Another thought for starting, of the weather is cold you may find it easier to start the engine of you hold a blowlamp next to the air inlet during cranking to heat up the intake air.
some times these older engines have a spot for a candle to preheat the cylinder/head. there is good news it dose puch back on the cold starts meaning it still have good compression
I have a Lister knock off that runs but not mounted or connected to a 5K generator. These things are hard to find and a beautiful piece of machinery. Good luck with yours.
In addition to all the advices given i would like to add that in modern diesel fuel you must have to add some petrol and kerosene to make it able to start easily and run smoothly not heavily . Plus adding some vegetable oil to the concoction also helps in lubrication . So the thing i have seen in old large static engines here is people add 10cc of petrol and 10 cc of kerosine along with 50 cc of vegetable oil per liter of diesel and it eases startups and runs more smoothly . I hope this helps
I agree. You can see, after releasing the compression, that it gets to a point where it "bounces" in the reverse direction. That is, I believe, where you are getting enough compression to ignite the fuel. That's why it smokes.
Thanks, but this decompressor lever just pops out of position when deactivated, so it makes no difference how quickly it's released. (It's been repaired in the past, which is why it seems back to front..)
Your enthusiasm for this old machine is infectious! I’m loving how happy you were in getting and running this old girl. I hope she gives you many years of service.
This is a magical piece of engineering and I'm very much looking forward to seeing you integrate it into the charcoal project. That slow diesel thump it's a beautiful sound, none of the harshness of a modern, multi cylinder version. Glorious. Martin and Vivian, Rousay
In Australia we have a product called "Start you Bastard" may be that would help :-)
gotta can of that for everything
I'd be careful with starting spray just because of the extremely high compression of non-electric diesel engines like this.
@@sinisterhipp0
G'day,
Nope, that's the actual Brand-Name.
The product is about a 50/50 mixture of Kerosene or Petrol and Petroleum Ether....
Squirt it into the Intake Manifold of either a recalcitrant Petrol or Diesel Engine..., and if it can possibly fire up - then it will have a go ; and having run a bit then it will warm up & maybe run propperly after that.
Just(ifiably ?) sayin',
Have a good one...
Stay safe.
;-p
Ciao !
Best kept in the cupboard unless you want to bugger up an engine. You're better of with a heat gun,blowtorch or a bit of burning rag held up to the air intake
Is that the stuff you pronounce as "Starchy-Bearstud"? - A squirt won't hurt, but it might break your thumb!
They’re fantastic when there is a Chinese restaurant neigh by, they running great on kitchen waist oil
I could listen to your voice for age's great storytelling accent, loving the series 2... you keep the videos coming and we will keep smiling 😃😊
Ok, will do!
PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE YOU COMMENT! Yes, you're right, we should have kept cranking after the decompressor lever was moved. We weren't sure what we were doing but now it's clear. In our defense, it was really hard going! Also, the handle drops off very easily as soon as the flywheel spins faster than we can keep the pressure on, so it looks as if we weren't trying when we just couldn't keep up. It's worn on the edges and needs some repair.
ALSO the decompressor lever has been repaired in the past. That's why it's works in a different direction to the manual. All it does is push the top of the valve in a little - it doesn't matter how quickly it is released.
AND, as for the vibrations, I checked the rpm and it's not running too fast or too slowly. There's nothing missing. I just need to fix it down better - which I will!
Thank you if you wanted to comment on these issues - I just don't want you to waste your time covering the same ground. Feel free to write something new though.
the flywheels are not balanced
it will eat the bearings if you bolt it down to ground
its lifting half a ton 3 times a second
@@meex88hiphop Er ... actually quite the contrary. These engines are designed, and balanced, to be absolutely stationary.
If "loose", the compression stroke "bucks" or "hops" the entire structure to move slightly, effectively ruining any designed rotational balancing.
@@sixmagpies ofcrs they were designed to be stationary but they wont "feel" better if they get bolted, on contrary, they will suffer greater material fatigue if you bolt them down.
just because they are not moving when bolted, it doesnt mean the forces are not there
in my opinion, if you have to bolt down a half ton engine to stop if from jumping, something is obviously off balance
i would instead balance the flywheels and the counterweight rather than bolting it to the ground
@@meex88hiphop Never said anything about "feelings", sir .. but whatever you say.
I'm just an old MS, retired in Ireland, who has been directly and solely responsible for signing off on the installation, commissioning and sea-trialling of some of the very largest diesel engines ever constructed by man. (MWM, B&V, Sulzer, Wartsilla, Hyundai.)
Basics 1. Any rotational machinery suffering chaotic accelerations (movement) is quite impossible to balance.
2. One of the most important elements in the installation of large marine diesel machinery is the series of torsional vibration calculations that must be made before, during and after each event.
We are not at home to "Wiggly bits" !
Wow I'm new to the cannel Tim so getting videos all squffy lol so I've obviously seen her working. But wow she's a beauty! So lucky to have her and god bless you for putting her to her intended use. I'm quite jealous chap lol
Half a ton just jumping about lol imagine big foundry engines they must have felt it a mile away lol
Does not matter what it is. It's a wonderful feeling to bring an old piece of equipment back to life.
Hi Tim, when hand cranking do not put your thumb around handle but over the top, it will save a dislocated or broken thumb if and when a kickback occurs, have fun.
Knowing how to hand crank an engine without destroying you're thumb and wrists is a long lost art.
You are so right
These stationary engines are awesome 👍. Great to see folks keeping them running 👌.
Hi Tim, in my experience of starting these things, the book is correct, you crank a couple of times to build up some inertia, and then pop the decompression lever and keep cranking for a couple more turns, the inertia in the flywheel will help you crank it over compression and its much more likely to start that way. After all, you're just hoping that the inertia will bring it through compression, so keeping cranking means that it tries to fire a couple of extra times and that will mean that it starts a lot quicker. I live near the Internal fire museum in Wales, and run a small preserved railway, where we have a hand started locomotive. Plus I have a Lister A and D awaiting some restoration - oh for the time for all these things eh? Good luck with your Banford, those single cylinder engines are great.
As the instructions say, keep cranking a few turns after dropping the de-compression lever.
The crank handle will automatically disconnect when it fires even when you’re holding it.
On our 2 cylinder Lister, on the tug boat, we de-com both cylinders then only start one cylinder. Once it starts banging, we engage second cylinder. 👍😃
@@DB-thats-me a backfire would be pretty nasty when holding on to the handle
@@magnusnielsen2648 It'll be okay as long as you keep all fingers on one side of the handle - if you grip it with your thumb around it it'll snap it clean in two but as long as you're mindful of what you're doing it shouldn't really be an issue (:
@@roseroserose588 yeah....😀
@@magnusnielsen2648, yup.
I’m glad I came across this. My dad recently caved and bought me a hit and miss engine. I am still learning how they work, but it’s been a fascinating journey so far. He has come to love the look of old vertical engines like yours here. My grandpa and I are on the hunt for one hopefully by Christmas. He has ole tractors.
I watched, I had a big grin on my face, I was entertained, I subscribed liked and hit the bell. Thankyou Tim for everything you have given me today. I have an engine exactly like yours, and you have inspired me to get it out from under the covers and into the shed for some prep work for starting it. Thanks again Tim and Sandra.
After a while you will probably find a way to start it reliably. For my 1950's tractor I use starting fluid, sprayed into the manifold as the original kygas starter has corroded away, but starter fluid polarises engine folk excessively, some believing it is a blessing from God, others a curse from the Devil. There were all manner of "crank avoidance" devices developed that included 12 gauge cartridge powered (no shot!), and various starters including ropes round the pulleys and similar heath robinson arrangements. All needing to be approached with extreme caution as crank injuries tend to be bad. I imagine a fast stop would be to decompress the engine, but sometimes my tractor will run when hot even if decompressed. Recently I had all my four injectors rebuilt and this has helped starting. It should be relatively easy and low cost to have a diesel injector shop check the spray pattern from your injector. Good Luck! Thanks for sharing!
thanks, yes, getting the injector checked would be no harm anyway, would it? And there's only one of them.. : - )
The other thing that is often forgotten with Diesel engines is that the air filter has to be clean.
Ahh, those days in my childhood. Every autumn in harvesting time, stationary motor and harvesting machine was pulled to our little farm. They were owned together by 3 farms. Starting the motor was celebration to little kid. Smell of petrol, cooling water running, smoke and sounds. Unforgettable. The results was kept in storage, and by winter milled. There was rat and mice poop within, but who cared? Maybe because off it, in age 63 I am still standing hard.
How wonderful to see one of these machines running again. In my childhood, I was raised on a sheep farm in outback Australia, and we used one of these machines to power the cutters for shearing the sheep. So the next thing to get, and connect to this machine, is the sheep shearing equipment.
I was away from your channel for a few years i am glad I am back love your videos and I have so many to catch up on .
The energy in the flywheel is what gets you over compression in the first couple turns. You do get enough to get over one compression at least, but you do need to keep cranking. It's a confidence and commit 100% to it thing. Well, at least in my experience with Lister and Ruston of the same size. Apart from the obvious hazard of flying off the handle, also please do change to not put your thumb around the handle. It might feel awkward but it is vital to save breaking your thumb. :-)
thanks - wise words!
You have to believe it is going to start and get some one that knows when to drop the valve lift before you slow down
@@WayOutWestx2 fairly late but i cant stress enough what jam said about cupping the starting handle instead of wrapping thumb round, had a petter paz1 kick back randomly and dam near took me wrist out.
These engines are very easy to start . After you drop the compression lever keep cranking a couple more times on full compression it will fire. a lot of comments here are from people who don't anything. How do I know? I have several single cylinder diesel engines all start easily.
Fantastic! Well done to you all. A real piece of engineering history.
My 14 year old daughter can start my Lister CS3, the same type of setup as yours. What you are doing wrong is stop cranking when you release the decompression. The decompression is there to start being able to get momentum up, and when you have got enough, keep cranking as you release the decompression. Once you do a couple of full rotations with the decompression off, it should then fire.
But please for the love of your hands, keep all 4 fingers and thumb on one side of the handle, otherwise, you will be able to share a great story of how you got no thumb.
Super jealous. Want a similar engine myself. I thought the head needed to be preheated on those old girls. Great video
We used to start cold reluctant diesel engines with a burning rag, soaked with petrol or paraffin, held near the air intake so it's pulling in hot , less dense, air. Not a move for the faint-hearted but very effective. The other thing we needed to be aware of doesn't apply to you Tim, make sure the boss wasn't around to see us doing it.
This is how I help my tractor to start. I just light a piece of newspaper and hold it under a hole in the intake manifold where there should be a heater fitted.
Thanks, yes, but curiously there are two ways in for the air so it's not easy to heat it. But I'll keep trying..
I good old building site trick.
I used to do the same to start the old Perkins lump in my heap of a rangerover. Till I got a heater injector fitted. Really got some funny looks, especially in Tesco's car park!
You need to remember to move the flames after a while, to allow the engine to get some oxygen. But it works a treat.
We used and still donatbtime use the same style for starting lister generator and some tractor here in the falkland.
Be careful the burning rag don't get pulled in. An old mechanic told of adjusting the fuel timing depending on the fuel source. This was from pre WW2 and diesel was poorly refined and the Cetane rating maybe unregulated unlike today. If starting continues to be difficult, you might try ether through an orificed fitting, the miniscule amount wont hurt anything, or some old diesels used have a removable hollow bolt, the Bolt would be removed and a fuel pellet installed. These would help start the fire. Good Luck, your vid was most enjoyable, wish I was there. Peter
I too started a diesel engine..scary at first and still scary...maily because of the fear of kickback..
If only modern equipment was engineered to the same quality standards of the love given to the making of these old girls.
This reminds me of when I started work in London in a blacksmith's shop in 1948 at fifteen. The drill stands, saws, grinding and all the other machines were powered by overhead belt drives with belts running down to them. No belt or machine guards in those days. Those spinning belt wheels gave me the creeps. I can't wait to see what you hook up to your brute. With all your different projects on the go you must work twentyfour hours a day. I'm always eager for the next video. Sandra is very patient with you playing with your toys;-) Keep your thumbs back!
I've seen that, belts being ran by a water wheel.
fabricate a metal , plastic or fiberglass cover for wheels on each side , and a tractor loader dc starter to spin the wheel to crank it to prevent any mishaps . it could be done .
My dad worked at Bamford’s, Uttoxeter, related to JCB nearby. Sadly the agricultural machine factory is no more.
(JC Bamford...)
I'm a Bamford..got any more history?
My dad talked about 'Woffeler' spelling? machines he made at Uttoxeter. I did a little business with JCB when Rupert Bamford was in purchasing.
You have the same problem I do. Horses. I've been waiting ten years for a new shop while we built a couple of horse structures and cleared three pastures 😐 - we are allegedly going to start work on my shop this year 🤔
Exactly!
Congratulations, governor! The only part I understood was the beautiful blue tarp it came with, but it's a fantastic machine and I'm glad you're taming it.
Ha! I'm trying, anyway : - )
I am lucky enough to have a Bamford SD-1 in Australia. 1938 from memory. Not many in Aus. Keep up the good work.
It was very satisfying to watch you guys get it running again. What a wonderful old engine.
Tim, it's great to see you have an old diesel engine there and I can't wait to see what you attach to it in time. With too much technology these days it's nice to see these old things coming to life and being used as they were originally designed for.
My soul cries out for a concrete pad- a half ton of casting and flywheels jumping around like that is incredible wear on the bearings and valves and everything will suffer but I’m pretty certain you have a long term plan for this to prevent it from hopping off into the sea 🌊 :-) Can’t wait to watch this story unfold.
Yeah a solid base sound good
I wonder if there is a balance issue that could be addressed with counterweights.
As for the hard start, perhaps a lighter fuel (kerosene/paraffin) could be used for the initial startup? Might be too much of a hassle though.
This new toy looks like so much fun.
@@arty1799 Single Cylinder engine will always have this inbalance.
These single cylinder engines were often on trolleys, they do rattle around a fair bit, but they're pretty low revs, somewhere between 700 and 1000 on my ev1 of a similar age.
Watching other videos of similar single cylinder engines with a basic trolley to sit on they do NOT seem to shake near as bad as this one. Something seems wrong for sure.
Looks like some very crude balancing of the fly and drive wheels is needed. Lovely looking machine and land rover!
That truck really is something, I love the capstan winch
"What the hell did you do to the antichrist?"
@@JeffRAllenCH Great reference
It's waking up😂
Whow that was exciting boys!!
It's a thing of rare beauty.
bealtfull motor i love it
As others have said, essential to keep cranking as you throw the decomp lever, if you stop it'll likely just bounce off the compression. Also hold the handle with all fingers and thumb on the back just in case it kicks back. Run it on a pure 5L bottle of diesel Purge (from Liquimoly) as it'll really give the valves, pump, injector, manifolds and cylinder a good clean. If you're really struggling to get it going, you can pre-heat the air intake (hair-drier is good). You can also, if you really must, give it a very quick spray of Easy Start and that'll certainly fire it up but it's best not to use that, as any engine that needs Easy Start is in need of mechanical attention.
Looks great Tim, keep her lit hai!
That's the plan!
Always very exciting to see an engine being started for the first time in a long time. Congratulations on your newest acquisition Tim!
Thank you very much!
Nice motor, greetings from Czech Republic 👍
: - )
I don’t know if it would make a difference but the decompression lever is being shown at 9 o’clock in the book before you move it down.
Yea, and maybe just moving the lever instead of slapping it so it spins 270 degrees
@@ledorf this stressed me too much hahaha
@@ledorf Yes!
If you "overflop" the bottom position, it does not start, because the upward movement break compression, when itˋs most needed. Donˋt flop it but grab it and turn it - thats what you did when it started.
Thanks, but this decompressor lever just pops out of position when deactivated, so it makes no difference how quickly it's released. (It's been repaired in the past, which is why it seems back to front..)
Fantastic. You guys really had fun.
Congratulations on your new toy, can’t wait when you add your contraptions😍Gilbert, Arizona
For a stationary engine that thing is totally going places.
What a fantastic engine
there is a place near me that has a half dozed of those old land rovers parked out in front of it
i drool every time i go past lol
Fabulous, it is alive! Love old engines. I had a boat with a 1937 a Kelvin diesel in it that started on petrol paraffin mix before going onto diesel. Andy UK
I saw the oil filler lid was off and was saying in my mind put the lid on! Put the lid on! I hope all your plans for this amazing old engine work out.
Nice one guys, this was very interesting. Safe travels up your your way
Beatiful! I love old Engines 👍 greetings From Germany 🇩🇪
Thank you very much!
I like how you put brand new modern engine oil in it, and only after a few cranks it's absolutely filthy. Shows how much better modern oils are at cleaning gunk out of engines. I bet after a few early oil changes and temprature cycles it'll be clean as a whistle inside. I remember my poor old 1980's Corolla I had when I was a student. over 200,000km on it, and it was filthy inside. I splurged some money on it and put some full synthetic in it and gave it 2 oil changes over about 3 months. When I popped the thing open. It looked brand new inside!..
No advice, but I gave an audible whoop! when it started the first time, I hope you can suss out the problems, can't wait to see the continuation of your projects, Tim!
With the decompression lever on get the diesel turning using the gas engine. Turning the diesel over like this builds up heat in the cylinder of the diesel which helps with starting. After 20 or 30 seconds release the decompression lever but keep the gas engine engaged. When the diesel starts disengage the gas engine and you are away. This arrangement really save you arms and the potential of injury.
Sorry this was in two messages as my fat fingers got in the way. Good luck with your project.
I have ran these antique engines my whole life with my father. I agree with the poster that mentioned to not throw the compression relief handle any further than the pure 6 o’clock position. Also I understand that you are not anchored to a slab. At running speed your engine should bounce much less. It’s understandable for these things to go everywhere while they get to speed but they should smooth to a smaller vibration at proper running speed and yours doesn’t. I would check main bearings for wear, check crankshaft for true, and check flywheels for balance. If you want longevity out of this engine it needs to run smoother than what I’m seeing. Just my 2 cents, I’ll be eagerly awaiting the follow-up video…
I love watching these engines of yesteryear run!!
love this old iron
As others have mentioned, starting the diesel is not easy without glow plugs or the burning rag on the air intake, something to heat up the air.
The diesel cycle is based on adiabatic compression of the air and diesel mixture. If the cylinder and surrounding metal parts are cold, the heat from the adiabatic compression of the mixture will be absorbed in the metal and make it difficult to get the mixture to burn.
All the "almost" starts contributed to warming up the metal and then eventually you were able to get this started.
Good luck with the learning curve. The engine is an oldie-but-goodie. I look forward to seeing this in action in the future.
Dave.
What a wonderful machine! Its hilarious how much it jumps around when running!
I have an old cement mixer (60’s or 70’s I think ,definitely pre 80’s ) with a Lister engine and-a starting system the same as your engine has .
I turn the handle one handed and continue to turn after you release the compression lever , a couple of turns and once the engine starts the handle frees itself .
Health and safety wouldn’t allow the likes of it to be used on a building site , now .
Was left lying for years and I started it last October with only three or four attempts .
Diesel single cylinder engines outlast any body there put on. Great engines .
It's a beauty, well done.
It looks so excited to be running again 😊
It looks like it came out of a Wallis and Gromit cartoon! Especially the way it jumps off the ground.
I love these old engines. Something about the heavy-metal, high tolerance, run forever design makes me very happy. I've very glad you have one, Tim. Now you can build that textile factory I know you've been itching to do ;)
Here u go .you have to keep turning it . Like to have the crank handle to be on the crank so on the up stripe it is on compression. A few turns to build up speed then move decompress or to the run position . Get someone to do this for you .keep on cranking don't stop put some back into it . It's a bit of a knack .
Yep, you're right, Mark - it's hard going though
@@WayOutWestx2 yes sorts the men out from the girls !!! It is something you get better at . I start a40 HP ronaldson and tippet . Others have tried I have given lessons . You will get better at it .
Make sure before you try the compression is on the up stroke of the crank handle most important .
Good to see the old girl coming to life. I don't have any words of wisdom.
Hi Tim, just saw your video on the starting of an old Banford. I have farmed with one running my waterpump for irrigation. Every thing went well while trying to start. Yes a lot of poeple commented to turn the handle after flipping the decompresion handle, that is the right way. I can hear the sqeeking sound of the injector that indicates that the fuel presure is there. My suggestion is to check the injector nozzle, my view is that the injector nozzle is not making the spray mist as required that is why you suffer to start it. The injector nozzle when tested needs to make a spray mist, if i remember correctly as my father tought me (that is at about 110 bar presure test), but when doing the setting as soon as the injector started mist spraying it will be fine(just do the test 2 or 3 times to be sure) . I do believe if you fix the injector nozzle it will start so much easier
we took it off and watched it make a beautiful spray pattern though
I’m sure Henry could assist with starting 🙂 I’ve seen people use air motors and a solid rubber wheel on the flywheel. Might save you from doing yourself an injury!
Looks fantastic Tim, can't wait to see what contraptions you build and hook up to it. Sorry I can't help with easier starting of these things, I have zero experience there. Craig
We in india have same engine... We used a open sprit flame on intake side for cold starts.... It literally sucked falme inside and started in one attempt even in coldest of temperatures
thanks. I will try that
I love this old stuff they don't make them like this any more simple and still running 80 to 100 years latter
If you need help with the engine, Internal Fire museum in Wales might be able ot hook you up with someone who has knowledge about Bamford engines. I used to own a smaller model when we lived in UK as well as other stationary engines. Nice to se one being put to use. BTW; Lister D engines are used on 7 1/4" locomotives.
Yes, Paul is very knowledgable
thank you - I'll do just that if we can't figure things out
Now that is the quintessential antique engine 👍 awesome
This was brilliant, thank you.
Now THAT is a powerful piece of machinery! Well done guys in getting it fired up after so long.
I'm glad you're going to put it to use. I would endorse the remarks about positioning your thumb and keeping cranking once the decompressor is closed.
Amazing piece of machinery!
That was pretty fun to watch!
A trick I have seen with old tractor diesels is to have a hot air gun and blow hot air into the cylinder to warm it up before starting. I don't know how that would work on a single cylinder like this or where one would blow the hot air in. But it does a great job of heating up things allowing for a much easier start.
We used to replace the water in the block with boiling water to start the tractor on frosty mornings, drain the block at night and repeat the next day.
Hmmm. I did notice that for the first successful start it was the first time that you held the decompression handle and moved it positively to 6 o’clock - rather than spinning it. That said, that technique did not work on the second day....
I was gonna say the exact same thing.
oh that manual is full of oil !!!!! :( well done ! I would make a donkey engine if you havent made one already :)
Hello from Across the Pond, here in the United States!
As an American, who's dealt with engines and motors most of my like, my first reaction to that old Hand-Smasher Manual Crank is to use an adaptor (a metal cup with a key-block, fit to the crank shaft end) attached to a Big drill, and turn it over like that.
But, what do I know! You've built yourself a work-rail system. Any way, I look forward to whatever solution you come up with!
Cheers :-)
thanks, Curtis : -- )
I have no reason what so ever for having one of these - but I still want one !!
I have helped in restoring several hit/and miss engines in the USA. Most were gas but a few were diesel. And I we used kerosene as fuel which is light diesel. Tractor fuel or Disulate fuel was used in carburetor engines after it had reached operating temp. I enjoyed seeing y’all start it. Today’s diesel is injected at high pressure. Into a high compression cylinder. I would guess that British equivalent of kerosene would have it purring. The injector may need cleaning.
Great stuff...I just got 1949 southern cross yb...from Australia running was having lot of trouble with fuel prime...ended up being high pressure fuel line...wasn't leaking...was sucking in air...the ends were very shiny ...had them glass bead blasted...to make ruff and be able to mate in with pump and injector.....did the trick on mine starts first time every time...not 2 to 3 hours like I first was doing too...but I still cranked and cranked just to hear it run when I first got it....best of luck...hope this helps
thank you, yes, the fuel supply is always worth investigating..
You book should have cold weather start instruction on how to heat combustion chamber diesel has a much higher combustion temperature than gasoline. That’s the reason why most modern diesel have a glow plug that gets the chamber to that temperature there should be something in your manual for cold weather starts and if you follow those instructions and regular weather it will make it start faster also. As suggested in the comments burning rags or using a Electric or propane charcoal starter or a little propane torch to get the Chambers give it up to temperature 52 ° to 92° Celsius, I did make lamps for this purpose in the day and they generally take about 10 minutes to get to temperature. Double check your weights of all this usually doesn’t use modern style lol it could be anywhere from a 30 to 90 weight oil. Too thick of oil could be slowing down your ability to crank it. And most times there was a different role for grazing the barons are desperate or for the crankshaft and then there may be some grease fittings also each one of these will be a different weight. Synthetics will probably add to the life of it but you’ll probably need to go 10 to 30 weight above from what suggested to get the same requirements. How’s that for a dual oil that is half regular and half synthetic is 5 to 15 weight about suggested Weight.
There's just no way to heat the head, unfortunately.
@@WayOutWestx2 There has to be a spark of some kind and that’s where you heated up at
We used to crank the engine over thirty or so revs, slowly, to put a bunch of fuel into the cylinder (that squeak you hear every other rev is the fuel coming out of the injector) then we used to go full tilt and try to start the engine. This is equivalent to pushing in the excess fuel button on the side of the fuel pump on old tractors. You get a big gout of black smoke for a short while but it clears pretty quickly. That was on an old Lister engine.
As regards the lube oil make sure you use the grade listed in the handbook. Some older engines burn through multigrade oil really quickly but run forever on monograde oil.
Another thought for starting, of the weather is cold you may find it easier to start the engine of you hold a blowlamp next to the air inlet during cranking to heat up the intake air.
Thanks, David. I'm learning!
Looks lethal....I love it !
You are having way too much fun , me thinks , . Great start to the farm power adventure
i guess you will be building a platform on heavy springs to dampen the vibration, nice to see old machines put to good use.
Very exciting! Perhaps the heated water can be used to warm up some hoophouses for more exotic plants!
living the dream Tim, very envious!
some times these older engines have a spot for a candle to preheat the cylinder/head. there is good news it dose puch back on the cold starts meaning it still have good compression
Ring up Ken Boak. He knows all about old stationary engines, including running them on wood gas (as in from the production of charcoal.)
I have a Lister knock off that runs but not mounted or connected to a 5K generator. These things are hard to find and a beautiful piece of machinery. Good luck with yours.
In addition to all the advices given i would like to add that in modern diesel fuel you must have to add some petrol and kerosene to make it able to start easily and run smoothly not heavily . Plus adding some vegetable oil to the concoction also helps in lubrication . So the thing i have seen in old large static engines here is people add 10cc of petrol and 10 cc of kerosine along with 50 cc of vegetable oil per liter of diesel and it eases startups and runs more smoothly . I hope this helps
Very nice vid!👍☘️
Lovely I have a lister cs a very similar engine You will enjoy it
Awesome 👍👍👍Thanks for sharing
The book says keep turning while releasing compression.. You are stopping.. Easy to say sat here😁
I agree. You can see, after releasing the compression, that it gets to a point where it "bounces" in the reverse direction. That is, I believe, where you are getting enough compression to ignite the fuel. That's why it smokes.
Yep and stop playing with the lever ,just hold it in the correct position ,I don't know why it goes all the way to the top
Thanks, but this decompressor lever just pops out of position when deactivated, so it makes no difference how quickly it's released. (It's been repaired in the past, which is why it seems back to front..)