Alright, I seem to have absolutely messed up by saying Eternal lacked Creative Expression. I’ll admit I was dead wrong and I’m sorry. Probably should have played more huh? I’ll do my research next time. Hope you still find something to like here, and do look forward to a Dark Ages video when that comes out ❤
@@UngliYT dont let the overacting individuals get to you. They need to be more understanding especially when your work is filled with so much love. Shake it off like Taylor.
@@underthemayodidn’t think to see mayo here. Was gonna refer Ungli to your video about player creativity in Eternal. Really helps people find their own playstyle in the game instead of feeling locked to what the game offers you
Agreed. I fukin love games that forces me to get gud. Rising up and overcoming the challenge is so satisfying. I don't want to run around with one gun and point and click.
@592Johno I, like most people probably, was initially put off by all the changes, such as weak basic melee and the faster enemies and low ammo, but once I broke away from bad habits I had developed from Doom (2016) I really started to enjoy it for what it was, so much so that I now can't go back to the 2016 version as it's too slow and easy now 😅. The key is to enjoy them both for what they are. Doom eternal simply requires more accountability on the players' part compared to 2016, where you could get by spamming the ssg or by cheesing encounters using the gauss cannon.
It told them, "you need to commit to this, and be focused, and practice like it's a sport" Which is good news for a certain kind of gamer The problem is that these games have always been casual. They don't demand devotion or optimisation, though that is there if you want it. I lot of people just want to chill and relax by blowing up demons, not feel like they're meeting a high pressure deadline at work. I think eternal fails these gamers
(2016) was fairly easy to get through with the Combat Shotgun and Grenade Launcher combo (sticky), even on UV difficulty. And I'm not a very skilled FPS player, just average. Eternal forced me to constantly switch weapons, run around, use my equipment. It was much more challenging. And the Marauder - that bitch was such a pain in the ass.
Idk about unanimously. Some people reeeally hate eternal. Doom 3 was probably more divisive at launch but I've been seeing it get a lot more love lately.
@@raguel4416and some people are suffering brain Aneurysms. Doesn't mean their thoughts and complaints are comprehensible or good. Doom Eternal is better than Doom 3. Definitively.
@@UngliYT Ngl I think all the DOOM games are divisive. I’ve seen hate DOOM 2 bc of the map and level design, people hate DOOM 3 bc it’s dark literally dark and slow, ppl hate DOOM 64 bc of the unsettling atmosphere and there isn’t as many demons, people hate Eternal bc they don’t like the gameplay loop. I always thought 3 was the most hated I’ve met people who can’t stand it more than I have people hating on Eternal but that might just be my experience so I’ll take your word for it. I enjoy all the DOOM games even 3
@@MysteryHandle76 Whoever call Doom 3 slow never end the game and stopped halfway. After getting out of the first Hell, its a full-fledged Action with fewer puzzle, most levels are also lit up and no need for flashlight at all. So the statement of "Doom 3 is too dark and slow." Is not true at all.
I fundamentally disagree with the idea that Doom Eternal doesn't offer player expression in the gameplay, it offers a different kind of player expression. If you want to use the triple barrel turret, its completely viable but its slow on the ground, so just meathook or ballista boost into the air and empty it into the enemies below, using your double jump or ballista to extend airtime. You barely have to touch the ground in eternal if you don't want to. I keep full auto shotgun as my default, because the mastery gives you ammo for kills, thus rewarding a tight, accurate, close-range playstyle with an infinite ammo fodder killer that keeps your super shotgun topped off(you can also use it to finish off weakened larger demons for a solid ammo payoff). The microwave beam is slow in normal combat, but completely overpowered for briefly swapping to and interrupting enemies into a brief stun state. The chaingun shield can be used momentarily to block incoming projectiles or attacks, or can be used to bully and stun enemies in melee range by dashing into them and interrupting their animations. The rocket launcher has a trade off between massive lock-on damage, or stagger/airburst utility with remote det. Every attachment in the game is useful and can be supported with one or more playstyles, and if you get good at punch canceling the swap animation, you don't even have to pick any more, it's jeet kune do, and you just play however you want. You'll notice if you watch players of high skill that often their gameplay looks completely different, and that's because there isn't a hard right answer, its a puzzle and the better you are at the game the more ways of solving it there are.
Yeah I agree! I always kind of smile that even though I play pretty well, I don't use basically anything that youtubers use. No slob, no quickswapping. My playstyle is more falter-oriented, with Micro Missiles for massive damage.
Completely agree! Some people main auto shotgun, most console players love the meathook (everyone loves the meathook, but you know what I mean), I love spam dashing with the shield on the chaingun. Heck, arbalest takes out caco’s just as good as grenades, it’s all about how you want to play!
I think like overall there is also expression in eternal, but with how often the game sort of presents how one should use different guns for different situations and combined with the ammo constantly making you switch guns. I can at times feel a bit more restrictive at least compared to 2016. Here’s hoping dark ages is able to hit a good in between 🙂
There is so much more creativity in Eternal than 99% of FPS just because the weapon mods are so varied, the enemies are varied and any situation you are in, depending on your resources, will push you to use different weapons on different enemies.
@@batarnakdekosse1312realllll sometimes I use the chainsaw as a way to get my bearings and get a little breather. Especially if my health is super critical.
I would tell people to think about getting ammo like reloading in other FPS games. Instead of pressing a button to get your ammo back, you have to chainsaw enemies.
I like your work and I think you made a good retrospective. But I'm not sure why at the 5 year point you would give weight to the claim that "eternal nullifies player creativity". It's something the fan base had to shut down for years so it kinda sucks to hear it here. And I don't even necessarily think you believe it when you say it. Because if you know the game, you know that you don't have to shoot an arachnotron turret to kill it. Throw a grenade and then full auto. Dead. Use a lock on rocket volley or an Arbalest shot on a cacodemon. Dead. There's so much creativity available to the player, and I don't accept the claim that player creativity = being able to use just one gun all day. There are rules to any game, and creativity within those rules. The rules of 2016 were that you had to be aggressive and not hide behind cover. If your idea of player freedom was that you want to be able to hide behind cover, then 2016 was "restricting your creativity" by forcing you into aggression. So, a 99% great video. But I think your statements on creativity could use a little more time in the oven.
Yep. Seems like I missed the mark by an extremely wide margin. And the animosity from these comments (not this one) have absolutely made sure I don’t discuss Doom again.
@@UngliYT well that's unfortunate. You don't deserve any kind of animosity for that. I'm sorry you've had to deal with such ugliness. People are awful, and more so every year. When dealing with the "no creativity" thing it always comes from people screaming and bitching about the game, so I think people are conditioned to lash out at this point because we're nearly universally dealing with bad actors. But people need to recognize when they're talking to someone who's expressing a genuine appreciation for the game and treat them with some freaking respect.
Wroooong, in the past years I’ve picked up doom again and again to replay, over doom eternal. Doom eternal does NOT feel creative. The way you listed on how to kill a certain enemy, is really the only way you can kill that enemy, some guns just aren’t viable against certain enemy’s because of how much they got rid of the creativeness that comes with killing ANY enemy with ANY weapon in ANY way. Whereas eternal, there’s only one right way that was INTENTIONALLY designed for the player to beat the enemy with a certain gun, certain swap, and a certain weak spot. I can’t even watch eternal gameplay cause it gets so boring seeing the same combos, same technique, same weapon swaps and it all just becomes repetitive. 2016 didn’t have that, you can use whatever gun to kill whatever enemy, although SOOOME methods were better, the freedom to just run and shoot and rip and tear with whatever you wanted IS STILL amazing, and since your pushed to run and gun instead of cover all the time, really makes you feel like a powerhouse regardless of how you play. And the music just seals the deal, the amount of work that went into 2016s music is still, to me, unmatched. I get ready to rip and tear whenever I replay DOOM 2016🔥🔥
@@UngliYTI think giving up on any commentary about Doom because of a few hate comments is kinda stupid, tbh, mate. Not saying their hate is justified, just that you ought to expect it at this point. People sometimes are assholes, and you can learn to ignore them. I do think you're gonna need to grow some thicker skin if your channel ever blows up. But eh, what do I know. I'm just some internet random.
I was someone who completed the base game, thought it was good, got all the keys and the Unmaykr. But when I played the expansion, I ended up getting turned off from the first level. Maybe it’s because I hadn’t played in the time between finishing and the DLC being released, but it felt way harder to do. I would get into combat with hordes of dangerous demons, running around to stay alive while working my way through my arsenal, trying to find fuel for the chainsaw so I could get more ammo, only to find my reward for surviving is to have another group spawn in. When I got through the last arena and struggled against the Baron of Hell, only to have yet another spawn in, my reaction was ‘Oh COME ON!’. I didn’t find it fun anymore, and I knew the rest of the levels were only going to get more difficult. And this is just a personal choice, but I preferred how Doom 2016 wasn’t arcadey. That the weapons were lying around like actual weapons instead of floating in mid air. I liked the more grounded feel.
dlcs very much expect you to master the mechanics of the game. TAG2 was a lot more friendly to players who didnt play the game that much, but i can understand why it could be too much
I hated eternal, tried and liked 2016 after a playthrough, then went back to eternal and never looked back. I feel like it comes down to how people play single player games and how eternal was lowkey designed against that. Eternal has its own metas and tech, as if its a multiplayer game. And diving in and engaging with that across multiple playthroughs, dlcs and the master levels is how you get the most out of the game imo. Most single player games are intuitive and comfortable enough for a single playthrough to be satisfying enough for singleplayer gamers. And i think thats what it comes down to between 2016 and Eternal. Do you want to pick up a shooter and have a mindlessly good time for a 10 hour playthrough once a year? Or do you want to sweat by yourself and master tech and metas in solitude for hours on end for your own satisfaction? 600+ hours into Eternal, and I'm almost finished with a spray n pray playthrough with only the autoshotty, heavy cannon w/ micro missiles, plasma rifle w/ heatblast, and the mobile turret---just because im bored of how everyone else plays it. The game lets you do what you want if you know what you're doing, but its so chaotic in the beginning that even I hated the first half of my first playthrough. I also feel that enjoying the game past the first playthrough enlists you into the UndertheMayo echo chamber essentially, in terms of other fans and their opinions, their advice on how to play the game, etc. Just my opinion after marinating on the games and community for 4 years and a couple hundred hours.
The chainsaw roughly refills every 15 secs, so when you get good with quick swapping and personalizing your play style, you can still have plenty of ammo in eternal
It is clear that people do not like Doom Eternal because it actually requires you to put in effort if you want to push yourself to be, in my opinion, the strongest version of the Doom Slayer. A recent developer direct about Doom The Dark Ages kind of explains all of why some people may not have liked Doom Eternal but liked Doom 2016 and vice versa and this is due to the way they designed the games to be. Doom Eternal was designed to make you feel like a "fighter-jet" and Doom TDA / Doom 2016 you are an "iron tank", the main difference between Doom 2016 and Doom TDA is that with Doom TDA it is going to be faster paced than Doom 2016 but not as fast as Doom Eternal, "a perfect entry point for anyone looking to get into Doom".
Just came here from Mayo’s video. I watched your Doom videos over the last few days and found them entertaining, it’s always great getting some perspective from someone new talking about the franchise. I agreed with a lot of your points, and there were a few things that you and I see differently, but hey, that’s fine. I enjoyed this video and your 2016 one. Subscribed, and I hope you continue to make Doom videos when Dark Ages comes out!
I didn't know it was divisive. The game was significantly better than 2016. Better combat, faster pace, music and more satisfying for me. The weapon switching really irked me in the beginning and lack of ammo. But once you get the hang of it, it was a blast. You wanna talk about divisive? That's Doom 3 lol
@@33connorkenway33if you value how the systems work together, compliment each other and you also value dance-like flow to the combat, then the game is undeniably better than 2016. It's literally the best, most intricate shooter combat system that was ever created, or at least that I know of.
The platforming in Eternal is way more foregiving than in Doom 2016.In 2016, some of the platforming was difficult for me, because it was hard to reach certain secrets and you were killed instantley if you fell.
Slow down my guy, I had already subscribed after watching the Doom (2016) review, no need to hit us with another banger of a video I'm really looking forward for any future videos, great work dude
The reason maps in Eternal feel like you're just bouncing form one place to another for the sake of it, is because people complained about Doom 2016's levels looking same-y. There were memes of map screenshot getting compared to friggin lasagne! In conclusion ID decided to give us the variety for the sake of it.
I enjoyed this game, but the atmosphere hit different in 2016. I’ve been thinking about replaying these games to see if my feelings have changed on them. Great video. 👍🏽
I have a very weird relationship with Eternal because when I criticise the game, I have the same points as you did, with the ammo and guns. But once I get in the game I really have a good time. However I am firmly on the side of 2016 concerning everything storytelling, artstyle and especially the gun designs. I really really miss the 2016 Plasma Gun and Gauss Cannon, and I like the rest of the guns more then their eternal counterparts.
I love Eternal but i agree there were many steps in the wrong direction for me. 1. The comic style and graphics 2. The focus on this grand story 3. The lack of horror vibe 4. The "forced gameplay" you practically have to kill the cacademon with a grenade, or else you're being incredibly inefficient. 5. Melee is worthless. Other than that i love the increased speed, movability. Addition of flame belch and frost grenade. Blood punch is great, if only they didn't make the regular punch hit like a soft pillow.
Hi, I understand Eternal doesn't click with everyone, and I agree with points 1 to 3. But the gameplay is not that forced, cacodemon is easily put into glory kill state with a grenade but experienced players use other tools like Ballista which is even more efficient at killing them. And melee isn't useless, when charged blood punchs are an incredible tool.
@ well, it's not as much no, it just does a ton of damage, and you can kill them with any weapon there without feeling like you wasted ammo or did it super ineffectively. In eternal, if you try to kill them with anything else, its gonna take 10x more ammo. the gauss cannon uses loads of ammo, and its damage is scaled relatively.
@@Struct.3 I can kill a cacodemon in eternal with just a lock on rocket barrage or 1 shot with the ballista weapon mod, with a grenade like you mentioned, with a precision bolt and super shotgun combo etc. I'm sry partner, but I don't see how any of these options is not "optimal" when he dies in 3 seconds by all of these options.
Yes, we know. We all heard Hugo say that in the presentation. What's with this trend of just mindlessly repeating something that everyone has already heard? You're not clever or saying anything new.
Doom Eternal felt like Piloting an Armored Core in first person with all the buttons, beeps, switching, and twitching and i loved it! i just wish we got more Master Levels
I think the criticism that you don't have freedom to choose your guns is rooted in truth but largely overblown. As soon as you get down the gameplay loop of the chainsaw you can choose to stick to your favorites. Yes there are tactical advantages of using certain types of weapons however I find that there are usually 2 or 3 options at any given time to perform a function. Want to take out an arachnotron turret? You can use the precision bolt sure, but how about the sticky bomb, or blood punch, or the ballista. Definitely far from being limited to one way of interacting with that system. My default is the flaming meathook ssg + ballista and I'll switch to other weapons if they happen to fit the bill better but I generally can just run through everything with those 2 guns. By the time I run out of ssg ammo my chainsaw is up again.
The point on Eternals story is that it doesn't want to commit to being too narrative focused to keep the gameplay at the forefront but also wants it to have way more lore based characters and environment which makes story far more messy and hard to follow than in 2016 which is much simpler but also a bit deeper and much better for the player to be focused throughout the entire plot and game. one of my biggest gripes of eternal is just how the story is really just week in comparison to 2016 even though its much simpler and doesn't nearly matter as much which I think is bad, also a lot of retconning in TAG undermines 2016 which wasn't the play in my own opinion. Both these games are amazingly different and I wouldn't have it either way, they both have different enjoyable tones and gameplay loops which I think makes the franchise much more enjoyable and longer lasting. Truly timeless games like the original.
I barely followed the stories of 2016/Eternal but in terms of "vibes" i definitely prefer 2016. It felt more focused and almost personal, with doom guy being more like a passenger, which makes sense, because Doom was never about the doom guy, it was about the stuff happening around him. I don't mind when they're teasing us with some cool reveals about the doom guy, how they did in the main campaign in eternal, but that lobster boss in tag2 was like the most anticlimactic ending ever to an otherwise nearly perfect game.
Everyone claims that DOOM Eternal divisived a fanbase, DOOM 2016 was hated by journalists and "bad" FPS fans, then Eternal came out and was praised by everyone else.
Yeah, I wish it still did enough damage to put zombies into glorykill. I can understand not wanting players to spam it against heavier enemies, but they could've made it simply not falter them or something so it's dangerous to spam up close. As well, it's not like you ever run out of ammo for literally every single gun, but it would've been a nice option to at least get that zombie glorykill if you were running low on ammo.
Well now that this video has gotten a reaction and I admittedly sperged out a bit too much in the comments earlier, I will say I respect this video for considering all perspectives and both sides on this topic. Every other video I've seen about this game is all about either why it's great or why it sucks and this is probably the only video I've seen that tries to understand both of those views and explain why you love it but also why you can understand why other people don't. When it comes to accomplishing that goal you did a great job
You had valid criticisms concerning my invalid ones. There is NOTHING wrong with that. People need to be called out on their misinformed opinions and statements, and that includes me.
Doom: Eternal is a fanstastically made game, but it's not one I find myself coming back to very often. When I have the energy to spare, it's an awesome experience analyzing fights, executing cool combos, and generally just being a badass. The problem is that it's just too much for me to enjoy casually. Doom: 2016 is a lot more chill, there's more freedom of what I can use without having to think too hard about every action I make. It's the same reason I enjoy Warframe; get in, put on some UA-cam, choose a gun, and kill shit.
But between you and me, maybe I need to toughen that skin up. So I won’t say I’m not going to. Especially if the chance arises to do it early along with everyone else.
@@UngliYT As someone with a thousand hours in each of these games who is so sick to death of the constant 2016 vs Eternal argument I mostly avoid Doom these days, I've really enjoyed your videos and would be keen to see you do The Dark Ages as well. It's so unfortunately rare to see decent takes presented in such a balanced way.
you CAN play the way you want in Eternal, its just got way more stuff to remember, there's way more ways to dominate enemies than just the ones the game tells you about, the Marauder for example, Under the Mayo blew everyone's mind when he made that video talking about the strategy of lobbing grenades at his feet or remote detonating rockets to damage him and open him up for a quick kill weapon combo, there's loads of stuff like that in the game, the game doesn't force you to use certain weapons for certain enemies, it DOES however force you to experiment with the mechanics and kit that you have at your disposal and find your own optimal strategies through your own discoveries and hours of slaying. the proper use of weapons and mechanics is not what the game tells you it is, its what you find works the most comfortably and enjoyably with you. Also not to be a dick, but there's quite a few instances of your footage where you're standing still while shooting demons, which is exactly what you should NOT be doing.
When i first tried eternal couldn't pass the first enemy and unistalled the game, later I downloaded it again and took the time to learn and became one of my favorite games, the phase of this game and the music is unique
Yo bro, amazing video , yes the gameplay and combat is the best aspect of improvement imo , since it's hella fast paced and allows for a lotttt of movement, just wanted to ask how do you get that color gradient on the hud ? It's looks fucking amazing
You feel way more powerful in eternal, as long as you use all the mechanics, since you need to play way more fast and aggressively, and I don't think it's that hard, ultra-violence is the perfect balance of being challenging at times but also being a power fantasy. I wonder what difficulty did you pick, nightmare is fun for replays.
thats the point. 2016 gave you that fantasy without asking much in return. Its a very forgiving game that leads new players into arena shooters where as Eternal expects you understand how these games work and makes you actually play the game to earn that fantasy
Doom Eternal is never letting you play the way you want, choose the weapon you want. Yes that's a good analysis. On the other hand Doom 2016 gives you complete freedom gameplay wise. And yes this is frustrating. Gameplay wise i choose Doom 2016 over Doom Eternal for this reason alone.
Eternal is tailor made for Nightmare and Ultra Nightmare play, that’s where it absolutely shines. And I don’t blame anyone at all for playing on lower difficulties, Nightmare and Ultra Nightmare can fucking consume your entire gaming mind.
i came here from underthemayo and was sad to see the comments being so rough, i disagree with some points you made plenty of others have mentioned but it offered a new perspective i appreciate. Eternal turned me into way more of a doom fan than i would have if it never released, I have trouble coming back to 2016 now that I’ve sunk so many hours into eternal and got accustomed to the high octane pace
I'm a bit confused why you say that eternal rips away player expression. most people play doom 2016 by running up to every demon with the super shotgun because that's all you had to do to win. Doom eternal is one of the most expressive shooters ever BECAUSE it makes you use every tool at your disposal. It forces you out of your comfort zone and makes you actually be Creative. if your idea of player expression is using a single gun for an entire fight and not think about it, then you can turn down the difficulty. I think the rest of your criticisms are valid (even if i personally disagree) but that particular comment rubbed me the wrong way
Great video! I do prefer the tone and atmosphere of 2016, but man, Eternal's combat is insane. I'm sure plenty have said it by now, but you're not actually forced to break weakpoints, it only feels that way at first when you're still getting comfortable with all the mechanics. I've done various challenge runs with my least preferred gun mods and even NO gun mods, and the game is still playable and beatable. Depending on mod choice, you can make your guns weakpoint breakers or raw damage dealers, meaning you can make any loadout work in this game, which is great for creativity and expression. And if you're good enough with your mobility, you can just straight up dodge Arachnotron and Mancubus fire. Ammo seems annoyingly low at first, but it teaches you to make your shots count and to figure out more efficient strategies. On the Flame Belch and Blood Punch, at first they seem like too much, I won't lie. I actually didn't use them during my first playthrough haha. But once you get comfortable with the game, they're such a great source of depth. The Flame Belch isn't necessary for survival, but it helps you tank extra damage. I LOVE burning groups of fodder and taking them out with a single rocket, so satisfying. The Blood Punch is best used as a crowd-clearer for when you get cornered, but it also breaks weakpoints and falters even superheavies, so you can use it defensively or offensively. The platforming isn't realistic no, but I've also come to find it really fun. You can bounce between walls as quickly as you can look and press jump, and even learn shortcuts to beat sections faster. I find it to be an extension of the game's speed and mobility. My favorite platforming levels are Super Gore Nest, Mars Core, and Urdak.
I'd actually advocate that DOOM Eternal pushes for more expression, as opposed to "yanking it away". The weapons aren't as locked to their roles as you make it seem. You can bust weak points with well landed rockets for example, you don't need to use the precision bolt or the ballista. Under The Mayo is a great person to look at regarding expression. Whenever I see his gameplay it's immediately apparent to me that it is him playing and not anyone else because of how much he can express himself through the way he uses weapons. That's just my 2 cents though Sorry, just saw your pinned comment. Gonna keep this here though because I'm not afraid to look stupid aha. Great video btw!
I made the transition to PC around 2020 and as someone who considers both modern Doom games to be among my favorite FPS (Ultrakill is the GOAT), I have to say-these games with MKB and high framerate are absolute game changers. What became with Eternal in that many people's relatively early impressions led them to believe that the weak point system incentivized certain weapons and mods over others suddenly became obvious that there's much more efficient ways to off enemies than what you're initially led to believe. Frankly, it's a skill issue to think so. I see no reason on that point alone to hold 2016 over Eternal. You can like 2016 for many reasons, but feeling like you're coerced by the game to play a certain way with regards to optimal play inidicates that one should probably experiment more and work on creative solutions. Also, watching very good players can help see through this.
I'm probably just bad at the new doom games, but ultra violence is that perfect sweet spot for me to feel challenged and appreciate the combat. Doom eternal is the ninja gaiden 2 of fps games.
Hugo said the Dark Ages will be a different feel than 2016 or Eternal, and I’m fucking excited about it. However long it’s been, I’ve not grown tired of either game because no matter how much you play or how much you improve, they always leave you feeling that _you can be better._
While I was wrong in my assessment of player expression, Eternal still rules. It’s MY preferred game. And I’m very much looking forward to talking about Dark Ages. Doom, but fantasy. A match made in heaven. (Or Hell lol)
@ you’re not entirely wrong, there were a lot of people initially that didn’t fall in love with Eternal. But I think now, the majority of people (like myself) who would find your video randomly like I did are people who are and have been diehard fans since release.
some neat things some of the useless mods do like the micro missiles for example completely bypass the doom hunters shields. the full auto now drops ammo with kills but still only really useful in the dlc.
see I'm actually a huge fan of eternal and the fast pace gameplay loop. Dark Ages looked to be a little slow for my liking but the added sliders hopefully will make it more on par with eternal
I completed Doom 2016 in ultra nightmare...I completed Doom Eternal in easy mode. Because in higher difficulties i wasn't having fun. Yes, this is how hard Doom Eternal is. It is way harder than Doom 2016.
Doom 2016 feels like enjoying the game and its difficult. Doom eternal feels like testing myself and trying to be better, trust me I play in console and it is really hard, specially the master levels
Some people had issues with the Glory kill animations mid games and said that it broke the flow of combat. I had no issues with the Glory kill system since 2016 and up until Eternal cause it's a cheesy way to bale out of tough situations or when I made a mistake on harder levels, or sometimes I needed to catch a break to figure out what mistakes I did by simply watching our modern barbarian guy shredding demons into bits, idk but sometimes it was kind of a stress releaver lol. Since Dark Age came out and they removed the Glory kill animation out of non-powerup gameplay I'd say they better include as many exclusive Execution animations on the Berserk powerup as possible and include more power ups on the higher levels and put it on a out of bound or a corner or somthing so that people have choices of either picking it up or not.
@UngliYT Me too, like they featured a chainsaw shield which could parry and block enemies atks is kind of a souls like mechanic. I'm guessing the game mechanics on Dark Age may be traditional boots on the ground with a bit of souls like play style and dare I say it's more friendly towards new players, like you literally have two tools in one and it could BLOCK and PARRY atks, how easier could this be lol. But it's only a part of the gameplay, I hope that they would add more challenging things such as super duper insane master levels to make players suffer lol.
I really don't think spamming one gun for an entire game is anything close to "player expression". And since chainsaw is on a cool down, ammo is actually more plentiful in eternal. I have no idea how so many people have these same trash, or just false, things to say about eternal There is nothing wrong with people not liking the game because they are bad at it. Just wish they would say that Holy shit dude actually compared eternal to doom 3. You are actually insane
16:10 Just a observation, the auto-shotgun mod, once fully upgraded makes every enemy killed with it drop shotgun ammos, os kinda of a free kill but, you won’t spam it because you will be moving slower
Doom Eternal is the story of a game that asked the player base to "git gud" and then players reacting with either "Okay, I love playing new games and learning the systems of combat!" or "I dont want to be good, I want to walk around and kill demons mindlessly and now I will pretend the game has design flaws because I made no effort to understand the flow of combat"
Good video! I think you hit every nail on the head, it would have been cool if you talked about the DLCs especially TAG1 but that's ok. I obviously disagree with your bit on creative expression but no reason to harp on that considering you already made a reply.
It was a bad call on my part. I should’ve played more and did more research. As for the dlc, it’s a lot more of the same, so I wasn’t quite sure what to say. There are new things, but I really wanted to focus on the main campaign. I considered a follow up dlc video, but after getting some pretty insane hate comments that I flat out deleted, I think I’ll hold off on that. Other than my one, glaringly bad take, lol, I’m glad you liked the video ❤️
I just don't understand how people can use the argument that some games don't let you play your way and some do. There are consessions in every game, that's why we play them. You like a game because it has defined rules and you play within them. The difference is that some games are more focused, and that is amazing imo. In Eternal you still have variety within systems, but you need to be more creative and have better understanding of the game to use them optimaĺy. Of course some games are just more restrictive, but in the case of Doom Eternal it is just about your level of understanding of the game systems.
@@UngliYT Nah, people need to accept there is a middle ground between the two camps. Eternal does have plenty of room for creativity but the number of tools suitable for each task is more limited, I think you have done a better job of expressing that than most have managed, even if it was a slightly clumsy way of going about it. Both games are great, I can respect iD for switching it up rather than just making more of what came before they are doing it again with Dark Ages (to similar reception it seems).
@@Tuberuser187 the point of my video critiquing was to try to put myself in the shoes of someone who didn’t like Eternal. I LOVE Eternal. I think that comes across in my video. But, hey. You live and you learn. I take full accountability and apologized to offended players. I’m glad you’re here. Now that my Doom videos are done. Dead Space 2023.
Hey bit curious since you seem new to UA-cam, you ever played games from the Remedy-verse like Alan Wake, Control, and the out of universe games like Max Payne and Quantum Break? Would love to see your thoughts on them goven the quality of this video.
Great video. You mentioned all the reasons why I prefer 2016 - it's just more my play- and artstile. I want to be in charge of how to play the game and not being dictated by the game. Still, I get why people love Eternal.
Claiming that Doom Eternal forces you to use certain weapons in big 2025 is crazy. It’s been 5 years I thought we already moved past this baseless claim. UnderTheMayo already made several rebuttals to this. There’s way more expression than what’s possible in Doom 2016 for instance, because the interactive elements have increased. It’s not about "the game forcing you to use precision bolt to break a weakpoint" it’s more like what can you use in your arsenal to falter enemies and destroy weakpoints. Sure some mechanics are pushed more than others but you’re not ever forced to use them. Ever heard of the fun zone? Each weapon possesses overlaps. You can use several options to falter lock an enemy. I don’t know if you’ve been living under a rock this whole time but the culture around the game is palpable. The fans will sing praise of its genius design, whereas dissenters are people who the game hasn’t clicked for yet. People who dislike Eternal for its "lack of freedom" haven’t quite understood how the game works. It literally gives you more things to do than any other doom game, it just heavily encourages you to actually interact with those elements instead of spam SSG non stop.
The reason for this is, I believe, that 2016 brought a lot of casuals, so when Eternal comes out, those new fans couldn't get a grip on a game that actually requires skill. That and 2016 fans tend to lie, A LOT!
My only criticism about Eternal is that it’s kinda slow at the start, though it does pick up a lot once you unlock the dash move. Personally, I kinda like how the Marauder and Doom Hunter are both introduced as bosses. Because it allows the game to demonstrate how different they are from the rest of the enemies to new players and how to kill them. I still remember my first encounter with both enemies, the cutscenes warming up the player with a kind of excitement you’d get when you pick up a comic book where the hero fights a brand new supervillain, and that sweet satisfaction and sense of accomplishment when you finally kill then for the first time.
We all agree that Eternal is more complex of a game than 2016. I think it's fair to like 2016 more casual flow more. However, if you are actually willing to spend your time and efforts on both games I think there's little debate to which one is best when it comes to pure gameplay. As an example, as someone who tipically plays shooters until there's really nothing more to gain, I have probably around 2500 hours in Eternal and around 300 on 2016. About the creativity discourse it's already been said: Eternal is a pretty creative game, definitely more than 2016 can possibly be in terms of sheer combinations of weapon, tools, movement and enemy variety. There are things I don't really like in the mix but man, there's just no comparison in my eye
@@UngliYT I think DE has been criminally underrated by the gaming community overall. Sure, people will say it's a good shooter. But most people, even people who do play a ton of videogames, have basically no idea how deep the rabbit hole goes with this game. It's unfortunate honestly, I think it deserved more than it eventually got
This video is one of the only ones ive seen thats fair to both sides of the debate, as i feel like most reviews shill whichever one they think is better. Also about the exploration, I feel like eternal has worse exploration since while the levels are bigger, theyre disguised hallways with one path, while on the other hand 2016s levels had a lot more backtracking which lead to more interesting secrets.
I'm here to give this video a like and some exposure. Don't worry about all these feathers you ruffled. I agree with pretty much every one of these criticisms, I think there's a little more freedom than people give the game credit for but it still has a very specific combat loop that it wants you to engage with. Which is not my favorite way to play Doom, but it's still a great system. The game is still a fantastic shooter. But I don't really care for the art style compared to the others, It feels so goofy in cartoony in this one, I hate all the platforming in between combat segments. I find it to be just janky and annoying. I'm not complaining about all the new mobility you have, but I only enjoy that during combat. And I still don't think the Marauder is a great enemy. It's not a skill issue, I've beat the game, I just don't find him fun to fight, in fact the only time I think they did him well was the DLCs I also miss the vibe that 2016 had with putting gameplay over story. I think it was better when this stuff was relegated to just some lore in the background. That being said I own two copies of this game I have run through the campaign multiple times along with both DLC chapters, and I've messed around with the master levels and horde mode, and just in general have gone back to play levels that I like It's a fantastic game, There's just a lot that I don't care for that much about it which keeps it from being in my top favorites in the franchise
Doom 2016 is classic run and gun, mostly strafing. Doom Eternal is like a ballet. You have to constantly jump, fly in air etc. I love Doom 2016's gunplay more than Doom Eternal's. And Doom Eternal forces you to play in a certain way. It's called Doom Dance. If you don't do Doom Dance you can not play on a higher difficulty than the easy mode. If you just want to strafe and run and gun you have to play on easy. On higher difficulties you have to learn the doom dance. That i didn't like about the game. But Doom Eternal is a masterpiece nonetheless. Doom Eternal is one of the best fps games ever.
I feel the combat has too many buttons. You have 3 different melee weapons that do 3 different things, a grenade launcher that switches between 2 different types of grenades, and a punch that’s only useful when powered up. Don’t get me wrong, I love Eternal, but it really should’ve toned down some of those options. Make one melee weapon that can work as both the blood punch and the chainsaw, and make the crucible more of a power up. DOOM the Dark Ages seems to be doing just that, and I’m excited for it.
okay but doom eternal being hard and challenging it my favorite part about it, but i see why its might be frustrating because in the first play through didn't play for a week and when i came back to i got absolutely obliterated by demons and died way too much and had to grind and get good at it agian. -English is not my first language, so spare me
Eternal was the sweet spot imo BUT it makes me excited for dark ages. Another hit will be really impressive. MAYBE Microsoft can let id make a halo spinoff
I prefer Eternal, but I completely understand people who prefer 2016. It took until the amcient gods part 1 for Eternal to click for me. It was a bizarre feeling, almost like my Ackerman sense awakened (from attack on titan) and I could suddenly use every weapon to my advantage rather than forgetting them half of the time. Not saying I'm a god at the game, I play on hurt me plenty. I'm just saying that I struggled with the combat for the longest time until it clicked, then I was still challenged but thoroughly enjoying it.
9:28 im gonna disagree with you on the lack of player expression being a frustrating aspect of eternal. I love that the devs have confidence in the combat loop they are leading players into playing and after 730 hours of just endlessly grinding the campaign and DLCs and master levels, i can confidently say they’ve nailed it and that these restrictions are an overall net positive to the gameplay. The combat is addictive and the flow state this game gives is unreal.
i wont judge you if our opinion’s don’t line up and I dont think you’re wrong either because initially on my first playthrough i thought of how much more demanding the game was and also how some mods felt less useful than others therefore steered me away from using it entirely but after some replays and on harder difficulties something just clicked that made me want to try different approaches to the combat loop, some worked, some didnt. Also don’t let the ultra negative comments discourage you on making the content you would be proud of. Loved your doom 2016 vid and this one as well despite our difference in opnion on one aspect of eternal.
Doom 2016 is like a beta of Eternal. I have a hard time replaying 2016 because Eternal is so much better. Also I turn off the HUD in every game. It used to be a preference to turn off the HUD, but HUDs keep getting worse year after year so now it's become essential.
I loved 2016, but Eternal kicked my ass. Since I only played the Mass Effect trilogy this year, I finally understand the Marauder Shields reference in Doom Eternal, so one day I'll get to see him there.
Doom eternal is a pc game at its core. For better or worse, the combat is more or less designed for keyboard and mouse. The console weapon scroll wheel slows down the player, unless youre actually skilled at the game. whereas on pc you can switch weapons almost instantly and fly across the map. I find it easier to keep up with enemies on pc.
I like all the modern era Doom games (3 included). They've all got their own flavor. My criticisms of Eternal are overused platform mechanics (they're not bad, just overused), and the expansions IMO were way too "busy." Like I'm on Ritalin and still can't focus on the number of mobs that pop up. My ADHD does not like the Ancient Gods at all. Also, not a deal breaker, but I don't like how weapon choice is determined by what demons are there. I like a little more freedom of choice.
Doom Eternal stans can't stand when someone doesn't enjoy it as much as they did. It was an ok game. In my opinion, 2016 was way superior in most ways. Eternal fans will be arguing with me and calling me a noob/casual for saying this, and say shit like their opinions are hard facts. It's always the same shit, they're so predictable.
i hate when people bring this up like i dont want to argue with someone that isnt entering hugos fun zone and is just mindlessly shooting mobile turret in 2016
Brother I entered it lol. I was trying to show why people didn’t like it. They don’t like being urged in any way to use a specific weapon at all. They wanna use what they want, with no restrictions.
Alright, I seem to have absolutely messed up by saying Eternal lacked Creative Expression. I’ll admit I was dead wrong and I’m sorry. Probably should have played more huh? I’ll do my research next time. Hope you still find something to like here, and do look forward to a Dark Ages video when that comes out ❤
@@UngliYT dont let the overacting individuals get to you. They need to be more understanding especially when your work is filled with so much love. Shake it off like Taylor.
There is still plenty to like. Great video, and people overly focusing just on this issue is a testament to that.
@@underthemayodidn’t think to see mayo here. Was gonna refer Ungli to your video about player creativity in Eternal. Really helps people find their own playstyle in the game instead of feeling locked to what the game offers you
I think the video is pretty fucking badass
You're doing great man
Unironically, Doom eternal told people to get good, and a large number of them took that personally.
Agreed. I fukin love games that forces me to get gud. Rising up and overcoming the challenge is so satisfying.
I don't want to run around with one gun and point and click.
@592Johno
I, like most people probably, was initially put off by all the changes, such as weak basic melee and the faster enemies and low ammo, but once I broke away from bad habits I had developed from Doom (2016) I really started to enjoy it for what it was, so much so that I now can't go back to the 2016 version as it's too slow and easy now 😅.
The key is to enjoy them both for what they are. Doom eternal simply requires more accountability on the players' part compared to 2016, where you could get by spamming the ssg or by cheesing encounters using the gauss cannon.
I fucking loved it!
It told them, "you need to commit to this, and be focused, and practice like it's a sport"
Which is good news for a certain kind of gamer
The problem is that these games have always been casual. They don't demand devotion or optimisation, though that is there if you want it. I lot of people just want to chill and relax by blowing up demons, not feel like they're meeting a high pressure deadline at work.
I think eternal fails these gamers
(2016) was fairly easy to get through with the Combat Shotgun and Grenade Launcher combo (sticky), even on UV difficulty. And I'm not a very skilled FPS player, just average. Eternal forced me to constantly switch weapons, run around, use my equipment. It was much more challenging. And the Marauder - that bitch was such a pain in the ass.
DOOM 3 is the most divisive this one is pretty unanimously loved by fans
You should read the comments in my 2016 video
Idk about unanimously. Some people reeeally hate eternal. Doom 3 was probably more divisive at launch but I've been seeing it get a lot more love lately.
@@raguel4416and some people are suffering brain Aneurysms. Doesn't mean their thoughts and complaints are comprehensible or good.
Doom Eternal is better than Doom 3. Definitively.
@@UngliYT Ngl I think all the DOOM games are divisive. I’ve seen hate DOOM 2 bc of the map and level design, people hate DOOM 3 bc it’s dark literally dark and slow, ppl hate DOOM 64 bc of the unsettling atmosphere and there isn’t as many demons, people hate Eternal bc they don’t like the gameplay loop. I always thought 3 was the most hated I’ve met people who can’t stand it more than I have people hating on Eternal but that might just be my experience so I’ll take your word for it. I enjoy all the DOOM games even 3
@@MysteryHandle76 Whoever call Doom 3 slow never end the game and stopped halfway. After getting out of the first Hell, its a full-fledged Action with fewer puzzle, most levels are also lit up and no need for flashlight at all. So the statement of "Doom 3 is too dark and slow." Is not true at all.
Remember kids, your opinions will die with you
But Doom?
Doom is Eternal
It was divisive because people expected it to just be more of 2016. Same things going to happen when people expect Dark Ages to be more of Eternal.
The devs already said that it’s gonna have a completely different approach to the combat in TDA compared to eternals
@@pepeondrugss8419 won't stop the crying that it's too slow before it even came out.
I fundamentally disagree with the idea that Doom Eternal doesn't offer player expression in the gameplay, it offers a different kind of player expression. If you want to use the triple barrel turret, its completely viable but its slow on the ground, so just meathook or ballista boost into the air and empty it into the enemies below, using your double jump or ballista to extend airtime. You barely have to touch the ground in eternal if you don't want to. I keep full auto shotgun as my default, because the mastery gives you ammo for kills, thus rewarding a tight, accurate, close-range playstyle with an infinite ammo fodder killer that keeps your super shotgun topped off(you can also use it to finish off weakened larger demons for a solid ammo payoff). The microwave beam is slow in normal combat, but completely overpowered for briefly swapping to and interrupting enemies into a brief stun state. The chaingun shield can be used momentarily to block incoming projectiles or attacks, or can be used to bully and stun enemies in melee range by dashing into them and interrupting their animations. The rocket launcher has a trade off between massive lock-on damage, or stagger/airburst utility with remote det. Every attachment in the game is useful and can be supported with one or more playstyles, and if you get good at punch canceling the swap animation, you don't even have to pick any more, it's jeet kune do, and you just play however you want. You'll notice if you watch players of high skill that often their gameplay looks completely different, and that's because there isn't a hard right answer, its a puzzle and the better you are at the game the more ways of solving it there are.
This! 100%
Yeah I agree!
I always kind of smile that even though I play pretty well, I don't use basically anything that youtubers use.
No slob, no quickswapping. My playstyle is more falter-oriented, with Micro Missiles for massive damage.
Completely agree! Some people main auto shotgun, most console players love the meathook (everyone loves the meathook, but you know what I mean), I love spam dashing with the shield on the chaingun. Heck, arbalest takes out caco’s just as good as grenades, it’s all about how you want to play!
I think like overall there is also expression in eternal, but with how often the game sort of presents how one should use different guns for different situations and combined with the ammo constantly making you switch guns. I can at times feel a bit more restrictive at least compared to 2016. Here’s hoping dark ages is able to hit a good in between 🙂
There is so much more creativity in Eternal than 99% of FPS just because the weapon mods are so varied, the enemies are varied and any situation you are in, depending on your resources, will push you to use different weapons on different enemies.
Idk the chainsaw in eternal fills up quick enough that I barely notice ammo as long as I constantly use it when it’s pipped again
literally, my friend complated about ammo and i was like yeah, felt like it at first but then I started using the chainsaw.
People need to learn to use the chain saw more and use and swap weapons
Using it is a nice break too ayy
@@batarnakdekosse1312realllll sometimes I use the chainsaw as a way to get my bearings and get a little breather. Especially if my health is super critical.
I would tell people to think about getting ammo like reloading in other FPS games. Instead of pressing a button to get your ammo back, you have to chainsaw enemies.
How is this game already 5 years old 💀
Doom 2016 is 9 years old :)
I like your work and I think you made a good retrospective. But I'm not sure why at the 5 year point you would give weight to the claim that "eternal nullifies player creativity". It's something the fan base had to shut down for years so it kinda sucks to hear it here.
And I don't even necessarily think you believe it when you say it. Because if you know the game, you know that you don't have to shoot an arachnotron turret to kill it. Throw a grenade and then full auto. Dead. Use a lock on rocket volley or an Arbalest shot on a cacodemon. Dead. There's so much creativity available to the player, and I don't accept the claim that player creativity = being able to use just one gun all day.
There are rules to any game, and creativity within those rules. The rules of 2016 were that you had to be aggressive and not hide behind cover. If your idea of player freedom was that you want to be able to hide behind cover, then 2016 was "restricting your creativity" by forcing you into aggression.
So, a 99% great video. But I think your statements on creativity could use a little more time in the oven.
I basically made the same point here. You find creativity within clearly defined rules, otherwise what even do we play games for?
Yep. Seems like I missed the mark by an extremely wide margin. And the animosity from these comments (not this one) have absolutely made sure I don’t discuss Doom again.
@@UngliYT well that's unfortunate. You don't deserve any kind of animosity for that. I'm sorry you've had to deal with such ugliness. People are awful, and more so every year.
When dealing with the "no creativity" thing it always comes from people screaming and bitching about the game, so I think people are conditioned to lash out at this point because we're nearly universally dealing with bad actors. But people need to recognize when they're talking to someone who's expressing a genuine appreciation for the game and treat them with some freaking respect.
Wroooong, in the past years I’ve picked up doom again and again to replay, over doom eternal. Doom eternal does NOT feel creative. The way you listed on how to kill a certain enemy, is really the only way you can kill that enemy, some guns just aren’t viable against certain enemy’s because of how much they got rid of the creativeness that comes with killing ANY enemy with ANY weapon in ANY way. Whereas eternal, there’s only one right way that was INTENTIONALLY designed for the player to beat the enemy with a certain gun, certain swap, and a certain weak spot. I can’t even watch eternal gameplay cause it gets so boring seeing the same combos, same technique, same weapon swaps and it all just becomes repetitive. 2016 didn’t have that, you can use whatever gun to kill whatever enemy, although SOOOME methods were better, the freedom to just run and shoot and rip and tear with whatever you wanted IS STILL amazing, and since your pushed to run and gun instead of cover all the time, really makes you feel like a powerhouse regardless of how you play. And the music just seals the deal, the amount of work that went into 2016s music is still, to me, unmatched. I get ready to rip and tear whenever I replay DOOM 2016🔥🔥
@@UngliYTI think giving up on any commentary about Doom because of a few hate comments is kinda stupid, tbh, mate. Not saying their hate is justified, just that you ought to expect it at this point. People sometimes are assholes, and you can learn to ignore them. I do think you're gonna need to grow some thicker skin if your channel ever blows up.
But eh, what do I know. I'm just some internet random.
Roses are red
Demons are nocturnal
Hell might be infinite
But Doom is Eternal
I was someone who completed the base game, thought it was good, got all the keys and the Unmaykr. But when I played the expansion, I ended up getting turned off from the first level. Maybe it’s because I hadn’t played in the time between finishing and the DLC being released, but it felt way harder to do. I would get into combat with hordes of dangerous demons, running around to stay alive while working my way through my arsenal, trying to find fuel for the chainsaw so I could get more ammo, only to find my reward for surviving is to have another group spawn in. When I got through the last arena and struggled against the Baron of Hell, only to have yet another spawn in, my reaction was ‘Oh COME ON!’. I didn’t find it fun anymore, and I knew the rest of the levels were only going to get more difficult.
And this is just a personal choice, but I preferred how Doom 2016 wasn’t arcadey. That the weapons were lying around like actual weapons instead of floating in mid air. I liked the more grounded feel.
Yeah the dlc is definitely harder than the base game
dlcs very much expect you to master the mechanics of the game. TAG2 was a lot more friendly to players who didnt play the game that much, but i can understand why it could be too much
I hated eternal, tried and liked 2016 after a playthrough, then went back to eternal and never looked back. I feel like it comes down to how people play single player games and how eternal was lowkey designed against that. Eternal has its own metas and tech, as if its a multiplayer game. And diving in and engaging with that across multiple playthroughs, dlcs and the master levels is how you get the most out of the game imo. Most single player games are intuitive and comfortable enough for a single playthrough to be satisfying enough for singleplayer gamers. And i think thats what it comes down to between 2016 and Eternal. Do you want to pick up a shooter and have a mindlessly good time for a 10 hour playthrough once a year? Or do you want to sweat by yourself and master tech and metas in solitude for hours on end for your own satisfaction?
600+ hours into Eternal, and I'm almost finished with a spray n pray playthrough with only the autoshotty, heavy cannon w/ micro missiles, plasma rifle w/ heatblast, and the mobile turret---just because im bored of how everyone else plays it. The game lets you do what you want if you know what you're doing, but its so chaotic in the beginning that even I hated the first half of my first playthrough. I also feel that enjoying the game past the first playthrough enlists you into the UndertheMayo echo chamber essentially, in terms of other fans and their opinions, their advice on how to play the game, etc. Just my opinion after marinating on the games and community for 4 years and a couple hundred hours.
The chainsaw roughly refills every 15 secs, so when you get good with quick swapping and personalizing your play style, you can still have plenty of ammo in eternal
It is clear that people do not like Doom Eternal because it actually requires you to put in effort if you want to push yourself to be, in my opinion, the strongest version of the Doom Slayer.
A recent developer direct about Doom The Dark Ages kind of explains all of why some people may not have liked Doom Eternal but liked Doom 2016 and vice versa and this is due to the way they designed the games to be. Doom Eternal was designed to make you feel like a "fighter-jet" and Doom TDA / Doom 2016 you are an "iron tank", the main difference between Doom 2016 and Doom TDA is that with Doom TDA it is going to be faster paced than Doom 2016 but not as fast as Doom Eternal, "a perfect entry point for anyone looking to get into Doom".
I tried to get that across, but I guess I didn’t. Hey, you can’t win ‘em all.
Just came here from Mayo’s video. I watched your Doom videos over the last few days and found them entertaining, it’s always great getting some perspective from someone new talking about the franchise. I agreed with a lot of your points, and there were a few things that you and I see differently, but hey, that’s fine.
I enjoyed this video and your 2016 one. Subscribed, and I hope you continue to make Doom videos when Dark Ages comes out!
I didn't know it was divisive. The game was significantly better than 2016. Better combat, faster pace, music and more satisfying for me. The weapon switching really irked me in the beginning and lack of ammo. But once you get the hang of it, it was a blast. You wanna talk about divisive? That's Doom 3 lol
Check out the comments of my 2016 vid. It’s all about which was better and which they didn’t like
It's not better than 2016
@@33connorkenway33if you value how the systems work together, compliment each other and you also value dance-like flow to the combat, then the game is undeniably better than 2016. It's literally the best, most intricate shooter combat system that was ever created, or at least that I know of.
@@33connorkenway33 For me it is. By far. Matter of preference.
2016 > eternal
The platforming in Eternal is way more foregiving than in Doom 2016.In 2016, some of the platforming was difficult for me, because it was hard to reach certain secrets and you were killed instantley if you fell.
Great point
Slow down my guy, I had already subscribed after watching the Doom (2016) review, no need to hit us with another banger of a video
I'm really looking forward for any future videos, great work dude
The reason maps in Eternal feel like you're just bouncing form one place to another for the sake of it, is because people complained about Doom 2016's levels looking same-y. There were memes of map screenshot getting compared to friggin lasagne! In conclusion ID decided to give us the variety for the sake of it.
And that was absolutely the correct choice. Every map in eternal is breathtaking.
@@Rez_U_Rekt agreed
I enjoyed this game, but the atmosphere hit different in 2016. I’ve been thinking about replaying these games to see if my feelings have changed on them. Great video. 👍🏽
weird, everyone hated DOOM 2015 for not being atmospheric as DOOM 3, now it's praised for having a atmosphere? Make your shit up.
@ Doom 2016 was my first Doom game.
I have a very weird relationship with Eternal because when I criticise the game, I have the same points as you did, with the ammo and guns. But once I get in the game I really have a good time.
However I am firmly on the side of 2016 concerning everything storytelling, artstyle and especially the gun designs. I really really miss the 2016 Plasma Gun and Gauss Cannon, and I like the rest of the guns more then their eternal counterparts.
I love Eternal but i agree there were many steps in the wrong direction for me. 1. The comic style and graphics 2. The focus on this grand story 3. The lack of horror vibe 4. The "forced gameplay" you practically have to kill the cacademon with a grenade, or else you're being incredibly inefficient. 5. Melee is worthless. Other than that i love the increased speed, movability. Addition of flame belch and frost grenade. Blood punch is great, if only they didn't make the regular punch hit like a soft pillow.
Hi, I understand Eternal doesn't click with everyone, and I agree with points 1 to 3. But the gameplay is not that forced, cacodemon is easily put into glory kill state with a grenade but experienced players use other tools like Ballista which is even more efficient at killing them. And melee isn't useless, when charged blood punchs are an incredible tool.
I can also insta kill a cacodemon with the Gauss cannon siege mode in 2016, so is that bad design too or what?
@ well, it's not as much no, it just does a ton of damage, and you can kill them with any weapon there without feeling like you wasted ammo or did it super ineffectively. In eternal, if you try to kill them with anything else, its gonna take 10x more ammo. the gauss cannon uses loads of ammo, and its damage is scaled relatively.
@@Struct.3 I can kill a cacodemon in eternal with just a lock on rocket barrage or 1 shot with the ballista weapon mod, with a grenade like you mentioned, with a precision bolt and super shotgun combo etc. I'm sry partner, but I don't see how any of these options is not "optimal" when he dies in 3 seconds by all of these options.
Doom 2016 has you run and gun eternal has you jump and gun and doom the dark age has you stand your ground
Yes, we know. We all heard Hugo say that in the presentation. What's with this trend of just mindlessly repeating something that everyone has already heard? You're not clever or saying anything new.
Word for word
@@DeadPixel1105 zoomers in a nutshell
i don't know how i found your video, but yeah, great vid, good editing, might watch more from you right now
Doom Eternal felt like Piloting an Armored Core in first person with all the buttons, beeps, switching, and twitching and i loved it!
i just wish we got more Master Levels
Play mods then!
I prefer Eternal, but 2016 is also awesome. I like doom. Looking forward to watching this video.
When comparing to Eternal, Doom 2016 feels like a tech demo.
There is literally nothing to compare both Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal. I personally enjoy them both at all.
I think the criticism that you don't have freedom to choose your guns is rooted in truth but largely overblown. As soon as you get down the gameplay loop of the chainsaw you can choose to stick to your favorites. Yes there are tactical advantages of using certain types of weapons however I find that there are usually 2 or 3 options at any given time to perform a function. Want to take out an arachnotron turret? You can use the precision bolt sure, but how about the sticky bomb, or blood punch, or the ballista. Definitely far from being limited to one way of interacting with that system. My default is the flaming meathook ssg + ballista and I'll switch to other weapons if they happen to fit the bill better but I generally can just run through everything with those 2 guns. By the time I run out of ssg ammo my chainsaw is up again.
Doom Eternal: Soundtrack & Gameplay
Doom 2016: Everything else
I mean, no.
The point on Eternals story is that it doesn't want to commit to being too narrative focused to keep the gameplay at the forefront but also wants it to have way more lore based characters and environment which makes story far more messy and hard to follow than in 2016 which is much simpler but also a bit deeper and much better for the player to be focused throughout the entire plot and game.
one of my biggest gripes of eternal is just how the story is really just week in comparison to 2016 even though its much simpler and doesn't nearly matter as much which I think is bad, also a lot of retconning in TAG undermines 2016 which wasn't the play in my own opinion.
Both these games are amazingly different and I wouldn't have it either way, they both have different enjoyable tones and gameplay loops which I think makes the franchise much more enjoyable and longer lasting. Truly timeless games like the original.
I barely followed the stories of 2016/Eternal but in terms of "vibes" i definitely prefer 2016. It felt more focused and almost personal, with doom guy being more like a passenger, which makes sense, because Doom was never about the doom guy, it was about the stuff happening around him. I don't mind when they're teasing us with some cool reveals about the doom guy, how they did in the main campaign in eternal, but that lobster boss in tag2 was like the most anticlimactic ending ever to an otherwise nearly perfect game.
Everyone claims that DOOM Eternal divisived a fanbase, DOOM 2016 was hated by journalists and "bad" FPS fans, then Eternal came out and was praised by everyone else.
I think they’re both great
I think my biggest gripe gameplay wise about eternal, especially when it first came out is that the basic melee does zero damage.
You’d think in that suit, his regular punch would be the blood punch
Yeah, I wish it still did enough damage to put zombies into glorykill. I can understand not wanting players to spam it against heavier enemies, but they could've made it simply not falter them or something so it's dangerous to spam up close.
As well, it's not like you ever run out of ammo for literally every single gun, but it would've been a nice option to at least get that zombie glorykill if you were running low on ammo.
Well now that this video has gotten a reaction and I admittedly sperged out a bit too much in the comments earlier, I will say I respect this video for considering all perspectives and both sides on this topic. Every other video I've seen about this game is all about either why it's great or why it sucks and this is probably the only video I've seen that tries to understand both of those views and explain why you love it but also why you can understand why other people don't. When it comes to accomplishing that goal you did a great job
You had valid criticisms concerning my invalid ones. There is NOTHING wrong with that. People need to be called out on their misinformed opinions and statements, and that includes me.
Doom: Eternal is a fanstastically made game, but it's not one I find myself coming back to very often. When I have the energy to spare, it's an awesome experience analyzing fights, executing cool combos, and generally just being a badass. The problem is that it's just too much for me to enjoy casually. Doom: 2016 is a lot more chill, there's more freedom of what I can use without having to think too hard about every action I make. It's the same reason I enjoy Warframe; get in, put on some UA-cam, choose a gun, and kill shit.
Also, I much prefer the art direction of 2016. Eternal's enemies are too cartoony for my tastes.
Doom eternal & Doom 2016 is fucking amazing than again i love DOOM
Doom Eternal kicks way more ass than 2016 in my opinion, I can't wait for The Dark Ages!
Dark Ages will be more of the 2016, they are ditching the gameplay of the Eternal. Rightfully so, I might add
@@krzysiekj2522 I dont think it’s going to follow Eternal or 2016’s shoes for that matter. It’s gonna do it’s own thing and I can’t wait for it.
@ really? where?
@@greekpestnyc3145 in one of the dev talks. There were a few that I've seen already, I believe it was one of the earliest ones close to the reveal.
If you want the adhd zoomer gameplay of eternal, you’re gonna be disappointed big time.
Another banger upload. I hope your channel grows. Btw will you do a dark ages review when it comes out?
Judging by the animosity from some of these comments, and surely more to come, probably not.
@UngliYT aight.
But between you and me, maybe I need to toughen that skin up. So I won’t say I’m not going to. Especially if the chance arises to do it early along with everyone else.
@@UngliYT aw yeah
@@UngliYT As someone with a thousand hours in each of these games who is so sick to death of the constant 2016 vs Eternal argument I mostly avoid Doom these days, I've really enjoyed your videos and would be keen to see you do The Dark Ages as well. It's so unfortunately rare to see decent takes presented in such a balanced way.
another neat thing id like to point out about the recharging abilities is it has a sound cue when things are recharged aswell
You know the games good when the only complaints are people sucking at the game
you CAN play the way you want in Eternal, its just got way more stuff to remember, there's way more ways to dominate enemies than just the ones the game tells you about,
the Marauder for example, Under the Mayo blew everyone's mind when he made that video talking about the strategy of lobbing grenades at his feet or remote detonating rockets to damage him and open him up for a quick kill weapon combo, there's loads of stuff like that in the game, the game doesn't force you to use certain weapons for certain enemies, it DOES however force you to experiment with the mechanics and kit that you have at your disposal and find your own optimal strategies through your own discoveries and hours of slaying.
the proper use of weapons and mechanics is not what the game tells you it is, its what you find works the most comfortably and enjoyably with you. Also not to be a dick, but there's quite a few instances of your footage where you're standing still while shooting demons, which is exactly what you should NOT be doing.
When i first tried eternal couldn't pass the first enemy and unistalled the game, later I downloaded it again and took the time to learn and became one of my favorite games, the phase of this game and the music is unique
Yo bro, amazing video , yes the gameplay and combat is the best aspect of improvement imo , since it's hella fast paced and allows for a lotttt of movement, just wanted to ask how do you get that color gradient on the hud ? It's looks fucking amazing
It’s a setting in the visuals. The green was hard on my eyes.
I really struggled with Doom Eternal to the point I'd give up, such a contrast to 2016 where I felt like I was the Doomslayer due to his shear power
Yeah, very fortunately eternal doesn't hand you the power fantasy on a silver plate
You feel way more powerful in eternal, as long as you use all the mechanics, since you need to play way more fast and aggressively, and I don't think it's that hard, ultra-violence is the perfect balance of being challenging at times but also being a power fantasy. I wonder what difficulty did you pick, nightmare is fun for replays.
thats the point. 2016 gave you that fantasy without asking much in return. Its a very forgiving game that leads new players into arena shooters where as Eternal expects you understand how these games work and makes you actually play the game to earn that fantasy
Oh yeah this vid is gonna do amazing brother I can already tell
Doom Eternal is never letting you play the way you want, choose the weapon you want. Yes that's a good analysis. On the other hand Doom 2016 gives you complete freedom gameplay wise. And yes this is frustrating. Gameplay wise i choose Doom 2016 over Doom Eternal for this reason alone.
Eternal is tailor made for Nightmare and Ultra Nightmare play, that’s where it absolutely shines. And I don’t blame anyone at all for playing on lower difficulties, Nightmare and Ultra Nightmare can fucking consume your entire gaming mind.
i came here from underthemayo and was sad to see the comments being so rough, i disagree with some points you made plenty of others have mentioned but it offered a new perspective i appreciate. Eternal turned me into way more of a doom fan than i would have if it never released, I have trouble coming back to 2016 now that I’ve sunk so many hours into eternal and got accustomed to the high octane pace
Friendly reminder if you love Doom Eternal, Shadow Warrior 3 is a must play.
I'm a bit confused why you say that eternal rips away player expression. most people play doom 2016 by running up to every demon with the super shotgun because that's all you had to do to win. Doom eternal is one of the most expressive shooters ever BECAUSE it makes you use every tool at your disposal. It forces you out of your comfort zone and makes you actually be Creative. if your idea of player expression is using a single gun for an entire fight and not think about it, then you can turn down the difficulty.
I think the rest of your criticisms are valid (even if i personally disagree) but that particular comment rubbed me the wrong way
Great video! I do prefer the tone and atmosphere of 2016, but man, Eternal's combat is insane.
I'm sure plenty have said it by now, but you're not actually forced to break weakpoints, it only feels that way at first when you're still getting comfortable with all the mechanics. I've done various challenge runs with my least preferred gun mods and even NO gun mods, and the game is still playable and beatable. Depending on mod choice, you can make your guns weakpoint breakers or raw damage dealers, meaning you can make any loadout work in this game, which is great for creativity and expression. And if you're good enough with your mobility, you can just straight up dodge Arachnotron and Mancubus fire. Ammo seems annoyingly low at first, but it teaches you to make your shots count and to figure out more efficient strategies.
On the Flame Belch and Blood Punch, at first they seem like too much, I won't lie. I actually didn't use them during my first playthrough haha. But once you get comfortable with the game, they're such a great source of depth. The Flame Belch isn't necessary for survival, but it helps you tank extra damage. I LOVE burning groups of fodder and taking them out with a single rocket, so satisfying. The Blood Punch is best used as a crowd-clearer for when you get cornered, but it also breaks weakpoints and falters even superheavies, so you can use it defensively or offensively.
The platforming isn't realistic no, but I've also come to find it really fun. You can bounce between walls as quickly as you can look and press jump, and even learn shortcuts to beat sections faster. I find it to be an extension of the game's speed and mobility. My favorite platforming levels are Super Gore Nest, Mars Core, and Urdak.
I'd actually advocate that DOOM Eternal pushes for more expression, as opposed to "yanking it away". The weapons aren't as locked to their roles as you make it seem. You can bust weak points with well landed rockets for example, you don't need to use the precision bolt or the ballista. Under The Mayo is a great person to look at regarding expression. Whenever I see his gameplay it's immediately apparent to me that it is him playing and not anyone else because of how much he can express himself through the way he uses weapons. That's just my 2 cents though
Sorry, just saw your pinned comment. Gonna keep this here though because I'm not afraid to look stupid aha. Great video btw!
I made the transition to PC around 2020 and as someone who considers both modern Doom games to be among my favorite FPS (Ultrakill is the GOAT), I have to say-these games with MKB and high framerate are absolute game changers. What became with Eternal in that many people's relatively early impressions led them to believe that the weak point system incentivized certain weapons and mods over others suddenly became obvious that there's much more efficient ways to off enemies than what you're initially led to believe. Frankly, it's a skill issue to think so. I see no reason on that point alone to hold 2016 over Eternal. You can like 2016 for many reasons, but feeling like you're coerced by the game to play a certain way with regards to optimal play inidicates that one should probably experiment more and work on creative solutions. Also, watching very good players can help see through this.
I'm probably just bad at the new doom games, but ultra violence is that perfect sweet spot for me to feel challenged and appreciate the combat.
Doom eternal is the ninja gaiden 2 of fps games.
I would watch this but I’m all of a sudden really good on Ultra Nightmare and need to keep playing. Will watch later.
contrary to most comments here, i prefer 2016 by a long shot. Just clicked with me more i guess
I think you have more in 2016. But the intensity of Eternal is crazy. I’m an Eternal guy. Just don’t like the ammo deal.
Hugo said the Dark Ages will be a different feel than 2016 or Eternal, and I’m fucking excited about it. However long it’s been, I’ve not grown tired of either game because no matter how much you play or how much you improve, they always leave you feeling that _you can be better._
While I was wrong in my assessment of player expression, Eternal still rules. It’s MY preferred game. And I’m very much looking forward to talking about Dark Ages. Doom, but fantasy. A match made in heaven. (Or Hell lol)
@ you’re not entirely wrong, there were a lot of people initially that didn’t fall in love with Eternal. But I think now, the majority of people (like myself) who would find your video randomly like I did are people who are and have been diehard fans since release.
It's like 2016 is more akin to Doom 64, darker and grittier, and Doom Eternal is more akin to Doom 1+2, more abstract and colorful.
i love both games and doom 3 but doom 64 is the best for me
DOOM 1&2 < DOOM 3 and 64.
some neat things some of the useless mods do like the micro missiles for example completely bypass the doom hunters shields. the full auto now drops ammo with kills but still only really useful in the dlc.
I personally feel dark ages is going to be far more divisive for more obvious reasons..
Yep.
see I'm actually a huge fan of eternal and the fast pace gameplay loop. Dark Ages looked to be a little slow for my liking but the added sliders hopefully will make it more on par with eternal
@UngliYT I personally can't help but feel like dark ages is going to be a disappointment
@@Eh2004Eyou must keep your expectations low and you will never be disappointed for DOOM: The Dark Ages for not being divisive.
I completed Doom 2016 in ultra nightmare...I completed Doom Eternal in easy mode. Because in higher difficulties i wasn't having fun. Yes, this is how hard Doom Eternal is. It is way harder than Doom 2016.
Doom 2016 feels like enjoying the game and its difficult.
Doom eternal feels like testing myself and trying to be better, trust me I play in console and it is really hard, specially the master levels
Some people had issues with the Glory kill animations mid games and said that it broke the flow of combat.
I had no issues with the Glory kill system since 2016 and up until Eternal cause it's a cheesy way to bale out of tough situations or when I made a mistake on harder levels, or sometimes I needed to catch a break to figure out what mistakes I did by simply watching our modern barbarian guy shredding demons into bits, idk but sometimes it was kind of a stress releaver lol.
Since Dark Age came out and they removed the Glory kill animation out of non-powerup gameplay I'd say they better include as many exclusive Execution animations on the Berserk powerup as possible and include more power ups on the higher levels and put it on a out of bound or a corner or somthing so that people have choices of either picking it up or not.
I love the glory kills. LOVE them. And I’m super curious about the new system.
@UngliYT Me too, like they featured a chainsaw shield which could parry and block enemies atks is kind of a souls like mechanic. I'm guessing the game mechanics on Dark Age may be traditional boots on the ground with a bit of souls like play style and dare I say it's more friendly towards new players, like you literally have two tools in one and it could BLOCK and PARRY atks, how easier could this be lol. But it's only a part of the gameplay, I hope that they would add more challenging things such as super duper insane master levels to make players suffer lol.
I really don't think spamming one gun for an entire game is anything close to "player expression". And since chainsaw is on a cool down, ammo is actually more plentiful in eternal. I have no idea how so many people have these same trash, or just false, things to say about eternal
There is nothing wrong with people not liking the game because they are bad at it. Just wish they would say that
Holy shit dude actually compared eternal to doom 3. You are actually insane
16:10 Just a observation, the auto-shotgun mod, once fully upgraded makes every enemy killed with it drop shotgun ammos, os kinda of a free kill but, you won’t spam it because you will be moving slower
Doom Eternal is the story of a game that asked the player base to "git gud" and then players reacting with either "Okay, I love playing new games and learning the systems of combat!" or "I dont want to be good, I want to walk around and kill demons mindlessly and now I will pretend the game has design flaws because I made no effort to understand the flow of combat"
I LOVE the combat. I wanted to show the perspective of people that didn’t like it and why that might be.
Conversely, the problem with people like you is that the answer to any and all criticism is "skill issue".
Gr8 vid-essay!🎉 keep it up!
Good video! I think you hit every nail on the head, it would have been cool if you talked about the DLCs especially TAG1 but that's ok. I obviously disagree with your bit on creative expression but no reason to harp on that considering you already made a reply.
It was a bad call on my part. I should’ve played more and did more research. As for the dlc, it’s a lot more of the same, so I wasn’t quite sure what to say. There are new things, but I really wanted to focus on the main campaign. I considered a follow up dlc video, but after getting some pretty insane hate comments that I flat out deleted, I think I’ll hold off on that. Other than my one, glaringly bad take, lol, I’m glad you liked the video ❤️
I just don't understand how people can use the argument that some games don't let you play your way and some do. There are consessions in every game, that's why we play them. You like a game because it has defined rules and you play within them. The difference is that some games are more focused, and that is amazing imo. In Eternal you still have variety within systems, but you need to be more creative and have better understanding of the game to use them optimaĺy. Of course some games are just more restrictive, but in the case of Doom Eternal it is just about your level of understanding of the game systems.
Here because of the Mayo man, he was right, good channel!
Too bad this video ain’t it, chief
@@UngliYT Nah, people need to accept there is a middle ground between the two camps. Eternal does have plenty of room for creativity but the number of tools suitable for each task is more limited, I think you have done a better job of expressing that than most have managed, even if it was a slightly clumsy way of going about it. Both games are great, I can respect iD for switching it up rather than just making more of what came before they are doing it again with Dark Ages (to similar reception it seems).
@@Tuberuser187 the point of my video critiquing was to try to put myself in the shoes of someone who didn’t like Eternal. I LOVE Eternal. I think that comes across in my video. But, hey. You live and you learn. I take full accountability and apologized to offended players. I’m glad you’re here. Now that my Doom videos are done. Dead Space 2023.
Hey bit curious since you seem new to UA-cam, you ever played games from the Remedy-verse like Alan Wake, Control, and the out of universe games like Max Payne and Quantum Break? Would love to see your thoughts on them goven the quality of this video.
Love them all.
Great video. You mentioned all the reasons why I prefer 2016 - it's just more my play- and artstile. I want to be in charge of how to play the game and not being dictated by the game. Still, I get why people love Eternal.
Doom Eternal was amazing 👏
True. Both Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal are iconic because of how amazing the heavy metal soundtrack really is for them both.
Claiming that Doom Eternal forces you to use certain weapons in big 2025 is crazy. It’s been 5 years I thought we already moved past this baseless claim. UnderTheMayo already made several rebuttals to this. There’s way more expression than what’s possible in Doom 2016 for instance, because the interactive elements have increased. It’s not about "the game forcing you to use precision bolt to break a weakpoint" it’s more like what can you use in your arsenal to falter enemies and destroy weakpoints. Sure some mechanics are pushed more than others but you’re not ever forced to use them. Ever heard of the fun zone?
Each weapon possesses overlaps. You can use several options to falter lock an enemy. I don’t know if you’ve been living under a rock this whole time but the culture around the game is palpable. The fans will sing praise of its genius design, whereas dissenters are people who the game hasn’t clicked for yet. People who dislike Eternal for its "lack of freedom" haven’t quite understood how the game works. It literally gives you more things to do than any other doom game, it just heavily encourages you to actually interact with those elements instead of spam SSG non stop.
The reason for this is, I believe, that 2016 brought a lot of casuals, so when Eternal comes out, those new fans couldn't get a grip on a game that actually requires skill.
That and 2016 fans tend to lie, A LOT!
My only criticism about Eternal is that it’s kinda slow at the start, though it does pick up a lot once you unlock the dash move.
Personally, I kinda like how the Marauder and Doom Hunter are both introduced as bosses. Because it allows the game to demonstrate how different they are from the rest of the enemies to new players and how to kill them.
I still remember my first encounter with both enemies, the cutscenes warming up the player with a kind of excitement you’d get when you pick up a comic book where the hero fights a brand new supervillain, and that sweet satisfaction and sense of accomplishment when you finally kill then for the first time.
Great vid man
Great vid bro! Eff the haters! Keep slayin!
We all agree that Eternal is more complex of a game than 2016. I think it's fair to like 2016 more casual flow more. However, if you are actually willing to spend your time and efforts on both games I think there's little debate to which one is best when it comes to pure gameplay.
As an example, as someone who tipically plays shooters until there's really nothing more to gain, I have probably around 2500 hours in Eternal and around 300 on 2016.
About the creativity discourse it's already been said: Eternal is a pretty creative game, definitely more than 2016 can possibly be in terms of sheer combinations of weapon, tools, movement and enemy variety. There are things I don't really like in the mix but man, there's just no comparison in my eye
Yep. I’m an eternal person. I tried to see it from both sides, but my assessment on player expression and combat is flat out WRONG.
@@UngliYT I think DE has been criminally underrated by the gaming community overall. Sure, people will say it's a good shooter. But most people, even people who do play a ton of videogames, have basically no idea how deep the rabbit hole goes with this game. It's unfortunate honestly, I think it deserved more than it eventually got
This video is one of the only ones ive seen thats fair to both sides of the debate, as i feel like most reviews shill whichever one they think is better. Also about the exploration, I feel like eternal has worse exploration since while the levels are bigger, theyre disguised hallways with one path, while on the other hand 2016s levels had a lot more backtracking which lead to more interesting secrets.
I'm here to give this video a like and some exposure.
Don't worry about all these feathers you ruffled.
I agree with pretty much every one of these criticisms, I think there's a little more freedom than people give the game credit for but it still has a very specific combat loop that it wants you to engage with. Which is not my favorite way to play Doom, but it's still a great system. The game is still a fantastic shooter.
But I don't really care for the art style compared to the others, It feels so goofy in cartoony in this one, I hate all the platforming in between combat segments. I find it to be just janky and annoying. I'm not complaining about all the new mobility you have, but I only enjoy that during combat.
And I still don't think the Marauder is a great enemy. It's not a skill issue, I've beat the game, I just don't find him fun to fight, in fact the only time I think they did him well was the DLCs
I also miss the vibe that 2016 had with putting gameplay over story. I think it was better when this stuff was relegated to just some lore in the background.
That being said I own two copies of this game I have run through the campaign multiple times along with both DLC chapters, and I've messed around with the master levels and horde mode, and just in general have gone back to play levels that I like
It's a fantastic game, There's just a lot that I don't care for that much about it which keeps it from being in my top favorites in the franchise
Doom 2016 is classic run and gun, mostly strafing. Doom Eternal is like a ballet. You have to constantly jump, fly in air etc. I love Doom 2016's gunplay more than Doom Eternal's. And Doom Eternal forces you to play in a certain way. It's called Doom Dance. If you don't do Doom Dance you can not play on a higher difficulty than the easy mode. If you just want to strafe and run and gun you have to play on easy. On higher difficulties you have to learn the doom dance. That i didn't like about the game. But Doom Eternal is a masterpiece nonetheless. Doom Eternal is one of the best fps games ever.
I feel the combat has too many buttons. You have 3 different melee weapons that do 3 different things, a grenade launcher that switches between 2 different types of grenades, and a punch that’s only useful when powered up.
Don’t get me wrong, I love Eternal, but it really should’ve toned down some of those options. Make one melee weapon that can work as both the blood punch and the chainsaw, and make the crucible more of a power up.
DOOM the Dark Ages seems to be doing just that, and I’m excited for it.
I liked it better than 2016. Marauders annoyed me until I got decent at them. 2 marauders at a time is still really hard for me though
at launch i thought 2016 was better, after playing more of eternal, I literally cannot go back to 2016
okay but doom eternal being hard and challenging it my favorite part about it, but i see why its might be frustrating because in the first play through didn't play for a week and when i came back to i got absolutely obliterated by demons and died way too much and had to grind and get good at it agian.
-English is not my first language, so spare me
Eternal was the sweet spot imo BUT it makes me excited for dark ages. Another hit will be really impressive. MAYBE Microsoft can let id make a halo spinoff
Tbh I always thought Eternal made made 2016 look generic, which is crazy because Doom 2016 is doom 2016
I prefer Eternal, but I completely understand people who prefer 2016. It took until the amcient gods part 1 for Eternal to click for me. It was a bizarre feeling, almost like my Ackerman sense awakened (from attack on titan) and I could suddenly use every weapon to my advantage rather than forgetting them half of the time.
Not saying I'm a god at the game, I play on hurt me plenty. I'm just saying that I struggled with the combat for the longest time until it clicked, then I was still challenged but thoroughly enjoying it.
5:55 the lore rocks, hard disagree
Hard dissagree good game but annoying as fuck story
If you want to play a game where you have to quick swap and jump like a addict or you're fucked play ultrakill
9:28 im gonna disagree with you on the lack of player expression being a frustrating aspect of eternal. I love that the devs have confidence in the combat loop they are leading players into playing and after 730 hours of just endlessly grinding the campaign and DLCs and master levels, i can confidently say they’ve nailed it and that these restrictions are an overall net positive to the gameplay. The combat is addictive and the flow state this game gives is unreal.
Yea I was wrong
i wont judge you if our opinion’s don’t line up and I dont think you’re wrong either because initially on my first playthrough i thought of how much more demanding the game was and also how some mods felt less useful than others therefore steered me away from using it entirely but after some replays and on harder difficulties something just clicked that made me want to try different approaches to the combat loop, some worked, some didnt.
Also don’t let the ultra negative comments discourage you on making the content you would be proud of. Loved your doom 2016 vid and this one as well despite our difference in opnion on one aspect of eternal.
Doom 2016 is like a beta of Eternal. I have a hard time replaying 2016 because Eternal is so much better. Also I turn off the HUD in every game. It used to be a preference to turn off the HUD, but HUDs keep getting worse year after year so now it's become essential.
I loved 2016, but Eternal kicked my ass. Since I only played the Mass Effect trilogy this year, I finally understand the Marauder Shields reference in Doom Eternal, so one day I'll get to see him there.
Id agree, I feel this game got even more divisive after the scumbag and Mick Gordon issues that happened over the music and ost
Doom eternal is a pc game at its core. For better or worse, the combat is more or less designed for keyboard and mouse. The console weapon scroll wheel slows down the player, unless youre actually skilled at the game. whereas on pc you can switch weapons almost instantly and fly across the map. I find it easier to keep up with enemies on pc.
I like all the modern era Doom games (3 included). They've all got their own flavor. My criticisms of Eternal are overused platform mechanics (they're not bad, just overused), and the expansions IMO were way too "busy." Like I'm on Ritalin and still can't focus on the number of mobs that pop up. My ADHD does not like the Ancient Gods at all. Also, not a deal breaker, but I don't like how weapon choice is determined by what demons are there. I like a little more freedom of choice.
Eternal is such a wonderful fucking game dude, i love it so much
Doom Eternal stans can't stand when someone doesn't enjoy it as much as they did. It was an ok game. In my opinion, 2016 was way superior in most ways. Eternal fans will be arguing with me and calling me a noob/casual for saying this, and say shit like their opinions are hard facts. It's always the same shit, they're so predictable.
I feel like the movement makes him feel like even more of a beast, with his bare hands he's digging into walls and climbing then like he's a monster
i hate when people bring this up like i dont want to argue with someone that isnt entering hugos fun zone and is just mindlessly shooting mobile turret in 2016
Brother I entered it lol. I was trying to show why people didn’t like it. They don’t like being urged in any way to use a specific weapon at all. They wanna use what they want, with no restrictions.
@@UngliYTyeah we saw you enter the fun zone with plasma rifle spam alright