I was taught Pretribulation Rapture in Bible College in early 80's, but after continuing to study, it was the first of a myriad of false teaching in the Apostate church. Thanks for your clear and true teaching of it. YES, Resurrection and Rapture is synonymous 👍
I love how you say, " This is just common sense ." I so much agree. Unfortunately, have you noticed how much common sense has been lost in the West?🤦♀️😥 And Yet, Maranatha!🕎✝️🐟🕊🙌🙏
WHEN we see the "Sign of the Son of Man in the heavens" it will THEN be imminent! ;) But all that "stuff" spoken of must first come to pass, as the scriptures say. Plainly. I wonder how dyed-in-the-wool Pre-Tribbers are taking this? For many it's going to be the seven stages of mourning or grief. The first being denial. Been there, but not on the rapture idea, but other false ideas taught to us since childhood.
@@thunderdove3764 Good point, however, the stages of grief will only take place if their eyes are opened. The more popular pre-tribbers on TV and UA-cam appear to be quite dug-in. I have not seen any of them change. In fact, Prophesy Watchers, an otherwise excellent source of teaching, is doubling down. They are actually lamenting the fact that the once dominant pre-trib view is being challenged and even fading. This is my concern: when things get really bad (persecutions) they will not be prepared to deal with it. A great shaking is coming: No doubt about it. 🙏
@@eswn1816 Yes, the shaking sure is coming. "Narrow and windy is the path"--part of me wishes the pre-Trib rapture were true. It's rough what's going on already, just in the pervasiveness and degeneracy of the evil. If my heart and my mind weren't being prepared for a few years already, specifically for the troubles, I don't know where I'd be. The Lord started whispering to me "Revelation" about 5 years back. I read the book again a few times, and still didn't know what was what. God actually led me to Joel's youtube channel, and then to the FAI studies in 2020. Some of my friends say "well if it's not pre-Trib, I'll be good either way." They think the Bible supports it perhaps, so now I'll have info to give them that's specific. I knew it didn't support pre-Trib, but some of their historic teachers like Ouest make a case. They use the "one will be taken and one left" example quite a bit, as in two women grinding at the mill, etc. We could say what the does the "taken" part mean? They think it means raptured. And the "Son of man comes like a thief in the night" is another building block. I'm sure these "proof texts" will be smashed as support for the doctrine of pre-Trib rapture the further along the study goes. Hang in there friend. We're in for a lot of turbulence! Praying for the body of Christ to be alert and awake, and listening to the voice of the Shepherd.
Great teaching Joel. You and Dalton have really encouraged me with your teaching. I used to believe in a pre-tribulation rapture until a few years ago. I started looking at some of these verses that you read and changed my beliefs. Soon after I came upon your teaching and was overjoyed because you guys helped me to understand so much more. Thank you and Maranatha...
@@cjohn316 There's no Bible Verses that show the bride of CHRIST in the thousand year reign of Jesus There's no Bible Verses that promise the thousand year reign of Jesus to the bride of CHRIST Daniel 12 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting Life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
When everyone is believing or doing a thing...my Spirit throws up a red flag! The path is narrow that leads to Jesus. Beware everyday of being deceived. Pray and confirm every doctrine and teaching. Do not believe unless the Holy Spirit has confirmed with scripture of 2 or 3 witnesses. Good teaching. Now be sober and vigilant. Discerning the times.
Amen, listen to Jesus only Revelation 20 4 seven descriptions Revelation 2 & 3 seven letters Jesus is Truth The church/bride rapture is a thousand years after the saints rapture John 6 40 Jesus says at the Last day Revelation 20 shows both Resurrections
Amen. I have yet to find a church that teaches post trib. A good 25 years ago just reading Matthew 24, I questioned what we are being taught. It is so clear what Jesus says. The wrath is not the 7 year tribulation. He did not appoint us to wrath, but unto salvation. I agree that this is a major deception. Jesus said. Take heed that no one deceives you. I believe the Holy Spirit guided me to truth. I never learned that from anyone, just reading and studying. I believe more will fall away when we are not ruptured out if here.
Same for me with Matthew 24, it's so clear that Christians will be persecuted through the tribulation, but our hope is the Day of the Lord when Jesus returns. The spirit grabbed me over Matthew 24 with Jesus's warning over deception. The pre-trib rapture idea in my view is leaving people unprepared for when the real trouble begins, and it's designed by the enemy to weaken the body of Christ
The pastor at our church recently spoke against the concept of a secret rapture and stated Jesus's 2nd coming is one event. I came to faith shortly after trying this church and they are full each week, with a successful church plant nearby 2 years ago. For anyone in search of faithful bible teaching please check out Armagh Baptist Church, they still record live each week.
Strong delusion All doctrines here in Mystery Babylon added the church/bride to the thousand year reign of Jesus SORRY but the church/bride doesn't get to hijack the saints reward The church/bride rapture is a thousand years after the saints rapture John 6 40 Jesus says at the Last day Revelation 20 shows both Resurrections
Yes. The pre-trib doctrine is something I once strongly believed in, but it was in ignorance. This doctrine is definitely a lie. It is not biblical. May the Holy Spirit help us to expose this doctrine, so the church will no longer teach this false message. May it be rejected just like any other false doctrine.
@@markusandrew777 Well some believers are just as I once was. I simply believed this doctrine because that is what I was taught when I converted to Christ. It wasn't because I had "itching ears". It was just pure spiritual immaturity and ignorance on my part. But once I actually began to read the scriptures for myself, I discovered this doctrine was indeed false. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3 was the scripture that initially opened my eyes. I was taught we would not be here when the antichrist was revealed. But this scripture contradicted that teaching.
@@markusandrew777 I know the truth for many years and I preached it.But I always believed, the Rapture is not an issue of salvation. But it seems to be a salvation issue. Not, that I must believe in the right Rapture view, to be saved. We get saved by faith in the LORD and Savior Yeshua the Christ, there is nothing to add. But after salvation we have to walk in the Spirit in the light and that is the truth. If someone loves the darkness and makes a lie, he will be as the murderers and outside of the New Jerusalem (Rev 22:15). Most Pre-trib believers believe in Once saved always saved, they follow blind their "teachers", they are twofold deceived. Yeshua and Paul warned us about a false believe in the coming of the Lord, contrary what Yeshua and Paul taught. The Lord comes after the 3 1/2 year Trib (Mat 24:29-31; 2.Thess 2:1-3). Lets pray, that the Pre-trib teachers get the fear of the Lord and that they come to the truth.
@@markusandrew777 I believed in OSAS, I was a backslider after I was saved. I did not repent, the Lord had to warn me 3 times, till I repented. The first warning, I went to hell, the Lord rescued me, but I thought He showed me hell. The second warning was the coming of the Lord in the air, He looked at me and shook His head. I would not be in the Rapture. But still I did not know what was wrong, they taught me, all our sins are forgiven, past, present and future. The third warning the Lord got specific, that I was the same as King David, a dead man. I repented as 1.Jn 1:9 says, to be cleansed.
That's not the problem... they have been deceived by the false prophets! 2nd thessalonians 2nd chapter says if you believe the lie God will send you a strong delusion so you can be judged or damned! The subject of the letter is the coming of the lord and our gathering together unto him!
So I'm listening on my loudspeaker and I'm trying to flour some steak for frying and " riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight NOW!! " I jumped out of my skin about 3ft and flour went everywhere. Did I miss it guys ??? .. imagine 😆😁. Just thought I'd share... thanks for that Joel. Again another great study and teaching. You guys are awesome vehicles for The purposes of God. Bless you guys
The Bible also teaches urgency because none of us are guaranteed one second more in this flesh body. So we are to live each day full of faith in Jesus Christ regardless of the timing of the Rapture. This is very rational also. Don't forget that any of us could breathe our last breath in this flesh body by any sorts of circumstances at any time. I try to live my life ready at any moment simply because of the world we live in today. Whether I live long enough to see and live in the Tribulation is still an unknown, but I will strive toward this end knowing my salvation has already been paid for by Jesus Christ.
Great teaching ,I always felt in my heart that there is more ,I felt that we are going to be here and n tribulation .thanks God bless this teaching and the fai. Family 🙏🙏🙏🙏
According to statistics, the amount of professing Christians that place their faith in the pre tribulation rapture is more than double than those who believe Gods Word that the catching up is on The Day of The LORD. Really shows you how narrow the gate is.
@@meredithgoodwin2930 You said that, not I. I said statistics show how many professing Christians have chose to place their faith in a lie. God is the judge! Serving Christ, you can't pick and choose what you want to accept as truth and disregard the rest.
Many will argue that the pre-trib rapture doctrine is useful from a pastoral point of view, because of the sense of imminency that makes people feel like that have to be ready to meet the Lord at any moment. But as Joel said in the end, we could DIE at ANY MOMENT, that is the real imminency! No need to preach a pre-trib rapture for that...
John 11:23-24 23 Jesus said to her, “Your brother will rise again.” 24 Martha said to Him, “I know that he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.” 1 Thessalonians 4:15 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. If Martha believed rightfully when the resurrection of the dead would occur, it should be obvious that immanency (context of rapture) in the early church was not taught to the disciples.
That's the verse that woke me up to the rapture lie. I decided to read the entire new testament with no preconceived notions. I would just read it all the way through and highlight every passage talking about the end times. I then summarized each passage and put it in a word doc. It was then I realized the rapture and the resurrection at the second coming is the same thing.
@@Strongtower Without a doubt. Right now I struggle in finding a local church that actually holds these biblical truths, but it seems like there aren't many, if any. There are good assemblies here that hold important the main Gospel message and the rest of scripture, but on this topic, man, they seem so far off base. I cannot understand how so many gifted pastors miss this whole rapture topic.
@@Strongtower By the way, I have a spare bible that I think I will use for the same reason you stated. go through and highlight all the end times passages. Good idea. My bible that I use daily is written up and underlined all through with most every topic. I think 1 John is almost completely underlined...lol.
@@discipledougnews1079 lol love to hear that about your underlining in 1 John. I could think of 2 things that might help you. Start a home bible study or just continue attending your current church. We need fellowship with other believers, you may have to sacrifice listing to pretrib stuff once in a while to be able to attend a church. My church did a series on end times a while ago and the pastor shared the varies end times positions. He shared the pros and cons of each and didn't push a particular position. Are there maybe any churches like that near you? Also about your comment about gifted pastors believing in pretrib. I have thought about that for a while and at the end of the day, all these pastors are just men. They are fallible just like me and you. We all have grown up in our culture and traditions. These traditions shape the way we see the world including reading the Bible. These pastors are shaped by their traditions and preconceived notions like we are. Each of us must realize that we have grown up in a tradition and to test that tradition using Scripture to see if it holds up.
Scripture says many signs will need 2b fulfilled b/4 Messiah's imminent return. Sadly, many teachers propose (erroneously) the Rapture can happen at any moment. Riiiiiiiight NOW! Zoom!⚡🌪️There's a saying that goes that when something is repeated long / often enough, people will begin to believe it! We all need to be cognizant to this phenomenon...
Amen ■ they collect their salaries at the obedience of the State; damning the souls that they prey; yet if truth were to be embraced then planning, prepping, and serious decisions would equip to finish the race to the end faithfully. After that cut, up to Revelation 21, I now focus if I am to be participating in the Millennium can I stand that much time being a servant under a 'rod of iron'? Because, Lucifer will be loosen and the nations gather to rebel against Jesus, the saints, and the city. It is my desire to continue with the Father, and one must be faithful in order to live with him here, in the New Jerusalem, Revelation 22.
The Great Comission is ultimately fulfilled by the angel mentioned in Revelation 14:6-7 6) Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth-to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people- 7) saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”
@@roberthoward3299 Dispensationalists ignore/downplay most of what Christ and the other apostles teach. Since virtually ALL Free Gracers are Dispensators, they 'only' have to twist Paul's teachings to support their OSAS balderdash.
Consider this: There is a difference between OSAS and "eternal security." Nothing can take away or rob my being in Christ. However, how was I saved? ... by faith, belief and trust in God. That was my choice. If I choose to depart from the faith (thus the great falling away as how can you fall away if you weren't first there?) Both pre-trib may have the same effect of causing believers to become complacent instead of disciples. Didn't Peter tell us to "grow in grace?" 2 Peter 3: 18
Great teaching as always however do you really have to keep interrupting the lessons for self promoting advertisements. Why oh why can’t you put them as the intro to your lesson. “The Hi sorry for interrupting…., are you really sorry? If you were you wouldn’t. Truthfully it disrupts the flow of the message. Trust in God not in you tube to meet your needs. Thank you for everything else and be blessed.
John 14 clearly states he comes to take us home, so that is pre trib to me. However if not then we have to prepare for hard times, even death. Live a pure life of obedience and it does not matter of pre or post. It only causes division in the body.
Jesus said at the Last day over and over and over again in John 6 The church/bride rapture is a thousand years after the saints rapture John 6 40 Jesus says at the Last day Revelation 20 shows both Resurrections. Daniel 12 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting Life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
I still have many questions and will continue to study as we all “see in part & know in part”… we must be prepared to suffer for our faith in Christ as many have in the past, present & will until Jesus returns to rule and reign. I would be more respectful of Dr. Missler’s teachings as he ALWAYS was respectful of other viewpoints… this subject is not as “duh stupid” as Dalton and you seem to think. Forgive me if I’m mistaken ❤
But in those days, after that tribulation...then they will see the SON OF MAN COMING IN CLOUDS...And then He will send forth the angels, and will gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest end of earth to the farthest end of heaven. Mark 13:24-27
So are you saying that those who believe in the "doctrine of imminency" is one and the same with those believe in the "pre~tribulation rapture??" Please correct me if I am wrong, thanks!!
I wonder about the caught up ■ my family can arrive in my drive, and I get caught up in the moment and join them and am changed while still in my home. However, this fulfilled promise is welcomed, the new body is our hope and God's promise.
By the way, I never found the "Rapture" any where in God's "moedim" . I do understand that where he is I will be. When the trumpet sounds I will be ready for his next instruction.
Moedim as in appointed/Feast ■ no one knows the day or hour is a Jewish idiom that is practice on identifying the new crescent moon by two witnesses for the Feast of Trumpets.
I believe Matthew 24: 23-25 refers to the lost deceived elect who fall away and take the mark of the beast because they were deceived by the pre tribulation rapture and the false ‘jesus’
Agree ■ Amen! I believe it is the falling away. Because there is no turning around from permanent abomination, then there is only left judgement. No repentance for receiving the mark, worship of the beast, and the system involved.
@@margiechism Thank you Margie. You are MOST right, once you take the mark - it is all over. Also taking the mark is pure blasphemy against Gods Holy Spirit. I believe the deceived elect as Christ warns of in Matthew 24: 23-25 are directly related to and the same as Paul writes in 2 Thessalonian 2: 1-3 The deceived elect will fall away and into apostasy all because of the false pre tribulation rapture escape. That was and is Satan's plan when he conceived the deception in the first place.
Dr. Alan Kurschner, a pre-wrath Greek scholar argues against pre-tribulationist position using 2 Thessalonians 2:3 stating that the use of the words "unless" = [ean me in Greek] is a noun not a verb [thus not denoting physical departure] and "first" = [proton in Greek] is an adverb describing the sequence of events. These 2 words are also used to describe the exact same message in John 7:51 and Mark 3:27.
I enjoy Dr. Kurschner's teachings on eschatology and Koine Greek construction. I would like to make one small change to your comment. He was not talking about the word "unless" (ean mé--conjunctive participle) being a noun. Apostasy is the noun and was always used to designate a non-spatial departure instead of a physical rapture.
the gathering of the Jews back to their own land has to happen first Ezekiel 36:24 :) and it happened in 1948. Then the Jews will be sorrounded by her enemies.
The book of Daniel is all about what will happen at the end of the age. Only in chapter 12 will you find a resurrection and only after the king of the north sets himself up in the beautiful land. There is not two resurrections.
Revelation 20 details Daniel 12 ■ the First Resurrection and the Millennium, then the White throne Judgement is the Second Resurrection for those not found in the Book of Life, the Lambs Book; Second Death is the lake of fire. Revelation 19 through chapter 20 is a quick read, and expains Daniel. Like when God told Adam and Even that they would die, overtime much happened for their bodies before burial, yet they were changed once they sinned; meaning they did not drop dead the moment they sinned.
This is when God told me the Raptures gonna happen.. The Bible is his word.. 2 Thessalonians 2: 1-4 (KJV) 1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; 4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
@@meredithgoodwin2930 if he who restrains is the church or even the Holy spirit with them scripture contradicts itself in the span of less than 10 verses. Scripture does not contradict itself, therefore your interpretation is incorrect.
I am beginning to think that the nearness of the Lords return needs to be considered in light of what Peter said that with the Lord 1000 years are as a day and a day as 1000 years. Our perception of time is different from the Lords. Peter brought his perception of time into alignment with the Lords. We can do the same. I remember when I was young summer break seemed to last forever, now at the age of 47 a summer comes and goes like a weekend. My perception of time has already changed. It’s not hard to conceptualize a God oriented perception of time on an everlasting scale and better understand what I think Peter saw regarding the nearness of the Lords return.
Hi Joel, I agree with much of what you say here, but just a thought...what if the the end of Matthew 23 ( 39For I tell you, you will not see me again, until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’”) all the way through Matthew 24 and 25 as well as Luke 21 is telling the singular story of Israel's salvation (both the rescue of the remnant from their enemies (the Beast empire (Islamic in nature)) AND their true repentance and changed heart. They will finally give their full allegiance to their God, and Creator...Jesus, who is the/their Messiah. I'm not convinced that our resurrection/catching up is what Jesus is talking about in this section of scripture. I actually think that He is referring to Isaiah 66:18-20: 18“For I know their works and their thoughts, and the time is coming to gather all nations and tongues. And they shall come and shall see my glory, 19and I will set a sign among them. And from them I will send survivors to the nations, to Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, who draw the bow, to Tubal and Javan, to the coastlands far away, that have not heard my fame or seen my glory. And they shall declare my glory among the nations. 20And they shall bring all your brothers from all the nations as an offering to the Lord, on horses and in chariots and in litters and on mules and on dromedaries, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, says the Lord, just as the Israelites bring their grain offering in a clean vessel to the house of the Lord. 21And some of them also I will take for priests and for Levites, says the Lord. Matthew 24:29 starts off with "Day of the Lord" language. The language that comes after in verse 30... the "sign" also mentioned in Isaiah 66:19 is the pillar of smoke/fire that is also mentioned in Isaiah 4:5-6. It is the same pillar that led Israel in the past and according to Isaiah 4:5-6 it is once again in the land protecting God's people after He has cleansed them with a new heart when finally they say "Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord" (Matthew 23:39) and mourn over whom they have pierced (Zech 12:10). I believe that the survivors mentioned in Isaiah 66:19 are survivors from the last battle (Armageddon) and are from the 10 nations that form the beast militia. Jesus at His 2nd coming has gone throughout the region in a series of battles with the last battle finally destroying all of the Beast armies except for these few survivors that He sends back as messengers (angels) to their homelands (where they have taken out a portion of Jews) to tell their people "let My people go" (just like Moses was sent to Pharaoh). The nations bring them back to Jerusalem and at that time the nations are judged as sheep or goats (Matthew 25:31-46) based on how they treated the least of His people. Verse 31 states "gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other" which leads us to what is recorded in both Deut 30:4-8, and Zech 2:6-13. This language of the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other is a description of God not only sending His people out of the land but also and more importantly bringing His people back into the land that He gave their fathers AND He gives them a new heart so that they will love God. Duet 30:4-8 is referring to the same time period that Jesus is referring to in Matthew 24 and according to Zech 2 He will dwell in their midst...which again will be this same time period. ***Here is a breakdown of the language used in Matthew 24:29-31 that is actually used and explained in the following Old Testament scriptures: * Tribulation of those days: * Sun, moon, cosmos: (Joel 2 + 3 + others re: Day of the Lord) * Powers of the Heavens: (Eph 6:12)12For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places. Col 1:16For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-all things were created through him and for him. * Sign of the Son of Man: The pillar of smoke and fire as in the OT.. (see Isaiah 66:19, Isaiah 4;1-6) * All tribes of earth will mourn: (Habakkuk 3:3-7, Rev 6:12-17) * Son of Man on the clouds of heaven: (see Daniel 7:13-14) * Send out His Angels: (Angels=messengers) (see Isaiah 66:19,20) * Loud Trumpet: (Joel 2:1-11) * Gather His elect: (Isaiah 66:19-20, Deut 30:4-8, Zech 2:6-13) * Four winds of heaven: (see Deut 30:4-8, Zech 2:6-13)
I Cannot think of anything God didn't complete. I don't believe he would put prophecy or some prophecy in a spot with the intention of it may or may not get fulfilled. Thinking of a pre tribulation rapture to me sounds almost Calvinistic. When Christ said he was waiting on the fullness of the gentiles, I don't believe that that would mean that the rapture could be imminent because The 2 thoughts do not coincide. I do believe that God Knows everything that can happen will happen in this happening. And I also believe he gave us free will.
#1 Yes, Jesus said the "end" will not occur until the gospel is preached everywhere. The pre-trib rapture (Luke 17:22-37) is not the "end". The "end" is the second coming (1 Thes 4:13-17). #2 The first clue the church was going to be on the earth for awhile. #3 Another clue the church was going to be on the earth for awhile. #4 Israel could not have been founded after the pre-trib rapture? I don't understand how that disproves a pre-trib rapture. Couldn't Daniel's 9:27 treaty be about the founding of Israel? #5 Yes, after Jerusalem was taken and destroyed, the church was in for the long haul. How does that disprove a pre-trib rapture? #6 The church is taken out so that the AC and devil can start his total rule on earth. I think it is good to have an attitude that believes Jesus could come for us at any moment (Matt 24:45-51).
So we don't need the two witnesses? We don't need the wars after the rumors of wars? Damascus does not need to cease to exist ? Jesus only said my father is the only who knows the moment. We are to use all our moments serving and spreading his word of salvation.
If the beast ■ turns out to actually be a mystery wo-men; then the two witnesses may not be what we plan either, but diffenently the two will drive the wicked mad, and these two will die and resurrect. If they resurrect on the day of the Lord, then that would indicate closer to the day, and the hour according to the sundown.
Let me show you Mathew 24 verse 14. In Daniel chapter 12 and look at them side by side. 14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come. The Great Tribulation 15“Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand),it comes after the time times and a half which is the preaching in Mathew 24 14 Daniel 12 4“But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book until the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.” 5, “How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?” 7Then I heard the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand to heaven, and swore by Him who lives forever, that it shall be for a time, times, and half a time; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished. Daniel 12 11“And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away,[ that is the time times and a half Matthew 24 14] and the abomination of desolation is set up, [ Mathew 24 15. We need to understand ]there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days. 12Blessed is he who waits, and comes to the one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days. Jesus comes on day 1335 to resurrect and rapture. So the great tribulation is only 45 day's long, then the Resurrection and rapture
It is true, I can see the LORD at any time, I could die in 5 seconds after typing, this, or 30 years, ONE day it will happen . . BUT not HIS Second Coming. . LOL ;)
If you have not received the mark, not worshipped the beast, and not been part of the system ■ I believe you can repent and be forgiven, but anyone that took the abomination cannot because it is not reversible where it can be repented/to turn from. Revelation has the details; I believe this is the 'falling away'.
does it means that if we are suffering rightnow for any reason and are able to avoid it for example Moving to another place to have some peace we should not do it??and allow the birth pain to continue? or is more like a massive suffering for the whole world as we had with the Pandemia ??? but getting worse and worse ??? can you clarufy next time ??
Thank you so much Joel for speaking truth boldly. This is something that has weighed heavy on my heart for some time now. I feel an urgency to warn the church before we enter the time Jesus spoke of in Matt 24. I feel dejected and beat down, by believers, who will not listen to sound doctrine. Even with scriptures such as 2 Thes 2 they refuse to hear or even see the plain text telling them that Paul will not be gathered until the man of lawlessness is revealed. We live in Laodicea and it's miserable. For every believer who understands the truth there are countless others who scoff. I wish I had a time machine so I could go back and duct tape Darbys mouth closed. Thanks again for sticking your neck out there. God bless you
I have a question in ch 7 of rev it states that there is a bunch of people b4 Gods throne , then after that it gets into the bowls and a lot of terrible stuff is that just because rev is not written in order?
In John's time, there were no chapters in manuscripts. Yes, Revelation is written in chronological order, with PARENTHETICAL SECTIONS inserted and are used for detailed reference and explanation of the main topic. For example, at the end of chapter 11, the 7th angel blew the 7th trumpet. Then, chapter 12 starts giving us information on the woman and the dragon. Rev 12:1 to 15:4 are parenthetical. At Rev 15:5, John continues on with the events of God's Wrath.
The people before the throne are 'those whom have come out of the tribulation'. To come out of something you first have to be in it! Matthew 24 clearly states Christians will be imprisoned and some even killed in regards to the end the age and his second coming. It makes sense those crying to God for their blood to be avenged are those killed during the tribulation.
The book isn't written in strict chronological order. We often see events first in a big picture scene, then we see it again in more detail. For example, Revelation chapter 6 is an outline of the Great Tribulation and God's wrath (the bowls); the remainder of Revelation fills in the details for us.
@@koalabear19 I believe that as well but after ch7 , we see bowls being poured out and the 2 witnesses but yet in ch7 saints coming out of tribulation are already before God
Lots of pre trib rapture preachers believe all prophecy has to be completed before the rapture. So your example is using a small majority of some beliefs to lump everyone into that thought process.
??? If lots of pre trib rapture preachers believe all prophesied events have to be completed before the rapture, would that not negate a pre trib rapture?
You are mixed up between pre tribulation rapture and pre wrath catching up. ALL and ALL pre tribulation rapture teachers state ‘Nothing needs to be fulfilled for ‘jesus’ to return and rapture’
Most Pre Trib Teachers I know say Loudly that the Coming of Jesus can happen at any second and that there is nothing else that needs to be fulfilled! They all say that Jesus could come at any hour as though His Coming is Imminent!
Name another prophecy that needs to be fulfilled? Israel becoming a nation again was the last prophecy that need to happen. And why all preachers (any rapture or non rapture belief) are talking the end days could be on us...because nothing else needs to be completed for the tribulation to start. So everyone is discussing that the end days can happen anytime now and the start of the tribulation could happen....as in the video says "right now"
I understand that every believer has to be ready to stand before the Lord at any moment, because we can die suddenly and that would be our Rapture, most believers in the last 2000 years have died in the Lord to be raptured in His parousia. The coming of the Lord is an appointed time and controlled by Father God only at the end of this world after the Great tribulation, as Yeshua said in Mat 24:29. Paul affirms with 2. Thess 2:1-3 and 1.Tess 5:1 the teaching of Yeshua, that the Rapture, the Day of the Lord is not at hand, but first comes the apostasy or rebellion (Greek protos=always first) AND the revealing of the Antichrist has to happen, before the Lord can come with the First Resurrection/Rapture 1000 years before the end of the Millennium. The Timing is fixed by God and no man can change it, not Pre- Mid-Trib or PreWrath. The bible is Post-trib, if someone likes it or not, it is a fact and preachers should acknowledge this fact and stop preaching contrary to the bible, or they will face one day God's judgment. Daniel gives us also the timing of the last days. The Great Tribulation is the persecution of the Saints, which is 3 1/2 years and NOT 7 years (Dan 12:7 and 7:25). The first 3 1/2 years the AC comes with peace and will destroy many (Dan 8:23-25). The last 3 1/2 years he persecutes the Saints, he demands to be worshiped as God. Dan 11:35 +36 tells us that it is for an appointed time, all will be done as it is appointed and all things will be finished with the end of the GT. That is the time frame according to Daniel and revelation agrees with it, but most Rapture views have made their own timing in revelation, first the seals, then the trumpets and last the bowels, that is not scriptural. The first 6 seals are the same as the Olivet Discourse. Rev 6:17 is the last day of this age (Strong's), Christ begins to reign on earth=Millennium. Rev 11:15-18 and 16:15-20 are the same event , His 2. coming with more details. Revelation is not written in sequence.
2THESS 2:1. Now we beseech you, brethren , by the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ ( before Jesus Christ comes in the clouds of glory, His coming in His saints it's called the epiphanie a corporate body of the man - child ministry, the 2 witnesses to minister to the church in the tribulation Rev 12:5,6; 2Thess 1:10, Hos 6:1-3; psalm 149:5-9; Isa 60:1,2; Acts 2:16-21; Rev 10:9-11; to preach the everlasting gospel to all creation ), and by our gathering together unto Him ( we gather unto Jesus Christ not religion nor denominations or man ) 2. That ye be not soon shaken in mind ( that's your soul area ), or be troubled, neither by spirit (wrong revelation, doctrines of demons , religious spirits , anti-christ spirit 1Jn 4:1-6; 2Jn verse 7; 2Pet 2:1-3; 1Tim 4:1 ), nor by word ( what's being preached, or taught, Lk 8:15. Jesus told His disciples to be careful with the leaven of the pharisees those are the preacher's of today, and to be careful with the leaven of herod that's your government ), nor by letter ( books, magazine's ,tracks ), as from us, as that the day of the Lord is at hand. 3. Let no man ( preacher, pastor, teacher, false prophet ) deceive ( beguile, trick you, tickle your ear ) by any means: for that day shall not come ( the coming of the Lord ), Except there come a falling away first ( Apostasy defecting from the truth, a great rebellion. 1Tim4:1; 2Tim3:1-5; 2Pet 2:3; Jude 18; Jn 6:66=666) , and the man of sin ( inside of each of us is the man of sin it's called the old man ) be revealed the son of perdition ( Judas iscariot was called the son of perdition by Jesus in Jn 17:12; Jn 13:26,27 SOP means son of perdition or destruction ). 4.Who opposeth and exalteth himself ( we must not exalt Self, the old man, the carnal man, the earthly man, the devilish man, the beastly nature of man, psalms 73:22 King David said , So foolish was I, and ignorant: I was as a beast before thee. We must deny Self, Matt 10:38,39; and die to Self the old man has to be crucified, the book of Roman's is the 6th book in the NT, chapter 6, and verse 6=666, the old man has to be crucified, so the born again, spiritual man, born from above. Christ in you the hope of glory rules your temple) above all that is called God, or is worshipped ( man likes to be worshipped, Self likes to be worshipped, false prophets, pastors, teachers, false apostles, Christian artists, even people in the secular world etc. Just like Lucifer Isa 14:13,14; Ezek 28:1-9; 2Tim 3:1-5; 2Cor 11-1-15 ); so he as God sitteth( look where he sitteth )in the temple of God ( we are the temple of God, God does not dwell in temples made with human hands, our spiritual man is the Holy of holies, the soul is the Holy place, the body is the outer court, Acts 17:24,25; 1Cor 3:16,17; ), shewing himself ( there's that word Self ) that he is God.5. Remember ye not, that when I was yet with you, I told you these things ( the apostle Paul always warned the church of Christ Jesus ) ? 6. And now ye know what withholdeth ( restraineth means to hold back ) that he ( the son of perdition ) might be revealed in his time ( let's go back to verse 3 and will see when the son of perdition will be revealed at the falling away first ).7. For the mystery of iniquity ( lawlessness ) doth already work ( it was already working in Paul's day ): only he ( the Holy Ghost ) who now letteth will let, until he ( the son of perdition ) be taken out of the way, or come out of the midst ( it's a corporate body of son of perdition in the temple of Christ spiritualy speaking, just as Judas iscariot was, the disciples didn't have a clue it was Judas iscariot until he betrayed Jesus Christ with a kiss, when he dip the Sop into the dish satan entered him, and history is going to repeat itself again, the sons of perdition are going to betray the brothers to death. Matt 24:9,10 ) 8. And then shall that Wicked be revealed ( in the NT, they are corporate bodies, Jesus has His body and that's the true church in means called out one's out of religious babylonian churches . Satan also has a body and it's all the children of disobedience among the people of God, the tares, and the goat's, they have a anti christ spirit ). Whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of His mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of His coming.9. Even him ( it's a corporate body of false prophets, Jesus said many false prophets not prophet but many would come in His name. Many serve a different Jesus and a different gospel) whose coming is after the working of Satan ( that's his body the sons of perdition 2Cor 11:4,13-15; Gal 1:6-9 )with all power and signs (all kinds of deceptions, and counterfeit,) and lying wonders.( Jesus saidm if it were possible the elect could be deceived )10. And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness( 1Jn 2:15-29; James 4:4 )in them ( the apostate people of God )that perish; because they received not the love of the Truth, ( the real true Gospel , they were spiritually blind to truth Isa 66:4), that they might be saved.11. And for this cause God shall send them a strong delusion, ( listen now ) that they should believe a lie ( such as a pre- rapture ) : That they all might damned who believe not the Truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness." My brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus our Lord said He would send the comforter the Holy Ghost and He would be with us and in us, and lead us into all truth. If you have the love of the truth you will not be deceived by the false prophets, and many doctrines of religion and denominations out there. CHRIST IS NOT DIVIDED INTO RELIGION OR DENOMINATIONS. Those are babylonian churches. The Mother Harlot has many daughters, and she and her daughters persecuted Jesus and the apostles and handed them over to be Roman beast of that time. Rev 17:56; Rev 18:24, Matt 23; and history repeats itself again, it's going to happen to the church the body of Christ in the tribulation, if the church believes it or not. You ain't going to fly away, or be raptured up unless you die before the tribulation. The church of Christ Jesus will prevail and come out victoriously and give her life for the Master and Saviour Jesus Christ our Lord. Rev 6:9-11; Rev 13:7; Rev 12:11; and Rev 15:2; Rev 20:4,6l
Thanks for your sound teaching, Joel! Here's an 11 year old video that's still relevant: ua-cam.com/video/4pTHgpXsQRM/v-deo.html (Imminence - Doctrine or Deception?)
A pretrib rapture is not imminent or possible. Not one of the popular “rapture” passages reveal whether it is pretrib or post trib (John 14:1-3, 1 Cor. 15:51,52, 1 Thes. 4:15-17, 2 Thes. 2:1). But there are two passages that are strong support for the rapture/second coming as one event: “Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you, and to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels in flaming fire.” (2 Thes. 1:6,7) This is clearly the Lord’s second coming. But why would the saints be given “rest” at that time? Weren’t they raptured seven years earlier? Wouldn’t that be the time to give it? Why would they need it at the second coming? And if it is given at the second coming then the church will obviously go through the tribulation. All these things point to the rapture and second coming as one event. If “rest” is the rapture, it has to be post trib. Pre trib theology claims these saints get saved after the rapture in the tribulation. So they call them “tribulation saints.” But scripture makes no distinction between saints. Either you are a saint or aint. Paul is clearly teaching the rapture and second coming are one event which will be imminent after the tribulation (Matt. 24:29-31, Luke 21:25-28).
God won't make us ever face a "Salvation on the line" test! We are saved and sealed until the Day of Redemption, which is the Pre-Tribulation Rapture! The Rapture is only for those who simply believe Jesus died for their sins and rose again. Matthew 24, Jesus was alive on the Earth teaching the Jews about the coming Kingdom where he rules as KING of Kings and LORD of Lords. Jesus wasn't addressing the blood bought Body of Christ Church in Matthew 24.
The Rapture is ESCAPE then Judgment as Days of Noah and Days of Lot. Plus God doesn't punish the righteous with the wicked. That would make the righteous equal with the wiked ^^^ Genesis 18:25 KJV That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?
Revelation 3:9 “Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Iewes, and are not, but doe lie: behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feete, and to know that I haue loued thee.” Colossians 3:11 “Where there is neither Greeke, nor Iew, circumcision, nor vncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond, nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.” You people love this avatar with prince Harry biting a gold medal that says I AM he is your best friend (two peas in a pod)
The pre-trib rapture makes the Last Week of Daniel an indeterminable time and not 7 years... Could you imagine if the rapture occured more than 7 years ago? They'd be suspended in the air... Think about it🤔
John 21:20 Then Peter, turning about, seeth the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? 21 Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do? 22 Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. 23 Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? 24 This is the disciple which testifieth of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his testimony is true.
Imminence was dismissed by Paul, Titus and Timothy in 2 Thessalonians 2 with the sequence of events must occur and also by Jesus in Matthew 24 when he said the ‘sign of the son of man’ must appear. The first testimony is a kingdom sequence including the rise of the Antichrist for 3.5 times (1,278 years in Daniel 7). The second is an astronomical sequence of the zodiacal ages and is usually described as the precession of the equinoxes. In the 1st century the sign of Jonah was rising (the fish / Pisces) and the next sign to rise is the sign of the son of man (the water carrier / Aquarius). This sign does not have to fully rise in the east but begin to appear and that is now. Daniel concurs, his 1,335th day from the abomination of desolation of the Temple Mount by Antichrist Islam begins in 2024. This was given by the Lord in 2011-2018 and is described in ‘Seven Times: Egypt to Istanbul’ published by Scope ‘n Compass.
As always, Joel splits the uprigths. Correct - Rapture WILL BE imminent. Incorrect - Rapture IS imminent The Greek for “near” in Luke 21:28 is “engizo” (#1448) and means, “to bring near, to join one thing to another, to draw or come near to, to approach.” Imminent means, “impending, overhanging, about to happen, close at hand, near.” When Christians say, “the rapture IS imminent,” they put it in the present tense. In other words, it’s about to happen. Of course, no one knows when it is about to happen. So by saying “The rapture is imminent” all they are doing is stretching it out indefinitely, so that if it doesn’t happen today, it’s still imminent tomorrow, ad infinitum. “The rapture (redemption) WILL BE imminent” after the events of Luke 21:25-27. There is no rubber in imminency.
It got many in a mess ■ because they are still here they immediately believed the 'dirk' abomination could not happen, so they became a different 'gene'ration of humans. Post19.
Revelation 3: 10 Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth. 11Behold, I am coming quickly! Hold fast what you have, that no one may take your crown. 12He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.
@Ken Klein Please re-read Rev. 3:10. No matter the translation, it literally means: "KEPT FROM". Christians who are "Saved" will not face God's wrath, which is the requirement for those who deny Christ.
@@kenklein9228 The Seals of Revelation 5 are the beginning of the Wrath of God. The actual Rapture happens at Revelation 4: 1. I Thessalonians 5: 9 NKJV For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ. JESUS TOOK GOD'S WRATH OF SIN ON THE CROSS! JUST-IF-I'D NEVER SINNED!
@@j.t.patton7820 "Rev. 3:10. No matter the translation, it literally means: "KEPT FROM"." Those words were first spoken to the Christians at Philadelphia - it was for them, and it's also for us. They weren't raptured out of their time when the world around them was tried, and we won't be either. "Christians who are "Saved" will not face God's wrath, which is the requirement for those who deny Christ." The GT isn't God's wrath, it's Satan's. We see this in Rev chapter 12. God's wrath is the bowls, which are described in Rev 19. We'll be here for the GT unless we die beforehand. Time to get ready (by keeping Christ's word of patient endurance).
@@j.t.patton7820 "For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ. JESUS TOOK GOD'S WRATH OF SIN ON THE CROSS! JUST-IF-I'D NEVER SINNED!" Yes. See my other post.
To answer your points: 1. "Can't be imminent because it takes time to spread the Gospel" - the Bible is available in hundreds of languages, on the internet, in print across the world, and is spreading still. Yet Jesus said I am coming quickly (Rev) "to receive you unto Myself." (John14:3) It could still happen in the very near future as the Gospel continues to spread thru the world, and more disciples are made in Jesus, bringing the rapture ever closer to now. 2. "Imminency" is speaking of the present, not of the past. Jesus wasn't coming back the next day. This argument is shallow and seeks to make us, 2000 years removed, seem stupid, saying that God contradicts Himself. 3. Again the same errant argument, saying pretrib imminency was active the moment Jesus left. 4. Again, as the prophecies have been fulfilled, the rapture has become more and more ready to happen. 5. Temple was destroyed 78 AD. The Holocaust might even apply here perhaps. But even now Israel is under near constant attack from her neighbors. 6. Church has fallen away especially in Europe and America. The kowtowing to woke, progressive, Marxist, secular, humanist, racist liberalism by the church is definently a falling away of the Church. (The Methodist split is another example.) Also, Satan has had AntiChrists ready throughout history, because he doesn't know when the Rapture will happen either. Neither does Jesus, only the Father. 7. Those points Speak of the Return and reign of Christ, not Rapture. Imminent vs urgency- just splitting hairs on a flawed premise. The birthpangs have been happening: world wars, holocaust, pandemics, persecution of the Church. Paul's urgency - that was 2000 years ago. Time has passed since then, like approaching the light at the end of the tunnel. It was far then, it is at our doorstep now. Or a 6 year old eager to learn to drive, compared to a 16 year old ready to take the keys in his hand and drive. The imminency is at the completion of all things. This argument is a big nothing-burger trying to make such a small distinction based on a flawed perception of pretrib folks. Of course the rapture wasn't imminent 2000 years ago, but it has become more and more so to the present day. The time is at hand, and you pretty much made that point while trying to deny it with semantics. Imminent rapture is not a heresy- it's an application of the Scriptures.
Those that would not receive the 'dirk' ■ testify that they are made in the image of God have futhered the Gospel to the ends of the earth. Most know of someone that did not consent. What was meant for death, those that trusted God were the light in truth. This division is amazingly clear, through luciferase or MAC bluetooth addresses.
If something must happen before the rapture, then it is not imminent. The parables teach imminency. Their theme is about being caught off guard because the people weren't ready. Pre trib requires that you be ready at ALL times, just as Jesus taught. Mat 24:44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.
In the parable of the Wheat & Tares in Matt. 24-30 Jesus says they must grow together until the Harvest. Jesus explained this parable in verses 36-43. Harvest is at the End of the World. See verses 39,40 & 49 of Matt. 13.
@@nickstaxfree9604 The point of the parable is that God will do the harvesting, and not men. There are two phases to this endeavor. First is the Rapture before the tribulation, Rev 3:10, 1 Thes 1:10. And then the completion of the harvest at the end of the age.The contrast between these two gatherings couldn't be more stark. The first phase will occur as the angels said it would: Act 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. Act 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. This is the coming Jesus mentions in John:Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. This event is imminent and requires nothing to happen before it. The harvest at the end of the tribulation is described quite differently:2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, 2Th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Why are they so different? Because they are two separate events. The Rapture with Jesus in the clouds, 1 Thes 4:17, followed 7 years later at the end of the age harvest, with Jesus in flaming fire with his mighty angles and vengence. In vain will you search for a translating the living into glorified bodies, the Rapture, at the end of the tribulation.
They said that Peter and Paul taught the imminent coming of the Lord lol. Both said good bye knowing they were going to die and what manner of death they would have to face. Everyone with them both were heart broken at their imminent demise. It’s ridiculous to use them as the example, the lie of Jesus any moment return. But they’re not critical thinkers and believe no one else is either.
Revelation is a book of symbols, not to be taken literally but in its spiritual meanings. Even his vision of Christ appears in symbolic form with a double-edged sword coming out of his mouth, and John is told to record what will be signified or shown by signs regarding those things which already are or will very soon take place. The battle of Armageddon is being fought right now as we can see the forces of evil attacking all around us. It is not speaking of a literal war fought with horses with blood flowing up to the horses' harnesses. Neither is the mark of the beast or the 1000-year reign or any of those numbers literal, like the 144,000. These are all symbolic representations with spiritual meaning, many already having been fulfilled, just as John says in his introduction. Christ's kingdom is a present reality right here and now, as we reign with him victoriously over the power of sin and Satan. It is a kingdom not of this world, just as Jesus said to Pilate. When Jesus returns, it will be to raise all the dead who have ever lived and to judge in the final judgment after the dead are raised. At his coming, the salvation Jesus will bring to his own redeemed and faithful people will be revealed. Jesus said that both the wicked and the righteous will live together until the end of the world (Matthew 13), when the angels will come to remove first the wicked from among the righteous, not the other way around as the rapture fiction pretends. Only after the judgment following the resurrection are the believers taken up to be forever more with the Lord in the Father's Kingdom. The so-called "Rapture" was never part of historical Christianity until the 19th century and especially the 20th century when it was popularized by the fictional writings of Tim LeHaye's Left Behind series, nonsensical writing which contradicts the very words of Jesus as noted above. Of course, Revelation is a work of spiritual significance expressed and depicted through symbols, which symbolism is explained in the writings of the apostles, such as the meaning of the "first resurrection" (the new birth as mentioned in Ephesians and many other places), the ruling with Christ in this present world as a royal priesthood of believers reigning victoriously over sin and Satan, to which John himself refers in his opening verses of Revelation, also mentioned by Peter and Paul. The Holy Spirit and the words of Christ and his apostles give understanding to those whose eyes are not blinded by loyalty to denominational doctrines and human teachings rather than to the pure word of God read without being viewed through a lens of denominational overlay. God told Abraham that his descendants would be as numerous as the stars in the sky and the sands of the sea. With the naked eye under the best of visual conditions and circumstances, only a few thousand stars can be seen, but we know now that the universe contains more stars than there are grains of sand on all the beaches and deserts of the planet. It would be foolish to give a literal interpretation to everything we see in Scripture. "The cattle on a thousand hills are the Lord's" is just a figurative expression, just as the 6/7 "days" of creation are metaphorical, expressed in terms that people of those ancient times could relate to, and not of course literal 24-hour days. In Revelation, the description of a city in a perfect cube with each side 1500 miles long, a city 1500 miles high, is not a literal description but a symbolic one of the perfection of God's redeemed Church, his Bride dressed in his perfect righteousness. We must be wise in our understanding, not led about by every wind of false doctrine and teaching of man. The Pharisees were wrong because they expected an earthly future literal and worldly Kingdom of the Messiah on this Earth, which is very much like what the millennialists teach today. Jesus told Pilate that his kingdom is not of this world--but rather a spiritual Kingdom right here and now in the hearts of all those in whom God's will is done during this present gospel age, the "thousand years" simply expressing the fullness of time in God's plan which is not entirely revealed to us. Revelation also mentions the seven spirits of God, which again we realize and recognize is not a literal depiction but symbolism of God's perfection. Some Pharisees asked Jesus when the Kingdom of God would come. His answer was, “The Kingdom of God does not come in such a way as to be seen. No one will say, ‘Look, here it is!’ or, ‘There it is!’-- because the Kingdom of God is within you.” (Luke 17:20-21) In an epistle Paul plainly states that when Jesus returns, he will deliver up his kingdom, this spiritual Kingdom in which we reign with him right here and now, at his coming to the Father, and that we shall reign in heaven eternally with him there, not in literal Israel. The New Testament plainly teaches that the true Zion / Israel and chosen people of God is not literal Jewry but the spiritual children of Abraham who compose God's Church of all the redeemed. God's focus is not on some literal real estate in the Middle East or on its population but rather he is focused on that most valuable of all real estate: the hearts of all mankind who are called to repentance and continuing obedient faith in his Son, turning from sin to God. While others dream and fantasize of a millennial age to come, He's reigning in our hearts today! The REAL "Replacement Theology": Replace resurrection WITH RAPTURE Replace one second coming WITH TWO Replace one plan of redemption WITH TWO Replace living, spiritual temple WITH PHYSICAL Replace current reign of Christ in spiritual Zion, God's church, WITH KING-ON-HOLD Replace centrality of Jesus Christ WITH CENTRALITY OF 'ISRAEL' DISPENSATIONALISM IS THE REAL REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY! It is the Bible which is "Left Behind"! Everything that is said in the gospels and epistles about the second coming of Christ has to be considered in its totality, and the pieces fit together perfectly like a puzzle. Jesus returns suddenly on the "last day" (as he says three times in John 6), the "day" of resurrection and final judgment. With him he will bring the souls of all those who have been in paradise. The time of his coming is not known; we will not have a thousand and seven years of advance notice. It could be today. Of course, since the world is round, that would be at all hours of the clock including night time depending on where one lives. But everyone on Earth will see him, including all mankind from all previous centuries and ages. In a twinkling of an eye all humanity who have ever lived are exposed before him as the entire material, physical, and molecular universe in this dimension of time, space, and matter which we now inhabit is dissolved instantaneously in fiery conflagration, passing away with a mighty roar. The Earth and starry heavens exist no more. The overwhelming power and glory of the Son of God is on display as he reveals the final salvation of his people. The angels remove the wicked first from among the righteous and then all mankind are judged, whether good or evil. The wicked are taken to their eternal punishment, and the righteous in Christ are taken with him as Jesus Christ delivers up his kingdom to the Father, in which we shall reign together with him forever. There will be degrees of eternal shame, disgrace, and bitterness of regretful sorrow and punishment in hell, and there will be degrees of glory and reward in heaven. God will do all things justly. There will be provision made for those who are classified as innocents, such as those who, although possessing souls, did not as infants or otherwise possess ability to make moral decisions resulting in spiritual death from sin, but the Bible does not give us any details about this; it is to be inferred. Heaven will be not at all what people imagine but far more wonderful. We will have spiritual bodies and will not appear as we do in this life but will bear the image of the glorious Son of God as he is now, not as he appeared in human form as he ascended from the Mount of Olives. As Jesus said, "The one who endures to the end will be saved.... Be faithful unto death, and I will give you the crown of Life."
This is are tribulation and trial. Revelation 1314And he deceives [f]those who dwell on the earth by those signs which he was granted to do in the sight of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who was wounded by the sword and lived. 15He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed. 16He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads, 17and that no one may buy or sell except one who has [g]the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. We can't buy or sell for 45 day's
Pre-trib is based on INFERENCE? It takes an awful big nerve to have a private interpretation of Scripture. To make up something that isn't there to support pre-trib. It goes along the lines of the serpent convincing Eve if she ate the fruit she wouldn't die. NO! INstead you'll be like God!
This is an excellent passage, but pre-tribbers can easily claim that “at the last day” means the day of the rapture and/or the period known as the last days (they just missed the “S” when they translated it). As you can tell, I don’t buy that for a second.
I was taught all three approaches, but ■ Revelation 19 and 20 has stood the test. We know this is the end of the age. Like measuring a garment, even an allowance for later growth, the pattern is set before the cloth is cut. Once cut it is shaped; it is best modeled with a flare of room. It would be silly trying to cover with the garment not in tact; but it will be glorious in the freedom of comfort. Faith is the reward of Trust.
Imminency is defined as nothing has to happen before the event takes place. I am a firm believer in that, I am sorry. I am surprised that you believe in a rapture at all!
For the life of me I just cant understand how pre-trib gets around 2 Thessalonians 2:1-4 . It is so plainly spelled out. The way I read it Paul says the day of the Lord and the rapture is the same day. "That Day Shall not come" Why is it Americans think that we are above suffering for our Lord? A servant is not above his master and if our master suffered we will also suffer. Paul said we press in with much suffering. Lord Yeshua give us grace that we may say "Though you slay me I will trust you"
Yes - but the satanic pastors are now preaching that verse 3 falling away, apostasy, rebellion - is falling away as snatched away. They have twisted it to say the antichrist won’t be revealed until the rapture comes first. Refer to J.D Farag, Jack Hobbs, Amir etc they are all teaching it.
Yeah I've heard that its a bit ridiculous to to say the rapture wont happen until the raptures happens ? Doesn't even make sense. they are Desperate to ignore the meaning of the verse .
The biggest joke from all pre tribulation rapturians is they say ‘oh, the great tribulation is ONLY for the Jews’ or they always separate the church from the Jewish/Gentile saints. Then they turn around and love to reference the JEWISH wedding as the shadow for the rapture of the non Jewish Church.
Thank you once again for your excellent teaching. My minister is not a pre-tribber, and I'm happy about that. I have learned so much more from you guys though. He won't discuss prophecy.
If you’re hooked on narcotic painkillers I highly suggest you sign up for a “medically assisted treatment” (mat)..and they’ll switch you to ‘buphernorphine’..that is if you are only!! God Bless!!🙏
I pray for you and all those like you who are being convicted to get off meds or overcome addictions. May you receive His healing in your body, soul, and spirit and your desire to be pure and clean be blessed.
I was taught Pretribulation Rapture in Bible College in early 80's, but after continuing to study, it was the first of a myriad of false teaching in the Apostate church.
Thanks for your clear and true teaching of it. YES, Resurrection and Rapture is synonymous 👍
I love how you say, " This is just common sense ." I so much agree. Unfortunately, have you noticed how much common sense has been lost in the West?🤦♀️😥 And Yet, Maranatha!🕎✝️🐟🕊🙌🙏
Not imminent, but rather urgent. Excellent 🙏
WHEN we see the "Sign of the Son of Man in the heavens" it will THEN be imminent! ;) But all that "stuff" spoken of must first come to pass, as the scriptures say. Plainly. I wonder how dyed-in-the-wool Pre-Tribbers are taking this? For many it's going to be the seven stages of mourning or grief. The first being denial. Been there, but not on the rapture idea, but other false ideas taught to us since childhood.
@@thunderdove3764
Good point, however, the stages of grief will only take place if their eyes are opened.
The more popular pre-tribbers on TV and UA-cam appear to be quite dug-in. I have not seen any of them change. In fact, Prophesy Watchers, an otherwise excellent source of teaching, is doubling down. They are actually lamenting the fact that the once dominant pre-trib view is being challenged and even fading.
This is my concern: when things get really bad (persecutions) they will not be prepared to deal with it.
A great shaking is coming: No doubt about it. 🙏
@@eswn1816 Yes, the shaking sure is coming. "Narrow and windy is the path"--part of me wishes the pre-Trib rapture were true. It's rough what's going on already, just in the pervasiveness and degeneracy of the evil. If my heart and my mind weren't being prepared for a few years already, specifically for the troubles, I don't know where I'd be.
The Lord started whispering to me "Revelation" about 5 years back. I read the book again a few times, and still didn't know what was what. God actually led me to Joel's youtube channel, and then to the FAI studies in 2020.
Some of my friends say "well if it's not pre-Trib, I'll be good either way." They think the Bible supports it perhaps, so now I'll have info to give them that's specific. I knew it didn't support pre-Trib, but some of their historic teachers like Ouest make a case. They use the "one will be taken and one left" example quite a bit, as in two women grinding at the mill, etc. We could say what the does the "taken" part mean? They think it means raptured. And the "Son of man comes like a thief in the night" is another building block. I'm sure these "proof texts" will be smashed as support for the doctrine of pre-Trib rapture the further along the study goes.
Hang in there friend. We're in for a lot of turbulence! Praying for the body of Christ to be alert and awake, and listening to the voice of the Shepherd.
Great teaching Joel. You and Dalton have really encouraged me with your teaching.
I used to believe in a pre-tribulation rapture until a few years ago. I started looking at some of these verses that you read and changed my beliefs.
Soon after I came upon your teaching and was overjoyed because you guys helped me to understand so much more.
Thank you and Maranatha...
@Joel What do you think of the pre~tribulation rapture stance of the the “dispensationalist??” Thanks!!..
The church/bride rapture is a thousand years after the saints rapture
John 6 40 Jesus says at the Last day
Revelation 20 shows both Resurrections
@@squirreljones3595 😳 huh?
@@cjohn316
There's no Bible Verses that show the bride of CHRIST in the thousand year reign of Jesus
There's no Bible Verses that promise the thousand year reign of Jesus to the bride of CHRIST
Daniel 12 2
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting Life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
When everyone is believing or doing a thing...my Spirit throws up a red flag! The path is narrow that leads to Jesus. Beware everyday of being deceived. Pray and confirm every doctrine and teaching. Do not believe unless the Holy Spirit has confirmed with scripture of 2 or 3 witnesses.
Good teaching. Now be sober and vigilant. Discerning the times.
Amen, listen to Jesus only
Revelation 20 4 seven descriptions
Revelation 2 & 3 seven letters
Jesus is Truth
The church/bride rapture is a thousand years after the saints rapture
John 6 40 Jesus says at the Last day
Revelation 20 shows both Resurrections
Thank you Abba Father for FAI in Jesus name Amen.
Amen. I have yet to find a church that teaches post trib. A good 25 years ago just reading Matthew 24, I questioned what we are being taught. It is so clear what Jesus says. The wrath is not the 7 year tribulation. He did not appoint us to wrath, but unto salvation. I agree that this is a major deception. Jesus said. Take heed that no one deceives you. I believe the Holy Spirit guided me to truth. I never learned that from anyone, just reading and studying. I believe more will fall away when we are not ruptured out if here.
Same for me with Matthew 24, it's so clear that Christians will be persecuted through the tribulation, but our hope is the Day of the Lord when Jesus returns. The spirit grabbed me over Matthew 24 with Jesus's warning over deception. The pre-trib rapture idea in my view is leaving people unprepared for when the real trouble begins, and it's designed by the enemy to weaken the body of Christ
True ■ they got the 'gene'ration abomination because they believed they would be rapture before the mar-k; God gave them over to the strong delusion.
My story is very similar to yours, Bill. Bless you. 🙌
The pastor at our church recently spoke against the concept of a secret rapture and stated Jesus's 2nd coming is one event. I came to faith shortly after trying this church and they are full each week, with a successful church plant nearby 2 years ago. For anyone in search of faithful bible teaching please check out Armagh Baptist Church, they still record live each week.
Strong delusion
All doctrines here in Mystery Babylon added the church/bride to the thousand year reign of Jesus
SORRY but the church/bride doesn't get to hijack the saints reward
The church/bride rapture is a thousand years after the saints rapture
John 6 40 Jesus says at the Last day
Revelation 20 shows both Resurrections
Yes. The pre-trib doctrine is something I once strongly believed in, but it was in ignorance. This doctrine is definitely a lie. It is not biblical. May the Holy Spirit help us to expose this doctrine, so the church will no longer teach this false message. May it be rejected just like any other false doctrine.
@@markusandrew777 please see my comment at "Yes" ■ there you will see what Asa has written as far as their statement of faith in what is written.
@@markusandrew777 Well some believers are just as I once was. I simply believed this doctrine because that is what I was taught when I converted to Christ. It wasn't because I had "itching ears". It was just pure spiritual immaturity and ignorance on my part. But once I actually began to read the scriptures for myself, I discovered this doctrine was indeed false. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3 was the scripture that initially opened my eyes. I was taught we would not be here when the antichrist was revealed. But this scripture contradicted that teaching.
@@markusandrew777 I know the truth for many years and I preached it.But I always believed, the Rapture is not an issue of salvation. But it seems to be a salvation issue. Not, that I must believe in the right Rapture view, to be saved. We get saved by faith in the LORD and Savior Yeshua the Christ, there is nothing to add. But after salvation we have to walk in the Spirit in the light and that is the truth. If someone loves the darkness and makes a lie, he will be as the murderers and outside of the New Jerusalem (Rev 22:15). Most Pre-trib believers believe in Once saved always saved, they follow blind their "teachers", they are twofold deceived. Yeshua and Paul warned us about a false believe in the coming of the Lord, contrary what Yeshua and Paul taught. The Lord comes after the 3 1/2 year Trib (Mat 24:29-31; 2.Thess 2:1-3).
Lets pray, that the Pre-trib teachers get the fear of the Lord and that they come to the truth.
@@markusandrew777 I believed in OSAS, I was a backslider after I was saved. I did not repent, the Lord had to warn me 3 times, till I repented. The first warning, I went to hell, the Lord rescued me, but I thought He showed me hell. The second warning was the coming of the Lord in the air, He looked at me and shook His head. I would not be in the Rapture. But still I did not know what was wrong, they taught me, all our sins are forgiven, past, present and future. The third warning the Lord got specific, that I was the same as King David, a dead man. I repented as 1.Jn 1:9 says, to be cleansed.
@@markusandrew777 Amen brother 🙏
Another great segment. I’m learning so much. Thank you.
Many that believe a pre-trib will be deceived by the anti-christ. God tells us about how deceitful the enemy will be to take many of His children.
That's not the problem... they have been deceived by the false prophets! 2nd thessalonians 2nd chapter says if you believe the lie God will send you a strong delusion so you can be judged or damned! The subject of the letter is the coming of the lord and our gathering together unto him!
So I'm listening on my loudspeaker and I'm trying to flour some steak for frying and " riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight NOW!! " I jumped out of my skin about 3ft and flour went everywhere. Did I miss it guys ??? .. imagine 😆😁. Just thought I'd share... thanks for that Joel. Again another great study and teaching. You guys are awesome vehicles for The purposes of God. Bless you guys
Hahaha 😂😂
The Bible also teaches urgency because none of us are guaranteed one second more in this flesh body. So we are to live each day full of faith in Jesus Christ regardless of the timing of the Rapture. This is very rational also. Don't forget that any of us could breathe our last breath in this flesh body by any sorts of circumstances at any time. I try to live my life ready at any moment simply because of the world we live in today. Whether I live long enough to see and live in the Tribulation is still an unknown, but I will strive toward this end knowing my salvation has already been paid for by Jesus Christ.
Well said Joel!
Great teaching ,I always felt in my heart that there is more ,I felt that we are going to be here and n tribulation .thanks God bless this teaching and the fai. Family 🙏🙏🙏🙏
Amen brother - thank you ❤
Another great study.. Thank you
According to statistics, the amount of professing Christians that place their faith in the pre tribulation rapture is more than double than those who believe Gods Word that the catching up is on The Day of The LORD. Really shows you how narrow the gate is.
True ■ Good job.
Ok so you are saying the ones who are actually saved are the ones who believe exactly like you.
@@meredithgoodwin2930 You said that, not I. I said statistics show how many professing Christians have chose to place their faith in a lie. God is the judge! Serving Christ, you can't pick and choose what you want to accept as truth and disregard the rest.
Many will argue that the pre-trib rapture doctrine is useful from a pastoral point of view, because of the sense of imminency that makes people feel like that have to be ready to meet the Lord at any moment. But as Joel said in the end, we could DIE at ANY MOMENT, that is the real imminency! No need to preach a pre-trib rapture for that...
Thank You Sir!
Excellent Joel - thanks.
Amen!! 🙏
@Joel
Thanks
John 11:23-24
23 Jesus said to her, “Your brother will rise again.”
24 Martha said to Him, “I know that he will rise again in the resurrection at the last day.”
1 Thessalonians 4:15
15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep.
If Martha believed rightfully when the resurrection of the dead would occur, it should be obvious that immanency (context of rapture) in the early church was not taught to the disciples.
Excellent ■ thank you; Daniel 12.
That's the verse that woke me up to the rapture lie. I decided to read the entire new testament with no preconceived notions. I would just read it all the way through and highlight every passage talking about the end times. I then summarized each passage and put it in a word doc. It was then I realized the rapture and the resurrection at the second coming is the same thing.
@@Strongtower Without a doubt. Right now I struggle in finding a local church that actually holds these biblical truths, but it seems like there aren't many, if any. There are good assemblies here that hold important the main Gospel message and the rest of scripture, but on this topic, man, they seem so far off base. I cannot understand how so many gifted pastors miss this whole rapture topic.
@@Strongtower By the way, I have a spare bible that I think I will use for the same reason you stated. go through and highlight all the end times passages. Good idea.
My bible that I use daily is written up and underlined all through with most every topic. I think 1 John is almost completely underlined...lol.
@@discipledougnews1079 lol love to hear that about your underlining in 1 John. I could think of 2 things that might help you. Start a home bible study or just continue attending your current church. We need fellowship with other believers, you may have to sacrifice listing to pretrib stuff once in a while to be able to attend a church. My church did a series on end times a while ago and the pastor shared the varies end times positions. He shared the pros and cons of each and didn't push a particular position. Are there maybe any churches like that near you?
Also about your comment about gifted pastors believing in pretrib. I have thought about that for a while and at the end of the day, all these pastors are just men. They are fallible just like me and you. We all have grown up in our culture and traditions. These traditions shape the way we see the world including reading the Bible. These pastors are shaped by their traditions and preconceived notions like we are. Each of us must realize that we have grown up in a tradition and to test that tradition using Scripture to see if it holds up.
Soo good as always!
Scripture says many signs will need 2b fulfilled b/4 Messiah's imminent return. Sadly, many teachers propose (erroneously) the Rapture can happen at any moment. Riiiiiiiight NOW! Zoom!⚡🌪️There's a saying that goes that when something is repeated long / often enough, people will begin to believe it! We all need to be cognizant to this phenomenon...
Amen ■ they collect their salaries at the obedience of the State; damning the souls that they prey; yet if truth were to be embraced then planning, prepping, and serious decisions would equip to finish the race to the end faithfully. After that cut, up to Revelation 21, I now focus if I am to be participating in the Millennium can I stand that much time being a servant under a 'rod of iron'? Because, Lucifer will be loosen and the nations gather to rebel against Jesus, the saints, and the city. It is my desire to continue with the Father, and one must be faithful in order to live with him here, in the New Jerusalem, Revelation 22.
Stay humble,if you’re called to pray for the world that is not a small thing.many people need your prayers so much.
Encouraging!
I like the answers refuting the doctrine of immanence. Excellent 👍👍
You are doing good work.
The Great Comission is ultimately fulfilled by the angel mentioned in Revelation 14:6-7
6) Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth-to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people-
7) saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”
Would love a study on the "once saved always saved" doctrine.
Do you believe you can lose your salvation?
@@fisherofmenmatt4194 I no longer believe in "once saved always saved" after I read and studied the Bible.
@@Stridermd from what I can see it doesn’t appear you can lose it but trial and time may indicate you never had it. Ref 1 John 2:19
@@roberthoward3299 Dispensationalists ignore/downplay most of what Christ and the other apostles teach. Since virtually ALL Free Gracers are Dispensators, they 'only' have to twist Paul's teachings to support their OSAS balderdash.
Consider this:
There is a difference between OSAS and "eternal security."
Nothing can take away or rob my being in Christ. However, how was I saved? ... by faith, belief and trust in God. That was my choice. If I choose to depart from the faith (thus the great falling away as how can you fall away if you weren't first there?) Both pre-trib may have the same effect of causing believers to become complacent instead of disciples.
Didn't Peter tell us to "grow in grace?"
2 Peter 3: 18
We are the two witnesses!
You’re bang on Brother!
Great teaching as always however do you really have to keep interrupting the lessons for self promoting advertisements. Why oh why can’t you put them as the intro to your lesson. “The Hi sorry for interrupting…., are you really sorry? If you were you wouldn’t. Truthfully it disrupts the flow of the message. Trust in God not in you tube to meet your needs. Thank you for everything else and be blessed.
John 14 clearly states he comes to take us home, so that is pre trib to me.
However if not then we have to prepare for hard times, even death.
Live a pure life of obedience and it does not matter of pre or post. It only causes division in the body.
Jesus said at the Last day over and over and over again in John 6
The church/bride rapture is a thousand years after the saints rapture
John 6 40 Jesus says at the Last day
Revelation 20 shows both Resurrections.
Daniel 12 2
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting Life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
An interesting point in Matt.28:18-20 is at the end of v20 “even to the end of the age”. An “age” is a period of 2000 years.
I don't want to " infer " God's Word, Ever!
👊🏾👊🏾👊🏾 good points... Point 3
Because it is gonna happen totally different from what many thought,not like a sci-fi movie, it will seem as though it happened suddenly.
I still have many questions and will continue to study as we all “see in part & know in part”… we must be prepared to suffer for our faith in Christ as many have in the past, present & will until Jesus returns to rule and reign. I would be more respectful of Dr. Missler’s teachings as he ALWAYS was respectful of other viewpoints… this subject is not as “duh stupid” as Dalton and you seem to think. Forgive me if I’m mistaken ❤
But in those days, after that tribulation...then they will see the SON OF MAN COMING IN CLOUDS...And then He will send forth the angels, and will gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest end of earth to the farthest end of heaven. Mark 13:24-27
So are you saying that those who believe in the "doctrine of imminency" is one and the same with those believe in the "pre~tribulation rapture??" Please correct me if I am wrong, thanks!!
The comments below on the subject of immanency by Dr Alan Kurschner - the emphasis on immanency is "how" we are caught up not "when" we are caught up.
I wonder about the caught up ■ my family can arrive in my drive, and I get caught up in the moment and join them and am changed while still in my home. However, this fulfilled promise is welcomed, the new body is our hope and God's promise.
those verses at the end he thinks pretribbers use.....aren't verses pretribbers use lol
Point 2... A good point
You would think that Jesus would say at least one time. “I can come back anytime”. But he never, nor does anyone else
By the way, I never found the "Rapture" any where in God's "moedim" . I do understand that where he is I will be. When the trumpet sounds I will be ready for his next instruction.
Moedim as in appointed/Feast ■ no one knows the day or hour is a Jewish idiom that is practice on identifying the new crescent moon by two witnesses for the Feast of Trumpets.
I believe Matthew 24: 23-25 refers to the lost deceived elect who fall away and take the mark of the beast because they were deceived by the pre tribulation rapture and the false ‘jesus’
Agree ■ Amen! I believe it is the falling away. Because there is no turning around from permanent abomination, then there is only left judgement. No repentance for receiving the mark, worship of the beast, and the system involved.
@@margiechism Thank you Margie. You are MOST right, once you take the mark - it is all over. Also taking the mark is pure blasphemy against Gods Holy Spirit.
I believe the deceived elect as Christ warns of in Matthew 24: 23-25 are directly related to and the same as Paul writes in 2 Thessalonian 2: 1-3
The deceived elect will fall away and into apostasy all because of the false pre tribulation rapture escape. That was and is Satan's plan when he conceived the deception in the first place.
Fyi your playlist are backwards 😢
Dr. Alan Kurschner, a pre-wrath Greek scholar argues against pre-tribulationist position using 2 Thessalonians 2:3 stating that the use of the words "unless" = [ean me in Greek] is a noun not a verb [thus not denoting physical departure] and "first" = [proton in Greek] is an adverb describing the sequence of events. These 2 words are also used to describe the exact same message in John 7:51 and Mark 3:27.
I enjoy Dr. Kurschner's teachings on eschatology and Koine Greek construction. I would like to make one small change to your comment. He was not talking about the word "unless" (ean mé--conjunctive participle) being a noun. Apostasy is the noun and was always used to designate a non-spatial departure instead of a physical rapture.
I just had a very dear brother lose his mind over this, he became extremely angry and cursed me out. Where is this pastor located?
the gathering of the Jews back to their own land has to happen first Ezekiel 36:24 :) and it happened in 1948. Then the Jews will be sorrounded by her enemies.
Thank you brother Niagara Falls Canada
The book of Daniel is all about what will happen at the end of the age. Only in chapter 12 will you find a resurrection and only after the king of the north sets himself up in the beautiful land. There is not two resurrections.
Revelation 20 details Daniel 12 ■ the First Resurrection and the Millennium, then the White throne Judgement is the Second Resurrection for those not found in the Book of Life, the Lambs Book; Second Death is the lake of fire. Revelation 19 through chapter 20 is a quick read, and expains Daniel. Like when God told Adam and Even that they would die, overtime much happened for their bodies before burial, yet they were changed once they sinned; meaning they did not drop dead the moment they sinned.
This is when God told me the Raptures gonna happen.. The Bible is his word..
2 Thessalonians 2: 1-4 (KJV)
1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,
2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.
Beautiful ■ Yes, indeed. Thank you.
I just don't want people to be caught off guard..
What’s the rest of it? Doesn’t it say that the man of lawlessness CANNOT be revealed until HE who restrains is taken out?
@@meredithgoodwin2930 yes but in the whole Bible I can't find anywhere where the church is referred to as a guy after all we are the bride of Christ..
@@meredithgoodwin2930 if he who restrains is the church or even the Holy spirit with them scripture contradicts itself in the span of less than 10 verses. Scripture does not contradict itself, therefore your interpretation is incorrect.
Woot
Study the 7 feasts the Almighty set,
That's Christs' chronological order
created for Christ to fulfill
I am beginning to think that the nearness of the Lords return needs to be considered in light of what Peter said that with the Lord 1000 years are as a day and a day as 1000 years. Our perception of time is different from the Lords. Peter brought his perception of time into alignment with the Lords. We can do the same. I remember when I was young summer break seemed to last forever, now at the age of 47 a summer comes and goes like a weekend. My perception of time has already changed. It’s not hard to conceptualize a God oriented perception of time on an everlasting scale and better understand what I think Peter saw regarding the nearness of the Lords return.
Hi Joel, I agree with much of what you say here, but just a thought...what if the the end of Matthew 23 ( 39For I tell you, you will not see me again, until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.’”) all the way through Matthew 24 and 25 as well as Luke 21 is telling the singular story of Israel's salvation (both the rescue of the remnant from their enemies (the Beast empire (Islamic in nature)) AND their true repentance and changed heart. They will finally give their full allegiance to their God, and Creator...Jesus, who is the/their Messiah.
I'm not convinced that our resurrection/catching up is what Jesus is talking about in this section of scripture. I actually think that He is referring to Isaiah 66:18-20:
18“For I know their works and their thoughts, and the time is coming to gather all nations and tongues. And they shall come and shall see my glory, 19and I will set a sign among them. And from them I will send survivors to the nations, to Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, who draw the bow, to Tubal and Javan, to the coastlands far away, that have not heard my fame or seen my glory. And they shall declare my glory among the nations. 20And they shall bring all your brothers from all the nations as an offering to the Lord, on horses and in chariots and in litters and on mules and on dromedaries, to my holy mountain Jerusalem, says the Lord, just as the Israelites bring their grain offering in a clean vessel to the house of the Lord. 21And some of them also I will take for priests and for Levites, says the Lord.
Matthew 24:29 starts off with "Day of the Lord" language.
The language that comes after in verse 30... the "sign" also mentioned in Isaiah 66:19 is the pillar of smoke/fire that is also mentioned in Isaiah 4:5-6. It is the same pillar that led Israel in the past and according to Isaiah 4:5-6 it is once again in the land protecting God's people after He has cleansed them with a new heart when finally they say "Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord" (Matthew 23:39) and mourn over whom they have pierced (Zech 12:10).
I believe that the survivors mentioned in Isaiah 66:19 are survivors from the last battle (Armageddon) and are from the 10 nations that form the beast militia. Jesus at His 2nd coming has gone throughout the region in a series of battles with the last battle finally destroying all of the Beast armies except for these few survivors that He sends back as messengers (angels) to their homelands (where they have taken out a portion of Jews) to tell their people "let My people go" (just like Moses was sent to Pharaoh). The nations bring them back to Jerusalem and at that time the nations are judged as sheep or goats (Matthew 25:31-46) based on how they treated the least of His people.
Verse 31 states "gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other" which leads us to what is recorded in both Deut 30:4-8, and Zech 2:6-13. This language of the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other is a description of God not only sending His people out of the land but also and more importantly bringing His people back into the land that He gave their fathers AND He gives them a new heart so that they will love God. Duet 30:4-8 is referring to the same time period that Jesus is referring to in Matthew 24 and according to Zech 2 He will dwell in their midst...which again will be this same time period.
***Here is a breakdown of the language used in Matthew 24:29-31 that is actually used and explained in the following Old Testament scriptures:
* Tribulation of those days:
* Sun, moon, cosmos: (Joel 2 + 3 + others re: Day of the Lord)
* Powers of the Heavens: (Eph 6:12)12For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places. Col 1:16For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-all things were created through him and for him.
* Sign of the Son of Man: The pillar of smoke and fire as in the OT.. (see Isaiah 66:19, Isaiah 4;1-6)
* All tribes of earth will mourn: (Habakkuk 3:3-7, Rev 6:12-17)
* Son of Man on the clouds of heaven: (see Daniel 7:13-14)
* Send out His Angels: (Angels=messengers) (see Isaiah 66:19,20)
* Loud Trumpet: (Joel 2:1-11)
* Gather His elect: (Isaiah 66:19-20, Deut 30:4-8, Zech 2:6-13)
* Four winds of heaven: (see Deut 30:4-8, Zech 2:6-13)
Jesus also did not make Peter the head of the apostles, all were servants as we are servants. He did ask Peter to feed his sheep 3 times.
One lambs ■ 2 sheep.
If the pretrib folks want to be the bride then don’t they have to go through the labor pains?
I Cannot think of anything God didn't complete. I don't believe he would put prophecy or some prophecy in a spot with the intention of it may or may not get fulfilled. Thinking of a pre tribulation rapture to me sounds almost Calvinistic. When Christ said he was waiting on the fullness of the gentiles, I don't believe that that would mean that the rapture could be imminent because The 2 thoughts do not coincide. I do believe that God Knows everything that can happen will happen in this happening. And I also believe he gave us free will.
#1 Yes, Jesus said the "end" will not occur until the gospel is preached everywhere. The pre-trib rapture (Luke 17:22-37) is not the "end". The "end" is the second coming (1 Thes 4:13-17).
#2 The first clue the church was going to be on the earth for awhile.
#3 Another clue the church was going to be on the earth for awhile.
#4 Israel could not have been founded after the pre-trib rapture? I don't understand how that disproves a pre-trib rapture. Couldn't Daniel's 9:27 treaty be about the founding of Israel?
#5 Yes, after Jerusalem was taken and destroyed, the church was in for the long haul. How does that disprove a pre-trib rapture?
#6 The church is taken out so that the AC and devil can start his total rule on earth.
I think it is good to have an attitude that believes Jesus could come for us at any moment (Matt 24:45-51).
What they teach is that you don't hear about the church after Revelation 5.
So we don't need the two witnesses? We don't need the wars after the rumors of wars? Damascus does not need to cease to exist ? Jesus only said my father is the only who knows the moment. We are to use all our moments serving and spreading his word of salvation.
If the beast ■ turns out to actually be a mystery wo-men; then the two witnesses may not be what we plan either, but diffenently the two will drive the wicked mad, and these two will die and resurrect. If they resurrect on the day of the Lord, then that would indicate closer to the day, and the hour according to the sundown.
This is so clearly taught, it is irrefutable. There isn't a pretrib rapture.
Let me show you Mathew 24 verse 14. In Daniel chapter 12 and look at them side by side.
14And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.
The Great Tribulation
15“Therefore when you see the ‘abomination of desolation,’ spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place” (whoever reads, let him understand),it comes after the time times and a half which is the preaching in Mathew 24 14
Daniel 12 4“But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book until the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.”
5, “How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?”
7Then I heard the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand to heaven, and swore by Him who lives forever, that it shall be for a time, times, and half a time; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished.
Daniel 12 11“And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away,[ that is the time times and a half Matthew 24 14] and the abomination of desolation is set up, [ Mathew 24 15. We need to understand ]there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days. 12Blessed is he who waits, and comes to the one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days. Jesus comes on day 1335 to resurrect and rapture.
So the great tribulation is only 45 day's long, then the Resurrection and rapture
It is true, I can see the LORD at any time, I could die in 5 seconds after typing, this, or 30 years, ONE day it will happen . . BUT not HIS Second Coming. . LOL ;)
If you fall away from the Faith, does that mean your salvation is gone as well??
Yes
It's called apostasy.
"The great falling away means that they fell from a good place to a bad place."
If you have not received the mark, not worshipped the beast, and not been part of the system ■ I believe you can repent and be forgiven, but anyone that took the abomination cannot because it is not reversible where it can be repented/to turn from. Revelation has the details; I believe this is the 'falling away'.
does it means that if we are suffering rightnow for any reason and are able to avoid it for example Moving to another place to have some peace we should not do it??and allow the birth pain to continue? or is more like a massive suffering for the whole world as we had with the Pandemia ??? but getting worse and worse ??? can you clarufy next time ??
Thank you so much Joel for speaking truth boldly. This is something that has weighed heavy on my heart for some time now. I feel an urgency to warn the church before we enter the time Jesus spoke of in Matt 24. I feel dejected and beat down, by believers, who will not listen to sound doctrine. Even with scriptures such as 2 Thes 2 they refuse to hear or even see the plain text telling them that Paul will not be gathered until the man of lawlessness is revealed. We live in Laodicea and it's miserable. For every believer who understands the truth there are countless others who scoff. I wish I had a time machine so I could go back and duct tape Darbys mouth closed. Thanks again for sticking your neck out there. God bless you
The church/bride rapture is a thousand years after the saints rapture
John 6 40 Jesus says at the Last day
Revelation 20 shows both Resurrections
I have a question in ch 7 of rev it states that there is a bunch of people b4 Gods throne , then after that it gets into the bowls and a lot of terrible stuff is that just because rev is not written in order?
In John's time, there were no chapters in manuscripts. Yes, Revelation is written in chronological order, with PARENTHETICAL SECTIONS inserted and are used for detailed reference and explanation of the main topic.
For example, at the end of chapter 11, the 7th angel blew the 7th trumpet. Then, chapter 12 starts giving us information on the woman and the dragon. Rev 12:1 to 15:4 are parenthetical. At Rev 15:5, John continues on with the events of God's Wrath.
The people before the throne are 'those whom have come out of the tribulation'. To come out of something you first have to be in it! Matthew 24 clearly states Christians will be imprisoned and some even killed in regards to the end the age and his second coming. It makes sense those crying to God for their blood to be avenged are those killed during the tribulation.
The book isn't written in strict chronological order. We often see events first in a big picture scene, then we see it again in more detail. For example, Revelation chapter 6 is an outline of the Great Tribulation and God's wrath (the bowls); the remainder of Revelation fills in the details for us.
@@koalabear19 I believe that as well but after ch7 , we see bowls being poured out and the 2 witnesses but yet in ch7 saints coming out of tribulation are already before God
Lots of pre trib rapture preachers believe all prophecy has to be completed before the rapture. So your example is using a small majority of some beliefs to lump everyone into that thought process.
??? If lots of pre trib rapture preachers believe all prophesied events have to be completed before the rapture, would that not negate a pre trib rapture?
You are mixed up between pre tribulation rapture and pre wrath catching up.
ALL and ALL pre tribulation rapture teachers state ‘Nothing needs to be fulfilled for ‘jesus’ to return and rapture’
Most Pre Trib Teachers I know say Loudly that the Coming of Jesus can happen at any second and that there is nothing else that needs to be fulfilled!
They all say that Jesus could come at any hour as though His Coming is Imminent!
Name another prophecy that needs to be fulfilled? Israel becoming a nation again was the last prophecy that need to happen. And why all preachers (any rapture or non rapture belief) are talking the end days could be on us...because nothing else needs to be completed for the tribulation to start. So everyone is discussing that the end days can happen anytime now and the start of the tribulation could happen....as in the video says "right now"
I understand that every believer has to be ready to stand before the Lord at any moment, because we can die suddenly and that would be our Rapture, most believers in the last 2000 years have died in the Lord to be raptured in His parousia. The coming of the Lord is an appointed time and controlled by Father God only at the end of this world after the Great tribulation, as Yeshua said in Mat 24:29. Paul affirms with 2. Thess 2:1-3 and 1.Tess 5:1 the teaching of Yeshua, that the Rapture, the Day of the Lord is not at hand, but first comes the apostasy or rebellion (Greek protos=always first) AND the revealing of the Antichrist has to happen, before the Lord can come with the First Resurrection/Rapture 1000 years before the end of the Millennium. The Timing is fixed by God and no man can change it, not Pre- Mid-Trib or PreWrath. The bible is Post-trib, if someone likes it or not, it is a fact and preachers should acknowledge this fact and stop preaching contrary to the bible, or they will face one day God's judgment. Daniel gives us also the timing of the last days. The Great Tribulation is the persecution of the Saints, which is 3 1/2 years and NOT 7 years (Dan 12:7 and 7:25). The first 3 1/2 years the AC comes with peace and will destroy many (Dan 8:23-25). The last 3 1/2 years he persecutes the Saints, he demands to be worshiped as God. Dan 11:35 +36 tells us that it is for an appointed time, all will be done as it is appointed and all things will be finished with the end of the GT. That is the time frame according to Daniel and revelation agrees with it, but most Rapture views have made their own timing in revelation, first the seals, then the trumpets and last the bowels, that is not scriptural. The first 6 seals are the same as the Olivet Discourse. Rev 6:17 is the last day of this age (Strong's), Christ begins to reign on earth=Millennium. Rev 11:15-18 and 16:15-20 are the same event , His 2. coming with more details. Revelation is not written in sequence.
2THESS 2:1. Now we beseech you, brethren , by the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ ( before Jesus Christ comes in the clouds of glory, His coming in His saints it's called the epiphanie a corporate body of the man - child ministry, the 2 witnesses to minister to the church in the tribulation Rev 12:5,6; 2Thess 1:10, Hos 6:1-3; psalm 149:5-9; Isa 60:1,2; Acts 2:16-21; Rev 10:9-11; to preach the everlasting gospel to all creation ), and by our gathering together unto Him ( we gather unto Jesus Christ not religion nor denominations or man ) 2. That ye be not soon shaken in mind ( that's your soul area ), or be troubled, neither by spirit (wrong revelation, doctrines of demons , religious spirits , anti-christ spirit 1Jn 4:1-6; 2Jn verse 7; 2Pet 2:1-3; 1Tim 4:1 ), nor by word ( what's being preached, or taught, Lk 8:15. Jesus told His disciples to be careful with the leaven of the pharisees those are the preacher's of today, and to be careful with the leaven of herod that's your government ), nor by letter ( books, magazine's ,tracks ), as from us, as that the day of the Lord is at hand. 3. Let no man ( preacher, pastor, teacher, false prophet ) deceive ( beguile, trick you, tickle your ear ) by any means: for that day shall not come ( the coming of the Lord ), Except there come a falling away first ( Apostasy defecting from the truth, a great rebellion. 1Tim4:1; 2Tim3:1-5; 2Pet 2:3; Jude 18; Jn 6:66=666) , and the man of sin ( inside of each of us is the man of sin it's called the old man ) be revealed the son of perdition ( Judas iscariot was called the son of perdition by Jesus in Jn 17:12; Jn 13:26,27 SOP means son of perdition or destruction ). 4.Who opposeth and exalteth himself ( we must not exalt Self, the old man, the carnal man, the earthly man, the devilish man, the beastly nature of man, psalms 73:22 King David said , So foolish was I, and ignorant: I was as a beast before thee. We must deny Self, Matt 10:38,39; and die to Self the old man has to be crucified, the book of Roman's is the 6th book in the NT, chapter 6, and verse 6=666, the old man has to be crucified, so the born again, spiritual man, born from above. Christ in you the hope of glory rules your temple) above all that is called God, or is worshipped ( man likes to be worshipped, Self likes to be worshipped, false prophets, pastors, teachers, false apostles, Christian artists, even people in the secular world etc. Just like Lucifer Isa 14:13,14; Ezek 28:1-9; 2Tim 3:1-5; 2Cor 11-1-15 ); so he as God sitteth( look where he sitteth )in the temple of God ( we are the temple of God, God does not dwell in temples made with human hands, our spiritual man is the Holy of holies, the soul is the Holy place, the body is the outer court, Acts 17:24,25; 1Cor 3:16,17; ), shewing himself ( there's that word Self ) that he is God.5. Remember ye not, that when I was yet with you, I told you these things ( the apostle Paul always warned the church of Christ Jesus ) ? 6. And now ye know what withholdeth ( restraineth means to hold back ) that he ( the son of perdition ) might be revealed in his time ( let's go back to verse 3 and will see when the son of perdition will be revealed at the falling away first ).7. For the mystery of iniquity ( lawlessness ) doth already work ( it was already working in Paul's day ): only he ( the Holy Ghost ) who now letteth will let, until he ( the son of perdition ) be taken out of the way, or come out of the midst ( it's a corporate body of son of perdition in the temple of Christ spiritualy speaking, just as Judas iscariot was, the disciples didn't have a clue it was Judas iscariot until he betrayed Jesus Christ with a kiss, when he dip the Sop into the dish satan entered him, and history is going to repeat itself again, the sons of perdition are going to betray the brothers to death. Matt 24:9,10 ) 8. And then shall that Wicked be revealed ( in the NT, they are corporate bodies, Jesus has His body and that's the true church in means called out one's out of religious babylonian churches . Satan also has a body and it's all the children of disobedience among the people of God, the tares, and the goat's, they have a anti christ spirit ). Whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of His mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of His coming.9. Even him ( it's a corporate body of false prophets, Jesus said many false prophets not prophet but many would come in His name. Many serve a different Jesus and a different gospel) whose coming is after the working of Satan ( that's his body the sons of perdition 2Cor 11:4,13-15; Gal 1:6-9 )with all power and signs (all kinds of deceptions, and counterfeit,) and lying wonders.( Jesus saidm if it were possible the elect could be deceived )10. And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness( 1Jn 2:15-29; James 4:4 )in them ( the apostate people of God )that perish; because they received not the love of the Truth, ( the real true Gospel , they were spiritually blind to truth Isa 66:4), that they might be saved.11. And for this cause God shall send them a strong delusion, ( listen now ) that they should believe a lie ( such as a pre- rapture ) : That they all might damned who believe not the Truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness." My brothers and sisters in Christ Jesus our Lord said He would send the comforter the Holy Ghost and He would be with us and in us, and lead us into all truth. If you have the love of the truth you will not be deceived by the false prophets, and many doctrines of religion and denominations out there. CHRIST IS NOT DIVIDED INTO RELIGION OR DENOMINATIONS. Those are babylonian churches. The Mother Harlot has many daughters, and she and her daughters persecuted Jesus and the apostles and handed them over to be Roman beast of that time. Rev 17:56; Rev 18:24, Matt 23; and history repeats itself again, it's going to happen to the church the body of Christ in the tribulation, if the church believes it or not. You ain't going to fly away, or be raptured up unless you die before the tribulation. The church of Christ Jesus will prevail and come out victoriously and give her life for the Master and Saviour Jesus Christ our Lord. Rev 6:9-11; Rev 13:7; Rev 12:11; and Rev 15:2; Rev 20:4,6l
Thanks for your sound teaching, Joel! Here's an 11 year old video that's still relevant: ua-cam.com/video/4pTHgpXsQRM/v-deo.html (Imminence - Doctrine or Deception?)
A pretrib rapture is not imminent or possible.
Not one of the popular “rapture” passages reveal whether it is pretrib or post trib (John 14:1-3, 1 Cor. 15:51,52, 1 Thes. 4:15-17, 2 Thes. 2:1). But there are two passages that are strong support for the rapture/second coming as one event:
“Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you, and to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels in flaming fire.” (2 Thes. 1:6,7)
This is clearly the Lord’s second coming. But why would the saints be given “rest” at that time? Weren’t they raptured seven years earlier? Wouldn’t that be the time to give it? Why would they need it at the second coming? And if it is given at the second coming then the church will obviously go through the tribulation. All these things point to the rapture and second coming as one event. If “rest” is the rapture, it has to be post trib.
Pre trib theology claims these saints get saved after the rapture in the tribulation. So they call them “tribulation saints.” But scripture makes no distinction between saints. Either you are a saint or aint. Paul is clearly teaching the rapture and second coming are one event which will be imminent after the tribulation (Matt. 24:29-31, Luke 21:25-28).
God won't make us ever face a "Salvation on the line" test! We are saved and sealed until the Day of Redemption, which is the Pre-Tribulation Rapture! The Rapture is only for those who simply believe Jesus died for their sins and rose again. Matthew 24, Jesus was alive on the Earth teaching the Jews about the coming Kingdom where he rules as KING of Kings and LORD of Lords. Jesus wasn't addressing the blood bought Body of Christ Church in Matthew 24.
The Rapture is ESCAPE then Judgment as Days of Noah and Days of Lot. Plus God doesn't punish the righteous with the wicked. That would make the righteous equal with the wiked
^^^
Genesis 18:25 KJV That be far from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right?
4 ads in first five minutes
Revelation 3:9
“Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Iewes, and are not, but doe lie: behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feete, and to know that I haue loued thee.”
Colossians 3:11
“Where there is neither Greeke, nor Iew, circumcision, nor vncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond, nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.”
You people love this avatar with prince Harry biting a gold medal that says I AM he is your best friend (two peas in a pod)
The pre-trib rapture makes the Last Week of Daniel an indeterminable time and not 7 years... Could you imagine if the rapture occured more than 7 years ago? They'd be suspended in the air... Think about it🤔
John 21:20 Then Peter, turning about, seeth the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? 21 Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do? 22 Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me. 23 Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? 24 This is the disciple which testifieth of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his testimony is true.
Imminence was dismissed by Paul, Titus and Timothy in 2 Thessalonians 2 with the sequence of events must occur and also by Jesus in Matthew 24 when he said the ‘sign of the son of man’ must appear. The first testimony is a kingdom sequence including the rise of the Antichrist for 3.5 times (1,278 years in Daniel 7). The second is an astronomical sequence of the zodiacal ages and is usually described as the precession of the equinoxes. In the 1st century the sign of Jonah was rising (the fish / Pisces) and the next sign to rise is the sign of the son of man (the water carrier / Aquarius).
This sign does not have to fully rise in the east but begin to appear and that is now. Daniel concurs, his 1,335th day from the abomination of desolation of the Temple Mount by Antichrist Islam begins in 2024.
This was given by the Lord in 2011-2018 and is described in ‘Seven Times: Egypt to Istanbul’ published by Scope ‘n Compass.
As always, Joel splits the uprigths.
Correct - Rapture WILL BE imminent.
Incorrect - Rapture IS imminent
The Greek for “near” in Luke 21:28 is “engizo” (#1448) and means, “to bring near, to join one thing to another, to draw or come near to, to approach.”
Imminent means, “impending, overhanging, about to happen, close at hand, near.”
When Christians say, “the rapture IS imminent,” they put it in the present tense. In other words, it’s about to happen. Of course, no one knows when it is about to happen. So by saying “The rapture is imminent” all they are doing is stretching it out indefinitely, so that if it doesn’t happen today, it’s still imminent tomorrow, ad infinitum. “The rapture (redemption) WILL BE imminent” after the events of Luke 21:25-27. There is no rubber in imminency.
It got many in a mess ■ because they are still here they immediately believed the 'dirk' abomination could not happen, so they became a different 'gene'ration of humans. Post19.
Revelation 3: 10
Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth. 11Behold, I am coming quickly! Hold fast what you have, that no one may take your crown. 12He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more. I will write on him the name of My God and the name of the city of My God, the New Jerusalem, which comes down out of heaven from My God. And I will write on him My new name.
Yes. There's a condition Christ lays out for His people in order that we be protected during the time of the GT.
@Ken Klein Please re-read Rev. 3:10.
No matter the translation, it literally means: "KEPT FROM".
Christians who are "Saved" will not face God's wrath, which is the requirement for those who deny Christ.
@@kenklein9228 The Seals of Revelation 5 are the beginning of the Wrath of God.
The actual Rapture happens at Revelation 4: 1.
I Thessalonians 5: 9 NKJV
For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ.
JESUS TOOK GOD'S WRATH OF SIN ON THE CROSS! JUST-IF-I'D NEVER SINNED!
@@j.t.patton7820 "Rev. 3:10.
No matter the translation, it literally means: "KEPT FROM"."
Those words were first spoken to the Christians at Philadelphia - it was for them, and it's also for us. They weren't raptured out of their time when the world around them was tried, and we won't be either.
"Christians who are "Saved" will not face God's wrath, which is the requirement for those who deny Christ."
The GT isn't God's wrath, it's Satan's. We see this in Rev chapter 12. God's wrath is the bowls, which are described in Rev 19.
We'll be here for the GT unless we die beforehand. Time to get ready (by keeping Christ's word of patient endurance).
@@j.t.patton7820 "For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ.
JESUS TOOK GOD'S WRATH OF SIN ON THE CROSS! JUST-IF-I'D NEVER SINNED!"
Yes. See my other post.
To answer your points:
1. "Can't be imminent because it takes time to spread the Gospel" - the Bible is available in hundreds of languages, on the internet, in print across the world, and is spreading still. Yet Jesus said I am coming quickly (Rev) "to receive you unto Myself." (John14:3) It could still happen in the very near future as the Gospel continues to spread thru the world, and more disciples are made in Jesus, bringing the rapture ever closer to now.
2. "Imminency" is speaking of the present, not of the past. Jesus wasn't coming back the next day. This argument is shallow and seeks to make us, 2000 years removed, seem stupid, saying that God contradicts Himself.
3. Again the same errant argument, saying pretrib imminency was active the moment Jesus left.
4. Again, as the prophecies have been fulfilled, the rapture has become more and more ready to happen.
5. Temple was destroyed 78 AD. The Holocaust might even apply here perhaps. But even now Israel is under near constant attack from her neighbors.
6. Church has fallen away especially in Europe and America. The kowtowing to woke, progressive, Marxist, secular, humanist, racist liberalism by the church is definently a falling away of the Church. (The Methodist split is another example.) Also, Satan has had AntiChrists ready throughout history, because he doesn't know when the Rapture will happen either. Neither does Jesus, only the Father.
7. Those points Speak of the Return and reign of Christ, not Rapture.
Imminent vs urgency- just splitting hairs on a flawed premise. The birthpangs have been happening: world wars, holocaust, pandemics, persecution of the Church.
Paul's urgency - that was 2000 years ago. Time has passed since then, like approaching the light at the end of the tunnel. It was far then, it is at our doorstep now. Or a 6 year old eager to learn to drive, compared to a 16 year old ready to take the keys in his hand and drive. The imminency is at the completion of all things.
This argument is a big nothing-burger trying to make such a small distinction based on a flawed perception of pretrib folks. Of course the rapture wasn't imminent 2000 years ago, but it has become more and more so to the present day. The time is at hand, and you pretty much made that point while trying to deny it with semantics. Imminent rapture is not a heresy- it's an application of the Scriptures.
Those that would not receive the 'dirk' ■ testify that they are made in the image of God have futhered the Gospel to the ends of the earth. Most know of someone that did not consent. What was meant for death, those that trusted God were the light in truth. This division is amazingly clear, through luciferase or MAC bluetooth addresses.
If something must happen before the rapture, then it is not imminent. The parables teach imminency. Their theme is about being caught off guard because the people weren't ready. Pre trib requires that you be ready at ALL times, just as Jesus taught.
Mat 24:44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.
In the parable of the Wheat & Tares in Matt. 24-30 Jesus says they must grow together until the Harvest. Jesus explained this parable in verses 36-43. Harvest is at the End of the World. See verses 39,40 & 49 of Matt. 13.
@@nickstaxfree9604 The point of the parable is that God will do the harvesting, and not men. There are two phases to this endeavor. First is the Rapture before the tribulation, Rev 3:10, 1 Thes 1:10. And then the completion of the harvest at the end of the age.The contrast between these two gatherings couldn't be more stark. The first phase will occur as the angels said it would: Act 1:9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. Act 1:11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. This is the coming Jesus mentions in John:Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also. This event is imminent and requires nothing to happen before it. The harvest at the end of the tribulation is described quite differently:2Th 1:7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
2Th 1:8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Why are they so different? Because they are two separate events. The Rapture with Jesus in the clouds, 1 Thes 4:17, followed 7 years later at the end of the age harvest, with Jesus in flaming fire with his mighty angles and vengence. In vain will you search for a translating the living into glorified bodies, the Rapture, at the end of the tribulation.
@@nickstaxfree9604 Precisely. Sadly, Dispensors are teaching otherwise.
They said that Peter and Paul taught the imminent coming of the Lord lol. Both said good bye knowing they were going to die and what manner of death they would have to face. Everyone with them both were heart broken at their imminent demise. It’s ridiculous to use them as the example, the lie of Jesus any moment return. But they’re not critical thinkers and believe no one else is either.
Revelation is a book of symbols, not to be taken literally but in its spiritual meanings.
Even his vision of Christ appears in symbolic form with a double-edged sword coming out of his mouth, and John is told to record what will be signified or shown by signs regarding those things which already are or will very soon take place.
The battle of Armageddon is being fought right now as we can see the forces of evil attacking all around us.
It is not speaking of a literal war fought with horses with blood flowing up to the horses' harnesses.
Neither is the mark of the beast or the 1000-year reign or any of those numbers literal, like the 144,000. These are all symbolic representations with spiritual meaning, many already having been fulfilled, just as John says in his introduction.
Christ's kingdom is a present reality right here and now, as we reign with him victoriously over the power of sin and Satan. It is a kingdom not of this world, just as Jesus said to Pilate.
When Jesus returns, it will be to raise all the dead who have ever lived and to judge in the final judgment after the dead are raised. At his coming, the salvation Jesus will bring to his own redeemed and faithful people will be revealed.
Jesus said that both the wicked and the righteous will live together until the end of the world (Matthew 13), when the angels will come to remove first the wicked from among the righteous, not the other way around as the rapture fiction pretends. Only after the judgment following the resurrection are the believers taken up to be forever more with the Lord in the Father's Kingdom.
The so-called "Rapture" was never part of historical Christianity until the 19th century and especially the 20th century when it was popularized by the fictional writings of Tim LeHaye's Left Behind series, nonsensical writing which contradicts the very words of Jesus as noted above.
Of course, Revelation is a work of spiritual significance expressed and depicted through symbols, which symbolism is explained in the writings of the apostles, such as the meaning of the "first resurrection" (the new birth as mentioned in Ephesians and many other places), the ruling with Christ in this present world as a royal priesthood of believers reigning victoriously over sin and Satan, to which John himself refers in his opening verses of Revelation, also mentioned by Peter and Paul. The Holy Spirit and the words of Christ and his apostles give understanding to those whose eyes are not blinded by loyalty to denominational doctrines and human teachings rather than to the pure word of God read without being viewed through a lens of denominational overlay.
God told Abraham that his descendants would be as numerous as the stars in the sky and the sands of the sea. With the naked eye under the best of visual conditions and circumstances, only a few thousand stars can be seen, but we know now that the universe contains more stars than there are grains of sand on all the beaches and deserts of the planet. It would be foolish to give a literal interpretation to everything we see in Scripture. "The cattle on a thousand hills are the Lord's" is just a figurative expression, just as the 6/7 "days" of creation are metaphorical, expressed in terms that people of those ancient times could relate to, and not of course literal 24-hour days.
In Revelation, the description of a city in a perfect cube with each side 1500 miles long, a city 1500 miles high, is not a literal description but a symbolic one of the perfection of God's redeemed Church, his Bride dressed in his perfect righteousness.
We must be wise in our understanding, not led about by every wind of false doctrine and teaching of man. The Pharisees were wrong because they expected an earthly future literal and worldly Kingdom of the Messiah on this Earth, which is very much like what the millennialists teach today. Jesus told Pilate that his kingdom is not of this world--but rather a spiritual Kingdom right here and now in the hearts of all those in whom God's will is done during this present gospel age, the "thousand years" simply expressing the fullness of time in God's plan which is not entirely revealed to us. Revelation also mentions the seven spirits of God, which again we realize and recognize is not a literal depiction but symbolism of God's perfection.
Some Pharisees asked Jesus when the Kingdom of God would come. His answer was, “The Kingdom of God does not come in such a way as to be seen. No one will say, ‘Look, here it is!’ or, ‘There it is!’-- because the Kingdom of God is within you.”
(Luke 17:20-21)
In an epistle Paul plainly states that when Jesus returns, he will deliver up his kingdom, this spiritual Kingdom in which we reign with him right here and now, at his coming to the Father, and that we shall reign in heaven eternally with him there, not in literal Israel. The New Testament plainly teaches that the true Zion / Israel and chosen people of God is not literal Jewry but the spiritual children of Abraham who compose God's Church of all the redeemed. God's focus is not on some literal real estate in the Middle East or on its population but rather he is focused on that most valuable of all real estate: the hearts of all mankind who are called to repentance and continuing obedient faith in his Son, turning from sin to God. While others dream and fantasize of a millennial age to come, He's reigning in our hearts today!
The REAL "Replacement Theology":
Replace resurrection WITH RAPTURE
Replace one second coming WITH TWO
Replace one plan of redemption WITH TWO
Replace living, spiritual temple WITH PHYSICAL
Replace current reign of Christ in spiritual Zion, God's church, WITH KING-ON-HOLD
Replace centrality of Jesus Christ WITH CENTRALITY OF 'ISRAEL'
DISPENSATIONALISM IS THE REAL REPLACEMENT THEOLOGY!
It is the Bible which is "Left Behind"!
Everything that is said in the gospels and epistles about the second coming of Christ has to be considered in its totality, and the pieces fit together perfectly like a puzzle.
Jesus returns suddenly on the "last day" (as he says three times in John 6), the "day" of resurrection and final judgment. With him he will bring the souls of all those who have been in paradise. The time of his coming is not known; we will not have a thousand and seven years of advance notice. It could be today. Of course, since the world is round, that would be at all hours of the clock including night time depending on where one lives. But everyone on Earth will see him, including all mankind from all previous centuries and ages. In a twinkling of an eye all humanity who have ever lived are exposed before him as the entire material, physical, and molecular universe in this dimension of time, space, and matter which we now inhabit is dissolved instantaneously in fiery conflagration, passing away with a mighty roar. The Earth and starry heavens exist no more.
The overwhelming power and glory of the Son of God is on display as he reveals the final salvation of his people. The angels remove the wicked first from among the righteous and then all mankind are judged, whether good or evil.
The wicked are taken to their eternal punishment, and the righteous in Christ are taken with him as Jesus Christ delivers up his kingdom to the Father, in which we shall reign together with him forever.
There will be degrees of eternal shame, disgrace, and bitterness of regretful sorrow and punishment in hell, and there will be degrees of glory and reward in heaven.
God will do all things justly. There will be provision made for those who are classified as innocents, such as those who, although possessing souls, did not as infants or otherwise possess ability to make moral decisions resulting in spiritual death from sin, but the Bible does not give us any details about this; it is to be inferred.
Heaven will be not at all what people imagine but far more wonderful. We will have spiritual bodies and will not appear as we do in this life but will bear the image of the glorious Son of God as he is now, not as he appeared in human form as he ascended from the Mount of Olives.
As Jesus said, "The one who endures to the end will be saved.... Be faithful unto death, and I will give you the crown of Life."
This is are tribulation and trial.
Revelation 1314And he deceives [f]those who dwell on the earth by those signs which he was granted to do in the sight of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who was wounded by the sword and lived. 15He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed. 16He causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hand or on their foreheads, 17and that no one may buy or sell except one who has [g]the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
We can't buy or sell for 45 day's
Another thing that must happen before Jesus return is the 10 tribes of Israel have to be found.
Pre-trib is based on INFERENCE? It takes an awful big nerve to have a private interpretation of Scripture. To make up something that isn't there to support pre-trib. It goes along the lines of the serpent convincing Eve if she ate the fruit she wouldn't die. NO! INstead you'll be like God!
??
@@kenklein9228 I don't see pre-trib in Scriptures
@@michellebehr7669 Agreed. I misread your comment!
@@michellebehr7669 It's Dispensationalism that prompts Christians to believe in that bullpuckey.
@@kenklein9228 It's sad
Immanency is a matter of perception. ever hear of 1000 years is a day to the LORD? THE 70 Weeks of Daniel?
This is an excellent passage, but pre-tribbers can easily claim that “at the last day” means the day of the rapture and/or the period known as the last days (they just missed the “S” when they translated it). As you can tell, I don’t buy that for a second.
I was taught all three approaches, but ■ Revelation 19 and 20 has stood the test. We know this is the end of the age. Like measuring a garment, even an allowance for later growth, the pattern is set before the cloth is cut. Once cut it is shaped; it is best modeled with a flare of room. It would be silly trying to cover with the garment not in tact; but it will be glorious in the freedom of comfort. Faith is the reward of Trust.
Imminency is defined as nothing has to happen before the event takes place. I am a firm believer in that, I am sorry. I am surprised that you believe in a rapture at all!
Paul literally says the rapture requires 2 events to occur first.
The rapture will happen when the lord say so nobody knows my man .
THE WORD RAPTURE ITSELF IS UNBIBLICAL
For the life of me I just cant understand how pre-trib gets around 2 Thessalonians 2:1-4 . It is so plainly spelled out. The way I read it Paul says the day of the Lord and the rapture is the same day. "That Day Shall not come" Why is it Americans think that we are above suffering for our Lord? A servant is not above his master and if our master suffered we will also suffer. Paul said we press in with much suffering. Lord Yeshua give us grace that we may say "Though you slay me I will trust you"
Because some fellowships only read ■ one verse a week.
Yes - but the satanic pastors are now preaching that verse 3 falling away, apostasy, rebellion - is falling away as snatched away.
They have twisted it to say the antichrist won’t be revealed until the rapture comes first.
Refer to J.D Farag, Jack Hobbs, Amir etc they are all teaching it.
@@MorrisonJames
Yeah I've heard that its a bit ridiculous to to say the rapture wont happen until the raptures happens ? Doesn't even make sense. they are Desperate to ignore the meaning of the verse .
The biggest joke from all pre tribulation rapturians is they say ‘oh, the great tribulation is ONLY for the Jews’ or they always separate the church from the Jewish/Gentile saints.
Then they turn around and love to reference the JEWISH wedding as the shadow for the rapture of the non Jewish Church.
Thank you once again for your excellent teaching. My minister is not a pre-tribber, and I'm happy about that. I have learned so much more from you guys though. He won't discuss prophecy.
Joel- Thanks for bringing sanity to this topic.
Pray for me that I can get off medications that I feel convicted for using. I feel trapped and want to be pure and clean before He comes.
🙏 Hope & pray for God's strength to help you.
stop the adderall. In Jesus' name.
If you’re hooked on narcotic painkillers I highly suggest you sign up for a “medically assisted treatment” (mat)..and they’ll switch you to ‘buphernorphine’..that is if you are only!! God Bless!!🙏
I pray for you and all those like you who are being convicted to get off meds or overcome addictions. May you receive His healing in your body, soul, and spirit and your desire to be pure and clean be blessed.
Are these medications for a physical condition? If so, you must not just stop taking them. Discuss this with your medical provider.