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China has a region that specialises in making Bosch etc. to German standards, but the issue lies with the importers (I used to work for one) - they buy as low as possible then mark it up 5-10x. $1 more to the manufacturer would get quality, but no, the importer wants that last dollar to themselves, despite making obscene markeups.
This made me think long and hard (like the S-LONG) about charging batteries on the houseboat I live on. Thanks for this John. I;ll change the way I charge these in the future.
I have a very good friend who a battery expert of sorts. He's a solar specialist and has been putting in off grid systems for about 28 years now. I do quite like his standard reply in various off grid forums and groups, when people show their home made battery systems, and ask "what else do you think I need?". His standard reply is "a fire extinguisher".
Its really worth consulting a specialist as well, people might have a 'good idea' to go about making a battery power supply and there's a lot of ways of doing it. But there's a lot of things involved in them when it comes to their charge/discharge cycles and a couple of the particular bits of electronics to regulate, convert power for 240V- chances are if you go over your plan with them, they'll probably find something you've missed. Plus anything you're wiring up to your house like this is going to need to be certified by a qualified electrician, for years I had these things in the workplace either in server rooms, remote sites and building backups. They are some really serious shit that can deliver massive amounts of amps, they do require maintenance and aren't something you can just plug in an forget about. I remember going over one of the UPS systems in a building which I worked at that had a big set up + V8 diesel genset and I figured at peak draw it was probably capable of delivering 4000A (for a long time!) and that's about enough to turn something like an I-beam into molten metal 'scary fast'
I have seen an off-grid solar system where the owner was using expired Telephone Repeater Backup Batteries which still test good when replaced. The worst thing would be a fire extinguisher whereas the most critical thing needed was Ventilation. Lots and Lots of Ventilation. The problem is they were all lead acid batteries and produced Hydrogen gas when charging. Hydrogen Fires must almost never be 'put out'. A Hydrogen fire that is extinguished is an explosion that is about to happen in the immediate future. So, in this particular case Ventilation wins out.
It's interesting that Milwaukee and Ryobi differ with the tick when they are both owned by the same parent company. What you say about the chargers being the correct one is a very good point also. With the Makita 40v max platform I use, the chargers have fans in them. The knock off, no fan. With how toasty they get I wouldn't risk the knock off.
200 Billion Kilometres, Thirty return trips to Pluto, but, for Aussies, how many Olympic Swimming Pools is that ? And for Americans, how many football fields is that ? Your measurements don’t make any sense, John.
Thank you for raising this very important topic and providing advice on how to better treat such batteries. I’ve been very concerned about the best location to charge and store my batteries following your recent related videos.
Thanks John well said. It should be repeated as often as possible please. The AUSNZ triangle circle tick symbol is definitely self certification and is used to certify that any electrical work is safe to use even changing a lamp or fuse. I think the issue is that misusing the symbol means the supplier can be in deep shit with the compliance body standing on their head making sure they drown if there is ever any problem with the product or the installation. So obviously there is a reluctance to use it unless the supplier or installer is really really confident
Just checked my batteries for the cordless tools. Milwaukee as stated, no compliance. Aldi cordless tool batteries have the Aussie compliance tick and another compliance abbreviation I don’t recognise.
As Colin says, the RCM tick-in-a-circle-in-a-triangle is self-certifying and should indicate the product meets safety and EMC interference requirements. Australia does not have RoHS, but most regions now seem to request e-waste is sent to directed disposal centres rather than dumped in the garbage. The European CE logo (and the UKCA logo, at least until the UK gets it's legislation clean-out done post-Brexit) also are self-certifying for safety, EMC interference and RoHS. The German GS or TÜV logos would indicate certification by a recognised lab. The US FCC logo is not safety but EMC interference only. The safety logo will be the symbol of the certifying lab (UL, CSA, or others) with an adjacent 'US' and/or 'C' (Canada) to show where the test is valid. Strangely, from my understanding, the US safety requirements seem to be driven by OHSA requirements rather than protecting retail customers. The other safety-related symbol that you may see is the Indian BIS 'twisted rope' logo. Most of the other logos shall only be for EMC interference aspects in other countries. In the end, the reputation of the company is probably the best indicator of how trustworthy the device is. A brand name with CE, UL, CSA, GS or TÜV would likely be okay (for ANZ's RCM, there are some additional tests such as for protecting coin cells from kids and devices from lightning surges) whereas mail-order direct from China may be well short of the claims on the device or packaging. Big Clive's YT channel demonstrates numerous bad examples. My biggest fear is Chinese e-scooters and e-bikes with suspect design and BIG batteries!
@teeanahera8949 No compliance symbol on the battery but there IS a compliance symbol on the charger. The battery has an ANZ Ser Nr, so I wonder if that might mean it is even more compliant with perhaps passing a tested certification?
John this is NOT a criticism of your content, which is brilliant! At 28:20 that EU CE mark that you have shown is the Knock off one. The middle bar of the 'E' is shorter than the radius on the top and bottom. Easy reference to en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking. It's so easy to get duped! Keep up the content.
Strip chargers, dude. Milwaukee and DeWalt at least do them which allows charging of up to six or eight batteries at a time. Not sure whether or not they charge them simultaneously or not though, but someone who owns one might comment regarding that bit. I know Milwaukee’s 12v/18v combined chargers normally charge the 18v first before switching over. I’ve got two DeWalt single battery chargers (only need the two since the beauty of them is they can charge from 10.8v all the way up to 18v as the battery design is the same no matter the voltage, so you could get away with one charger for all your DeWalt tools if you went that way and didn’t need more than one battery charged at a time.
The European voltage standard was increased from 220Vac to 230V around 1999. America matched half this from 110V up to 115V. Australia Pacific and UK reduced from 240V to 230V. Tolerance for cables, powerboards and appliances is -5/+10%. This allows a working range of 218.5-253V. The problem is imported products continue to be made for the old 220V standard and still get the CE tick. Close enough right? Well, -5/+10% of 220V is now 209-242V. Anyone less than half the distance between a substation and the end of the line is getting more than 242V, causing vibration, EMF and potential fire risk from the excess heat. Excess voltage also drastically reduces the life of appliances.
The CEO of a lithium mining company recently gave a speech and said that even with the new mines planned to start operation in the future they won't be able to produce enough lithium to meet even 50% of the expected demand !
@27:38. The FCC logo is *NOT* the same thing at all! That means the product passed US electromagnetic compatibility, not safety! US safety is usually a UL mark (Underwriters Laboratories) with CSA being the Canadian counterpart to that.
We had a while batch of Dell laptops that had batteries swelling so much that the touchpad was getting lifted off the case. Seemed humorous at first but once we realised what's going on the service guy attended at first priority to replace them. They were funny shaped, like overweight, moulding into the shape of the laptop internals. Scary stuff.
This is one of John’s best! He answered several questions I had about these batteries. Everyone who uses this technology should watch and pay attention. Sincere thanks from USA!
Talking about new fuel technologies and new energy storage systems, please check the amazing Plasma Kinetics. It was banned tech in the USA in 2008 labelled as a disruptive technology. In 2017, they were reinstated and now they are coming out with all guns blazing. If it takes off the way it should, that will be the end of EV’s as we know it. If they can get the key players on board and get the supply chain right, this could be the game changer.
Mechatronics Engineer here, before the term really existed (1986 grad, ex-UK, now living in B.Mtns) . Suffice to say all our power tool batteries are only charged when cool and stored in the garage beer fridge set at about 8C - wife is Welsh so prefers warmer beer... It's still interesting that a few brands fare better than other. E.g. I've never had a DeWalt battery fail, and some go back to 2014 and still work well with high drain devices like angle grinders etc. Ryobi? Not so good. Have now got an eBay DeWalt to Ryobi battery converter which works perfectly but you need to make sure you stop using it the moment it starts slowing down as the DeWalt battery does not have the same BMS/Protection system as Ryobi, it's in the tool instead. Works great if you understand that. John - love your overall video content. You're a brave man putting it out there, particularly in Aus...
Interesting, I've got my Ryobi fan on the desk here running on a 2015 week 42 1.3 A/h Ryobi battery - bottom of the bucket model that's had a hard life - it'll still run the fan all day - but I have a 2017 1.5 a/h higher end one (with the built in power gauge) that only lasted 3 years or so before the charge capacity started dropping off noticeably. Never had any issues with the larger batteries - have 2 very old 4 A/h and two much newer 5 A/h and they are all still great. Maybe it's just down to insufficient QC?
Is the tick like the Heart Foundation where you can sell candy bar full of sugar and fat and as long as you pay enough money to the foundation get to put the tick on the product? Plus Chinese imports can have anything on them if they can market a 42V battery which is only 24V or 1000AH mobile phone battery, or back in the 2000s a 256MB USB stick which could write for infinity but only show 32MB.
The real risk is with the lightweight chargers from China which use a capacitor dropper and a diode with very often nothing more inside, then the manufacturers cheat even more by not using a Y class capacitor which is designed to fail open circuit, they just put in whatever they can get the cheapest and when that fails they can fail short circuit so now you have full mains voltage going into the battery which most likely has no over volt protection either.
Pretty sure the C-tick compliance logo is only for EMC compatibility, that is, it will not cause radio interference, not for fire or electrical safety.
In the USA, FCC is the Federal Communications Commission and has to do with the radio frequency (RF) emissions or reception of a device. Almost all of the devices that use rechargeable batteries use switching or digital regulation to control the power delivery to the device and switching supplies for the battery charger. These type of supplies can create radio frequency noise that can interfere with licensed communication devices.
I have my Gopro on the windscreen behind the rear view mirror. I have trashed a few batteries, I think because the batteries get cooked. I now keep the Gopro hidden until I need it.
@@craigo7235 in the old days I used to have a TomTom plugged in and attached to the windscreen as you normally would, and that used to get awfully hot. Luckily it survived 😅
Hahah… beer, forget. I went downstairs to check I hadn’t left old school charger on car battery. Good point about damaged ones….. not worth the she’ll be right motto. Just buy another and move on to avoid the paperwork.
Re damage to batteries, there is a report via Reuters that insurance companies are writing off EVs over just scratched batteries after minor accidents. There is apparently, at present, no information on repairability and the battery manufacturers will not supply it. The insurance companies refuse to take on the risk of later failure.
Hey John, During the hotter months, I tend to put my depleted (Ryobi 18v and 36v) batteries in front of the garage fan to cool down before whacking on the charger. A few tradie mates I have talked with actually put their batteries in the camp fridges in their 4x4 masterbation chariots to cool down for a few minutes if they've been run hard. They've all experienced a battery fire because of whacking directly on charge after use, when hot. It's been a case of learn from the mistakes of others, in my case. Lesson well learned, I reckon.
The RCM is a symbol that represents compliance with the Electrical Equipment Safety System. By 2019 an Inter-Governmental Agreement (IGA) on governance of the Electrical Equipment Safety System (EESS) has been signed by Queensland, Victoria, Western Australia and Tasmania. Other jurisdictions are currently progressing or considering implementation of the EESS. The EESS moved from oversight by the Electrical Regulatory Authorities Council (ERAC) to being governed by a Ministerial Oversight Committee (MOC) who appoint a representative on the Standing Committee of Officials (SCO).
Two points: Firstly, the road toll, is too high. But some of us remember the early 70's and before. Secondly, as a person who works in an operating theatre, I always ask my patients who have power tool injuries, "was it the first cut or the last?" Distraction "What am I doing next?" Is the big danger in my opinion.
I bought 2 after market makita battery's, they had no text on them at all were apparently 6 amp hours but lasted less than my genuine 3 amp batterys. Also after around 20 charges the batteries refused to charge and the charger came up with the broken battery symbol. Honestly not worth the money, buy genuine.
My workplace was using HP laptops, and the battery started expanding gradually until one day the back cover popped off. Same happened to my coworker a short time later. IT support replaced them of course (I read that there were multiple recalls for that laptop).
One thing I see in my industry is trades buying cheap aftermarket batteries sold on ebay as an example "for Milwaukee ", this worries me as there may not be built in battery protection with these.
I put unattended lithium battery chargers on a mains supply plug-in countdown timer set to 2 hours - they're about $10 from Bunnings. And I often charge my phone beside the pillow on the bed - but on a very low output charger, so instead of charging in 1 hour it takes 4, thus minimising any heat. It's better for the battery too. Edit: Sorry to hear you're thinking of sidelining your Schlong.
It does have to be a fairly particular concentration of fuel vapour but, personally, I really wouldn't risk it, not that I'm silly enough to have ever smoked anyway.
@@TonyRule "The experiments conducted for this study consisted of 70 distinct tests involving a total of 723 cigarettes and over 4,500 instances of exposure of a lit cigarette to ignitable concentrations of gasoline vapor in air. There were no instances of the ignition of gasoline vapors from the exposure of those vapors to a lit tobacco cigarette during any of the experiments."
@@TonyRule yes, vacuum was used to simulate a draw. It's actually fascinating that it didn't work, however lighting a cigarette near fuel is a different story.
What do the Milwaukee batteries say about compliance? Do they say anything useful? UL or anything? I’ve always had questions about compliance in various regions. Are some stricter than others? I see lots of things here in the USA with CE, but not UL. I’d prefer UL, but most Chinese products claim CE. Is that true, who knows? But I don’t see them being held accountable for claiming that here, if not real, but I can see them being held accountable if they claim UL, but aren’t. So that could be why.
The next burning (!) questions ought to be (1) are LiFePO4 batteries really safe on the road to DPC creek with all the corrugations and high temperatures (2) should we be opening them up to improve the vibration resistance of the BMS wires etc with silicon rubber to improve fatigue risk and (3) what if any risk reduction benefit do we gain by persevering with AGM lead acid batteries at the expense of weight and inferior cycle life.
Your comments about battery standards made me have a look at my DeWalt batteries and they have the tick on them. Must be why they’re so much more expensive than Milwaukee equivalents. From personal experience though, many modern phones have fail safe devices that automatically shut them down when they overheat. Something which iPhones have had it since at lease iPhone 4 and it seems like Galaxies have had it since the beginning except for the Note 10 hand grenade. Would’ve thought cooking fans that run while charging EVs to help dissipate heat would’ve been the standard for all large battery packs to increase lifecycle and reduce the likelihood off self combustion.
I pretty much always agree with this guy... But I also pretty much always smoke when I'm refueling stuff. Maybe it'll git me one day but it's been a few decades. 🤠Yeehaw up dingo piss creek we go.
Another great video, thanks. Like you I put my chargers in a central location where they can’t be covered by anything. A trick I also do is to use a heavy duty power-strip plugged into an automatic timer set to turn on midnight to 4am so there is no chance of overcharging even if you don’t use the batteries for days at a time. I use the same setup for my phone, iPad, headphones, etc. in the house. Makes me feel safer. Keep up the great information and see in the next one. 😊😊
John, great lecture. You mentioning the 1kWm-2 insolation figure just made me think you're the Dr Karl of the automotive engineering world. Keep it up!
The main principle that I see for this risk. The main principle at play here is similar to BMI, the ability to disperse heat is proportionally to the surface area and the potential to overheat is proportional to the mass. So the bigger the battery pack, the harder it is to cool and thus a batter with 1000 times the capacity with only 100 times the surface area probably needs active cooling.
You're missing a point: Batteries are in near everything. People charge their smartphones on their nightstands. They leave their crap on hot dashboards. Etc.pp. Sooner or later you will burn the house down.
Come on Johnno, how are you going to see if the chainsaw tank is full without having a lit cigarette near the filler cap??? You could use an electric torch or something, but that is all so mundane and boring! :-)
I only charge tool batteries in my barn, and only when I am present. When the batteries are charged, I remove from the chargers and turn the charger off. I have a glass table near my bed for my phones, which I charge while reading before going to sleep. Then I unplug the phones from the chargers.
Plenty of cheap compatible power tools from China that use regular big brand batteries. I have to say some of them are better than the tools from some original manufacturers. Of course some are worst.
Awesome episode. Word of Darwinian Warning. I recently put my Samsung S22Ultra Bucks phone in a waterproof/ floatation pouch after another mate dispatched his to Davy Jones' locker. I also left it on the car dash while retrieving the boat. Thankfully, the phone's safety switch kicked in or I could had a dark tinge to the hilux.
Wow. Food for thought. A redesign of homes is needed due to EVs and power tools on home garages usually attached to, you guessed it, homes. Should fire sprinkler systems in garages be mandatory in new homes?
It horrifies me that so many people actually park their cars IN their houses these days, with no fire barrier between the "garage" and the rest of the house.
29:58 Some things you don't think of in the shed is hydrochloric acid. I put the fuel tanks and gas cylinders away but then I saw the hydrochloric acid and thought yep that will go up. If there is sparks get it all away. Those lithium batteries are little fuel tanks treat them the same. Hydrochloric acid is the best rust remover just play it safe.
IMO every lithium power tool charging dock/station should be fan assisted just like the Makita batteries which do dissipate quite a bit of heat from the battery + charger whilst its charging which IMO makes charging them just that little bit safer. Something I do with Lithium batteries which are not fan assisted during charging is to charge them in 2 stages, as I never let them usually get under 25% capacity I charge them firstly to around 60% take them off the charger let them cool down for around 30-40 minutes, before charging again to usually around 85-90% total state of charge.
Hi John. Thank you for the video. I just checked my 3 5Ah 18v and 1 12v Milwaukee batteries and they do have the tick. Interestingly, I recently purchased a Digitech 5W handheld UHF transceiver and while the actual device has the tick the battery and charger do not. I might make a complaint to RTM/Jaycar about this. I also made my grandson watch the personal device section as he has an abhorrent habit of watching his devices in bed. Obviously we can't watch him all the time and can only discipline him when we catch him in the act. Hopefully he can see the sense of not using devices in bed as he puts all of us at risk.
If you don't need the tool battery recharged immediately, a 24hr/ 7day timer connected to the charger will get it topped up some time after it has cooled down from all that driveway blowing - it will be topped off for the next weekend's bout of home handyman/lady/person. My (LiPo, unregulated cells) RC battery charging station is in an old "slow combustion fireplace" in the shed (palletised for ease of movement) - complete with flue pointing at the non flammable shed roof (with a rudimentary spark catcher atop. Other drone batteries get charged at their station sitting on the top of a machinists toolbox - 1/4 inch thick steel -- not going anywhere soon all half tonne of it - constantly observed of course, as per the book (we add the monitored charging as a billable item -overtime - jk).
Engineering out d!ckhe@ds is a spectacular challenge if your objective is to do it with one hundred percent efficiency, cause it will never happen because the world does a spectacular job of engineering an even better d!ckhe@d. D!ckhe@d labs run 24/7 according to a highly precise R&D regime to design, engineer, and build the very finest candidates for the very latest and highly renowned Darwin award.
Excellent overview, John. This is one reason why I keep several batteries on hand: besides having at least five tools (Milwaukee in my case) using the same battery, the temptation to stick a warm-ish battery right into a charger is minimized. And, like the song goes, keep all of this in a cool, dry place
I'm not certain that the tick known as the RCM (regulatory compliance mark) is designed to reflect the fire safety of the batteries. I know it covers some of the electrical safety aspects to do with isolation from mains. It's also used in telecommunications and also to show that devices comply with EME. However my feeling is it is not a broad identification of safety. Much like ANCAP is not a measure of fire safety for vehicles. I think fire rescue NSW are thinking that most rubbish gear won't have gone to the effort to get RCM compliance. It is for the reasons I said above that I don't think a RCM is required on a battery but nothing stops a market from placing the RCM on a battery. I could be wrong but that's what I have picked up from playing around the edges with this kind of compliance. Regardless everything in the video is sensible and exercise caution with these batteries RCM or not.
On the driving and walking and phones topic. I walk to work, but my usual walking path was undergoing some upgrades last year, meaning I had to walk beside a busy road for about a mile. On the way home it would be oncoming traffic and I'd get to see the whites of the drivers' eyes (or not) because you could count every 10th driver would have their head or eyes down. I'm assuming it was phones, but after that experience I found myself surprised there's not more prangs.
Fun with batteries! I had to have a giggle because it reminded me of an incident I had when we were building a house and NiCad batteries were prevalent, so you can guess how long ago, it's before LiPO4 battery powered tools were readily available. Most of our big tools were 240V, but I had a couple of battery powered ones. I had just finished for the day and removed the batteries from the small drill I had been using and placed the cylindrical batteries into my pants pocket, forgetting about the Tek screws that I had in the same pocket. The burning sensation on my thigh was the first indicator that something was horribly wrong. I had placed them contacts down and yes the Tek screws had completed the circuit across the terminals. Even when the batteries where quite discharged there was sufficient charge left to create a lot of heat. Vision of grown man hopping around with smoke coming out of pants pocket!
Been using NiCd , Nimh , Lion and Lipo batts since the 1990's and in high and low power devices. Never had an issue apart from seeing the common bulging of poor quality pouch cells which seem to have issues with gas diffusion. Even with these batteries being stuffed , never seen a fire even with randomly purchased Chinese made switch mode power chargers. To be honestly I have seen more issues with leaky alkaline or lead acid batteries.
EGO power tools: could I humbly give a shout out to this company regarding good engineering … Ego seems to have a good focus on battery cooling, in terms of both charging and in use, along with built-in protection. Unlike tool manufacturers who routinely place their tool batteries into very high discharge lawnmowers/leaf blowers etc, Ego has specifically designed the batteries for this purpose, rather than for example placing two sealed 18v batteries into a lawnmower. Ego battery chargers also flow a high volume of air through their batteries while charging and will pre-cool the battery if required before charging. In my very humble experience I have 2 Ego batteries that have lasted 5 years, with a minimum loss in runtime … it will be interesting to see how the traditional tool batteries last in the hot and high discharge environment of a lawn mower.
Great vid Mr C. This is not just relevant to Australia but throughout the World. At the beginning of the vid you said about having a smoke when filling your lawnmower. Isn't there something called the Darwin Awards? That's got nothing to do with the Northern Territories. All the best....
Engineering out the Dickhead? John - thats a T-shirt for sure. I once knew a fella, when checking his battery fluiid and couldn't see the liquid, lit his cigarette lighter to take a clearer view. boom - fortunately he wasn't alone, on the front lawn and by the tap beneath which he was duly held. Oh, he's dead now so I guess it doesn't really matter. John - the whole battery thing is just SO misunderstood - great presentation.
As I started watching this, it reminded me to go to my garage and turn off the Milwaukee battery charger. Interestingly, Tesla states in their user manual to keep the cars on charge when not on use. When I clarified this with Tesla, this is only applicable to low amperage chargers, 10-15 amp.
What about LiPo batteries used in RC cars and planes? They can be touchy. They have to be charged and discharged with their cells in balance or they can catch fire. Let alone if you stack your RC car or plane and the battery gets punctured, they become a smoke machine and then a flamethrower!
Interesting and good stuff John. I have 18 Milwaukee batteries, both M12 and M18, and ALL of them have the tick symbol. Maybe yours pre-date that requirement?
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I've bot nord it's Sodium Ion Batteries 🔋 I want to know about
I'm hanging out for that bin cam every time you throw something over there 😂
I Second the Motion…
@@dougstubbs9637 Thirds!
China has a region that specialises in making Bosch etc. to German standards, but the issue lies with the importers (I used to work for one) - they buy as low as possible then mark it up 5-10x. $1 more to the manufacturer would get quality, but no, the importer wants that last dollar to themselves, despite making obscene markeups.
This made me think long and hard (like the S-LONG) about charging batteries on the houseboat I live on. Thanks for this John. I;ll change the way I charge these in the future.
I have a very good friend who a battery expert of sorts. He's a solar specialist and has been putting in off grid systems for about 28 years now. I do quite like his standard reply in various off grid forums and groups, when people show their home made battery systems, and ask "what else do you think I need?".
His standard reply is "a fire extinguisher".
Perfect response. Also true.
Its really worth consulting a specialist as well, people might have a 'good idea' to go about making a battery power supply and there's a lot of ways of doing it.
But there's a lot of things involved in them when it comes to their charge/discharge cycles and a couple of the particular bits of electronics to regulate, convert power for 240V- chances are if you go over your plan with them, they'll probably find something you've missed. Plus anything you're wiring up to your house like this is going to need to be certified by a qualified electrician, for years I had these things in the workplace either in server rooms, remote sites and building backups.
They are some really serious shit that can deliver massive amounts of amps, they do require maintenance and aren't something you can just plug in an forget about. I remember going over one of the UPS systems in a building which I worked at that had a big set up + V8 diesel genset and I figured at peak draw it was probably capable of delivering 4000A (for a long time!) and that's about enough to turn something like an I-beam into molten metal 'scary fast'
A CO2 fire suppression system might be more effective.
I have seen an off-grid solar system where the owner was using expired Telephone Repeater Backup Batteries which still test good when replaced.
The worst thing would be a fire extinguisher whereas the most critical thing needed was Ventilation. Lots and Lots of Ventilation.
The problem is they were all lead acid batteries and produced Hydrogen gas when charging. Hydrogen Fires must almost never be 'put out'.
A Hydrogen fire that is extinguished is an explosion that is about to happen in the immediate future. So, in this particular case Ventilation wins out.
@@phprofYT : or a masonry bunker - vital for many DIYers, from battery tinkerers to nuclear enthusiasts.
It's interesting that Milwaukee and Ryobi differ with the tick when they are both owned by the same parent company.
What you say about the chargers being the correct one is a very good point also. With the Makita 40v max platform I use, the chargers have fans in them. The knock off, no fan. With how toasty they get I wouldn't risk the knock off.
Yes, both owned by TTI (Techtronic Industries)
200 Billion Kilometres, Thirty return trips to Pluto, but, for Aussies, how many Olympic Swimming Pools is that ?
And for Americans, how many football fields is that ?
Your measurements don’t make any sense, John.
In Canada batteries have to have either the UL from the Underwriter Labs or a C with an SA inside of it.
Two hour timer’s are available from Bunnings for a safety margin
yeh but how dodgy are they? :)
My s-long was put away long ago, I’m married.
Thank you for raising this very important topic and providing advice on how to better treat such batteries. I’ve been very concerned about the best location to charge and store my batteries following your recent related videos.
Thanks John well said. It should be repeated as often as possible please.
The AUSNZ triangle circle tick symbol is definitely self certification and is used to certify that any electrical work is safe to use even changing a lamp or fuse. I think the issue is that misusing the symbol means the supplier can be in deep shit with the compliance body standing on their head making sure they drown if there is ever any problem with the product or the installation. So obviously there is a reluctance to use it unless the supplier or installer is really really confident
Interesting, Colin. I thought it would be that kind of blowback. Thanks for the kind words.
Just checked my batteries for the cordless tools. Milwaukee as stated, no compliance. Aldi cordless tool batteries have the Aussie compliance tick and another compliance abbreviation I don’t recognise.
As Colin says, the RCM tick-in-a-circle-in-a-triangle is self-certifying and should indicate the product meets safety and EMC interference requirements. Australia does not have RoHS, but most regions now seem to request e-waste is sent to directed disposal centres rather than dumped in the garbage.
The European CE logo (and the UKCA logo, at least until the UK gets it's legislation clean-out done post-Brexit) also are self-certifying for safety, EMC interference and RoHS. The German GS or TÜV logos would indicate certification by a recognised lab.
The US FCC logo is not safety but EMC interference only. The safety logo will be the symbol of the certifying lab (UL, CSA, or others) with an adjacent 'US' and/or 'C' (Canada) to show where the test is valid. Strangely, from my understanding, the US safety requirements seem to be driven by OHSA requirements rather than protecting retail customers.
The other safety-related symbol that you may see is the Indian BIS 'twisted rope' logo.
Most of the other logos shall only be for EMC interference aspects in other countries.
In the end, the reputation of the company is probably the best indicator of how trustworthy the device is. A brand name with CE, UL, CSA, GS or TÜV would likely be okay (for ANZ's RCM, there are some additional tests such as for protecting coin cells from kids and devices from lightning surges) whereas mail-order direct from China may be well short of the claims on the device or packaging. Big Clive's YT channel demonstrates numerous bad examples. My biggest fear is Chinese e-scooters and e-bikes with suspect design and BIG batteries!
@teeanahera8949 No compliance symbol on the battery but there IS a compliance symbol on the charger. The battery has an ANZ Ser Nr, so I wonder if that might mean it is even more compliant with perhaps passing a tested certification?
John this is NOT a criticism of your content, which is brilliant! At 28:20 that EU CE mark that you have shown is the Knock off one. The middle bar of the 'E' is shorter than the radius on the top and bottom. Easy reference to en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CE_marking. It's so easy to get duped! Keep up the content.
Nice gay t-shirt John!
Found inside the loony tunes cart at movie world,?
Only problem with chargers is that there are never enough power points in the house.
Strip chargers, dude. Milwaukee and DeWalt at least do them which allows charging of up to six or eight batteries at a time. Not sure whether or not they charge them simultaneously or not though, but someone who owns one might comment regarding that bit. I know Milwaukee’s 12v/18v combined chargers normally charge the 18v first before switching over.
I’ve got two DeWalt single battery chargers (only need the two since the beauty of them is they can charge from 10.8v all the way up to 18v as the battery design is the same no matter the voltage, so you could get away with one charger for all your DeWalt tools if you went that way and didn’t need more than one battery charged at a time.
The European voltage standard was increased from 220Vac to 230V around 1999. America matched half this from 110V up to 115V. Australia Pacific and UK reduced from 240V to 230V. Tolerance for cables, powerboards and appliances is -5/+10%. This allows a working range of 218.5-253V. The problem is imported products continue to be made for the old 220V standard and still get the CE tick. Close enough right? Well, -5/+10% of 220V is now 209-242V. Anyone less than half the distance between a substation and the end of the line is getting more than 242V, causing vibration, EMF and potential fire risk from the excess heat. Excess voltage also drastically reduces the life of appliances.
I put a drink coaster under the edge of my phone when charging so some air can flow under it to help cooling
Councils putting gum tree widow makers around foot paths is good example of potential energy.
My Schlong always feels good in my hand
Well, pinch grip, anyway.
@@TonyRule
Have you ever tried the other hand for a different experience, go on it'll feel like you're cheating !
@@123hoffie The real trick is to make it numb first 😁
My Sheila was loving the sparks when I did the 4” lift, bull bar, light bar, 35’s and winch on the Ute 💪
How many sparks in a 4" lift. Isn't it mainly just cursing with a wrench?
Send the apprentice to the hardware shop to pick up a box of sparks.
Sheila is his blue healers name
Thanks John great advice. Checked my batteries yep got the tick. Also now wear a helmet when going up ladders 🙂
The CEO of a lithium mining company recently gave a speech and said that even with the new mines planned to start operation in the future they won't be able to produce enough lithium to meet even 50% of the expected demand !
Tesla P100 caught fire on the Auckland harbour bridge last night, over an hour to put it out 🙁
Chuck it off the bridge. Do we Aussies have to come over and fix up everything for youse blokes ?
“Engineering out the dickhead” 🤣 I think you need that right next to the “Make Australia less shit” hat.
@27:38. The FCC logo is *NOT* the same thing at all! That means the product passed US electromagnetic compatibility, not safety!
US safety is usually a UL mark (Underwriters Laboratories) with CSA being the Canadian counterpart to that.
We had a while batch of Dell laptops that had batteries swelling so much that the touchpad was getting lifted off the case.
Seemed humorous at first but once we realised what's going on the service guy attended at first priority to replace them. They were funny shaped, like overweight, moulding into the shape of the laptop internals. Scary stuff.
This is one of John’s best! He answered several questions I had about these batteries. Everyone who uses this technology should watch and pay attention.
Sincere thanks from USA!
Interesting that you say that your Milwaukee battery doesn’t have the “tick” as mine, and I have six of them, all have one. I’m in NZ.
Even lead acid batteries have unexpected outcomes and you wear PPE when checking them as we had one decide to explode while checking the water levels
Talking about new fuel technologies and new energy storage systems, please check the amazing Plasma Kinetics. It was banned tech in the USA in 2008 labelled as a disruptive technology. In 2017, they were reinstated and now they are coming out with all guns blazing. If it takes off the way it should, that will be the end of EV’s as we know it.
If they can get the key players on board and get the supply chain right, this could be the game changer.
Mechatronics Engineer here, before the term really existed (1986 grad, ex-UK, now living in B.Mtns) . Suffice to say all our power tool batteries are only charged when cool and stored in the garage beer fridge set at about 8C - wife is Welsh so prefers warmer beer... It's still interesting that a few brands fare better than other. E.g. I've never had a DeWalt battery fail, and some go back to 2014 and still work well with high drain devices like angle grinders etc. Ryobi? Not so good. Have now got an eBay DeWalt to Ryobi battery converter which works perfectly but you need to make sure you stop using it the moment it starts slowing down as the DeWalt battery does not have the same BMS/Protection system as Ryobi, it's in the tool instead. Works great if you understand that.
John - love your overall video content. You're a brave man putting it out there, particularly in Aus...
Interesting, I've got my Ryobi fan on the desk here running on a 2015 week 42 1.3 A/h Ryobi battery - bottom of the bucket model that's had a hard life - it'll still run the fan all day - but I have a 2017 1.5 a/h higher end one (with the built in power gauge) that only lasted 3 years or so before the charge capacity started dropping off noticeably. Never had any issues with the larger batteries - have 2 very old 4 A/h and two much newer 5 A/h and they are all still great. Maybe it's just down to insufficient QC?
What prevents people from just sticking on compliance stickers?
My cheap re-chargeable prostate massager went poopy the first time i used it.
I sent it back and told them where they could stick it.
And never put the in a bin or skip. Fires in waste facilities caused by battery packs is a major issue costing hundreds of millions.
Auckland motorway traffic drew to a standstill waiting for the Tesla fire to burn itself out on Harbour Bridge.
Is the tick like the Heart Foundation where you can sell candy bar full of sugar and fat and as long as you pay enough money to the foundation get to put the tick on the product? Plus Chinese imports can have anything on them if they can market a 42V battery which is only 24V or 1000AH mobile phone battery, or back in the 2000s a 256MB USB stick which could write for infinity but only show 32MB.
Dear John, where do you get your cool T-shirts from? Iwant a couple as my wardrobe is pretty crap. Probably ask ChatGTP I'm guessing.
If you make something idiot-proof, someone will just make a better idiot.
The real risk is with the lightweight chargers from China which use a capacitor dropper and a diode with very often nothing more inside, then the manufacturers cheat even more by not using a Y class capacitor which is designed to fail open circuit, they just put in whatever they can get the cheapest and when that fails they can fail short circuit so now you have full mains voltage going into the battery which most likely has no over volt protection either.
Dang…my Sheila wont have that 💪
Full Bridge Rectifier!
What I hate is when my fleshlight is getting overused and ignites at a really inconvenient time.
Pretty sure the C-tick compliance logo is only for EMC compatibility, that is, it will not cause radio interference, not for fire or electrical safety.
Not according to Fire & Rescue NSW.
In the USA, FCC is the Federal Communications Commission and has to do with the radio frequency (RF) emissions or reception of a device. Almost all of the devices that use rechargeable batteries use switching or digital regulation to control the power delivery to the device and switching supplies for the battery charger. These type of supplies can create radio frequency noise that can interfere with licensed communication devices.
Just a thought John, Dash Cams and E-Toll tags have batteries in them all be it small ones and they are in direct sunlight inside a baking car 🤔
I have my Gopro on the windscreen behind the rear view mirror. I have trashed a few batteries, I think because the batteries get cooked. I now keep the Gopro hidden until I need it.
@@craigo7235 in the old days I used to have a TomTom plugged in and attached to the windscreen as you normally would, and that used to get awfully hot. Luckily it survived 😅
Hahah… beer, forget. I went downstairs to check I hadn’t left old school charger on car battery.
Good point about damaged ones….. not worth the she’ll be right motto. Just buy another and move on to avoid the paperwork.
Re damage to batteries, there is a report via Reuters that insurance companies are writing off EVs over just scratched batteries after minor accidents. There is apparently, at present, no information on repairability and the battery manufacturers will not supply it. The insurance companies refuse to take on the risk of later failure.
Yes. Working on a report on this.
Thanks John. Good information.
Hey John,
During the hotter months, I tend to put my depleted (Ryobi 18v and 36v) batteries in front of the garage fan to cool down before whacking on the charger. A few tradie mates I have talked with actually put their batteries in the camp fridges in their 4x4 masterbation chariots to cool down for a few minutes if they've been run hard. They've all experienced a battery fire because of whacking directly on charge after use, when hot. It's been a case of learn from the mistakes of others, in my case. Lesson well learned, I reckon.
The RCM is a symbol that represents compliance with the Electrical Equipment Safety System.
By 2019 an Inter-Governmental Agreement (IGA) on governance of the Electrical Equipment Safety System (EESS) has been signed by Queensland, Victoria, Western Australia and Tasmania. Other jurisdictions are currently progressing or considering implementation of the EESS.
The EESS moved from oversight by the Electrical Regulatory Authorities Council (ERAC) to being governed by a Ministerial Oversight Committee (MOC) who appoint a representative on the Standing Committee of Officials (SCO).
Then the meeting broke up, and they all went out for a boozy long lunch, and the taxpayers picked up the bill.
Two points: Firstly, the road toll, is too high. But some of us remember the early 70's and before.
Secondly, as a person who works in an operating theatre, I always ask my patients who have power tool injuries, "was it the first cut or the last?" Distraction "What am I doing next?" Is the big danger in my opinion.
I bought 2 after market makita battery's, they had no text on them at all were apparently 6 amp hours but lasted less than my genuine 3 amp batterys. Also after around 20 charges the batteries refused to charge and the charger came up with the broken battery symbol.
Honestly not worth the money, buy genuine.
My workplace was using HP laptops, and the battery started expanding gradually until one day the back cover popped off. Same happened to my coworker a short time later. IT support replaced them of course (I read that there were multiple recalls for that laptop).
One thing I see in my industry is trades buying cheap aftermarket batteries sold on ebay as an example "for Milwaukee ", this worries me as there may not be built in battery protection with these.
The cheap batteries from Ebay or the like is the worst thing you can do.
In my opinion.
Seen a few either don't work or catch fire.
The one who dies with the most toys wins!
2018 Ryobi battery no compliance markings. 2021 has the tick. SPOOOON!
I put unattended lithium battery chargers on a mains supply plug-in countdown timer set to 2 hours - they're about $10 from Bunnings. And I often charge my phone beside the pillow on the bed - but on a very low output charger, so instead of charging in 1 hour it takes 4, thus minimising any heat. It's better for the battery too.
Edit: Sorry to hear you're thinking of sidelining your Schlong.
A new use for the backyard swimming pool. To throw or push you e-scooter, e-bike or EV into in the event of a thermal runaway battery fire.
Educational and interesting - changed my recharging habits
John, what do you know about the new Sodium Ion Batteries 🔋 will they take over from lithium eventually?
There has been research into ignition of fuel with cigarettes and other smoking types and they could not get the fuel to ignite.
It does have to be a fairly particular concentration of fuel vapour but, personally, I really wouldn't risk it, not that I'm silly enough to have ever smoked anyway.
@@TonyRule "The experiments conducted for this study consisted of 70 distinct tests involving a total of 723 cigarettes and over 4,500 instances of exposure of a lit cigarette to ignitable concentrations of gasoline vapor in air. There were no instances of the ignition of gasoline vapors from the exposure of those vapors to a lit tobacco cigarette during any of the experiments."
@@PSY7HON *_"a lit tobacco cigarette"_*
Was it being drawn on to reach the required ignition temperature?
@@TonyRule yes, vacuum was used to simulate a draw. It's actually fascinating that it didn't work, however lighting a cigarette near fuel is a different story.
What do the Milwaukee batteries say about compliance? Do they say anything useful? UL or anything? I’ve always had questions about compliance in various regions. Are some stricter than others? I see lots of things here in the USA with CE, but not UL. I’d prefer UL, but most Chinese products claim CE. Is that true, who knows? But I don’t see them being held accountable for claiming that here, if not real, but I can see them being held accountable if they claim UL, but aren’t. So that could be why.
The next burning (!) questions ought to be (1) are LiFePO4 batteries really safe on the road to DPC creek with all the corrugations and high temperatures (2) should we be opening them up to improve the vibration resistance of the BMS wires etc with silicon rubber to improve fatigue risk and (3) what if any risk reduction benefit do we gain by persevering with AGM lead acid batteries at the expense of weight and inferior cycle life.
Your comments about battery standards made me have a look at my DeWalt batteries and they have the tick on them. Must be why they’re so much more expensive than Milwaukee equivalents.
From personal experience though, many modern phones have fail safe devices that automatically shut them down when they overheat. Something which iPhones have had it since at lease iPhone 4 and it seems like Galaxies have had it since the beginning except for the Note 10 hand grenade.
Would’ve thought cooking fans that run while charging EVs to help dissipate heat would’ve been the standard for all large battery packs to increase lifecycle and reduce the likelihood off self combustion.
I pretty much always agree with this guy... But I also pretty much always smoke when I'm refueling stuff. Maybe it'll git me one day but it's been a few decades. 🤠Yeehaw up dingo piss creek we go.
Another great video, thanks. Like you I put my chargers in a central location where they can’t be covered by anything. A trick I also do is to use a heavy duty power-strip plugged into an automatic timer set to turn on midnight to 4am so there is no chance of overcharging even if you don’t use the batteries for days at a time. I use the same setup for my phone, iPad, headphones, etc. in the house. Makes me feel safer. Keep up the great information and see in the next one. 😊😊
John, great lecture. You mentioning the 1kWm-2 insolation figure just made me think you're the Dr Karl of the automotive engineering world. Keep it up!
The main principle that I see for this risk. The main principle at play here is similar to BMI, the ability to disperse heat is proportionally to the surface area and the potential to overheat is proportional to the mass. So the bigger the battery pack, the harder it is to cool and thus a batter with 1000 times the capacity with only 100 times the surface area probably needs active cooling.
You're missing a point: Batteries are in near everything. People charge their smartphones on their nightstands. They leave their crap on hot dashboards. Etc.pp.
Sooner or later you will burn the house down.
Come on Johnno, how are you going to see if the chainsaw tank is full without having a lit cigarette near the filler cap??? You could use an electric torch or something, but that is all so mundane and boring! :-)
I only charge tool batteries in my barn, and only when I am present. When the batteries are charged, I remove from the chargers and turn the charger off. I have a glass table near my bed for my phones, which I charge while reading before going to sleep. Then I unplug the phones from the chargers.
Plenty of cheap compatible power tools from China that use regular big brand batteries.
I have to say some of them are better than the tools from some original manufacturers. Of course some are worst.
Sodium batteries will soon take over from Lithium. Safer and environmental when end of life. It’s only mostly salt.
Awesome episode. Word of Darwinian Warning. I recently put my Samsung S22Ultra Bucks phone in a waterproof/ floatation pouch after another mate dispatched his to Davy Jones' locker. I also left it on the car dash while retrieving the boat. Thankfully, the phone's safety switch kicked in or I could had a dark tinge to the hilux.
The tweet that would be found after my untimely death would no doubt be arguing with a vegan. I really need to reexamine my life... :)
Wow. Food for thought. A redesign of homes is needed due to EVs and power tools on home garages usually attached to, you guessed it, homes.
Should fire sprinkler systems in garages be mandatory in new homes?
It horrifies me that so many people actually park their cars IN their houses these days, with no fire barrier between the "garage" and the rest of the house.
Power tool batteries? You mean, zombie apocalypse grenades?
ua-cam.com/video/DK7MjajHMAY/v-deo.html
This has to be an April fools joke. Right?
Vale Doug Mulray.
29:58 Some things you don't think of in the shed is hydrochloric acid. I put the fuel tanks and gas cylinders away but then I saw the hydrochloric acid and thought yep that will go up. If there is sparks get it all away. Those lithium batteries are little fuel tanks treat them the same. Hydrochloric acid is the best rust remover just play it safe.
Thank You Seriously!
IMO every lithium power tool charging dock/station should be fan assisted just like the Makita batteries which do dissipate quite a bit of heat from the battery + charger whilst its charging which IMO makes charging them just that little bit safer. Something I do with Lithium batteries which are not fan assisted during charging is to charge them in 2 stages, as I never let them usually get under 25% capacity I charge them firstly to around 60% take them off the charger let them cool down for around 30-40 minutes, before charging again to usually around 85-90% total state of charge.
Hi John. Thank you for the video. I just checked my 3 5Ah 18v and 1 12v Milwaukee batteries and they do have the tick.
Interestingly, I recently purchased a Digitech 5W handheld UHF transceiver and while the actual device has the tick the battery and charger do not. I might make a complaint to RTM/Jaycar about this.
I also made my grandson watch the personal device section as he has an abhorrent habit of watching his devices in bed. Obviously we can't watch him all the time and can only discipline him when we catch him in the act. Hopefully he can see the sense of not using devices in bed as he puts all of us at risk.
If you don't need the tool battery recharged immediately, a 24hr/ 7day timer connected to the charger will get it topped up some time after it has cooled down from all that driveway blowing - it will be topped off for the next weekend's bout of home handyman/lady/person.
My (LiPo, unregulated cells) RC battery charging station is in an old "slow combustion fireplace" in the shed (palletised for ease of movement) - complete with flue pointing at the non flammable shed roof (with a rudimentary spark catcher atop.
Other drone batteries get charged at their station sitting on the top of a machinists toolbox - 1/4 inch thick steel -- not going anywhere soon all half tonne of it - constantly observed of course, as per the book (we add the monitored charging as a billable item -overtime - jk).
Engineering out d!ckhe@ds is a spectacular challenge if your objective is to do it with one hundred percent efficiency, cause it will never happen because the world does a spectacular job of engineering an even better d!ckhe@d.
D!ckhe@d labs run 24/7 according to a highly precise R&D regime to design, engineer, and build the very finest candidates for the very latest and highly renowned Darwin award.
Excellent overview, John. This is one reason why I keep several batteries on hand: besides having at least five tools (Milwaukee in my case) using the same battery, the temptation to stick a warm-ish battery right into a charger is minimized. And, like the song goes, keep all of this in a cool, dry place
I'm not certain that the tick known as the RCM (regulatory compliance mark) is designed to reflect the fire safety of the batteries. I know it covers some of the electrical safety aspects to do with isolation from mains. It's also used in telecommunications and also to show that devices comply with EME. However my feeling is it is not a broad identification of safety. Much like ANCAP is not a measure of fire safety for vehicles. I think fire rescue NSW are thinking that most rubbish gear won't have gone to the effort to get RCM compliance. It is for the reasons I said above that I don't think a RCM is required on a battery but nothing stops a market from placing the RCM on a battery. I could be wrong but that's what I have picked up from playing around the edges with this kind of compliance. Regardless everything in the video is sensible and exercise caution with these batteries RCM or not.
On the driving and walking and phones topic. I walk to work, but my usual walking path was undergoing some upgrades last year, meaning I had to walk beside a busy road for about a mile. On the way home it would be oncoming traffic and I'd get to see the whites of the drivers' eyes (or not) because you could count every 10th driver would have their head or eyes down. I'm assuming it was phones, but after that experience I found myself surprised there's not more prangs.
Is there any advantage to adding a ribbed aluminum panel or two to a battery pack to help dissipate heat?
Fun with batteries! I had to have a giggle because it reminded me of an incident I had when we were building a house and NiCad batteries were prevalent, so you can guess how long ago, it's before LiPO4 battery powered tools were readily available. Most of our big tools were 240V, but I had a couple of battery powered ones. I had just finished for the day and removed the batteries from the small drill I had been using and placed the cylindrical batteries into my pants pocket, forgetting about the Tek screws that I had in the same pocket. The burning sensation on my thigh was the first indicator that something was horribly wrong. I had placed them contacts down and yes the Tek screws had completed the circuit across the terminals. Even when the batteries where quite discharged there was sufficient charge left to create a lot of heat. Vision of grown man hopping around with smoke coming out of pants pocket!
Been using NiCd , Nimh , Lion and Lipo batts since the 1990's and in high and low power devices. Never had an issue apart from seeing the common bulging of poor quality pouch cells which seem to have issues with gas diffusion. Even with these batteries being stuffed , never seen a fire even with randomly purchased Chinese made switch mode power chargers. To be honestly I have seen more issues with leaky alkaline or lead acid batteries.
EGO power tools: could I humbly give a shout out to this company regarding good engineering … Ego seems to have a good focus on battery cooling, in terms of both charging and in use, along with built-in protection.
Unlike tool manufacturers who routinely place their tool batteries into very high discharge lawnmowers/leaf blowers etc, Ego has specifically designed the batteries for this purpose, rather than for example placing two sealed 18v batteries into a lawnmower.
Ego battery chargers also flow a high volume of air through their batteries while charging and will pre-cool the battery if required before charging.
In my very humble experience I have 2 Ego batteries that have lasted 5 years, with a minimum loss in runtime … it will be interesting to see how the traditional tool batteries last in the hot and high discharge environment of a lawn mower.
Great vid Mr C. This is not just relevant to Australia but throughout the World. At the beginning of the vid you said about having a smoke when filling your lawnmower. Isn't there something called the Darwin Awards? That's got nothing to do with the Northern Territories. All the best....
Engineering out the Dickhead? John - thats a T-shirt for sure. I once knew a fella, when checking his battery fluiid and couldn't see the liquid, lit his cigarette lighter to take a clearer view. boom - fortunately he wasn't alone, on the front lawn and by the tap beneath which he was duly held. Oh, he's dead now so I guess it doesn't really matter. John - the whole battery thing is just SO misunderstood - great presentation.
As I started watching this, it reminded me to go to my garage and turn off the Milwaukee battery charger. Interestingly, Tesla states in their user manual to keep the cars on charge when not on use. When I clarified this with Tesla, this is only applicable to low amperage chargers, 10-15 amp.
What about LiPo batteries used in RC cars and planes? They can be touchy. They have to be charged and discharged with their cells in balance or they can catch fire. Let alone if you stack your RC car or plane and the battery gets punctured, they become a smoke machine and then a flamethrower!
Wouldn't grabbing Harry's wand be assault?
What about the 4000 permanent injuries each year.
Also look for UL "underwriters laboratory" at least here in the USA. For all electrical installations all materials must display this "UL" symbol.
Don't care what the circumstances are I'm going no where near Harrys wand.
Ticks are cheap these days. $8.95 a month.
Interesting and good stuff John.
I have 18 Milwaukee batteries, both M12 and M18, and ALL of them have the tick symbol. Maybe yours pre-date that requirement?