Thanks for making this video. Those are very enticing panels! However, Buyers are NOT interested in efficiency (and should, generally, not be interested either). Panel Efficiency doesn't mean anything provided that the panel efficiency is in a decent range. It is just a selling point, and has almost nothing to do with "Price per Watt" which IS what the consumer needs to know about, as well as warranty, ability to handle hail, and Aesthetic (they want all black panels). Unless the buyer happens to have a very very small rooftop, efficiency is really not very important as long as it is reasonable. Edit: However, if the efficiency of a panel drops to the point where you need to buy another one to meet the anticipated load, then you might have to account for the added cost of hardware to mount it etc.
It's funny that you come here to correct this guy who is holding this "expert" video venue- and you are correct - although I never hear anyone else point that out about efficiency (Kudos to you for that) no one else here mentioned it now did they - I do all the time. But you then go on to make the same mistake in a different way about something equally obvious. This industry never ceases to amaze! That's why this "industry" struggles and suffers it's way through things. Completely avoidable!
@@IKidTheSolar Thanks. It's a difficult niche for this type of video because it has to reach out to different audiences. You mentioned something obvious that I erred on?
These videos on this channel in my opinion are jist utterly cringe worthy. There's almost NOTHING being explained right. All this talk and not one word that speaks to a homeowner about what's REALLY going on with Solar Power. These videos, in my opinion, do 100 times more damage than they do good. Because if the "Solar" industry had a clue what they're doing wring, then none of these things would be an issue. Interest rates, dealer fees, prices, NEM, etc. This industry reminds me of a Star Trek story line where some old technology was set in motion for a good purpose but then, over time, without updates, became not just obsolete but dangerous to the objectives it set out to achieve! Your mistake? PPW. That's an acronym. But it is also a built in joke when you say it. It makes fun of itself. A phonetic joke.
@@IKidTheSolar Well, I guess I am not viewing this in the same way. Some of the content does seem useful to me. And if it is not, then I tend to skip video that I just don't find interesting. I personally like to see the reviews of the panels themselves. But I always have to take into account that there might be bias in any review. I can't recall exactly why, but I felt like the whole "efficiency is king" attitude was just wrong with respect to most solar buyers. Nevertheless, I look at this channel as performing a service that helps me to discover new products that I haven't come across, as long as I don't buy into too much of the fluff. For example, I did learn about the REC panel which seemed pretty cool.
Nice video, thank you. An interesting follow up would be to do a mini educational video on the new and upcoming technologies coming up in the next 2-3 years. From my understanding Perovskite solar panels are now starting to leave the lab environment and are being scaled up for commercial applications. These tandem cells should be able to get a significant uplift over today's state of art cells.
It's the "how" of how solar panels are rated that causes such stories as "The parent company HAD somebody else making the product." NO MENTION THAT THE PARENT COMPANY IS DOING NOTHING OTHER THAN FLIPPING CHINESE MADE PRODUCTS AND ISN'T BUILT WITH THE INTENTIONS OF ANYTHING ELSE. Ok, now with THAT behind us as well as in front of us...what that efficiency figure is is for one cell out of the bunch....it has nothing to do with the panels actual measured efficiency. Now, you would think this would be common sense because I could just as well make the panel twice the size and with half the cells and have the same numbers...so "efficiency" and panel have nothing to do with one another. Now, we take our panel and now, every nine cells we need to deduct 1 1/5 cells from the figure, because we need to include blocking diodes. So, although the manufacture says it will put out 400 watts...it will never actually do it. The took the math from the testing of one cell and multiplied it by the number of cells...they never told anyone that most of the cells do go in the dumpster because NASA intends on putting them in space and tests them before they build the panel and afterward. They don't tell you that NASA doesn't need blocking diodes because birds don't plop out of the sky in geostationary orbit. AND THEY DEFIANTLY DO NOT TELL YOU THAT ALL OF THE MANUFACTURERS OF PANELS DO IT THE SAME WAY. WITH THAT...HOW MANY WATTS PER SQUARE METER? Now, I'm gonna check my math. If I put my money in the bank and don't pay some banker for the loan and withdraw $200 every month to pay some percentage of my electric bill then will I be loosing money? Current US National average price on a KWh a tad under 16 cents. So, $200 divided by 16 cents is 1250 KWh per month. That is KW hours not kilowatts. With thirty days in the month and 24 hours in the day..I get 1.7 kilowatts every hour, every day, all day long...without buying a solar panel, a charger, a battery or an inverter. I'm sure anyone reading this would know...but $200 a month won't even pay to shingle a roof. So, the price of solar has gone down a lot but that is relative to the price of electricity going up. It's a nice idea but it's like listening to a car salesman about how much I can save by spending my money.
Just curious on your thoughts about the Renogy 550 Watt Monocrystalline Solar Panels. On their website they state 22.8% efficiency which is higher than the ones you mentioned while also being a higher wattage.
The best panel compared to all the one you mention is Aiko solar module Neostar series with ABC technology with efficiency exceeding 24% and all black panel even the frames in their 2S module.
I heard from CED the Q.TRON will need to be paired with a different Enphase micro that won't be available until Q3 2024 as it cannot be paired with any of the current IQ8 series micros. Have you heard anything about this?
Another great solar video. Thanks Joe. How about a video on bifacial panels. Seems like a great option to create more output with the same footprint. Very curious to understand because they seem to perform well around snow. As a Canadian, I curious to hear your feedback.
Hi Richard, and thank you for the comment. I wish I had more personal experience with bi-facial panels, but I’ve never actually used them. In theory, they will perform better on ground, mounted systems, where you have an opportunity for light, reflected off the ground or from snow on the ground.
I would like to know watts Per $I might not mind a larger foot print if the cost was a good bit lower. I really like made in the US so Qcell might just be the ticket.
I have issues with the idea of the long-term value of solar panels, because what if there are incremental breakthroughs in 5 years? in 7 years, can I put an 18x24 solar panel up that has 3x the production? I mean the panels are up there, so why take them down.. but realistically, like the 25 year Enphase warranty, would one really want to keep their current components for more than 10 years? I already see lots of IQ inverters for sale, and TONS of older panels.. that gets me thinking, how are these things recycled after they are decommissioned?
@@benfaubion I guess. But it is unfortunate that all this pointless "solar talk" only lead you to "wonder" or "think about" all those irrelevant things.
Well, it's not really an opinion. It's an obvious set of facts. True for every homeowner that has Sun, roof space, an electricity bill and some kind of net metering (which is almost all)
Nothing about this was educational, it was more of a sales video for these brands. And there are plenty of better brands out there that have 23% and 24% efficiency now. Thanks!
National Labs are testing multiple Perovskite "products" at the moment. So far, their lifespans seem disappointing. It takes time to perfect all aspects of such new tech.
Thanks for making this video. Those are very enticing panels! However, Buyers are NOT interested in efficiency (and should, generally, not be interested either). Panel Efficiency doesn't mean anything provided that the panel efficiency is in a decent range. It is just a selling point, and has almost nothing to do with "Price per Watt" which IS what the consumer needs to know about, as well as warranty, ability to handle hail, and Aesthetic (they want all black panels). Unless the buyer happens to have a very very small rooftop, efficiency is really not very important as long as it is reasonable.
Edit: However, if the efficiency of a panel drops to the point where you need to buy another one to meet the anticipated load, then you might have to account for the added cost of hardware to mount it etc.
It's funny that you come here to correct this guy who is holding this "expert" video venue- and you are correct - although I never hear anyone else point that out about efficiency (Kudos to you for that) no one else here mentioned it now did they - I do all the time. But you then go on to make the same mistake in a different way about something equally obvious. This industry never ceases to amaze! That's why this "industry" struggles and suffers it's way through things. Completely avoidable!
@@IKidTheSolar Thanks. It's a difficult niche for this type of video because it has to reach out to different audiences. You mentioned something obvious that I erred on?
These videos on this channel in my opinion are jist utterly cringe worthy. There's almost NOTHING being explained right. All this talk and not one word that speaks to a homeowner about what's REALLY going on with Solar Power. These videos, in my opinion, do 100 times more damage than they do good. Because if the "Solar" industry had a clue what they're doing wring, then none of these things would be an issue. Interest rates, dealer fees, prices, NEM, etc. This industry reminds me of a Star Trek story line where some old technology was set in motion for a good purpose but then, over time, without updates, became not just obsolete but dangerous to the objectives it set out to achieve!
Your mistake? PPW. That's an acronym. But it is also a built in joke when you say it. It makes fun of itself. A phonetic joke.
@@IKidTheSolar Well, I guess I am not viewing this in the same way. Some of the content does seem useful to me. And if it is not, then I tend to skip video that I just don't find interesting. I personally like to see the reviews of the panels themselves. But I always have to take into account that there might be bias in any review. I can't recall exactly why, but I felt like the whole "efficiency is king" attitude was just wrong with respect to most solar buyers. Nevertheless, I look at this channel as performing a service that helps me to discover new products that I haven't come across, as long as I don't buy into too much of the fluff. For example, I did learn about the REC panel which seemed pretty cool.
Nice video, thank you. An interesting follow up would be to do a mini educational video on the new and upcoming technologies coming up in the next 2-3 years. From my understanding Perovskite solar panels are now starting to leave the lab environment and are being scaled up for commercial applications.
These tandem cells should be able to get a significant uplift over today's state of art cells.
Thank You Good Sir. Great Information, that I needed.
It's the "how" of how solar panels are rated that causes such stories as "The parent company HAD somebody else making the product." NO MENTION THAT THE PARENT COMPANY IS DOING NOTHING OTHER THAN FLIPPING CHINESE MADE PRODUCTS AND ISN'T BUILT WITH THE INTENTIONS OF ANYTHING ELSE. Ok, now with THAT behind us as well as in front of us...what that efficiency figure is is for one cell out of the bunch....it has nothing to do with the panels actual measured efficiency.
Now, you would think this would be common sense because I could just as well make the panel twice the size and with half the cells and have the same numbers...so "efficiency" and panel have nothing to do with one another. Now, we take our panel and now, every nine cells we need to deduct 1 1/5 cells from the figure, because we need to include blocking diodes. So, although the manufacture says it will put out 400 watts...it will never actually do it. The took the math from the testing of one cell and multiplied it by the number of cells...they never told anyone that most of the cells do go in the dumpster because NASA intends on putting them in space and tests them before they build the panel and afterward. They don't tell you that NASA doesn't need blocking diodes because birds don't plop out of the sky in geostationary orbit. AND THEY DEFIANTLY DO NOT TELL YOU THAT ALL OF THE MANUFACTURERS OF PANELS DO IT THE SAME WAY.
WITH THAT...HOW MANY WATTS PER SQUARE METER?
Now, I'm gonna check my math. If I put my money in the bank and don't pay some banker for the loan and withdraw $200 every month to pay some percentage of my electric bill then will I be loosing money? Current US National average price on a KWh a tad under 16 cents. So, $200 divided by 16 cents is 1250 KWh per month. That is KW hours not kilowatts. With thirty days in the month and 24 hours in the day..I get 1.7 kilowatts every hour, every day, all day long...without buying a solar panel, a charger, a battery or an inverter.
I'm sure anyone reading this would know...but $200 a month won't even pay to shingle a roof. So, the price of solar has gone down a lot but that is relative to the price of electricity going up. It's a nice idea but it's like listening to a car salesman about how much I can save by spending my money.
Have seen ads for "solar stack" adhesive roof attachments for solar panels that do not penetrate the roofing material, any feed back on that system?
Maxeon 7 445W is at 24.1% efficiency
Good update I have been buying tier 1 panels for.25 to .35 / watt since 2017 for my diy instills 32kwAc so far.
The heck with "efficient" - tell us about cost-effective.
The Info is not right The Aiko N-Type ABC Series overperform all this 3 modules whif 23.6% Effizients and 88.85% System Power behind 30 years
Ya, this guy just sells stuff. His info is questionable at best.
Sorry but your misspelling of simple words negates your info/opinion 😂
Just curious on your thoughts about the Renogy 550 Watt Monocrystalline Solar Panels. On their website they state 22.8% efficiency which is higher than the ones you mentioned while also being a higher wattage.
This is a bit off you're using the 420w Maxeon vs the 430 Qcell. I sell Maxeon 440s and they are 22.8%
The best panel compared to all the one you mention is Aiko solar module Neostar series with ABC technology with efficiency exceeding 24% and all black panel even the frames in their 2S module.
Qcells is a german manufacturer owned by a korean Hanwha. How is it American?
Thanks Joe - Always great to see you give updates on solar panels and solar components.
I heard from CED the Q.TRON will need to be paired with a different Enphase micro that won't be available until Q3 2024 as it cannot be paired with any of the current IQ8 series micros. Have you heard anything about this?
Yes, take a look at the new Enphase IQ8X: ua-cam.com/video/e72cBN3rDNc/v-deo.html
Do you talk about Jinko solar? They are all over the world. Do you talk about the best products worldwide, not just in the US?
No point, murrica
Very nice video, can you please recommend top commercial panels as well?
This is the day to buy maxn stock 🎉🎉
I appreciate the info, I needed this going into purchasing my first panels next month or June.
Have you, or will you produce a video explaining the difference in efficiency and cost of "solar panels" versus "solar roof shingles"?
@RezaReportsBoosters
I appreciate the info,
Any information on the "flexible film" solar panels? Or the "new" higher performance panels requiring much less space?
Another great solar video. Thanks Joe. How about a video on bifacial panels. Seems like a great option to create more output with the same footprint. Very curious to understand because they seem to perform well around snow. As a Canadian, I curious to hear your feedback.
Hi Richard, and thank you for the comment. I wish I had more personal experience with bi-facial panels, but I’ve never actually used them. In theory, they will perform better on ground, mounted systems, where you have an opportunity for light, reflected off the ground or from snow on the ground.
Thanks Joe. How would a user be able to recognize panel degradation?
Thanks for another Video!
Very glad to have found this channel
I would like to know watts Per $I might not mind a larger foot print if the cost was a good bit lower. I really like made in the US so Qcell might just be the ticket.
According to clean energy reviews. Their are 20 residential panels that have efficiency over 22.3%
You did a great informative job.
This is such good presentation.
I have issues with the idea of the long-term value of solar panels, because what if there are incremental breakthroughs in 5 years? in 7 years, can I put an 18x24 solar panel up that has 3x the production? I mean the panels are up there, so why take them down.. but realistically, like the 25 year Enphase warranty, would one really want to keep their current components for more than 10 years? I already see lots of IQ inverters for sale, and TONS of older panels.. that gets me thinking, how are these things recycled after they are decommissioned?
So THAT's what you "got thinking about?" "Solar." The worst word ever spoken. Missing the point is "solar's" greatest achievement.
@@IKidTheSolar haha, greatest achievement. That’s a funny one.
@@benfaubion I guess. But it is unfortunate that all this pointless "solar talk" only lead you to "wonder" or "think about" all those irrelevant things.
@@IKidTheSolar so what would be relevant regarding solar in your opinion?
Well, it's not really an opinion. It's an obvious set of facts. True for every homeowner that has Sun, roof space, an electricity bill and some kind of net metering (which is almost all)
Thanks, really interesting.
Graphene quantum dot?
Nothing about this was educational, it was more of a sales video for these brands. And there are plenty of better brands out there that have 23% and 24% efficiency now. Thanks!
470W panels are outdated. We cAn do a lot better with 550 W panels all arround
Perovskite???
National Labs are testing multiple Perovskite "products" at the moment. So far, their lifespans seem disappointing. It takes time to perfect all aspects of such new tech.
My guy out here doing solar videos just to show off his biceps
Aiko solar 620W and 24% efficiency