J&D Productions: “Don’t take a RB in the first round, an average RB can be elite behind a good OL” “Don’t take a WR early in the draft” “Situation is more important than talent when drafting a QB”. Ok when I’m a GM I will only draft defensive players and offensive linemen in the top 10
Honestly? Yeah, what’s the point of having the next Mahomes or Josh Allen if they’re getting sacked all the time, their receivers drop every pass, and their defense can’t stop a light breeze
It would also be important to not draft line backers and saftey in the top 10 as they too have limited upside. So you should only draft either side of the line or corner
Drafting more O-Line early would be a wise move for a LOT of teams. The FANS love flashy skill position players so of course they want the next Mahomes or D-Hop or whoever to go in the first. But TEAMS, management, coaches, scouts, should know which positions matter and they’re not just the highlight reel players. Draft more O-Line. Everyone.
I’m an Australian so I don’t know the game as well as you guys but I’m always astounded when a team doesn’t go hard for a good o line as a priority. In my train of thought isn’t protecting your Qb the main priority and also freeing him up with time in the pocket to find a receiver.
Rugby fan, eh? There’s a compelling argument that talent at skill positions is worthless without a solid line. Which is true to a point- QBs who don’t get 2.5 seconds of a clean pocket can’t make throws, routes have no time to develop, backs have no open field. It’s true to a point. A mid-tier like can be compensated for with godlike talent at skills positions, and the game is evolving from a league of pocket passers to QBs who can move the sticks with their legs. You can have an effective offense with an average o-line if your skill positions are elite. It’s much easier to have an elite o-line who will make your average skill players appear Godly.
Yea it is for many teams, O tackle is one of the three positions (OT, QB, DE) that u will usually see picked first overall or close to it. Im a jets fan, and our line is one of the biggest reasons why our offense is so shit
@@MustacheDLuffy Smith's chiefs had a good offense once in 5 years. 4of 5 years they were a bottom 5 pass offense. One year smith threw 0 tds to a WR. I think people forget that early on in reid's run KC was about Jamaal charles and a great defense.
@@SycoticForeverNeverAF A lot of people forget the media and fans blasted KC for cutting maclin, insisting a returner like hill could never be a #1 WR. He was, and I quote "just a poor man's percy harvin" They're wrong more than they're right. Like meteorologists.
Your use of "situation" is such a vague term, can literally say that about any player drafted in the 1st round. Josh Allen inherited a 9-7 Buffalo Bills who lost basically their entire offensive line other than Dion Dawkins. Allen's #1 receiver was Kelvin Benjamin and WR2 was Robert Foster. What a team needs is a competent front office who does due diligence in selecting a head coach that possesses the right attitude to facilitate culture. Then selecting the players who fit the mold both personally and athletically. McDermott is a disciple of Ron Rivera, suggesting Josh Allen or Pat Mahommes wouldn't succeed in DC is asinine.
I think people greatly overestimate the Bills organization that Allen was drafted into. Sure, they lucked into the playoffs via less than 10% odds heading into week 17 the year before, but they were on a 17 year playoff DROUGHT, longest in the league before that. Their roster was terrible. Look at Allen's first year roster. They had nobody. They went into the season with only 2 QBs on the roster, Nathan Peterman as the stater, Allen as the "project," raw backup. But they were so bad so early that Josh was forced to play by half time game 1. Midway through the season, they were so desperate for a veteran QB they sign Derek Anderson out of retirement, then Matt Barkley off the streets when he got injured. This was NOT a "stable" situation. It was the opposite. McDermott was a first time HC, it was Brandon Beane's first draft as GM, & the team was in complete rebuold mode. Allen had to bust his ass & really apply himself over the first 2 years, just as the team had to slowly build up a roster around him. It didn't exist when he got there. The situation was terrible. So scratch that one from the list please. The Bills were not like Chiefs who just won 12 games under Alex Smith.
Talent does matter however in an exstent. It depends who you draft if you draft somebody like Patrick Mahomes who is smart and talented then you should draft him. However somebody like Ryan Leaf that uses talent wrong you dont draft.
Talent is much less important than intelligence and calmness in a qb. If you have a qb that is super physically gifted but is dumb and can't read a defense or sticks to his bad habits despite having it brought out by the coach then he's gonna be a massive pick thrower and liability.
Basically, If you want to develop a QB. Do the exact opposite that the dolphins have done the previous 2 years. And it might still be too late for Tua.
Matthew Stafford developed into one of the better QBs in the NFL in the dumpster fire that is Detroit. How good your QB gets is more dependent on your QB than anything else. How much he HWEENS, however, is dependent upon the situation.
Talent is extremely important. But what's behind the ears is more important. You are making a correlation/causation fallacy. First of all, PROCESSING and quick reaction time is a _talent._ Second, these rare instances of talented guys succeeding in the NFL isn't just because of the team developing them, it's because they have what it takes to _be_ developed. Mahomes would have been good no matter where he went. He perhaps wouldn't have been a future Hall of Famer, but he was going to be good. Case in point: *_Matthew Stafford._* He was _always_ good. He was 6th in NFL history at 4th quarter comebacks _before_ he got to the Rams. He had 8 seasons of 4000+ yards, including one 5000+ yard season, _before_ he got to the Rams. The only thing he was bad at was _winning._ But he was clearly a good QB, even on the Lions. Now, you could argue had he ended up in a better situation he'd be a surefire future Hall of Famer. But, as it stands, he was still one of the better QBs in the NFL the entire time the Lions were sucking.
WR core in some cases doesn’t really matter. Lamar’s 2019 season had a top 10 O-line but a bottom 5 wr core with rookie Hollywood, Seth Roberts and willie Snead
@@TruthLC The ravens would have a top 5 run game if they didnt run him so much. Provided all of their RBs arent on IR by the start of the season. Buuuuut you're not wrong.
This topic requires a lot of nuance. I feel like the proper ratio between QB Skill and Good Team has to be 60/40 - the 60 bring Skill. Look at Kirk Cousins and the Vikings for example, on a great 2018-19 team, Cousins (because an above average at best QB) couldn’t elevate the team to the next level. It’s just not as easy as saying “situation matters” it’s a whole lot more
With Patrick Mahomes, Andy Reid basically repeated his earlier stint with the Eagles with #2 o/a pick D McNabb & veteran backup QB Doug Pederson. Situation is vital for rookie QB: starts at the top with ownership with patience & faith in HC & HC’s “blueprint,” and either a ready to win now roster (Cowboys) or sufficient cap space & draft picks to add skill players. Having a “go to” receiver helps a lot (Kelce, Gronk, Edelmann or C Megatron Johnson). Future looks positive for CJ Stroud who just might make Texans forget that previous guy except for all Cleveland’s draft picks (cynically, the picks would’ve been wasted anyway). Of course, the QB has to have the right mental & leadership makeup (Mahomes) and not self-destruct (Manziel or J Russell).
J&D Productions - "What do you need in order to have a successful quarterback?" J&D Productions - "Oh I don't know, maybe a good offensive line, good wide receivers, a good coach" lmao
Being in the right situation doesn’t mean shit to an elite talent. Talent will always transcend everything. I bury the Browns every chance I get for not taking Josh Allen, but then I’ll get the folks who say he wouldn’t have been as good as he is had the Browns drafted him…..which is absolutely absurd. Every great QB didn’t just fall into a perfect scenario.
Peyton Manning is another example of this. The Colts were a pretty clueless organization before he came along. Joe Burrow as this video mentioned. I think it's a ratio personally. Even though Stafford I think has elite talent, Detroit dragged him down to being above average.
As a Bills fan I have to agree. Josh Allen would have been successful no matter where he landed. It's the competitive fire and the willingness to do what it takes to win that complements his natural gifts. That will shine no matter what the situation.
Tua landed in a better situation than Herbert AND Burrow. The difference is the Bengals and Chargers know how to draft and not overspend on Free Agents like the Dolphins. Burrow and Herbert both played behind literally the two worst Offensive Lines their rookie year
@@RioluLucario1994 the dolphins made some smart moves in the draft by getting waddle, Holland and promising DE but we 100% failed in Free agency by getting Will Fuller who played only three games because he got a injured and a bunch of depths pieces
I’ve been saying this for a very long time. My friends ignore me a lot about it, but a better team makes a better QB. A good QB won’t make a bad team turn around. A team with certain offense elements may make a QB look good, but if the entirety of the team isn’t good there still won’t be success.
There are talents that transcend there situation but they are really rare. Joe burrow taking the Bengals to the super bowl his first full year as a starter is a great example. Talent does matter but situation is also very important.
Shitheap organizations could be given the next GOAT and still mess it up. The Bears, Jags, and Dolphins are all gonna ruin their young QBs without a doubt
It’s interesting that once Jacksonville got a proven coach in Doug Peterson and the situation was more stable, Lawrence became a top 10 QB! Situation absolutely matters.
Like the video but the Colts only won 2 games the year before Andrew luck. I think still he was in a good situation with Bruce arians as HC his rookie year (after Chuck got cancer) but Luck and Big Ben play similarly so it was a good match but we definitely sucked the year before
You broke your own argument by referencing Detroit. Stafford has been seen as a great QB by coaches, players, and anyone who actually saw his games for years. Yeah he's getting recognition by more of the fan base, but Stafford was going to be a baller anywhere.
they're equally important. How do you explain late round QB's. For every Taylor Heinicke, Dak there are Aaron Murray and Nick Mullins. 19 of the 32 starting QB's are in the 1st round and a bunch more in the 2nd round.
Remember kids, football is a TEAM game. Of course the player who has to give the ball to a bunch of other guys on every play is going to be most impacted by the TEAM.
The 2010 colts were a much different team than the 2012 colts. Luck straight carried that terrible roster and is a much different scenario than what was insinuated in this video.
When these pundits say Miami was stupid to draft Tua over Herbert...if Miami drafted Herbert, they'd be saying how Herbert sucks and Tua is so amazing. It's the situation and not the talent.
Talent does matter. Trubisky wasn't drafted over mahomes because of talent. Situation matters. Obviously. What matters more than both is a QB being 'that guy' who outworks everyone. It matters if they can lead men. It matters if they can rally a team, or be the cultural centerpiece for other players. A lot of things matter.. but realistically talent is a big part of what makes Allen and Mahomes great. Every other QB too.
You shoulda mentioned mac jones in New England vs Lawrence down in Jacksonville. If Trevor went to NE he woukda been a baller his rookie year while mac woulda struggled in Jacksonville.
Talent doesn’t matter …look at mahomes and Allen ….blue chip arm talent and running ability …Herbert …yes , it matters. …ex. Leinert or Sanchez weren’t going to be good , no matter where they were drafted to …g ms fall in love with guys who play at big schools …instead of looking at how their skill set and talent level will translate to the nfl
I joke w/ my grandpa who's a Bears fan a lot b/c it's like "oh you could've had Mahomes but you drafted Trubisky" but at the same time, I doubt Mahomes would be Mahomes if he went to Chicago. Hell if the two were swapped we could be talking about 2 time SB champ Mitch Trubisky now, who knows?
J&D: starts listing examples that support his thesis Me: Yeah, definitely gotta agree with J&D overall here, I mean it's more like a guideline than a- J&D 5 minutes later, still listing examples Me: JFC
"The Colts making the playoffs the year before with Peyton Manning" 2011 Peyton was hurt and on IR. They had Charlie Whitehurst that year and played terrible
The owner tanked and intentionally sabotaged the team to get luck. They werent as bad as the record. Caldwell was a fine coach, but he took the blame. Irsay is an asshat who damn near got a lottery instated.
ofc talent matters. Just imagine those lower drafted qbs that ended up in good situations, if they were playing for the jets, texans or falcons. Their numbers would be even more horrifying. We've seen recent examples like Drew Locke. Decent talent, good team, but not talented enough to make any impact.
although good points were made, brock purdy had over 50 starts in college, thats considered being pro ready...was drafted into the best possible situation and yet he'll never win a SB because he lacks talent... talent is what separates good QBs from great QBs.
Had it not been for the rookie contract caveat, he would surely be an exception to the rule. He's made the Cardinals better every season and is on track to be a real good one.
I’m getting really tired of takes that say you shouldn’t draft dudes other then OL and DL simply because of bust rates. Simply put draft what your team needs, if they need a QB in the first round get it, if they need a WR get it, if they need a RB get it. Maybe the reason busts rates are so high isn’t because those positions are getting drafted so high, it’s because teams to draft high tend to be you know bad. Bad teams tend to be bad because of front offense incompetence, not because they drafted a QB in the first round.
I know I will trigger a lot of TB12 fanboys with this take, but if they cannot face facts, that's on them. Yes, we know Brady was a 6th round pick, but while TB12 fanboys will twist the narrative to make their "messiah" look great, Brady was also put in a good position to succeed. Remember, Brady was sitting behind Drew Bledsoe, a talented QB in his own right. Belichick was always known as a defensive coach, and you can always count on the Patriots defense when it mattered. If Bledsoe was never injured at all, Brady would have been a footnote. Plus, Brady was pretty pedestrian during his rookie season, mostly coming in relief of Bledsoe, and him winning his first ring was during his SOPHOMORE season. So no, TB12 did not win his first championship ring right off the bat, contrary to what most TB12 fanboys will tell you. Being put in the right position matters for a QB's development, and that includes Brady himself.
People hate on baker mayfield. But he was the obvious #1 QB in the 2018 and there was zero indication that he was a bust after his rookie year. But cleveland still could only develop him into an average QB. Baker went head to head with mahomes in college. If baker went to the bills and Allen to the browns. I could see mahomes and mayfield being the top 2 young QBs right now.
College film sure doesn't translate well. The welcome to the NFL moments are every D player is faster than most on the best college teams, many DCs are among the best 25 ever and Belichick eats rookie QBs for desert. Couch lasted ~5 seasons. WFT ruined RG III. Best college QBs go to the worst teams. Situation & coach matters. Matt Stafford beat the odds (thnx Megatron).
Yeah, I'm going to pretend Peyton got the Colts to the playoffs while having neck surgery and somehow the team got the 1st overall pick and drafted Luck LOL. The 2012 Colts just show the amount of talent Luck had and why he was the most hyped QB prospect ever, one of the best carry jobs by any QB ever, let alone a rookie, I believe he is the only 1st overall pick to take his team to the playoffs year one but I might be wrong.
@@justinbaker941 PFF is garbage. PFF rated the 2009 kC ol bottom of the nfl in run blocking for 6 weeks. After that, they became the top run blocking unit in football the remainder of the season. Did the OL get better? No. They changed running backs. PFF cant distinguish responsibilities of players. The people doing the grades are simply not qualified to grade players. Citing PFF for grading NFL players has no value to me, and the roster purge by irsay was part of the tank job. He should have been fined for that bullshit. Luck retiring early was poetic.
Herbert and Burrow break the narrative in this video. They came in with shit offensive lines and garbage defenses at their back. Everything about their situation sucks. Herbert literally must score 30 points a game or lose, in many cases he needed 35. Burrow and Herbert can’t do this without talent, I don’t care who their WRs are.
So does Josh Allen. He saw playoffs the year before and assumed good team.... negating the team was on a league leading, PROFESSIONAL SPORTS IN NA leading, playoff drought & had just gutted their roster knowing they lucked into the playoffs when the Ravens choked in week 17. Then they lost 10-3 to Jacksonville, & that was it. Talk about dysfunctional organizations, the Bills never developed a QB in over 2 decades. I was 13 the last time they had made the playoffs, then 31 the next time they made it! Allen's rookie roster was a mess. It took 2 more years of building around him & him busting his ass like crazy to develop into what the Bills hoped he would become. It was anything but a "good" situation in Buffalo before Allen got there.
@@corey2232 Allen rookie season would have broken most 1st round drafted QBs. In one game the Bills were clowned so bad by the Chargers that a secondary player quit the team during halftime. You dont over come this kind of dysfunction unless you have right stuff. This mentality that QBs are ruined if they’re not on training wheels and a bib is nonsense.
J&D Productions: “Don’t take a RB in the first round, an average RB can be elite behind a good OL” “Don’t take a WR early in the draft” “Situation is more important than talent when drafting a QB”. Ok when I’m a GM I will only draft defensive players and offensive linemen in the top 10
Honestly? Yeah, what’s the point of having the next Mahomes or Josh Allen if they’re getting sacked all the time, their receivers drop every pass, and their defense can’t stop a light breeze
It would also be important to not draft line backers and saftey in the top 10 as they too have limited upside. So you should only draft either side of the line or corner
Drafting more O-Line early would be a wise move for a LOT of teams.
The FANS love flashy skill position players so of course they want the next Mahomes or D-Hop or whoever to go in the first. But TEAMS, management, coaches, scouts, should know which positions matter and they’re not just the highlight reel players. Draft more O-Line. Everyone.
Basically the Indianapolis Colts
You win in the trenches so you'd have success
I’m an Australian so I don’t know the game as well as you guys but I’m always astounded when a team doesn’t go hard for a good o line as a priority. In my train of thought isn’t protecting your Qb the main priority and also freeing him up with time in the pocket to find a receiver.
Rugby fan, eh? There’s a compelling argument that talent at skill positions is worthless without a solid line. Which is true to a point- QBs who don’t get 2.5 seconds of a clean pocket can’t make throws, routes have no time to develop, backs have no open field. It’s true to a point.
A mid-tier like can be compensated for with godlike talent at skills positions, and the game is evolving from a league of pocket passers to QBs who can move the sticks with their legs.
You can have an effective offense with an average o-line if your skill positions are elite. It’s much easier to have an elite o-line who will make your average skill players appear Godly.
Yea it is for many teams, O tackle is one of the three positions (OT, QB, DE) that u will usually see picked first overall or close to it. Im a jets fan, and our line is one of the biggest reasons why our offense is so shit
But why aren’t Offensive Lineman paid more? That’s a fair question
This is why I love the Penix pick for the falcons. Now he gets to sit back and develop behind Cousin’s
Obviously a better team makes a good QB, but there’s no way that talent doesn’t matter. Alex Smith’s Chiefs were not the same as Mahomes’ Chiefs
Both teams were actually good offensively tho
@@MustacheDLuffy But one was a generational offense and one couldn't make it far in the playoffs
@@MustacheDLuffy Smith's chiefs had a good offense once in 5 years.
4of 5 years they were a bottom 5 pass offense. One year smith threw 0 tds to a WR.
I think people forget that early on in reid's run KC was about Jamaal charles and a great defense.
@@MustacheDLuffy not even close. KC’s offense was bottom tier for most of the Smith era. Mahomes is what made the chiefs what they are today.
@@SycoticForeverNeverAF A lot of people forget the media and fans blasted KC for cutting maclin, insisting a returner like hill could never be a #1 WR. He was, and I quote "just a poor man's percy harvin"
They're wrong more than they're right. Like meteorologists.
Dude Trevor Lawrence was fully thrown into a chaotic mess of a situation. As a full on Rookie. I still believe he can thrive in the NFL
Crazy enough he is
Hotdogs are good
You do realize if you’re a bad team you usually will continue to be bad only now with a young quarterback who is expected to be good
Your use of "situation" is such a vague term, can literally say that about any player drafted in the 1st round. Josh Allen inherited a 9-7 Buffalo Bills who lost basically their entire offensive line other than Dion Dawkins. Allen's #1 receiver was Kelvin Benjamin and WR2 was Robert Foster. What a team needs is a competent front office who does due diligence in selecting a head coach that possesses the right attitude to facilitate culture. Then selecting the players who fit the mold both personally and athletically. McDermott is a disciple of Ron Rivera, suggesting Josh Allen or Pat Mahommes wouldn't succeed in DC is asinine.
0:50 Jags went 3-14 in 2021 not 1-15. Trevor Lawrence was drafted after the Jags went 1-15.
I think people greatly overestimate the Bills organization that Allen was drafted into.
Sure, they lucked into the playoffs via less than 10% odds heading into week 17 the year before, but they were on a 17 year playoff DROUGHT, longest in the league before that.
Their roster was terrible. Look at Allen's first year roster. They had nobody. They went into the season with only 2 QBs on the roster, Nathan Peterman as the stater, Allen as the "project," raw backup.
But they were so bad so early that Josh was forced to play by half time game 1. Midway through the season, they were so desperate for a veteran QB they sign Derek Anderson out of retirement, then Matt Barkley off the streets when he got injured.
This was NOT a "stable" situation. It was the opposite. McDermott was a first time HC, it was Brandon Beane's first draft as GM, & the team was in complete rebuold mode.
Allen had to bust his ass & really apply himself over the first 2 years, just as the team had to slowly build up a roster around him. It didn't exist when he got there. The situation was terrible.
So scratch that one from the list please. The Bills were not like Chiefs who just won 12 games under Alex Smith.
Saw the pfp and thought i unknowingly commented 3 weeks ago on a video i had never seen lol
Sigh. That defense has bailing out a QB who has turned the ball over the most since he been in the league.
At 4:52, “Quinn Brady?” 🤣
I think his name is Brady Quinn. 😂
Someone is having Tom Brady nightmares again....Hmmmm, J&D>?? :)
I have always thought that some teams can never develop a QB
That Deshuan joke had me lmao 🤣😂
I'm so happy about the hastily made Cleveland tourism video part 2 reference
Talent does matter however in an exstent. It depends who you draft if you draft somebody like Patrick Mahomes who is smart and talented then you should draft him. However somebody like Ryan Leaf that uses talent wrong you dont draft.
It's a full package. Talent, intelligence, maturity, etc.
Talent is much less important than intelligence and calmness in a qb. If you have a qb that is super physically gifted but is dumb and can't read a defense or sticks to his bad habits despite having it brought out by the coach then he's gonna be a massive pick thrower and liability.
I’d say that talent matters, but situation matters more
🎯
Talent matters more than ever when it comes to Qbs bc whether Qbs are good or great they all still demand 40+ million nowadays
Real chad teams draft some kid in round 3 to start every 3 years and trade him for a first when the contract is about to expire
Basically, If you want to develop a QB. Do the exact opposite that the dolphins have done the previous 2 years. And it might still be too late for Tua.
Matthew Stafford developed into one of the better QBs in the NFL in the dumpster fire that is Detroit. How good your QB gets is more dependent on your QB than anything else. How much he HWEENS, however, is dependent upon the situation.
Tua has some hope, the dolphins invested heavily into getting some help this year
Talent is extremely important. But what's behind the ears is more important. You are making a correlation/causation fallacy. First of all, PROCESSING and quick reaction time is a _talent._ Second, these rare instances of talented guys succeeding in the NFL isn't just because of the team developing them, it's because they have what it takes to _be_ developed. Mahomes would have been good no matter where he went. He perhaps wouldn't have been a future Hall of Famer, but he was going to be good.
Case in point: *_Matthew Stafford._* He was _always_ good. He was 6th in NFL history at 4th quarter comebacks _before_ he got to the Rams. He had 8 seasons of 4000+ yards, including one 5000+ yard season, _before_ he got to the Rams. The only thing he was bad at was _winning._ But he was clearly a good QB, even on the Lions. Now, you could argue had he ended up in a better situation he'd be a surefire future Hall of Famer. But, as it stands, he was still one of the better QBs in the NFL the entire time the Lions were sucking.
WR core in some cases doesn’t really matter. Lamar’s 2019 season had a top 10 O-line but a bottom 5 wr core with rookie Hollywood, Seth Roberts and willie Snead
He had Mark Andrews, though.
@@someperson8151 and a good defense. And a great run game.
@@whitewhale9012 He was his own run game to be fair
@@TruthLC The ravens would have a top 5 run game if they didnt run him so much.
Provided all of their RBs arent on IR by the start of the season.
Buuuuut you're not wrong.
He had pretty much everything besides a receiving core, still does tbh
This topic requires a lot of nuance.
I feel like the proper ratio between QB Skill and Good Team has to be 60/40 - the 60 bring Skill. Look at Kirk Cousins and the Vikings for example, on a great 2018-19 team, Cousins (because an above average at best QB) couldn’t elevate the team to the next level. It’s just not as easy as saying “situation matters” it’s a whole lot more
With Patrick Mahomes, Andy Reid basically repeated his earlier stint with the Eagles with #2 o/a pick D McNabb & veteran backup QB Doug Pederson. Situation is vital for rookie QB: starts at the top with ownership with patience & faith in HC & HC’s “blueprint,” and either a ready to win now roster (Cowboys) or sufficient cap space & draft picks to add skill players. Having a “go to” receiver helps a lot (Kelce, Gronk, Edelmann or C Megatron Johnson). Future looks positive for CJ Stroud who just might make Texans forget that previous guy except for all Cleveland’s draft picks (cynically, the picks would’ve been wasted anyway).
Of course, the QB has to have the right mental & leadership makeup (Mahomes) and not self-destruct (Manziel or J Russell).
He said Aaron Rodgers is the best player in football 😂😂
J&D Productions - "What do you need in order to have a successful quarterback?"
J&D Productions - "Oh I don't know, maybe a good offensive line, good wide receivers, a good coach"
lmao
Being in the right situation doesn’t mean shit to an elite talent. Talent will always transcend everything. I bury the Browns every chance I get for not taking Josh Allen, but then I’ll get the folks who say he wouldn’t have been as good as he is had the Browns drafted him…..which is absolutely absurd. Every great QB didn’t just fall into a perfect scenario.
Peyton Manning is another example of this. The Colts were a pretty clueless organization before he came along. Joe Burrow as this video mentioned. I think it's a ratio personally. Even though Stafford I think has elite talent, Detroit dragged him down to being above average.
As a Bills fan I have to agree. Josh Allen would have been successful no matter where he landed. It's the competitive fire and the willingness to do what it takes to win that complements his natural gifts. That will shine no matter what the situation.
Great QBs MAKE the organization and history. Not the other way around. 👌
And Justin Herbert was picked after Tua, meanwhile Tua has been put in a bad position down in Miami
Tua landed in a better situation than Herbert AND Burrow. The difference is the Bengals and Chargers know how to draft and not overspend on Free Agents like the Dolphins. Burrow and Herbert both played behind literally the two worst Offensive Lines their rookie year
@@RioluLucario1994 the dolphins made some smart moves in the draft by getting waddle, Holland and promising DE but we 100% failed in Free agency by getting Will Fuller who played only three games because he got a injured and a bunch of depths pieces
1:55 u got me bro I ain’t even gl
I’ve been saying this for a very long time. My friends ignore me a lot about it, but a better team makes a better QB. A good QB won’t make a bad team turn around. A team with certain offense elements may make a QB look good, but if the entirety of the team isn’t good there still won’t be success.
There are talents that transcend there situation but they are really rare. Joe burrow taking the Bengals to the super bowl his first full year as a starter is a great example. Talent does matter but situation is also very important.
Shitheap organizations could be given the next GOAT and still mess it up.
The Bears, Jags, and Dolphins are all gonna ruin their young QBs without a doubt
I agree with this. Tom Brady doesn't have a shred of athletic talent but he makes up for it with good decision making and a high football IQ.
It’s interesting that once Jacksonville got a proven coach in Doug Peterson and the situation was more stable, Lawrence became a top 10 QB! Situation absolutely matters.
I've been people that for years! Situations matter! Smart teams usually picks linemen or defense if they're that high.
Great video. As a Broncos fan, my only disappointment was the total lack of Paxton Lynch mentions. lol
Like the video but the Colts only won 2 games the year before Andrew luck. I think still he was in a good situation with Bruce arians as HC his rookie year (after Chuck got cancer) but Luck and Big Ben play similarly so it was a good match but we definitely sucked the year before
Andrew Luck, Joe Burrow, and Peyton Manning are really the outliers here. Those guys legitimately changed their teams for the better
You broke your own argument by referencing Detroit. Stafford has been seen as a great QB by coaches, players, and anyone who actually saw his games for years. Yeah he's getting recognition by more of the fan base, but Stafford was going to be a baller anywhere.
they're equally important. How do you explain late round QB's. For every Taylor Heinicke, Dak there are Aaron Murray and Nick Mullins. 19 of the 32 starting QB's are in the 1st round and a bunch more in the 2nd round.
As a Notre Dame fan the Quinn Brady shook me
4:26 Quinn Brady, huh...
Ahh, yes, Quinn Brady. Husband to Sister of Hawk AJ
Remember kids, football is a TEAM game. Of course the player who has to give the ball to a bunch of other guys on every play is going to be most impacted by the TEAM.
This is why Stafford was built different. Shit team. Still succeeds. Different breed
The 2010 colts were a much different team than the 2012 colts. Luck straight carried that terrible roster and is a much different scenario than what was insinuated in this video.
Rivers to Herbert debunk this theory.
When these pundits say Miami was stupid to draft Tua over Herbert...if Miami drafted Herbert, they'd be saying how Herbert sucks and Tua is so amazing. It's the situation and not the talent.
Talent does matter. Trubisky wasn't drafted over mahomes because of talent.
Situation matters. Obviously.
What matters more than both is a QB being 'that guy' who outworks everyone. It matters if they can lead men. It matters if they can rally a team, or be the cultural centerpiece for other players.
A lot of things matter.. but realistically talent is a big part of what makes Allen and Mahomes great. Every other QB too.
You shoulda mentioned mac jones in New England vs Lawrence down in Jacksonville. If Trevor went to NE he woukda been a baller his rookie year while mac woulda struggled in Jacksonville.
4:49 Uhhh...Quinn Brady, is that Tom Brady's nephew? ....Ok, but seriously you got the first and last name switched there.
Talent most definitely matter. It's just not everything. Development is.
This is probably the reason why Colts refuse to draft a QB and kept doing 1 year rentals since Luck retired.
Talent doesn’t matter …look at mahomes and Allen ….blue chip arm talent and running ability …Herbert …yes , it matters. …ex. Leinert or Sanchez weren’t going to be good , no matter where they were drafted to …g ms fall in love with guys who play at big schools …instead of looking at how their skill set and talent level will translate to the nfl
I joke w/ my grandpa who's a Bears fan a lot b/c it's like "oh you could've had Mahomes but you drafted Trubisky" but at the same time, I doubt Mahomes would be Mahomes if he went to Chicago. Hell if the two were swapped we could be talking about 2 time SB champ Mitch Trubisky now, who knows?
"Why being high doesn't matter when you're making content"
J&D: starts listing examples that support his thesis
Me: Yeah, definitely gotta agree with J&D overall here, I mean it's more like a guideline than a-
J&D 5 minutes later, still listing examples
Me: JFC
Awesome vid
Great video Love the VT flag. Go hokies
"The Colts making the playoffs the year before with Peyton Manning" 2011 Peyton was hurt and on IR. They had Charlie Whitehurst that year and played terrible
thats where you are wrong because the year Manning was on IR Curtis Painter was put in as the Colts starting QB
@@ernestogastelum9123 I knew it was Painter but said whitehurst for some reason because I think he was still on the Titans around that time
The owner tanked and intentionally sabotaged the team to get luck.
They werent as bad as the record. Caldwell was a fine coach, but he took the blame. Irsay is an asshat who damn near got a lottery instated.
Thank you for finally recognizing how good Aaron Rodgers is. He's gets out at qb 4 or 5 every year and just keeps winning the mvp
English?
I’ve never heard someone say “as a Washington fan…”
Fast Forward - Now Chiefs have Matt Nagy, Chief's LOW YEAR EVER with barely any offensive weapons. Your video is 100% correct
ofc talent matters. Just imagine those lower drafted qbs that ended up in good situations, if they were playing for the jets, texans or falcons. Their numbers would be even more horrifying. We've seen recent examples like Drew Locke. Decent talent, good team, but not talented enough to make any impact.
Locke has talent.
What he lacks is skill.
although good points were made, brock purdy had over 50 starts in college, thats considered being pro ready...was drafted into the best possible situation and yet he'll never win a SB because he lacks talent... talent is what separates good QBs from great QBs.
Kyler Murray is watching this, fuming
Had it not been for the rookie contract caveat, he would surely be an exception to the rule. He's made the Cardinals better every season and is on track to be a real good one.
"Quinn Brady" , "Brady Tom", tomato tomahto
Talent does matter at QB
The Jaguars did not go 1-15 in 2021 they went 3-14
Basically unless your like the 2017 Browns or 2019 Bengals, don't take a quarterback because he can't carry a team that's just bad like the Texans
I’ve been saying this for years thank you for saying it
Eh situation matters for the first couple years, but past that your qb needs to actually have elite talent to remain a franchise qb
U ever heard of cam Newton
I’m getting really tired of takes that say you shouldn’t draft dudes other then OL and DL simply because of bust rates. Simply put draft what your team needs, if they need a QB in the first round get it, if they need a WR get it, if they need a RB get it. Maybe the reason busts rates are so high isn’t because those positions are getting drafted so high, it’s because teams to draft high tend to be you know bad. Bad teams tend to be bad because of front offense incompetence, not because they drafted a QB in the first round.
THIS! ^^^^^
Take Mahomes and put him on the Dolphins or the Lions in the 20-Teens.
2-14 would be a GOAL for that team
I know I will trigger a lot of TB12 fanboys with this take, but if they cannot face facts, that's on them.
Yes, we know Brady was a 6th round pick, but while TB12 fanboys will twist the narrative to make their "messiah" look great, Brady was also put in a good position to succeed. Remember, Brady was sitting behind Drew Bledsoe, a talented QB in his own right. Belichick was always known as a defensive coach, and you can always count on the Patriots defense when it mattered. If Bledsoe was never injured at all, Brady would have been a footnote. Plus, Brady was pretty pedestrian during his rookie season, mostly coming in relief of Bledsoe, and him winning his first ring was during his SOPHOMORE season. So no, TB12 did not win his first championship ring right off the bat, contrary to what most TB12 fanboys will tell you.
Being put in the right position matters for a QB's development, and that includes Brady himself.
I agree. If Tom Brady had gone to another team, he likely wouldn't even be a recognizable name.
Uhm..He DID go to another team. The Bucs. And he won a Superbowl. His first year.
....Next?
People hate on baker mayfield. But he was the obvious #1 QB in the 2018 and there was zero indication that he was a bust after his rookie year. But cleveland still could only develop him into an average QB. Baker went head to head with mahomes in college. If baker went to the bills and Allen to the browns. I could see mahomes and mayfield being the top 2 young QBs right now.
Except Jordan Love
Bills went to the playoffs the year before Allen, right and then they lost 3 starting O-linemen.
Wtf the Colts won 2 games to draft Andrew Luck goofball
Boy said Quinn Brady
I think I agree with this. Bengals really lucked out with Joe Burrow
Burrow? And then is Jordan Love gonna be amazing too?
By this logic, Jordan love will become the best the game has ever seen
Andrew Luck made it to the playoff with a team that won 2 games the year prior lol. Wytalking about
Derek carr went to the raiders and then ended up balling.
College film sure doesn't translate well. The welcome to the NFL moments are every D player is faster than most on the best college teams, many DCs are among the best 25 ever and Belichick eats rookie QBs for desert.
Couch lasted ~5 seasons. WFT ruined RG III. Best college QBs go to the worst teams. Situation & coach matters.
Matt Stafford beat the odds (thnx Megatron).
Absolutely absurd. Pat mahomes was one of the most talented QB in college. He threw for nearly 800 yds in one game against my Sooners
Uhh yea it does to an extent
Bro what are you talking about? If it came down to situation baker would still be in Cleveland it’s about talent
Such a horrible take. Especially at the end
Quinn Brady 😂
You had to show my team (the Jets) when talking about bad teams 🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄
Gotta admit they are tho
Can you really talk about bad teams without mentioning the Jets at least once?
Lamar is an athletic freak, imo I think he would’ve done well almost anywhere
@raiders , there exact situation rn
QBs are overrated!
Games are won by a great defense, a serviceable QB is enough...
Brock Purdy is probably the best example of this to ever happen.
I mean, the GOAT didn't have a TON of this..."talent"...you speak of, and was taken late in the Draft... Only to become the GOAT 🔥 KIRK COUSINS 🔥
Yeah, I'm going to pretend Peyton got the Colts to the playoffs while having neck surgery and somehow the team got the 1st overall pick and drafted Luck LOL. The 2012 Colts just show the amount of talent Luck had and why he was the most hyped QB prospect ever, one of the best carry jobs by any QB ever, let alone a rookie, I believe he is the only 1st overall pick to take his team to the playoffs year one but I might be wrong.
The owner sabotaged that team in a tank job so blatant and obvious we are lucky it didnt end up causing a lottery system.
I felt bad for caldwell.
Yeah I have no idea what he was talking about when he brought up Luck, he completely ignored reality to make his argument.
@@justinbaker941 Colts would have been a .500 team if not for the owner sabotaging the coach and team.
@@whitewhale9012 Not only does this ignore the roster purge after 2011, they were ranked the 31st team overall according to PFF.
@@justinbaker941 PFF is garbage.
PFF rated the 2009 kC ol bottom of the nfl in run blocking for 6 weeks. After that, they became the top run blocking unit in football the remainder of the season.
Did the OL get better? No. They changed running backs.
PFF cant distinguish responsibilities of players. The people doing the grades are simply not qualified to grade players.
Citing PFF for grading NFL players has no value to me, and the roster purge by irsay was part of the tank job. He should have been fined for that bullshit. Luck retiring early was poetic.
Jags went 3-15. Because 18 games, not 1-15 like you said
Herbert and Burrow break the narrative in this video. They came in with shit offensive lines and garbage defenses at their back. Everything about their situation sucks. Herbert literally must score 30 points a game or lose, in many cases he needed 35. Burrow and Herbert can’t do this without talent, I don’t care who their WRs are.
Herbert, at least, had good skill position players. Burrow didn't have all the skill position players until year two.
Most nfl teams that succeed have shit defenses in favor of strong offenses
So does Josh Allen. He saw playoffs the year before and assumed good team.... negating the team was on a league leading, PROFESSIONAL SPORTS IN NA leading, playoff drought & had just gutted their roster knowing they lucked into the playoffs when the Ravens choked in week 17.
Then they lost 10-3 to Jacksonville, & that was it.
Talk about dysfunctional organizations, the Bills never developed a QB in over 2 decades. I was 13 the last time they had made the playoffs, then 31 the next time they made it!
Allen's rookie roster was a mess. It took 2 more years of building around him & him busting his ass like crazy to develop into what the Bills hoped he would become.
It was anything but a "good" situation in Buffalo before Allen got there.
@@corey2232 Allen rookie season would have broken most 1st round drafted QBs. In one game the Bills were clowned so bad by the Chargers that a secondary player quit the team during halftime. You dont over come this kind of dysfunction unless you have right stuff. This mentality that QBs are ruined if they’re not on training wheels and a bib is nonsense.
Let me see a lance breakdown Pls !
Bruh, are an italian american?
Quinn Brady lol