5.0L 4V COYOTE MODS-NITROUS & HEADERS (GEN 1 YOTE)
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- Опубліковано 28 чер 2024
- FULL RESULTS1 NITROUS 5.0L COYOTE. BIG BANG COMING!! COYOTE MODS-PLUS- We announce the BIG BANG Turbo Coyote TEST!! How much power can the SBE COYOTE TAKE? Can it beat the current king-the 1543-hp 6.0L LS? On the Gen 1 Coyote-Nitrous Oxide, headers, tune, Ford Racing Crate Motor. How well does the early Coyote respond to performance mods?
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It's the middle of the night, let me see what Richard has posted. ; )
🤣
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BIG BANG COYOTE, WOOOOO! Oh man, I'm pretty pumped for this!
With no shortage of 900-1000HP
"stock Mustang GT with twin turbos" chassis dyno runs, I gotta say, I'm feeling pretty optimistic once you remove the power loss of the drivetrain(through the additional direct changes of an independent rear suspension in newer cars too don't forget!), the exhaust, intake, restricted airflow of an engine bay, and accessories from the equation. If we do the guesstimate napkin math, a 1000HP chassis dyno run is about 1150HP with a 15% adjustment, and 1200HP with a 20% adjustment - and, while I don't know if I would keep a 'street car' stock Coyote at that power level, there are people driving these things around without any pattern of failures that I've seen. In other words, that's a very roughly estimated 1200HP with room to spare.
Enough room for another roughly 350HP increase? Well that's the big question of course.
The heads are absolutely there, whether stock 2011s(IIRC, outflow GT/GT500 Mod heads by ~4%) or the new GT350/GT500 monster heads, the intake side is there, the exhaust side is there, the valvetrain has always been there in the Ford DOHCs, and the crank is there - but the pistons, rods, and possibly the block? Guess we're going to find out. The blocks haven't traditionally been considered 'safe' over ~1000HP, the Coyote seems to move around a little more than the Teksid 4.6l, the sleeves don't seem to hold up - but the same is true for factory LSx stuff too.
'Big bang' isn't about practical strength though; it's about absolute strength, bring on the 'hero' runs!!!
Then there is itsjusta6 that can't keep one together. They are kick ass motors for sure but there are plenty that are breaking.
Looks like they are using gen 1 Coyotes. Those rods are no stronger than LS gen 4 rods. Now, if they were using a gen 2 Coyote I can pretty much guarantee it would exceed that 6.0 LS big bang of 1540 HP. But that 6.0 LS isn't a 6.2. 6.2 with LS3 style heads would make more power than the 6.0 tested if you really wanted to make things fair.
@@shawnsanders9450 the 6.0 big bang motor didn't blow he ran out of map sensor so he would have to put more boost on it to find out where it gave anyhow. Gen 4 ls rods are solid the Gen 3 are the weaker ones and even they are pretty strong but they gave out around 1300lbft
@@thatturbotruck I think one of the keys with the coyote is going to be the revs. If it'll live at 8500 rpm on stock rods (and I really don't know if it will), then you can keep the cylinder pressures down and spin it for power. Peak power at 8000 rpm would require "only" 1000 lbs-ft of torque to make over 1500 hp. Based on what the Honda guys have done on stock rods, you can make some pretty impressive power on relatively weak parts if you can keep the torque levels down. Definitely looking forward to this series!
@@thatturbotruck right, they actually don't know the limit of that gen 4 LS yet. That's true.
7.3 godzilla big bang?
Good idea
That thing would probably decimate it.... Really really really strong from factory
Not enough in circulation yet, but I’d like to see this as well
Great idea!
This will be interesting. Let it rip and let’s see what happens. I’m a huge fan of the coyote platform. It’s just crazy expensive compared to the LS stuff.
Scott Sigmon I agree, luckily the gen 1’s were in enough trucks that prices have come down a good bit. I’ve picked up several complete drop outs from trucks for under $1000, tons of miles but it’s boost friendly and the 6r80 with a converter is pretty impressive.
@@videokiller96 complete pan to tb gas engines at my yard at 260$
Would be great to to a Big Bang test in the new 7.3L Ford truck motor as well 😉
I'll be surprised if we don't see this within the next year or so - surely Ford will release a crate+control pack version, and Rich is the go-to guy for magazine engine testing. HOPEFULLY that actually happens and Ford Racing sends Hotrod Mag a crate engine - then we could get a write up of the architecture, see Freiburger & Co get their hands on it for the Engine Masters show, and Rich get ahold of it for some parts comparos and a 'big bang'!
Here's to dreaming...
As per usual, Valuable information, high quality video production, daily postings and good work Richard
You have the coolest job In The world. I would never feel like I’m at work.
Really enjoying your videos! I enjoy the experimenting aspect of your videos. Refreshing to hear someone that knows what they’re talking about.
I believe the 2015-17 gen 2 Coyote with it's factory forged rods and crank shaft should hold more power than the LS. There are Turbo gen 2 Coyotes running 8's through a stock/sealed motor. Supposedly the Coyotes weak points are the oil pump gears, so as long as you don't bang against the rev limiter the OPG's shouldn't fail.
My Guy never fails to impress!!!
As for performance, the coyote platform is amazing. The make a ton of power right out of the box and respond really well to upgrades, especially boost. The only issue I have with them is their physical size- they just take up a ton space under the hood. The debate over which platform (LS/LT or Coyote) makes more power is mute- both are capable of making ridiculous HP numbers.
Generally speaking, for longevity, around 600-750hp is the limit on the stock Coyote. After that, sleeves, rods, and pistons are good idea and any time you're that deep into the motor put billet oil pump gears in it, especially if belt-driven supercharged. Also, the 12mm block is preferable as it has thicker, deeper head bolts/studs that tie directly into the main webbing. 11mm block are okay but known to crack around the knock sensor boss under very high boost. Do all that these engines are known to be happy at 1500hp, which is pretty incredible considering it a production aluminum block 5 liter. That would be like an aluminum block 6.2l LS making 1,820hp.
Excited for the Coyote stuff
More FORD !!! Yes ,,,, this dude is awesome 😎
great video.... please keep it going
Finally some Ford stuff. Would really like to see some more N/A tests. Thanks again for the videos....
Great video
Great video Rich! I still own and love your Dyno-Proven SBF performance book. I'd really love to see a Big Bang test on a 90's truck Ford 351W! Maybe one on a Vortec 350 as well?
i did the 351W big bang
@@richardholdener1727 I remember that, but I believe it blew up when the wastegate spring was removed entirely? Lol
1054 glorious horsepower on that 351w
The almighty 351w, the original LS. I'm currently building one right now with a set of early 351w heads for my 1980 Coupe Fox. It'll be a fun car!
@@richardholdener1727 can we see the coyote engine big bang? Is it happening soon?
Big Bang Ford 7.3 gas
More, more, more please!!!
Can you get your hands on. Ford Godzilla motor. And BIG BANG IT
Cant wait for that big bang Coyote.
Poor Richard...what a life...the engines he sacrifices, so that others may live...
We don't deserve you, sir!
Even as a Ford guy, 1,543 hp is a tall order, gen 2 engine or not.
Yea, it's pretty unpredictable at that level. The heads & crank are there for sure - but neither the Coyote blocks nor LSx blocks are considered "safe" over about 1000HP, they both have relatively weak cylinder liners for any kind of extended use at those levels.
As long as everything can hold up to some 'hero runs', then the Coyote 'should' be able to match any of the LSx short blocks, the architecture is there, the cylinder heads are certainly there(IIRC, Gen 1 heads outflow GT/GT500 heads by 4% or so, and they've only been improved), but we'll see if the bottom end is there. I am feeling a bit optimistic, there's no shortage of "stock Mustang GT with twin turbos" chassis dyno runs hitting 900-1000RWHP. Add in the lack of drivetrain loss & accessories/intake/exhaust of an engine dyno, plus the "big bang formula"(ring gap and what not), and it's looking REALLY compelling for sure...
@@RyTrapp0 Have to disagree about the LS blocks not being reliable over 1000hp. I am pretty sure I have heard Richard say he has well over 70 pulls over 1000hp on more than one stock LS block.
@@BigMikesGarage Iron or aluminum? The Coyote is an aluminum block so we're comparing it to aluminum block LS's for strength. I think any stock production aluminum block is in the danger zone over 1000hp.
That said, there is an iron block for the Coyote that might come out this year or next that is designed to withstand ProMod horsepower levels so Coyote guys will have the option too.
177SCmaro isnt the truck coyote a cast iron block? Or is it all aluminum too?
@@CraftsmanQuad19
No, all 5.0 Coyote production blocks are cast aluminum. They are heavily ribbed though to withstand a lot of power and miles.
More Coyote stuff please!
it will be close....LS vs coyote shootout LS won handily BUT was 427lsx and only cam chain broke on coyote at 1350hp or so....so, upgrade cam chains for sure!!! This channel is amazing! You are saving SO MANY PEOPLE SO MUCH MONEY......there might be a bounty out on you !
When are we ever going to get the big Bang test
the coyote motors are very responsive to mods, the killer is their size. compared to an LS they are huge.
One of the biggest little engines around! 29.5 inchs wide up top but they are pretty narrow down low.
Their size and the cost of aftermarket parts for it is why I don't want one.
Another reason to run an LS is you have more choices of transmissions... GM has had the same bellhousing bolt pattern since the first small block V8 in 1955 to today.
LS is the cheapest and most compact way to make power in whatever you wanna put it in. I'm putting a 5.3 in my 88 Isuzu Spacecab pickup with a T56 and a narrowed Ford 9" I built with disc brakes and a full spool.
@@theall-seeingpie8887
The entire Ford modular family, including the Coyote, has the same bellhousing pattern as far as I'm aware. And you can buy bellhousings that adapt a coyote to a GM transmission if you want which really opens up the possibilities. I'm doing that myself.
And if you want the absolute lowest hp/$ you should probably forgo the LS and just get a BBC. Yes, it's a bit wider and heavier but much more displacement to make easy HP and torque with.
LS is a great choice too, don't get me wrong, but the Coyote is more flexible then a lot of people think and the LS isn't always as inexpensive as people think.
An L** big block should be able to take more than an LS I would think. Especially one setup with real good flowing heads and a mid sized cam.
Big Bang Big Block. That'd be a good test. Another would be putting a LS 427 against a BB427, both identical cams, rocker ratios and good intakes.
Kimbal Mackinnon or the new lsx454 vs bbc 454
I know you like doing the v8 stuff. I enjoy it as well, but id love to see some 4cyl testing, personally id like to see the gm ecotec platform testing like the lsj,lnf/ldk,lhu etc
sinformant, I was just thinking the same thing, definitely want to see some 2.2 Ecotec testing. 👍🏻
the direct injected 4.3 and the Atlas 4.2 also while we’re suggesting smaller displacement stuff
Eww
GM already did all this in building their record holding 2.2 ecotec fwd drag car
www.superstreetonline.com/how-to/engine/turp-0203-gm-racing-ecotec-engine
Big bang Hemi next!
Just Rev it over 6000 for 30 seconds...
@@ianm432 coyote is a v8 vtec honda
If I recall correctly, you ran out of MAP sensor on the Big Bang LS motor so you should get a 4 or 5 bar sensor and redo the test!
I will if the Coyote makes more
10 bar map sensor long live the 6.0🤣
Richard Holdener Can you please make a video on oil viscosity and how it can affect power and reliability? Maybe do a test running 20, 30, 40 and 50 weight oils on the same motor seeing how it responds on the dyno to the different weights? Thanks!
4am here.
Love the vids.
I dont really care for nitrous dyno runs bcuz no telling what ppl do out there when they jet their nozzel or what is a 100hp jet from company to company.
10 psi of boost is 10 psi no matter who or where you are.
In my garage we have a 2011 GT Coyote and a 2007 6.0 Corvette and we monkey around with both.
I wish you would be testing the Gen 2 Coyote which is better in every way over the early gen 1. SBE Gen 1's are good until they start flinging rods at 740ish whp but the Gen 2 Coyote (which got a lot of the Boss 302's tech) can get their more easily and live a happy life at 850-900whp and 1,000whp if you want to show off on occasion.
The Big Bang motor will be Gen 2
looking forward to the big bang video. I would kinda like to see the ly6 go again with a 4 or 5 bar map sensor and see how far it will really go till something breaks.
i'm most impressed by the baseline numbers.
Richard I've been waiting for this. So exvited6
I would love to see what you could do with a carbureted NA gen 2 Coyote with really high compression and locked out cam's. Think it would make a good power plant on a vintage stick shift race car like a Maverick, similar to those wheel standing Fox's in the sealed Coyote engine class.
I love the coyote but I doubt it will beat the 6.0L
Inferno_Spud honestly that new LT L83 is 🔥
In terms of bottom line hp numbers the Coyote and the ~6l LS are usually pretty similar. Were the Coyote shines is hp/l as it does what the LS does with a liter or more less displacement. LS usually wins in torque though.
@@177SCmaro LS has cubes and more torque, but the coyote makes peak power really high in the rev range (assuming correct camshafts). That will somewhat make up for the displacement, ultimately won't beat the 6.0's peak though. My guess.
@@177SCmaro I love the Coyote for it's tech, but the LS is so small on it's outside dimensions I can easily see why pretty much everyone loves them for the big power / small package aspect. Put them in anything with plenty of room for additional activities like turbos etc in a small chassis. I'm a Coyote owner / lover here, and I do think they make good power for their displacement, but the damn things are friggin huge with their 4cam 32 valve design, just a different way to do it I suppose.
@@MrLightning54
Tell me about it. I'm swapping a Coyote into my second gen Camaro racecar, which are known to have pretty large engine bays, and it just barely fits between the A-arms. It certainly has "presence" in any engine bay, lol.
The main man richard
This Chevy guy gives two thumbs up
Mmmm Coyote motors! 😀😀😀😀
Great video, I'm super excited to see the coyote stuff!
In the beginning if the next video, I would really appreciate it if you would put up a dyno chart of the stock coyote with headers vs a stock 5.3 LS with headers, just so we have an easy comparison/refrence going forward.
what comparison is that-the LS that has the record is a 6.0L. A 5.3L with headers makes 355 hp. The Coyote makes 455 hp-a 6.0L LQ4 makes 405 hp.
@@richardholdener1727
It would just be interesting to see the baseline torque and power curves of each motor all on the same graph together, just so we can have an easy visual of how they all compare to each other in stock(ish) trim.
It's by no means mandatory, just something I would like to see if you have time.
@@Cowboy.underwater why don't you compare the ls3 to the coyotah? The 5.3 was never intended as a performance engine.
@@HioSSilver1999: Wow, that little 5.0 made 50 more HP than the 6.0. That's impressive.
"I'm OG Coyote!" ❤
The stock oil pump gears will likely fail before the bottom end does.
@Richard Holdener Could you do a Coyote test with mustang intake manifold vs truck manifold from both 2018 versions of the coyote just have to lock out imcr on them to work on 1st gen coyote
I'd be interested in seeing the test done with the holley race series intake. I dont think the boss intake or any of the factory composite intakes will hold the boost pressure needed to make the numbers well over 1000 hp.
Cant wait. You sure are going to hurt some feelings.
What with Big Bang Vortec LL8 - 4.2 inline 6, 2JZ, Chrysler RB, LA and 3rd gen Hemi.
Also what about wet nitrous test with methanol instead of gas?
6 liter shall remain undefeated
Richard, I love your videos. Would be interested in a series to explain what you do to prep jyard motors to keep them alive. Machine shops are getting harder to find, and $ so what can be done with brake clean and a ball hone? What is really needed to keep them happy at 1xxx, head studs? Deburring? Etc? I see some people that bore, do rings, bearings, etc no matter what....then others just change the oil and go even if it has 200k miles. What’s the right approach?
Lots of guys have success doing both, I wouldn't put a motor in a car with boost without gapping rings-but lots do
Shaun Perry at AED ran a similar test on his gen 2 mustang (stock block) with CPR single turbo and found the weakest part in the engine to be head bolts. I "think" he end up making 1,320ish rwhp before a head bolt let go. I haven't done the math but, through a 6r80 transmission those numbers would have to be close to the LS numbers.
Still waiting for the gen2 big bang motor .
5 bar map sensor! Full send...
Use the Cobra jet intake manifold for the Twin turbo test
Big Bang
Looking forward to the big bang Coyote series. Personally, I don't care whether or not the Ford makes more power than Chevy or Chrysler-I'm sure it'll make more power than I can use on the street or handle LOL. Just educate me on the best Ford power combo. Thank you.
"We also had Ken from Kenne Bell there to help with the tune..." 🤣 🤣 🤣
Gonna have to start setting my alarm for 4am 🤣 (central time zone)
High compression drag motors make 16+ bar BMEP. The coyote with headers and no accessories is only at 12.6 bar. The 2020 480 bhp coyote is only at 12.0 bar.
More new coyote stuff
Coyote 💪🏻 its a beast. If only ford used quality internals for the first time other than the ecotrash . Ford would be way on top with this engine
I do not have much faith in factory con rods...cant wait for this series. this episode felt like a teaser
btw, if you want significantly simplify the tuning on the Coyote you can lock out the vvt. Modular Motor Sports and Comp Cams both make parts to achieve this. MMR completely removes the phasers and replaces them with aluminum plates which removes some weight off valve train. The trade-off is you lose a good deal of torque curve, usually down low, but for a racing engine this is usually not a concern. You get really good at degreeing cams, lol.
we actually want to reduce mid range torque anyway and plan on locking them
@@richardholdener1727
Well, there you go.
What generation is your yellow dog? I have a Gen 1 Golden Retriever gotten from the wrecking yard (rescue). She's a great dog although has some rather poor emissions.
Two Goldens, so much awesome
Could you do a 3V top end on a 98 5.4 dohc bottom end? You know really Frankenstein it?
When the Big Bang come up will it have the 2018 intake manifold on it?
What about a Big Bang Hemi?
yes
Don't get me wrong I like The Big Bang Theory on Tv, BUT this is the BIG BANG Series I WANT to watch lol
I love the Coyote and was a fan before they even hit the streets. But I don't think it'll beat the LS. I'll guess bent rod at around 1400.
Thoughts on using a higher weight oil when running a gen 2 coyote at elevated horsepower ?? The rod bearings tend to fail. Would a higher weight oil have more film strength and improve bearing life ?
Yes, my dad's blown S550 runs 10w-50 to help keep the rods happy👍
Watch lake speed Jr real tuners vidy on oil
I'm excited to see the results of the big bang test. A 2010 Gt could be a great budget build that's pretty fast! I'd just go straight for the 2015 gt and keep it at 1000 Hp for reliability(turn it up at the track to run 7's). It will be interesting to see how much you can push it on the engine dyno.
2010 GT is still a 4.6 3 valve. 3 valve engines suck. Need to get a 2011, or better yet like you say a 2015. 2018+ 10 speed like mine is the best so far.
@@shawnsanders9450 oh your right i meant 2011. They only announced the gen 1 coyote in 2010. Everyone just gets a 2015 and throws the 2018 gen 3 heads on it and maybe upgrade the chain tensioner so harmonics dont break it. Pretty badass motors.
@@KillinReapers gen 3 Coyote is dual injection. It is both port and direct injection. To my knowledge gen 3 heads can't be made to fit gen 1 and gen 2 Coyotes.
Ive seen a guy put a 18 head on a stock 15 bottom end from ford. The blocks are still essentially the same design. The injection style affects the heads/intake. It's pretty common now. The gen 3 made more power just because the heads flow better but people still wsmt the gen 2 forged bottom end. You know...
@@KillinReapers no, I dont know. The gen 3 is the same bottom end as gen 2 but the pistons are slightly bigger and the bore is slightly larger. The heads have direct injection bosses so what do you do with those? Maybe you're talking about putting Vodoo 5.2 heads on gen 2 engines. That makes more sense.
Coyote is limited by bore spacing, prevents you from making big cubes when adding a stroker kit. Expensive shortblock to correct that.
Personally, I think what the coyote loses in the cubes will be somewhat made up for in the RPM it makes peak at, though I don't think it will match the 6.0. 12-1300hp is my guess.
Key will be keeping the tq levels lower and not revving excessively but with its rod length and the stroke i feel it will surpass the 5.3 and definitely be barking at the engine 1 liter its senior
Billet oil pump gears for big bang?
2010 gts have a 3v lol but still love the video
Do a Gen 3😁👌🏻
The Coyote might beat the 6.0 LS, but I sure wish you would test a Dark Horse, the 6.2 Ford SOHC Hemi truck engine.
It might beat them both, at least the potential is there.
John Parrish this
@@CraftsmanQuad19 ????????????????
John Parrish it means I agree. Or this is the truth. Or this is right. Etc
Cobra Jet Intake Manifold
we r looking at that
What size nitrous jet were used?
When is the BIG BANG? I got one on the bench waiting on this to see if I need rods and pistons lol.
Can't wait for big bang coyote screaming at 8500!
Can you do a big bang vq35de? I am very curious to know the real limit
Finally a coyote. Hopefully you do gen 2 and 3. Gen 1 motors are the weakest byfar
Gen 1 coyotes aren't any weaker than a gen 2. They have the same short locks except the gen 2 uses smaller head bolts. The gen 1 has 12mm head bolts vs the gen 2's smaller 11mm bolts. If anything, the gen 2 would be weaker. However, ford finally got it right with the gen 3 as far as strength. The gen 3 uses Boss rods and pistons along with 12mm head bolts. Not to mention, the extra power from better heads, cams, intake and compression increase. This (gen 3) coyote is what I'd like to see Richard test against the LS.
Hey Richard, how can I support you and these videos?
Get on with the BIG BANG Coyote!
I’ve seen bone stock mustangs get thrown 20psi and hold up fine, making 1000+hp on chassis dynos. I’d imagine if you did simple ring gap like the LSs, and tuned it correctly, I don’t doubt the factory motor would make 1100-1200.
The stock oil pump gears are the weak spot. If he changed those out, then it may make some big power. But since they are driven by the crank, replacing them would wipe out the claim of stock bottom end. The other big hurdle to being the HP king is the lack of displacement. Down 62 cid (1 liter) in a boosted application is a killer. With 2.5 hp+ per cid, that is a guarantee of being down 150 hp+ right from the get go.
Hey Richard I'm hoping I'm not asking for too much but what are the chances of you getting your hands on Ford's new 7.3 L engine strapping it onto your Dino and letting her rip, now I'm not a Ford guy but I'm definitely impressed with that engine that thing already has the specs of a race motor in stock trim, just throwing it out there.
Revan Evan did minor port cleanup on the heads, intake swap, and cam and ran it was touch under 600 hp
BIG BANG COYOTE VIDEO ... WHERE IS IT RICHARD??!!
When is the gen2 coyote big bang coming?
In the Max HP, Big Bang Test...
That 6.0 vs 5.0 has one obvious advantage one cannot overlook...
61 more cubic inches.
And the 5.0 has an even bigger advantage...
Why are you _intentionally_ overlooking it?
The biggest contributor to hp: cylinder heads.
Coyote vs LSX?
So on most of your nos hits the horse power jumps real high the falls off but this one didn’t follow that how do you explain that?
the spike in torque is the initial hit-where the dyno responds to the big (sudden) increase in torque.
Do the 1UZ-FE and 5.7LT Tundra Engines. Please.
The thing I didn’t understand about these Mod motor/ Ford enthusiasts is their love for those inefficient ass blowers... these small cubic inch OHC motors are completely optimized for turbos lol... especially when you look at the Cost vs performance gain factor. Hell, with a Forged Coyote and a single efficient CAST 76mm-80mm turbo (nothing extravagant or crazy aka Non Promod turbo) you can make some serious steam. The Coyote makes Good power per cube for its cubic inch and on top of the fact it’s only 5.0L.. so the turbo size doesn’t need to be crazy to make 4 digit power
Dont the stock sleeves usually break around 1000hp?
We've done more than that on a Gen 1 motor
The timing chain is the weak link in the coyote they go around the 1200hp mark
How can the chains (excuse the pun) weak link be attributed to hp??? More hp does put anymore load on a timing chain. Over revving is most likely the issue.
My only problem with the Coyote is that it costs about the same to modify as a Mercedes V12.
Weakest points of Coyote Gen 1 in order as I see them, #1 oil pump gears, #2 Rods/pistons and fasteners #3Head Gaskets/ head fasteners, #4 secondary timing chains. #5 the Cooling Jackets in block seem to develop cracks above 900-1000 h.p. over time. Of course tuning makes a Huge difference! And could keep some of the internal component issues mentioned here at bay for a while! Still waiting to see the Big Bang Coyote engine! Can't wait! I'm also curious to see if my predictions are right!
I would of taken four degrees out just to be safe and still run stock plugs and 750 wheel the gen one taps out