As different as he is, I'm glad people like Bret Weinstein aren't afraid to articulate their religious (or ireligious) views and talk to smart religious people about it.
I absolutely disagree with him . He’s talking about the fear of God . That’s what someone who is wet behind the ears about God believes but as we grow up and nature we understand Gods love a lot better than that . Brett is unfortunately very young in his understanding of god Source : me: former atheist that came to theism through science , reason and logic
@@angelbrother1238 interesting; I have two questions for you, if you don't mind. first; does being a former atheist give you more or less sympathy for current atheists?, in your estimate. second; I've always struggled with feeling emotions, positive or negative, and so to that I've partly attributed my inability to believe in or feel the presence of God or the supernatural, so when you name logic, reasoning, and science as primary in your conversion, I'm wondering if you'd be able to lay out what that looked like?
Fun fact. The writer of the Purge movies was hired by the WHO to help guide the media "narrative" of COVID, according to Whitney Webb, who is a goddess even if she isn't always 100% correct.
My faith in God, specifically Jesus, helped me overcome my gambling addiction. Now I loved gambling and even after years of GA, I could not in of myself overcome it. I gave it up not out of fear of judgement, but because it was the right thing to do when you realize it’s the right thing to do when you have a loving relationship with a loving God!!
frank whelan :I won’t discount strength of will with some people, but having been a counselor, I’ve seen that when they give up one addiction they pick up another in the process. We are all born with a hole in our heart that we often try to fill with money, sex, drugs etc. But only our connection with God can adequately fill. That’s just my opinion.
@Holmes245 Things that people BELIEVE exists but (probably) don't , but when things that they wish to happen happens (overcoming illness/ addiction, getting a job etc,)they give thanks to it . even though the same rate of good (or bad) luck is experienced by non believers.
@Skitalets " Yeah, but let's see at the other side of this, because for me, when people bring this up, it looks obviously like a class thing. Non-believers who achieve or overcome problems are overwhelmingly middle and upper class. " That's dishonest, class has nothing to do with mental capacity. "They have education, they have a trade, they have wealth, they have a network of people who can help them. " Except this isn't always true, and a lot of people who leave religious organizations find themselves alone, assuming they were even in one. I'm not sure why you keep painting this "us vs them" mentality. "The raw existence without any relationships attached is cruel and torturous." Is this what your pastor told you, because that does sound awfully like a threat used to keep people roped into religion. Are you saying that a non-believer isn't capable of relationships? " There are no atheists in foxholes" Fuck you. "when you're all alone in a difficult situation, faith in God can be as real as any other relationship and bring about miraculous changes" About as real as a relationship with an imaginary friend that's responsible for leviticus 20. " So why does some smart ass always have to come out of the woodwork and tell a fella that his God doesn't exist?" Same reason someone like you has to come out of the woodwork with a victim complex and accuse those who evaluates what they believe of being "upper class". Does it at all bother you that the so called "holy men" of religious institutions are some of the richest?
Hi Justin, I just want to say that I am inspired by the way you communicate in general but it's very impressive how you articulate yourself during topics with alot of controversy. I have been desperately struggling to repair my reputation and find strength in myself while battling with severe mental health issues due to my past mostly. I am having a hard time finding strength and having faith in Jesus and also believing the storyline. I appreciate your effort in explaining why you are convinced of Christianity being the most logical explanation of good in the world. I feel like this may be the only way forward for me to find forgiveness from myself and others but it also seems like a desperate way to find meaning and reason why I deserve it , rather than being able to do this without Jesus. Being slightly optimistic while being strongly pessimistic about humanity has helped me continue while I'm healing or finding strength again. The idea of being saved and living a condemnation free life from now on sounds very appealing as well. Sometimes I wish I never thought about any of this and just lived , but that is exactly why I ended up in the situation I find myself in today. What was the most convincing evidence for you that Jesus was a real man who died and then resurrected? To me it seems like faith has to be had to.believe the story and there is no clear evidence. Thank you
Hey brother. I hope you're doing ok. These are my main causes for belief. 1. Empirical evidence. Moments of divine connection in life, with the divine force, when I have needed it. 2. The willingness of the apostles to be killed for their beliefs after the resurrection. No one would allow themselves to be killed unless they were ABSOLUTELY POSITIVE of what lay beyond. 3. The testimony of other people. 4. I just do. Sending you light and love my friend ❤🙏
I think he gets it from social interactions in a pragmatic sense, where you will get some sort of retaliation from other individuals; All social animals have these wrong/right intuitions from their evolutionary background. For example in the wolf pack where it is "absolute wrong" for a low-ranking wolf to eat before the alpha-wolf. Or why it is "absolute wrong" for most social species to eat their children (hey, it's an easy source of nutrition right?). The God of Wolves forbidding it? Or because if it was another way the group will go extinct? The main difference with us is that we are far better articulating and rationalizing the reason behind what we already "know".
Stealing is virtuous if it's something like embezzling from corrupt organizations like government & corporations, or especially the Church. Believe me, they can afford it, and they acquired it through immoral means. When a thief robs a thief, no crime has been committed. Rip off a drug dealer and pat yourself on the back. Make men who hate women pay for sex. In a corrupt world, some crime can be virtuous.
You don't really wonder, because you actually already know where he gets it from: pragmatism, social Solidarity, conscious beings with free will deciding to make agreements about make agreements about what they mutually value , and this is far better than a fictional belief in a sky God
Those of us who truly do _know_ the Lord look at all of these intelligent, articulate fools wondering how in the world they can’t see Him. But they don’t want to. Or else they would.
He wants God to be a 'hack' because it ultimately means no moral responsibility to the real God. And this is always the ulterior motive. It's one more of the myriad excuses on the atheist's list of preferred unbelief.
Religion is not the source of morals. As most moral in religious book are seen as immoral by modern standards. The bible tell you how best to own slaves. That is immoral. I’m glad we no longer follow the moral of thousands of years ago. We have improved since then.
@@ManicPandaz I said he needs God not to be real because he hates the idea of being ultimately _accountable_ for moral wrongdoing, beyond any human institution.
@@nichoudha Of course you are. If someone murders a chap, he still has to serve his time in prison even if he's forgiven in eternity through true repentance and reception of Christ crucified for sin. Criminal justice is not the same as God's justice, which is higher, and is why many of these atheists want to make out God isnt real. They hate being accountable to the ultimate moral authority.
Reading the comments. I find it interesting, if not disturbing, that most believers need an absolute moral giver to say what is right or wrong. Plenty of people would take the money and plenty wouldn't. Considering that ALL gods are created by humans in past societies for a power/control system, they say nothing about any divine authoritative being right or wrong about anything. It has always been human subjectivity and human laws that put things in context. Never a reward or punishment from a external being. Sorry, but god is metaphorical internal and not remotely literal.
Reading your comments I find it very alarming that nonbelievers in God talk about a created god. It shows that they don't understand what God the creator means. Nobody in the right mind could possibly believe that God was created. Created gods are called idols. They are man made. The God of the bible is the creator of energy, matter, space and time. Therefore He is outside of the universe and has to be eternal and not natural but supernatural. If ever there was nothing then there would always be nothing, therefore there must always be something and that is the God of the bible. How do I know this is the truth? The bible told us that the universe had a beginning, has fixed laws of physics, is expanding, gets colder as it gets older and what is detectable i. e. Energy, matter, space and time, is made from that which is undetectable. Now what has science (which is the biblical method: put everything to the test and hold fast to that which is good) helped scientists to discover? All the above but thousands of years later! So some people take the money and some don't. Who is right and who is wrong? Who is in the position to decide right from wrong if there is no ultimate truth there cannot be right or wrong and we wouldn't have moral law. But the creator God gave us the moral law also. Created gods give you nothing and that is what the scientists say we came from: NOTHING. Who put the information into DNA? INFORMATION ONLY COME FROM ONE SOURCE AND THAT IS INTELLIGENT MIND! Now what exactly to you believe we came from? I'd be interested to know.
Without God, objective morality cannot exist. If God does not exist then morality doesn’t exist outside of human subjectivity. Murder, rape, theft are just actions that you don’t like, but you wouldn’t be able to argue with me if I told you that those things weren’t wrong to do. Saying those things are morally wrong would just be your opinion and nothing more.
A LOT of people just behave well anyway because they've got innate integrity not because of some infantile idea. I think it's denigrating to believers to suggest they are the stupid people who need external threats in order to behave well. In my experience of life it's the people who don't believe and especially those who consume alcohol and drugs who behave badly and have no morals or ethics.
Religion doesn’t teach moral understanding, religion teaches obedience. Simple obedience to rules is a limited moral system. To understand moral systems and act accordingly no matter if someone else is watching is actually being a moral person.
What, this is confusing. Plenty of people of faith abuse substances. Where were you raised, las vegas? Cause i grew up in the church hearing so many people say stuff like, if x or y isnt true why does anything matter, why not just kill or do whatever we want. A lot of people out here are good because theyve been promised an afterlife insurance policy. Our experiences have been widly different. Cause i deal with toxic religious stuff all the time and im of faith, but i have experienced plenty of people who need external threats to remind them not to be a dick
Well,I guess I'm just bloody lucky then because all my life including now all the people I've encountered and had to deal with have been are nice good people. I've met and now know so many extraordinary people of goodness and virtue,both believers and non-believers. Lucky for me the evil fuckers keep their distance from me which suits me just fine.
@@nicolab2075 nobody bloody well cares what I think. I'm not interested in the subject. As someone who God has chosen to create unshaggable,so coarse and vulgar,oops I'm not getting any so I never think about other people.
1. Why did you put an non-quote in quotes? 2. What are you referring to by "it"? (maybe belief or god)? 3. What are you referring to by "foundations"? (foundations of what)? 4. I can't identify where he implies either is important for foundations of...), will you please help locate the time in the clip?
I don't think God is a hack. I have experimented with both sides of belief. I generally try to live from a sense of self, by my own strength and wisdom and can do without God. But I have noticed when I clean up my life and stop doing those things that are hindering my potential, all of a sudden I am making room for God and feel a sort of relationship with a "controlling factor" (God or whatever you call it). So, basically what I am saying is the inverse of Weinstein is probably true. Humanity by doing moral has felt in line with their destiny, sensed an approval by God.
I practice Ethical Nihilistic Absurdism: Life is stupid, meaningless, cruel, and absurd, but we should still strive to be decent people and do good things instead of bad whenever we can, because being nice is just better, and because we don't want to be assholes (or maybe some of us do, but it doesn't really matter, because nothing really matters).
Nah. Because god is imaginary, the "enforcement" is also imaginary. The God Delusion isost often used to justify tremendous evil & oppression, and that's not imaginary. The suffering caused by people who are doing evil in the name of God is very very real.
The cashier gets caught because he's repeating the act in the place at the same time eventually some one will notice the missing funds, not mention potential cameras or witnesses . What if you replace the cashier who commits the same crime repeatedly every now and then to some one who commits stranger r*pe and then kills them all in different random untraceable ways he won't get caught like jack the ripper .
It's easier to just get a girlfriend than to through all this trouble. The population of people who end up behaving this way is increasingly small and also not going to be deterred much by religion anyway. He is more likely to use the church as cover for his sick actions than read the bible and be deterred.
The foundation of traditional moral laws can not be reversed. The programming i think all humans have is from genetic cell memory over the course of thousands of years. Not to mention oral & written traditional programming. The end of tradition is the beginning of madness. but what do i know right? Good topic! Thank you!
I don't think it's that hard a concept to convey to a kid that they shouldn't take the money because it's someone else's money. You don't need the threat of an always-watching supernatural inevident deity to do it. I think Weistein over-estimates the value of religious tradition.
Jesus either was or was not resurrected. Too many secular scientists believe in His existence to deny it. The question comes down to whether you believe your need for a Savior. If not, good luck with your good deed hypothesis when you stand before a judge for your crimes.
Why would secular scientists believing that Jesus existed, be a reason to believe in a resurrection? The question comes down to whether you believe that a god should not be afraid of critical examination. If a god deems it a crime to disbelieve fantastic claims without good evidence, then that god is an immoral thug.
Biological Engine of Love God gives you your entire life to accept or reject Him There is plenty of evidence supporting His existence. I didn’t believe for almost 40 years mainly because I was too close minded (proud) to even search for Him. I hope you find the curiosity to seek Him.
@@rickknight5872 Sure, there is loads of anecdotal evidence, but that's not good evidence. If there was good evidence, everyone would believe the same god.
@@biologicalengineoflove6851 "If there was good evidence, everyone would believe the same god." It is recorded that there were those who witnessed Jesus resurrection who chose not to believe. There are those who believe the earth is flat.
@@thisslightlysweetlife3402 That would make sense, because even if one were to witness a resurrection, it would still be more likely that the witness was somehow deceived. And while there are people who believe the earth is flat despite good evidence, it does appear pretty flat to a layman on the ground. If there was good evidence for a somehow supernatural being, it would mean that being wanted us to have the evidence. If a god wanted us to have evidence, it would be incontrovertible. If a god expected worship without good evidence, that god would be an asshole, an immoral thug not worth worshiping anyway. But I don't find that likely either.
If God is a hack to get people to behave then it aint a good one cos if it was we would be living in the best possible world ever so God hasn't hacked anyone which I think we can all agree. As for stopping people stealing then I would consider the Tao de Jing which says to hold nothing of more value than the other because as soon as you place value on something you create a thief.
Yeah, and it's not news, people with half a brain figure it out very young. Morons & moral milquetoasts continue debating it well into old age, as if it matters.
And ‘He took them through the scriptures all the things concerning Himself’. ‘The vine of the book testifies of me’ Listen to Chuck misslers ‘message from the edge of eternity ‘ and explain to me the phenomenon of prophecy and the supernatural nature of the bible; and I have great respect for Bret Weinstein, but disagree with him on this.
Attack someone personally over the internet, i don't care, but please proceed to explain why they are a blabbering fool. He sure ignited something in you. If you knew how to explain why Bret is wrong, you would.
@Sticky Steve The problem is there is no way to convey objective morality without God. It can't exist. So if you convince people that God does not exist you untether our moral code to anything outside of ourselves. Everything then becomes subjective and there is not such thing as right or wrong outside of our constructs. All that is good becomes a matter of opinion. Is slavery objectively wrong? Is intolerance of homosexuality objectively wrong? Is torturing a baby for fun objectively wrong outside of our opinions? If anything is true for everyone then God exists. The difference is that we are either pursuing truth because we are pursuing God or there is no truth and nothing to pursue.
@Sticky Steve Objective means that which is true outside of human experience and opinion. If we have evolved to believe that empathy is morally good, that only means that this is conducive to survival so it was passed on genetically. In this philosophy that which is not conducive to survival is bad. So you should be careful about claiming that that which is conducive to survival is good itself. You'd be trapped logically into claiming that homosexuality is bad, for example, or that surrendering your own life to save another is bad.
@Sticky Steve "No, I wouldn't be trapped, my example of animal behavior is to illustrate it's natural and not exclusive to humans." This doesn't seem to have any bearing on whether or not it's subjective. There are two options for morality, it exists as something we strive for as a standard outside of ourselves, or it exists subjectively as that which comes from our experiences and opinions (be that genetically determined or not). It may help you to know that many theists are totally ok with the idea that evolution has lead us toward the objective standard. It makes a lot of sense that, if God is that standard, he would build it into the system such that we would freely seek Him.
@Sticky Steve You're covering a lot of ground in your comments which is counterproductive to moving forward from one point to the next. So I'm trying to keep us focused on this one idea first before we jump into other ideas that logically lead from it. The topic at the moment is the foundation of morality. It can only be subjective or objective. We are either striving toward a standard (improving) or the standards can change as we change. Would you say you believe morality is objective or subjective?
As different as he is, I'm glad people like Bret Weinstein aren't afraid to articulate their religious (or ireligious) views and talk to smart religious people about it.
I absolutely disagree with him . He’s talking about the fear of God .
That’s what someone who is wet behind the ears about God believes but as we grow up and nature we understand Gods love a lot better than that .
Brett is unfortunately very young in his understanding of god
Source : me: former atheist that came to theism through science , reason and logic
@@angelbrother1238 interesting; I have two questions for you, if you don't mind. first; does being a former atheist give you more or less sympathy for current atheists?, in your estimate. second; I've always struggled with feeling emotions, positive or negative, and so to that I've partly attributed my inability to believe in or feel the presence of God or the supernatural, so when you name logic, reasoning, and science as primary in your conversion, I'm wondering if you'd be able to lay out what that looked like?
I like the movies....” the purge”. The writers are spot on about what we are capable of in the face of lawlessness.
Which is utter chaos
Fun fact. The writer of the Purge movies was hired by the WHO to help guide the media "narrative" of COVID, according to Whitney Webb, who is a goddess even if she isn't always 100% correct.
_"For if you did believe Moses, you would perhaps believe me also; for he wrote of me."_
My faith in God, specifically Jesus, helped me overcome my gambling addiction. Now I loved gambling and even after years of GA, I could not in of myself overcome it. I gave it up not out of fear of judgement, but because it was the right thing to do when you realize it’s the right thing to do when you have a loving relationship with a loving God!!
What about unbelievers who overcome addiction,some people give credit to nonexisting things.
frank whelan :I won’t discount strength of will with some people, but having been a counselor, I’ve seen that when they give up one addiction they pick up another in the process. We are all born with a hole in our heart that we often try to fill with money, sex, drugs etc. But only our connection with God can adequately fill. That’s just my opinion.
@Holmes245 Things that people BELIEVE exists but (probably) don't ,
but when things that they wish to happen happens (overcoming illness/ addiction, getting a job etc,)they give thanks to it .
even though the same rate of good (or bad)
luck is experienced by non believers.
Or maybe it's because you simply overcame it yourself. Would you say it's impossible for someone to overcome an addiction on their own?
@Skitalets " Yeah, but let's see at the other side of this, because for me, when people bring this up, it looks obviously like a class thing. Non-believers who achieve or overcome problems are overwhelmingly middle and upper class. "
That's dishonest, class has nothing to do with mental capacity.
"They have education, they have a trade, they have wealth, they have a network of people who can help them. "
Except this isn't always true, and a lot of people who leave religious organizations find themselves alone, assuming they were even in one. I'm not sure why you keep painting this "us vs them" mentality.
"The raw existence without any relationships attached is cruel and torturous."
Is this what your pastor told you, because that does sound awfully like a threat used to keep people roped into religion. Are you saying that a non-believer isn't capable of relationships?
" There are no atheists in foxholes"
Fuck you.
"when you're all alone in a difficult situation, faith in God can be as real as any other relationship and bring about miraculous changes"
About as real as a relationship with an imaginary friend that's responsible for leviticus 20.
" So why does some smart ass always have to come out of the woodwork and tell a fella that his God doesn't exist?"
Same reason someone like you has to come out of the woodwork with a victim complex and accuse those who evaluates what they believe of being "upper class". Does it at all bother you that the so called "holy men" of religious institutions are some of the richest?
Hi Justin, I just want to say that I am inspired by the way you communicate in general but it's very impressive how you articulate yourself during topics with alot of controversy. I have been desperately struggling to repair my reputation and find strength in myself while battling with severe mental health issues due to my past mostly. I am having a hard time finding strength and having faith in Jesus and also believing the storyline. I appreciate your effort in explaining why you are convinced of Christianity being the most logical explanation of good in the world. I feel like this may be the only way forward for me to find forgiveness from myself and others but it also seems like a desperate way to find meaning and reason why I deserve it , rather than being able to do this without Jesus. Being slightly optimistic while being strongly pessimistic about humanity has helped me continue while I'm healing or finding strength again. The idea of being saved and living a condemnation free life from now on sounds very appealing as well. Sometimes I wish I never thought about any of this and just lived , but that is exactly why I ended up in the situation I find myself in today. What was the most convincing evidence for you that Jesus was a real man who died and then resurrected? To me it seems like faith has to be had to.believe the story and there is no clear evidence. Thank you
Hey brother. I hope you're doing ok. These are my main causes for belief.
1. Empirical evidence. Moments of divine connection in life, with the divine force, when I have needed it.
2. The willingness of the apostles to be killed for their beliefs after the resurrection. No one would allow themselves to be killed unless they were ABSOLUTELY POSITIVE of what lay beyond.
3. The testimony of other people.
4. I just do.
Sending you light and love my friend
❤🙏
I wonder from where he got that "absolute wrong" he referred to at 3:43? In other words, why does he think it absolutely wrong to steal?
I think he gets it from social interactions in a pragmatic sense, where you will get some sort of retaliation from other individuals; All social animals have these wrong/right intuitions from their evolutionary background.
For example in the wolf pack where it is "absolute wrong" for a low-ranking wolf to eat before the alpha-wolf. Or why it is "absolute wrong" for most social species to eat their children (hey, it's an easy source of nutrition right?). The God of Wolves forbidding it? Or because if it was another way the group will go extinct?
The main difference with us is that we are far better articulating and rationalizing the reason behind what we already "know".
From nowhere ... it's an axiom without proof.
👍 @@RainbowDevourer 🧠
Stealing is virtuous if it's something like embezzling from corrupt organizations like government & corporations, or especially the Church. Believe me, they can afford it, and they acquired it through immoral means. When a thief robs a thief, no crime has been committed. Rip off a drug dealer and pat yourself on the back. Make men who hate women pay for sex. In a corrupt world, some crime can be virtuous.
You don't really wonder, because you actually already know where he gets it from: pragmatism, social Solidarity, conscious beings with free will deciding to make agreements about make agreements about what they mutually value , and this is far better than a fictional belief in a sky God
I agree with Bret Weinstein that this 'hack'/ self-comdemner and self-justifier is embedded in all healthy people.
Pathetic wishful thinking is never a substitute for truth
God is truth
Those of us who truly do _know_ the Lord look at all of these intelligent, articulate fools wondering how in the world they can’t see Him. But they don’t want to. Or else they would.
How awful that everybody else doesn't hallucinate the same things you hallucinate. Life is tough.
The Classic everybody is wrong, but im right BS.
He wants God to be a 'hack' because it ultimately means no moral responsibility to the real God. And this is always the ulterior motive.
It's one more of the myriad excuses on the atheist's list of preferred unbelief.
Religion is not the source of morals. As most moral in religious book are seen as immoral by modern standards. The bible tell you how best to own slaves. That is immoral. I’m glad we no longer follow the moral of thousands of years ago. We have improved since then.
@@ManicPandaz I said he needs God not to be real because he hates the idea of being ultimately _accountable_ for moral wrongdoing, beyond any human institution.
@@david-spliso1928 But if Jesus forgives your sins, you're never accountable in the real world.
Plus it really is the definition of wish fulfillment - the desire that God does not exist without respect to whether He does or not
@@nichoudha Of course you are. If someone murders a chap, he still has to serve his time in prison even if he's forgiven in eternity through true repentance and reception of Christ crucified for sin. Criminal justice is not the same as God's justice, which is higher, and is why many of these atheists want to make out God isnt real. They hate being accountable to the ultimate moral authority.
Reading the comments. I find it interesting, if not disturbing, that most believers need an absolute moral giver to say what is right or wrong. Plenty of people would take the money and plenty wouldn't. Considering that ALL gods are created by humans in past societies for a power/control system, they say nothing about any divine authoritative being right or wrong about anything. It has always been human subjectivity and human laws that put things in context. Never a reward or punishment from a external being. Sorry, but god is metaphorical internal and not remotely literal.
You, like most internet atheists, have no idea of what you're talking about and have done scant reading on God and morality. It really shows.
Reading your comments I find it very alarming that nonbelievers in God talk about a created god. It shows that they don't understand what God the creator means. Nobody in the right mind could possibly believe that God was created. Created gods are called idols. They are man made. The God of the bible is the creator of energy, matter, space and time. Therefore He is outside of the universe and has to be eternal and not natural but supernatural. If ever there was nothing then there would always be nothing, therefore there must always be something and that is the God of the bible. How do I know this is the truth? The bible told us that the universe had a beginning, has fixed laws of physics, is expanding, gets colder as it gets older and what is detectable i. e. Energy, matter, space and time, is made from that which is undetectable. Now what has science (which is the biblical method: put everything to the test and hold fast to that which is good) helped scientists to discover? All the above but thousands of years later! So some people take the money and some don't. Who is right and who is wrong? Who is in the position to decide right from wrong if there is no ultimate truth there cannot be right or wrong and we wouldn't have moral law. But the creator God gave us the moral law also. Created gods give you nothing and that is what the scientists say we came from: NOTHING. Who put the information into DNA? INFORMATION ONLY COME FROM ONE SOURCE AND THAT IS INTELLIGENT MIND! Now what exactly to you believe we came from? I'd be interested to know.
Without God, objective morality cannot exist. If God does not exist then morality doesn’t exist outside of human subjectivity. Murder, rape, theft are just actions that you don’t like, but you wouldn’t be able to argue with me if I told you that those things weren’t wrong to do. Saying those things are morally wrong would just be your opinion and nothing more.
There is only one God, we would have several sets of laws of physics otherwise. “gods” are human approximations to the real One
@@gerardmoloney9979 Wouldn't it be amazing with this tendency to make gods the christian one would be the exception,(the only one not made)
A LOT of people just behave well anyway because they've got innate integrity not because of some infantile idea. I think it's denigrating to believers to suggest they are the stupid people who need external threats in order to behave well. In my experience of life it's the people who don't believe and especially those who consume alcohol and drugs who behave badly and have no morals or ethics.
Religion doesn’t teach moral understanding, religion teaches obedience. Simple obedience to rules is a limited moral system. To understand moral systems and act accordingly no matter if someone else is watching is actually being a moral person.
What, this is confusing. Plenty of people of faith abuse substances. Where were you raised, las vegas?
Cause i grew up in the church hearing so many people say stuff like, if x or y isnt true why does anything matter, why not just kill or do whatever we want. A lot of people out here are good because theyve been promised an afterlife insurance policy. Our experiences have been widly different. Cause i deal with toxic religious stuff all the time and im of faith, but i have experienced plenty of people who need external threats to remind them not to be a dick
Well,I guess I'm just bloody lucky then because all my life including now all the people I've encountered and had to deal with have been are nice good people. I've met and now know so many extraordinary people of goodness and virtue,both believers and non-believers. Lucky for me the evil fuckers keep their distance from me which suits me just fine.
@@janebaker966 Do you think the Bible's teachings on gays are moral though? Or do you use your own moral judgments on that?
@@nicolab2075 nobody bloody well cares what I think. I'm not interested in the subject. As someone who God has chosen to create unshaggable,so coarse and vulgar,oops I'm not getting any so I never think about other people.
It’s not about a “hack”. It’s about getting your heart in order.
A heart pumps blood, that's it!
I hate when Christians say stuff like this. It’s so cringy 😂.
Andrew Thoppil What we say has meaning.
R Genericson You aren’t even trying to understand.
Sticky Steve So there’s nothing you can tell me. That’s nice.
We’re the hack, but He cared enough to be hacked for us, so that we can be forever reconnected back to Him.
Bret's answer was essentially just "It gives us important foundations, but I don't like the idea of God". Not very informative at all.
1. Why did you put an non-quote in quotes?
2. What are you referring to by "it"? (maybe belief or god)?
3. What are you referring to by "foundations"? (foundations of what)?
4. I can't identify where he implies either is important for foundations of...), will you please help locate the time in the clip?
@nnyghy7
It says "essentially" and the quotations were to show it is something I'm not saying.
I don't think God is a hack. I have experimented with both sides of belief. I generally try to live from a sense of self, by my own strength and wisdom and can do without God. But I have noticed when I clean up my life and stop doing those things that are hindering my potential, all of a sudden I am making room for God and feel a sort of relationship with a "controlling factor" (God or whatever you call it). So, basically what I am saying is the inverse of Weinstein is probably true. Humanity by doing moral has felt in line with their destiny, sensed an approval by God.
Philosophical laziness plus exuberant rationalism
I like Bret but does he have even rudimentary philosophical training, that was terrible.
I don’t think he does
Thank you for sharing your thoughts. What part of what Bret was saying do you disagree with?
Forced free will is not free will. Free will is the hack. If God exists then free will is not a necessity. I does nothing to enhance our lives anyway.
Makes perfect sense. Ethiism is the most rational sense of direction .
I practice Ethical Nihilistic Absurdism: Life is stupid, meaningless, cruel, and absurd, but we should still strive to be decent people and do good things instead of bad whenever we can, because being nice is just better, and because we don't want to be assholes (or maybe some of us do, but it doesn't really matter, because nothing really matters).
What’s wrong with behaving?
Behaving correctly for the wrong reasons does not always produce correct behavior.
nyyght7
That doesn’t make any sense, “behaving correctly”~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Does not always produce correct behavior...
Life was Given to us some might say, . . . An oxymoron
nyyght7 Don’t make excuses.
Life was Given to us Don’t project your own issues.
God is beneficial as an imagined enforcement mechanism.
Hmm, whatever makes you sleep well, there is god
@@samkam2319 Never said there wasn't
Nah. Because god is imaginary, the "enforcement" is also imaginary. The God Delusion isost often used to justify tremendous evil & oppression, and that's not imaginary. The suffering caused by people who are doing evil in the name of God is very very real.
The cashier gets caught because he's repeating the act in the place at the same time eventually some one will notice the missing funds, not mention potential cameras or witnesses . What if you replace the cashier who commits the same crime repeatedly every now and then to some one who commits stranger r*pe and then kills them all in different random untraceable ways he won't get caught like jack the ripper .
It's easier to just get a girlfriend than to through all this trouble. The population of people who end up behaving this way is increasingly small and also not going to be deterred much by religion anyway. He is more likely to use the church as cover for his sick actions than read the bible and be deterred.
The foundation of traditional moral laws can not be reversed. The programming i think all humans have is from genetic cell memory over the course of thousands of years. Not to mention oral & written traditional programming.
The end of tradition is the beginning of madness. but what do i know right? Good topic! Thank you!
I like Brett but I hate when anyone, Christian or not uses this argument.
Please explain why that arguement is wrong.
I don't think it's that hard a concept to convey to a kid that they shouldn't take the money because it's someone else's money. You don't need the threat of an always-watching supernatural inevident deity to do it. I think Weistein over-estimates the value of religious tradition.
Its a hard concept to convey to a goat herder from the 8th century BCE. Also, don't underestimate how stupid people can be or how stupid YOU could be.
God is Great!
Seek and you will find 💖✝️💖
Sounds way more like Bret wants to replace God with a 'hack'.
Bret is the hack
God is the reason people don't behave. Look at islam.
Jesus either was or was not resurrected.
Too many secular scientists believe in His existence to deny it.
The question comes down to whether you believe your need for a Savior.
If not, good luck with your good deed hypothesis when you stand before a judge for your crimes.
Why would secular scientists believing that Jesus existed, be a reason to believe in a resurrection? The question comes down to whether you believe that a god should not be afraid of critical examination. If a god deems it a crime to disbelieve fantastic claims without good evidence, then that god is an immoral thug.
Biological Engine of Love
God gives you your entire life to accept or reject Him
There is plenty of evidence supporting His existence.
I didn’t believe for almost 40 years mainly because I was too close minded (proud) to even search for Him.
I hope you find the curiosity to seek Him.
@@rickknight5872 Sure, there is loads of anecdotal evidence, but that's not good evidence. If there was good evidence, everyone would believe the same god.
@@biologicalengineoflove6851 "If there was good evidence, everyone would believe the same god." It is recorded that there were those who witnessed Jesus resurrection who chose not to believe. There are those who believe the earth is flat.
@@thisslightlysweetlife3402 That would make sense, because even if one were to witness a resurrection, it would still be more likely that the witness was somehow deceived. And while there are people who believe the earth is flat despite good evidence, it does appear pretty flat to a layman on the ground. If there was good evidence for a somehow supernatural being, it would mean that being wanted us to have the evidence. If a god wanted us to have evidence, it would be incontrovertible. If a god expected worship without good evidence, that god would be an asshole, an immoral thug not worth worshiping anyway. But I don't find that likely either.
Stealing is an evolutionary advantage.
And than you do Pennance!!!!!!!!!! There’s no justification going on there. Don’t leave things out dude.
If God is a hack to get people to behave then it aint a good one cos if it was we would be living in the best possible world ever so God hasn't hacked anyone which I think we can all agree.
As for stopping people stealing then I would consider the Tao de Jing which says to hold nothing of more value than the other because as soon as you place value on something you create a thief.
He can't answer directly,
If you want to know the Real God of the Bible then ask those who knew the Bible..
💖✝️💖 God is great!
Thank fuck galileo didn't behave.
The last respondent nailed Weinstein to the cross
What a waste of time. There is a moral foundation to western civilisation so stick to it
So basically beliefs in deities are guardrails for the weak minded who can't seem to abide by the simplicity of the golden rule .
👍
Yeah, and it's not news, people with half a brain figure it out very young. Morons & moral milquetoasts continue debating it well into old age, as if it matters.
Why does he want to be sacrilegious? Why not just respectfully disagree?
Rebecca Johnson sounded pretty respectful to me.
@@Dialogos1989 He said he was being sacrilegious.
Rebecca Johnson he apologized for the terminology being sacrilegious. Seemed like he was going out of his way to sound respectful.
@@Dialogos1989 He said he was being sacrilegious. I'm just asking why.
@Sticky Steve Why should anyone show respect to anyone they disagree with?
No.
The Jewish mind was created to serve the Most High.
😂
Human beings are strange creatures, some of us don't think we can be good unless a celestial undetectable unfalisfiable sky daddy exists.
How do you know what good is my friend?
Watch out! You'll suffer the wrath of 100 + butt hurt Christians with that kind of talk. Lol
Nathaniel J Franco I don’t see anyone getting angry
Isaac Banks It’s an arbitrary term in relation to our social goals.
@@myjciskate4
No Its not. Good is clearly an objective morale standard. Anyones who denies that is denying reality itself.
And ‘He took them through the scriptures all the things concerning Himself’. ‘The vine of the book testifies of me’
Listen to Chuck misslers ‘message from the edge of eternity ‘ and explain to me the phenomenon of prophecy and the supernatural nature of the bible; and I have great respect for Bret Weinstein, but disagree with him on this.
Silly. Rationalism.
Wait until something really bad happens.
When bad things happen, and people make choices based on emotion, things inevitably get worse.
A blabbering fool.
Attack someone personally over the internet, i don't care, but please proceed to explain why they are a blabbering fool. He sure ignited something in you. If you knew how to explain why Bret is wrong, you would.
Gotta wonder how God feels about being called a hack.
Not sufficient evidence that the supernatural exists but probably better to live as if one does.
Is he then saying that we should remove God and expect people to behave
TK UA We can’t expect people to behave even with god.
@Sticky Steve The problem is there is no way to convey objective morality without God. It can't exist. So if you convince people that God does not exist you untether our moral code to anything outside of ourselves. Everything then becomes subjective and there is not such thing as right or wrong outside of our constructs. All that is good becomes a matter of opinion.
Is slavery objectively wrong? Is intolerance of homosexuality objectively wrong? Is torturing a baby for fun objectively wrong outside of our opinions? If anything is true for everyone then God exists. The difference is that we are either pursuing truth because we are pursuing God or there is no truth and nothing to pursue.
@Sticky Steve Objective means that which is true outside of human experience and opinion. If we have evolved to believe that empathy is morally good, that only means that this is conducive to survival so it was passed on genetically. In this philosophy that which is not conducive to survival is bad.
So you should be careful about claiming that that which is conducive to survival is good itself. You'd be trapped logically into claiming that homosexuality is bad, for example, or that surrendering your own life to save another is bad.
@Sticky Steve
"No, I wouldn't be trapped, my example of animal behavior is to illustrate it's natural and not exclusive to humans."
This doesn't seem to have any bearing on whether or not it's subjective. There are two options for morality, it exists as something we strive for as a standard outside of ourselves, or it exists subjectively as that which comes from our experiences and opinions (be that genetically determined or not). It may help you to know that many theists are totally ok with the idea that evolution has lead us toward the objective standard. It makes a lot of sense that, if God is that standard, he would build it into the system such that we would freely seek Him.
@Sticky Steve You're covering a lot of ground in your comments which is counterproductive to moving forward from one point to the next. So I'm trying to keep us focused on this one idea first before we jump into other ideas that logically lead from it.
The topic at the moment is the foundation of morality. It can only be subjective or objective. We are either striving toward a standard (improving) or the standards can change as we change. Would you say you believe morality is objective or subjective?
I wonder if he’s changed his mind 🤔
I don't think God's the hack in this clip. 😁 I jest, Brett's awesome too.