Holy moly! Thank you! I am one of those who get contractions way before the strong urge to breath! No one had ever explained me this before! Thank you!
This is really interesting. I've often wondered that we weren't doing more harm than good, by creating mental trauma with unpleasant contractions. It didn't seem very good. Thank you for this video. I'll be giving it a shot.
Great advice and very clearly presented! Greetings from a trainer for Apnea Alicante in Spain. I'll be incorporating your advice into our training next week. Thanks, Nathan!
Nice video! However, i would like it even more of you would elaborate on why you don't think pushing through contractions works. And why you think this method works, what the base for your claims are. Thanks.
Basics of how brain works. Across your entire life your brain adapts to many different levels of things in your body. Those minimums are most of the time far higher than your body can withstand. By pushing yourself just before the contractions and all the adverse effects, you tell your brain that "Everything works fine, this is a safe level" and slowly adapt it to the new minimum. Pushing yourself further, onto the pain region, you will only strengthen the association between pain and high CO2 levels. This rule extends to much more than just CO2 level tolerance. Addictions, seizures, how far you can stretch and everything that is based on your brain's behavior.
I've been doing O2/Co2 training for 2 years now with little improvement in the time until my first contraction, I have increased my PB however by pushing through the discomfort, which is no fun and I would never do that underwater. I've been wondering why my contraction time hasn't been improving. I am anxious to try your techniques and hopeful that it will improve my bottom time. Thank you for this video.
If I (or anyone) said we know the "exact mechanism" we would be making stuff up, so I'm not going to pretend to have a specific answer.. However, what we do know (from sports science research) is that the body / mind adapt best to "threshold level" stimulus for what ever we are doing (flexibility, strength, endurance, hypoxic tolerance (mountaineering is another example) etc.. I assume also CO2 tolerance).. What I think happens (why this delayed the urge to breathe) is that we do 2 things.. Physically: the body becomes a little better a regulating acidity (since we are providing a MANAGABLE dose of acidity) Mentally, we become more relaxed during the initial CO2 symptoms (since they are mentally Manageable), VS reinforcing the expectation of upcoming contractions.. Neurally: your CNS learns that it's "normal" to go a long time without contractions Vs doing hard tables: your CNS learns that it's "acceptable" for contractions to start early
@@trainfreediving2772 that makes sense. I thought since for example when doing bodybuilding you lift to failure which stimulate muscle growth. Similiarly i thought going maximum would be best. But your logic makes sense. And since you saw improvements in your clients and sp forth i guess there is science behind it. Thanks for the reply
@@Kyoutube121 hypertrophy training is one of the only examples of where going to "failure" is the actual best way to improve.. it's the exception to the rule.
If you're speaking about the Audio, I don't know / it's fine for me when I play it? If your talking about the trianing volume (number of holds), this is only a "conceptual" video just to show the idea of what to achieve. Realistically, training volume needs to match the individual.. For example the "holds to 1st contractkon" method; the volume will be very differen between a person who's getting 1;30Sta Vs 4:30Sta.. a 200m diver might use 10x25 with 3-5 breaths between , where a 100m diver might only need 6x25 with 3-5 breaths to achieve the same training results.. Make sense? // if it was just the Audio, there's a little extra info haha..
Thanks for the video! Your content rocks! This way freediving ist not only more enjoyable but also much safer. Short question. What do you think of the following training for Static? Inhale, Hold till first contraction Exhale Inhale Hold till first contraction Exhale Inhale Etc... I set a timer on on a certain time (could be 10, 15 or 20 minutes) and do the table till the timer rings, no matter how long each hold is. Would that also be effective? Greetings from switzerand ;)
Hey.. In short, yeah that could work but my "concern" would be how short the exhale holds would end up, after 1st contraction on full lungs for a few rounds you'll just almost immediately get them after your exhale. You'd be better off doing this on just 1 volume, full to 1st, 1 breath, full to 1st, etc.. Ive actually been seeing good results from a slightly different version of this (I call it 2-part holds) Breathe up, RV to 1st co traction, 1x inhale, full to first.. rest / breathe up for 2:00 and repeat 3-5x total. The benefits here is you get 2x 1st contraction exposure per hold, the no contraction time(s) are maintained or increase through the exercise, you get to practice focusing for the (total: RV + Full) time, and as your RV times improve you might even get a little bit of hypoxia exposure as well..
Hello, Thank you for the video. When I hold breath, I don`t feel anxious or uncomfortable but just pain. I train it but it just comes the same and I cannot hold breath any longer than before. Do you know why this might be?
it sounds very good and all, but does this really get you there. wouldnt the fact that youre not going outside your comfort zone, just keep you within the same time? like what is the empirical evidence that this works? Im just beginning my journey as a freediver and I have done both the classic way and tried with this, but is too early for me to see how this works on myself. I was wondering if you care to share your experience and how far you have come
I've used this approach with over 100 athletes via distance coaching and given enough time and correct adherence to the training I keep getting the same results with it. A significantly later urge to breathe / later first contractions & improved overall (PB) performance. To make a few examples. Personally I increased (depth) my first contraction at 30-35m on the way DOWN to 20-25m on the way Up from 90m. My wife started with this approach and she achieved 150m DYN without contractions. I have a few athletes who were in the 150-175 range, who delayed contractions from 60-80m all the way up to 100-125m. I've worked with quite a few divers who struggled to EQ between 30-50m depth for YEARS and after applying this approach for a few months increased their depth by 10-20m quite easily. Same thing with more average DYN divers struggling for years with 75-100 and after only a few months making +100 very controlled and confidently. -- That being said, you cannot just do this. This type of training should make up 70-80% of total training dives, but the other 20-30% need to be more challenging. Think of this like building base fitness, and the occasional harder training is what allows you to express / use this fitness for 1-rep maximum dives.
"can they be".. Yes. "Should they be"... Thay depends on what you were doing before and your own genetics / response to training. I often see people plateaued because they are training too often. I would reccomend maximum 3 or 4 breath holding days per week (for 99.9% of people) more than that will likely slow down your progress..
Is it common that contractions comes much earlier in the water than dry? That seems to be the case for me, my contractions for dry static and apnea walks comes much later compared to wet static and dynamics no matter how relaxed I am.
Sorry I took so long to reply... Yes, that's quite normal for divers who; Are beginners, train more often dry than wet, or who aren't training dry in an equivalent way to wet. To elaborate: - For beginners, being underwater is a stress (on top) of breath-holding. This means it will be difficult to fully relax while doing 2 relatively new things; holding breath & being underwater on breath-hold. - For divers who train dry more often.. The principle of specificity states that you will get the best at what you practice.. If you hold dry more than wet, you will get better at dry holds vs wet holds.. - For 'equivalent training'. With STA if you train dry with no-mask, and do pool with mask or noseclip. It will be easier with no mask. For apnea walks.. You really need to walk very fast (about 2 full steps per second) to even come close to CO2 production rates underwater.. If you walk normal-speed, you can probably walk for 150-200% as long (time wise) VS swimming. Hope that helps explain it a bit.
@@trainfreediving2772 Thank you for the reply. I think I would fit in your second point as I my dry is equivalent to wet just like in your third point. I can only get 1 (if I'm lucky I get to do 2) session per week in the pool, so I spend more time doing dry, and would also replace with dry if the pool session is cancelled, especially now with the pandemic going on. Thanks again.
3 роки тому+4
I believe a common cause for this is that people get cold in the water, and being cold increases metabolism. The increase will start long before the diver noticed it. Try a thicker suit and see what happens.
Training once per day it too much for most people. I typically have myself and my athletes train 3 or 4 days per week, and they tend to see the fastest progress that way. In static that could be 6-12 total breath holds depending on the workout, but having full days off from breath holding is important
@@trainfreediving2772 Would you say there are physiological adaptations or is it purely mental? I know that some people have conditions which make them build up too much co2 and the body adapts by keeping bicarbonate in the system. Could this adaptations be replicated with breath-holds?
@@JohnDoe-id5ih I'm pretty confident that there are physiological adaptations... If it was only psychological the progress would stop pretty quickly, but most people I work with make improvements on this for months / years.. this isn't just "relaxation" (psychological).
No, but FRC and RV (by VC do you mean fill exhale?) To threshold would be a great O2 training.. I will eventually make a video on this.. But once your CO2 tolerance is good enough, you can do exhale holds to first contraction and become quite hypoxic this way..
I still think training with high co2 concentrations is important? And, I figured if you do co2 tables where you are reaching higher co2 concentrations, you are still improving your co2 tolerance? I mean, you are still training your brain to tolerate higher co2 levels without getting contractions.
great video and all the best with the new channel 🙏
Holy moly! Thank you! I am one of those who get contractions way before the strong urge to breath! No one had ever explained me this before! Thank you!
This is really interesting. I've often wondered that we weren't doing more harm than good, by creating mental trauma with unpleasant contractions. It didn't seem very good. Thank you for this video. I'll be giving it a shot.
Great advice. This plan will make training fun again.
All the best on your new project, Nathan!
Greetings from Brazil!
That is the best advice ever. Thank you so much.
Great info! These techniques will most likely help me to have more comfortable trainings .. resulting in more training thus performance, thank you!
Amazing, can't wait to try ! I wish I had learned about your channel sooner, it's great !
More of these please 👍🏾
Great advice and very clearly presented! Greetings from a trainer for Apnea Alicante in Spain. I'll be incorporating your advice into our training next week. Thanks, Nathan!
Excellent video, thanks Nathan
Really interesting, saved for reference, thanks.
Nice video! However, i would like it even more of you would elaborate on why you don't think pushing through contractions works. And why you think this method works, what the base for your claims are. Thanks.
Basics of how brain works.
Across your entire life your brain adapts to many different levels of things in your body.
Those minimums are most of the time far higher than your body can withstand.
By pushing yourself just before the contractions and all the adverse effects, you tell your brain that "Everything works fine, this is a safe level" and slowly adapt it to the new minimum.
Pushing yourself further, onto the pain region, you will only strengthen the association between pain and high CO2 levels.
This rule extends to much more than just CO2 level tolerance.
Addictions, seizures, how far you can stretch and everything that is based on your brain's behavior.
I've been doing O2/Co2 training for 2 years now with little improvement in the time until my first contraction, I have increased my PB however by pushing through the discomfort, which is no fun and I would never do that underwater. I've been wondering why my contraction time hasn't been improving. I am anxious to try your techniques and hopeful that it will improve my bottom time.
Thank you for this video.
Did it work?
How is your progress now?
Hello, this is intersting video. But what is the mechanism on why you adapt to higher CO2 by not going over the threshold? thanks in advance
If I (or anyone) said we know the "exact mechanism" we would be making stuff up, so I'm not going to pretend to have a specific answer..
However, what we do know (from sports science research) is that the body / mind adapt best to "threshold level" stimulus for what ever we are doing (flexibility, strength, endurance, hypoxic tolerance (mountaineering is another example) etc.. I assume also CO2 tolerance)..
What I think happens (why this delayed the urge to breathe) is that we do 2 things..
Physically: the body becomes a little better a regulating acidity (since we are providing a MANAGABLE dose of acidity)
Mentally, we become more relaxed during the initial CO2 symptoms (since they are mentally Manageable), VS reinforcing the expectation of upcoming contractions..
Neurally: your CNS learns that it's "normal" to go a long time without contractions Vs doing hard tables: your CNS learns that it's "acceptable" for contractions to start early
@@trainfreediving2772 that makes sense. I thought since for example when doing bodybuilding you lift to failure which stimulate muscle growth. Similiarly i thought going maximum would be best. But your logic makes sense. And since you saw improvements in your clients and sp forth i guess there is science behind it. Thanks for the reply
@@Kyoutube121 hypertrophy training is one of the only examples of where going to "failure" is the actual best way to improve.. it's the exception to the rule.
So, like any kinda workout, it takes time to improve over time.
Just after one static session I delayed my contractions by 30 seconds. This is crazy!
What is a contraction in this case?
i dont understand what you mean by your first contraction... what is that,,, your first urge to breath???
Hi. How this video corresponds to your other video - "reverse tables"? Are reverse tables methode 4?
Why is the volume so low.
If you're speaking about the Audio, I don't know / it's fine for me when I play it?
If your talking about the trianing volume (number of holds), this is only a "conceptual" video just to show the idea of what to achieve.
Realistically, training volume needs to match the individual..
For example the "holds to 1st contractkon" method; the volume will be very differen between a person who's getting 1;30Sta Vs 4:30Sta.. a 200m diver might use 10x25 with 3-5 breaths between , where a 100m diver might only need 6x25 with 3-5 breaths to achieve the same training results..
Make sense? // if it was just the Audio, there's a little extra info haha..
@@trainfreediving2772 it was about the audio but, the extra was more than welcomed thanks
Thanks for the video! Your content rocks! This way freediving ist not only more enjoyable but also much safer. Short question. What do you think of the following training for Static?
Inhale,
Hold till first contraction
Exhale
Inhale
Hold till first contraction
Exhale
Inhale
Etc...
I set a timer on on a certain time (could be 10, 15 or 20 minutes) and do the table till the timer rings, no matter how long each hold is. Would that also be effective?
Greetings from switzerand ;)
Hey..
In short, yeah that could work but my "concern" would be how short the exhale holds would end up, after 1st contraction on full lungs for a few rounds you'll just almost immediately get them after your exhale. You'd be better off doing this on just 1 volume, full to 1st, 1 breath, full to 1st, etc..
Ive actually been seeing good results from a slightly different version of this (I call it 2-part holds)
Breathe up, RV to 1st co traction, 1x inhale, full to first.. rest / breathe up for 2:00 and repeat 3-5x total.
The benefits here is you get 2x 1st contraction exposure per hold, the no contraction time(s) are maintained or increase through the exercise, you get to practice focusing for the (total: RV + Full) time, and as your RV times improve you might even get a little bit of hypoxia exposure as well..
Hello, Thank you for the video. When I hold breath, I don`t feel anxious or uncomfortable but just pain. I train it but it just comes the same and I cannot hold breath any longer than before. Do you know why this might be?
it sounds very good and all, but does this really get you there. wouldnt the fact that youre not going outside your comfort zone, just keep you within the same time? like what is the empirical evidence that this works? Im just beginning my journey as a freediver and I have done both the classic way and tried with this, but is too early for me to see how this works on myself. I was wondering if you care to share your experience and how far you have come
I've used this approach with over 100 athletes via distance coaching and given enough time and correct adherence to the training I keep getting the same results with it.
A significantly later urge to breathe / later first contractions & improved overall (PB) performance.
To make a few examples.
Personally I increased (depth) my first contraction at 30-35m on the way DOWN to 20-25m on the way Up from 90m.
My wife started with this approach and she achieved 150m DYN without contractions.
I have a few athletes who were in the 150-175 range, who delayed contractions from 60-80m all the way up to 100-125m.
I've worked with quite a few divers who struggled to EQ between 30-50m depth for YEARS and after applying this approach for a few months increased their depth by 10-20m quite easily.
Same thing with more average DYN divers struggling for years with 75-100 and after only a few months making +100 very controlled and confidently.
--
That being said, you cannot just do this.
This type of training should make up 70-80% of total training dives, but the other 20-30% need to be more challenging.
Think of this like building base fitness, and the occasional harder training is what allows you to express / use this fitness for 1-rep maximum dives.
Can these be done more often than if you were to fight contractions?
"can they be".. Yes.
"Should they be"... Thay depends on what you were doing before and your own genetics / response to training. I often see people plateaued because they are training too often. I would reccomend maximum 3 or 4 breath holding days per week (for 99.9% of people) more than that will likely slow down your progress..
Cool I appreciate the response
Is it common that contractions comes much earlier in the water than dry? That seems to be the case for me, my contractions for dry static and apnea walks comes much later compared to wet static and dynamics no matter how relaxed I am.
Sorry I took so long to reply...
Yes, that's quite normal for divers who; Are beginners, train more often dry than wet, or who aren't training dry in an equivalent way to wet.
To elaborate:
- For beginners, being underwater is a stress (on top) of breath-holding. This means it will be difficult to fully relax while doing 2 relatively new things; holding breath & being underwater on breath-hold.
- For divers who train dry more often.. The principle of specificity states that you will get the best at what you practice.. If you hold dry more than wet, you will get better at dry holds vs wet holds..
- For 'equivalent training'. With STA if you train dry with no-mask, and do pool with mask or noseclip. It will be easier with no mask. For apnea walks.. You really need to walk very fast (about 2 full steps per second) to even come close to CO2 production rates underwater.. If you walk normal-speed, you can probably walk for 150-200% as long (time wise) VS swimming.
Hope that helps explain it a bit.
@@trainfreediving2772 Thank you for the reply. I think I would fit in your second point as I my dry is equivalent to wet just like in your third point. I can only get 1 (if I'm lucky I get to do 2) session per week in the pool, so I spend more time doing dry, and would also replace with dry if the pool session is cancelled, especially now with the pandemic going on. Thanks again.
I believe a common cause for this is that people get cold in the water, and being cold increases metabolism. The increase will start long before the diver noticed it. Try a thicker suit and see what happens.
So would you recommend doing the breath hoIds just once per day? Is this enough?
Training once per day it too much for most people.
I typically have myself and my athletes train 3 or 4 days per week, and they tend to see the fastest progress that way.
In static that could be 6-12 total breath holds depending on the workout, but having full days off from breath holding is important
@@trainfreediving2772
Would you say there are physiological adaptations or is it purely mental? I know that some people have conditions which make them build up too much co2 and the body adapts by keeping bicarbonate in the system. Could this adaptations be replicated with breath-holds?
@@JohnDoe-id5ih I'm pretty confident that there are physiological adaptations...
If it was only psychological the progress would stop pretty quickly, but most people I work with make improvements on this for months / years.. this isn't just "relaxation" (psychological).
@10:40 byron's pool Dahab.
To save time would you do FRC or VC holds to thresholds?
No, but FRC and RV (by VC do you mean fill exhale?) To threshold would be a great O2 training..
I will eventually make a video on this..
But once your CO2 tolerance is good enough, you can do exhale holds to first contraction and become quite hypoxic this way..
Ok what’s a contraction ? To you ?
I still think training with high co2 concentrations is important?
And, I figured if you do co2 tables where you are reaching higher co2 concentrations, you are still improving your co2 tolerance? I mean, you are still training your brain to tolerate higher co2 levels without getting contractions.
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