It now looks like DT Swiss Hub =) with that sayed... DT Swiss is making a brilliant Job =P only 51 tooth? my one has 54 tooth. And just by the way... i modded mine and make them slightly louder. It is the Only one Video on my "Channel"
You are the tech master when it comes to mountain bikes. I swear something I used to know just got pushed out of my brain with all that info. Great tech vid.
I love and ride Mavic rims and can't wait for the day I can ride a complete engineered wheelset of theirs. I like how the latest hub engineering mirrors my personal fav which is Chris King and his 72 point engagement ring drive system. When it all comes down to it spending extra money on wheels and tires is just smart money !
Mavic actually didn't always have two bearings in the freehub. For years they had a bearing on the outboard side, but an awful plastic bushing on the inner side that would wear down over time and result in play in the cassette. Not only did the bushing wear, but the aluminum part of the hub that it moved against would wear down too so eventually the stock bushings wouldn't work anymore... I don't understand why Mavic didn't just put a second bearing on those freehubs.
Because Mavic degradated with the whole bicycle market. Thanks to Rohloff, I have to ride somewhat not being a marketing part planned to die in 2-3 years of normal usage.
Any knowledgeable or true history would have included their lows and their highs to give a true reflection of their history and development / Im in the middle of fixing the truly awful wheel hub from an old SLE COSMIC REAR WHEEL ridiculous amounts of play in the bushing; have had to order the hub doctor kit from america to solve.
Doddy- just took a sideways glance at you in the vid and the wheel around your head is hilarious! Great stuff as usual my man thank you. I've always laced up Mavic rims myself.
I still have that 2011 cross trail wheel set @13:40 on my old trek fuel. It's Solid as a rock. Though it has only 2paws in it but with proper care. Still doing its job like new. Love mavic wheels. Wish I could have them in my new bike.
You mountain bikers are so lucky to have Doddy. Alright, he has a fancy haircut, but apart from that he's just strait to the point, bombarding us with interesting information. Would love to have that on GCN.
Nice content would love seeing more of this. That said I don’t understand the hype about any hub with more than a single degree of engagement. i9’s 0.52 degree engagement now that’s actually impressive.
I’ve been riding Mavic wheels since the late 90’s and they’re strong and stay trued. I’ve never bought the Max, always the lower end and they’re more than fine for weekend rides in my local trails down here in South Florida.
Exactly. And while many people seem to hesitate against the changes, it is so satisfying to own this quirky stuff and show everyone how well it works :D
Hi Doddy, I love that episode about Mavic. Since I believe 1998 when I’ve got chance to look on My brother’s magazines and catalogs Mavic wheels were our wheels of dream, for me DeeMax, and brother Crossmax. Actually I have DT Swiss hub with upgraded from bontrager rings with 54 points of engagement, wich is nice in MTB. But, i’ve been riding for 10 years Bike Trial and there I’ve got 109 points. So dt for me is still not enough fast engaging. Kind Regards for whole GMBN TEAM.
My rear axle got stuck after a day of riding in very muddy and wet conditions. I'm riding Mavic xa pro carbon 2017, similar or same as Doddy holds in 13:21. Finding out how to open it, check the bearings, clean it using right grease and seal it again while not damaging any part of it, is a tricky task if you're not a pro. Might be very useful to make a video for this particular maintenance task (haven't found any on GMBN Tech). I believe it would save some pain to many fresh Mavic riders!
nice to catch up with the newer hubs, that clutch mechanism is almost identical to my very early 90's DT hugi, they were also especially loud, especially with a tight set of spokes in a noisy aluminium Merlin malt 2.
Are they using PTFE on the teeth? (18:45) Must it connect on free Wheeling it like on a down hill? How does it handle extreme speeds? Near sound barrier speeds?
That was a really helpful video and I will be purchasing some Mavic MTB wheels today with the new ID360 hubs. Just wanted to see the hubs in action so a great review and history lesson. The old 500 series hubs that we used back in the day were revolutionary when they came out and were better than the best from Campagnolo that I used previously. Changing the axles was a breeze to as was changing the disc wheels hubs for track use. Good to see that they have not sat on their laurels as many manufacturers have and offer the tech across the range.
Are you going to turn this into a series Doddy? Would be cool to find out the evolution of other companies for different parts of the bike. Maybe you could talk about brakes next.
17:35 Do a 51 tooth sprocket really put more load on the hub? I know that the torque increase with diameter, but i would still expect the same power at a smaller sprocket would be just as bad.
The new mavic hubs are Very similar to the dt swiss ratchet system.... I've used shimano xtr hubs, mavic sx its, hope pros, easton m1's, sun ringle chargers but have to say that the dt 240 hubs have been the most robust and reliable of them all!
That was well presented. Loved it! I have an old set of Mavic Cosmos from 2002 that are still in service. Great wheelset but discontinued a while ago. Debating on another set of Mavics for my mountain bike or going with something more traditional.
Hi awsome vid i have 3 wheels using its2 on an ebike i need an upgrade without changing the wheels or hub just the freehub any ideas or help would be extremely greatfull
Great video, is the hub held together by just press fit? I got home from a road spin, the rear cassette had come away from the wheel with half of the freehub still attached on my new Cosmic Carbon SL. Just pushing it back together seems like a design flaw.
Wait, I see that on the freewheel hub, there is a lot of axle unsupported by bearing, but I don't see how the situation is any better based on what's shown at 17:52. The bearings in the freehub do support the splines nicely, which is definitely an improvement, but not the spoke flange.
I have a wheel with a mavic id360 hub and at the moment there is a xd freehub body mounted, I'm not sure how I can get it of, I ordered a compatible microspline freehub body directly from mavic, but still have no idea how I can do that, in your video you just pull the Endcaps off but I can't pull them of, its a new rear wheel, I see a black ring with 5 holes facing outward of the xd freehub body do I have to remove that and if so which direction is loose?
Do these new hubs develop play in the freehub body after a few hundred miles? Wouldn't want to lose that signature cassette slop that only Mavics can provide!
Very nice video... as a matter of today and this video was release current year 2018... I was told by my bicycle mechanical .. that there are better options than Mavic wheels... can you make a comparison ... and point out the differences... pros, cons.. but focused on XC... Thanks.
Lots of us roadies were seduced, and severely stung by those early Ksyrium wheel sets way back in the early 2000's. Back then the Ksyrium's 1500 gram weight for a pair of wheels was revolutionary.. The rims were absolutely bombproof and those zicral spokes were as tough as old boots.. All was fine and dandy and carefree until one was unfortunate enough to bend or break a rim, then it would become very quickly apparent that Mavic didn't really want anyone attempting to repair their wheel systems...Sure you could buy a Ksyrium rim and a bunch of zicral spokes, but it would cost almost the same as buying a brand new wheel. If one was brave enough to attempt a rim transplant, those FORE spoke inserts had a nasty habit of adhering themselves permanently to the damaged rim. And don't get me started on Mavic's crappy FTTS freehub system.. It freehub body consisted of an inner Delrin/nylon bushing running on the bare aluminium hub surface, it would eventually wear the hub to the point it was unusable. Sorry Mavic, I won't be spending anymore of my discretionary cash of your non-user serviceable products....
Question do they have a mavic hub with 3 pawls? i have a set of mavic crossmax elite with a shimano hub and i'm trying to find a a sram hub with 3 pawls and i can't seem to find one! Would you be able to help?
Loved your talk. I have Mavic Enduro wheels (2014) on my Trek Remedy. I also have a pair of Mavic Enduro shoes, an all time favorite, like are on the work bench. I am about to put a micro spline freehub on my wheels; going to XT 12 speed. What should I use for lube on the freehub pawls?
GMBN Tech that's quite true. They're extremely expensive and I'd imagine not available everywhere. I used to have king hubs on an old bmx race bike years ago and loved them. Haven't managed to afford a king wheel set for the mtb yet but I do plan on it!
Great video as usual! I have an 2013 Crossride 29 wheel from Mavic with a ITS-4 freehub system and I try to upgrade the freehub to a Micro-Spline for 12 speed Shimano cassette. But I couldn't find any freehub that fits, even on the mavic homepage. Is there a solution just with the right conversion kit to avoid to change the whole hub?
Hi Doddy, I'm after some tyres that will get me to work and back on the roads buthandle a good offroad shred in the woods at the weekend. What features am I looking for and can you recommend anything? I'm hoping not to have to buy 2 sets of tyres and change them every week, thanks Dave
Hello, thank you, very informative video. But my Mavics with this latest hub system slips after 5000km of use, the first time it happened I had to walk home. I cleaned it several times and after a short test it failed again. So no, I'm no happy whith the system, now I'm investigating how to solve it. .. The LBS advice was also cleaning... And it is on a roadbike, no MTB.
Took my 2019 XA carbon 27.5X30 wheels for their maiden voyage this afternoon on my 2018 Spectral 6.0, I cant believe how QUIET that hub is and the 40 engagement is great. Glad I bought them, one look at the rim and you can see the significant offset, between the new wheels and tire change from DHF to Vittoria Mezcal G+ 2.6 are MUCH smoother and better suited to my type of riding and also dropped exactly 1 pound
Thanks a lot for old Mavic's hub 500 awesome review! That's all information I need for building my own DIY hub for freewheel, because it's too expensive fo me to buy modern systems, but couple freewheels I got for free from scrap metal. Mavic are the best, but so far an unattainable dream for me.
How cool are Mavic's new hubs? What do you think of their new design?
Mavic's new design looks awesome. Also, more of these 'history of tech' style videos, please!
It now looks like DT Swiss Hub =) with that sayed... DT Swiss is making a brilliant Job =P
only 51 tooth? my one has 54 tooth. And just by the way... i modded mine and make them slightly louder.
It is the Only one Video on my "Channel"
Looks just like DT Swiss design. If you want to look at something ahead of its time, take a look at onyx and stealth hubs.
Obviousley simular to the DT Swiss, but isn't that what's Shimano is also doing a version of?
You forget to write mavic’s new hubs SYSTEM.
hands down doddy is the best addition to the gmbn channel.
Four years later and this video is still informative and relevant. Good work Doddy and team!
Thanks dfiler2! Great to hear 👍
6 years later!
This video was fantastic. I love seeing the history of where we came from with biking compared to where we are at now.
Thanks Ryan!
Really great hub , I have one low budget one and its great and they were good in the seventies also. I really like the mavic wheels in the seventies!
Dear GMBN, this is the best type of video you do. Doddy is especially good presenter for this kind of stuff. 👍
Why on earth has no one come up with that hub idea before?! So simple, so logical, looks effective and so easily serviceable!
You are the tech master when it comes to mountain bikes. I swear something I used to know just got pushed out of my brain with all that info. Great tech vid.
This host is a gifted technical instructor. I love this side channel only because he is so good.
I love and ride Mavic rims and can't wait for the day I can ride a complete engineered wheelset of theirs. I like how the latest hub engineering mirrors my personal fav which is Chris King and his 72 point engagement ring drive system. When it all comes down to it spending extra money on wheels and tires is just smart money !
Insightful video Doddy. You are a great speaker! Love the history of the Mavic Hubs. Great innovation over the years.
I never realised I was so interested in how hubs work. Great show GMBN, keep it up.
This video changed my life. Can’t wait to rage DH on my new Mavic XA Elites I bought mid video!
As a roadie, I really appreciated this video and the excellent demonstration of the ID360 hubs. Well done!
Mavic actually didn't always have two bearings in the freehub. For years they had a bearing on the outboard side, but an awful plastic bushing on the inner side that would wear down over time and result in play in the cassette. Not only did the bushing wear, but the aluminum part of the hub that it moved against would wear down too so eventually the stock bushings wouldn't work anymore... I don't understand why Mavic didn't just put a second bearing on those freehubs.
They didn't do it properly because they're French. Engineering things differently just to be different.
I had that hub, worst wheel I have ever owned.
Because Mavic degradated with the whole bicycle market. Thanks to Rohloff, I have to ride somewhat not being a marketing part planned to die in 2-3 years of normal usage.
Yes, this is the reason why I never bought their wheels - the stupid bushing design.
This new DT Swiss ratchet copy looks promising though.
Any knowledgeable or true history would have included their lows and their highs to give a true reflection of their history and development / Im in the middle of fixing the truly awful wheel hub from an old SLE COSMIC REAR WHEEL ridiculous amounts of play in the bushing; have had to order the hub doctor kit from america to solve.
Doddy- just took a sideways glance at you in the vid and the wheel around your head is hilarious! Great stuff as usual my man thank you. I've always laced up Mavic rims myself.
Thanks, I always learn so much about bikes on GMBN Tech. Keep it up :)
I still have that 2011 cross trail wheel set @13:40 on my old trek fuel. It's Solid as a rock. Though it has only 2paws in it but with proper care. Still doing its job like new. Love mavic wheels. Wish I could have them in my new bike.
To see how the hub works you pawl it apart (ba dum tss)
Spike Spikus
Hubba hubba
😂
You mountain bikers are so lucky to have Doddy. Alright, he has a fancy haircut, but apart from that he's just strait to the point, bombarding us with interesting information. Would love to have that on GCN.
Nice content would love seeing more of this. That said I don’t understand the hype about any hub with more than a single degree of engagement. i9’s 0.52 degree engagement now that’s actually impressive.
Honestly I’d say that anything under 3° is sufficient, but yeah, 9° is not impressive at all.
I’ve been riding Mavic wheels since the late 90’s and they’re strong and stay trued. I’ve never bought the Max, always the lower end and they’re more than fine for weekend rides in my local trails down here in South Florida.
I love my mavic with a maxxis tyre, full French 🐸 🇫🇷 🇫🇷
Mavic must've been like a Cannondale in their days :D That one company to rule in unconventional and shocking ideas, I love it!
Kuba Gajda we need those type of guys...just imagine how uninventive would it be if it was all shimano
Exactly. And while many people seem to hesitate against the changes, it is so satisfying to own this quirky stuff and show everyone how well it works :D
I love the ID360 hub, it's so easy to take apart and service. Beats cup and cone hubs and freehubs with pawls
Hi Doddy, I love that episode about Mavic. Since I believe 1998 when I’ve got chance to look on My brother’s magazines and catalogs Mavic wheels were our wheels of dream, for me DeeMax, and brother Crossmax. Actually I have DT Swiss hub with upgraded from bontrager rings with 54 points of engagement, wich is nice in MTB. But, i’ve been riding for 10 years Bike Trial and there I’ve got 109 points. So dt for me is still not enough fast engaging.
Kind Regards for whole GMBN TEAM.
My rear axle got stuck after a day of riding in very muddy and wet conditions. I'm riding Mavic xa pro carbon 2017, similar or same as Doddy holds in 13:21. Finding out how to open it, check the bearings, clean it using right grease and seal it again while not damaging any part of it, is a tricky task if you're not a pro. Might be very useful to make a video for this particular maintenance task (haven't found any on GMBN Tech). I believe it would save some pain to many fresh Mavic riders!
nice to catch up with the newer hubs, that clutch mechanism is almost identical to my very early 90's DT hugi, they were also especially loud, especially with a tight set of spokes in a noisy aluminium Merlin malt 2.
Are they using PTFE on the teeth? (18:45)
Must it connect on free Wheeling it like on a down hill?
How does it handle extreme speeds?
Near sound barrier speeds?
That was a really helpful video and I will be purchasing some Mavic MTB wheels today with the new ID360 hubs. Just wanted to see the hubs in action so a great review and history lesson. The old 500 series hubs that we used back in the day were revolutionary when they came out and were better than the best from Campagnolo that I used previously. Changing the axles was a breeze to as was changing the disc wheels hubs for track use.
Good to see that they have not sat on their laurels as many manufacturers have and offer the tech across the range.
I had some mavic crossmax enduro wheels. The spokes snap all the time. Moved to some Chris kings laced to dt swiss which were a huge improvement
I have these yellow Mavic wheels on my yeti sb66.
I really like doddy when he's explaining the techy stuff. 😄 Thank you for all the info..!
No problem!
Are you going to turn this into a series Doddy? Would be cool to find out the evolution of other companies for different parts of the bike. Maybe you could talk about brakes next.
Not a bad idea! Thanks for the suggestion.
17:35 Do a 51 tooth sprocket really put more load on the hub?
I know that the torque increase with diameter, but i would still expect the same power at a smaller sprocket would be just as bad.
One question, how did Mavic fit a tiny machine gun in the hub (14:50)?
The new mavic hubs are Very similar to the dt swiss ratchet system.... I've used shimano xtr hubs, mavic sx its, hope pros, easton m1's, sun ringle chargers but have to say that the dt 240 hubs have been the most robust and reliable of them all!
That was well presented. Loved it! I have an old set of Mavic Cosmos from 2002 that are still in service. Great wheelset but discontinued a while ago. Debating on another set of Mavics for my mountain bike or going with something more traditional.
Very informative and thorough. Thank you.
Do a video on Pawl Service? I did mine and had trouble reinstalling my spring ring (only a couple of my pawls seemed to be working correctly)
Superb detail. Thanks!
Criss king hub is the one !!
Liamr300 Yates water ingress wrecks them and they are heavy
Does the “infinity” hub use pawls or the ratchet system? Thanks 🙏
Hi awsome vid i have 3 wheels using its2 on an ebike i need an upgrade without changing the wheels or hub just the freehub any ideas or help would be extremely greatfull
Hi GMBN, As hard as I try I cannot pull off the freehub. Is there a version of the id360 that you cannot just pull off?
Awesome video doddy, you explained it so clearly and kept it interesting. Thanks mate
Is there any conceivable way to install an XD driver on the relatively old FTS-X hub?
Great video, is the hub held together by just press fit? I got home from a road spin, the rear cassette had come away from the wheel with half of the freehub still attached on my new Cosmic Carbon SL. Just pushing it back together seems like a design flaw.
Now this is an infomertial I cant complain about!
Did they do the cosmic wheelset before the helium?
Interesting watch.
My existing freehub is its-2 can upgrade to its-4?
Can the ID60 System be fitted into a crossmax XL 2015 Wheelset? Or similar products? Or is this system just compatible with new hubs?
What is the use of mavic paa gf50??
Great bed time story, uncle Doddy, seriously amazing feature, thank you for the content guys.
WOW this is full of so good info! Love how detailed you went to show how these work! :D
Wait, I see that on the freewheel hub, there is a lot of axle unsupported by bearing, but I don't see how the situation is any better based on what's shown at 17:52. The bearings in the freehub do support the splines nicely, which is definitely an improvement, but not the spoke flange.
I have a wheel with a mavic id360 hub and at the moment there is a xd freehub body mounted, I'm not sure how I can get it of, I ordered a compatible microspline freehub body directly from mavic, but still have no idea how I can do that, in your video you just pull the Endcaps off but I can't pull them of, its a new rear wheel, I see a black ring with 5 holes facing outward of the xd freehub body do I have to remove that and if so which direction is loose?
what a cool video Doddy, thanks mate, I don't have the most updated version but they are brilliant nonetheless
Do these new hubs develop play in the freehub body after a few hundred miles? Wouldn't want to lose that signature cassette slop that only Mavics can provide!
Very nice video... as a matter of today and this video was release current year 2018... I was told by my bicycle mechanical .. that there are better options than Mavic wheels... can you make a comparison ... and point out the differences... pros, cons.. but focused on XC... Thanks.
Is it possible to install the sram torque caps on a mavic xa pro front wheel/hub (2018 mod,) ?
Got a pair of crossrocs and I love them!
Lots of us roadies were seduced, and severely stung by those early Ksyrium wheel sets way back in the early 2000's. Back then the Ksyrium's 1500 gram weight for a pair of wheels was revolutionary.. The rims were absolutely bombproof and those zicral spokes were as tough as old boots.. All was fine and dandy and carefree until one was unfortunate enough to bend or break a rim, then it would become very quickly apparent that Mavic didn't really want anyone attempting to repair their wheel systems...Sure you could buy a Ksyrium rim and a bunch of zicral spokes, but it would cost almost the same as buying a brand new wheel. If one was brave enough to attempt a rim transplant, those FORE spoke inserts had a nasty habit of adhering themselves permanently to the damaged rim. And don't get me started on Mavic's crappy FTTS freehub system.. It freehub body consisted of an inner Delrin/nylon bushing running on the bare aluminium hub surface, it would eventually wear the hub to the point it was unusable. Sorry Mavic, I won't be spending anymore of my discretionary cash of your non-user serviceable products....
I love this Mavic DT 350... I mean ID 360. Why did I get those two confused?
Nice.. when you show Hope history ;)
That new Mavic's system looks pretty much like DT Swiss "Star Ratchet". But I guess it is good to have competition between brands.
Anybody know when crossride wheels first came out?
what mavic rim is that hung behind you on the wall the one enclosed in the poster ?
Question do they have a mavic hub with 3 pawls? i have a set of mavic crossmax elite with a shimano hub and i'm trying to find a a sram hub with 3 pawls and i can't seem to find one!
Would you be able to help?
Fascinating video again. Thanks Doddie
The bike industry admits DT star ratchet is the best. nice looking wheels.
Have this hub on my xa35 pro carbon wheels. Great engagement and holding up well. Stiff and lightweight
Very good video - thank you!
You guys should mention Mavics new ID360 ratchet hubs. They come w their 2019+ wheelsets.
@waquzy have you tried the new ID720 ratchetless hubs yet? ua-cam.com/video/LjUgz5FHR90/v-deo.html
Loved your talk. I have Mavic Enduro wheels (2014) on my Trek Remedy. I also have a pair of Mavic Enduro shoes, an all time favorite, like are on the work bench. I am about to put a micro spline freehub on my wheels; going to XT 12 speed. What should I use for lube on the freehub pawls?
This is an interesting and great video from Mavic hubs and wheels. Thanks a lot.
nice video. thank you very much. learned a lot. go the mavic crossride before id360, but they really nice too
Been rolling on Mavic for twenty years, Ex729 best rim ever
Thank you Doddy, very informative and thanks for assembling all of the hub examples, Even I could understand what you were talking about! Ride on! Tim
I have a Mavic 500 front hub laced to an old campagnolo rim sitting around I didn’t realize they were made in 1975
Is Mavic cross ride disc model using this hub ? 14:16
Excellent video. Highly informative and interesting. Great job
King's ring drive system has been the best twin plate mechanism for decades.
doctajuice came here to say the same.
Chris King make an excellent product. But they are by no means accessible to many riders.
GMBN Tech that's quite true. They're extremely expensive and I'd imagine not available everywhere. I used to have king hubs on an old bmx race bike years ago and loved them. Haven't managed to afford a king wheel set for the mtb yet but I do plan on it!
Exelente clip and great quality product.. Love Mavic
Great Video Dobb 👍
Great video as usual!
I have an 2013 Crossride 29 wheel from Mavic with a ITS-4 freehub system and I try to upgrade the freehub to a Micro-Spline for 12 speed Shimano cassette. But I couldn't find any freehub that fits, even on the mavic homepage. Is there a solution just with the right conversion kit to avoid to change the whole hub?
I used a bomb proof set of 823s and loved them, but Mavic hubs always felt too proprietary for me
Yeah, good luck sourcing spokes and whatnot for older wheel "systems" too. Proprietary is the enemy of longevity and serviceability
Can ITS-4 system hub be adapted to the New systems?
Hi Doddy, I'm after some tyres that will get me to work and back on the roads buthandle a good offroad shred in the woods at the weekend. What features am I looking for and can you recommend anything? I'm hoping not to have to buy 2 sets of tyres and change them every week, thanks Dave
Hello, thank you, very informative video. But my Mavics with this latest hub system slips after 5000km of use, the first time it happened I had to walk home. I cleaned it several times and after a short test it failed again. So no, I'm no happy whith the system, now I'm investigating how to solve it. .. The LBS advice was also cleaning... And it is on a roadbike, no MTB.
Great video guys, I found that really interesting
Now I know how cool the Mavic wheels are on my Capra lol.
Took my 2019 XA carbon 27.5X30 wheels for their maiden voyage this afternoon on my 2018 Spectral 6.0, I cant believe how QUIET that hub is and the 40 engagement is great. Glad I bought them, one look at the rim and you can see the significant offset, between the new wheels and tire change from DHF to Vittoria Mezcal G+ 2.6 are MUCH smoother and better suited to my type of riding and also dropped exactly 1 pound
Great video, and I'm a Mavic fan.
Question, what are the differences between Mavic Crossmax Pro 27.5 vs Mavic XA Pro 27.5?
Please, thank you.
Crossmax pro is lighter I think
Hope use 17mm axles...
i like Mavic's rims but their hubs are not anything extraordinary.
Will you be doing tech history on DT swiss rims, spokes, hubs and wheelset?
Never mind the hubs where can i buy the model car
Another great evaluation from you excellent level of knowledge Doddy you are a one off man thank you for another fantastic video,PD
Thanks a lot for old Mavic's hub 500 awesome review! That's all information I need for building my own DIY hub for freewheel, because it's too expensive fo me to buy modern systems, but couple freewheels I got for free from scrap metal.
Mavic are the best, but so far an unattainable dream for me.
Doddy, that was extremely interesting!!