The truth behind D&D's shapeshifting imposters (They're EVERYWHERE)
Вставка
- Опубліковано 9 лют 2025
- Doppelgangers, known by their own kind as Shallar, are lurking within every major city in the Forgotten Realms. Your party has probably met one and didn't even know it!
➡️ Unlock a wealth of Realmslore, worldbuilding, and much more on my Patreon. Join now and be part of a community that thrives on extraordinary storytelling! / ed Greenwood
🦜 Today's Realmspeak: How to Pronounce "Otiluke"
👕 My Shop
➡️ manyrealms.net...
This is the perfect lore supplement for your Forgotten Realms campaign, whether you use DnD (D&D, 5e, Dungeons & Dragons) or any other tabletop roleplaying game (TTRPG) system.
#################
🗣️ Greenwood’s Grotto (Discord)
➡️ / discord
🎲 Sponsor: RPGMatch
➡️ rpgmatch.org
#####################
🐤 Find Ed on Twitter
➡️ / theedverse
👍 Find Ed on Facebook
➡️ / theedverse
⏰ Find Ed on TikTok
➡️ / edgreenwood
🐤 Find Ivan on Twitter
➡️ / papat0k
🐤 Find RPGMatch on Twitter
➡️ / rpgmatch
🐤 Find Editor BLeeP on Twitter
➡️ / bleep__
🐤 Find Editor BLeeP on UA-cam
➡️ youtube.com/ @theBLeePcast
#realmslore #dnd #baldursgate3
Has a Shallar (doppelganger) ever made a significant impact in one of your campaigns? Did these revelations about their culture life up to your expectations?
Thank you so much for your support in helping me continue to make these videos. I can't do it without you: patreon.com/EdGreenwood
I’m using dopplegangers in my Waterdeep game right now! This video came out just on time, thanks ed!
@@donvlinar My pleasure! A wizard is never early, nor is he late. ;}
I plan on using Dopplegangers in a future game so this was great, thank you! The Baldur's Gate video game series is where I really got my entrance to Shallar in The Realms, and where I became so fascinated with them and how they can be used in a story.
I tend to use illusion magic but occasionally have a prominent NPC that falls into the category of Shallar.
This video has inspired me to give them a greater role in the city campaign setting I'm creating.
This is so interesting, I could have used that just a few weeks ago. I am currently running Tyranny of Dragons and had an idea to have my Players investigate the murder of a masked Lord. The perpetrator was a Doppelganger working for the Cult of Dragon. The Doppelganger was assuming the form of a (already deceased) friend of the party and "helped" them in their investigation. Of course they could stop the plot in time but it was rather close.
In any case my Players now hate me but they hate Doppelgangers more. Thank you for creating this beautiful and sometimes terrifying deceptive world.
Gotta love Dopplegangers, got an experienced party? Got an arrogant player? Just looking for a WTF moment or two in your campaign? Call up a Doppleganger.
Heh. Call up? They're already here. ;}
@@edgreenwoodofficial I had a table that became so paranoid by the shape shifters that it was both funny and troubling. It didn't help that they had a Cavalier who had a way of annoying people with his attitude. Needless to say he annoyed the wrong fellow (a Doppleganger who was a prominent merchant and a member of the kingdom's leadership, under different guises of course). This 'fellow' would prank the Cavalier at least once, every time he came to town.
Mostly I like to use them when the campaign is mostly in an urban setting, or I need a really crafty supporting villain.
Now, every now and then, I'll get a player who want's to 'play' a Doppleganger. It's rare that I'll allow it, but it just depends on the player and the character. My friend Shannan was very good; he 'kept' his regular disguise up in front of the rest of the group. It wasn't until much later that the truth came out. As best as I could tell, the group was only annoyed by the fact that they didn't know as surely it would have altered their planning stages. Shannan helped to keep it secret by being openly obsessed with spells and items that altered one's appearance. It was a character quirk, he said, as he tried one lame disguise after another as part of this ruse he was running on the whole group.
@@yourseatatthetable Did the party only seem annoyed or did they think it was a fun reveal? I had a character that managed to keep the fact that he was a mind flayer secret from my party for several sessions. Seeing as how we met on a mind flayer prison ship, I was hoping for SOME sort of reaction to my eventual reveal. Nothing egotistical, just an "ooh, wow! omg bro!" Instead, all I got was "Good, so you can pilot this illithid ship, right?" wan wan. 😑
Even more things to get paranoid over...
Paranoia is an essential life skill in the Realms. ;}
worry not, they are but shapeshifting Harpers
THIS is why you need to be skilled in the Arcane arts or have money to purchase the service of such a person. True Polymorph into something that has true sight and go from there.
Is it really paranoia if they really ARE out to get you?
This is why sense motive and perception (or their prior editions analogues) are so important. You never know if you're talking to the person you think you are, a magically disguised wizard, or some sort of shape changer.
In my country, growing up in the 90s as a geek I had taken note of DnD but it was always an activity reserved for groups of middle-class boys -- not very accessible or welcoming to my gender or class. Thankfully, this has changed and in the past decade I was invited a few times to play but due to being a single parent (and an avid board gamer) I couldn't commit to anything other than one-shots. But, I can finally say that after finding the right crew (and DM ❤) I finally joined a party and their campaign.
Oh dear, exploring the Forgotten Realms is so addictive! I'm familiar with most fantasy worlds and I've studied world mythology in uni but Ed's approach to world-building is so unique and relatable, full of surprises and wisdom. And what a talented narrator he is. I could listen to him all day -- truth be told I AM listening to him all day on YT, I even fall asleep to his voice! I'm 40 years old and I feel like a kid, like I'm getting another chance to have the childhood I missed. From the bottom of my heart, thank you Ed!
I can imagine some noble/wealthy person hiring a doppleganger to live their life while they escape an arranged marriage or something, or just have so much wanderlust that they want to ditch their gilded cage.
And everything worked out well... until they wanted to return home! The doppleganger had grown quite fond of this life...
They would make perfect temporary allies of Bhaalspawn. Someone should do that.
The joys of making next months game.
It's like writing a script for an old TV show like Supernatural. Guys make sure you put story hooks in your adventures or encounters.
Ironically, by seeking a life of ease, they end up with the most stressful of situations…
Oh more lore for The Unseen!!! I’ve been using them in my Waterdeep game because of their connection to the Irlingstar family. So much room for story creation
Amazing timing my friend. I love your videos.
Ivan and Ed make a great team.
Thank you! Ivan is a great man, and an even better friend. The world needs more Ivans.
Would think a slime or baby gelatinous cube would be a better way to get rid of a body
Definitely, I keep a cube in a room in my tower for such... Unexpected occasions 😁
@@nickm9102 I would if I was a doppelganger. :P
I have a Greater Doppelganger Cleric of Lathander npc I use in my games. He was found as a child in the lair of his parent who ran a thieves guild by a group of Lathanderites who smashed the guild. The child was taken in by the church and trained as a cleric, and his unique abilities made him a great asset to the church.
The volume of lore within just this video makes me realize I need to continue developing my skills as a DM and lore within my own setting. Thank you Mr. Greenwood your example continues to motivate and inspire DMs and setting creators everywhere
My favorite doppelganger is not a doppelganger: Nylaersyn Floshin - a fey'ri who infiltrated the Unseen by posing as the the doppelganger Synyl...
The Floshin family has lot's of interesting members.
Erolfindar Floshin is still alive in my campaign and a major character that the players frequently interact with.
@@rogerwilco2 Ah yes! Last Mythal is my favorite series in the Realms so I know that name!
I like that the excuse for Changlings being evil by impersonating people after selling them into slavery or killing them is their laziness. Like they could get a real job but that would be too much effort. It seems the most plausible of all monster motivations.
I enjoy all of Ed Greenwood videos and again thank you for indulging my social hobbies of my youth🎉😅🎉
Ed and the Dopplegangers! A great name for a cover band!
I like to play with the notion of a society of doppelgangers, but I never realized how close it can be from "normal" Dungeons & Dragons. The necessary work involving in faking anything from long enough makes the faking something else. The usual path to became good at doing anything is keep doing that badly, and "fake it until you make it" is not a empty expression. This people are useful members of society, in their own way, and sooner or later some societies will realize that.
Is hard to not see the ending result. Gradually a giving human city has its doppelganger population raising. They are in many of the strategic positions. Eventually, all strategic positions. So, one day, someone notices this is not a human city anymore. This is a doppelganger city with some non-doppelgangers.
Generation after generation, people realize they don't need to pretend anything. They are the prosperous and industrious society their ancestors pretended to be.
Eventually the rest of the world recognizes this as the capital of a Shallar nation. Another civilized nation, no worse than any other. Likely, better neighbour than most.
I wonder how would feel humans, dwarves, elves. Travelling in a land owned by self-declared doppelganger. Perhaps not all people in the nation belong to this race. Just all nobles and most rich merchants.
I must have the mindset of the Doppelganger down pretty good. I had one I did as a character that started off as a merchant's son. His goal was to set up a merchant caravan up and down the Sword Coast so he could then set up and own a series of inns for travelers and merchants on those routes where there were no inns yet.
I've been a fan of yours since I was 11 Ed, I clung to Forgotten Realms lore the second I found out about it, and can't believe I'm just finding your channel now.
This video actually helps me a good bit right now, I'm running Dragon Heist.
I don't know if you cover this later on, only at 6:23 . BTW I Can see a few open Shallar as "Distractions" protecting others as well.
I know they have innate polymorph, is it possible some might just make a series of id's that are combinations of people rather than direct replacements, that way they can claim:
"I've not killed anyone and replaced them this is just a combination of someone I admire and a parent, I'd be careful though many of my fellow Shallar are less idealistic."
I can also see one living in the open as a dress merchant, what to see how the dress would look and not a reverse reflection? We had a top model who can take your form so you can see if from all sides!
Or a troupe of Bards who put on plays with amazing "Costumes"
4:09 4:09 Like the background. I just reading the double diamond books. 9 of them. Half of the story is about a doppelganger. Ed's book shandril's saga also deals with dopplegangers.
There are even more in my books. You just don't know they're doppelgangers. ;}
@@edgreenwoodofficial true
Maybe im projecting my feelings but i choked up at the end Quote and i think Mr Greenwood did too. I didnt even see his face when the quote began but i felt a rush of profound feeling in me. Thats the power im looking for in storytelling
In the hood they're doppelgangbangers.
A doppelganger weatherman is a dopplerganger.
so is that doppleganger brothel still active in Waterdeep
The what
@@sashacollins5399 Volo outed a brothel that was dopplegangers and greater dopplegangers... they were really mad at him
Now we just need a video on mimics, from books to spitting, especially including the intelligent talking kind.
I really love these videos. I think the forgotten realms are so good. I have read everything I can get my hands on, there is always more to find out. EL is my favorite character. I want to know what gonna happen with manshoon too.
I never knew you had a yt channel till 5 seconds ago... Time to binge every video!
Puts a spin on this monster.
Production quality got a MAJOR upgrade, videos are looking SHARP now
A few thoughts I had watching this
Even a good doppelganger who assumes the form of someone who died a death unrelated to them could potentially be blackmailed by the evil character who killed that person in the first place because they would know that that person was dead and that this is an imposter so that could make for some very interesting and complex npcs
Some doppelgangers would likely be employed by wealthy and powerful people who know what they are to act as body doubles, which I imagine would be a lucrative but risky business
Definitely sharing this video with my DM since our game is set in Waterdeep
Don't forget to SUBSCRIBE! So, we can continue to get this great content.
Great post, Ed. Bringing yet another facet of the Realms to life!
Loved the video! Enjoying the format well. Thank you.
It would be funny if we discovered that EVERYBODY is a doppleganger, including potential victims of dopplegangers. 😁
So doppelgangers occupy the exact rank of society that I would want to..... great.
i wonder if its possible to play as a shallar and maybe even hide it from the party
Hey Ed! Are you planning to make videos for other Wards of Waterdeep like the one you made for North Ward?
Is Ed going to an archery tournament after this video?
A fantastic video!
Busting out my Eye of the Druuthbane
So question. The skeem with the dragon scales to throw off suspension, how does that work with the dragon ward up over waterdeep? Wouldn't they find it odd that a dragon had made its way in or would they think they sustained their injuries outside and came in the city for cover?
The DM we all wanted, or strove to become.
This monster is dangerous as well as a pain in the back. Also extremely difficult to deal with and defeat it prays on human to catch and eat.
Love the outro
Honestly. from a societal point of view. doppelgangers really don't seem to be that much of a problem. they take the lives of those living comfortably in the status quo and then continue and try and keep the status quo as is so they can keep living comfortably and rich. this does mean that they will fight against positive societal changes that do not serve them..but i'd argue that the person they'd replace would more then likely have done the same given that no one likes changes that makes their situation worse. the only issue is the sociopathic mindset a doppelganger has and so a doppelganger might go far futher in his effort to serve himself then the original person might (unless the original person is also quite sociopathic). i'd guess that while they seem like a very terrifying threat, the actual impact on doppelgangers on the going ons of the world would be surprisingly minimal.
Thank you Arch Magus. Your words of warning are sacred to the wise.
A lot impersonate spoiled children, reading the minds of victims and manipulating parents and siblings.
What is it about old-school RPG creators having godly voices? Personally I call it the Dungeon Master Voice or Game Master Voice. Cyberpunk's Mike Pondsmith, The Realms has Ser Greenwood. Geez. I betcha people would buy short downloadable audio-logs/audio-descriptions for bits of lore or cities or areas for their phone so novice DMs will just play that on the game table, or maybe practice imitating the cadence.
Doppelgangers are one of those few monsters that fall into the category of interesting have some useful Powers but not too powerful what I'm saying are monsters that could very well be used as player characters
So, where do Changelings, like Orin the Red from Baldur's Gate III, fit into Realmslore, if at all?
Are they related to Doppelgangers in some way (e.g. if they're hybrid descendants of Doppelgangers and other races, similar to Half-Elves, Half-Orcs, Half-Dragons, Half-Celestials, Half-Fiends, and the various Planetouched races; if Changelings came first and some of them got altered to become the modern Doppelgangers somehow; or if they're just two different names for the same creature?), or are they different creatures altogether that just developed similar traits through either convergent evolution or deliberate design?
Are Changelings considered to be Humanoids like the Eberron setting's Changelings are (or were, pre-MotM), Fey as they were classified in the setting-neutral Monsters of the Multiverse, or as Monstrosities like Doppelgangers are in the Monster Manual?
Do people in Faerûn frequently mistake Changelings for Doppelgangers and break out the torches and pitchforks if and when they happen to catch one shapeshifting?
Do Changelings and Doppelgangers run in the same circles, or do they give each other a wide berth whenever possible?
Runesmith did a video of it. ua-cam.com/video/AMZdKdJ2qu8/v-deo.html
Thank you sir
A lesson on doppelgangers and imposters - what a coincidence. I visited the Forgotten Realms Wiki page for Alustriel Silverhand just yesterday, and I'm pretty sure I stumbled upon a spoiler of this nature for the new adventure module that pits PCs against Vecna. Well, of course per Wizards of the Coast's storytelling, Elminster couldn't be the Torilian archmage to lead the forces of good against the eye-and-hand BBEG - without spoiling anything for other commenters on this video, Elminster would have spotted the imposter six planes away. Ruins the drama.
Re "innate cooperation": beauty within them words.. plus (as simplply ascertained it's not "because🔎),
Gotta get permanent True Sight 😂
naaah they just trying to enjoy life and keep the peace (mostly) plus do you really want to know your favourite Sunite priestess is a doppleganger
I've all ways loved a good Doppelganger but I like to have be used by the Big bad In The same was as famous dictators
Mr, Greenwood, one for comment, Are the Shallar self aware that their own actions of how they treat (and eat) others have made themselves hated by so many others? If they realized they were just honest and hard working (and less consuming of other intelligent races) they would be welcomed with open arms?
Is a doppelganger network a doppelganger gang banger?
Doppelgangers, also known as Shallar... and j w e s.
🖖❤️
s
567👍
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE ... Do an episode on Evereska.
My party is going to be there in a few sessions and there's nearly 0 real info on the city online, even the wiki is, sparce