Let's see how the Line 6 Catalyst compares to the Fender Tone Master
Вставка
- Опубліковано 22 вер 2022
- Today I explore whether the Line 6 Catalyst can get close to the Fender Tone Master Deluxe Reverb at producing Fender tones. I show how each responds to low gain overdrive pedals in clean mode, and whether the Catalyst has an amp model that gets close to the Tone Master's natural overdrive.
I reviewed the Catalyst a few months ago, here's a link:
• Leonard checks out the...
I also demoed my Fender Tone Master. Here's a link to that video:
• About my amp, the Fend...
I had been on the fence for some time about which amp to ultimately get and this finally made the decision! The Fender is awesome, but the Catalyst is my choice! Thank you for doing this comparison!
And thank you for tuning in. 😎
Well, you just sold me on the Catalyst. Great video, thanks very much!
Someone needs to tell Line 6! LOL
Thanks for watching.
Catalyst is such as Bang for The Buck
Great play and comparison videos sir!
Subscribed
Thank you my friend. Glad you enjoyed it.
Thanks Leonard, both equipped with great sound , spontaneously the song Tin Pan Alley came in my mind ....
Thanks. 😊
Hmmm, very informative video. I think Both sound really great! I liked the bouquet setting on the 6, and you’re right the edge goes to the Big “F”! Thx for these great videos Sir!
I bought a Katana mk2 just to be
Be controversial 😱😆. Maybe I should do a shootout of my Vibrolux and the Katana. Blasphemy😱💥😆. Might even get my first Thumbs Down 😱
Loving you series, All of them👍
I owned a couple of Katanas, a 50 and the Mk II, 100 watt head. Certainly a capable amp, especially the gain sounds.
Dang! I think I am buying the Catalyst. Thanks!
And thank you for watching.
Good review … i wish your personal ‘like’ was presented at the end rather than up front. I absolutely loved the rifts you used to judge the similarities (differences are to be expected).
Without changing any settings, i agree with your ‘ears’ - You can close your eyes and the Tone Master sounded as thou we’re in a smokey Cafe somewhere enjoying good talent. At this point - would have LOVED it if you could have shown what ACTUAL tweak to the Catalyst could bring it closer to the Tone Master sound …
Great Video … thanks fir helping me ‘hear’ a great sound and an affordable path to make it mine.
(Really loved rifts used to demo the comparison)
Thanks, I’m very happy you enjoyed the video. I hope I got the point across in any case.
I used to have high end fenders. Amps and guitar. Lost them to a fire. Replaced them with a catalyst 60 and a Leo jamz tele clone. Didn't take long to realize that I paid a lot of money for the fender name. Gear I have now I'm keeping.
That’s a good attitude to have. Thanks so much for watching.
Very good video in presentation and your playing fits the real world !
Usable head range, point of amp breakup without pedals and tone!
Thank you
Well thank you. I appreciate it.
Nice video. There are other reasons as well why you'd pick one or the other. I'll be picking up a Catalyst 2x12 in a week. I run a Helix and if anything happens to my rig during the gig I'm covered. I'll also be running the Helix into the power amp in and just using the amp as a platform. Can't do that with the Fender unless you go 4CM and do some gymnastics. But the biggest reason for my choice is the cost. I'm a working musician so you know how that goes. BTW, one of my favorite sounds on my Helix is a Blackface Deluxe.
Thanks. To be clear, my intention was not to pit the two amps against each other and advise one over the other, but simply to see if I could get close to the Fender with the Catalyst (I reviewed the Catalyst separately in an earlier video). These are most likely going to appeal to completely different types of players. You don’t buy a Tone Master if you’re interested in multiple amp models, effects, etc. That’s obviously not the target market. As a traditional blues player who needs a very lightweight, all in one unit that does an amazing blackface Fender without having to lug one around (which I’ve done for many decades), the Tone Master is a godsend. The depth, complexity, drive characteristics, etc., are really remarkable. But for many players, especially those who do rock covers where versatility will be very helpful, the Catalyst or another amp that does multiple models with effects might be the better choice. The Catalyst, for such an inexpensive modeler, gets some very good sounds, especially the overdriven models. I was favorably impressed and preferred it to the similarly priced Katana. But again, that may just be my traditional bias.
Thanks again for watching.
@@leonardgriffieblues5845 thanks for the reply. If it weren't for my Helix I'd probably try the Tone Master but there's been 2 amp brands that have never worked for me....Marshall and Fender for what ever reason. The last Fender I had was a Hot Rod Deville 4x10. Too loud, too heavy and honky sounding. Marshalls have been worse. Again, great video.
Very informative 👍🎶thanks
Glad to hear it. Thanks for watching.
Hi Leonard! Great playing and tone! Was this video made with the Tone Master's original Jensen speaker, or is this after you had switched to the Creamback? Thanks so much!
The Creamback. I didn’t leave the Jensen in for long, since I already owned the Creamback. In my opinion it’s a far better amp with the Celestion and the firmware update.
Thanks for watching.
I use a Catalyst. Not is it a versatile unit, but the bang for the buck can’t be denied. Do I think the ToneMaster range is excellent? Yes, I do. Do I think the Catalyst is a whole lot of value and more than good enough for live? Yep. As long as you can make the amp feel right under your fingers, the audience will not know any difference
I was impressed with the Catalyst, as you’ve seen if you watched my precious video on it. For me, the Tone Master is right, but for many others the Catalyst will be the best choice. Way better than the Line6 amps I tried years ago.
Thanks for watching.
@@leonardgriffieblues5845 - I have watched your videos (it was part of my research prior to buying the Catalyst). I agree that the TM series are unbelievable tone machines. I just can't justify the cost as much as I'd like to! Great content as always!
Im wanting a good versatile clean tone. I tried the Tonemasters at GC and wasnt at all impressed. Im thinking of getting the Line 6 catalyst 100 watt version.
Well that might be the one for you. But be sure you played the blonde Tone Master. That neo Jensen in the black one is pretty awful and the amp is night and day with the Celestion in the blonde version.
Thanks for watching.
I got the line 6 because it was 25% of the Tone Master price.
Ich habe Tone Master verkauf und Catalyst gekauft und das war ein s.gute deal ich vermise den T.M nicht
I would use the Tone Master as a pedal platform, as I've used most amps. The Catalyst is a great all-in-one amp and a better value for most players, and I think I'd have to go with it myself for this reason. The Catalyst is a huge improvement over the other Line 6 amps and more in line with their fine Helix line of pedals.
Yes, the Tone Master does a very specific thing. It sounds and responds like a blackface Deluxe Reverb. And it does that better than any modeler other than maybe high dollar units like the Kemper. If you’re not after that specific thing and just want a good pedal amp, then it would make far less sense. And I agree the Catalyst is about the best sounding Line6 amp I’ve tried. Not the amp for me, but certainly a great amp for lots of players.
Thanks for watching.
@@leonardgriffieblues5845 I'm thrilled with the current state of solid state. I've always believed in giving it a fair shake as I've used many solid state amps since I began gigging in the mid 80s. I've used plenty of tube amps, but to be honest, they are very overrated. It's not that great tube amps don't exist, but rather than too many players ignore solid state innovations because they buy into witchcraft about tubes. One of the only things that can change this is the growing adaptation of solid state, mainly in the form of units like Fractal, Helix, etc., by some very big players from Mark Knopfler to John McLaughlin. Because of these units a lot of players are forgoing cabs and going right into the PA board. Cabinet and speaker emulation is groundbreaking. Amps like the Catalyst or the Katana are giving players a taste of this cutting edge tech at a good price point.
It is he helex technology I read somewhere
Have you tried the Line6 Spider V ii amps? I think they sound great. I wonder if the Catalyst is a "huge improvement" over one.
Would've been nice to hear the "difference" with an effort made to match the character of the Deluxe TM with the Catalyst tone controls.
Actually, I did that very thing. Since the point was to see how close the Catalyst could get, I tweaked the controls to get as close as possible. Sorry if that wasn’t clear. Fact is, no amount of time knob twisting would make it sound like a blackface Fender. Still, it’s very good at what it does.
I had a tone master and sold it. Great amp but too much a one trick pony for the price. And I wasn't happy with jow it took some of my pedals. Now I play through a catalyst 200 2x12.
Yes, any gear needs to fit your personal requirements. For me, the Tone Master is the best representation of blackface tone in an extremely lightweight amp, but it was absolutely designed to do it’s one trick only. I haven’t had any issues with pedals or anything else, but again, you have to choose based on your own needs. The Catalyst is the best Line6 combo I’ve tried. Thanks so much for watching.
Clean with no pedals, the Fender was the clear winner to me. With pedals, I thought the Catalyst was quite good. I think they should make a Catalyst head because the speakers are always a weakness in budget amps.
Line 6 has traditionally made head versions of their amps, so it wouldn’t be surprising if they offer one in the future.
@@leonardgriffieblues5845 They designed this speaker for the Cab and head, I looked at some forums to see if anyone changed the speakers (playing full frequency Music just does not sound like it's going to be a good Guitar speaker, or the best one anyways) and a few guys did and it did not sound good to them.
To emulate a 2x12 or 4x12 cab they need to add stuff I guess. Once I played it for a few weeks the speaker loosened up and it sounds better, a little more balls and less brittle highs.
To a comment above, this will never emulate a actual Fender, its has no girth, that was the first thing I noticed when I turned it on compared to the H&K amp I had been using this sounded like a hollow box. Cab is too thin, but that saves on weight, another selling point for me. I am tired of a pound a watt combos amps.
Did you try selecting manual mode and adjusting the gain on the amp model to get more distortion? Also the catalyst isn't meant to be a fender clone. If you dig into the editing a bit you would be surprised what you create.
Thanks for watching. Yes, I point out the Catalyst was not designed to get blackface tones. It was just an interesting exercise to see if I could get close. And yes, I’m sure there’s a lot more available through editing. I don’t remember if I mentioned that on this video or my earlier review of the Catalyst alone. In any event, I like to show what the amp can do just by twisting the knobs and I usually mention there’s more to be had for those who like to hook it up to a computer. Again, thanks for tuning in.
Depends on your budget. I’m great with the catalyst
And that’s what matters.
Thanks for watching.
Great sounds from both...Tone Master is better but the price gap is by faaaaar too wide
Honestly I think they’re products designed for entirely different markets. I was interested to see if the Catalyst could get in the ballpark, but mimicking a blackface Fender is not really its forte.
I have both amps and 8 others including a toneking imperial mk2 and the boutique amp on the catalyst sounds just as good as the tonemaster
The point was never that one is “better”. It’s been awhile now but as I recall I was trying to see if I could replicate the Tone Master with the Catylist. I played blackface Fenders since the 60s and more recently, all the backlines on the bigger shows typically were Fender reissues, so when I had to give up my vintage Fenders as I got old (dammit LOL), the best lightweight solution I found was the Tone Master with the Neo Creamback. Earlier I gave the Catalyst a very favorable review, and in the video you’re referring to it wasn’t intended to be a “which one is best”. Sorry if that wasn’t clear and thanks for watching.
Doesn't the Catalyst's editor software iron out differences; increase Sag enough; etc..?
Perhaps. I haven’t had the Catalyst for quite a long time now and I didn’t get into using the editor, since I only bought it for the videos. In general though, I’ve played blackface Fenders since the 60s and toured with them and in my experience not many amps sound and respond exactly the same. The Catalyst is a nice sounding modeling amp and has some real quality sounds, just not that very specific thing. For that matter, neither do all these 2 channel tube amps that claim the clean channel has “Fendery cleans”. I’m not sure what they mean by that, but they never sound like Fenders.
Thanks so much for watching.
@@leonardgriffieblues5845 thanks so much for replying
That's my new amp I just bought a catalyst 60 that's all you need
Nice. I hope it’s all you hope for. Thanks for watching.
I’m curious how the Catalyst would sound with an upgraded speaker.
It would likely change the character, but may or may not be an improvement. I performed that experiment with one of the Boss amps a few years ago (can’t remember if it was the Katana or Nextone), trying a couple of relatively expensive speakers and was surprised to find the stock speaker sounded best. Both Roland and Line6 seem to optimize the speaker for their modeling tech. It may be that a flatter response than the typical guitar speaker is what’s called for (pure speculation).
Totally with you on this one for sure. I had a couple of speakers kicking around so thought id try them out on my Catalyst. Result is i tried the Creamback and the Greenback and they werent as good as the stock speaker so I now run the Catalyst as is and use the stock speaker. @@leonardgriffieblues5845
The difference is most noticeable straight in. I think the Tone Master takes the ribbon there. But both amps sound great with guitar. I just can't get over how faithful the Tone Master is to vintage black face Fender. Definitely worth the money for Fender diehards.
Especially those no longer able to carry heavy tube amps!
To be honest, I thought the Tone Master sounded a bit weird in this video. Nasaly, and muffled in some frequencies.
Fender is late to the modeling game, and I think it shows. Their pricing is insane too.
But nice demo and playing, thank you.
Interesting. Thanks so much for watching.
The Fender sounds better but it is a slight difference that I would still buy the Catalyst and save a ton
And if you enjoy the versatility and built in effects, the Catalyst would be the way to go. Thanks for watching.
They both sound like you are playing a Strat through them, and from the other room I could not hear you changing them.
If you have a grand for a amp, get another few hundred and buy a Tube amp. One model, why, just build the real amp for a Grand. (real ones are not cheap, 6Gs for a combo and 2300CND for a head). Still; only one amp, they can do better.
The 200w Catalyst is cheaper (600CND) than the Fender and you get MiDi control with that version as well. (100w also has that feature).
the big thing with the Catalyst is the Bias Controls on the PC control panel. You have every amp in the world with that and the Sag control.
Bias is the charge your tubes are idling at, higher means they are ready for the input, but also burns them out (in RL analog gear).
BiasX is the plate charge
Blending the two compresses and adds sparkle to the distortion.
Sag is how your Poweramp out handles the input from the preamps, high Sag means less pick attack because the PowerAmp is being overloaded, low Sag is a PowerAmp that can take what the pre's are feeding it, a more defined pick attack.
I think that clean channel is modeled after a solid state amp, it's the only one with no Bias controls but it does have Sag and Hum. I think you want the Chime Amp for a Fender(ish) sound.
Cheers! (I just watched Jimi's first Video with some singers, and then you start playing what can only be described as heavily Jimi influenced riffs and fills. Serendipity, or the algorithm, we can't tell anymore). 🍁
Thanks. The fact is, I played blackface Fender amps since I began in the 60s. And I toured with vintage Fender amps until I finally had to retire from the road ( except for all the fly in shows where I’d use backline amps, usually Fender vintage reissues). When age related back issues forced me to go as light as possible, the Tone Master was a real godsend. For awhile I used small tube heads and cabs, but being able to carry a 20 lb amp that requires nothing else to set up but my pedalboard, and that sounds and responds very close to the amps I’d been using all my life really was a no brainer.
The Catalyst is a very decent sounding amp, and good at what it does. But I found it can’t come close to doing a convincing blackface Fender, nor is it designed to.
My used TMDR with a Weber 12Q copy doesn’t sound or feel as good as my 5E3 clone, or a good vintage BF Deluxe or DR. Still, old broke bassists like me can’t afford a big stable of tube amps. The TMDR suits me fine as one side of my stereo rig, and a used Cat 60 complements it perfectly for my “dirty side”. Light, loud enough, and cheap to boot!
Yes, as I’ve said many times, the Tone Master isn’t going to win in a direct comparison. But it does a remarkable enough job I’m never thinking about it during a performance.
Thanks so much for watching and engaging.
It was proven back when cd players came out that .5 dB difference was enough to create a clear tonal preference between identical devices, and the dB difference between these samples is far, FAR greater than that, not to mention that the gain structure on the Catalyst is clearly not adjusted to create the greatest possible equivalency. No effort seems to have been made to equate apples to apples, and that's what side-by-side comparisons are all about. That said, the Fender sure do sound like a Fender, don't it?
Thanks for watching.
Why you Use Pedals ???? Everything you need is in the Catalyst btw I want to here a Amp as it is without any pedals
I did a full review of the Catalyst, without pedals, earlier. The point of this video was to see how close I could get to the Tone Master and how it takes pedals was part of that. Again, for a full review of the Catalyst:
ua-cam.com/video/gBrKAztx7Go/v-deo.html
I have the katana head
Nice. I hope it’s perfect for you. Thanks for watching.
Already at 2:22 - you can hear the difference in headphones - the Catalyst sounds "sterile" after the Deluxe (especially with the Jam Ray) and your attack sounds overdone. And that combo of The Dude and the Deluxe - creamy!
It does show how important the detail and texture is in the clean sound, even when using pedals. I really think an amp like the Catalyst (or the Katana for that matter) is better when using the gain channels.
"Sterile"? Lol, no.
Import some Fender irs change the speaker maybe The Catalyst is different beast 3times less the cost In the end it all turns down to preference of brand or brand snobbery
I try to evaluate gear on its merits with no respect to brands. Brand loyalty or snobbery never made much sense to me. Just like what you like.
@@leonardgriffieblues5845 I Agree with you it's only a marketing ploy to fleece the consumer
I bought a tonemaster twin,I'm wrapped. I've got tube amps also but given the effects I'm using my ears aren't going to decipher a huge difference. My old mustang V2 100 watt is still firing and as I use only one amp voice plus overdrive,reverb delay the tonemaster is just the sensible answer to questions not even asked. I got the twin for the speaker setup and the fact it was only a few hundred dollars more then deluxe
So... for almost $1000 I'd get a solidstate amp that only models a Fender Twin? I don't care if it's a perfect clone there's no way I could justify it over a Catalyst, Katana, yada yada.
Thankfully there are lots of choices. I appreciate the view.
This is like comparing a house cat to a catfish. It's literally two different animals.
Of course they are, and I tried to make that very clear in the video. The point was only to see if those who want multiple models might be able to get close to a blackface Fender sound with the Catalyst. I made it clear that’s not what the amp is best at, but could it get in the ballpark?
Not saying this is you, but sometimes I get these comments from viewers who look at the thumbnail and only skim the video. Again, if that’s not you I apologize if I wasn’t more clear. And thanks for watching.
@@leonardgriffieblues5845 I've worked in music retail since the 80s and demoed and sold everything from $99 beginner amps to touring rigs. I retired a couple of years ago and forgot not every video is aimed at me. I didn't mean to sound crass. Newbies gotta learn somehow. Sorry if I seemed smartalecky.
Tonemasters sound good... But so does just about everything else nowadays! The fender looks legit and is lite as a feather, and also is waay overpriced imo.
Obviously choose what’s right for you. No shortage of choice. Thanks for watching.
Tone Master is definitely better, but it's not chalk and cheese. I feel like you're paying 3x the price for 1/3rd better tone.
For me, it’s not so much a matter of “better”, but rather the Tone Master’s ability to replicate most of the specific characteristics of a classic blackface Fender. It’s not perfect, but it does it better than most. The Catalyst produces nice sounds in its own right, nothing at all wrong with it; a hand wired Marshall doesn’t do blackface Fender either. Just depends what you’re after.
Thanks so much for watching.
I had a Catalyst for one day. Returned it. A child’s toy at best.
So… you didn’t like it? 🤣🤣
I can’t tell from this if you watched the video or are just responding to the thumbnail, but if you did, thanks.
O wow. a $1,000 amp sounds better than a $300 amp.
My mind is fucking blown right now. Why the fuck isn't it the other way around?
Well I’m glad your mind is blown but I think maybe you missed the point, which was to see how close that $300 amp could get. (Not all the way there but certainly not bad.) Thanks for watching anyway.
No need to be a dick.
You missed the point so mugged yourself right off there anyway 😊