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- Опубліковано 31 січ 2019
- My 2nd attempt at designing a Printed Circuit Board - a great improvement!
$5 for 10 PCBs and fast turnaround: pcbway.com
So my second foray into the world of PCB CAD has produced a much better PCB design (IMHO) than my first attempt. I used both EasyEDA and KiCAD but which did I prefer and why? Both are free to use with no limitations.
This is not a detailed "how to" on using either of those programs. But I try and show that it's not rocket science to get a decent PCB design - if you have sufficient restraint and patience to get the circuit diagram done first the rest is much easier.
Videos on EasyEDA (UA-cam playlist). This appears to be the official guide but I warn you the English is atrocious:
• Playlist
Or find UA-camr MickMake and follow his quirky style on EasyEDA:
• #184 Making a PCB usin...
DigiKey's excellent series of videos about KiCad v5.0 (with Shawn Hymel)
• Intro to KiCad
COMPONENTS mentioned in the video:
Stackable Header pins for Arduino (you need 1 x 10 pin, 2 x 8 pin and 1 x 6 pin for a complete shield)
10 pin www.banggood.com/5pcs-10P-2_5...
8 pin: www.banggood.com/3pcs-8P-2_54...
AliExpress do a complete header kit for Arduino, 6P, 8P, 10P x 20, very cheap
www.aliexpress.com/item/FREE-...
Soldering iron tip cleaner scourer
www.banggood.com/DANIU-1-Pcs-...
If you like this video please give it a thumbs up, share it and if you're not already subscribed please consider doing so :)
My channel and blog are here:
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ralphbacon.blog
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KICAD uses the mouse wheel for pan-ing and zoom-ing. Scroll for zoom, click and drag for pan. If you are doing a more complex board, the KICAD 5.0's openGL default mode supports automatic track placement that will move other tracks and via's out of the way when you need to route a new track through a tight space. I hated KICAD when I first switched from EAGLE, but once you get used to how it works, it is an amazing tool. Contextual Electronics has tons of great UA-cam videos and Chris has just started publishing a bunch of new videos on the new 5.0 version
The fact that you at first hated KiCAD but now obviously think it's great gives me confidence that if I persevere I should learn how to use it too. So I will. Thanks for that, Edward.
I know quite literally nothing about electronics and circuit boards but somehow I ended up here and was mesmerised by your video. I'd love to learn .anyway ,no idea what I've just watched really but I kinda loved it :)
I'm glad you enjoyed it even if you didn't understand it all. Maybe you will start a new electronics hobby?
Your experiences with KiCAD and EasyEDA mirror my own almost exactly. My present project is a vocoder, and I have just ordered the PCB's for the PPM's using EasyEDA/JLCPCB.
I will win - that's how it works. . .
Enjoyed the video - subscribed.
Glad to have you along for the Arduinite journey, Ellis. My view on KiCad is slowly being modified, which I will make clearer in a future video. But EasyEDA rulz!
Thanks, very clear. I love the fact you don't get it all in one go, you bumble along, just like I do and will continue to, and finally either work it out or give up for a while.; Then we get the update.
It's nice to see how it all comes together. I will be having a go myself soon, Thanks again, keep it up.
You are so welcome! Now, I hope that, as far as PCB design is concerned at least, I no longer bumble along 😉 and that I have grasped the (hobbyist, prototype) essentials. But we all have to go through the pain of the learning curve (aka the bumbling along phase) to learn anything! All I can say is DO have a go. Don't expect perfection. Learn from your mistakes. Keep going! Watch lots of instructional videos. Once you have "got it", it makes such a difference to your projects. Thanks so much for posting, great to hear from you.
@@RalphBacon Thanks, I am always giving it a go, I have decided to bumble along for quite a while with the PCB design as it takes a lot of mistakes to get something that looks OK(ish). Please keep your results posted. I am trying to do the "Elector" watchdog board as practice, if it makes perfect I should be so very good,😂.
P.S. When can I place an order for your one??
My boards have arrived, I built one to check it, works 100%. Assuming you are in the UK send me your full UK address via email (my email you will find the ABOUT tab of this channel). Don't tell anyone! Note: my boards are (mostly) for SMD components except the 1N4148 diode and 2N7000 MOSFET transistor, mainly because i have a lot of those and just wanted to use them up!
I feel your learning-curve pain Ralph :)
It's a bit of a steep one, Julian, but well worthwhile, even with all the frustrations that it brings! That said, I know my second board is better than my first (well, let's face it, it had to be) and I'm sure my third board will improve again. Getting the time to do all this is the challenge! Thanks for posting, Julian, it is really good to hear from you.
Good job Ralph, enjoyed the video.
Thanks for that, barryg41, nice to hear from you.
Thank you Ralph, love the channel, working on my first pcb 😎
Best of luck! Are you using EasyEDA?
Thank you for saving me the sisyphean task of wrestling with KiCad. I generally (wrongly) don't take web bases apps too seriously, so I would have opted for the KiCad first. Now I know that, even if at times a little challenging, I would do better persevering with EasyEDA. Great video and I to think the finished product looks just fine without an enclosure. Well done you!
Thanks, Michael, and the boss has not complained about the look either so I guess it's a winner. Well, I'm not so sure Dougle has taken much notice of it so far, but it's a long term thing. Whilst I do like EasyEDA more, I will go through the "pain barrier" of KiCAD because so many of you have said, "Go for it". So I will try. What's that, Joda? "There is no try, only do or not do." Oh, OK.
Great video Ralph! thanks for sharing! 👍
Thanks for watching!
I have subscribed to your channel and find your videos very useful, keep up the good work. There seems to be 3 main areas to making a finished project, 1/ the electronic design 2/ the PCB design and build and 3/ finding or making the ideal enclosure. So far I have skipped making PCB's by using ready made MCU modules, but plan to make my own PCB's at some stage and KiCad looks well supported and worth learning. For the project cases I made my own 3D printer, this alone is a great experience if you like making things and 3 years ago cost around £200.00 and is a Prusa clone. The 3D modelling software to design a case also has it's own learning curve, I use FreeCad and find this straight forward and when used with a 3D printer it's not hard to make a quality case. For more involved projects cases including apertures and bezels for things like LCD displays or adding a bit of style to an enclosure then 3D printing is the only way to go.
It's quite funny (or ironic, even) that you have cracked the enclosure problem but have yet to design the PCBs. I'm still looking at enclosures but not sure if I can really justify a 3D yet.
If you can use FreeCad then I suspect that you will grasp KiCAD in no time at all. Or EasyEDA, also very easy to use (in some ways, still easier than KiCAD).
Thanks for joining me as a subscriber on my journey, appreciated.
I like your videos Ralph. I like your "just a normal guy" style. I learned on orcad since I was working at a company that used it. I would say it just depends on what you get used to. I agree that easyEDA is very intuitive and has almost no learning curve. +1 for the Chinese. I would say if you plan on making a bunch of boards kiCad is worth the time invested.
Very true, Joey, it does depend on what you get used to, or what just "clicks". And Easy EDA just clicked with me. And thanks for your post, yes, I'm just a normal guy who makes stuff! And sharing it with the world. Thanks for posting.
so where do i get the pcb circuit for the repelant as i may build this my-self as i have a dog that conctantly barks and at the moment iv tried loads of things but to no avail
If I send you my PayPal page's password, Tony, for the postage, I can send you a board - but that's it, no components, no technical assistance, just good will! If you are interested find my email in the "About" tab on my channel and let me know! FYI the ultrasonic repeller unit I used is not cheap - check that out first. Details all in the video's description and my GitHub, I believe. I would say this "helped" my dog quieten down, not fully but better than before.
Hi Ralph, love the laughter at the beginning ! very contagious. This is the exact route I took and I learned so much with EasyEDA, I had never touched CAD before this. I personally would recommend this way to anyone new to CAD. I decided to persevere with Kicad, It's a lot harder at first, as you found out ! but this was my personal choice. Both have viewers but I think Kicad has a massive advantage cos it shows the Physical shape and size of components next to each other in real life, never mind if its red or green, is it 5mm and does it fit ! Kicad also has a realy confusing libary structure (at least for me !) but again with practice it becomes normal...oh yeah the mouse wheel button is your "fist grab " thing, use this to swing around, and wheel to zoom in and out. The little green errors can be got rid of by placing power flags on power inputs just once as well as ground VCC etc, or ignored as green is more for your guidance than an actual error....I think...I to am only learning to!......one more thing to note is there are lots of Kicad library's that contain 3d components but quite tricky to use, again for me, as I'm not a file handling sort of guy. Anyway that's quite enough (for now). I look forward to perhaps some more CAD stuff in the future?...…...nice vid.
Yes, the component layout in the 3D viewer in KiCAD is indeed a plus point. I've tried the mouse wheel click as others suggested this too, great stuff! Now I need to get my head around libraries so I can import other components - and/or learn to create my own. So much to do, so little time to do it. Thanks for posting, AndyMouse123, good to hear from you. Hahahahahhaha - oh , there's that infectious laugh again!
@@RalphBacon yes libraries ! when you get that sorted please do a tutorial !..thanks
I am now on Kicad and it is really the best for me .And it is totally free
It is indeed free, and supported by CERN too. Which might explain why it feels (to me) like a tool only a technician could write and feel at home with! But it's a capable product and if you go to the trouble (as I did) to install the Autorouter it's quite usable; just a pity it's not integrated into the main product.
I love Kicad. I don't think it is as easy to get started, but after a slight learning curve it's a pleasure to use and is very capable. If you plan on doing more than quite basic boards I think the learning time for Kicad will quickly be offset :)
Undoubtedly you're correct, Josh, which is why I have committed to giving it another go, perhaps I will use it to produce my next board, even though I find EasyEDA easier!
Great video, I would highly recommend Fritzing for pcb design especially for arduino related pcb boards they offer a wide range of templates and shield pcb's and components and ive found it to be super easy as far as drag and drop and customization. Different strokes for different folks but just thought i would make the suggestion.
I never considered Fritzing as I have only ever seen it for breadboard mock-ups - in my view far less clear than a proper circuit diagram but I appear to have only seen a glimpse of it so I've added it to my list of things to explore properly. I know at least one other viewer has suggested the same.Thanks for the nudge.
What are the extra “dots” at P1 pin2, R3 and at the Arduino 5V pin?
Does the sw jst ignore these?
Dots... dots.. in which software, irgski, EasyEDA or KiCad? And at which point in the video, so I can have a look?
Thanks for sharing this walk through😀👍
Glad you liked it Asger, good to hear from you again, it's been a while!
Any one can tell what is the name of that table mate of green colour with scaling lines
It's a self-healing cutting mat, to be found everywhere at various costs and sizes. Don't buy too cheap (and nasty).
Any idea how i can place a hole for wiring and holes for potentiometers in schematic mode? In pcb format you can place holes and pads, but then you cant lay down the traces via schematic mode.
You need to know the pin spacing of the pot (plus [optional] fixing lug), so you can add a three pin header (or equivalent) on the PCB. If you have the pot already then you will have to measure (accurately) the distance between holes). If you are buying a pot, you need the datasheet which will have all this information on it.
If you intend to have the pots remote from the main PCB, connected by wires, than a standard three pin header is what you need. Make sense?
@@RalphBacon A little yes. Audio pots are fairly standardized tho. I have discovered the library button by now, it has user created footprints, it has patterns with the right holes and footprint listed under "guitar potentiometers" I have yet to figure out to get customized exact spacing placed as you just described. I just started to work in the pcb format instead of the schematic one, its easier as it visualizes the size. The standard axial 1/4w resistor was way to large of a foot print , the library ones more came to the rescue. Right now im a little stuck on the non polar capacitors.
Man, I learnt about ground planes some hours after ordering my first PCB. Can't believe I missed that when researching Easy EDA. Must say though that Easy EDA is definitely easy and I'll be designing a lot more pcb's with it.
Ground planes can be useful, Adam, but they are not mandatory. So I'm sure your first PCB was just fine without one, just like mine was. But we learn as we go, right?
I tried surface mount a few years ago and never went back. Thanks for showing us EasyEDA. I've been using KiCAD for a couple years now, "FreePCB" before that.
I've never had the courage to try SMDs, TenToes, but it is surely the way to go. Maybe my next PCB? I might need a hot air gun reworking tool though!
@@RalphBacon I use a toothpick and magnifier hood to put solder paste on the pads and position the parts. Then I take my soldering skillet, and electric skilled with a jumper in the thermostat so it doesn't turn off. Put the board on the cold skillet and plug it in. In a few minutes the gray solder paste turns bright silver, then slurps itself up to the joints. Turn off the skillet and let it cool down. Putting the right amount of past is the trick, but there's a big difference between too little and too much. If you get a bridge, a soldering iron and bit of soldering brade will solve that.
Sounds cool. I love the way you describe how the solder "slurps itself up to the joints", it really does do that. I will investigate the necessary tools then. So much to do, so little time to do it all. Thanks for the info, appreciated.
I will try Easy EDA - having tried KiCad, anything that makes more of an effort to be usable is worth a go in my book.
Let me know what you think of EasyEDA (after the usual frustrations because it doesn't work the same way as KiCad!).
wow - great info - i'm just starting so this is helpful
Great to hear!
Does either KiCAD or EasyEDA handle HDI vias ? .. if not I mind as well use Cadencce
I don't know, I'm afraid, as that is a specialist use of a PCB that I don't need. If I had to guess, I'd say that KiCAD probably covers most bases, and EasyEDA Pro might do to. The only way to find it is to email the support lines, or ask in a support forum.
Would you please tell me what the part name is for P1? Thanks
P1 (on the left hand side of the circuit diagram) is just a 3-pin header socket, so I can plug in the microphone module easily. I hope this helps.
Thank you it does I have used eagle before and there is s distinct difference.
Wow, I've had the same experience as you. I keep going back to easyeda as most things I design are simple 2-layer boards for fun little projects like these. Easyeda has proven fine for this.
I come from the art design world where packages like Photoshop and illustrator have easy panning around. You need to move around your image as you work with it. You simply cannot afford to waste any time faffing about with a clunky interface when you need to put down your artistic vision as efficiently as possible because you have several more jobs in line.
Designing a pcb is no different and it boggles my mind that there is no easy panning method with kicad. That's an absolute deal breaker for me and I just can't get past the frustration of not being able to see the part of my project I need to see in a quick and intuitive manner.
Googling about I see I'm not the only one with the issue though there is no easy answer. The middle mousewheel is an option but it's much too fiddly and it lacks the right tactile feel to be efficient.
So back to easyeda for me.
And each to their own, Han, I quite agree. When you have found a program that works for you then stick with it. Would you believe I still use Paint Shop Pro 7 (yes, seven) for my picture manipulation? Best I could ever find, works like a dream and I'm sticking with it despite the countless alternatives out there!
You've probably already learned this, but just in case, with KiCad you can move the view by press and hold of the mouse wheel.
If you have not done so already, get the parts library from DigiKey. Tonnes of components with footprints and 3d already done. I use the library far more than the parts service. DigiKey is also a good source for datasheets.
I chose KiCad. Mainly as it resides on my machine and does not rely on the internet being up. Nor am I at the whim of some website company that decides to change their business model several years down the line as Eagle did, when it was purchased by another corporation. It does have a steep learning curve, but does all I need to do, and more. It's something I can grow with.
Yes, I have learned that one now, but I am still fighting the way KiCAD works, I'm afraid. For instance, getting wires to actually connect to the component you have to zoom in to get it *exactly* on the wire - so unlike EasyEDA, which intuitively knows what you are trying to do. I'd love to ry out a CAD product costing a few thousand just to see how that feels once you get to use it! Anyway, good tips you give there and I shall persevere!
@@RalphBacon I'm still in the learning process, and don't work with it often enough to pop answers off the top of my head. If I find the answer, I'll be happy to pass it on, as I don't recall having that problem.
@@gfodale Some people will want the Benz even when an Audi is outperforming it.
@@fernandohood5542 Quite true. I advise as I choose, but in no way expect others to heed it. I just hope some help is found in it.
@@RalphBacon You've probably already learnt too that connecting wires is very difficult if you set the grid too small (Pull down list near top of screen). Set GRID to 0.25 mm (or bigger) and connection is super easy, set it to 0.0025 and you have to zoom way, way in in order to get an exact connection.
I love easy eda, just have to remember to save any changes before updating pcb, but it warns you if you try without saving
Another thing is you can set up teams, team members can be managers or developers.
I have tried a few times to autoroute, most of the time it works, though i try to avoid via's
Actually, i prefer to manually route my boards, it's therapeutic, challenging, and can be artistic in the track routes.
I've done a few boards more complex than yours
In fact, i decided on my latest design (not printed yet) to mix pcb layout with point to point wiring, the only other way would have been 4 layer at least, but i think my way is going to look cool
Also, think about using the pcb as a front panel for projects, part of the above project will include this.
(Though i prefer jlcpcb)
I didn't use AutoRouting at all, as I saw an expert video web site that said do it manually. So I did. And it worked better than Autorouting. It can take a while but it's a hobby (in my case) so I can enjoy it whilst I do it. Now, what's this? A PCB as a front panel? I'd like to see photos of that when you're done.
Like yourself, I spent around the 2 day mark with EasyEDA . Couple of things I had to work at to get it to come right ( well, one is, the other, not yet).
For some reason on an Arduino ProMini, no matter how I made the schematic grounds connect to other devices, the pcb part would leave out the main ground connection.
Would connect all the intended grounds together but not the main one.
Other bother is the online auto router gets busy sometimes and just sits doing nothing and comes up with an error saying "install a local router".
MMM...yes, well followed all the instructions but the program keeps telling me I have no local router installed. Have to work that one out yet.
However, all good eventually I guess, just keep at it.
I found out why my most recent board did not connect an LED to GND - the schematic was a tiny bit misaligned and it was not electrically connected. The "Nets" report did state this but there were so many "unconnected" messages (because I had put an X unconnected mark on them) that I missed it. Practice (and double checking) makes perfect, I suppose!
I don't use the autorouter much - maybe just to see how it might do it, but there are so many weird routes it takes that I find manual routing better. Thanks for posting, Jeff, nice to hear from you.
I have used Eagle some years ago, recently I wanted to design a new circuit board and needed some software, the license of Eagle did not fit me and I changed to KiCad. My initial impression is that it is lacking a lot compared to Eagle (Rip-up is one detail, component library is another one), but it is definitely usable (It did not see you problems with the ERC and be aware that you need to run two different DRC, the second on is "List unconnected", for some reason it is not included it the main DRC). Correctly designed and coordinated you can do a "Update PCB from schematic" without any issues.
When you have placed you components on the circuit board, do a print out and cut the paper to size, then mount the large parts on it. This gives a very good impression of the final result (Much better than any 3d view) and can be used to check against your selected box.
Why place the MOS below the circuit board, just lay it down on the top, you have lot of space (Or use a SMD part).
My circuit was also with a Arduino, but I used a ProMicro, this is my favorite Arduino due to the small size. There is one caveat, a check on the serial port takes 10ms! Why!
Yes, I found the two bits of the ERC, thankfully and with the help of viewers here I have fixed the two errors I had. So simple when you know how! I placed the MOSFET below the board because I had the connection to the ultrasonic module right next to it. Maybe I should have mounted THAT underneath and the MOSFET flat on top. Oh well, it's built now and works great. I like ProMicro boards but they are considerably more expensive than a UNO or Nano.
Ralph, thanks for the video. I'm new to circuit design and PCBs and have been looking for some easy, intuitive software for this newbie. After all the comments here and elsewhere ("EasyEDA??Are you kidding? KiCad is the thing!!) I have been trying KiCad. I am >not< impressed.
1) The libraries--the stock ones aren't very complete, and it is like working a puzzle to figure out how to upload third party libraries. I am still trying to load in the KiCad libraries built by/for DigiKey and Mouser. Not simple. GitHub? C'mon--why? Download another program and then go online to search for one part at a time? >>Why
You are preaching to the converted, Mark.
I really, really, really, really wanted to like KiCAD. After all, it is supported by some big industry figures, including CERN. So it must be good, right?
Your KiCAD experiences reflect my own. From the stupid, non-standard dragging of the PCB around (my middle button on the mouse starts enlarging the PCB when I do that unless I'm very, very careful) to all the other things you've mentioned I am quite disappointed (typical British understatement) at the way KiCAD works.
Not least that the AutoRouter is not currently embedded and although I got it to work it was like pulling teeth; painful. When queried about this, the response was along the lines that most people did not use the AutoRouter anyway and preferred to manually route all 100 pins on the µController. Yeah, right. KICAD feels like it was written by nerds for other nerds, not actual electronics engineers.
I use EAsyEDA most of the time now, despite its obvious hobbyist, low-end target audience. There are many things I cannot do in EasyEDA (like having a track different widths at points around the PCB, as a random example) but it is intuitive, the AutoRouter almost works most of the time (if you install it locally) and you have the footprints of all the components in the LCSC library - plus the user-submitted ones.
It's also not too hard to create an alternative footprint for a component either.
I don't suppose many commercial design houses use EasyEDA but as I don't have upwards of £5,000 for a commercial level product it will have to do (and what it does, it does quite well). I wouldn't want to design a PC motherboard with it but I have designed a full Arduino 328PB with it so it does enough for me.
Your rant is excused - as you see, I've just done it too. Coincidence?
"Your rant is excused - as you see, I've just done it too. Coincidence? "
Great minds (or "seasoned curmudgeon" in my case) think alike? :)
Maybe with CERN's support the KiCad folks will be able to get some of the right help to clean it up and make it intuitive. Would be great, but if the many folks who use it like it just like it is, well, it's more likely to get additional niche features . . . IMO, the most important capabilities (and more) all appear to be there, the ease-of-use things are the rub. And fixing that requires a mindset that is >sometimes< less evident in open-source teams.
I hope you won't mind if I chime in later after I've tried a few other things.
Mark
Well have to put in the work, surprised never moaned about lack of autorouting, usual complaint from beginners. Some software have to spend the effort in time. I used Diptrace for 50 or so boards. I agree Kicad is probably more of a learning curve but I feel was worth the effort to get 4 layers for free. Of course you can export a DSN file and run an external Autorouter application if required.
I like KiCAD, i have tried all the free (and some pirated) PCB design softwares under the sun and i liked KiCAD the most.
It most certainly is popular (and well supported) so I'll definitely be practicing. Thanks for posting.
I agree 100% on the subject of the high cost of enclosures, Ralph! How come we have SO many throw-away cartons/containers/boxes etc for all kinds of food and consumables......but the minute we want that plastic in an "enclosure" shape, it is such an unreasonable amount? It galls me so i look elsewhere for my enclosures, but i cannot afford the cost of a 3D printer. Nor would it pay off at my age and precarious health. Great video,....thanks Ralph!
Yes, we're on the same page with this one. I'm keen to get a 3D printer, but I'm put off by the constant tinkering required that the cheaper units demand. The more expensive Prusa units are, by all accounts, fantastic but eye-wateringly priced (for me anyway). I'd have to make lots of things with it to justify the cost. But where there is a will... you'll know if I ever get one,as I will doubtless do one or more videos!
Some how make the enclosure you want(3d printer that you own or have a friend/person 3d print the shape you want, or simpler construction if its a basic box, could be made out of cheap wood), than make a silicone mold from the "blank". Once the mold has cured you can pour resin into it to make a cast resin enclosure. Cheap way to make 1 plastic enclosure that looks and works better than a 3d print and you can make dozens if you need too. For multiple enclosures resin casting is far faster than 3d printing and they're more consistent. Also lower cost if you outsourced the 3d print/blank for the mold.
Rite Ralph, wow realy late to this one! I'm trying to get an arduino, keypad, LCD and solinoid lock thing going, never done out like it before so big fun learning curve. Iv'e never heard of KiCAD, will have a look.I have used EasyEDA but couldn't get to grips with it (will try again) so tried DipTrace, still need to put in some hrs on it but liked it, lurning curve on component size/footprint agree! Just a thought! I like you idea of putting two rows of pins, would it work if you put them on the outside of the board, it would make the footprint a bit bigger but you would still have access to them when a board was put on top, just thinking out loud (in silence typing on a keyboard) :) Stay safe n well Dude! TFS, GB :)
Remember to prototype all your electronics before committing to a PCB, Graeme. That way, no surprises of the disappointing kind! 😲
And don't worry too much about board size; most PCB factories give you 100mm x 100mm for the same price so give yourself some room to work in!
Good luck with your project, sounds like fun!
I had the same issue with my design, what I did is I connected one PowerFlag to Batt+ and another flag to GND and that resolved my errors from that.
Indeed, various suggestions have allowed me to fix this, thanks for posting this.
I'm sure this has been asked before, but why not include Fritzing? It doesn't take days to get productive and produces perfectly usable Gerber files.
Ah ha! I knew there was a second comment on Fritzing, Andy. Yes, I will investigate it further. I didn't realise it could produce Gerber files. Live and learn, hey?
In case you want to make your own project boxes, a 3D printer is a very good tool for that. Filament is ~$20 USD for a kilogram, allows you to print quite a bit of boxes for small projects.
You're not the first to suggest this Paco, so thanks for the nudge, I will seriously look at a 3D printer again.
@@RalphBacon I recommend Fusion 360 for CAD design, it's got a short but steep learning curve, it's free for startups, hobbyists and poor people, and it outputs STL files ready for 3D printing. I have designed a few enclosures with it.
Pardon the two-year gap on my reply, but is a 3D printer 'really' a cost effective option. Considering the cost and time involved in 3D printing, how many project boxes would one need before it was a cost effective option over buying the over-priced boxes. Several times I've consided getting a printer for just this, project boxes, but every time I find doing so would not save money unless I needed many dozens of boxes, possibly well over a hundred. As a hobbiest, I rarely need more than a few boxes at a time. Being able to produce boxes to my specifications is worth some of this overhead, as is being able to 3D print in general, but I'm not sure how much. I'd love to hear from someone who has gotten a 3D printer specifically for project boxes to weigh in.
Hi Ralph fr9m the distant past. Nice video. Thank you. You should have your own tv show.
Maybe one day! Never say never!
Try flipping the MOSFET and solder it in from the bottom ?
Most through hole components pitch spacing are usually dividable by 0.1" or 0.05" and 0.025"
Metric equivalents 2.54mm or 1.27mm and 0.635mm
Set up a grid for the finest pitch needed .
EG
0.6 watt resistor is 0.4" so a 0.1" or 2.54mm or even finer grid could be used.
Smd components 0805 = 0.08" x 0.05"
I've actually mounted the MOSFET underneath now, Adam, and soldered from the top. What I belatedly realised is that I could have done the same with the ultrasonic connector (and left the MoSFET where it was) but there we are!
The grid information is very useful thanks for that. I've not used SMD components (apart from a couple of voltage regulators) so that will be something I'll be looking into in order to create a more compact board. Thanks for all that, most appreciated.
@@RalphBacon
The only reason I mentioned the grid, when using various modules for the Arduino.
You can create the footprint( package outline) in the PCB software, working to the nearest 25 thousands of of an inch.
Using a digital caliper to take physical measurements.
It helped me get the footprint right. If in doubt print the footprint on to paper and visually check it for fit.
Adam
I followed the Digi Key tutorial for kicad, but skipped all the custom library directions, and stuck with built-in footprints. Once I started it was way easier than I expected.
I ordered my first board a week ago, I can't wait for it to get here to see what horrible mistakes I made. I've already reserved a spot for it next to my first through hole disaster board.
Oh, ye of little faith! Even if you do have a couple of errors they can be corrected and you will learn something from them (that's from someone who did just that, of course). Yes, I will persevere with KiCAD and see how it goes alongside Easy EDA.
Most pcb design programs use a 1/10” grid pattern this is the same as the hole spacing on your breadboard when choosing the component hole placement use the breadboard for comparison this should make sure the hole spacing are correct.
Kendrick
An excellent point you make there, Kendrick, I shall ensure my grid is set to that setting. Sometimes, though, depending on the zoom setting, I notice the grid just vanishes! Thanks for the tip, nice to hear from you.
Dear Ralph maybe you should consider buying a 3D.printer for projects enclosures. They are pretty cheap theese days and you will develop a new skill. Thank you again for your videos
+1 on that comment. Not only are project boxes expensive but they are rarely exactly the right size. You wind up making compromises. Going down the 3D print path results in boxes that fit exactly, and they cost peanuts to print in PLA/PLA+.
For years I coveted a 3D printer. Then they became more affordable (and reliable) but I had no room. Then I got my workshop. Then I felt I could not justify getting one as I couldn't think what it was I might print. Now I know what that could be. Custom cases could be just the thing. I will have to re-open all my research notes and see where 3D printing has gotten to over the last 12 months or so. Thanks for the suggestion, both of you, appreciated.
@@RalphBacon The Creality Ender 3 is about £200 and I have seen some very positive reviews of it, so it might be worth a look.
I had a look then I got side-tracked by the Prusa i3 Mk3 original (not an open-source version). I'm drooling, but my bank account says No! But where there's a will... and I have the room... and the support looks great... and I just want one!
Have a look at the AnyCubic i3 Mega Ultrabase (the “Ultrabase” suffix is like a “.1” on the “i3 Mega” and, while I might be wrong about it, I believe “i3” puts it in the same general evolutionary space as the Prusa Mk3). I had also been casting around looking at various models including Prusa and concluding “too much” but around AUD$300 during “singles day” sale last year saw me take the plunge. Ordered on a Sunday. In my hands the following Tuesday. A mere two days to not-quite-outback Australia. Talk about speedy! Anyway, it was trivially easy to set up (half a dozen bolts) plus learning curves in TinkerCAD and Cura later (both free software) and I have not looked back. I’m using no-name brand PLA+ from eBay which, despite all the “advice” on the web about “reputable” filament brands, has not given me any more “trouble” than working out the best nozzle temperature (195C, in my case) to get reproducible results. As I type this I’m a couple of hours into a 19 hour print of a box to house a WeMos D1 R3 plus a Hiking Class 3 electricity meter (RS485 comms) plus embedded power supply. The all up cost of the box will be about AUD$4 while getting the tangle of loose components off my desk where it has been sitting for the last 10 months will be, as they say, “priceless”. Meanwhile, the existing modded Uno shield carrying the RS485 module plus bits and pieces all linked up with wire wrap is slowly transforming itself into a KiCad design which will be heading to PCBWay in the not too distant future (your video inspired me to give it a whirl).
I use FreePcb and Expresspcb PLUS.Very good.
The FreePCB GUI looks quite clear (if a bit dated) but the main concern I have is that last update was on *Dec. 5, 2011* which makes me think that the product has been abandoned. Pity, considering the upsurge in hobbyist and small business PCB designs.
ExpressPCB is at least up to date and viable but I've not used it and I doubt I will move from EasyEDA unless that platform disappears! But thanks for the information, others will doubtless also find it interesting.
I use express pcb too. My only issue is the large setup fee.
Hi Ralph, I had a try of Kicad after watching one of your videos, and found Kicad very hard work. I was trying to design a PCB using an Atmega 328P programmed as an Arduino. Problem is that I was unable to find an Atmega 328P in the library. The Atmega 328 is listed in the library, but Kicad will only load some other Atmega IC onto Escheema. I persevered drawing a schematic, as I wanted to find out how to use Escheema, but of course the Atmega pin out bore no relation to a 328 IC. Like you I did not want to try to put together a Atmega 328 from scratch, so I am goingto put Kicad on one side for the time being, and have a go at EasyEDA. Many thanks for all your brilliant videos.
Written by geeks, for geeks, is how I would describe KiCAD. I don't find it particularly intuitive and despite being financed by CERN that doesn't make it good. It works, and if you have to use it day-in, day-out I'm sure would would become a master of its quirks! But EasyEDA "just worked" for me, even though it does not have the bells and whistles of a commercial program.
@@RalphBacon I completely agree... it is like these guys have never used a real drawing program before let alone a pcb/schematic editor. Even small things like the coordinate system originates from upper left corner (like many computer languages favor incidentally)... NO software ever works like that! It is quite irritating when people try to re-invent an unbroken wheel smh!
Connect a pwr_flag to the Gnd and that will get rid of that error. Then remove the floating pwr_flag as it isn't connected to any power/gnd lines.
Did that, David, and it immediately solved the issue. Doh! Thanks for that. Now I've just got to understand exactly what those power flags (or, indeed, VCC) is actually telling the system...
@@RalphBacon You need power flag if you have components with pin type power input and it is not connected to power out pin of other components. Power flag is necessary if you have power coming from connectors for example. If you have power coming from power out pin of regulator then you don't need power flags. Assuming you have correct pin types selected. VCC does not tell this to system - it is basically just a global label for that net.
I think I get it now, obvious really that KiCAD does not "know" that a particular pin is a source of power until you tell it. But batteries and power sources are already described as a power source so do not need the additional flag. I guess I was expecting KiCAD to "know" that the Vout, +5v, GND pins etc were already tagged correctly. Now I know, thanks very much for that, Ivars.
The interesting thing is that EasyEDA is actually provided by PCBWay's competition (sponsoring this video)
Might be worth checking out Contextural Electronics for KiCad tutorials ua-cam.com/channels/kJRycUz2CylxpiP-zMePow.html
Shhh! I know! Don't tell anyone else, Steven, let's keep this between us.
Seriously, though, I can't let that fact affect my editorial content. EasyEDA is a fine product, and I'm sure it generates lots of business for many PCB manufacturers, not just its provider. Hats off to them!
True. BUT JLCPCB is very good too. My first test of them was a gerber from a really old FreePCB opensource project. Came to me spot on. My second order that is on the way now, is a eagle cad import. I hope that worked correctly.
Pardon the two-year gap in my reply, but for those suggesting 3d printing project boxes is a 3D printer 'really' a cost-effective option. Considering the cost and time involved in 3D printing, how many project boxes would one need before it was a cost-effective option over buying the over-priced boxes available online. Several times I've considered getting a printer for just this, project boxes, but every time I find doing so would not save money unless I needed many dozens of boxes, possibly well over a hundred. As a hobbyist, I rarely need more than a few boxes at a time. Being able to produce boxes to my specifications is worth some of this overhead, as is being able to 3D print in general, but I'm not sure how much. I'd love to hear from someone who has gotten a 3D printer specifically for project boxes to weigh in.
What you describe, Roy, is what has prevented me purchasing a 3D printer. I just could not justify the cost of the printer over some simple project boxes (as expensive as they always are).
Just lately, however, I've determined that if I were a competent 3D designer (not an easy task) I could design myself all sorts of simple plastic devices to make my life easier AND make some purpose built and sized enclosures too.
However, another viewer has suggested that until I can master something like Fusion 360 then all I would be able to do is print designs made by others - not ideal at all.
So now I'm on that uphill learning curve of Fusion 360 (free for hobbyists) and it's taking too much time and effort. It reminds me very much of my PCB design journey - that took about 18 months until I could design a decent PCB (and I'm still learning).
Hence, no 3D printer yet, but the price keeps dropping and the quality keeps going up - so I have high hopes!
Good video, but those long diagonal lines drive me insane! Pick a side and call it horizontal, and call the other vertical!! And definitely flood one side with ground and the other with V+ or whatever you call power. !! But still good informative video!
Yes, a ground plane (for flood fill) is definitely on the cards for my next PCB, Glenn, it does actually make it much easier to connect stuff up. There's a lot of "discussion" about the use of straight vs diagonal lines, especially when they turn corners. 45° connections are deemed the de facto standard even though it makes no difference unless you're dealing with fast signals (I suppose a fast Arduino I2C connection might qualify here). Yes, it's an art form all by itself! Glad you still like the video, and thanks for posting, appreciated.
Ralph, I didn't mean to be critical, and in the case of your board, it really doesn't matter to the circuit, but I personally find it aesthetically displeasing. It would certainly make a denser board very difficult to route.
As for signal speed, many physical tests have been done on different styles of corners. Rounded, 45s, and 90s. And while your mind and many rules of thumb suggest square corners are bad for high speed signals, or preventing acid from pudding during manufacturer, it make no appreciable difference until you are dealing with microwave speed signals. And at that point there are many other factors to consider as well.
Have a great day.
Ah, the art of PCB design, Glenn! Yes, aesthetics most certainly does come into it, and we all recognise a well-laid out board. Don't worry, I'm trying to improve so we shall see what my next board brings.
Use the horiz and vert scroll bars to shift the screen view
Yes, Helmuth, that's another way of doing it, just not quite as easy when you're in the middle of creating the ultimate PCB!
@@RalphBacon Also holding the scroll button and moving will shift the display, though you may need version 5 I can not rember if the version4 did I have used 5 for some time and now ver 5.1
Yes, holding down the scroll button works (sort of), the problem I then get is the scroll wheel moves a tiny bit and the image moves off my screen. These days I just press HOME and F4 a lot!
Kicad is Great if you understand what the warning is that Kicad does not know where your power net is you can ignore those errors. Kicad is not like cadence the program from hell that refuses to create a netlist untill all errors are cleared..
As Kicad is being so active development I advise using it .
Arie
Yes, I am practicing already using it. There is so much help on the internet for it there are no questions that have not been answered by someone. My next PCB will be designed with KiCAD. Thanks for the info regarding the errors, good to know.
yes I enjoyed this video will give the easyeda a try first
Thanks for your post, glynn mason, good to hear from you and Good Luck with EasyEDA.
I think Kicad is just complaining that you have a POWER_FLG that is not connected to anything! Just delete the floating one that is arrowed. Another aproach is to use the 'Vcc' symbol which is more informational and is implicitly tagged with a power flag.
If you press the mouse wheel so that it clicks you can move the diagram around like on EasyRDA. With some mice this can be a bit annoying because you have to press quite firmly without simultaneously scrolling - this is KiCAD showing its Unix originswhere 3 button mice were commonplace but on PC's these have been replaced by scrollweels but they still retain the 'click' function on most mice.
I deleted the floating one and connected it to GND and it was OK (as per David F's suggestion). All sorted.
And I pressed the mouse wheel, as you stated here, the directional symbol appeared and I could drag it to wherever I wanted. Bliss! I just have to be careful not to scroll as I do it, but it's better than the F4 option! Thanks very much for posting.
you need a 3d printer and make your own enclosures
Wayne, you're the millionth viewer (OK, perhaps the 10th) to suggest this so I will DEFINITELY look into it. If all it does it supply me with custom enclosures then maybe it's all worth it. Thanks for posting.
@@RalphBacon I sure once you get it and make a couple enclosures, you'll find other cool things to make. such empowering technology!
he is to stupid to learn the processes for 3D printer if he can't run Eagle.....I have videos on my channel showing me doing layouts in eagle for the first time....not hard at all....this guy is probably getting a kickback for mentioning the software he uses while bashing Eagle just like he gets paid for mentioning PCBWay
KiCad : Connect a Power flag to the ground to probably avoid the ERC errors.
Yes, there are a few things I could/need to do to avoid the errors and I'll see what works best for me, thanks for the suggestion.
The pros for KiCad: it's Free Software, so you can fix it, and also, the files it creates are text files, which can be versioned with tools like git, so you can look up when you added this component and why…
We could talk about one program's advantages over another forever (like the PC vs MAC) but I still find the EasyEDA easier (more intuitive) to use. But KiCAD is used now and again (perhaps that's the problem, I need to use it more).
@@RalphBacon Yeah, it also depends on what you put first. Personally I favor Free Software for many reasons, so I wouldn't even use non-free software for real projects. One reason being they mostly use open and documented formats (even if only by the source code). Meaning you can reuse the data, for ex. to extract a BOM: github.com/alexisvl/kicad-bom
But not everyone is a coder, so YMMV.
hi there, please use this link to convert any number od EasyEDA files to kiCAD files for free 😀
Hi Ralph, I've got 4 of these damn cad programs, the fact is I find all 4 annoying and confusing, so for me it's proto boards for one off's, and for printed track designs it's photo sensitive boards, or a dalo pen , sorry nice try but no cigar.
Perhaps the problem here, Paul, is that you have FOUR of the programs. Just stick with one (dare I suggest EasyEDA) and you might get to love it as I did? But if not then stick with your current solution, it it works for you, then it works.
21:00 the error is because there is no power connector (input) or pins associated with the symbol.
Indeed, I believe that was the case, as I managed to clear those errors eventually. But that's KiCad for you!
Your board outline in KiCad is wrong. You can see it in 3D view - board edges goes over outlines. Board outline has to be on Edge cuts layer.
That doesn't surprise me at all, Ivars. I got a bit jaded as I was designing this board so next time I do a PCB I will START with KiCAD and see how it goes.
Instead of EasyEDA, you can use Upverter, IMO much better than EasyEDA.
Well now, I don't want to get into any kind of religious war regarding which is "best". Everyone has their favourites, for whatever reason, and I'm glad you have found yours. Needless to say, I will take a look, you never know I might prefer it too! Thanks for the heads up.
@@RalphBacon well, I didn't wanted to Say that like "religious war" or something, I just wanted to Say to try Upverter, tool made by Altium. I don't use it, neither EasyEDA, so... :P
Totally understood, Damian, I just wanted to avoid an "Apple Mac vs Microsoft Windows" style "discussion"! I will definitely check it out, it's on my to-do list! Thanks for posting, appreciated.
I'm glad you liked my suggestion of EasyEDA. It worked for me. As always , great video. Hope you eye is doing well. My other 1/2 has eye problems also. I told her about you being laid up and not being able to move. She has other eye issues and you can check her New channel @ ua-cam.com/video/T9y0P6GQoh8/v-deo.html that would mean a lot to us. Thanks.
Yes, I did like the EasyEDA suggestion, Drex. Great success all round. Bad news on the eye, though, I need cataract surgery to get my sight back to (near) normal. The first chat is with the specialist in March 2019. It just goes on. But that's nothing compared to your other half, Mel. I watched her video, she seems very positive about it (and I love her cats) and I wish her channel well. I'll mention her channel in my blog and posts whenever I mention my eye, it might get her more views.
Kicad .... forget power/ground flags , use +5V, GND etc
I first tried the suggestion by David F (and others) and it was fine - no errors. Replacing the PWR_FLAG with +5V or VDD or anything really, just reintroduced the error I showed in the demo. Weird.
you are quite correct but let me give you what I do, several of my projects use "Wall Warts" I try to use decent quality, and as they connect to my project, say 12v via 3.5 mm jack or barrel Conn's, I call this VCC and put a power flag there as well, from then on any 5v or 3.3v regulators, I use there actual signs, as you say +5 and +3.3 and the normal GND through out and never get the issue...… its great when you run ERC's and you just get "Finished" !
You might want to get yourself a 3D Printer soon. So no need to buy expensive enclosures anymore. I got myself one and surely have saved the amount of money I paid for it in not buying any enclosures anymore.
Yes, so many viewers have suggested this now, it's something I'm looking into. The original Prusa i3 Mk3 looks great (I don't want to spend my lifetime having to "tweak" a clone) but it's not cheap. Perhaps the Creeatlity Ender is a cheaper, but as good, an option?
Ralph S Bacon i have a creality Cr 10 mini which was the model before the ender 3. as a beginner the ender 3 is a good machine to start with. But if you can afford the prusa this would be my first choice. Unfortunately my wife has something against spending 800€ for it otherwise I would have bought one
I've just replied to another comment here about me drooling over the Pruse i3 Mk3. The boss here also might have other ideas about me spending that sort of money. Perhaps I can disguise it as a "computer upgrade"? Essential workshop maintenance? Annual soldering iron service? 😅
Ralph S Bacon just tell your lovely Boss that you can also print some decorations with it and she will agree. At least mine was calmed down that I’ve spent 300€ on my Cr 10 mini as I made her a few things. Now she occupies about 20% of my print time with her trash (or decorationsi should say)
here I use sPrintlayout.
Any good?
Why are your boards SO big and sparce? The manufactures charge per area.
Phillip Toone it wouldn’t fit on the uno otherwise.
Yes, in this case it was an Arduino Uno shield so the board had to be that size, although I cheated a bit by creating all those prototyping areas. The circuit was spread out a little as I didn't want to fail (again) with my 2nd board. Maybe my next board will be both compact and small!
@@RalphBacon Oh, that makes sense. But you could of used a smaller Arduino.
If I did it again I would have used a Nano with a shield. But then I have 20/20 hindsight. Next time!
I hated KiCad
Don't sugar-coat it, Bruce, say what you really mean. Oh. OK, that's saying it like it really is, good on you! Yes, sometimes programs can have that effect on people. Stick with what you like and know.
just a big advert for PCBWay....they pay him about $200 per video and supply him with the boards for free....just a gimmick to get you to get PCBWay to make your boards.....and this is what he has to show you the layout software because they do not do that for you....and obviously he cant figure it out but he says it's easy because they don't offer even a program to do it
PCBWay do indeed sponsor (some of) my videos and let me use their services so that I can show my viewers the results. They hope that others will be tempted to use their services. I don't understand your problem with that?
@@RalphBacon and you get paid to tell people you used their services....you follow their contract....I have the contract the tells you exact what to say and how many times to say and so on so it's not your opinion it is what is required to get paid
Nope, totally untrue. I am free to present and say exactly what I want. Obviously I am not going to run down their products as it would be pointless me promoting their PCBs if I didn't believe in them. No different to someone (a well known actress, for example) on TV promoting hair products. You know she's worth it.
@@RalphBacon I will have to show the contract they sent to me.....It would be the same one they sent to every one.....unless your special.....and they pay you to say good things.....if you want to lie about that then that is fine.....they paid people money to do these videos and you will not admit that.....if anyone wants to see the contract these people sign let me know and I'll post a video showing this guy is not telling the truth
My contract is _very_ different to the one you might have, that's for sure. But I still don't get why you object to me being sponsored (paid) by a company selling quality PCBs at low cost to allow hobbyists and small businesses to progress their projects. There's no conspiracy here, despite what you think, it's just business advertising.