It also feels faster than it is, which I LOVE. I like to have a good time out on a country road with minimal risk of dying or going to jail, the Fiesta ST will almost certainly be my next daily driver when my 2005 Focus ST finally gives up the ghost. Ford makes fantastic small front drive real-world usable fun cars, I’ve never been a Ford guy, but I don’t think their equal can be had for anywhere near their price.
I guess Im randomly asking but does any of you know of a way to log back into an instagram account..? I somehow forgot the password. I appreciate any help you can offer me
I test drove the brz, fun but it seemed mostly like a novelty car. Then to the focus st, pretty rowdy, too much money. Fiesta st felt perfect. A little smaller but still able to haul any equipment I needed for my job. Plus when you really get going it feels rabid as hell. When you add the highway mpg it's no brainer. Very fun car.
I have an Focus ST3, had a Fiesta Black ST pass by the other day ago....those things look so good with some after market mods. Front wheel drive is hard to beat I feel for the city, you feel very connected to the road. Small zippy front wheel drives...lovem
FORD FIESTA ST: 25.891 + 31.939 + 30.252 = 88.082 s = 1 min 28.082 seconds. They had this correct. SUBARU BRZ: 26.352 + 31.948 + 29.791 = 88.091 s = 1 min 28.091 seconds. They had this one wrong. THE FORD IS FASTER.
the fiesta is almost identical in lap times as the frs/brz at nurburgring, but if you were to go rally driving, the FWD fiesta just mops the floor with any rwd car. People like to say "rwd is the proper wheel drive" but it really depends. Yes it's more fun, and yes it's better for acceleration, but fwd has it's advantages too. And when you compare the two's lap times, the fiesta is almost as fast on-road as the brz, but destroys the brz on loose surfaces. For me, fiesta all the way
I made the same transition as well from the 86 platform to the st. The torque is usable through out the city. It is a far better for city day to day driving compared to the 86 platform.
I have a 2016 Fiesta ST with the COBB Accessport running the Mountune 93 octane optimized stage 1 tune. No less than 26.5 pounds of boost and I walk STI's
Uhh.. The time for the BRZ is 1:28.091 if you add those 3 times together. Which means the Fiesta ST is actually the faster one with 1:28.082 in this comparison test. Adding is fun
Excellent test. I thought the ST would be faster than the BRZ especially under damp conditions. The Fiesta has far better tires. I own the BRZ but have mad respect for the Fiesta st.
Fiesta ST overall wins. It pretty much does everything the BRZ can do, but the Fiesta is cheaper in price, and from all reviews, is MORE FUN to drive because of that 200 pounds of torque. I don't see how the Fiesta ST isn't the better value. It clearly is. But the BRZ is a true sports car look (2 door coupe) while the Fiesta ST looks like an everyday driver. So it's up to you what you want, but Fiesta ST wins in overall.
hmmm They say the Fiesta ST's systems correct almost all torque steer soo... not this time. I haven't driven one though so that's based on the reviews.
The ST is the better car in every way. Its turbo, its got recaro seats, amazing colors, tons more options and a vastly more premium feel. A fully loaded fiesta st is a meer $2000 more than the BRZ fully equipped and a much better car.
test drove the frs new when it first came out... then a used brz and 5 used frs a few years later... liked the looks, shifter and steering but the quality wasn't the greatest on cars with low mileage... rattles... wear on the interior... oh and the lack of power... wound up test driving many others including the wrx, mustang, 370Z, s2000, gti, focus St, civic si, 228I, 128i, 135i etc... wound up buying the fiesta St despite hating the idea of owning a fiesta... now I don't even care about that... it's just the most fun out of all the stuff I drove... really torquey, light and tossable
+theshapeofpunk2comee same here I'm driven many cars working at a dealer and never saw myself in a tiny fiesta. test drove the focus st because it was the car i wanted, but then test drove the fiesta st right after and bought it on the spot. had no regrets fun car
Brz: -Built from ground up to be a sports car -high revving boxer motor -lower COG than many supercars -Sporty seating position -RWD Fiesta: -Based on econobox -Good motor -Minivan driving height -FWD For anyone average joe that wants a sporty car, the fiesta would be the way to go, but any true motorhead would go for the brz due to the RWD and seating alone. It might be low on torque but if you keep the revs high, the torque won't matter.
+Jasim Q LOL I am a Camaro 1LE road course racer and guess what I DD? hint, it ain't the BRZ.....The Fie3sta was WAY better and that is painful coming from a chevy guy
In every review I've ever seen where reviewers call the FWD car the one with the inferior drivetrain layout, it turns out to get the same time as the RWD car. I think it's a matter of driver preference. I'm thinking BRZ is better for the track, and the Fiesta is better on mountain and canyon runs. The BRZ won't compete with the Fiesta in high altitude on steep grades due to the torque figure. The Fiesta looks like the more fun and better equipped/more upscale vehicle. Fiesta for Mt. Baldy's GMR!
Drive them on wet roads or in snow I TAKE THE ST - Take a long cross country trip? I take the FORD & the interiors? Are you kidding? Ford is beautiful inside. Real world use? ST!!! Neither car is a race car. They both perform well as daily drivers. The FORD shines as an all over package AND you have SEVRAL ST packege/body layout choices to chose for your personal use requirements. The SUB does not.
Ill tell you what. Id have to agree. I love my chevorlet cobalt ls with a turbo and many engine upgrades which is indeed faster than these two.. but my second favorite type of car is Subaru.... again i have another but. I love economy cars and the fiesta ST is a beautiful car. I would take it over the brz or a cobalt SS any day i love that with all that power i could still get 35 MPG Brilliant car.
+buildmorefarms100 But you can reach it from anywhere. It's very small inside there. Why would you need more of them? For that matter, when do you ever use the lock/ unlock button these days? It pretty much does it automatically, or with the fob.
+Black List How does your ST perform practically? I've heard the rear seat and cargo space is somewhat limited and that the suspension is a little rough.
+Jack Van Nest I have a UK spec so the rear seats are smaller than that of the US version but I have taken a whole load of television cameras and extras to location before and it's fine. Admittedly the suspension and tyres are a little rough at low speeds but when you get it on a good road, it all makes sense.
WuWei Xu The interior on the Fiesta ST seemed to be even cheaper/more economy grade than the FR-S! Also the Fiesta consistently scores very low on reliability. It was fun to drive and all but I dont like the looks.
I almost rear ended a brz that was trying to go fast in my ST. I had to lift. A bit of torque disadvantage?? LOL almost 6 g's and you go slower. Not to mention better fuel economy. Got my ST for less then 20 grand.
FRS/BRZ has an amazing chassis and suspension set up. Throw on grippy tires and its a good club racer. If it has MORE power (230-250 hp), it will blow everything else in its category out of the water. Right now, its better to go for the Miata or Fiesta ST in its performance bracket.
I enjoy watching your guys' videos, but wouldn't it make more sense to have side by side column comparisons when you guys run down the specs? otherwise, we'd have to rewind the video to the previous car,
I think you meant to say is "just like the Fiesta the BRZ is a hopped up econobox" Did you look underneath? Did you notice the stamped steel suspension components? What about the booming roar at 65 mph worse than a corolla? The BRZ makes a GTI look and feel like a Maybach.
ill take the brz for one good reason, the fact that it is possibly the best platform to start with tuning. Problems like "underpowered" can always be fixed albeit you have the money. The fiesta is a good car, but its not something i could see myself in the next few years, ill probably just upgrade into a better car. While i CAN see myself still driving the brz for many many years to come and maybe keep improving it as time goes on just like an old silvia. Just my thoughts.
ua-cam.com/video/M-NZqlSfi_M/v-deo.html they stay underpowered no matter what you do to them. This guy spent almost 30k on his car and mods, i spent less than 25...
At the end, the ford is faster, the time for the ford is correct, but 26.352+31.948+29.791=88.091=1:28.091 which is 0.009 seconds SLOWER. Not a whole second faster.
Looks like segment 3 for the BRZ should have been 29.491, not 29.791 assuming the final times are correct. I'm very surprised though at the huge difference in braking G's.
I'm happy I went with my Abarth 500. Chuck in a computer, track torsion bar and good tires, it handles, sounds and goes amazing.200hp, 210lbs torque at 2500lbs Drove on the track and its a very capable little car with a menacing growl.
The Fiesta ST is a nice little car. Got a 2015 with 14k miles for 14995. It was an awesome deal. Cheapest 2015 FoST i could find was 22k. Its defiantly the type of car you either love or hate though, most people i talk to about it either immediately fall in love with it or call it garbage that needs to be killed with fire. Its just about the best bang for your buck when looking for a practical car that is also fun to drive though. It handles great, and thats coming from someone whos last car was a Miata. Its also quicker then most people expect, especially when you reflash the shitty stock tune that it comes with. the COBB tune really makes the car come alive; ive outrun my buddies mostly stock 2014 Golf gti multiple times now, and one newer Civic SI i found on the highway. At first I was disappointed that i couldn't get a FoST (thats what i wanted to get, but only had 20k), but after owning the FiST for a few months, and applying the tune, I wouldn't trade it for a FoST. I actually went with a different friend to test drive a FoST, and while it was bigger and slightly faster, i just didnt like it.
Scott honestly I'm not sure. I found it at a Chevy dealer in San Diego. They had been asking 18999 but had just lowered it to 14999. It's a 2015 model ST that had 15000 miles on it. Basically perfect condition. I walked in there with a check for 15000 and said "Tax, title, license and the car out the door". After some haggling they agreed and it was mine. Only downside is the car didn't come with the Recaro seats. Only Regular seats.
The Fiesta ST is actually a far more entertaining car to drive than the Focus ST. The Focus looks better by the numbers. The Fiesta is a much more balanced car.
BRZ is such a sad, sad car. If you want a sports car, BUY A SPORTS CAR. There are plenty of options out there. The BRZ, Toyota GT86and FRS (all the same freakin cars) are horrible excuses for a "sports car". A base model Camaro puts out 323 hp and mine got 34 mpg on the highway before I traded it in for a Focus ST. I needed the room. It's so sad that the BRZ's rivals are cars like... the FIESTA LMAO
Sports car doesn't necessarily have to be all about power. It's about balance and handling and feel. Looks don't hurt either. I test drove the BRZ and didn't find it lacking power, it's a fun car. Very close to the Fiesta ST in terms of fun.
I almost got the BRZ, except for two things. The BRZ is a "real sports car" and everyone will know it. Even non-car people. It made me feel very "mid-life crisis". I actually like the interior, oddly. Not sure why it gets bagged on all the time. The FiST doesn't have to be a sports car all day long, every day. That said, if they threw a turbo on the BRZ, I may have pulled the trigger. These were totally different cars, but I liked them both a lot. Maybe next time.
Most Americans, incorrectly so, believe RWD is superiour. Maybe in a large, muscle car, or supercar it would be, but in these smaller performance cars, it works really well.
People who buy these cars with automatic transmissions are completely missing the fun. Iv'e never driven a BRZ or Fiesta, but I have driven 2 manuals back in Poland ( bmw 316i and peugeot partner) So fun to drive stick
If you want to pass without downshifting, if you want 4 real seats, if you want a proper hatch for cargo, if you want to be able to easily get in and out of the car, if you want to blend in, if you want to save a little money, if you want to never have to sell your car to get something more practical, buy the Fiesta St. If you want to feel every bit of speed from a seat 1 foot off the ground, if you want to slide around corners like a 70s car chase, if you want to looks back at your car longingly, if you want to have seats so comfortable you can lean them back and sleep in them like a lazyboy, if you want to add wide summer tires and rims, if you want a mechanical limited slip diff for both winter driving and summer fun, if you want to look forward to the temperature drop in the fall that gives you more power, if you want to compromise a little on practicality to make every commute a real life video game, buy the gt86/frs/brz/gr86.
I'm not quite sure what you're digging at? I think you'll have to explain why tradition is an absolute gold standard. I'm sorry, as well, that you can't drive. If you could, I'm certain it would in some fashion moderate your views...
opusmonday Do you mind expressing your view on why you dislike RWD so much? I know that RWD has better handling while FWD is great around corners. You've probably heard of torque steer on FWD vehicles cause they receive way too much power, a negative for racers.
Great vid guys, thanks. It sucks the end of the video had so much wind. Good job by whomever worked with the audio to pull most the wind noise out. To bad that also flattened out the voices. Still it was intelligible, which I'm sure it wasn't before the noise reduction work.
I just bought a Focus ST and it's a really fun little car. I averaged my MPG at 32 after about a 2 hour drive on the highway and an hour of mountain driving. It really feels solid and punchy. I never lost confidence in it but I have to say, in order to get that MPG, you need to be really gentle. On average, I get combined 20... maybe. It's tough to be tame because it just makes you laugh while you drive.
The reason why the BRZ beats the mustang ,ST ,etc on race track is that no other car in that competition can handle like the BRZ ,its just fenomenal,amazing car...
fiesta st is faster that brz check again the seconds and do correct the result the finaly time of lap from brz is more tha fiesta s time in lap fiesta has done lesss timeee!!!!!!!
JCTiggs I think he's trying to say that their calculations for lap times are not accuracte. If you take the Fiesta's 3 segments, you get 1:28.082. If you take the BRZ's 3, you get 1:28.091, meaning they either A) typo'ed or B) lied. Either way, it's wrong.
The BRZ/FRS is a great car but honestly it just doesn't have enough power, and realistically if you want to have a BRZ/FRS with power you are going to need to drop another $6000 on a supercharger/turbokit and at that point it puts you into a different price bracket. One which includes the GTI, WRX, Focus ST, and in the used market there are a lot of interesting options for $30K (M5, M3, Jag XKR, Camaro SS, Mustang GT, Challenger SRT8, Boxter S, 911 etc etc) All which have more power, more pedigree and more character.
DJrezafication I've driven the BRZ and from 3500rpm and up it's decent, but honestly it has pathetic torque figures. Torque is what gives you the sensation of instant power that pushes you into the back of the seat. High rev hp is all well and fine but the BRZ doesn't really provide any thrills in the acceleration department and yes a turbo would help that. Modern variable vein turbos have very little lag and produce power in the low 2000rpm range. Just look at the power band and torque figures of the GTI and Focus ST.
***** Turbos that work in the low RPM range are put there for fuel efficiency not power. That's the thing with people who keep saying they want a turbo in the BRZ, they imagine a sort of car from fast and furious with a blow off valve making hissing noises every time you shift gears. All you would get from a stock turbo that operates in the low RPM range is a laggy economy car. You can't get away from turbo lag, it's an intrinsic property of turbos. There are ways to reduce it but it's just not worth it unless were talking high revs.
DJrezafication Well I'm pretty convinced (and so is porsche, vw, mazda,ford etc) that modern turbos systems are great at delivering power throughout the power-band but you may disagree so in that case a supercharger on the BRZ would be a better solution. No lag and more power from idle to redline, or better yet an inline 6 cylinder or small v8. I just think that cornering capabilities is only half the equation when building a sports car. That's just my personal taste.
***** Porsche doesn't use turbos in the same way as say a Chevy Cruze or a VW Jetta. A VW Jetta uses a turbo because it's more fuel efficient to recycle some of that power coming from the exhaust. A decent turbo setup in the BRZ would increase its price way above 25-30k range. If you look at the WRX its a 35K car and still has notorious turbo lag.
Driven the FRS and the focus st. Focus is slightly cheaper, loaded with options, cheaper to fix down the road, and more practical for a daily driver. Wife decided to buy the st. I'll keep my Audi for now so I can actually leave the house when it snows.
Shocking to see the nerdy dude praising the fiesta so much. He's usually kind of an anti-domestic car type guy. lol. It's always annoyed me to listen to him praise imports that are DREADFULLY falling behind the domestics in this country. I hear all kinds of praise to the BRZ and it's handling but I feel like Toyota/subaru copped out a bit. They literally put prius tires on it to get it to drift and to me that's just like putting a loud exhaust on a car to make it sound powerful. I'd like to see an SC'd BRZ/FR-S soon especially since mustang is going to be a direct competitor with it's new 4banger turbo.
There's already an optional SC available. And they didn't put prius tires on it so it can drift, they did it so normal people (the people buying this car) can feel like they're going fast even when they're at safe speeds.
Unlike putting a loud exhaust on a car to make it sound powerful, the choice of tires actually makes a difference in performance, hence it is more fun in the corners because of the Prius tires.
To both of you... I usnder stand that theory. But realistically why drop 24k on a car that can get you killed for fun in the corners. You'd have to upgrade your tires just to be safe in this thing. Pretty sure asc isn't an option and even then if you can't grip it's redundant.
That Toyota was nice but I would take the Ford. For a five door hatch to be less money (even decked out) and actually be competitive to a "real sports car" (2:48) and have modern conveniences unlike the "proper sports car" (2:57) yet still get compared time and time and time again to other "real sports cars" obviously there is something to it.
I love my BRZ!! Thanks for the video...very good, but may be confusing to some when you use stock footage showing the interior of the Limited, when you're testing the Premium model. Just saying
Fiesta ST brilliant, have owned Focus RS mk2 two of them Focus RS 3 and Focus ST.......Fiesta ST the best out of bunch for all round ability fun costs brilliant car Ford nailed it with Fiesta ST best all round value for money car you can buy
Nice review as usual. Only complaint is with the sound quality. Don't know the guys names, but the music was loudest, the shorter guy's voice was next, and could barely hear the taller guy. Don't you use a mixing software to balance the input gains? Music should never be louder than the vocal.
Very enjoyable review! I have driven the Toyota GT86 and have to say I loved the handling and the shifting and I think the exterior styling, always personal taste, is good. The big negative for me was the interior, which might have passed muster in 1990 but is just a miserable, noisy and depressing place to spend time in. I have rented Fiestas (manual 5 speed) and enjoyed them too but I think the ST really must raise the ante. As much as I liked driving the GT86, I think the STs (either Fiesta or Focus) might be better cars to live with.
There is absolutely no doubt that the BRZ blows the FiST out of the water when it comes to style and looks. I still sometimes cringe when I look at the carp-faced front end of my Fiesta. I however bought the FiST because I wanted something I could live with every day. I like the higher seating position for daily driving and getting in and out of my car. I like having 4 doors and a hatch. I also think that Ford has the easiest to use and highest audio fidelity bluetooth system out of any of the cars I have driven.
brz is way to slow, my friend beat one in his 2003 impala... The driver was acting like he was driving a ferrari, and my friend had to put him back in his place lmfao.
yea i didn't know that there was a 4-door fiesta ST till i seen this video, i think we only have the 3-door here and i think im going to have to buy it, i just have too!!!!!!
BRZ is not even in the same category as the ST. The ST beats it in almost every single category. Amenities, torque, functionality, space, usability, acceleration, fun factor, interior, quality, price, hp add-ons etc; Of course it wins hands down!
Really? Quality? That's why Ford still use this technology from the 1960s. the worst quality car I've ever sat in and will never sit in again. Be prepared to replace the tranny at 500 miles
tacomanfan344 actually the quality from the 60s is better. Now all the uses cheap plastic an ugly materials. And speaking out of my ass? Do some research and you'll see that ford is always among the worst quality and less reliable cars on any website. So kick rocks. Reliability of the Subaru shits on the ST. Not a fan boy. Don't even own a Subaru and never have.
The Fiesta ST? Really? Please just... shut up... did you accidentally buy one of those pieces of shit or something? The BRZ is RWD, limited slip diff, boxer engine mounted lower than a Nissan GTR, has one of the lowest centres of gravity of almost any production car which means you have amazing handling and much more fun than you can ever dream of in that nasty Ford. You want to talk about add-ons? Toyota released the blue prints of this car to aftermarket part manufacturers before they even started production, the BRZ is way more customizable. Sorry but nothing you said was accurate.
DJrezafication All of your cool-aid cute addons and yet the Fiesta still blows it out of the water. I wonder why national rally circuit didn't choose the BRZ for their car of choice. OPPS! Maybe you misspoke.
I have never driven the ST but i have driven the new BRZ and i may say that i do not like it one bit. I drive a cobalt ls with upgrades to make about 230 hp. but the brz definitely felt slower than my cobalt did when it was stock. The car isnt fast at all.
My neighburs wife drives a normal Ford Fiesta to work. And she is 60 or something years old. That makes me think a Ford Fiesta is an old Ladies car. But The ST is probaly a fun car to drive but the brz is a nice sports car that looks like a fast sports car.
here we are 5 years on what has happened? everyone ragged on the BRZ/FRS for being slow and the Fiesta ST as the clear victor in this match up but.... the Fiesta ST has largely fallen off, no one talks about it anymore, it's certainly seen as a great used car bargain but no one besides doug demuro has made a video about it. The BRZ/FRS is still being talked about and compared to by many enthusiasts and reviewers, it still has a large community behind it and still is being compared to bigger fish and I think that speaks volumes for what people say against what people do in the car community
@@Random.Contents. Those Fiesta STs look way better than those sorry-ass BRZs.. (lol). BRZs are fuckig boring, The Fiesta ST demolish it every time, in every comparison.. (ha-ha).
BRZ looks faster than it is.... the Fiesta is faster than it looks.
Your mom looks faster than she is.
Matt Waterman nigga what
Well said
It also feels faster than it is, which I LOVE. I like to have a good time out on a country road with minimal risk of dying or going to jail, the Fiesta ST will almost certainly be my next daily driver when my 2005 Focus ST finally gives up the ghost. Ford makes fantastic small front drive real-world usable fun cars, I’ve never been a Ford guy, but I don’t think their equal can be had for anywhere near their price.
I guess Im randomly asking but does any of you know of a way to log back into an instagram account..?
I somehow forgot the password. I appreciate any help you can offer me
I test drove the brz, fun but it seemed mostly like a novelty car. Then to the focus st, pretty rowdy, too much money. Fiesta st felt perfect. A little smaller but still able to haul any equipment I needed for my job. Plus when you really get going it feels rabid as hell. When you add the highway mpg it's no brainer. Very fun car.
I have an Focus ST3, had a Fiesta Black ST pass by the other day ago....those things look so good with some after market mods. Front wheel drive is hard to beat I feel for the city, you feel very connected to the road. Small zippy front wheel drives...lovem
FORD FIESTA ST: 25.891 + 31.939 + 30.252 = 88.082 s = 1 min 28.082 seconds. They had this correct.
SUBARU BRZ: 26.352 + 31.948 + 29.791 = 88.091 s = 1 min 28.091 seconds. They had this one wrong.
THE FORD IS FASTER.
i agree with you i just write it and is correct
Id rather have a car that feels fast, as opposed to one that may be faster, but you cant feel it.
the fiesta is almost identical in lap times as the frs/brz at nurburgring, but if you were to go rally driving, the FWD fiesta just mops the floor with any rwd car.
People like to say "rwd is the proper wheel drive" but it really depends. Yes it's more fun, and yes it's better for acceleration, but fwd has it's advantages too.
And when you compare the two's lap times, the fiesta is almost as fast on-road as the brz, but destroys the brz on loose surfaces.
For me, fiesta all the way
I walk on brz’s all day in my fiesta st. No competition
I made the same transition as well from the 86 platform to the st. The torque is usable through out the city. It is a far better for city day to day driving compared to the 86 platform.
I have a 2016 Fiesta ST with the COBB Accessport running the Mountune 93 octane optimized stage 1 tune. No less than 26.5 pounds of boost and I walk STI's
@@kconnaroe lol, mmk
@@laundrieshanging9077 what part of that upsets you?
Yea Buddy upsets me? Been laughing not upset
Uhh.. The time for the BRZ is 1:28.091 if you add those 3 times together. Which means the Fiesta ST is actually the faster one with 1:28.082 in this comparison test. Adding is fun
Excellent test. I thought the ST would be faster than the BRZ especially under damp conditions. The Fiesta has far better tires. I own the BRZ but have mad respect for the Fiesta st.
Fiesta ST overall wins. It pretty much does everything the BRZ can do, but the Fiesta is cheaper in price, and from all reviews, is MORE FUN to drive because of that 200 pounds of torque. I don't see how the Fiesta ST isn't the better value. It clearly is. But the BRZ is a true sports car look (2 door coupe) while the Fiesta ST looks like an everyday driver. So it's up to you what you want, but Fiesta ST wins in overall.
Front vs rear. Rear will always win.
hmmm They say the Fiesta ST's systems correct almost all torque steer soo... not this time. I haven't driven one though so that's based on the reviews.
"It (Fiesta ST) pretty much does everything the BRZ can do,"................................The Fiesta ST can't do doughnuts.
hmmm that means a smart car is better. RWD doesn't always win
V1ralB1ack By all accounts i've heard, the focus st has torque steer issues, but not the fiesta.
5 years later and I rewatch this looking to buy my fist.
same lol
Same
The ST is the better car in every way. Its turbo, its got recaro seats, amazing colors, tons more options and a vastly more premium feel. A fully loaded fiesta st is a meer $2000 more than the BRZ fully equipped and a much better car.
test drove the frs new when it first came out... then a used brz and 5 used frs a few years later... liked the looks, shifter and steering but the quality wasn't the greatest on cars with low mileage... rattles... wear on the interior... oh and the lack of power... wound up test driving many others including the wrx, mustang, 370Z, s2000, gti, focus St, civic si, 228I, 128i, 135i etc... wound up buying the fiesta St despite hating the idea of owning a fiesta... now I don't even care about that... it's just the most fun out of all the stuff I drove... really torquey, light and tossable
+theshapeofpunk2comee Its also the cheapest car for cheap skates!
+theshapeofpunk2comee same here I'm driven many cars working at a dealer and never saw myself in a tiny fiesta. test drove the focus st because it was the car i wanted, but then test drove the fiesta st right after and bought it on the spot. had no regrets fun car
Brz:
-Built from ground up to be a sports car
-high revving boxer motor
-lower COG than many supercars
-Sporty seating position
-RWD
Fiesta:
-Based on econobox
-Good motor
-Minivan driving height
-FWD
For anyone average joe that wants a sporty car, the fiesta would be the way to go, but any true motorhead would go for the brz due to the RWD and seating alone. It might be low on torque but if you keep the revs high, the torque won't matter.
+Jasim Q LOL I am a Camaro 1LE road course racer and guess what I DD? hint, it ain't the BRZ.....The Fie3sta was WAY better and that is painful coming from a chevy guy
tq always matters : ua-cam.com/video/M-NZqlSfi_M/v-deo.html
In every review I've ever seen where reviewers call the FWD car the one with the inferior drivetrain layout, it turns out to get the same time as the RWD car. I think it's a matter of driver preference. I'm thinking BRZ is better for the track, and the Fiesta is better on mountain and canyon runs. The BRZ won't compete with the Fiesta in high altitude on steep grades due to the torque figure. The Fiesta looks like the more fun and better equipped/more upscale vehicle. Fiesta for Mt. Baldy's GMR!
3/10 of a second aint shit... There's so many little errors that can be made. Fiesta st ftw!
daniel rodriguez they added wrong. If you add the BRZ numbers up. It actually gets 1:28.091. Which means the Fiesta actually won
Exactly too many variables, put some real tires instead of Prius tires on the brz!
Drive them on wet roads or in snow I TAKE THE ST - Take a long cross country trip? I take the FORD & the interiors? Are you kidding? Ford is beautiful inside. Real world use? ST!!! Neither car is a race car. They both perform well as daily drivers. The FORD shines as an all over package AND you have SEVRAL ST packege/body layout choices to chose for your personal use requirements. The SUB does not.
Ill tell you what. Id have to agree. I love my chevorlet cobalt ls with a turbo and many engine upgrades which is indeed faster than these two.. but my second favorite type of car is Subaru.... again i have another but. I love economy cars and the fiesta ST is a beautiful car. I would take it over the brz or a cobalt SS any day i love that with all that power i could still get 35 MPG Brilliant car.
I really don't care for looks. I'll get the Fiesta ST.
+Mark Batarina The Fiesta is ugly.
buildmorefarms100 opinion
Mark Batarina 1 lock/unlock button for the whole car and its on the dashboard....LOL
+buildmorefarms100 But you can reach it from anywhere. It's very small inside there. Why would you need more of them? For that matter, when do you ever use the lock/ unlock button these days? It pretty much does it automatically, or with the fob.
rrpostalagain I see your point, but it is just odd and a cost saving measure Im sure.
just bought an st shes beautiful
This is the first time I've ever heard someone say that a front wheel drive car is easier to drive on a track than a rear wheel drive car.
I'll take my ST over a BRZ anyday!
+Black List How does your ST perform practically? I've heard the rear seat and cargo space is somewhat limited and that the suspension is a little rough.
+Jack Van Nest I have a UK spec so the rear seats are smaller than that of the US version but I have taken a whole load of television cameras and extras to location before and it's fine.
Admittedly the suspension and tyres are a little rough at low speeds but when you get it on a good road, it all makes sense.
+Black List I feel just the opposite! I drove both and Id take the BRZ over the Fiesta anyday....except when its snowing!
+buildmorefarms100 Reason?
WuWei Xu The interior on the Fiesta ST seemed to be even cheaper/more economy grade than the FR-S! Also the Fiesta consistently scores very low on reliability. It was fun to drive and all but I dont like the looks.
I almost rear ended a brz that was trying to go fast in my ST. I had to lift. A bit of torque disadvantage?? LOL almost 6 g's and you go slower. Not to mention better fuel economy. Got my ST for less then 20 grand.
+riothero313 Its a cheap car.
buildmorefarms100
Cheap and faster, sounds like a bargain.
***** Cheaply made, it rated poor in CR magazine.
***** You mad bro? CR rates the Fiesta -182 reliability rating based on owners surveys.
***** No matter how cheap your car is if it doesnt run it isnt a good deal.
FRS/BRZ has an amazing chassis and suspension set up. Throw on grippy tires and its a good club racer. If it has MORE power (230-250 hp), it will blow everything else in its category out of the water. Right now, its better to go for the Miata or Fiesta ST in its performance bracket.
I enjoy watching your guys' videos, but wouldn't it make more sense to have side by side column comparisons when you guys run down the specs? otherwise, we'd have to rewind the video to the previous car,
You're 100% right! We're working on new graphics and a new into and everything. And that side-by-side comparison chart is in the works!
I think you meant to say is "just like the Fiesta the BRZ is a hopped up econobox"
Did you look underneath? Did you notice the stamped steel suspension components? What about the booming roar at 65 mph worse than a corolla? The BRZ makes a GTI look and feel like a Maybach.
Too bad the subbie doesn't have a 2.5l in it. That car really needs more torque IMO.
Do you remember commenting this lol. 7 years ago!!!!!!
slap more power on it... this argument that putting more power will make it like everything else doesn't make sense
why do they keep comparing the brz to 4 cylinder turbos and v6s? its like they're trying to make it look bad
ill take the brz for one good reason, the fact that it is possibly the best platform to start with tuning. Problems like "underpowered" can always be fixed albeit you have the money. The fiesta is a good car, but its not something i could see myself in the next few years, ill probably just upgrade into a better car.
While i CAN see myself still driving the brz for many many years to come and maybe keep improving it as time goes on just like an old silvia. Just my thoughts.
ua-cam.com/video/M-NZqlSfi_M/v-deo.html they stay underpowered no matter what you do to them. This guy spent almost 30k on his car and mods, i spent less than 25...
Dude even with tune and header. It is still slow.... it will never break 200 ft lb of torque without force induction.
His math was wrong, the fiesta was acutally faster by the margin stated.
"You just have to love the progressive and linear way the power is delivered in the BRZ."
But that's wrong....
At the end, the ford is faster, the time for the ford is correct, but 26.352+31.948+29.791=88.091=1:28.091 which is 0.009 seconds SLOWER. Not a whole second faster.
Looks like segment 3 for the BRZ should have been 29.491, not 29.791 assuming the final times are correct.
I'm very surprised though at the huge difference in braking G's.
I'm happy I went with my Abarth 500.
Chuck in a computer, track torsion bar and good tires, it handles, sounds and goes amazing.200hp, 210lbs torque at 2500lbs
Drove on the track and its a very capable little car with a menacing growl.
oh my god
+StarWars Spartan What?
I ended up trading it in for a 96 Vette, the Abarth was more fun though.
Wyvern an abarth? Whatever floats your boat
StarWars Spartan
The thing was fun as hell! It was very odd to look at, but it was different.
Probably fun but just an ugly little car. I like the numbers but I've got to look at it too.
The Fiesta ST is a nice little car. Got a 2015 with 14k miles for 14995. It was an awesome deal. Cheapest 2015 FoST i could find was 22k. Its defiantly the type of car you either love or hate though, most people i talk to about it either immediately fall in love with it or call it garbage that needs to be killed with fire. Its just about the best bang for your buck when looking for a practical car that is also fun to drive though. It handles great, and thats coming from someone whos last car was a Miata. Its also quicker then most people expect, especially when you reflash the shitty stock tune that it comes with. the COBB tune really makes the car come alive; ive outrun my buddies mostly stock 2014 Golf gti multiple times now, and one newer Civic SI i found on the highway. At first I was disappointed that i couldn't get a FoST (thats what i wanted to get, but only had 20k), but after owning the FiST for a few months, and applying the tune, I wouldn't trade it for a FoST. I actually went with a different friend to test drive a FoST, and while it was bigger and slightly faster, i just didnt like it.
Scott honestly I'm not sure. I found it at a Chevy dealer in San Diego. They had been asking 18999 but had just lowered it to 14999. It's a 2015 model ST that had 15000 miles on it. Basically perfect condition.
I walked in there with a check for 15000 and said "Tax, title, license and the car out the door". After some haggling they agreed and it was mine.
Only downside is the car didn't come with the Recaro seats. Only Regular seats.
26,390?? for that price it should be against the Focus ST , and there it would get murdered !
The Fiesta ST is actually a far more entertaining car to drive than the Focus ST. The Focus looks better by the numbers. The Fiesta is a much more balanced car.
BRZ is such a sad, sad car. If you want a sports car, BUY A SPORTS CAR. There are plenty of options out there. The BRZ, Toyota GT86and FRS (all the same freakin cars) are horrible excuses for a "sports car". A base model Camaro puts out 323 hp and mine got 34 mpg on the highway before I traded it in for a Focus ST. I needed the room. It's so sad that the BRZ's rivals are cars like... the FIESTA LMAO
Sports car doesn't necessarily have to be all about power. It's about balance and handling and feel. Looks don't hurt either.
I test drove the BRZ and didn't find it lacking power, it's a fun car. Very close to the Fiesta ST in terms of fun.
I almost got the BRZ, except for two things. The BRZ is a "real sports car" and everyone will know it. Even non-car people. It made me feel very "mid-life crisis". I actually like the interior, oddly. Not sure why it gets bagged on all the time. The FiST doesn't have to be a sports car all day long, every day. That said, if they threw a turbo on the BRZ, I may have pulled the trigger. These were totally different cars, but I liked them both a lot. Maybe next time.
I love both of these cars and if I had the funds, I would not know what to get. So many awesome rides to be had in the 20k-27k range.
In five years that fiesta will be in a junkyard and the brz wont even be broken in yet.
yeah because it will have been up on a rack for the last 5 years.
Most Americans, incorrectly so, believe RWD is superiour. Maybe in a large, muscle car, or supercar it would be, but in these smaller performance cars, it works really well.
People who buy these cars with automatic transmissions are completely missing the fun. Iv'e never driven a BRZ or Fiesta, but I have driven 2 manuals back in Poland ( bmw 316i and peugeot partner) So fun to drive stick
If you want to pass without downshifting, if you want 4 real seats, if you want a proper hatch for cargo, if you want to be able to easily get in and out of the car, if you want to blend in, if you want to save a little money, if you want to never have to sell your car to get something more practical, buy the Fiesta St.
If you want to feel every bit of speed from a seat 1 foot off the ground, if you want to slide around corners like a 70s car chase, if you want to looks back at your car longingly, if you want to have seats so comfortable you can lean them back and sleep in them like a lazyboy, if you want to add wide summer tires and rims, if you want a mechanical limited slip diff for both winter driving and summer fun, if you want to look forward to the temperature drop in the fall that gives you more power, if you want to compromise a little on practicality to make every commute a real life video game, buy the gt86/frs/brz/gr86.
The fiesta ST is better in every way. He just says the BRZ is better because its RWD
If only BRZ had turbo on it would be an amazing machine!!!
Yep but it doesn't bro. Oh well.
I've seen videos where people have installed turbos on it ;)
RWD fanboys... RWD fansboys EVERYWHERE
opusmonday FWD on economy cars, RWD on sports cars, AWD on performance/luxury or otherwise sedans or SUV's. It's tradition, not fanboyism.
See also, fanboyism. Thanks for writing in.
opusmonday Yeah, I can't even drive. I'm not a fan of RWD, I don't even know what it feels like.
I'm not quite sure what you're digging at? I think you'll have to explain why tradition is an absolute gold standard. I'm sorry, as well, that you can't drive. If you could, I'm certain it would in some fashion moderate your views...
opusmonday Do you mind expressing your view on why you dislike RWD so much? I know that RWD has better handling while FWD is great around corners. You've probably heard of torque steer on FWD vehicles cause they receive way too much power, a negative for racers.
I love matchup like this ... Especially this one !
If price was a factor, then why not compare the ST to a frs instead.
looks like the fiesta was faster in the straights and the brz brought it back where it counts. in the turns
Great vid guys, thanks. It sucks the end of the video had so much wind. Good job by whomever worked with the audio to pull most the wind noise out. To bad that also flattened out the voices. Still it was intelligible, which I'm sure it wasn't before the noise reduction work.
are we here for car reviews or video criticism?
Adrian B Are we here for video comments or comment criticism?
cloud819 We are here to comment and share ideas about the new cars and how they perform,it's a car review not a video review
also i raced a kid in a FRS from a roll and pulled him easy. and i have a stock FiST.
I just bought a Focus ST and it's a really fun little car. I averaged my MPG at 32 after about a 2 hour drive on the highway and an hour of mountain driving. It really feels solid and punchy. I never lost confidence in it but I have to say, in order to get that MPG, you need to be really gentle. On average, I get combined 20... maybe. It's tough to be tame because it just makes you laugh while you drive.
Somebody didn´t go to kindergarden and doesn´t know how to add
LOL, he said "no body roll." You can clearly see the understeer and body roll. RWD for the win!
The reason why the BRZ beats the mustang ,ST ,etc on race track is that no other car in that competition can handle like the BRZ ,its just fenomenal,amazing car...
Enjoy our Fiesta ST vs Subaru BRZ track shootout!
***** *****
#fordfiestast #ford #subaru #subarubrz #shootout
fiesta st is faster that brz check again the seconds and do correct the result the finaly time of lap from brz is more tha fiesta s time in lap fiesta has done lesss timeee!!!!!!!
tasos papadopoulos what?
JCTiggs
I think he's trying to say that their calculations for lap times are not accuracte. If you take the Fiesta's 3 segments, you get 1:28.082. If you take the BRZ's 3, you get 1:28.091, meaning they either A) typo'ed or B) lied. Either way, it's wrong.
+Alex W It's really embarrassing...
Driven both. The Fiesta ST Would probably beat the BRZ in a rolling drag race but the BRZ/GT86 is a great car.
Love Fiesta ST ! 2003 TopGear year of car !
The BRZ/FRS is a great car but honestly it just doesn't have enough power, and realistically if you want to have a BRZ/FRS with power you are going to need to drop another $6000 on a supercharger/turbokit and at that point it puts you into a different price bracket. One which includes the GTI, WRX, Focus ST, and in the used market there are a lot of interesting options for $30K (M5, M3, Jag XKR, Camaro SS, Mustang GT, Challenger SRT8, Boxter S, 911 etc etc) All which have more power, more pedigree and more character.
So the you think some turbo lag is the way to go? The BRZ has a very respectable power to weight ratio already.
DJrezafication I've driven the BRZ and from 3500rpm and up it's decent, but honestly it has pathetic torque figures. Torque is what gives you the sensation of instant power that pushes you into the back of the seat. High rev hp is all well and fine but the BRZ doesn't really provide any thrills in the acceleration department and yes a turbo would help that. Modern variable vein turbos have very little lag and produce power in the low 2000rpm range. Just look at the power band and torque figures of the GTI and Focus ST.
***** Turbos that work in the low RPM range are put there for fuel efficiency not power. That's the thing with people who keep saying they want a turbo in the BRZ, they imagine a sort of car from fast and furious with a blow off valve making hissing noises every time you shift gears. All you would get from a stock turbo that operates in the low RPM range is a laggy economy car. You can't get away from turbo lag, it's an intrinsic property of turbos. There are ways to reduce it but it's just not worth it unless were talking high revs.
DJrezafication Well I'm pretty convinced (and so is porsche, vw, mazda,ford etc) that modern turbos systems are great at delivering power throughout the power-band but you may disagree so in that case a supercharger on the BRZ would be a better solution. No lag and more power from idle to redline, or better yet an inline 6 cylinder or small v8. I just think that cornering capabilities is only half the equation when building a sports car. That's just my personal taste.
***** Porsche doesn't use turbos in the same way as say a Chevy Cruze or a VW Jetta. A VW Jetta uses a turbo because it's more fuel efficient to recycle some of that power coming from the exhaust. A decent turbo setup in the BRZ would increase its price way above 25-30k range. If you look at the WRX its a 35K car and still has notorious turbo lag.
Driven the FRS and the focus st. Focus is slightly cheaper, loaded with options, cheaper to fix down the road, and more practical for a daily driver. Wife decided to buy the st. I'll keep my Audi for now so I can actually leave the house when it snows.
should make a comparison between the Fiesta st and the Veloster turbo
Shocking to see the nerdy dude praising the fiesta so much. He's usually kind of an anti-domestic car type guy. lol. It's always annoyed me to listen to him praise imports that are DREADFULLY falling behind the domestics in this country. I hear all kinds of praise to the BRZ and it's handling but I feel like Toyota/subaru copped out a bit. They literally put prius tires on it to get it to drift and to me that's just like putting a loud exhaust on a car to make it sound powerful. I'd like to see an SC'd BRZ/FR-S soon especially since mustang is going to be a direct competitor with it's new 4banger turbo.
There's already an optional SC available. And they didn't put prius tires on it so it can drift, they did it so normal people (the people buying this car) can feel like they're going fast even when they're at safe speeds.
Unlike putting a loud exhaust on a car to make it sound powerful, the choice of tires actually makes a difference in performance, hence it is more fun in the corners because of the Prius tires.
To both of you... I usnder stand that theory. But realistically why drop 24k on a car that can get you killed for fun in the corners. You'd have to upgrade your tires just to be safe in this thing. Pretty sure asc isn't an option and even then if you can't grip it's redundant.
That Toyota was nice but I would take the Ford. For a five door hatch to be less money (even decked out) and actually be competitive to a "real sports car" (2:48) and have modern conveniences unlike the "proper sports car" (2:57) yet still get compared time and time and time again to other "real sports cars" obviously there is something to it.
i have to say ford has impressed me with this one
The Focus ST is the better comparo....but the Ford would stomp the BRZ too badly for the anti-domestic folks at AutoGuide.
Bill White thats the dumbest shit. The focus st is another market entirely
I love my BRZ!! Thanks for the video...very good, but may be confusing to some when you use stock footage showing the interior of the Limited, when you're testing the Premium model. Just saying
Love both these cars. Hard to go wrong. Great video
Probs a dumb question. But can you change a normal Fiesta bumper with the ST bumpers?
and then a 500 dollar tune, the fiesta spanks the brz
Just put a damn ecoboost engine in the damn BRZ! Why can't we have a lightweight RWD car with torque?!
Fiesta ST all day!
I'll be getting my fiesta ST here pretty quickly
Linear is the last way I would explain the BRZ’s torque curve 4:36
Fiesta ST brilliant, have owned Focus RS mk2 two of them Focus RS 3 and Focus ST.......Fiesta ST the best out of bunch for all round ability fun costs brilliant car Ford nailed it with Fiesta ST best all round value for money car you can buy
Nice review as usual. Only complaint is with the sound quality.
Don't know the guys names, but the music was loudest, the shorter guy's voice was next, and could barely hear the taller guy. Don't you use a mixing software to balance the input gains? Music should never be louder than the vocal.
Very enjoyable review! I have driven the Toyota GT86 and have to say I loved the handling and the shifting and I think the exterior styling, always personal taste, is good. The big negative for me was the interior, which might have passed muster in 1990 but is just a miserable, noisy and depressing place to spend time in. I have rented Fiestas (manual 5 speed) and enjoyed them too but I think the ST really must raise the ante. As much as I liked driving the GT86, I think the STs (either Fiesta or Focus) might be better cars to live with.
your right , I owne a ST for a year now, however mij wive don`t like the (very, very ) harsh supspension ( i like it)
Damn look at that Ford Fiesta ! I rather pick that over the brz. I kid
I'll get the fiesta st all day!
There is absolutely no doubt that the BRZ blows the FiST out of the water when it comes to style and looks. I still sometimes cringe when I look at the carp-faced front end of my Fiesta. I however bought the FiST because I wanted something I could live with every day. I like the higher seating position for daily driving and getting in and out of my car. I like having 4 doors and a hatch. I also think that Ford has the easiest to use and highest audio fidelity bluetooth system out of any of the cars I have driven.
The segment time numbers for the BRZ doesn't really add up to being 0.3s faster than the Fiesta.
the brz is a tuners platform, just waiting to be boosted and its a true race car there after
Thanks Guys, Great comparison!!!
absolute rubbish,st would wipe the floor with the brz on that track
brz is way to slow, my friend beat one in his 2003 impala... The driver was acting like he was driving a ferrari, and my friend had to put him back in his place lmfao.
dammit Ford make me a freaking 3 door fiesta and i will buy it
their is a 3 door (uk)
yea i didn't know that there was a 4-door fiesta ST till i seen this video, i think we only have the 3-door here and i think im going to have to buy it, i just have too!!!!!!
Fiesta st 200
YURI that’s funny actually. This comment was 4 years ago but I see you bought it now 😂
The FiST probably would have been faster on the track if it didn't have the sun roof.
I like both cars. I've driven both in the past 30 hours. I don't think fans of either are stupid. Why do people get so personal about car opinions?
The BRZ is low? There is close to 4 inches of gap above the wheels. By no means is it "low"
BRZ is not even in the same category as the ST. The ST beats it in almost every single category. Amenities, torque, functionality, space, usability, acceleration, fun factor, interior, quality, price, hp add-ons etc; Of course it wins hands down!
Really? Quality? That's why Ford still use this technology from the 1960s. the worst quality car I've ever sat in and will never sit in again. Be prepared to replace the tranny at 500 miles
tacomanfan344 actually the quality from the 60s is better. Now all the uses cheap plastic an ugly materials. And speaking out of my ass? Do some research and you'll see that ford is always among the worst quality and less reliable cars on any website. So kick rocks. Reliability of the Subaru shits on the ST. Not a fan boy. Don't even own a Subaru and never have.
Martin Mikha Do you know how to look up consumer reports?
The Fiesta ST? Really? Please just... shut up... did you accidentally buy one of those pieces of shit or something? The BRZ is RWD, limited slip diff, boxer engine mounted lower than a Nissan GTR, has one of the lowest centres of gravity of almost any production car which means you have amazing handling and much more fun than you can ever dream of in that nasty Ford. You want to talk about add-ons? Toyota released the blue prints of this car to aftermarket part manufacturers before they even started production, the BRZ is way more customizable. Sorry but nothing you said was accurate.
DJrezafication All of your cool-aid cute addons and yet the Fiesta still blows it out of the water. I wonder why national rally circuit didn't choose the BRZ for their car of choice.
OPPS! Maybe you misspoke.
Both these cars are up there with the greatest cars of this decade
And both would get dusted by a sienna
good thing colunm wood doesnt do testdrives anymore
I have never driven the ST but i have driven the new BRZ and i may say that i do not like it one bit. I drive a cobalt ls with upgrades to make about 230 hp. but the brz definitely felt slower than my cobalt did when it was stock. The car isnt fast at all.
"Semi-performance tires," are you kidding me? They're Prius tires for god's sake.
You cannot get those from Prius in North America.
Fiesta is best
nice test i see big advantage in braking acceleration for brz in telemetric graph - better tire?
Can you please mention it again that the brz is rwd I didn't hear you the 90 other times you mentioned it.
My neighburs wife drives a normal Ford Fiesta to work. And she is 60 or something years old. That makes me think a Ford Fiesta is an old Ladies car. But The ST is probaly a fun car to drive but the brz is a nice sports car that looks like a fast sports car.
here we are 5 years on what has happened? everyone ragged on the BRZ/FRS for being slow and the Fiesta ST as the clear victor in this match up but.... the Fiesta ST has largely fallen off, no one talks about it anymore, it's certainly seen as a great used car bargain but no one besides doug demuro has made a video about it.
The BRZ/FRS is still being talked about and compared to by many enthusiasts and reviewers, it still has a large community behind it and still is being compared to bigger fish and I think that speaks volumes for what people say against what people do in the car community
Undr Grnd yeah they are talking about a recall on the boxer engine
Of course they're still talking about the Fiesta ST, there are new videos here on UA-cam to prove that. The Fiesta ST still a BETTER CAR, sorry.
@@77GR1982 lol nobody give a shit about that ugly fwd ecobox anymore
@@Random.Contents. Those Fiesta STs look way better than those sorry-ass BRZs.. (lol). BRZs are fuckig boring, The Fiesta ST demolish it every time, in every comparison.. (ha-ha).
I wouldn't even consider the Ford if I were in the market.
please do a comparison of these two cars with the abarth 500, veloster turbo, civic si
The fiesta is 10x more practical, nicer interior, better torque "and just an overall better car" ( my opinion )
Unless you are a family of midgets the Fiesta is is only slightly more practical than the Brz. The St is an exceptional performance value.
fatboy19831 Uh it's a lot more practical
mrhiguy Not for me I am 6.5 feet tall. The Fiesta is a 3 seater for me.
fatboy19831 LOL you're a Giant.