Dont get excited... Even a 4090 sweats doing a decent job over 2 4k displays.. You are adding 2 more displays to render. Its not just double the workload though, you are increasing the pixel blackmajicfukery by a few orders of magnitude.
240 degree FOV is way beyond anything thats not a lizard or a bird that has eyes on the sides of its noggin ! Full human ain't going much above 60 degrees either side of your nose end if it was pointing directly 0 degrees North. Just look straight forward and put your arms straight out like a T pose and wriggle ya fingers.. You may have a dim idea something is wriggling somewhere off to the side, but ya wont see any arms. To close to your peripheral vision.
@@alexanderlozano8004 Yep foveated rendering would sort it out nicely. No need for full resolution across the entire display all the time when our human "sweet spot" means we can't see detail at edges from point of focus...but seeing shapes and movement there which we are sensitive to IRL but in a HMD will be amazing!
now to wait... 2025 first PCVR with this tech. 2028 fixes around the gaps 2030 first standalone 240º fov 2035 first stand alone 240º fov with decent res, and battery.
While I adore, and am happy with the size of the Bigscreen, I mean I have to clap my hands for design and technology.. But I'm still looking through a snorkel mask at best... They just shouted they'd increased FOV with new optics, but it was literally 2 or 3 degrees. If Bigscreen was 130 - 140 FOV with just a standard 5mm jack for headphones, Id throw money at them.
@@KinkyJalepeno That is misinformation. It went from 93 to 102, glare was reduced and more. Overall, beyond has hit the limits of its form factors physics limitations. Beyond innovated with extreme lightweightness, size and clarity being together. No one has pulled all three of those off at once before. The tech shown here with hypervision is only iteratively new; it is a edit of existing lens tech. The flaw it has is edge distortion, which they made a excuse for with panel size; leaving out the detail that they used a smaller one to not show the distortion at that point, and everyone here glossed over the fact that while you don't hyperfocus at the horizontal edge of your fov eyes wise, the clarity at said point does matter greatly regardless of it. We can perceive the difference in practical tests. The second misleading thing done here, is the lack of facial interface consideration. In here they make you hold it close enough for eyelashes to rub on them. Bit misleading with that part.
It's very impressive. The seams between the screens are only barely perceptible. Way less than a typical multi-screen setup. It takes only a moment and you stop noticing. There's possibility of fixed fovaeted rendering for side screens on stanalones. There's no distortion. Basically a big improvement
Peripheral vision is the single biggest factor in immersion. More than black levels, pixel density, resolution, frame rate, brightness, heaviness of the display, etc etc. It is the difference between looking at a traditional screen like we have been doing for nearly 100 yaers, and being inside the experience. This is very, very exciting.
140 fov with 40 ppd is dreamy all by itself, but 240 is one heck of a statement piece! Remarkable work! Gifted engineering. One thing crosses my mind: Does this leave any room at all for eye tracking? Let alone the more advanced facial microexpression tracking. Some people just want a fabulously vast sim display, and some people want to be socially immersed in VR Chat and the like.
So you made the video 5 months ago (about half a year), and he says we will see it in VR headsets on the market in 2 years... so I guess we will see this in VR headsets in about a year and a half...wow. Very exciting. I've been so disappointed with how there has been no progress in FOV for any of the more mainstream VR headsets for so very long.... so it is nice to see this prototype!
I would imagine we are seeing what we will be able to buy for "normal" amount of money in 4-5 years but just knowing this is now actually on the table makes me smile, I'm sure there are still a lot of challenges and as ppl in the comments have mentioned there is always more that we as consumers want but this is a huge step in the right direction :)
I was just looking at these and speaking with Arthur today. Very interesting product and quite impressive. He also provided some thoughts on our approach to achieving an ultra wide FOV. Good product and a very friendly and talented CEO.
Best idea in years as regards VR development! I'm glad these guys are working in the most underrated and forgotten aspect of VR headsets: FOV, which is 90% responsible for inmersion and therefore for a realistic experience.
This is simply amazing! He said to expect this in a couple years. I think sooner if some of the bigger companies (you listening Meta?) show interest. Thanks again Seb. and Marcos! You are the best!
Meta will be aware of this, but it's not there thing to produce a PC headset. and unless they borrow the M2 chip from Apple, it's very unlikely to appear in the standalone Quest Pro either. They would need to start a new line of premium headsets which has about as much chance as me winning the lottery.
@@dtrjones, honestly, I'm okay with that. Meta's habit of turning more open-sourced companies into Meta-only... well, we already have way too much of that in VR right now.
@@dtrjones Given that more than a tiny part of their quest 2 sales were specifically for PCVR (i'm one of them) it would not surprise me at all if PCVR headsets were somewhat back on the radar
Thank you for sharing this video Sebastian and Marco ! Your Audio equipment seems not to work proper though. I only have mono sound on the left channel . The right channel is dead.
NOW we're talking. Just pair this wide FOV with Valve's off-ear audio solution and Lighthouse tracking for the upgrade from Index I've been waiting for! Add dynamic foveated rendering to make it perfect. Am I correct in thinking that it was as clear as the Beyond or Crystal? Or maybe that it could be if, as he said, it is paired with a different display?
Ive been banging on about FOV since the launch of the quest 2. my Vive I bought in 2016 has 110 degree fov and it raged me when the quest 2 came out with barly 90 degree fov. I'll not getting another headset now unless I see a decent improvment in FOV. sure id love the see these lenses become the standard but I cant see this company making enough to make differance on their own, I hope their propriatary lens technology is licenced out to other manufacturers so companies can actually get them into their headsets.
I was thinking about the curved displays or folding ones as well. I figured it would be easier on the GPU to process 2 images rather than 4. But they may have it all setup in programming in the head set it self to take the 2 images and route a portion of each to the 3rd and 4th displays. That would make it to where it shouldn't affect GPU performance. Easier said than done I imagine.
This is incredible the next generation of VR headsets will be insane. I expect one of the two new headsets Lynx is working on will use this technology.
@@adrenalinejunkie3828 He could indeed even triple the price, but for us average consumers, the production cost is what matters most. And if it's not insanely more expensive to produce this when compared to dual lenses, then it could theoretically trickle down for a acessible price. Maybe double of normal lenses.
if they figure out full fov and > 60PPD thin headsets, it would be great for productivity or just in general. if they can make > 60PPD glasses that looks like normal glasses, that could replace smartphones and maybe even laptop if you can connect it to a computing unit that would sit in the backpack or something.
sehr gute Frage mit den Curved Displays die Idee kam mir nämlich auch sofort als ich es gesehen hatte und die Erklärung warum das nicht so gut ist, war auch sehr interessant. Danke
Going to be great for sim racing. My only worry is the hardware needed to run at native res. I run a G2 with a 3080 and have to be careful with my settings. These are going to have a lot of pixels to push
Not necessarily. With foveated rendering, you don't need to render full resolution at the edges of the FOV. It can be quite blocky and you wouldn't know.
@@heyjeySigma Foveated rendering on a 240fov headset would bring about so much performance gain that it would likely run better than something like the pimax 8kx does and that runs perfectly well on a 4090 in most titles
Seems like yesterday Palmer Luckey started touting a new, actual road to real vr with oculus vr. That was ~2014. It has come a long way, but has a long way to go. For me, its probably still another 10 years away before it is actually feasible.
The fact that many companies are realizing the potential for VR and even AR in general, it's now becoming a consumer product. More companies and investors will always equal a better product with competition. Especially with Apple's new VR being just around the corner, it's been in development from around 8 years and yet just maybe we'll get news on it this Monday at the WWDC. People can hate or love Apple but if they release a VR product I almost guarantee it'll be revolutionary just like the smart phones, even if it's an insane price like $3000 it's going to eventually get cheaper and there'll be more competition making similar products.
@@cheeeeezewizzz No. As of right now, VR is surviving perfectly well with absolutely no apple product in the space and it will do fine with the tiny share that apple VR will make up
At the end of the day, it's all about the software and how much games are able to take advantage of the big field of view. The bigger the FOV, the drain of resource it is on the graphics card. If that's the case, do I even want that big a field of view? Certainly with the 8KX, I never attempt to try to take advantage of the widest FOV which is 170 I believe...and always settle with 150 degree due to performance issue. Of course, it's for racing game which is demanding. I believe the 12K is good enough.
Most of the time when looking straight ahead, 180 horizontal is fine. But when looking to the sides, the 240 degrees will complete the feeling of full optical immersion. Very intriguing!😅
@@Optimus514 Right. So wouldn't this be a license-able OEM product they have on their hands? It sure doesn't make me want to buy anything too soon. I guess I'm going continue with my Quest2 for a while and see more of what's on the horizon..
Any indication about price? I mean, can we expect a "reasonable" price, or will the terminals (that will mount these lenses) be very expensive initially?
He said XTAL is going to implement this technology into their upcoming simulators, just check their price, you need at least thousands of dollars if u are interested with their products to use at home. I guess that’s affordable for enthusiasts?
MY LEFT EAR ENJOYED THIS !
omg thank you for this I only had my right earbud in and was wondering why I could only just barely hear anything 😅
Haha I just put my right earbud in the case for charging^^ I thought it had no battery anymore
Lol, thought the balance in the car was off
Lol
😂😂
Full human FOV in a small form factor coming soon, I'm beyond excited. Keep up the gut work guys.
Dont get excited... Even a 4090 sweats doing a decent job over 2 4k displays.. You are adding 2 more displays to render. Its not just double the workload though, you are increasing the pixel blackmajicfukery by a few orders of magnitude.
240 degree FOV is way beyond anything thats not a lizard or a bird that has eyes on the sides of its noggin ! Full human ain't going much above 60 degrees either side of your nose end if it was pointing directly 0 degrees North. Just look straight forward and put your arms straight out like a T pose and wriggle ya fingers.. You may have a dim idea something is wriggling somewhere off to the side, but ya wont see any arms. To close to your peripheral vision.
@@KinkyJalepeno *5090*
Foveated rendering can help with that
@@alexanderlozano8004 Yep foveated rendering would sort it out nicely. No need for full resolution across the entire display all the time when our human "sweet spot" means we can't see detail at edges from point of focus...but seeing shapes and movement there which we are sensitive to IRL but in a HMD will be amazing!
I’ve been waiting for a progress in terms of FOV for ages, this is finally happening
Yes seems like we’ve been stuck on binocular FOV for way too long
Finally!
Finally? It will take at least a couple of year before you will be able to see it in consumer vr headset
now to wait...
2025 first PCVR with this tech.
2028 fixes around the gaps
2030 first standalone 240º fov
2035 first stand alone 240º fov with decent res, and battery.
Now we will wait a progress in GPU capacities for this screens😅
Nevermind human FOV, I'd be happy with stereo audio. 😂
So clever you! :)
oh woooow! I'm soo excited for this new VR tech. I really wish all new VR headset will also adapt this tech.
Between this, Crystal, Bigscreen, and 12K, nice to see some innovation for 2023.
While I adore, and am happy with the size of the Bigscreen, I mean I have to clap my hands for design and technology.. But I'm still looking through a snorkel mask at best... They just shouted they'd increased FOV with new optics, but it was literally 2 or 3 degrees. If Bigscreen was 130 - 140 FOV with just a standard 5mm jack for headphones, Id throw money at them.
@@KinkyJalepeno That is misinformation. It went from 93 to 102, glare was reduced and more. Overall, beyond has hit the limits of its form factors physics limitations.
Beyond innovated with extreme lightweightness, size and clarity being together. No one has pulled all three of those off at once before.
The tech shown here with hypervision is only iteratively new; it is a edit of existing lens tech. The flaw it has is edge distortion, which they made a excuse for with panel size; leaving out the detail that they used a smaller one to not show the distortion at that point, and everyone here glossed over the fact that while you don't hyperfocus at the horizontal edge of your fov eyes wise, the clarity at said point does matter greatly regardless of it. We can perceive the difference in practical tests.
The second misleading thing done here, is the lack of facial interface consideration. In here they make you hold it close enough for eyelashes to rub on them. Bit misleading with that part.
THIS is what I want. I don't care half as much about zero screen door effect as I do about fully immersive FoV.
It's very impressive. The seams between the screens are only barely perceptible. Way less than a typical multi-screen setup. It takes only a moment and you stop noticing. There's possibility of fixed fovaeted rendering for side screens on stanalones. There's no distortion. Basically a big improvement
The future of VR! Thanks Seb!
Peripheral vision is the single biggest factor in immersion. More than black levels, pixel density, resolution, frame rate, brightness, heaviness of the display, etc etc. It is the difference between looking at a traditional screen like we have been doing for nearly 100 yaers, and being inside the experience. This is very, very exciting.
This is what I want to make it to the consumer market. I'd also like more vertical display area.
It's amazing to see how quickly VR tech is improving and shrinking... LETS GOOOO!
Lol Marco isn't easily satisfied 😂, he stays ice cold even with the latest high-tech in his hands 😅
"Oh yes, there it is." LOL
nope. when he sees something good he will react amazed. this time no amazement cause its shit.
Stoic German
Maybe he's like me... Blind with his glasses off. He may not be impressed because he just sees a blurry mess. lol
140 fov with 40 ppd is dreamy all by itself, but 240 is one heck of a statement piece! Remarkable work! Gifted engineering.
One thing crosses my mind: Does this leave any room at all for eye tracking? Let alone the more advanced facial microexpression tracking. Some people just want a fabulously vast sim display, and some people want to be socially immersed in VR Chat and the like.
this is what Bigscreen should be producing imho
I cannot wait for this! This is exactly what ive been waiting for!
Please come out with this soon! =)
So you made the video 5 months ago (about half a year), and he says we will see it in VR headsets on the market in 2 years... so I guess we will see this in VR headsets in about a year and a half...wow. Very exciting.
I've been so disappointed with how there has been no progress in FOV for any of the more mainstream VR headsets for so very long.... so it is nice to see this prototype!
Cant wait for consumer applications
A window to the futur, thank you for showing this. And congratulation to the engeneers who made this possible.
Pimax, you better get a wriggle on with your 12K headset, because it looks like you have competition hot on your heels now! 😅
I would imagine we are seeing what we will be able to buy for "normal" amount of money in 4-5 years but just knowing this is now actually on the table makes me smile, I'm sure there are still a lot of challenges and as ppl in the comments have mentioned there is always more that we as consumers want but this is a huge step in the right direction :)
10 years away still
I was just looking at these and speaking with Arthur today. Very interesting product and quite impressive. He also provided some thoughts on our approach to achieving an ultra wide FOV. Good product and a very friendly and talented CEO.
This is the dream, human FOV.
Best idea in years as regards VR development! I'm glad these guys are working in the most underrated and forgotten aspect of VR headsets: FOV, which is 90% responsible for inmersion and therefore for a realistic experience.
Awesome, Marco could barely contain his excitement ;) I would be getting excited like Seb fore sure!
How could he; it was just as advertised. :)
I believe Marco is a robot sent back from the future. Prove me wrong ;)
"I'll be back" says Marco from the future!
These 140 fov lens in cheap head set with 3.5k per eye for 500 would be amazing
I can’t wait for this to be productized. I bet it’ll look sick as a headset design too.
What an exciting development. Thanks guys for the presentation.
Thanks for asking the question about curved displays, ive been wondering the same thing for a while. Can't wait to see these optics in products!
Resolution has been solved by now. I’m glad FOV is being fixed next. Quest 4 please have at least 180FOV!!!
Shoutout to vrtuber Eric Hartley in the background.
Marcos calm reactions to normally amazing things are sublime.
Marco is a typical 'Chuurman'! Remember Sargeant Schultz, 'I see/like nothing'!
Very interesting mate! 😮
Very great News! Also funny to see, they all got HP Omen Hardware, in our Office, we also use Omen and we are very satisfied.
This is simply amazing! He said to expect this in a couple years. I think sooner if some of the bigger companies (you listening Meta?) show interest. Thanks again Seb. and Marcos! You are the best!
Meta will be aware of this, but it's not there thing to produce a PC headset. and unless they borrow the M2 chip from Apple, it's very unlikely to appear in the standalone Quest Pro either. They would need to start a new line of premium headsets which has about as much chance as me winning the lottery.
@@dtrjones, honestly, I'm okay with that. Meta's habit of turning more open-sourced companies into Meta-only... well, we already have way too much of that in VR right now.
@@dtrjones Given that more than a tiny part of their quest 2 sales were specifically for PCVR (i'm one of them) it would not surprise me at all if PCVR headsets were somewhat back on the radar
so Vin Diesel making revolution in vr technology...good for him :)
Thank you for sharing this video Sebastian and Marco !
Your Audio equipment seems not to work proper though. I only have mono sound on the left channel . The right channel is dead.
Yea same here..I thought something was wrong lol
The audio quality of this video is amazing, it sounds like every thing is coming from the left....super cool
My left ear totally loved this video
Oh how creative you!
Not every day Sebastian says “wow.”
Very exciting !!
Wow. Full Immersion. 😮
Just AMAZING.
Marco very spontaneous and says what he sees. Thanks.
Yes, a more critical eye.
NOW we're talking. Just pair this wide FOV with Valve's off-ear audio solution and Lighthouse tracking for the upgrade from Index I've been waiting for!
Add dynamic foveated rendering to make it perfect.
Am I correct in thinking that it was as clear as the Beyond or Crystal? Or maybe that it could be if, as he said, it is paired with a different display?
OMG this is going to be amazing!
Ive been banging on about FOV since the launch of the quest 2. my Vive I bought in 2016 has 110 degree fov and it raged me when the quest 2 came out with barly 90 degree fov. I'll not getting another headset now unless I see a decent improvment in FOV. sure id love the see these lenses become the standard but I cant see this company making enough to make differance on their own, I hope their propriatary lens technology is licenced out to other manufacturers so companies can actually get them into their headsets.
I was thinking about the curved displays or folding ones as well. I figured it would be easier on the GPU to process 2 images rather than 4. But they may have it all setup in programming in the head set it self to take the 2 images and route a portion of each to the 3rd and 4th displays. That would make it to where it shouldn't affect GPU performance. Easier said than done I imagine.
going to start saving lol they sound awesome
OMG this is revolutionary on the dimension of human perception.... Truly omg
I’m in love with the way all of them in this video struggling with english 😂😂 this is so cute
Nobody is struggling. Everyone _(everyone)_ has an accent.
Vr seems not to be an english deal😁😁
Can't Wait Immersive!
My left ear was amazed to hear that!
That's a super new and super creative comment! Congrats!
Amazing what great R&D is going on on the background. There is so much nice tech to come.
This is incredible the next generation of VR headsets will be insane. I expect one of the two new headsets Lynx is working on will use this technology.
Suspect?
@@NextWorldVR I must have been thinking of writing expect but my 3am brain was clearly stalling 😂 Thanks, I will correct my mistake
The FOV of that headset is better than the FOV of the audio in this video 💀
My left ear is so impressed !
People in the comments don't seem to grasp just how insanely expensive this is going to be.
Yep I heard him say next deployment is in professional flightsims. In there other video about AR in VR the guy said it would cost about 50.000$ LOL 🤪🤑
Bull, he said all off the shelf components,. That means cheap.
@@adrenalinejunkie3828 He could indeed even triple the price, but for us average consumers, the production cost is what matters most. And if it's not insanely more expensive to produce this when compared to dual lenses, then it could theoretically trickle down for a acessible price. Maybe double of normal lenses.
if they figure out full fov and > 60PPD thin headsets, it would be great for productivity or just in general.
if they can make > 60PPD glasses that looks like normal glasses, that could replace smartphones and maybe even laptop if you can connect it to a computing unit that would sit in the backpack or something.
Valve Decard, Quest 4, Pimax, Take Notes!
my left ear really liked the video
That's a new one, congrats!
@@mixedrealityTV thanks, put a lot of thought into it
I wonder if these lens can be used with adjustable IPD setup
Why wouldn't they be? This is just a prototype, whoever they sell them to can make that decision
sehr gute Frage mit den Curved Displays die Idee kam mir nämlich auch sofort als ich es gesehen hatte und die Erklärung warum das nicht so gut ist, war auch sehr interessant. Danke
Going to be great for sim racing. My only worry is the hardware needed to run at native res. I run a G2 with a 3080 and have to be careful with my settings. These are going to have a lot of pixels to push
Not necessarily. With foveated rendering, you don't need to render full resolution at the edges of the FOV. It can be quite blocky and you wouldn't know.
research done decades ago said you need at least 110 deg for immersion so this is good
My right ear really felt left out on this one... very cool tech though, thanks for covering it.
I’m literally throwing money at my screen while watching this video
Oh yeah and…bye bye Pimax?
I just threw my safe box into the screen... it was a bad idea
@@gothicvillasgaming 😂😂😂😂
My left ear was happy to hear this...
"Yea yea that's great let's move onto the second demo over there"
my left ear really loves this video
How creative! :)
@@mixedrealityTV wait why did my man respond, was not expecting that
You need to convert the mono channel to stereo, otherwise, like in this video, we only get audio in our left ear.
This is a future VR FOV 240°, I hope it's coming soon...
suuuure... good luck getting an RTX5090 to barely run this properly lol
@@heyjeySigma Foveated rendering on a 240fov headset would bring about so much performance gain that it would likely run better than something like the pimax 8kx does and that runs perfectly well on a 4090 in most titles
i got fpv drones and a few PC VR headsets, this shit is awesome, the technology has jumped incredibly in the past 20 years
Congratulations. Hope to see a commercial product soon.
This is incredible
Seems like yesterday Palmer Luckey started touting a new, actual road to real vr with oculus vr. That was ~2014. It has come a long way, but has a long way to go. For me, its probably still another 10 years away before it is actually feasible.
Better start saving folks.
Put this on a racing helmet and you don't need 5 monitors to actually see the car & track or who's behind you!
Looks awesome - a glimpse of the future!
The fact that many companies are realizing the potential for VR and even AR in general, it's now becoming a consumer product. More companies and investors will always equal a better product with competition. Especially with Apple's new VR being just around the corner, it's been in development from around 8 years and yet just maybe we'll get news on it this Monday at the WWDC. People can hate or love Apple but if they release a VR product I almost guarantee it'll be revolutionary just like the smart phones, even if it's an insane price like $3000 it's going to eventually get cheaper and there'll be more competition making similar products.
It's also scary, if the apple headset flops....then the entire industry might die.
@@cheeeeezewizzz No. As of right now, VR is surviving perfectly well with absolutely no apple product in the space and it will do fine with the tiny share that apple VR will make up
mr clean makes a insane vr glasses headset haha !
This is what us Sim Racers need!
nice stuff 😄
Great video and super hyped for the wider fov in the future! But please, check your audio is not stereo in one channel only next time haha
Well we're getting there.
I'm sure you know, but the audio in this video is mono - only through the left channel.
Perhaps I missed it, but I didn't hear the pixels per degree stat mentioned. To me, that's critical. And of course, it has to be affordable.
At the end of the day, it's all about the software and how much games are able to take advantage of the big field of view. The bigger the FOV, the drain of resource it is on the graphics card. If that's the case, do I even want that big a field of view? Certainly with the 8KX, I never attempt to try to take advantage of the widest FOV which is 170 I believe...and always settle with 150 degree due to performance issue. Of course, it's for racing game which is demanding. I believe the 12K is good enough.
we need this!!!!!
Ya, I'm not buying any more VR until we get the FOV issue fixed. Doesn't matter the rez if it's still just looking through 'tubes'.
Sweet. Would like to get one of those soon lol
please in future videos even if mono have the audio go to both left and right channels. with head phones audio is only left side
Most of the time when looking straight ahead, 180 horizontal is fine. But when looking to the sides, the 240 degrees will complete the feeling of full optical immersion. Very intriguing!😅
Huge potential... but probably still a long way away realistically.
Wow I need this.
Pimax better starts R&D on this design.
Or license them.
This design is great, Arthur was showing it off to me earlier today.
@@Optimus514 Right. So wouldn't this be a license-able OEM product they have on their hands? It sure doesn't make me want to buy anything too soon. I guess I'm going continue with my Quest2 for a while and see more of what's on the horizon..
Any indication about price? I mean, can we expect a "reasonable" price, or will the terminals (that will mount these lenses) be very expensive initially?
That depends on the companies they sell them to, I don't think they're trying rto build their own headset
He said XTAL is going to implement this technology into their upcoming simulators, just check their price, you need at least thousands of dollars if u are interested with their products to use at home. I guess that’s affordable for enthusiasts?
would love to see a Geordi La Forge style wrap around headset like this
and in a few years they can put in a curved/bent oled display, so only one screen/eye behind the front and side glass...
Hopefully there will be something like this on the market in a few years that's not $1000+
7:35 real impressive :)
Interesting, but looks difficult to manage the distortion.